In concept - Virtue vs Vice

[The Zog historian]

You attack a poster about quoting numbers? So how did you do your numbers survey? Is this based off 10 or 100 players questioned. Pretty sure if a Vise kills a Virtue no matter what color they are there is going to be no murder account window. The concept of V/V should be all about PVP without the bothersome turning red and never visting the Royal City again. "You rarely have anything to say that includes arguments with any substance. You are only "dumbing down" UO and contributing to it's decay. Please stop posting." This saying applies still, that we both agree on.

And if a crescent wrench kills a Virtue, would that be instant-red? Just kidding about your typo.

It's hard to make out what the other guy wrote. I'm also sure that any PvP system would make sides orange to each other. It's been that way for 14 years, so his talk of blues sitting at moongates would be irrelevant. Having shrines as established loci should also make it interesting, instead of faction bases that non-factioners can't enter. Some people may try to crash the party on their reds (killed on a V-V character so he logs on another account), but it's the same old risk of being freely attackable, including by your own side who aren't your friends.

Wherever there can be fighting, hopefully healing will be prevented like with factions. I haven't seen that brought up yet.

 

[Mithryl Elves]

I stopped smoking over a hear ago so no smokebombing for me either. I run I live to comeback and loot more stuff I'm there for the stuff not for the fight.

Just as long as you know that is not PVP. Just Sayin...

 

[cazador]

Yay UO mini games..keep them in tram..try again please! Sounds like more of a monthly event hosted by an EM not an actual thought out PvP mechanic and system..hope this doesn't happen..stupid In so many ways

 

[Warpig Inc]

And if a crescent wrench kills a Virtue, would that be instant-red? Just kidding about your typo.

It's hard to make out what the other guy wrote. I'm also sure that any PvP system would make sides orange to each other. It's been that way for 14 years, so his talk of blues sitting at moongates would be irrelevant. Having shrines as established loci should also make it interesting, instead of faction bases that non-factioners can't enter. Some people may try to crash the party on their reds (killed on a V-V character so he logs on another account), but it's the same old risk of being freely attackable, including by your own side who aren't your friends.

Wherever there can be fighting, hopefully healing will be prevented like with factions. I haven't seen that brought up yet.

Not to throw a monkey wrench into things. There is a fight between two sides that comes with risk and reward. There should not be anyway for a third party to tip the balance of the fight. Reason my earlier post on V/V only zones. And I totally agree with all the post that Virtue and Vice title is lame compared to the Order and Chaos. Now if I'm in vice and one my fellow vice members kills me, there better be a murder count option. Or some traitor tag they receive for 24 hours. And everytime when killed by fellow members while tagged they get temp stats and skills reduction that stacks and remains as long as they are tagged. And their 24hour count restarts after every death.

 

[Warpig Inc]

Yay UO mini games..keep them in tram..try again please! Sounds like more of a monthly event hosted by an EM not an actual thought out PvP mechanic and system..hope this doesn't happen..stupid In so many ways

Like fishing or treasure hunting. Not required to follow the other lemmings. Just an option. If this carrot pulls in PvP action, there will always be Yew Gate or some distant champ. Lets see. PvP mechanics. I agro on you. You run or fight. I lure you into a stealther trap. Or you kill me with some awsome three hotkey tap of some pre-set combos. We have a winner and a loser and the general chat full of smack talk to entertain the trammies. Even if five people run multi accounts with each account on opposite sides. Just to run the battlezones for the winning sides pumps/points. Could alway 120 weaving and spam chat for a WBB 6 to get pumps for an easy button effect. It is an easy button world where nothing can be hard or time consuming. Much more fun smashing a button then achieving a sense of accomplishment. It is hard to add anything to the game that wont get abused that is worth while.

 

[Lady Michelle]

Just as long as you know that is not PVP. Just Sayin...

Yes I do know what pvp is I was surround by 3 pvpers, and their friends before I had my own account.
My brother played on lake superior character was keldan, then my 2 nephews played on great lakes Morph, and Uther even back then I wasn't interest in pvp. Decoing is what I love to do the most nowdays.

 

[Mithryl Elves]

Yes I do know what pvp is I was surround by 3 pvpers, and their friends before I had my own account.
My brother played on lake superior character was keldan, then my 2 nephews played on great lakes Morph, and Uther even back then I wasn't interest in pvp. Decoing is what I love to do the most nowdays.

Ur brother was not Keldan. Whats the deal with people all teh sudden claiming TC lol. Some dude in CC on ATL swears that he is Bill Gates. I played with those dudes for years and Keldan never told me he had a sister. Besides, his sister wouldnt run from a good fight

Got proof? ICQ me 402886

 

[The Zog historian]

Not to throw a monkey wrench into things. There is a fight between two sides that comes with risk and reward. There should not be anyway for a third party to tip the balance of the fight. Reason my earlier post on V/V only zones. And I totally agree with all the post that Virtue and Vice title is lame compared to the Order and Chaos. Now if I'm in vice and one my fellow vice members kills me, there better be a murder count option. Or some traitor tag they receive for 24 hours. And everytime when killed by fellow members while tagged they get temp stats and skills reduction that stacks and remains as long as they are tagged. And their 24hour count restarts after every death.

Faction strongholds shows that multiple members-only zones are possible to code. And no mounts allowed, like in Blackthorn's new castle?

I like your suggestion of a traitor tag and what can be done to a traitor. One would want to turn on the warning for committing a criminal act, lest one accidentally attack someone on the same side who has a grudge, then suicides to turn the first person into a traitor.

 

[The Zog historian]

Ur brother was not Keldan. Whats the deal with people all teh sudden claiming TC lol. Some dude in CC on ATL swears that he is Bill Gates. I played with those dudes for years and Keldan never told me he had a sister. Besides, his sister wouldnt run from a good fight

Got proof? ICQ me 402886

I know for a fact that guy isn't Bill Gates, because I'm Carlos Slim and we play only on Sonoma!

 

[Gedgerez Tesherd]

The lore & game play of current Faction Bases & Teams (True Britannias TB, Council of Mages CoM, Minax Min, & Shadow Lords SL) are apart of UO. Some people still enjoy Faction pvp, sigil stealing, sigil guarding, trap placement, trap disarming, base occupation & defense, pvm (silver farming), role playing, & being a stable keeper for riding Faction horses. Even if the mentioned events are occurring at a minimum, that still means the system is being used. There are reasonable things to keep & change such as the following listed:

[Joining Factions]:

-System still auto checks for balance on existing Faction team ratio, and the balance check yields at 50 active players. Player status is determined by a 1 time 24hr login period. Every 50 players of population, the stone will analyze the active player status between all Faction Teams to determine eligibility in joining that team at the designated time.

Example: True Britannians has 60 active players, Minax 10, CoM 20, & SL 30. The balance check would redirect you to joining one of the lesser teams team other than True Britannians until reaching a minimum range within 10 players of the balance check (50 active players). If all teams are above the minimum balance check, or within 10 players of the top populated team, then any Faction team becomes available.

-Factions convert to a singular opt in base aspect of game play (can join Factions within a non Faction player guild). Can only have 1 Faction type per guild, & prompts to join the same Faction if one exist already within the player guild (joining Factions within the guild is optional not mandatory).

-Player can only select 1 Faction, but can add all remaining characters on their account.

-Player receives 24hr debuff upon resigning along with all characters on the account.

-Faction Hostility will flag you as an enemy (orange) to the aggressor, & normal rules apply with combat.

-Players can freely join Factions while in a non Faction guild. While in Felucca Factions auto flags individual enemy toward opposing Factions. Factions come with an OPT in option to flag combat within all non Felucca facets. Hostility persist until resigning from Factions (doesn't require you to leave your guild).

[Statloss]:

-Faction 'Thirst' debuff flags player to gain statloss after 50% damage received by Faction player if hit points left non healed or regenerated (1-99% hp). 'Thirst' debuff diminishes upon 100% hit points healed or regenerated.

-Upon dying player receives the current loss of skill points for a duration of 15 minutes upon Resurrection.

-Faction Hearthstone converts to a Ghost Hearthstone. Ghost Hearthstone option auto activates only when dead. Upon dying player can OPT (click yes or no on menu) to auto Hearth to their designated base. Player can immediately Resurrect while receiving a 'Battle Sickness' debuff to resurrect without penalty of statloss. Each stack of 'Battle Sickness' debuff comes with an elapse waiting period of 5 minutes to Faction Hearth again with a maximum of 2 stacks (10 minutes), after which point you cannot Faction Hearth & will be vulnerable to the 15min statloss upon normal Resurrection. 'Battle Sickness' debuff includes a minus 20% damage reduction penalty for the duration of the debuff (overcapping SDI & Damage Increase will not overwrite the debuff penalty).

[War Games]:

-Faction Stone gains new option to que into new 'optional' Battleground games.

-Battleground games yields 200 Silver upon winning & 20 Silver upon losing.

-Battleground games come with no victory buffs or debuffs, put simply they are for 'extra' enjoyment to add onto the already existing Faction system.

-Battleground games can consist of however they are currently described as to Mesanna and other players 'in concept' adaption (I am not heavily concerned how the games are settup since it should be optional to que into the games).


Faction Artifacts:

-Faction Lieutenant Npc stationed next to Faction Stone at each Faction Base. Allows purchase of Faction Artifact mods slots. Player can select which slot to receive any regular Artifact structure on any slot.

-Artifact Jewelry can only swap between themselves (Ring & Bracelet, & Necklace for Gargoyle). Once an artifact structure becomes soulbound you cannot equip multiples.

Example: I Select from the menu & equip an Ornament of the Magician mod structure for a Faction Ring slot. Now I cannot equip this same structure on the Faction Bracelet slot.

-Artifact Armor can only swap between slots (Head, Neck, Arms, Gloves, Chest, or Legs). Once an artifact structure becomes soulbound you cannot equip multiples.

Example: I Select from the menu & equip a Stormgrip mod structure for a Faction Arms slot. Now I cannot equip this same structure on Head, Neck, Arms, Gloves, Chest, nor Legs.

-Maximum of 3 Armor, & 1 Jewelry Faction Artifact mod structures can be equipped at any given time.

-Faction Artifact Pricing per mod structure set at 2000 Silver

-Faction hue Dyes that turn clothing into Faction items, costing 500 silver per charge

Example: True Britannian Gold & Royal Purple dyes, upon using 1 charge on a piece of clothing turns a Blessed Faction Cloth, after resigning from factions the items turns into a plain color.


[Faction Vendors]:

-Vendors remain the responsibility of the Treasurer position.

-Treasurer gains a command term, 'show command' to view command option for placing/removing vendors.

-Removed the need for Town Silver to place any vendor

-Vendors will no longer block stamina when walked over.

-Vendors Decay after a 24 hour period.

-Vendor pricing auto set to minimum standard levels:

-Reagents are 2gp per 1 Reagent & auto spawn unlimited supply at 999 with 10min respawn & no markup price increase.

-Bottles start 5gp per 1 Bottle & auto spawn unlimited supply at 999 with 1 gp markup at a maximum of 10gp per Bottle.

-Wood starts at 2gp per 1 Board with unlimited supply at 999, and 1 gp markup at a maximum of 10gp per 1 Board.

-Metal starts at 2gp per 1 Ore with unlimited supply at 999, and 1 gp markup at a maximum of 10gp per 1 Ore.


[Faction Guards]:

-Guards remain the responsibility of the Sheriff position.

-Sheriff gains a command term, 'show command' to view command option for placing/removing guards.

-Type of Guards & names remain the same as current, but gain new abilities:

-Melee Guards can gain Bushido, Ninjitsu, & Movement speed increase ability & spells to coincide with their currently held weapon special abilities (weapon cannot be disarmed).

-Caster Guards can gain Necromancy, Mysticism, & Teleport spells to coincide with their current Magery spells.

-Guards de-spawn after a 24hour period


[Faction Leadership]:

-Leadership position continue lasting up to 1 full week, after which the election term expires & requires voting.

-Voting becomes account bound & only 1 vote per faction per account.

-Commanding Lord can now add 2 Sheriff, & Treasurer positions per town. If the Commanding Lord position is left inactive for 48hrs of real world time, and elapse debuff is established (timer visible on Faction stone) until replacement voting can occur.

-Commanding Lord gains access to Faction Base Tool for their current Faction Base only:


[Faction Misc]:

-Faction Points returns to a 3 point to 1 kill ratio

-Faction Points decay rate is set at -1 per day

-Faction Point transfer is no longer available seeing how it isn't necessary for Rank Increase & only bragging rights.

-Faction Scoreboard is now available for your server, or all servers combined on your designated Faction Stone.

-Faction Rank requirements to equip certain Faction Artifact mod structures gets updated to Teir level Artifact mod structures (5 different teir levels).

-Faction Rank increases every 10 kills (not every 10 points obtained or kept) only while in Battlegrounds for incentive to participate in Battlegrounds.

-Faction word 'Punkte' has been removed, & now only uses the term, 'showscore' to view points away from their designated Faction Stone.

-Sigil timers for Corruption, Purification remain unchanged for town control

-Faction Base Tool comes equipped with menu for walls & blockades (similar to house customization but with far fewer abilities).

-Faction Base Tool auto analyzes eligibility for each tile as to not completely cut off a pathway into the Sigil room.

-Wall & Blockade pieces come in 2 optional existing Faction hues (example for Minax: Red & Shadow).

-All non Faction Tool placed obstacles within a base will auto delete (example: bagballs, candelabras, boxes).

There are plenty of other additions that can be done, so don't let me stand in the way of what others have to offer, thank you for reading.

 

[Lady Michelle]

Ur brother was not Keldan. Whats the deal with people all teh sudden claiming TC lol. Some dude in CC on ATL swears that he is Bill Gates. I played with those dudes for years and Keldan never told me he had a sister. Besides, his sister wouldnt run from a good fight

Got proof? ICQ me 402886

my mom had 6 girls 6 boys first marriage 4 boys 2 girls second marriage 4 girls 2 boys. Im the second oldest in the second marriage he is the 3rd oldest his bday is sept 14th 1968. first name Dan that is where the last part of kelDAN came from. I don't claim TC , really didn't want to claim him either. I didn't play the game with him I was playing on great lakes. BTW I don't run I stealth away LOL. Not sure what you know but I'm not putting out personal info. Once I Rip some hair out of his head I'll get the DNA test, and send you some results.

 

[Revan123]

Load of post counts and not one worthy counter point. Good for you. Attacking posters and no objective view of their post and one liners. You may grow out of it. A members only area for a battleground will really put a dent in griefer non V/V players. Hope you enjoy the rest of your summer break.

Scroll up a little ^^

 

[Revan123]

You attack a poster about quoting numbers? So how did you do your numbers survey? Is this based off 10 or 100 players questioned. Pretty sure if a Vise kills a Virtue no matter what color they are there is going to be no murder account window. The concept of V/V should be all about PVP without the bothersome turning red and never visting the Royal City again. "You rarely have anything to say that includes arguments with any substance. You are only "dumbing down" UO and contributing to it's decay. Please stop posting." This saying applies still, that we both agree on.

I was refuting the notion that you can put a number on something that is completely subjective and relative to an individuals opinion and the way they play the game (the idea that factions are 5% of UO). My 8:2 ratio is more of a generalized observation. Blue to red ratio is something you can put an exact number on, I however, made a generalization based on my observations. There is a difference. If you scroll up, I've already written a text wall with plenty of what I perceive to be adequate points. Goldberg on the other hand, NEVER has any points that can withstand a little reasonable judgment, and easily falter in the face of a rational skepticism.

 

[Crak Lord]

The lore & game play of current Faction Bases & Teams (True Britannias TB, Council of Mages CoM, Minax Min, & Shadow Lords SL) are apart of UO. Some people still enjoy Faction pvp, sigil stealing, sigil guarding, trap placement, trap disarming, base occupation & defense, pvm (silver farming), role playing, & being a stable keeper for riding Faction horses. Even if the mentioned events are occurring at a minimum, that still means the system is being used. There are reasonable things to keep & change such as the following listed:

[Joining Factions]:

-System still auto checks for balance on existing Faction team ratio, and the balance check yields at 50 active players. Player status is determined by a 1 time 24hr login period. Every 50 players of population, the stone will analyze the active player status between all Faction Teams to determine eligibility in joining that team at the designated time.

Example: True Britannians has 60 active players, Minax 10, CoM 20, & SL 30. The balance check would redirect you to joining one of the lesser teams team other than True Britannians until reaching a minimum range within 10 players of the balance check (50 active players). If all teams are above the minimum balance check, or within 10 players of the top populated team, then any Faction team becomes available.

-Factions convert to a singular opt in base aspect of game play (can join Factions within a non Faction player guild). Can only have 1 Faction type per guild, & prompts to join the same Faction if one exist already within the player guild (joining Factions within the guild is optional not mandatory).

-Player can only select 1 Faction, but can add all remaining characters on their account.

-Player receives 24hr debuff upon resigning along with all characters on the account.

-Faction Hostility will flag you as an enemy (orange) to the aggressor, & normal rules apply with combat.

-Players can freely join Factions while in a non Faction guild. While in Felucca Factions auto flags individual enemy toward opposing Factions. Factions come with an OPT in option to flag combat within all non Felucca facets. Hostility persist until resigning from Factions (doesn't require you to leave your guild).

[Statloss]:

-Faction 'Thirst' debuff flags player to gain statloss after 50% damage received by Faction player if hit points left non healed or regenerated (1-99% hp). 'Thirst' debuff diminishes upon 100% hit points healed or regenerated.

-Upon dying player receives the current loss of skill points for a duration of 15 minutes upon Resurrection.

-Faction Hearthstone converts to a Ghost Hearthstone. Ghost Hearthstone option auto activates only when dead. Upon dying player can OPT (click yes or no on menu) to auto Hearth to their designated base. Player can immediately Resurrect while receiving a 'Battle Sickness' debuff to resurrect without penalty of statloss. Each stack of 'Battle Sickness' debuff comes with an elapse waiting period of 5 minutes to Faction Hearth again with a maximum of 2 stacks (10 minutes), after which point you cannot Faction Hearth & will be vulnerable to the 15min statloss upon normal Resurrection. 'Battle Sickness' debuff includes a minus 20% damage reduction penalty for the duration of the debuff (overcapping SDI & Damage Increase will not overwrite the debuff penalty).

[War Games]:

-Faction Stone gains new option to que into new 'optional' Battleground games.

-Battleground games yields 200 Silver upon winning & 20 Silver upon losing.

-Battleground games come with no victory buffs or debuffs, put simply they are for 'extra' enjoyment to add onto the already existing Faction system.

-Battleground games can consist of however they are currently described as to Mesanna and other players 'in concept' adaption (I am not heavily concerned how the games are settup since it should be optional to que into the games).


Faction Artifacts:

-Faction Lieutenant Npc stationed next to Faction Stone at each Faction Base. Allows purchase of Faction Artifact mods slots. Player can select which slot to receive any regular Artifact structure on any slot.

-Artifact Jewelry can only swap between themselves (Ring & Bracelet, & Necklace for Gargoyle). Once an artifact structure becomes soulbound you cannot equip multiples.

Example: I Select from the menu & equip an Ornament of the Magician mod structure for a Faction Ring slot. Now I cannot equip this same structure on the Faction Bracelet slot.

-Artifact Armor can only swap between slots (Head, Neck, Arms, Gloves, Chest, or Legs). Once an artifact structure becomes soulbound you cannot equip multiples.

Example: I Select from the menu & equip a Stormgrip mod structure for a Faction Arms slot. Now I cannot equip this same structure on Head, Neck, Arms, Gloves, Chest, nor Legs.

-Maximum of 3 Armor, & 1 Jewelry Faction Artifact mod structures can be equipped at any given time.

-Faction Artifact Pricing per mod structure set at 2000 Silver

-Faction hue Dyes that turn clothing into Faction items, costing 500 silver per charge

Example: True Britannian Gold & Royal Purple dyes, upon using 1 charge on a piece of clothing turns a Blessed Faction Cloth, after resigning from factions the items turns into a plain color.


[Faction Vendors]:

-Vendors remain the responsibility of the Treasurer position.

-Treasurer gains a command term, 'show command' to view command option for placing/removing vendors.

-Removed the need for Town Silver to place any vendor

-Vendors will no longer block stamina when walked over.

-Vendors Decay after a 24 hour period.

-Vendor pricing auto set to minimum standard levels:

-Reagents are 2gp per 1 Reagent & auto spawn unlimited supply at 999 with 10min respawn & no markup price increase.

-Bottles start 5gp per 1 Bottle & auto spawn unlimited supply at 999 with 1 gp markup at a maximum of 10gp per Bottle.

-Wood starts at 2gp per 1 Board with unlimited supply at 999, and 1 gp markup at a maximum of 10gp per 1 Board.

-Metal starts at 2gp per 1 Ore with unlimited supply at 999, and 1 gp markup at a maximum of 10gp per 1 Ore.


[Faction Guards]:

-Guards remain the responsibility of the Sheriff position.

-Sheriff gains a command term, 'show command' to view command option for placing/removing guards.

-Type of Guards & names remain the same as current, but gain new abilities:

-Melee Guards can gain Bushido, Ninjitsu, & Movement speed increase ability & spells to coincide with their currently held weapon special abilities (weapon cannot be disarmed).

-Caster Guards can gain Necromancy, Mysticism, & Teleport spells to coincide with their current Magery spells.

-Guards de-spawn after a 24hour period


[Faction Leadership]:

-Leadership position continue lasting up to 1 full week, after which the election term expires & requires voting.

-Voting becomes account bound & only 1 vote per faction per account.

-Commanding Lord can now add 2 Sheriff, & Treasurer positions per town. If the Commanding Lord position is left inactive for 48hrs of real world time, and elapse debuff is established (timer visible on Faction stone) until replacement voting can occur.

-Commanding Lord gains access to Faction Base Tool for their current Faction Base only:


[Faction Misc]:

-Faction Points returns to a 3 point to 1 kill ratio

-Faction Points decay rate is set at -1 per day

-Faction Point transfer is no longer available seeing how it isn't necessary for Rank Increase & only bragging rights.

-Faction Scoreboard is now available for your server, or all servers combined on your designated Faction Stone.

-Faction Rank requirements to equip certain Faction Artifact mod structures gets updated to Teir level Artifact mod structures (5 different teir levels).

-Faction Rank increases every 10 kills (not every 10 points obtained or kept) only while in Battlegrounds for incentive to participate in Battlegrounds.

-Faction word 'Punkte' has been removed, & now only uses the term, 'showscore' to view points away from their designated Faction Stone.

-Sigil timers for Corruption, Purification remain unchanged for town control

-Faction Base Tool comes equipped with menu for walls & blockades (similar to house customization but with far fewer abilities).

-Faction Base Tool auto analyzes eligibility for each tile as to not completely cut off a pathway into the Sigil room.

-Wall & Blockade pieces come in 2 optional existing Faction hues (example for Minax: Red & Shadow).

-All non Faction Tool placed obstacles within a base will auto delete (example: bagballs, candelabras, boxes).

There are plenty of other additions that can be done, so don't let me stand in the way of what others have to offer, thank you for reading.

LOVE IT!!!

 

[Summoned]

The worst idea since TRAM. Please Leave fel alone.

 

[Ch33ch]

The lore & game play of current Faction Bases & Teams (True Britannias TB, Council of Mages CoM, Minax Min, & Shadow Lords SL) are apart of UO. Some people still enjoy Faction pvp, sigil stealing, sigil guarding, trap placement, trap disarming, base occupation & defense, pvm (silver farming), role playing, & being a stable keeper for riding Faction horses. Even if the mentioned events are occurring at a minimum, that still means the system is being used. There are reasonable things to keep & change such as the following listed:

[Joining Factions]:

-System still auto checks for balance on existing Faction team ratio, and the balance check yields at 50 active players. Player status is determined by a 1 time 24hr login period. Every 50 players of population, the stone will analyze the active player status between all Faction Teams to determine eligibility in joining that team at the designated time.

Example: True Britannians has 60 active players, Minax 10, CoM 20, & SL 30. The balance check would redirect you to joining one of the lesser teams team other than True Britannians until reaching a minimum range within 10 players of the balance check (50 active players). If all teams are above the minimum balance check, or within 10 players of the top populated team, then any Faction team becomes available.

-Factions convert to a singular opt in base aspect of game play (can join Factions within a non Faction player guild). Can only have 1 Faction type per guild, & prompts to join the same Faction if one exist already within the player guild (joining Factions within the guild is optional not mandatory).

-Player can only select 1 Faction, but can add all remaining characters on their account.

-Player receives 24hr debuff upon resigning along with all characters on the account.

-Faction Hostility will flag you as an enemy (orange) to the aggressor, & normal rules apply with combat.

-Players can freely join Factions while in a non Faction guild. While in Felucca Factions auto flags individual enemy toward opposing Factions. Factions come with an OPT in option to flag combat within all non Felucca facets. Hostility persist until resigning from Factions (doesn't require you to leave your guild).

[Statloss]:

-Faction 'Thirst' debuff flags player to gain statloss after 50% damage received by Faction player if hit points left non healed or regenerated (1-99% hp). 'Thirst' debuff diminishes upon 100% hit points healed or regenerated.

-Upon dying player receives the current loss of skill points for a duration of 15 minutes upon Resurrection.

-Faction Hearthstone converts to a Ghost Hearthstone. Ghost Hearthstone option auto activates only when dead. Upon dying player can OPT (click yes or no on menu) to auto Hearth to their designated base. Player can immediately Resurrect while receiving a 'Battle Sickness' debuff to resurrect without penalty of statloss. Each stack of 'Battle Sickness' debuff comes with an elapse waiting period of 5 minutes to Faction Hearth again with a maximum of 2 stacks (10 minutes), after which point you cannot Faction Hearth & will be vulnerable to the 15min statloss upon normal Resurrection. 'Battle Sickness' debuff includes a minus 20% damage reduction penalty for the duration of the debuff (overcapping SDI & Damage Increase will not overwrite the debuff penalty).

[War Games]:

-Faction Stone gains new option to que into new 'optional' Battleground games.

-Battleground games yields 200 Silver upon winning & 20 Silver upon losing.

-Battleground games come with no victory buffs or debuffs, put simply they are for 'extra' enjoyment to add onto the already existing Faction system.

-Battleground games can consist of however they are currently described as to Mesanna and other players 'in concept' adaption (I am not heavily concerned how the games are settup since it should be optional to que into the games).


Faction Artifacts:

-Faction Lieutenant Npc stationed next to Faction Stone at each Faction Base. Allows purchase of Faction Artifact mods slots. Player can select which slot to receive any regular Artifact structure on any slot.

-Artifact Jewelry can only swap between themselves (Ring & Bracelet, & Necklace for Gargoyle). Once an artifact structure becomes soulbound you cannot equip multiples.

Example: I Select from the menu & equip an Ornament of the Magician mod structure for a Faction Ring slot. Now I cannot equip this same structure on the Faction Bracelet slot.

-Artifact Armor can only swap between slots (Head, Neck, Arms, Gloves, Chest, or Legs). Once an artifact structure becomes soulbound you cannot equip multiples.

Example: I Select from the menu & equip a Stormgrip mod structure for a Faction Arms slot. Now I cannot equip this same structure on Head, Neck, Arms, Gloves, Chest, nor Legs.

-Maximum of 3 Armor, & 1 Jewelry Faction Artifact mod structures can be equipped at any given time.

-Faction Artifact Pricing per mod structure set at 2000 Silver

-Faction hue Dyes that turn clothing into Faction items, costing 500 silver per charge

Example: True Britannian Gold & Royal Purple dyes, upon using 1 charge on a piece of clothing turns a Blessed Faction Cloth, after resigning from factions the items turns into a plain color.


[Faction Vendors]:

-Vendors remain the responsibility of the Treasurer position.

-Treasurer gains a command term, 'show command' to view command option for placing/removing vendors.

-Removed the need for Town Silver to place any vendor

-Vendors will no longer block stamina when walked over.

-Vendors Decay after a 24 hour period.

-Vendor pricing auto set to minimum standard levels:

-Reagents are 2gp per 1 Reagent & auto spawn unlimited supply at 999 with 10min respawn & no markup price increase.

-Bottles start 5gp per 1 Bottle & auto spawn unlimited supply at 999 with 1 gp markup at a maximum of 10gp per Bottle.

-Wood starts at 2gp per 1 Board with unlimited supply at 999, and 1 gp markup at a maximum of 10gp per 1 Board.

-Metal starts at 2gp per 1 Ore with unlimited supply at 999, and 1 gp markup at a maximum of 10gp per 1 Ore.


[Faction Guards]:

-Guards remain the responsibility of the Sheriff position.

-Sheriff gains a command term, 'show command' to view command option for placing/removing guards.

-Type of Guards & names remain the same as current, but gain new abilities:

-Melee Guards can gain Bushido, Ninjitsu, & Movement speed increase ability & spells to coincide with their currently held weapon special abilities (weapon cannot be disarmed).

-Caster Guards can gain Necromancy, Mysticism, & Teleport spells to coincide with their current Magery spells.

-Guards de-spawn after a 24hour period


[Faction Leadership]:

-Leadership position continue lasting up to 1 full week, after which the election term expires & requires voting.

-Voting becomes account bound & only 1 vote per faction per account.

-Commanding Lord can now add 2 Sheriff, & Treasurer positions per town. If the Commanding Lord position is left inactive for 48hrs of real world time, and elapse debuff is established (timer visible on Faction stone) until replacement voting can occur.

-Commanding Lord gains access to Faction Base Tool for their current Faction Base only:


[Faction Misc]:

-Faction Points returns to a 3 point to 1 kill ratio

-Faction Points decay rate is set at -1 per day

-Faction Point transfer is no longer available seeing how it isn't necessary for Rank Increase & only bragging rights.

-Faction Scoreboard is now available for your server, or all servers combined on your designated Faction Stone.

-Faction Rank requirements to equip certain Faction Artifact mod structures gets updated to Teir level Artifact mod structures (5 different teir levels).

-Faction Rank increases every 10 kills (not every 10 points obtained or kept) only while in Battlegrounds for incentive to participate in Battlegrounds.

-Faction word 'Punkte' has been removed, & now only uses the term, 'showscore' to view points away from their designated Faction Stone.

-Sigil timers for Corruption, Purification remain unchanged for town control

-Faction Base Tool comes equipped with menu for walls & blockades (similar to house customization but with far fewer abilities).

-Faction Base Tool auto analyzes eligibility for each tile as to not completely cut off a pathway into the Sigil room.

-Wall & Blockade pieces come in 2 optional existing Faction hues (example for Minax: Red & Shadow).

-All non Faction Tool placed obstacles within a base will auto delete (example: bagballs, candelabras, boxes).

There are plenty of other additions that can be done, so don't let me stand in the way of what others have to offer, thank you for reading.​

GGerz
Gedgerez Tesherd, Monday at 5:06 PM

I'm not much of a forum typer or reader since I've played over the years, but felt I should get my say in this thread before It's too late. If Factions is going to be dissolved, at least this guy offered a lot of suggestions fix to some annoying shieeeeett as to keeping Factions & adding to it. I used Factions for killing since it came out, and Gedgerez goes on to include some new stuff which is what needs to happen without trashing a good system that's been around for over a decade. Whatever this Virtue & Vice thing is, just make it a temporary opt in que battleground. Which means that Factions can still continue to offer what it has been offering for each individual that seeks out their own purpose to play. Maybe there is a lack of community to join Factions currently on most servers. Maybe a battleground que is just what is needed to spur some Faction interaction like Gedgerez described with using Factions to que into the battleground with the Faction Base Stone. I dunno about anyone else, but it was a dayum shame when Chaos & Order got removed. Half the time when I pvp on servers there's a bit of waiting around at yew gate for either me to flag criminal, or hope for a random red to pop up. At least with Factions, we were ready to go, & attack, no waiting, assuming someone would show up in the usual evening time, which there would be at least 1 or 2 good fights for me on a daily basis. I don't believe in the whole advertisement trashy crap with general chat, just to appeal to someones laziness to scout Felucca, so I usually try to avoid the Felucca cities, since people don't go to them anymore.

But ya, props to you Gedgerez for contributing some thought into saving Factions, ty sir, & I hope we get to keep our Factions, & maybe get battleground games as well. So long & GL to everyone with the outcome.

 

[Barney_wins_UO]

Pwease note the followingds:

Factiond muonts MUST remain but no longer be spawnable through faction system. My Minax horsies have been with me for over 10 years real time, they are a trophy to me, an me fwiends

Faction titles should wemain as a optional title as per the PVE system title, e.g. Commanding Lady of the Minax Faction...as a thank you and reminder of what has gone before.

The points system should remain in some shape or form. Even if t just show the legacy points before the system changed.

The town sigils themselves should be either locked down in their respective townds or be allowed to be taken home finally and locked down (without exploits) as a final easter egg thing for the end of an era

kkk

Barney Wins UO

Greetings everyone,
We would like to share with you an “In Concept” design for the future of the Faction system within Ultima Online. Please remember that while everything you see here is “In Concept” at this stage, it represents the direction we are aiming to go. We look forward to hearing your constructive feedback!


What are our high level goals for this new system?

1. Provide an objective based PvP experience.

2. Offer a sufficient level of gear that allows playing multiple shards to find the fight on whichever shard it may be occurring on.

3. Provide appropriate rewards to incentivize group efforts while engaging the system.

4. Incorporate Ultima’s Virtues as the basis for participating.

What will happen to the current faction system?

1. All aspects of the current faction system will be removed.

2. All currently existing faction artifacts will be allowed to expire via the “Moonbound” property.

3. All faction vendors and faction NPCs will be removed.

4. Town stones and faction bases will be removed.

How will Virtue & Vice work?

1. There are two opposing sides, one representing “Virtue” and one representing “Vice”

2. Each side will have an encampment located somewhere in the overworld where they can get limited amounts of gear similar to old faction gear for free, with additional gear being available for purchase. Each side will also get a mount. These encampments will only be accessible by members of its respective team.

3. Gear will be functionally useful in Felucca only.

4. If a guild participates in Virtue & Vice all members of that guild are automatically enrolled.

5. A single account can only affiliate with one team at a time. You may join multiple characters, but all account characters must be on the same team.

6. The system will track the number of players logged in to each team, when a threshold is met a battle will begin.

How do battles work?

1. At the beginning of each battle a random shrine that hasn’t already been featured in a battle will be chosen.

2. Players on each team will be notified that a shrine has been identified for battle.

3. Battles are objective based on the following:

a. When only 1 team is present in the vicinity of a shrine that team will begin claiming the shrine.

b. If at any time a living member of the opposing team is present in the vicinity of the shrine claiming will cease.

c. Visual cues at the shrine will indicate which team is currently claiming points for that shrine.

d. When resurrected in battle players will receive a “wounded” debuff that provides a damage modifier to incoming damage.

e. If a team reaches a victory threshold for holding the shrine they will be declared victors of that battle.

f. Following a battle there will be a cool down before the system checks to see if the population threshold has been met to begin another battle.

What happens after a battle has concluded?

1. Each shrine that is claimed will give a buff to the members of the team who claim it, while providing a lesser consolation buff to the losing team.

a. After all eight shrines have been cycled through for battle, the team with the most shrines will receive rewards.

2. In the event of a 4-4 tie, the Chaos shrine will be the tie breaker.



Some Player Generated FAQ (Thanks to Tina Small for putting together the base of this list)



Q: How will you put your character into Virtue & Vice?

A: Recruitment NPCs will be available in each of the Feluccan cities.



Q: How will you take characters out of Virtue & Vice and how long will it take to leave? How long will it take to re-join?

A: You can leave instantly at any time using a speech command, it will take 7 days to rejoin. If you shard transfer you will immediately be allowed to rejoin on your destination shard.



Q: How will you know who else is enrolled in Virtue & Vice?

A: There will be a team roster and each team will have their own visual style.



Q: Will there be any kind of structure to Virtue & Vice so that individual characters are perceived as being part of a team? If yes, what does that structure look like?

A: There won’t be any ranks like factions, but working as a team will provide for a greater chance of victory.



Q: If there is no structure to Virtue & Vice and you fight any and all other members of this arrangement on an individual basis, what incentives will people have for participating in it other than presumably just being able to PvP anywhere in the game?

A: There will be objectives that when completed will give rewards. The functionality of Virtue & Vice will be restricted to Felucca.



Q: Will it still be possible to set up guilds to war each other?

A: Yes, Guilds will still be able to war each other as they do now.



Q: If yes, will membership in Virtue & Vice affect how "guild war" kills are counted, i.e., which arrangement/system will take precedence in counting a kill that involves two characters in opposing guilds who also happen to belong to this arrangement?

A: They will work independently of each other.



Q: Will "young" characters be able to join this arrangement?

A: No.



Q: If there are any "teams" to Virtue & Vice, will all your characters on an account on the same shard have to join the same side or stay neutral, or can you have characters on the same account on different "teams" on the same shard?

A: You may only join 1 team per account. You can join multiple characters, but they must all be on the same team.



Q: Will there be anything similar to faction strongholds or bases, or just sign-up/quit stone(s)?

A: Nothing quite as large – think a smaller encampment.



Q: While you're in Virtue & Vice, can other characters in Virtue & Vice heal or rez your character or your pet? Can your guildmates or alliance mates heal or rez your character or pet?

A: When joining Virtue & Vice a guild must be all in. In Felucca if your guild or alliance mates are part of the same team, they will be able to heal and rez both you and your pets.



Q: Can you steal from a character who also belongs to this arrangement while both are outside of Felucca?

A: No.



Q: Will there be anything like the faction 20-minute skill loss period after your character dies to another character that is in Virtue & Vice?

A: There won’t be any stat loss, but continued death will result in a “Wounded” debuff where incoming damage is modified. Attacking one’s own team members will result in a “Traitor” debuff that will have dire negative effects on stats and skills.



Q: Will a character under Virtue & Vice be able to participate in the Trammel and Siege town election system, including taking advantage of town buffs?

A: Yes, so long as they are eligible under the requirements of that system.



Q: Are all kills made by members of Virtue & Vice of other members of Virtue & Vice considered "legal" and not reportable as murders?

A: Yes.



Q: Will you be able to use traps outside Felucca to kill/injure other members of Virtue & Vice? Will you be able to remove such traps?

A: We are still discussing the implementation of any traps within the system.



Q: Will Virtue & Vice add any new kinds of craftables?

A: Not at this time.



Q: What will be the consequences for non-members of Virtue & Vice who assist in kills or kill-attempts made by members of Virtue & Vice?

A: They will flag according to current flagging mechanics.



Q: Will there be any kind of ranking system, shard-wide leaders of any type, voting periods, etc.?

A: Not at this time.



Q: Will there be a leaderboard of any sort to keep track of who has made the most kills?

A: Yes.



Q: Will joining Virtue & Vice grant you any sort of special abilities or access to special items?

A: Yes, you will have access to gear (similar to current faction gear) that will only work in Felucca. These items will not be ephemeral, however will take extreme damage in Trammel.



Q: Are there plans for the designers/developers and the EMs to create special events built around Virtue & Vice?

A: Not at this time, but you never know


Q: What will happen to the faction strongholds, sigil posts and town stones?

A: They will be removed.



Q: Will there be any kind of replacement for faction vendors, especially of the reagent and bottle type?

A: Yes, they will be located within the encampments for each team.



Q: Will the team make sure that NPC pricing in faction towns is not left at an artificially high or low level after the faction system is disabled?

A: Everything related to the current faction system will be removed and returned to its normal operating state.



Q: What will happen to existing faction war horses? Will there be any point in trying to keep them if you won't be able to actually ride them anymore or be able to rez them with bandages without vet skill?

A: Each team will have their own mounts to utilize. Current mounts will be removed.


Q: Will faction silver continue to have a use? What about faction trap deeds, faction trap removal kits, faction robes, faction-hued clothing and weapons, faction artifacts, faction consumables? Will these get stuck in containers and backpacks or on paperdolls and mannequins after the faction system is turned off?

A: Current faction gear will expire normally. Silver will continue to have a use, the extent of which is still in concept. Anything available in Factions as far as consumables will be available in Virtue & Vice.

Q: What about Siege & Mugen?

A: On Siege Perilous & Mugen opposing members of Virtue & Vice will be able to engage in combat anywhere. Initial gear will also be provided while additional gear will be available for purchase.

 

[Viquire]

Having choices is good! Why are we dismantling factions again?

Battles to corrupt or cleanse shrine sounds pretty old school Ultima to me. I am interested to hear more about this VvV. Whee!

 

[Faith]

4. Town stones and faction bases will be removed.

You cannot remove the faction bases... They are a symbol and memory to every old school player that participated in factions. I've probably spent more time defending and sieging faction bases back in the day than anything else since then. If you are to scrap the faction system, let the bases remain.

 

[cazador]

You cannot remove the faction bases... They are a symbol and memory to every old school player that participated in factions. I've probably spent more time defending and sieging faction bases back in the day than anything else since then. If you are to scrap the faction system, let the bases remain.

Well maybe all of them except the goofy CoM base. That needs to go..

 

[virtualhabitat]

Well maybe all of them except the goofy CoM base. That needs to go..

Yeah, the CoM base has rendered the Moonglow teleporter, an historic and useful part of UO heritage, inoperable.

 

[Kyronix]

2. Is wounded a modified stat loss? IE Like , the more you die and you get "wounded" you take MORE damage?

Pretty much. The idea here is that while fighting in a battle if dieing carries no penalty you essentially wind up with a stalemate - everyone just rezzing over...andover...and....over...and...over....

The idea is that your incoming damage will be buffed, for example, if you under normal circumstances were to take 20 damage, if you were wounded you would take 25 etc etc.

 

[Kyronix]

With regard to reagent and bottle vendors, is it possible to have access to our bank box within the encampments? Or, alternatively, can they be placed in select towns near or inside a bank?

I ask because bottles and reagents are heavy items.

The encampments will be fully functional, providing all the modern conveniences of a well equipped stronghold.

 

[Kyronix]

Will there be any formal role for thieves in this system?

We recognized the original outline for the concept didn't include a role for faction thieves - we will change that with a final design. The goal would be to provide a role for thieves that allows thieves to do what they do best, steal...sneak...peak...evade....

 

[Vexxed]

Just a Suggestion for all of those "Don't Remove Factions People."...

I'm almost positive they are going to move forward with this whole thing, so please stop begging for them not to and instead lets give them feedback that will make a great system that REPLACES factions etc. I'd rather spend all this time helping them get it right then telling them we don't want it & have them do it anyway (refinements) without a guiding hand from the players...

 

[Kyronix]

Can you please clarify how you will participate in this system if you do not want to leave your current guild? I imagine that participation will work the same as it does today with factions, that is:

• You can join with a character that does not belong to a guild.
• When a guild leader character joins a side, every character in the guild who does not already have a character on the same account in the opposing side is also added to the side that the guild leader joined. Characters in the guild who already have a character on the same account in the opposing side are supposed to be dropped from the guild. (This seems to be bugged and people have abused the "guild leader joins the whole guild to a side" mechanic as a way to get characters on the same account and shard into opposing sides in factions.)
• If you want to have a character join a guild that already belongs to one side in this system, you must first go to Fel and join that side of the system (if able to do so with characters on that account, i.e., no other characters on that account on that shard belong to the other side) and then be added to the guild.
• If you want to drop out of this system and are not the guild leader, you must drop out of the guild your character belongs to and then leave with the appropriate speech command.
• If you drop out of the system using a guild leader character, every character in the guild is simultaneously dropped out of the system.

So, will things work as above with this new system? Also, can a guild leader join their guild to the system if the guild is allied with another guild that has joined the other side in the system? Can a guild leader join the system if the guild is allied with another guild that is not involved in the system at all? What if the guild leader of the guild that formed the alliance joins the system--does that cause every other guild in the alliance to also join the system? A few years ago, we had to remove our faction guilds from alliances with non-faction guilds, so I would assume that most guilds that were in factions already and want to join this new system won't have problems with existing alliances unless their alliance mates want to go in a different direction with this system, perhaps for role-playing purposes or because of shard politics. (Another reason to allow more sides than two in this system to give more flexibility to existing alliances that want to enter the system!)

While in Fel, will you be able to trade pets, rez, or perform any other beneficial acts on characters that belong to the other side in the system or if they belong to any side in the system but your character does not? Will there be any "beneficial acts" restrictions with respect to members of this system while they are outside of Felucca? How will "beneficial acts" restrictions (if any) work on Siege and Mugen in facets other than Felucca?
How will you see the team roster? Will it be available for viewing while not logged into the game? How long will inactive team members show up on the team roster? In which order will team members be listed and will you be able to see any additional information about them such as their guild membership, skills, etc.?

If you join the "Vice" side of this system, will your character still be able to work on and benefit from the existing virtue system? If you join the "Virtue" side of this system, will your character still be able to work on and benefit from the existing virtue system? Will joining the "Vice" side of the system affect your character's karma, e.g., will it be a bad thing to do if your character uses chivalry? Will joining the "Virtue" side of the system make sense for negative-karma characters?

That's all I can think of for questions at the moment. I'm sure I'll have more later. Thank you for putting out these "in-concept" notes and giving us a chance to mull them over!

Participation at the guild level will work similar to how it works now with factions. We had originally hoped to be able to make it an individual opt-in/opt-out system independent of your guild affiliation, however there are serious issues regarding flagging/targeting/aggression. Joining Virtue or Vice won't have an effect on the Virtue system or your karma or anything like that.

 

[Kyronix]

I like the idea of people getting a starter set so they can PvP on other shards.

1. Will this gear be like the old Faction Arties?
2. Is there any way to make this gear only function around the Battle Shrines only?
3. What are these Buffs and how long do they last?
4. I there anyway to make it where these Buffs only work around the Battle Shrines?
5. Reason for #2 and #4 is depending on the Gear and Buffs these will be used just like the old system and should NOT BE ALLOWED AT CHAMP SPAWNS and should be usefull only when a Battle is ongoing or PEOPLE WILL FIND A WAY TO ABUSE THIS SYYTEM TOO. One group of players could do this with no problem using multi accounts. Main Account on one side and 2nd Account on the other side. Most UO Players have more than one account and with dual client this will be done.

1. Kind of - but different.
2. The gear will be limited to Felucca only for functional use.
3. The details of the buffs are still in the planning stage.
4. There are arguments for and against this...something we'll have to decide after we get a working prototype.
5. Understandable, it's going to rely on balancing and the final design.

 

[Kyronix]

Will the "Traitor" situation only apply when a battle is active?

Will you be able to issue counts if killed by a team member outside battles/outside battle zones?

That's the intent. Our goal is to treat everything that happens outside of a battle as you would normally expect it to occur in Felucca.

 

[Kyronix]

I do have an opinion too! ;-)
And now my biggest concern:
Why is this better than factions?
I play factions for two reasons:
1. If you kill someone in a faction fight, you are rid of him for 20 min, enough time to finish the champ. In a classic blue vs. red you have endless resurrection and fighting without ever coming to a conclusion. This might also work with the wound system, we'll see.
2. My whole guild loves having control of towns - 'tis a roleplaying thing even tho we are more of a powergamer guild. Conquering and defending towns, setting up vendors and guards, those are the fun things. People asked for year for improvement on the town interaction side of factions. But instead with those battlegrounds you will go away from that. I fear this way the system might go the way of the arenas, even PvPers prefer to fight for something. No one really cares about the shrines in the middle of nowhere, the towns on the other hand...

Why is this better than factions?
1. Factions controlling cities always presents a challenge when adding new content. Virtue & Vice does not have a city component, thus we eliminate that problem.
2. There has been a long standing issue with the use and prevalence of faction artifacts by those who do not participate in factions, this will address that issue.
3. Factions requires a critical mass to support it on any given shard, something that is not plausible on every shard. Virtue & Vice does not require that critical mass.
4. There is no farming required to do anything with Virtue & Vice...everything is the result of participating in player vs. player content...fighting/stealing/evading etc etc.

Regarding your concerns...

The wounded debuff is intended to make sure it's not an endless resurrection fest.

We are looking at means to introduce more opportunities for role play throughout the game, the recent Governorships a good example.

Thanks for the feedback!

 

[Kyronix]

Blocking off areas will be a nut to crack. Bagballs etc can be used to block large areas around the shrines as well as limiting the recall chances to the area. Perhaps ultra fast decay of items in the nearby area is one method to handle this.

We are looking at providing a solution to this by centering battles in a mirrored area of the shrine....something along the lines of you go to a shrine, then head to the battleground area. This allows us to both deal with housing in the area that could complicate things, as well as provide different areas for battle with varying landscapes and other natural features...which of course makes for a more fun fighting experience.

Thanks for the feedback!

 

[Kyronix]

Why name it Virtue & Vice? Why not Order Vs Chaos again.. That system was good and brought about great guild battles back in the day!

Order vs. Chaos doesn't really fit right now with the fictional landscape of our Britannia.

 

[Kyronix]

The only reason I play is to put people in stat. That's the only reason. The shrines is a good idea but why allow a guild to keep resurrecting for 3 hours due to mass numbers and allow them to be stronger after they resurrect?

You will still be able to put your enemies into a world of pain and misery, resurrecting multiple times will have seriously negative effects. We want to give you an agile and easily accessible means to get in and fight, allowing you to play across multiple shards and bring the pain wherever you wish...right now the Faction system doesn't allow this...we want to fix that.

 

[Kyronix]

I've a few questions

What is stopping players from obtaining rewards on non populated shards and shipping them to populated shards and so decreasing the value of the rewards like they do with powerscrolls?

What is stopping everyone from joining the same side in order to win the rewards? For example, in factions people would join different sides to fight without reward, in this VV system, the winners get the reward so say Virtue has 20 people and Vice has 3, why would a player join Vice knowing his team will never get the rewards?

You are free to ship anything wherever you want (to a degree), as the introduction of the transfer token changed the shard economy to a global one long ago. With the way the battles will work, a certain threshold must be met on each team before the battle initiates...if there are 300 Virtue players online and only 1 Vice...the battle won't initiate until sufficient balance has been met.

 

[Native]

Is this why test center has been down, perhaps? Are you guys testing this stuff currently? And if so do you have an idea as to when it might be back up?

 

[Kyronix]

I went through about half the thread (so far) and tried to answer some questions where I could. This is very much an In Concept discussion and anything said could very well end up changing with final implementation. We are very interested in continuing the conversation about Virtue & Vice and appreciate the continued feedback. If you asked a question and I didn't answer it I am not ignoring you...feel free to ask again and I'll get an answer for you. If you have questions or would like to submit feedback directly feel free to visit http://www.uo.com/contact

Thanks again everyone for your questions and feedback!

 

[Tjalle]

1. Kind of - but different.

Is there any possibility to not add the new Artifacts to Siege if this new system gets implemented?

Powerful artifacts should not be able to be easily bought through a vending system on Siege. Too similar to insurance IMO.
If a VvV player fights a non-VvV player and dies then he should have to go through the same trouble to re-equip as the non-VvV player would if he was the one who died.
Both sides should be dependant on the revamp loot farming and the imbuing made by crafters.

 

[Tina Small]

3. Factions requires a critical mass to support it on any given shard, something that is not plausible on every shard. Virtue & Vice does not require that critical mass.

With the way the battles will work, a certain threshold must be met on each team before the battle initiates...if there are 300 Virtue players online and only 1 Vice...the battle won't initiate until sufficient balance has been met.

Pretty much. The idea here is that while fighting in a battle if dieing carries no penalty you essentially wind up with a stalemate - everyone just rezzing over...andover...and....over...and...over....

The idea is that your incoming damage will be buffed, for example, if you under normal circumstances were to take 20 damage, if you were wounded you would take 25 etc etc.

You will still be able to put your enemies into a world of pain and misery, resurrecting multiple times will have seriously negative effects. We want to give you an agile and easily accessible means to get in and fight, allowing you to play across multiple shards and bring the pain wherever you wish...right now the Faction system doesn't allow this...we want to fix that.

The wounded debuff is intended to make sure it's not an endless resurrection fest.

At what point does the "wounded debuff" wear off? And is it only possible to become subject to the "wounded debuff" if you die within a certain area on the shard, or will it apply any time you die to someone who is on the opposite side, no matter where the death happens and even if there is no "Virtue vs. Vice" battle in progress? Also, what happens if so many people just log off or quit in the middle of a battle that the initial requirements per side to start the battle are no longer satisfied--will the battle just stop at that point?

It would also be good to get confirmation of how a battle is started and ended and whether there will be any kind of monster spawn to overcome.

 

[Promathia]

I know a big thing alot of pvpers Ive talked to do not like, is the fact you have to fight with people outside of their "group". I know technically you can still kill them, but then you receive the traitor debuff.


I have my own opinions on it, but I know the majority ive talked to do not like the system for that reason.

 

[Promathia]

This is the dumbest crap I have ever heard of... Has anyone on the Dev team ever pvped in Ultima Online? You do realize this will just end up being who has the biggest ZERG...

With the way the battles will work, a certain threshold must be met on each team before the battle initiates...if there are 300 Virtue players online and only 1 Vice...the battle won't initiate until sufficient balance has been met.

From what was said, I dont think being a zerg would be a problem.

 

[Kage]

Why is this better than factions?
1. Factions controlling cities always presents a challenge when adding new content. Virtue & Vice does not have a city component, thus we eliminate that problem.
2. There has been a long standing issue with the use and prevalence of faction artifacts by those who do not participate in factions, this will address that issue.
3. Factions requires a critical mass to support it on any given shard, something that is not plausible on every shard. Virtue & Vice does not require that critical mass.
4. There is no farming required to do anything with Virtue & Vice...everything is the result of participating in player vs. player content...fighting/stealing/evading etc etc.

Regarding your concerns...

The wounded debuff is intended to make sure it's not an endless resurrection fest.

We are looking at means to introduce more opportunities for role play throughout the game, the recent Governorships a good example.

Thanks for the feedback!

This is the dumbest crap I have ever heard of... Has anyone on the Dev team ever pvped in Ultima Online? You do realize this will just end up being who has the biggest ZERG...




FIX FACTIONS

From what I've gathered you guys just feel like getting rid of factions because it causes you to do a little more work when having to introduce new things to the game.(You Should Be Fixing The Game)

But ya I love the Idea of killing people at some dumb random shrine while they all just cast a bunch of para fields and wall of stones and resurrect over and over all day.

OH NO I HAVE BEEN DEBUFFED AND I'M TAKING EXTRA DAMAGE..... ITS OKAY THOUGH I WILL JUST HEAL YOU GUYS UNTIL IT WEARS OFF.

 

[Kyronix]

At what point does the "wounded debuff" wear off? And is it only possible to become subject to the "wounded debuff" if you die within a certain area on the shard, or will it apply any time you die to someone who is on the opposite side, no matter where the death happens and even if there is no "Virtue vs. Vice" battle in progress? Also, what happens if so many people just log off or quit in the middle of a battle that the initial requirements per side to start the battle are no longer satisfied--will the battle just stop at that point?

It would also be good to get confirmation of how a battle is started and ended and whether there will be any kind of monster spawn to overcome.

Long enough to be an effective deterrent but not so long as to become a burden. It will apply anywhere...that's the trade off for free top level gear.

Once a battle has started it will continue until there is a victor. If there is a change in population after a short cool down before the next battle starts the next battle won't initialize.

No monster spawn, this is all about PvP. Participants will be notified when a battle is about to start via messages as well as visual cues.

 

[Lythos-]

We want to give you an agile and easily accessible means to get in and fight, allowing you to play across multiple shards and bring the pain wherever you wish...right now the Faction system doesn't allow this...we want to fix that.

I want to bring the pain across multiple facets. :whip:

 

[Kyronix]

Here are some examples of why you cannot give a 'traitor' penalty to killing someone on your own side.
Lets say you're in Virtue and you're doing a champ or something, and a guild of reds come along who have a couple of players in Virtue with them, the players in Virtue heal the reds, you will then get a penalty for killing that Virtue player who is healing the reds???

The traitor penalty would only apply within the confines of the battle area and each team's encampment...this is to prevent someone from joining a team and simply using that as a means to slaughter their own teammates.

 

[Winker]

Pretty much. The idea here is that while fighting in a battle if dieing carries no penalty you essentially wind up with a stalemate - everyone just rezzing over...andover...and....over...and...over....

The idea is that your incoming damage will be buffed, for example, if you under normal circumstances were to take 20 damage, if you were wounded you would take 25 etc etc.

Not if one team is using a stealther to kill those being rezzed. It then take 3-4 players to make a safe zone to rez the dead. While the team with a stealthier is only using one man to occupie 4 people defending an area for team rezing.

In the days we all played out of factions and battles could have 60+ people all in different guilds. This could cripple a side, just trying to keep the dead alive

 

[Tina Small]

The traitor penalty would only apply within the confines of the battle area and each team's encampment...this is to prevent someone from joining a team and simply using that as a means to slaughter their own teammates.

Are you guys quite sure you can't build more sides into this system? I think there will be some PvP guilds, especially small ones, who will sit this out because they won't want to give any kind of assistance to or be perceived as being allied with (even for a few minutes at a time), certain other guilds who are already in the system. All it will take is for two guilds who are not well-regarded on their shard to join opposite sides and other guilds that were already in the system may just bail out of it to avoid helping either guild. And if those two guilds stay in the system on opposite sides and keep reaping reward after reward for their characters in the way of buffs or better gear, but no one else on the shard wants to be associated with those guilds and has no avenue for defeating them or stripping them of some of their Virtue vs. Vice rewards, what will have been accomplished? No one is going to care about traitor penalties if the bottom-line result of participating in this system is that you could be helping to make your enemies or people you just flat-out despise because you think they are cheaters even more powerful.



Also, can you clarify who qualifies for the rewards and consolation rewards (whatever they are going to be)? Will they only be available to people who actually participated in a battle (or series of battles) or will they be available to every character on a particular side even if they never did anything or were maybe just logged on their Virtue or their Vice character while a battle was going on?

 

[The3rdAuditore]

Kyronix ... while I like the fact you are attempting to make changes, umm this entire system is one huge mistake & will be a fail if this garbage is actually permitted by your boss to go into the game...

I read your replies and it's almost like you don't care about the history that surrounds factions for instance this little gem of a RANT!

Why is this better than factions?
1. Factions controlling cities always presents a challenge when adding new content. Virtue & Vice does not have a city component, thus we eliminate that problem.
2. There has been a long standing issue with the use and prevalence of faction artifacts by those who do not participate in factions, this will address that issue.
3. Factions requires a critical mass to support it on any given shard, something that is not plausible on every shard. Virtue & Vice does not require that critical mass.
4. There is no farming required to do anything with Virtue & Vice...everything is the result of participating in player vs. player content...fighting/stealing/evading etc etc.

What? Seems to me you are adding new content just fine... & More to that why not add new content around the current faction system? Your grand plan of tossing out 14 years of history for something that we all know even you will be bug ridden from the start..
Another question I have for you is exactly how long have you been playing UO? Fighting of the control of a town is not a problem at all! We fight to control the town, to place guards, to control the prices, to have faction vendors, it's a reason to fight and it's a reason to play....

A long standing issue with the use of faction artifacts? You mean like as long as you have ever played UO huh? Well I seem to remember when these items went into the game how they got implemented and there was a developer just like you saying how it will make players join factions and create new wars and bla bla bla just like you are doing right now!

Factions requires a critical mass to support on any given shard? Once again you are wrong this must be why you have no set course for a thief in your new system... You seem like one of those tram blue non-pvpers making a push to abolish factions but never have actually taken part in holds, fights, capturing of towns, placing guards, traps ...
Your idea is to change to basically Call of Duty Domination at shrines, are you kidding us?! Who ever asked for this bud?
We asked for a fix to factions not a total removal and replaced with one guys stupid system.. ONE GUY is basically killing off 14 years of history and memories and your using these things and the voices of non-pvpers to do it - SHAME on you Kyronix!

As for farming silver... Hey bud once again farming silver in fel only leads to more fights and thats what this is all about right?
Yes lets do away with raiding blighted grove, fire or anywhere with oj monsters. Did you ever stop to think players actually enjoy this? Your talking like everything about factions is bad & needs to be removed because everyone hates it.

I want you to seriously rethink what you are doing Kyronix because I don't think you are taking any actual players who PvP into account here. Think dude! Your not because all the real pvpers who have posted are telling you this is a dumb idea! But your not listening are you? Your listening to non pvpers tell you how to make a pvp system..

 

[The3rdAuditore]

We replace this-->

for this?

Accept we just stand on a shrine.. I can see the little capture marker just like in CoD now or the Flags going up like in Battlefield.

Please rethink this stupid idea I can list a billion reasons why you should not change but it's not like your listening to players who actually pvp anyways....

And anyone who supports this change and actually pvps please go take a walk south of Moonglow and look at that base these developers made for CoM.... That is the caliber of creativity we will have on a system that replaces factions.

 

[Kyronix]

Kyronix ... while I like the fact you are attempting to make changes, umm this entire system is one huge mistake & will be a fail if this garbage is actually permitted by your boss to go into the game...

I read your replies and it's almost like you don't care about the history that surrounds factions for instance this little gem of a RANT!


What? Seems to me you are adding new content just fine... & More to that why not add new content around the current faction system? Your grand plan of tossing out 14 years of history for something that we all know even you will be bug ridden from the start..
Another question I have for you is exactly how long have you been playing UO? Fighting of the control of a town is not a problem at all! We fight to control the town, to place guards, to control the prices, to have faction vendors, it's a reason to fight and it's a reason to play....

A long standing issue with the use of faction artifacts? You mean like as long as you have ever played UO huh? Well I seem to remember when these items went into the game how they got implemented and there was a developer just like you saying how it will make players join factions and create new wars and bla bla bla just like you are doing right now!

Factions requires a critical mass to support on any given shard? Once again you are wrong this must be why you have no set course for a thief in your new system... You seem like one of those tram blue non-pvpers making a push to abolish factions but never have actually taken part in holds, fights, capturing of towns, placing guards, traps ...
Your idea is to change to basically Call of Duty Domination at shrines, are you kidding us?! Who ever asked for this bud?
We asked for a fix to factions not a total removal and replaced with one guys stupid system.. ONE GUY is basically killing off 14 years of history and memories and your using these things and the voices of non-pvpers to do it - SHAME on you Kyronix!

As for farming silver... Hey bud once again farming silver in fel only leads to more fights and thats what this is all about right?
Yes lets do away with raiding blighted grove, fire or anywhere with oj monsters. Did you ever stop to think players actually enjoy this? Your talking like everything about factions is bad & needs to be removed because everyone hates it.

I want you to seriously rethink what you are doing Kyronix because I don't think you are taking any actual players who PvP into account here. Think dude! Your not because all the real pvpers who have posted are telling you this is a dumb idea! But your not listening are you? Your listening to non pvpers tell you how to make a pvp system..

Thanks for your feedback. I've been playing UO since 1999 since you asked and have participated in a number of different play styles. At times I've been a "tram blue non-pvpers" that you describe, others I've been a resource gatherer and crafter, a role-players, and others I've been an Abyss shard color war junkie (Which I still think was the best PvP UO offered...right before Siege became a reality).

Part of something being In Concept it is just that - In Concept. The issue I pointed out with faction artifacts used in Trammel is that for a while the system was exploited for the artifacts in that players would join, get free gear, and then never actually participate in the faction system. Over time there have been a series of attempts to fix that, the most recent the inclusion of faction silver. While you may not have an issue with collecting enough silver to sustain the use artifacts, others do, and have made their feelings known. The idea is that if you want to PvP you don't want to have to PvM to farm silver. That is why the artifacts and gear won't require any payment, other than participating and using them in Felucca.

 

[Tina Small]

Please rethink this stupid idea I can list a billion reasons why you should not change but it's not like your listening to players who actually pvp anyways....

I wonder if this new system is actually something that the Ultima Forever team cooked up. They may have figured we would be the perfect guinea pigs to test it and help them fine tune it. The "Virtue vs. Vice" concept and using instanced versions of the shrines seems like it would fit perfectly into Ultima Forever.

 

[Promathia]

What shard are you on that people are still actively fighting over the towns? On Atlantic, its VERY VERY rare to EVER see a fight over owning the towns, a fight over silver. I never even see anyone do anything ASSOCIATED with factions besides using it as a means to go fight and stat each other.Then you have many shards where the pvp guilds arent even IN factions.

From a lore standpoint, the factions don't make sense anymore (Minax gone, Shadowlords dead, ect)

From a game standpoint, factions are basically unused besides the pvp being orange to each other provides. The actual faction SYSTEM is hardly used at all.

Is this new proposed system perfect? Of course not. But that is why they have this thread to get feedback and understand changes that need to be made.