A
Al Thorin
Guest
Ok then, thank you. As I've said, I havn't seen much of it on LS, so I'm not all that familiar with seeing what form tends to be used more than others for that purpose.
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Summoning Pet Balls, Animal Form, and Pets
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A
Al Thorin
Guest
<blockquote><hr>
Too bad these same people don't see the "mob" as a team.. Tamer and Pets.. TEAM... like any other gank squad...
[/ QUOTE ]
Well, that little tid bit right there is -one- reason why tamers are universaly hated.
Techincally, there is no such thing as a 1v1 with a tamer in the mix, and I understand the frustration by many PVP'rs, but have often only had that advatage in a situational 1v1. Dismount in a 1v1 where they don't have anyone else running interfearance, is usually death. In many other situations though, their power is often quite limited.
Too bad these same people don't see the "mob" as a team.. Tamer and Pets.. TEAM... like any other gank squad...
[/ QUOTE ]
Well, that little tid bit right there is -one- reason why tamers are universaly hated.
Techincally, there is no such thing as a 1v1 with a tamer in the mix, and I understand the frustration by many PVP'rs, but have often only had that advatage in a situational 1v1. Dismount in a 1v1 where they don't have anyone else running interfearance, is usually death. In many other situations though, their power is often quite limited.
S
smile
Guest
How about you and/or yalp start a new thread and bring these and other views on how tamer is equivalent to other templates over? We can have a fruitful discussion w/o derailing this thread started by Leurocian.
I presume that you are not a pvp tamer in disguise. So with that new thread, perhaps you can also learn a thing or two about how to unleash the full potential as a tamer. The devs can also be informed better (provided they read it. I am surprised and worried that Leurocian was not aware of an earlier long thread about petballs).
I presume that you are not a pvp tamer in disguise. So with that new thread, perhaps you can also learn a thing or two about how to unleash the full potential as a tamer. The devs can also be informed better (provided they read it. I am surprised and worried that Leurocian was not aware of an earlier long thread about petballs).
I
imported_mr.blackmage
Guest
Yes, you are right. My 5x120 wrestle mage with scribe that can do about 0-20 dps (taking into account interrupts) is more powerful than a pet that can do about 110 dps, along with a fully functional mage that can do 15-20 dps (since they are not getting interrupted). Very well thought out.
No template that currently exists is as powerful as a tamer 1v1. This has been the case for many years. You are silly, your posts don't even make sense. The logic pattern that you are displaying is incomprehensible to me, so maybe that's the problem here.
No template that currently exists is as powerful as a tamer 1v1. This has been the case for many years. You are silly, your posts don't even make sense. The logic pattern that you are displaying is incomprehensible to me, so maybe that's the problem here.
I've basically said all I wanted to say, and I've also said it many times, so I don't really feel like getting into another thread. I also feel that what I said was extremely relevant to this discussion because the whole basis of the thread is a response to the whining that many "real pvp'rs" have been doing on these forums.
I do play a pvp tamer. One of the few successful ones on my shard (Catskills). You might say that I am biased, and there is no doubt that I am, but I also have been doing this for almost two years now, and I know what I am talking about.
If I sound defencive or cranky, it is, in part, due to the fact that I've been listening to the same crap, in and out of game, ever since I started getting into pvp. I am successful, and I do have an extremely good kd ratio, but I am one of the few tamers that does. I am not lying or exaggerating when I say that more than 90% of the tamers I see trying to pvp on my shard, get their butts handed to them on a plate. I just don't see how what I have seen justifies a nerf.
I have heard there is a real problem on Siege, and from what I know of pets in pvp, and can believe it, but a problem on Siege should not translate into a general nerf on all the shards. I would very much like to see the devs actually pay attention to what is really happening on the shards, and not to the whining that goes on here on the Stratics forums.
If the devs find that there are a disproportionate number of pvp tamers on the standard rules set shards, and they are disproportionately successful, then by all means, there will be some "balancing" required, but my guess is this is not the case at all.
Based on the attitudes I have seen both in game and on these forums, there is a large number of "real" pvp'rs who simply think that tamers don't belong in pvp. I strongly and emphatically disagree. My playstyle, and my template, is just as valid as theirs is, in every way. My tamer template takes skill, patience, and hard work to play successfully, just as theirs does and I pay the same $15 a month that they do.
I do play a pvp tamer. One of the few successful ones on my shard (Catskills). You might say that I am biased, and there is no doubt that I am, but I also have been doing this for almost two years now, and I know what I am talking about.
If I sound defencive or cranky, it is, in part, due to the fact that I've been listening to the same crap, in and out of game, ever since I started getting into pvp. I am successful, and I do have an extremely good kd ratio, but I am one of the few tamers that does. I am not lying or exaggerating when I say that more than 90% of the tamers I see trying to pvp on my shard, get their butts handed to them on a plate. I just don't see how what I have seen justifies a nerf.
I have heard there is a real problem on Siege, and from what I know of pets in pvp, and can believe it, but a problem on Siege should not translate into a general nerf on all the shards. I would very much like to see the devs actually pay attention to what is really happening on the shards, and not to the whining that goes on here on the Stratics forums.
If the devs find that there are a disproportionate number of pvp tamers on the standard rules set shards, and they are disproportionately successful, then by all means, there will be some "balancing" required, but my guess is this is not the case at all.
Based on the attitudes I have seen both in game and on these forums, there is a large number of "real" pvp'rs who simply think that tamers don't belong in pvp. I strongly and emphatically disagree. My playstyle, and my template, is just as valid as theirs is, in every way. My tamer template takes skill, patience, and hard work to play successfully, just as theirs does and I pay the same $15 a month that they do.
G
Guest
Guest
<blockquote><hr>
I can imagine myself using the following tactic: stealth to target, wait for dismount, summon rune beetle, 'all kill', summon nightmare, mount, chase, summon rune beetle while keeping pace. Using uoa macros I bet I could do that pretty darn quick. So this is where the summon timer comes into play as well, I will still only be getting 2 hits in by the time the guy is able to remount.
[/ QUOTE ]
Naa it could work but what tamer would go through all this for 1 kill? after the kill he would have to stall his pets and start at square one for one more kill its more hassle then what its worth if you ask me.
I like the 30 second cool down maby in fel only areas/servers only cause I have pvmed with my pet and have had to try to get him out quick it could possibly hurt PvMers " aka trammies". , I also like the no summon while in animal form. I also like the mounted speed forms taking a control slot.
I can imagine myself using the following tactic: stealth to target, wait for dismount, summon rune beetle, 'all kill', summon nightmare, mount, chase, summon rune beetle while keeping pace. Using uoa macros I bet I could do that pretty darn quick. So this is where the summon timer comes into play as well, I will still only be getting 2 hits in by the time the guy is able to remount.
[/ QUOTE ]
Naa it could work but what tamer would go through all this for 1 kill? after the kill he would have to stall his pets and start at square one for one more kill its more hassle then what its worth if you ask me.
I like the 30 second cool down maby in fel only areas/servers only cause I have pvmed with my pet and have had to try to get him out quick it could possibly hurt PvMers " aka trammies". , I also like the no summon while in animal form. I also like the mounted speed forms taking a control slot.
<blockquote><hr>
Yes, you are right. My 5x120 wrestle mage with scribe that can do about 0-20 dps (taking into account interrupts) is more powerful than a pet that can do about 110 dps, along with a fully functional mage that can do 15-20 dps (since they are not getting interrupted). Very well thought out.
[/ QUOTE ]
There is so much more to pvp than simply potential dps. It is true, the potential dps of a tamer with pets might be higher than a mage with scribe, but anyone that knows anything about dexxers and tamers will tell you that the dps of a dexxer is actually higher than that of a tamer, with the exception of a tamer with a pack (and a pack is extremely difficult to play in pvp, and too susceptible to aoe attacks to be useful in most high end pvm situations either). But in pvp mobility is also a huge factor, and even a dismounted player will move faster than any pet, and there is far more to the picture than even that. Pets are slow, and extremely stupid.
What the devs need to do, is stop paying attention to what you and I are saying, because we both are pretty convinced we are right, and start paying attention to what is actually happening in game. They need to find out what the proportions are of tamers playing on standard rules set shards, and how successful they are, again proportionally, and pay attention to what kinds of tamer templates are being played and how successful those templates are.
You and I can argue about this until our fingers fall off, but the truth is that neither of us have any hard evidence to support our arguments and assumptions. The devs are the only ones that have the means at their disposal to collect that evidence, and that is something they should be doing. They should find some way of collecting solid statistics on which they can base their decisions, so that they aren't simply responding to the interest group that whines the longest and hardest.
Yes, you are right. My 5x120 wrestle mage with scribe that can do about 0-20 dps (taking into account interrupts) is more powerful than a pet that can do about 110 dps, along with a fully functional mage that can do 15-20 dps (since they are not getting interrupted). Very well thought out.
[/ QUOTE ]
There is so much more to pvp than simply potential dps. It is true, the potential dps of a tamer with pets might be higher than a mage with scribe, but anyone that knows anything about dexxers and tamers will tell you that the dps of a dexxer is actually higher than that of a tamer, with the exception of a tamer with a pack (and a pack is extremely difficult to play in pvp, and too susceptible to aoe attacks to be useful in most high end pvm situations either). But in pvp mobility is also a huge factor, and even a dismounted player will move faster than any pet, and there is far more to the picture than even that. Pets are slow, and extremely stupid.
What the devs need to do, is stop paying attention to what you and I are saying, because we both are pretty convinced we are right, and start paying attention to what is actually happening in game. They need to find out what the proportions are of tamers playing on standard rules set shards, and how successful they are, again proportionally, and pay attention to what kinds of tamer templates are being played and how successful those templates are.
You and I can argue about this until our fingers fall off, but the truth is that neither of us have any hard evidence to support our arguments and assumptions. The devs are the only ones that have the means at their disposal to collect that evidence, and that is something they should be doing. They should find some way of collecting solid statistics on which they can base their decisions, so that they aren't simply responding to the interest group that whines the longest and hardest.
Leurocian
Can you please give us some feedback on our ideas and let us know when and what you think will be a possible impliment?
3rd attempt....
Can you please give us some feedback on our ideas and let us know when and what you think will be a possible impliment?
3rd attempt....
W
Widowtaker
Guest
rtlfc
Why are we even arguing about this at all. Put a timer on Pet Balls, stop pet's insta log if they are flagged. Done, everyone goes forward with the game. We don't need a committee to look at this. This is NOT rocket science, it's common sense. The super Dragons do not need a nerf, Ninjitsu does not need a nerf.
For God's sake, sometimes I have to wonder about you all.
Why are we even arguing about this at all. Put a timer on Pet Balls, stop pet's insta log if they are flagged. Done, everyone goes forward with the game. We don't need a committee to look at this. This is NOT rocket science, it's common sense. The super Dragons do not need a nerf, Ninjitsu does not need a nerf.
For God's sake, sometimes I have to wonder about you all.
<blockquote><hr>
If a tamer wants to run around knocking people off mount and siccing a super-pet on people thats fine by me. But it just makes absolutely no sense that in the rare instances said tamer dies he can 100% protect his pet just by logging out.
It seems wrong in concept and certainly is wrong in all aspects of fair play. Why even bother having a system in place that drops pets stats when they die if it is damn near impossible to have a pet die? (I assume there is still something in place that drops pets stats if they die? As you can tell I dont play a pvp tamer lol)
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes pets lose skills every time they die. So perhaps your weapons or spells should all do a point less damage for twenty minutes after you die in pvp. That would be the equivalent. There is no other template that has to retrain anything after a death. I don't have any problem with getting rid of auto stabling, but if that is done, the skill loss on deaths needs to go as well.
If a tamer wants to run around knocking people off mount and siccing a super-pet on people thats fine by me. But it just makes absolutely no sense that in the rare instances said tamer dies he can 100% protect his pet just by logging out.
It seems wrong in concept and certainly is wrong in all aspects of fair play. Why even bother having a system in place that drops pets stats when they die if it is damn near impossible to have a pet die? (I assume there is still something in place that drops pets stats if they die? As you can tell I dont play a pvp tamer lol)
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes pets lose skills every time they die. So perhaps your weapons or spells should all do a point less damage for twenty minutes after you die in pvp. That would be the equivalent. There is no other template that has to retrain anything after a death. I don't have any problem with getting rid of auto stabling, but if that is done, the skill loss on deaths needs to go as well.
I
imported_mr.blackmage
Guest
no, the differnce is that I *KNOW* I am right, and you only think you are. The devs should listen to people that solely PvP when it comes to terms of pvp balances.
G
Guest
Guest
<blockquote><hr>
rtlfc
Why are we even arguing about this at all. Put a timer on Pet Balls, stop pet's insta log if they are flagged. Done, everyone goes forward with the game. We don't need a committee to look at this. This is NOT rocket science, it's common sense. The super Dragons do not need a nerf, Ninjitsu does not need a nerf.
For God's sake, sometimes I have to wonder about you all.
[/ QUOTE ]
It would not hurt ninjitsu unless your a gimp ninja tamer with a beetle/2nd pet, or a super dragon.
rtlfc
Why are we even arguing about this at all. Put a timer on Pet Balls, stop pet's insta log if they are flagged. Done, everyone goes forward with the game. We don't need a committee to look at this. This is NOT rocket science, it's common sense. The super Dragons do not need a nerf, Ninjitsu does not need a nerf.
For God's sake, sometimes I have to wonder about you all.
[/ QUOTE ]
It would not hurt ninjitsu unless your a gimp ninja tamer with a beetle/2nd pet, or a super dragon.
C
Clx-
Guest
<blockquote><hr>
no, the differnce is that I *KNOW* I am right, and you only think you are. The devs should listen to people that solely PvP when it comes to terms of pvp balances.
[/ QUOTE ]
Indeed.
no, the differnce is that I *KNOW* I am right, and you only think you are. The devs should listen to people that solely PvP when it comes to terms of pvp balances.
[/ QUOTE ]
Indeed.
______________________
"Yes pets lose skills every time they die. So perhaps your weapons or spells should all do a point less damage for twenty minutes after you die in pvp. That would be the equivalent. There is no other template that has to retrain anything after a death. I don't have any problem with getting rid of auto stabling, but if that is done, the skill loss on deaths needs to go as well"
______________________
My bad
I totally forgot how obtuse non-pvp tamers could be.
Nice job though trying to compare your 1 billion hit point, non-killable, flamestrike casting pet with my sword.
"Yes pets lose skills every time they die. So perhaps your weapons or spells should all do a point less damage for twenty minutes after you die in pvp. That would be the equivalent. There is no other template that has to retrain anything after a death. I don't have any problem with getting rid of auto stabling, but if that is done, the skill loss on deaths needs to go as well"
______________________
My bad
I totally forgot how obtuse non-pvp tamers could be.
Nice job though trying to compare your 1 billion hit point, non-killable, flamestrike casting pet with my sword.
<blockquote><hr>
Nice job though trying to compare your 1 billion hit point, non-killable, flamestrike casting pet with my sword.
[/ QUOTE ]
Your sword that attacks at the swing speed cap, that has 45 hci, that restores mana and life every time it hits, that always hits the lowest resists, that does 100% extra damage, plus a dozen other possible magical effects. You specifically might not have all these things, but an advanced dexxer will have most of these things, if not all, plus 45 dci, and all of these bonuses that I listed are bonuses that no pet has (and I didn't even mention hld and hla, again, something that no pet has).
<blockquote><hr>
no, the differnce is that I *KNOW* I am right, and you only think you are. The devs should listen to people that solely PvP when it comes to terms of pvp balances.
[/ QUOTE ]<blockquote><hr>
I totally forgot how obtuse non-pvp tamers could be.
[/ QUOTE ]
You are both fairly funny. I gain justice once a week, right after the virtue decay timer does its thing. That probably equates to me gaining justice less than one in twenty pvp kills. You may wonder what this has to do with anything? Well, I've been a knight of justice for well around two years now. Ask anyone who pvp's on the Catskills shard if they've heard of Llewen, they'll know who I am. They may hate me, but they'll know who I am...
See the difference between what you two are saying, and what I am saying, is that I actually use examples, and give concrete details when I make a point. I don't just say "I *KNOW* I am right", even though I'm pretty confident that I am. I'm old enough, and experienced enough to realize that I could always be wrong.
That's why I have suggested that the developers gather some statistics so they have something concrete, something other than a few cranky clients' opinions to base their decisions on. And trust me on this one, in comparison to the overall population of the game, all the people that whine, complain, and toss around temper tantrums and insults on these boards (and I'm not saying I never do this, because I do), are a very few.
Nice job though trying to compare your 1 billion hit point, non-killable, flamestrike casting pet with my sword.
[/ QUOTE ]
Your sword that attacks at the swing speed cap, that has 45 hci, that restores mana and life every time it hits, that always hits the lowest resists, that does 100% extra damage, plus a dozen other possible magical effects. You specifically might not have all these things, but an advanced dexxer will have most of these things, if not all, plus 45 dci, and all of these bonuses that I listed are bonuses that no pet has (and I didn't even mention hld and hla, again, something that no pet has).
<blockquote><hr>
no, the differnce is that I *KNOW* I am right, and you only think you are. The devs should listen to people that solely PvP when it comes to terms of pvp balances.
[/ QUOTE ]<blockquote><hr>
I totally forgot how obtuse non-pvp tamers could be.
[/ QUOTE ]
You are both fairly funny. I gain justice once a week, right after the virtue decay timer does its thing. That probably equates to me gaining justice less than one in twenty pvp kills. You may wonder what this has to do with anything? Well, I've been a knight of justice for well around two years now. Ask anyone who pvp's on the Catskills shard if they've heard of Llewen, they'll know who I am. They may hate me, but they'll know who I am...
See the difference between what you two are saying, and what I am saying, is that I actually use examples, and give concrete details when I make a point. I don't just say "I *KNOW* I am right", even though I'm pretty confident that I am. I'm old enough, and experienced enough to realize that I could always be wrong.
That's why I have suggested that the developers gather some statistics so they have something concrete, something other than a few cranky clients' opinions to base their decisions on. And trust me on this one, in comparison to the overall population of the game, all the people that whine, complain, and toss around temper tantrums and insults on these boards (and I'm not saying I never do this, because I do), are a very few.
I
imported_Goron
Guest
<blockquote><hr>
<blockquote><hr>
lol kiddo, I'll respond once again the same way Nerf has everytime:
I CAN MOVE AT MOUNTED SPEED WITH A BEETLE AND KILL. I DO NOT NEED A SUPER DRAGON. I wrote that in all capital letters in an attempt to emphasize my point, because it is obviously not coming across. Super dragons are just more powerful sure, but a beetle is enough. I dont use a super dragon, I dont need one, rune beetle does fine.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes, a rune beetle does fine. I've yet to argue that pet ball run downs cannot be done without ninjitsu.
Maybe if you'd focus a little less on the caps lock key, you'd actually be able to grasp that super dragons -should not- be able to be pet balled in that manor, and only -1- skill is permited to do so.
Pet balls need to be adressed. Fine and wonderfull. There's still one -remaining- issue that ties -very specifically- to pet balls -and- ninjitsu. Unless petballs are nerfed into oblivion, which is probably what will happen due to the level of whining, Ninjitsu and the dragon -specifically- will continue to be an issue -regardless- of pet ball limits. (short of nerfing into oblivion)
What brand are your blinders? I must avoid them with my animals, as I do not need them focused so narrowly.
[/ QUOTE ]
lol, you just can't get over superdragons can you? lol. have fun.
<blockquote><hr>
lol kiddo, I'll respond once again the same way Nerf has everytime:
I CAN MOVE AT MOUNTED SPEED WITH A BEETLE AND KILL. I DO NOT NEED A SUPER DRAGON. I wrote that in all capital letters in an attempt to emphasize my point, because it is obviously not coming across. Super dragons are just more powerful sure, but a beetle is enough. I dont use a super dragon, I dont need one, rune beetle does fine.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes, a rune beetle does fine. I've yet to argue that pet ball run downs cannot be done without ninjitsu.
Maybe if you'd focus a little less on the caps lock key, you'd actually be able to grasp that super dragons -should not- be able to be pet balled in that manor, and only -1- skill is permited to do so.
Pet balls need to be adressed. Fine and wonderfull. There's still one -remaining- issue that ties -very specifically- to pet balls -and- ninjitsu. Unless petballs are nerfed into oblivion, which is probably what will happen due to the level of whining, Ninjitsu and the dragon -specifically- will continue to be an issue -regardless- of pet ball limits. (short of nerfing into oblivion)
What brand are your blinders? I must avoid them with my animals, as I do not need them focused so narrowly.
[/ QUOTE ]
lol, you just can't get over superdragons can you? lol. have fun.
I
imported_Yalp
Guest
What an excellent idea.. developers doing their jobs instead of asking for ways to cripple a particular template/playstyle. This system is inherently about who complains the loudest getting action from the devs.
The mindset that has become concrete in the pvp world, is that tamer/pet are a plague. Tamer and pet are a TEAM. 2 characters, each with strengths and weaknesses. Two characters that act in concert with each other. Two characters capable of being defeated with the right tactics. 2 Characters capable of being successful with the right tactics.
Confusious say, when entering into pvp against 2 opponents, a**hat may be handed to you!
And yes, this line of discussion does belong in this thread.. because my argument is... LEAVE the petballs ALONE! And stop listening to the few complainers who don't want to have to change anything about themselves, ever, ever, ever.
LORD Yalp of Zento, CTDM
The mindset that has become concrete in the pvp world, is that tamer/pet are a plague. Tamer and pet are a TEAM. 2 characters, each with strengths and weaknesses. Two characters that act in concert with each other. Two characters capable of being defeated with the right tactics. 2 Characters capable of being successful with the right tactics.
Confusious say, when entering into pvp against 2 opponents, a**hat may be handed to you!
And yes, this line of discussion does belong in this thread.. because my argument is... LEAVE the petballs ALONE! And stop listening to the few complainers who don't want to have to change anything about themselves, ever, ever, ever.
LORD Yalp of Zento, CTDM
I
imported_athos_uo
Guest
A player has posted on my site, he is for adding casting to summon pets. If a tamer needs to cast in order to summon pets, you can interefere his cast or recall out during his casting.
He made a proposal that it would be interesting to be able to cast to send pets into stable, if casting is necessary for summoning pets from stable,
And he is against increasing charges for summoning. It wouldn't contribute to nerfing pet summoning PK.
--
As for me(athos), this issue has nothing to do with my life in UO.
I personally think, in general, it is not good to make something too inconvenient, for the sake of PvPers.
He made a proposal that it would be interesting to be able to cast to send pets into stable, if casting is necessary for summoning pets from stable,
And he is against increasing charges for summoning. It wouldn't contribute to nerfing pet summoning PK.
--
As for me(athos), this issue has nothing to do with my life in UO.
I personally think, in general, it is not good to make something too inconvenient, for the sake of PvPers.
G
Guest
Guest
Firstly, accept that there will always be PvPers who believe tamers do not belong in PvP. It's been the case since I started UO up with the 10x ww tamers to now where the pet balls have enabled a few tamers to turn gimp. I'm glad the taming skill can't hit 120 in a day because it wouldn't just be a few doing the gimp thing
Secondly, you have to understand that problems with pet AI don't mean that any pet ball changes are wrong, only that they require fixes to pet AI. If you're using pet balls as a sticky plaster to cope each time the AI fails, it's the AI you need to worry about.
Now, as an example, I don't usually have a pet ball with me. I hunt carefully, because I don't want to risk my pets dying. Sure I can recall out with my pets etc, but usually I don't. I would rather the AI was fixed too. I don't want that ball to become a daily part of my tamer's lives.
When it comes to PvP, the tools we have at our disposal need some restriction to prevent their worst abuses. A skilled tamer PvPer can adapt to restrictions on using pet balls. I don't consider myself good at PvP, yet I don't feel my tamer is sucky. It's a pity tamers were allowed to get used to having pet balls in PvP, but that doesn't mean you can't adapt to using them less
Wenchy
Secondly, you have to understand that problems with pet AI don't mean that any pet ball changes are wrong, only that they require fixes to pet AI. If you're using pet balls as a sticky plaster to cope each time the AI fails, it's the AI you need to worry about.
Now, as an example, I don't usually have a pet ball with me. I hunt carefully, because I don't want to risk my pets dying. Sure I can recall out with my pets etc, but usually I don't. I would rather the AI was fixed too. I don't want that ball to become a daily part of my tamer's lives.
When it comes to PvP, the tools we have at our disposal need some restriction to prevent their worst abuses. A skilled tamer PvPer can adapt to restrictions on using pet balls. I don't consider myself good at PvP, yet I don't feel my tamer is sucky. It's a pity tamers were allowed to get used to having pet balls in PvP, but that doesn't mean you can't adapt to using them less
Wenchy
I don't have a problem with a ten second cool down on pet balls, and ninjas not being able to use them in animal form. I do have a problem with a 30 second cool down, and I do have a problem with a delay on use similar to spell casting, unless the A.I. is fixed, and the skill loss on death is gotten rid of.
I
imported_Yalp
Guest
I just don't agree that there is an abuse of the pet ball in pvp.
I think it's a few peeps complaining because they can't run away from a pet... which leads me to say.. I don't think that's an issue either. Because Tamer and Pet are a TEAM. If two players (no pets) engage another, all players can run at the same speed..exceptions being those already identified .. ninja, casting, etc.
The pet does have a disadvantage, in that they don't move the same speed as the player. That may be the issue. If pets, once targeted on you, can keep up with you, then the issue of the pet ball "abuse" goes away.. of course.. this will bring up a whole new hornet's nest of discussion...
But this discussion comes about because some peeps use the pet ball to keep the player targeted. Is it really so different than 2 players remaining on the target? I don't think it is.. and that's why I don't agree that the pet ball "abuse" is a valid argument.
LORD Yalp of Zento, CTDM
I think it's a few peeps complaining because they can't run away from a pet... which leads me to say.. I don't think that's an issue either. Because Tamer and Pet are a TEAM. If two players (no pets) engage another, all players can run at the same speed..exceptions being those already identified .. ninja, casting, etc.
The pet does have a disadvantage, in that they don't move the same speed as the player. That may be the issue. If pets, once targeted on you, can keep up with you, then the issue of the pet ball "abuse" goes away.. of course.. this will bring up a whole new hornet's nest of discussion...
But this discussion comes about because some peeps use the pet ball to keep the player targeted. Is it really so different than 2 players remaining on the target? I don't think it is.. and that's why I don't agree that the pet ball "abuse" is a valid argument.
LORD Yalp of Zento, CTDM
C
Clx-
Guest
<blockquote><hr>
I just don't agree that there is an abuse of the pet ball in pvp.
[/ QUOTE ]
hahah
I just don't agree that there is an abuse of the pet ball in pvp.
[/ QUOTE ]
hahah
I
imported_Lord GOD(GOD)
Guest
<blockquote><hr>
It would not hurt ninjitsu unless your a gimp ninja tamer with a beetle/2nd pet, or a super dragon.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes it would.
It would not hurt ninjitsu unless your a gimp ninja tamer with a beetle/2nd pet, or a super dragon.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes it would.
G
Guest
Guest
I think we all draw the line differently with what we as tamers feel is ok.
There is also a line where EA set out how they feel things should work, as balanced against other templates.
With pets, I think they should move at their speed and no faster. I think EA intended that too. Look at revenants, for example. The gits glue themselves to you regardless of how fast you run. You can't hide, you can't cast, so unless you're a dexer you're a corpse on feet. At least I have been when on foot
It would be exceptionally frustrating if pets attacked like that by themselves, never mind in the current pet ball attack mode.
With pet balls, the tamer can not only pop out from being hidden and drop them on you, repeatedly, they're also turbo charging pets that otherwise couldn't move nearly as fast. Tamers wouldn't be devastating without the pet balls. Still effective in the hands of a skilled PvPer, but a far cry from the utterly gimpy kills they can do right now.
It comes down to what EA intended us to do with petballs. IMO they weren't intended as PvP weapons and thus should be changed so they can't be used to circumvent the normal movement of pets in PvP to the extreme we have now.
Wenchy
There is also a line where EA set out how they feel things should work, as balanced against other templates.
With pets, I think they should move at their speed and no faster. I think EA intended that too. Look at revenants, for example. The gits glue themselves to you regardless of how fast you run. You can't hide, you can't cast, so unless you're a dexer you're a corpse on feet. At least I have been when on foot
With pet balls, the tamer can not only pop out from being hidden and drop them on you, repeatedly, they're also turbo charging pets that otherwise couldn't move nearly as fast. Tamers wouldn't be devastating without the pet balls. Still effective in the hands of a skilled PvPer, but a far cry from the utterly gimpy kills they can do right now.
It comes down to what EA intended us to do with petballs. IMO they weren't intended as PvP weapons and thus should be changed so they can't be used to circumvent the normal movement of pets in PvP to the extreme we have now.
Wenchy
I
imported_mr.blackmage
Guest
<blockquote><hr>
<blockquote><hr>
I just don't agree that there is an abuse of the pet ball in pvp.
[/ QUOTE ]
hahah
[/ QUOTE ]
<blockquote><hr>
I just don't agree that there is an abuse of the pet ball in pvp.
[/ QUOTE ]
hahah
[/ QUOTE ]
T
trickmaster
Guest
GUYS
Can we talk about the 76 damage firebreath that my dragon just did?
I hope these things don't change
Can we talk about the 76 damage firebreath that my dragon just did?
I hope these things don't change
I
imported_ElRay
Guest
<blockquote><hr>
Hello Everyone,
Just letting you know we have been reading your feedback on summoning pet balls, animal form, and pets.
Some of the suggestions I've seen target reducing effectiveness of one or more of these three things.
At the moment, I'm more inclined to look at the summoning pet balls first and see if we want to make any changes to it. One of the main suggestions I have seen that has possibilities is to require a reuse timer for the summoning pet balls, and perhaps don't allow them to be used while in animal form.
Let's try and only discuss pet summoning ball specific changes in this thread. I'd like to gather specific feedback on them.
Thanks all!
[/ QUOTE ]
thank you for taking the time to address this problem
Hello Everyone,
Just letting you know we have been reading your feedback on summoning pet balls, animal form, and pets.
Some of the suggestions I've seen target reducing effectiveness of one or more of these three things.
At the moment, I'm more inclined to look at the summoning pet balls first and see if we want to make any changes to it. One of the main suggestions I have seen that has possibilities is to require a reuse timer for the summoning pet balls, and perhaps don't allow them to be used while in animal form.
Let's try and only discuss pet summoning ball specific changes in this thread. I'd like to gather specific feedback on them.
Thanks all!
[/ QUOTE ]
thank you for taking the time to address this problem
I
imported_Lord GOD(GOD)
Guest
<blockquote><hr>
GUYS
Can we talk about the 76 damage firebreath that my dragon just did?
I hope these things don't change
[/ QUOTE ]
Thats not really the focus of this thread, the dragons aren't being considered for nerf - yet.
Btw what your dragons firebreath does depends greatly on the targets fire resist.
GUYS
Can we talk about the 76 damage firebreath that my dragon just did?
I hope these things don't change
[/ QUOTE ]
Thats not really the focus of this thread, the dragons aren't being considered for nerf - yet.
Btw what your dragons firebreath does depends greatly on the targets fire resist.
________________
"I just don't agree that there is an abuse of the pet ball in pvp"
"LORD Yalp of Zento, CTDM"
________________
I honestly don't know what is more ridiculous...
Your obviously self-serving denial of pet ball abuse or your self-imposed & equally ridiculous title of 'LORD bla bla bla'
IMO neither your statements or your self proclaimed title have given you one ounce of credibility and I for one now know to look right past anything you may post in the future.
Peace
"I just don't agree that there is an abuse of the pet ball in pvp"
"LORD Yalp of Zento, CTDM"
________________
I honestly don't know what is more ridiculous...
Your obviously self-serving denial of pet ball abuse or your self-imposed & equally ridiculous title of 'LORD bla bla bla'
IMO neither your statements or your self proclaimed title have given you one ounce of credibility and I for one now know to look right past anything you may post in the future.
Peace
I
imported_Yalp
Guest
I'm certainly willing to read all personal attacks you might want to throw at me... but I'm more interested in debating the issue.
As for credibility, I only claim what we are all entitled to.. I pay my fees and I play UO.
LORD Yalp of Zento, CTDM
As for credibility, I only claim what we are all entitled to.. I pay my fees and I play UO.
LORD Yalp of Zento, CTDM
G
Good_Ole_Lefty
Guest
A timer is a good start, but a PK usually will set their own time to strike. Thus they travel off screen for 30 seconds and come back.
It takes no skill or mana to run a pvp tamer. This in itself is an imbalance. Every other template type uses some form of mana and or calculations. The use of a heavy x bow with hld, rune beetle with corruption and spells from both the beetle and mare+ running shot is overkill on a single target.
It takes no skill or mana to run a pvp tamer. This in itself is an imbalance. Every other template type uses some form of mana and or calculations. The use of a heavy x bow with hld, rune beetle with corruption and spells from both the beetle and mare+ running shot is overkill on a single target.
I
imported_Anakena
Guest
<blockquote><hr>
GUYS
Can we talk about the 76 damage firebreath that my dragon just did?
I hope these things don't change
[/ QUOTE ]
Impossible for a greater dragon against 70 fire resist. For such a result the target had probably less than 25 fire resist.
GUYS
Can we talk about the 76 damage firebreath that my dragon just did?
I hope these things don't change
[/ QUOTE ]
Impossible for a greater dragon against 70 fire resist. For such a result the target had probably less than 25 fire resist.
G
Guest
Guest
How about instead of nerfing the pet ball you all nerf the animal form? Make it so that while in animal form that it takes one of your follower slots. The advantage of animal form that everyone I know uses it for is to be able to run as fast as you can on a mount without being on a mount. If any nerf is to be done to the pet ball then I like the idea about making it so you can not use the pet ball while in animal form. Please do not add a re-use timer or any of the other suggestions.. Thank You.
<blockquote><hr>
It takes no skill or mana to run a pvp tamer.
[/ QUOTE ]
As soon as you say something like that you show me you know nothing about tamers, and therefore, any opinion you might have about them is basically worthless...
<blockquote><hr>
I like the idea about making it so you can not use the pet ball while in animal form.
[/ QUOTE ]
/signed That solution targets the specific problem that most are complaining about, without screwing over the entire profession. I don't much care about animal forms taking a control slot. I don't really think that is necessary. The one fix of making pet balls unusable while in animal form is the magic bullet as far as I am concerned. I don't like a re-use timer either, not while there is skill loss on death, and not while the chasing a.i. is ridiculously inept.
It takes no skill or mana to run a pvp tamer.
[/ QUOTE ]
As soon as you say something like that you show me you know nothing about tamers, and therefore, any opinion you might have about them is basically worthless...
<blockquote><hr>
I like the idea about making it so you can not use the pet ball while in animal form.
[/ QUOTE ]
/signed That solution targets the specific problem that most are complaining about, without screwing over the entire profession. I don't much care about animal forms taking a control slot. I don't really think that is necessary. The one fix of making pet balls unusable while in animal form is the magic bullet as far as I am concerned. I don't like a re-use timer either, not while there is skill loss on death, and not while the chasing a.i. is ridiculously inept.
S
smile
Guest
<blockquote><hr>
I think it's a few peeps complaining because they can't run away from a pet... which leads me to say.. I don't think that's an issue either. Because Tamer and Pet are a TEAM. If two players (no pets) engage another, all players can run at the same speed..exceptions being those already identified .. ninja, casting, etc.
The pet does have a disadvantage, in that they don't move the same speed as the player. That may be the issue. If pets, once targeted on you, can keep up with you, then the issue of the pet ball "abuse" goes away.. of course.. this will bring up a whole new hornet's nest of discussion...
But this discussion comes about because some peeps use the pet ball to keep the player targeted. Is it really so different than 2 players remaining on the target? I don't think it is.. and that's why I don't agree that the pet ball "abuse" is a valid argument.
LORD Yalp of Zento, CTDM
[/ QUOTE ]
let me paraphrase some of your views, one of which you had repeated in this and several other of your posts:
Your view: tamer and pets are a team. it is no different from a gank situation, which is common in pvp.
Meaning: a tamer is a template that allows me to have the ability to gank others. if you ever fight me (i.e. a tamer), remember it is never a 1 vs 1 fight. it is a 2 or 3 vs 1 fight. I do not see this as overpowering. afterall, my tag team partner is just a 900 hp overgrown lizard with fire breath and spell casting abilities. if you cannot survive against such a gank situation, you suck.
Your view: i see no issue with others not being able to run away from my pets. in fact, my pets should be able to catch up with you.
Meaning: aww.... if I (i.e. a tamer) attacks you with my 900 hp overgrown lizard with fire breath and spell casting abilities, just die and go get rez ok? isn't dying part of pvp?
I think it's a few peeps complaining because they can't run away from a pet... which leads me to say.. I don't think that's an issue either. Because Tamer and Pet are a TEAM. If two players (no pets) engage another, all players can run at the same speed..exceptions being those already identified .. ninja, casting, etc.
The pet does have a disadvantage, in that they don't move the same speed as the player. That may be the issue. If pets, once targeted on you, can keep up with you, then the issue of the pet ball "abuse" goes away.. of course.. this will bring up a whole new hornet's nest of discussion...
But this discussion comes about because some peeps use the pet ball to keep the player targeted. Is it really so different than 2 players remaining on the target? I don't think it is.. and that's why I don't agree that the pet ball "abuse" is a valid argument.
LORD Yalp of Zento, CTDM
[/ QUOTE ]
let me paraphrase some of your views, one of which you had repeated in this and several other of your posts:
Your view: tamer and pets are a team. it is no different from a gank situation, which is common in pvp.
Meaning: a tamer is a template that allows me to have the ability to gank others. if you ever fight me (i.e. a tamer), remember it is never a 1 vs 1 fight. it is a 2 or 3 vs 1 fight. I do not see this as overpowering. afterall, my tag team partner is just a 900 hp overgrown lizard with fire breath and spell casting abilities. if you cannot survive against such a gank situation, you suck.
Your view: i see no issue with others not being able to run away from my pets. in fact, my pets should be able to catch up with you.
Meaning: aww.... if I (i.e. a tamer) attacks you with my 900 hp overgrown lizard with fire breath and spell casting abilities, just die and go get rez ok? isn't dying part of pvp?
I
imported_Yalp
Guest
In your attempts to consolidate my views you've missed just a tad from my opinion. Comparing Tamer/Pet v. single pvp'r is like comparing apples to oranges... how about comparing apples to apples? Or least I be attacked for discriminating against citrus, oranges to oranges.
Pet/Tamer (2 slot "team") v. other 2 slot team. In this case.. if you nerf ability of one of those 2 slot teams to work efffectively together, you have crippled one template to play pvp. This I am strongly NOT in favor of.
This leads into my second point which is many on this thread and in Fel are in favor of removing any effectiveness of tamers from doing pvp. This is also were I differ in your opinion. Why should Tamers and/or their tools be nerfed so far that they can no longer choose to play in pvp? Do they not also pay their monthly fee? Do they not have the right to be in fel? Or should they just be an ATM machine for "serious" pvp'rs? This is a philosophy I do not subscribe to.
And as so often the case .. the squeeky wheel gets the grease, I am offering up my voice in the opposition of the few squeeky wheels that are demanding the dev's nerf all aspects of tamer pvp. (this time guised in the cloak of animal form/petball/ninja tamer/dragon argument).
And lastly, when you attempted to characterize my thoughts as being basically *gonna paraphrase your paraphrase of my comments*
.....if you die at the hands of a tamer (with or without a 900lb overgrown lizard w/ firebreath) just die already cause you suck and it's fel.....
how is that different from .... if you die at the hands of a 5v1 gank squad ... or if your crafter dies at the hands of a 2 person team.. or your group gets jumped while you are doing a champ spawn... or any number of thousands of scenarios? Last I checked... it's FEL. You risk dying everytime you go to fel. And I have no thoughts that getting jumped by tamer + pet is any worse or better then getting jumped by any other template.
And no.. I don't think you suck.
Pet/Tamer (2 slot "team") v. other 2 slot team. In this case.. if you nerf ability of one of those 2 slot teams to work efffectively together, you have crippled one template to play pvp. This I am strongly NOT in favor of.
This leads into my second point which is many on this thread and in Fel are in favor of removing any effectiveness of tamers from doing pvp. This is also were I differ in your opinion. Why should Tamers and/or their tools be nerfed so far that they can no longer choose to play in pvp? Do they not also pay their monthly fee? Do they not have the right to be in fel? Or should they just be an ATM machine for "serious" pvp'rs? This is a philosophy I do not subscribe to.
And as so often the case .. the squeeky wheel gets the grease, I am offering up my voice in the opposition of the few squeeky wheels that are demanding the dev's nerf all aspects of tamer pvp. (this time guised in the cloak of animal form/petball/ninja tamer/dragon argument).
And lastly, when you attempted to characterize my thoughts as being basically *gonna paraphrase your paraphrase of my comments*
.....if you die at the hands of a tamer (with or without a 900lb overgrown lizard w/ firebreath) just die already cause you suck and it's fel.....
how is that different from .... if you die at the hands of a 5v1 gank squad ... or if your crafter dies at the hands of a 2 person team.. or your group gets jumped while you are doing a champ spawn... or any number of thousands of scenarios? Last I checked... it's FEL. You risk dying everytime you go to fel. And I have no thoughts that getting jumped by tamer + pet is any worse or better then getting jumped by any other template.
And no.. I don't think you suck.
Leurocian
Can you please give us some feedback on our ideas and let us know when and what you think will be a possible impliment?
4th Attempt!
Can you please give us some feedback on our ideas and let us know when and what you think will be a possible impliment?
4th Attempt!
G
Guest
Guest
<blockquote><hr>
How about instead of nerfing the pet ball you all nerf the animal form? Make it so that while in animal form that it takes one of your follower slots. The advantage of animal form that everyone I know uses it for is to be able to run as fast as you can on a mount without being on a mount. If any nerf is to be done to the pet ball then I like the idea about making it so you can not use the pet ball while in animal form. Please do not add a re-use timer or any of the other suggestions.. Thank You.
[/ QUOTE ]
There's a reason pet balls need changing.
Ninja forms let a player maintain mounted speed with all their control slots used.
Take away that and it's not fixed.
Same tamer gets on his ethy mount, pulls 2 kitsune out the stables and voila! Business as usual.
There is a very real issue with how pet balls can be abused in PvP right now, and it's not simply ninja based.
If you're one of several tamers who object to pet ball fixes because you use balls to correct pet AI problems, I'd suggest making that clear here. That way, Leurocian will realise that if the pet AI was fixed, it would minimise the effects of a pet ball nerf on PvM tamers.
Wenchy
How about instead of nerfing the pet ball you all nerf the animal form? Make it so that while in animal form that it takes one of your follower slots. The advantage of animal form that everyone I know uses it for is to be able to run as fast as you can on a mount without being on a mount. If any nerf is to be done to the pet ball then I like the idea about making it so you can not use the pet ball while in animal form. Please do not add a re-use timer or any of the other suggestions.. Thank You.
[/ QUOTE ]
There's a reason pet balls need changing.
Ninja forms let a player maintain mounted speed with all their control slots used.
Take away that and it's not fixed.
Same tamer gets on his ethy mount, pulls 2 kitsune out the stables and voila! Business as usual.
There is a very real issue with how pet balls can be abused in PvP right now, and it's not simply ninja based.
If you're one of several tamers who object to pet ball fixes because you use balls to correct pet AI problems, I'd suggest making that clear here. That way, Leurocian will realise that if the pet AI was fixed, it would minimise the effects of a pet ball nerf on PvM tamers.
Wenchy
A
Al Thorin
Guest
<blockquote><hr>
It takes no skill or mana to run a pvp tamer. This in itself is an imbalance. Every other template type uses some form of mana and or calculations.
[/ QUOTE ]
Nice generalization!
I'm personally finding myself mana dumped -alot-, and I don't spend my time looking for solo players to kill. I often fight in a group, against a group.
It takes no skill or mana to run a pvp tamer. This in itself is an imbalance. Every other template type uses some form of mana and or calculations.
[/ QUOTE ]
Nice generalization!
I'm personally finding myself mana dumped -alot-, and I don't spend my time looking for solo players to kill. I often fight in a group, against a group.
<blockquote><hr>
I'm certainly willing to read all personal attacks you might want to throw at me... but I'm more interested in debating the issue.
As for credibility, I only claim what we are all entitled to.. I pay my fees and I play UO.
LORD Yalp of Zento, CTDM
[/ QUOTE ]
OK; let's debate....
Self-confessed PvP tamers have said that the current situation is imbalanced. I'm a crappy tamer, who never actively looks for PvP, but who always defends when attacked, and if even I can accept that the combination of pet-balls and ninja skills are overpowered, then why would any "real" PvP tamer disagree?
(The credibility of my arguments is based solely on the basis that I pay my fees.
)
I'm certainly willing to read all personal attacks you might want to throw at me... but I'm more interested in debating the issue.
As for credibility, I only claim what we are all entitled to.. I pay my fees and I play UO.
LORD Yalp of Zento, CTDM
[/ QUOTE ]
OK; let's debate....
Self-confessed PvP tamers have said that the current situation is imbalanced. I'm a crappy tamer, who never actively looks for PvP, but who always defends when attacked, and if even I can accept that the combination of pet-balls and ninja skills are overpowered, then why would any "real" PvP tamer disagree?
(The credibility of my arguments is based solely on the basis that I pay my fees.
Leurocian
Can you please give us some feedback on our ideas and let us know when and what you think will be a possible impliment?
5th Attempt..............................
Can you please give us some feedback on our ideas and let us know when and what you think will be a possible impliment?
5th Attempt..............................
L
LAH Architect
Guest
Leurocian and Jeremy are at the Town Hall.
Devs are not obliged to answer an impatient player's pestering and commit their next steps unnecessarily. I think you can spend the time to learn how to pvp better.
You might also want to start breathing. Green does not suit you.
Devs are not obliged to answer an impatient player's pestering and commit their next steps unnecessarily. I think you can spend the time to learn how to pvp better.
You might also want to start breathing. Green does not suit you.
S
smile
Guest
<blockquote><hr>
Pet/Tamer (2 slot "team") v. other 2 slot team. In this case.. if you nerf ability of one of those 2 slot teams to work efffectively together, you have crippled one template to play pvp. This I am strongly NOT in favor of.
how is that different from .... if you die at the hands of a 5v1 gank squad ... or if your crafter dies at the hands of a 2 person team.. or your group gets jumped while you are doing a champ spawn... or any number of thousands of scenarios? Last I checked... it's FEL. You risk dying everytime you go to fel. And I have no thoughts that getting jumped by tamer + pet is any worse or better then getting jumped by any other template.
[/ QUOTE ]
hmmm... seems you either refuse to understand or that you still fail to understand. I shall give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you fall within the second category and illustrate with an extreme example. Ok, here goes.
If a tamer who has no limited control slots were to attack you with 99 greater dragons, is that overpowered? According to your arguments, it is no different from being ganked by 100 gank squad right?
The problem is that too much power is being vested onto a single player because of this template. This problem is less severe given the limit in control slots but the problem is still there.
Reading your last post, you seems to be worried that tamers would be nerfed beyond oblivion in pvp. The point is, we are not even into the discussion of what nerfs to be implemented aside from petballs, which affect the ninjitsu tamer template. Do not let that get to you, thereby affecting your judgement and ability to comprehend.
Pet/Tamer (2 slot "team") v. other 2 slot team. In this case.. if you nerf ability of one of those 2 slot teams to work efffectively together, you have crippled one template to play pvp. This I am strongly NOT in favor of.
how is that different from .... if you die at the hands of a 5v1 gank squad ... or if your crafter dies at the hands of a 2 person team.. or your group gets jumped while you are doing a champ spawn... or any number of thousands of scenarios? Last I checked... it's FEL. You risk dying everytime you go to fel. And I have no thoughts that getting jumped by tamer + pet is any worse or better then getting jumped by any other template.
[/ QUOTE ]
hmmm... seems you either refuse to understand or that you still fail to understand. I shall give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you fall within the second category and illustrate with an extreme example. Ok, here goes.
If a tamer who has no limited control slots were to attack you with 99 greater dragons, is that overpowered? According to your arguments, it is no different from being ganked by 100 gank squad right?
The problem is that too much power is being vested onto a single player because of this template. This problem is less severe given the limit in control slots but the problem is still there.
Reading your last post, you seems to be worried that tamers would be nerfed beyond oblivion in pvp. The point is, we are not even into the discussion of what nerfs to be implemented aside from petballs, which affect the ninjitsu tamer template. Do not let that get to you, thereby affecting your judgement and ability to comprehend.
<blockquote><hr>
Leurocian and Jeremy are at the Town Hall.
Devs are not obliged to answer an impatient player's pestering and commit their next steps unnecessarily. I think you can spend the time to learn how to pvp better.
You might also want to start breathing. Green does not suit you.
[/ QUOTE ]
no one said they were obligated Im just asking for a reponse and keeping this on front page so they are aware of the problem...
Is that ok with you?
I did not inhale - President Clinton
Leurocian and Jeremy are at the Town Hall.
Devs are not obliged to answer an impatient player's pestering and commit their next steps unnecessarily. I think you can spend the time to learn how to pvp better.
You might also want to start breathing. Green does not suit you.
[/ QUOTE ]
no one said they were obligated Im just asking for a reponse and keeping this on front page so they are aware of the problem...
Is that ok with you?
I did not inhale - President Clinton
and pvp? Let me guess your a prodo shard composite bow pvper?
Come to siege and learn to play uo the real way.. The hard way.... no macroing/no insurance/no trammel... you wouldnt last a day.... so move along
keep this on topic ya troll.
Come to siege and learn to play uo the real way.. The hard way.... no macroing/no insurance/no trammel... you wouldnt last a day.... so move along
keep this on topic ya troll.
<blockquote><hr>
In your attempts to consolidate my views you've missed just a tad from my opinion. Comparing Tamer/Pet v. single pvp'r is like comparing apples to oranges... how about comparing apples to apples? Or least I be attacked for discriminating against citrus, oranges to oranges.
Pet/Tamer (2 slot "team") v. other 2 slot team. In this case.. if you nerf ability of one of those 2 slot teams to work efffectively together, you have crippled one template to play pvp. This I am strongly NOT in favor of.
This leads into my second point which is many on this thread and in Fel are in favor of removing any effectiveness of tamers from doing pvp. This is also were I differ in your opinion. Why should Tamers and/or their tools be nerfed so far that they can no longer choose to play in pvp? Do they not also pay their monthly fee? Do they not have the right to be in fel? Or should they just be an ATM machine for "serious" pvp'rs? This is a philosophy I do not subscribe to.
And as so often the case .. the squeeky wheel gets the grease, I am offering up my voice in the opposition of the few squeeky wheels that are demanding the dev's nerf all aspects of tamer pvp. (this time guised in the cloak of animal form/petball/ninja tamer/dragon argument).
And lastly, when you attempted to characterize my thoughts as being basically *gonna paraphrase your paraphrase of my comments*
.....if you die at the hands of a tamer (with or without a 900lb overgrown lizard w/ firebreath) just die already cause you suck and it's fel.....
how is that different from .... if you die at the hands of a 5v1 gank squad ... or if your crafter dies at the hands of a 2 person team.. or your group gets jumped while you are doing a champ spawn... or any number of thousands of scenarios? Last I checked... it's FEL. You risk dying everytime you go to fel. And I have no thoughts that getting jumped by tamer + pet is any worse or better then getting jumped by any other template.
And no.. I don't think you suck.
[/ QUOTE ]
Ok Dismount Archery and Ninja Tamer with superdragon and pet balls....
Please show me the one player who can get away from this combo? Ive been playing uo since the start and have plenty of pvp skills... There is absolutely nothing I can do besides run a template that is built around surviving a gank like that.... And when running that template I am completely defense so therefore giving me no oppritunity to kill anyone....
These templates have been abused for far to long and were never intended to be in uo and played this way... I think its fair that they are finally taking pvpers opinons into account....
And like you said there are far fewer of you guys without any problems, vs the 1000's of us who have a problem with the current tamer/ninja/petball/smoke bomb situation...
I cannot wait until they make it so you cant use smoke bombs in animal form and put a timer on the pet balls as well... We will finally see how the people who say "adapt" or "quit" if you dont like it end up doing in the REAL pvp world....
If I wanted to fight dragons Id just go to destard...
In your attempts to consolidate my views you've missed just a tad from my opinion. Comparing Tamer/Pet v. single pvp'r is like comparing apples to oranges... how about comparing apples to apples? Or least I be attacked for discriminating against citrus, oranges to oranges.
Pet/Tamer (2 slot "team") v. other 2 slot team. In this case.. if you nerf ability of one of those 2 slot teams to work efffectively together, you have crippled one template to play pvp. This I am strongly NOT in favor of.
This leads into my second point which is many on this thread and in Fel are in favor of removing any effectiveness of tamers from doing pvp. This is also were I differ in your opinion. Why should Tamers and/or their tools be nerfed so far that they can no longer choose to play in pvp? Do they not also pay their monthly fee? Do they not have the right to be in fel? Or should they just be an ATM machine for "serious" pvp'rs? This is a philosophy I do not subscribe to.
And as so often the case .. the squeeky wheel gets the grease, I am offering up my voice in the opposition of the few squeeky wheels that are demanding the dev's nerf all aspects of tamer pvp. (this time guised in the cloak of animal form/petball/ninja tamer/dragon argument).
And lastly, when you attempted to characterize my thoughts as being basically *gonna paraphrase your paraphrase of my comments*
.....if you die at the hands of a tamer (with or without a 900lb overgrown lizard w/ firebreath) just die already cause you suck and it's fel.....
how is that different from .... if you die at the hands of a 5v1 gank squad ... or if your crafter dies at the hands of a 2 person team.. or your group gets jumped while you are doing a champ spawn... or any number of thousands of scenarios? Last I checked... it's FEL. You risk dying everytime you go to fel. And I have no thoughts that getting jumped by tamer + pet is any worse or better then getting jumped by any other template.
And no.. I don't think you suck.
[/ QUOTE ]
Ok Dismount Archery and Ninja Tamer with superdragon and pet balls....
Please show me the one player who can get away from this combo? Ive been playing uo since the start and have plenty of pvp skills... There is absolutely nothing I can do besides run a template that is built around surviving a gank like that.... And when running that template I am completely defense so therefore giving me no oppritunity to kill anyone....
These templates have been abused for far to long and were never intended to be in uo and played this way... I think its fair that they are finally taking pvpers opinons into account....
And like you said there are far fewer of you guys without any problems, vs the 1000's of us who have a problem with the current tamer/ninja/petball/smoke bomb situation...
I cannot wait until they make it so you cant use smoke bombs in animal form and put a timer on the pet balls as well... We will finally see how the people who say "adapt" or "quit" if you dont like it end up doing in the REAL pvp world....
If I wanted to fight dragons Id just go to destard...
<blockquote><hr>
<blockquote><hr>
It takes no skill or mana to run a pvp tamer.
[/ QUOTE ]
As soon as you say something like that you show me you know nothing about tamers, and therefore, any opinion you might have about them is basically worthless...
<blockquote><hr>
I like the idea about making it so you can not use the pet ball while in animal form.
[/ QUOTE ]
/signed That solution targets the specific problem that most are complaining about, without screwing over the entire profession. I don't much care about animal forms taking a control slot. I don't really think that is necessary. The one fix of making pet balls unusable while in animal form is the magic bullet as far as I am concerned. I don't like a re-use timer either, not while there is skill loss on death, and not while the chasing a.i. is ridiculously inept.
[/ QUOTE ]
I do know plenty about pvp tamer templates and they are fairly easy to play especially in a group... You stay hidden wait for a dismount hit your all kill macro.... and hide...
If you are a true pvp tamer you instead of hiding chase them down in animal form spamming a macro to summon your pet and say all kill... You basically just run along side of someone and hit 1 button... And god forbid if you have any problems we got that great thing called smoke bombs....
And further if they are not running a ninja stealth tamer then most likly they will just put their pets on you and run along side with a petball and if they are mana vamped or hit with any kind of offensive spell they normally tuck their tail between legs and run as far as they can away from battle....
PS we love the insta log too so you dont lose any skills on your pet when it doesnt die.... Crim or not it doesnt matter.... call it nbd NO BIG DEAL.
Almost forgot the bokuto templates too... Cant leave them out with no love....
I mean you got a dismount archer/Stealth bushido nervestriker/ and a superdragon followed by someone in animal form... What options do you have to flee that battle?
<blockquote><hr>
It takes no skill or mana to run a pvp tamer.
[/ QUOTE ]
As soon as you say something like that you show me you know nothing about tamers, and therefore, any opinion you might have about them is basically worthless...
<blockquote><hr>
I like the idea about making it so you can not use the pet ball while in animal form.
[/ QUOTE ]
/signed That solution targets the specific problem that most are complaining about, without screwing over the entire profession. I don't much care about animal forms taking a control slot. I don't really think that is necessary. The one fix of making pet balls unusable while in animal form is the magic bullet as far as I am concerned. I don't like a re-use timer either, not while there is skill loss on death, and not while the chasing a.i. is ridiculously inept.
[/ QUOTE ]
I do know plenty about pvp tamer templates and they are fairly easy to play especially in a group... You stay hidden wait for a dismount hit your all kill macro.... and hide...
If you are a true pvp tamer you instead of hiding chase them down in animal form spamming a macro to summon your pet and say all kill... You basically just run along side of someone and hit 1 button... And god forbid if you have any problems we got that great thing called smoke bombs....
And further if they are not running a ninja stealth tamer then most likly they will just put their pets on you and run along side with a petball and if they are mana vamped or hit with any kind of offensive spell they normally tuck their tail between legs and run as far as they can away from battle....
PS we love the insta log too so you dont lose any skills on your pet when it doesnt die.... Crim or not it doesnt matter.... call it nbd NO BIG DEAL.
Almost forgot the bokuto templates too... Cant leave them out with no love....
I mean you got a dismount archer/Stealth bushido nervestriker/ and a superdragon followed by someone in animal form... What options do you have to flee that battle?
A
Al Thorin
Guest
<blockquote><hr>
Self-confessed PvP tamers have said that the current situation is imbalanced. I'm a crappy tamer, who never actively looks for PvP, but who always defends when attacked, and if even I can accept that the combination of pet-balls and ninja skills are overpowered, then why would any "real" PvP tamer disagree?
[/ QUOTE ]
Most of us that are debating issues are -not- debating wether it's over powered, we want other issues we think -compound- the issue also looked at as well, instead of just over nerfing tamers as a whole.
Self-confessed PvP tamers have said that the current situation is imbalanced. I'm a crappy tamer, who never actively looks for PvP, but who always defends when attacked, and if even I can accept that the combination of pet-balls and ninja skills are overpowered, then why would any "real" PvP tamer disagree?
[/ QUOTE ]
Most of us that are debating issues are -not- debating wether it's over powered, we want other issues we think -compound- the issue also looked at as well, instead of just over nerfing tamers as a whole.
<blockquote><hr>
<blockquote><hr>
Self-confessed PvP tamers have said that the current situation is imbalanced. I'm a crappy tamer, who never actively looks for PvP, but who always defends when attacked, and if even I can accept that the combination of pet-balls and ninja skills are overpowered, then why would any "real" PvP tamer disagree?
[/ QUOTE ]
Most of us that are debating issues are -not- debating wether it's over powered, we want other issues we think -compound- the issue also looked at as well, instead of just over nerfing tamers as a whole.
[/ QUOTE ]
Agreed, them silly trammies cant seem to understand that though!
Damnit how do I get rid of this stupid yellow cursor? OH YES SIEGE PERILOUS AHHH MUCH BETTER no insurance no trammel
TONS OF TAMERS THO
<blockquote><hr>
Self-confessed PvP tamers have said that the current situation is imbalanced. I'm a crappy tamer, who never actively looks for PvP, but who always defends when attacked, and if even I can accept that the combination of pet-balls and ninja skills are overpowered, then why would any "real" PvP tamer disagree?
[/ QUOTE ]
Most of us that are debating issues are -not- debating wether it's over powered, we want other issues we think -compound- the issue also looked at as well, instead of just over nerfing tamers as a whole.
[/ QUOTE ]
Agreed, them silly trammies cant seem to understand that though!
Damnit how do I get rid of this stupid yellow cursor? OH YES SIEGE PERILOUS AHHH MUCH BETTER no insurance no trammel
C
Calibretto
Guest
When can we expect a fix on this.
Siege pvp is going down hill fast.
Pet ball all kill. Pets FTW!!!
Siege pvp is going down hill fast.
Pet ball all kill. Pets FTW!!!