It seems like people aren't reading the link that petra posted so I have quoted the entire relevant section for anyone new to the thread. This was not meant to be the prototype classic shard, it's a test to guage interest.
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Perhaps this thread should be edited to put that important part in full bolded red letters on the very first post so people will get the idea, lol.
Sounded like a reasonable start, until I read this:
EA just don't get the fact that people would be happy with a standard classic ruleset without any of these ridiculous "features" they insist on tacking on.
Attempting to partake in real PvP on this shard will just be ruined the instant someone can fire off one of these randomly as a guaranteed "I-WIN" button.
Blah. Good luck with it. I predict for the meantime, the serious classic guys will just (continue) playing elsewhere.
Cheers.
BS like this kinda proves that EA have no idea what would draw people back to subscribing to play classic UO. It's a poor test of viability when the type of classic players who'd be tempted to resubscribe will be instantly put off when reading about stuff like this.
EA just don't get the fact that people would be happy with a standard classic ruleset without any of these ridiculous "features" they insist on tacking on.
Attempting to partake in real PvP on this shard will just be ruined the instant someone can fire off one of these randomly as a guaranteed "I-WIN" button.
Blah. Good luck with it. I predict for the meantime, the serious classic guys will just (continue) playing elsewhere.
Cheers.
V
Vyal
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So is there advanced char tokens I would like to know before I create the toon. IS there only one toon per account also?
Are you still on that astroturfing kick? man you really knock yourself out don't you? Find a new buzzword to amuse yourself with, that one grew old a month ago.
Yeah, it's shard of the dead, a Halloween shard too. If they go and make a real classic shard afterward I'd bet they will be leaving that out.
Lol what kind of pvpers though. Things don't get simpler as you add things to something. Only more complex therefore requiring more skill to operate unless you add a EASY BUTTON to the machine which atm would be mysticism. Fix that and better the quality of the pvp we're capably of now. What a waste of time to focus on old content that the true feeling of it will never be reproduced because there was a time and a place for it, and that was years ago. You do realize that since a "classic" shard is only limited to one shard it will become a one guild dominant server like every other server right? It's just going to become another thing to complain about.
*clears throat*... EMM EMM EMM... I'm not the one trying to CONvince everyone that Siege without ROT is a Classic shard.
No you are just the one troll who finds himself in every classic shard thread talking about astroturfing, I suppose the empty can rattles the most though eh? I'm not trying to convince anyone that this is classic, to many other changes would have to be made before this was classic and it really wasn't intended to be or they would have done it from the start.
What it is though at least from Cals point of view is a testing of the waters to see if what could, later down the road become a classic shard, would be worth the effort.
And a classic shard is not Siege without ROT, Siege has pretty much gotten every publish the other production shards have received and is really a poor example of what classic looks like.
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StoneAvenue
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It sounds like to me the Classic shard debate with EA is never going to pan out in our victory.
Whether or not this new shard will own or suck, we are requesting that EA make a shard that emulates the days when Origin and Richard Garriott controlled our destinies.
EA is unprepared to do that, probably does not have a good sense of the feel of the game during that era, and is really here to exploit our nostalgia for monthly dues.
Which we all pay.
I honestly don't expect a shard to come down from EA that has the warm, honest to goodness feel of Britannia like we know and love. There was a labour of love in this game which is no longer present except within ourselves.
Whether or not this new shard will own or suck, we are requesting that EA make a shard that emulates the days when Origin and Richard Garriott controlled our destinies.
EA is unprepared to do that, probably does not have a good sense of the feel of the game during that era, and is really here to exploit our nostalgia for monthly dues.
Which we all pay.
I honestly don't expect a shard to come down from EA that has the warm, honest to goodness feel of Britannia like we know and love. There was a labour of love in this game which is no longer present except within ourselves.
Well let me just say this, I'm not naive I've been around the block enough times on the hoping they really do it this time train. But honestly Cal is the first dev I have seen that gives it any real mention from time to time, he said we would have an answer by the end of the year, and with the end of the year coming up in two months we get the announcement that this test shard will give them numbers they will use to base the feasibility of the classic shard down the road.
Now obviously I don't agree that it's the best way to handle it, but they obviously cannot devote the amount of time it would take to make a true to form classic test shard, while still working on the other aspects of the game, so the next best option? if you have a few spare hours you do some tweaking on the current ruleset so that it loosely mirrors the playstyle of old UO in terms of the gameplay not the skills/items.
But it boils down to this, I have resubbed and the most I will keep my account open is 2-3 months if there is no follow up from this. The alternative is we all act like pessimists not many of us show up and they completely pull the plug on the idea for good, much to the cheers of some of the posters here.
And I've been on SOTD most of the day, so I am doing my little part trying to represent. All I can do is ask anyone that wants classic to show up for this, at worst you are out of a couple months subscription fee, which to me is nothing really.
Now obviously I don't agree that it's the best way to handle it, but they obviously cannot devote the amount of time it would take to make a true to form classic test shard, while still working on the other aspects of the game, so the next best option? if you have a few spare hours you do some tweaking on the current ruleset so that it loosely mirrors the playstyle of old UO in terms of the gameplay not the skills/items.
But it boils down to this, I have resubbed and the most I will keep my account open is 2-3 months if there is no follow up from this. The alternative is we all act like pessimists not many of us show up and they completely pull the plug on the idea for good, much to the cheers of some of the posters here.
And I've been on SOTD most of the day, so I am doing my little part trying to represent. All I can do is ask anyone that wants classic to show up for this, at worst you are out of a couple months subscription fee, which to me is nothing really.
Agreed, item based/no insurance will just lead to what Puni said.
Non item based/no insurance would put everyone on a more even playing field and help to keep smaller, more numerous guilds viable.
I must admit that I don't understand the reasoning of this shard at all. First in the timing, it's gonna be up for a month maybe 2 and it's on the heels of the booster and halloween stuff...we all have new toys to play with and we are supposed to go putz around on a test shard.
And secondly the "classic" label. It's a pvp shard that doesn't have the struggle that siege does. I logged on and item properties are there and you can choose an artifacer as a template.
I just really don't understand it. WE have siege, we have pvp in factions and in fel on all our prodo shards. What am I missing? How is this representative of anything anyone is asking for?
And secondly the "classic" label. It's a pvp shard that doesn't have the struggle that siege does. I logged on and item properties are there and you can choose an artifacer as a template.
I just really don't understand it. WE have siege, we have pvp in factions and in fel on all our prodo shards. What am I missing? How is this representative of anything anyone is asking for?
Siege is the new Classic!! LMAO
Just rename "Siege" to "Classic" in the shard list and hey presto, you got a Classic shard. It worked for the EC, didnt it?
G
Gunga_Din
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You can't have the new races and skills. Should have just had GM weapons.
Taylor
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That's what I'm thinking, too. As I mentioned in a separate thread, we often debate about the definition of "classic": pre-15, pre-AOS, pre-insurance, etc. However, I don't think that anyone would argue that post-imbuing is a "classic pvp server".
The adv char option is triggered at the creation of the characters first login.
I had a uh difficulty and checked to see if I could make another character and it gave me the create option on the log in screen.
Maybe, I haven't decided yet.
I made a garg, but mysticism is very reg heavy. If it looks like I just cant keep much in the way of a lrc suit then I may have to rethink all that.
Skill gains are nice though. I can't see them making a server that never sees any changes, but maintains and grows its player base.
I would add that since we appear to be using a post AOS armor system that imbuing would be ve3ry important, but you wont see folks running around in full relic property suits unless they are zerging.
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Well, I'm not trying to argue the merits of it. I haven't made up my mind whether I like it or not.
However, would you agree that it is a bit of a stretch to call a post-garg, post-imbuing shard a "classic pvp server"?
Pretty sure I already addressed this, but for some reason, I don't know what it is but there is this weird disconnect going on. I'm trying to think of a simpler way to break it down but I begin to wonder if people are just selectively reading in order to stir up animosity.
1) This is not a representation of what an eventual classic shard would be
2) They are only using a basic framework as in open pvp/no insurance/fel only as a test to see if there is a big enough market for the idea.
3) If there are enough people interested then it would be up to the developers to decide on what starting point classic would take, I think we all can agree however that it is pre-AoS and certainly should be pre-trammel as renaissance marked the first big step away from the classic era game design.
Therefore there is a whole lot more to it then Siege without RoT, there would be no AoS properties, . no trammel, the old resist system, no neon colored garbage that makes the game look like a terrible acid trip, no new lands beyond the second age and most importantly no item insurance.
Now later on down the line who knows, I mean actually I could see some of the classes as being enjoyable in PvP to an extent, like would necros/paladins be fun without all the other stuff that came with AoS? might be similar to the hero vs villain system they had out a long time ago again who can tell?
It is pure snake oil salesman marketing.
That's why I am posting what I am posting.
I actually support a super pvp server, where all the pvpers can go to mass pvp [and also a super pve server, where all the pvers can go too].
But really it is just another Siege shard. It may be more popular because of a combo of it is a new shard, skill gain is faster, and marketing/astroturfing.
I would have much rather they tried a new Siege shard with insurance. There is a reason why Siege PvP is dead, and production shard PvP isnt... insurance.
A bug my ass! If there is no precasting then it is not a Classic Shard and it is doomed to fail no if and buts about it. I guarantee you players on Freeshards and the PvP'ers of old will not return for a Classic Shard without Pre-Casting.
Anytime there has ever been talk about playing on a Freeshard with those I've know the first question is "Is there Pre-Casting?". If the answer is no then it's not the UO of 1997-2000 which is what people are clammoring for.
Precasting is what allowed and created skill in PvP. You could precast Offense Spells and Defensive Spells. There is no bug whatsoever...what it creates is the ability to throw combos together that can kill someone who doesn't know how to defend against it.
Unfortunately Warriors were unable to defend against Pre-casting so you were forced to play a tank mage if you wanted to be a viable PvPer. Sorry but this is the reality: Tank Mages owned the day and this is the reason why you would see players in groups of 10 or more at times sitting on top of a roof near wrong or some other place dueling. Everyone was a tank mage and that's how it should be because that system promoted the best PvP UO has ever seen. It took alot of skill to learn and master and there were some extremely skilled players who understood the timing of spells and how to interrupt. When to attack...when to defend etc.
Trying to make all classes equal is what destroyed the PvP system back in the day. I'm sorry but when people are asking for a Classic Shard they are asking for the days of when Pre-casting Tank Mages ruled the land.
Okay so here we are back at defining classic, which is, of course, the problem.
Siege was designed to be a "graduate" shard, more difficult and pvp friendly everywhere, but with publishes that kept the game current and maintained the flavor of the shard, which meant special care and special consideration had to be made.
Now if they remove in fact make easier the difficulty level with regard to skill advancement what will the level of acceptance be like?
See classic to me does not necessarily mean human only and tank or mage or tank mage only, but it does mean that anytime you are outside a guard zone you should be ready for anything to happen. That was, for me, what made the game such a rush. And in that sense, this could be classic.
I would rather not cut my bandies one by one, or raise anatomy and eval by "looking" at folks around the bank. I am also hesitant to place a lot of faith in a system that is designed to get you there(where ever there is) quick.
The other aspect of a "classic" server for me would be a sense of achievement. And I am not sure I see that element in the factoring here. Time will tell.
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Your answer was very diplomatic, but I am interested in a more direct response. Would you term a shard that included imbuing and mysticism a "classic pvp server"?
Again, I am not talking about pre/post AOS, nor am I talking about chiv/necro, nor anything else that folks have debated on forever and ever. I'm talking imbuing, mysticism, and "classic pvp server."
meh. this is just another shard like siege perilous that will soon be dominated by tamers and stealthers. why is it again that pets can bond on siege? yeah, i never got an actual answer.
until pets can't bond, i see no reason to bother with it. especially since on this shard you don't even get your 'one personal bless', and yet tamers still get their bonded super dragons. -rolls eyes-
:gun:
until pets can't bond, i see no reason to bother with it. especially since on this shard you don't even get your 'one personal bless', and yet tamers still get their bonded super dragons. -rolls eyes-
:gun:It was a bug, even mentioned so in the patch notes here Publish 2 - UOGuide, the Ultima Online encyclopedia
To quote the relevant text for you.
Produce some of these conversations the two big ones we had here there was maybe one or two people who gave a lick about pre-casting.
Skill? what a joker lol ok what is skillfull about precasting an explosion, equipping a halberd, doing near 50 damage with it, getting off a stored up exp followed by an ebolt for a quick kill? that isn't skill that is exactly what I said it was, easy mode for mages.
Pure warriors had a hard go of it, hybrid warriors with trapped pouches generally ran over pure mages pretty well, I made a nice living destroying red mages on atlantic with my hybrid dexxer.
And saying that everyone should be forced into one class is pretty silly, don't get me wrong I enjoyed playing my mage as well and the long duels were pretty exciting at the time but there is a reason that they removed some of the mage dominance over time, because not everyone wanted to be crammed into one template.
Some people are wanting that, because it marks a return to a time where they pretty much had easy pickings against a lot of other people because a lot of newer players enjoyed playing warrior characters for reasons unrelated to the pvp, so yeah precasted paralyze/equip halberd/rinse and repeat until they die was a lot of easy loot for mages back then.
But if your saying that you can't pvp without precasting, that tells me alot about what you think "good pvp" is all about. Balance in an mmo is nearly impossible but I didn't find PvP to be terrible until they added the special moves like the concussion blow/spear para blow that hit pretty often, post precasting the pvp wasn't bad at all, the worse part was the whiney butthurt easy mages couldn't handle having to work a little harder for their kills.
Besides anyone who did pvp back in the day knows the real tank mage is full plate/heavy x bow. But that was pre T2A so I don't expect many people to remember.
Okay fair enough. Is it the first thing that comes to mind when I hear the phrase Classic UO? Absolutely not.
However IF they do go post AoS with the armor and properties system I would argue that imbuing at least will be essential to the over all health and longevity of the server.
Classic is classic, me running around with a nox mage that has wrestle and resist, or with a ring mail suit and a kat and a heavy X. Thats where it all happened for me. But Each individual will have very different feelings there.
And again I just don't see a static model based on the old school armor system taking the game anywhere currently.
I would posit that the devs recognize there are lots of pvp systems in UO that need work and better balance, and in order to find them they need a dedicated, fairly deep pool of players to poll for advice and opinion, not just a bunch of folks advocating their own playstyle which we already see beginning to happen in this thread.
Keep spamming it eventually someone besides you may believe it.
V
Vyal
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Siege is dead cause no one wants to play on that shard there is not enough people to support all of the world.
I am loving every minute on sotd got myself 3 pure mares some dragons some beetles 100% lrc suit 500ish luck suit, it's all fel and no freaking LUNA or ish or any of that shyt.
No 1 char BS.......
I dont understand why I am having lrc and stuff like that tho.. It isn't classic at all tbh but I still like it.
I am loving every minute on sotd got myself 3 pure mares some dragons some beetles 100% lrc suit 500ish luck suit, it's all fel and no freaking LUNA or ish or any of that shyt.
No 1 char BS.......
I dont understand why I am having lrc and stuff like that tho.. It isn't classic at all tbh but I still like it.
Keep in mind a classic shard is not meant to "take the game anywhere" it's an option purely for going back to a better time for those of us who enjoyed it.
I do not disagree with this in the slightest, but I just don't think a classic shard is the place for it, again it's only purpose is to go back. Now when you are talking production I completely agree with you there are a lot of things in the system that need to be addressed.
And of course people will always advocate their own playstyles, we all do it, otherwise there would be no point in paying for a product you don't enjoy.
I can't say I didn't see this one coming, I'm not clueless about PvP I did it pretty much all the time, but it sounds like someone can't back their nonsense up with anything other then "me and my small group of friends say it was this way so it was" sadly you know I am right, if you just cop to it and say I enjoyed the easy kills I wouldn't blame you, a lot of people did back then.
Okay but it is a business. And how do you "pitch" something that doesn't change to an investor.
McDonalds changes their menu seasonally to keep pulling customers back in the door. Plus tries new things now and again to gauge response, hot items get added more permanently.
Without a reason to speculate that the base will grow ie: monthly gain more customers than it loses, how do you justify the additional capital for such a limited experience?
i agree with this.meh. this is just another shard like siege perilous that will soon be dominated by tamers and stealthers. why is it again that pets can bond on siege? yeah, i never got an actual answer.
until pets can't bond, i see no reason to bother with it. especially since on this shard you don't even get your 'one personal bless', and yet tamers still get their bonded super dragons. -rolls eyes-
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You can choose the skill, both in the starting menu and via the "artificer" advanced character token.
Now that the server is available, I advise you to log into the game and give it a look.
There is a Soul Forge at the Sea Market. I don't know if the Sea Market exists on this shard though.
The map in the EC does show it.
Well there are plenty of people who want a classic option, they just aren't all posting on stratics. So they resub to play classic and EA makes more money, and Mcdonalds doesn't really change their menu as much as they bring back a few things that have been on their menu before like the Mcrib for example.
Also this shard could be done with a minimum of time and effort once they decide where they want to start, if it doesn't work out they won't really lose much at all.
It is a business so sometimes you have to take calculated risks to make money, even if the classic shard flops I doubt it will be more then a minor blip on the EA radar, certainly it won't dent their revenue appreciably.
Lets just look at what we know, we know this test shard is a gauge for interest in a classic shard even though it isn't entirely classic itself. So that tells us that Cal and the team have seen some kind of potential in the idea, now if the population doesn't turn out during SoTD then nothing to worry about we will likely not see the classic option be persued at all.
Which will pretty much mark the end of the idea altogether, if it doesn't pan out, then we will finally know once and for definitively that the answer is no and then everyone opposed to the idea will never have to worry about it happening.
It is a 99.9% copy of Siege. What this can gauge is how many people they can con-
vince to play Siege if they rebrand Siege as a Classic shard.
Except for the whole this is not representative of what a classic shard will look like, and round and round we go.
G
Gandie
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I must say that i actually enjoy this shard a bit. I just re-opened my account again to fool around on this shard because i was bored with what else i got to play atm.
Now even though this is long from what i wanted a classic shard to be, i still love the thrill of fighting skeletons at brit graveyard, or being in despise, without knowing when a pk will turn up and try to gank you and take your 3.k gold
This is what i miss. And the way people last night worked together at despise to get rid of two PKs so they could keep on training and gaining gold, was just awesome.
Now even though this is long from what i wanted a classic shard to be, i still love the thrill of fighting skeletons at brit graveyard, or being in despise, without knowing when a pk will turn up and try to gank you and take your 3.k gold
This is what i miss. And the way people last night worked together at despise to get rid of two PKs so they could keep on training and gaining gold, was just awesome.
R
Rancid Wolf
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There are a lot of good posts in this thread and I'm glad EA has given a shot to getting rid of things that I have never heard about like "item insurance" and all theat mimble jumble.
When I read on a forum that they released a "Classic PvP server" I was stoked, I was actually like a little kid at christmas but I knew that couldn't be the case. Sure enough I was disappointed. I love that everyone is having fun with it, but classic UO is so much more then no item insurance and no trammel. I mean, after everything I read I can't believe there is even a reason for a trammel on the regular servers in UO.
Hopefully they don't "reall gaze" the interest rate of any of the old players on this server because I'm sure noone who hasn't played UO in the last 7 years would even consider it.
People like me will be playing one of these new T2A era shards that opened up and have pops that are doing just fine until EA either opens up a true T2A type shard or says they are moving on for good and we'll never look back. And people, even though this isn't the thread for it. It's the T2A ruleset and combat system that makes that type of UO so great not this era accurate stuff.
When I read on a forum that they released a "Classic PvP server" I was stoked, I was actually like a little kid at christmas but I knew that couldn't be the case. Sure enough I was disappointed. I love that everyone is having fun with it, but classic UO is so much more then no item insurance and no trammel. I mean, after everything I read I can't believe there is even a reason for a trammel on the regular servers in UO.
Hopefully they don't "reall gaze" the interest rate of any of the old players on this server because I'm sure noone who hasn't played UO in the last 7 years would even consider it.
People like me will be playing one of these new T2A era shards that opened up and have pops that are doing just fine until EA either opens up a true T2A type shard or says they are moving on for good and we'll never look back. And people, even though this isn't the thread for it. It's the T2A ruleset and combat system that makes that type of UO so great not this era accurate stuff.
T
Trebr Drab
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Personally, I'm not playing a wide open PvP game without a justice system that works to vastly reduce PKing, thieving, and griefing.
Any game without justice is doomed to having some players constantly taking from the rest, and doomed to smaller and smaller numbers.
Any game without justice is doomed to having some players constantly taking from the rest, and doomed to smaller and smaller numbers.
EA doesn't care if you go play on some free to play T2A shard, if enough of the classic crowd have your mentality then they aren't going to open a classic shard because they are using the population on the test shard to see if it is worth their time to open a classic shard later.
This is probably not the shard for you, it sounds to me like you would prefer the trammel playstyle that is available on 20 other shards right now. If you read one of the above posters described how people banded together to fight off a pk in despise, that's how it should be, player justice in the hands of players.
It is good you are enjoying this 2nd Siege shard. You might consider starting up on Siege now, as this new Siege shard is only going to last 1 to 2 months.
To Siege players. This shard is just Siege with faster skills gains. All I can say is you could have had a nice influx of new players.
G
Green Destiny
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Anyone else having trouble logging in? I log in and it just shows names of NPC's but the screen stays like the login screen...
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