You've been driving this off-topic. You're misleading people here, feint is not a goddamn disadvantage. This whole topic is about a template that makes heavy use of the best feint weapon in the game. Just leave it if you can't handle it.
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I don't agree with you here. My last post was on Mart 5. But ten days later - on Mart 15 - NuSair made his post #54 with wrong information about Feint, starting this off-topic discussion.
How am I misleading people? I posted a list of Feint disadvantages. Well, you may say that they are fencing disadvantages or game mechanic disadvantages but the sense if remain the same: this features make using feint less effective. And this is useful info that I myself unfortunately hadn't when started my feint character.
I believe almost any skill/spell/special in the game has its own disadvantages. If I post here Raising Colossus disadvantages (5 slots taken and so on) would it mean that RC is a "goddamn disadvantage"?
Influence of each disadvantages depends on template you are going to use. For example, if you are going to build a sampire that you shouldn't worry about #5 = "you can't get 90 HLL on your weapon" because you needn't HLL on your weapon in any case. And if you are going to have 120 bushido you needn't worry about #1 = "damage reduction is depends on bushido" because you are going to have max bushido. And so on - about each disadvantage. But if you are going to build a HLL-based warrior without necro and going to have 80 bushido you will find that it doesn't work. What is wrong in knowing this in advance? You may treat this disadvantages as a list of factors that restrict range of templates that can use feint effectivly.
Who is misleading people here - is a person that says "feint halves damage and you always survive better". Feint is not a "magic wand" and it is not always halves damage and you may survive worse with it. And so on.
Who is misleading people here - is a person that say "Feint is a fantastic and very useful special". Hey, this info is outdated! May be someone just don't know that now you are able to chain AI/DS, have 100 HLL on your weapon, have 55 SSI without weapon and so on... while leafblade damage was nerfed.
I'd agree if it wasn't all speculative statements. The original post, that now seems to have been edited out, said something to the effect of 'this isn't for biggest damage output, fastest kill'. There comes a point when you have capped all your damage dealing capabilities and to further extend the success you look to damage reduction. I don't personally see the point in starting without damage from all sources capped where possible, but even in those situations Feint works from the start. Which (as is the whole point of this thread that you seem to have missed) it is being advocated as 'best ALL ROUNDER'.
The topic wasn't about what does it faster.
You asked do I have examples of it happening. So it seems I do need to confirm it.
That isn't a contradiction it is logical. Taking half damage means surviving longer. Comparing templates does not alter the fact that using Feint halves damage.
Yes. Because that was the topic. The original post even stated something to the effect of 'this isn't the fastest/highest damage' but you chose to ignore that and argue with it anyway.
I can't. I don't play a Feint template. This does not prevent me from understanding what it does, or the original post in this thread which advocated it's use, and the benefits of it's use. As I said on page 1, I advised a friend to build for Feint for the specific reason that they are not the type of person to test and figure things out themselves or rebuild frequently, and just wanted an all round Sampire that would work everywhere. With zero dexxer experience they solo'd the Dark Father with minimal (verbal) guidance, if I had advised them to make an AI spammer they would have died to Blood Oath multiple times and been asking wtf did you advise this for. It isn't the only way of doing it (also said in the original post) but it is one of the simplest and one that you can use long before you maximise any other aspect of the character such as template/suit in order to see results. Most people I know (I'm not one of them personally) like to play their characters before they're finished (i.e. running around in a basic suit).
Yes, all of my templates are good without Feint. On these boards you can find threads of my Wraith Thrower and Mystic Dexxer, soloing Slasher, Corgul and Scalis. Or just ask around they were first's.
I know you're not a native English speaker (or so you said earlier) but I think you have associated the wrong meaning to contradiction. Low Leafblade damage is irrelevant to Feint. Feint halves damage received whether the hit does 273 or 1. You also don't have to keep the Leafblade equipped for the subsequent hits. Any encounter in which you (even if it's just once) take half damage for 5 seconds will be 5 seconds where you had less risk of death than the rest of the fight taking full damage. You also don't need to wait for Feint to wear off before doing it again. You can do it whenever you feel like it.
In fact I used to have a Tamer/Sampire that would Vet while a Greater Dragon on the same tile as Rikktor, easily surviving and Feinting for the Earthquake damage. In this case positioning was the key to using it effectively.
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I never edit my posts except it the last post in the topic and it's only few minutes old.
I didn't understand the rest of the first paragraph but for sure fencing sampire can't be the 'best all rounder' character (if this means 'ability to do well against wides range of opposition').
So you didn't understand my example? Unbelievable! It seems you are just trolling me. By the way it wasn't about 'faster' it was about comparison when there are more than one factor involved. You can take 2x less damage and die 2x faster. I hope you understand the last statement, don't you? There are a lot other factors that affects (healing speed and so on).
You did exactly opposite to what I asked. I asked you stop saying unsupported words and give me real examples when with Feint you survive better. And I gave you real examples when without Feint you survive better. And you still haven't given me example.
Longer compared to what? Here is another example for you: John has grown up and became 2x longer. Is he longer than Mary now? (you see there is no 'faster' word this time)
Leafblade (without Feint) is a crappy weapon. You survive 100500 times worse with it. And if with feint you survive 2x longer you still survive 50250 times worse. Well, "100500" is a joke. But you must get the idea now.
I believe this is the reason you count it so good. You didn't try it but you claim that is survive better then your Mystic Dexxer in any situation. Surprisingly.
Feint looks good in theory but not as good in practice. It does very well against weak monsters when you can do well without feint as well if you have good equipment and some experience. But against really tough monsters you get a lot of problems (the main problem is the lack of mana). The main problem with Feint is that it's on 2.75sec weapon.
As to DarkFather - replace 100 necro with 100 resisting spells and replace leafblade with double axe - and you will never die on DF. You will do 2x more damage and leach 2x more life with a double axe. BO is not a problem if you get resisting spells instead of wasting skill points on necro.
Yes it is fine if you haven't enough gold for a good suit.
For example, compare two chars that have about the same suits/stats except the second has some SSI on jewels:
120 Fencing/Tactics/Anatomy/Bushido, 60 parry, 99 Necro, 90 Chivalry (pretty standard template for a fencer)
120 Swords/Tactics/Resisting Spells/Bushido, 60 parry, 99 Necro, 90 Chivalry
The second one has the same damage as the first one, about the same stats but has 120 Resisting Spells. Those additional 120 skill points is the difference between Leafblade and Broadsword/BladedStaff.
The original post in the thread. Not yours. *rolls eyes*
What don't you understand?
This is all irrelevant to the topic. As a hint to what the topic is, it's in the first post in this thread, and concerns a game called Ultima Online, and things you can do within that game.
People don't need to do what you ask least of all when you are incapable of grasping the topic, or the point of argument. They aren't unsupported words. Using Feint at all/ever equals surviving better, compared to not using it, by the mere reason that you are taking half damage.
Irrelevant/already answered.
I said no such thing. I have tried it. I just don't use it at the moment. I certainly never said it was 'better than my Mystic Dexxer in any situation'. You asked 'have I any good templates that don't use Feint.' Not 'is it better than them.'
Your 'advice' is pointless, as you have, again, missed out the entire context in which it was raised as you have throughout this thread. A friend of mine who does not want to change their setup, wanted a sampire that would work in the hunts they intended to do, and had not played a dexxer before. Your 'advice' does not meet their requirements.
Here it is! "at all/ever equals". It exactly what I pointed. I agree that a fencer with Feint generally survive at least not worse (against tough monsters - usually better) than a fencer without Feint. But in current reality (with all those good suits) Swordsmanship is much better than Fencing in PvM (I myself don't like this dis-balance). And even taking 2x less damage usually doesn't compensate this handicap.
You said that template with feint ALWAYS survive better than ANY template without feint. And it is what I'm arguing against. (as to logic: "ANY" includes your Mystic Dexxer and "ALWAYS" include all monsters in UO)
Do you now accept that there is (exists) template without feint that in some situations survive better than any template with feint?
No I didn't. If you think I did what post number?
The only thing relating to 'better templates' that I have spoke about was in relation to where you asked in post #93 "Have you ever used any good template without Feint?" My answer to that question didn't say Feint was better/worse than anything because, that isn't the question you asked, and as I keep saying comparing a special to a template is not relevant to the effectiveness of either.
You've given me the impression in this thread that 1) you think a disadvantage of Feint is that if you miss it's useless, and 2) that AI/DS (or both) gives superior survivability due to leeching more life, and killing whatever it is quicker. However, it seems to have been overlooked that not only can AI/DS both also miss and be useless, but that they also only last for one effect, where as Feint does not. What I mean is, because Feint lasts several seconds, not only can you afford to miss, but while you are you are taking less damage. If you miss your AI or DS this isn't the case. This equates to an advantage Feint has over the other two.
I will give you few quotes. You can click on the small red up-arrow and read the whole post.
I feel I need to remind you that we discussed about 'who survives better' or in other word 'who has lesser chance to die'. So your words 'it helps' and 'it is an advantage' mean 'it decrease your chance to die'. Do you agree that it would be pretty oddly and absolutely wrong to say 'it helps'/'it's an advantage' when it increases you chance to die or it doesn't change your chance to die? Confirm please.
It's about Travesty, Dread Horn and other peerless (not including Shimmering). I said Feint doesn't help against them because good non-feint template has less chance to die.
In this quote you claim that some template with feint survive better than any template without feint.
You claim that Feint helps against any monster or animal in the game (I'm not sure does 'everything' includes' other players). This means that with feint you have less chance to die even against rabbits.
By the way this means that your best char without feint has some chance to die on rabbits.
The same as above.
ALWAYS. And you rejected all my arguments like 'halving damage is not free so depending on price it may be disadvantage.
Here you directly say that a char with feint has lesser chance to die.
No I don't. In that quote all I said was Feint reduces your chance of death. I didn't say anything about whether it was better/worse than a template, that's an argument you've invented on your own.
And they do. This (like the rest of it) doesn't support your point.
None of what you have quoted here is a post in which I say 'feint ALWAYS survive better than ANY template without feint.' as you claim in post #108.
How Feint reduce your chance of death if a char without Feint die less (have less chance to die)?
The two things are entirely separate. Feint doesn't do half damage unless template x is doing blah blah blah, it just does half damage, the comparison you've invented is irrelevant to it's functionality.
They are not separate. You doesn't generate Feint from air. To use it you need special equipment. And usually you need to change your template. For example, Bushido Paladin can't use Feint.
When I suggested to separate Feint and equipment ("feint on a bladed staff") you said it rubbish.
When I wrote that Feint is not a free bonus and about price you need pay to get it, you just repeated like a mantra that Feint halves damage and taking less damage is always an advantage. (although both those your claims are wrong)
You cannot logically compare Feint (a special move that does a set thing) with a template (a collection of things, including skills, items, target, players setup, players skill and a dozen other highly variable factors). This is why they are separate. This is why most of your arguments have been irrelevant.
Feint on a Bladed Staff is rubbish because it does not exist in game!
You want to discuss Feint vs Templates. I do not. My point, as it has been throughout your inability to understand what is being said to you, is that Feint does what it does regardless of the other variables.
The only thing wrong in this thread is you claiming I've said things I clearly haven't.
I don't compare Feint with a template. I'm speaking about using Feint in the game and it can be used only as a part of templates.
Repeating feint description from uoguide doesn't help to other players except novices that don't know about uoguide. Practical advices about using it in the game - this is what is useful.
Which is why I imagine the OP made the thread.
I did run a fencing sampire like the one in the original post back when there was only imbuing and no reforging. Did like it, very solid template, little chance of dying . Nice thing about that temp is, it actually needs very little in gear and can be made on a low budget or on siege ruleset.
That said, i did retire it because sampires are less usefull for general purpose these days, IF you got the resources to build something else. Chances are, you dont need those 99 points in necro at all.
Mystic fencer kills fencing sampire in terms of flexibility and not needing to soulstone stuff around all day, and for the true hard melee hitters i prefer 4/6 chiv/ninja/fencer or just a ranged char.
About feint, i still believe its very useful for when you use bandage healing or bad gear. For sampires on the other hand, the typical method these days is to simply outheal the incoming damage by chaining armor ignores or double strikes, there are not that many mobs where you need feint on a sampire.
That said, i did retire it because sampires are less usefull for general purpose these days, IF you got the resources to build something else. Chances are, you dont need those 99 points in necro at all.
Mystic fencer kills fencing sampire in terms of flexibility and not needing to soulstone stuff around all day, and for the true hard melee hitters i prefer 4/6 chiv/ninja/fencer or just a ranged char.
About feint, i still believe its very useful for when you use bandage healing or bad gear. For sampires on the other hand, the typical method these days is to simply outheal the incoming damage by chaining armor ignores or double strikes, there are not that many mobs where you need feint on a sampire.
ninja for mirror images? how much ninja?
(could you post both your template mentioned here in a new threads?)
Chance to divert is Ninjitsu skill -30. So at 120 you have a 90% chance that the attacker will lose target, while you continue to hit, until they retarget you (unless you have hit spell or any DOT effects going off which makes it happen faster obviously.)
If I'm not intending to need mounts or followers I'd have Ninja on every character if I could.
I believe you must be on foot to use mirror images?
And probably good FC/FCR to cast them between swings?
On foot yes. Casting mirror images doesnt affect swing speed. Bit slow with 0 fc, i did always try to have at least 2 fc when using them on melee chars.
When using lots of bushido/ninja/chiv/necro during combat a little bit of fcr makes the playing easier.
@CorwinXX , no offense, but you've been a plague in this thread since post #11 by stating that there are "monsters you can't leech life off of." It's become obvious that you have some deep issues involving sampires. Maybe one used to be a friend and left you for another whammy partner, who knows... (yes that was a joke.)
AGAIN.....
This thread (among others) is for new players who have interest in doing "Warrior things." This is not a thread saying "my template is better than yours." There are plenty of templates to chose from. This specific template shows how a player can use Feint, Counter-Attack and Evasion to maximize damage mitigation while boosting DPS. For a warrior template (as in hitting stuff with a weapon in your hand) there ain't much more to do to mitigate damage (we don't need to discuss what more can be done, we already traveled down that road in this thread, multiple times.)
This thread was supposed to be a new helpful little thing for new players, and you've all turned it into this big in-depth theory crafting discussion all because of what you believe (that your template is better than mine, which I could care less about.) @CorwinXX you've derailed this thread, and in doing so any new player that reaches this thread and chooses to read all the comments will now be either confused or double-guessing exactly what's true and what's not.
A brand new player walking into this game doesn't want to be told which weapon skill he should pick. He wants to pick it himself, and if he wants fencing, then by god he's gona use fencing. And if said player needs a template for fencing, guess where he can go to find one? Thaaaat's right! The warrior thread where there are plenty of templates to choose from!!!!!! Holy crap it's almost like players have a choice over what skills they want to use to make whatever template they want, HOW CAN THIS BE? WHAT GAME IS THIS!?!
This is a very simple template, for new players. If you're not a new player, then get the hell out
EDIT: And as far as DAMAGE MITIGATION goes yes, this is top of the litter. Attune weapon is a caster's spell, with 0 Spell Weaving, humans have a 50% chance to cast it (and only humans.) Sitting there spamming Attune Weapon until it's successful in a PVM fight is not effective.
This template == get hit like a truck and keep on swinging.
AGAIN.....
This thread (among others) is for new players who have interest in doing "Warrior things." This is not a thread saying "my template is better than yours." There are plenty of templates to chose from. This specific template shows how a player can use Feint, Counter-Attack and Evasion to maximize damage mitigation while boosting DPS. For a warrior template (as in hitting stuff with a weapon in your hand) there ain't much more to do to mitigate damage (we don't need to discuss what more can be done, we already traveled down that road in this thread, multiple times.)
This thread was supposed to be a new helpful little thing for new players, and you've all turned it into this big in-depth theory crafting discussion all because of what you believe (that your template is better than mine, which I could care less about.) @CorwinXX you've derailed this thread, and in doing so any new player that reaches this thread and chooses to read all the comments will now be either confused or double-guessing exactly what's true and what's not.
A brand new player walking into this game doesn't want to be told which weapon skill he should pick. He wants to pick it himself, and if he wants fencing, then by god he's gona use fencing. And if said player needs a template for fencing, guess where he can go to find one? Thaaaat's right! The warrior thread where there are plenty of templates to choose from!!!!!! Holy crap it's almost like players have a choice over what skills they want to use to make whatever template they want, HOW CAN THIS BE? WHAT GAME IS THIS!?!
This is a very simple template, for new players. If you're not a new player, then get the hell out
EDIT: And as far as DAMAGE MITIGATION goes yes, this is top of the litter. Attune weapon is a caster's spell, with 0 Spell Weaving, humans have a 50% chance to cast it (and only humans.) Sitting there spamming Attune Weapon until it's successful in a PVM fight is not effective.
This template == get hit like a truck and keep on swinging.
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No. You have posted wrong info here. You misleaded new players. I just pointed that your info is wrong.
Here is what you posted:
Sibble's template is a good one that gets a new player going fast. Im not questioning that . However, the whole -strongest all-around tank- description is a bit misleading and that is what did start the whole discussion.
That temp isnt all around. Oh, cant fight this, need to soulstone, cant fight that because of anti life leech, stun attacks or mystics putting you out of form.
A tank in other games is usually a char that does take damage for the group and keeps aggro from mobs, but sampires in general are suboptimal for random group play.
And strongest is always debatable as this thread does show.
Apart from that, posting those overkill suits is something that doesnt exactly help new players, because they take quite a bit of time and/or gold to build.
That temp isnt all around. Oh, cant fight this, need to soulstone, cant fight that because of anti life leech, stun attacks or mystics putting you out of form.
A tank in other games is usually a char that does take damage for the group and keeps aggro from mobs, but sampires in general are suboptimal for random group play.
And strongest is always debatable as this thread does show.
Apart from that, posting those overkill suits is something that doesnt exactly help new players, because they take quite a bit of time and/or gold to build.
@CorwinXX Well then that would be what we'd call an opinion Corwin and I told you before what you do with opinions back on page one bro.
Not one sentence in the original post is incorrect. Go ahead and post any information you have that says otherwise. I don't even know what you're arguing anymore it's pretty silly at this point. You have obviously been somehow offended by my opinion stating that this is the strongest all-around tanking template in the game, which would mean you have in mind a better one. Maybe you should go make your own post with your template if you feel that strongly about it, and then I'll head over and criticize it with nothing but opinions. Or maybe you should even post some hard proof comparing something vs. something that shows a result of some kind that says "hey look this is better!" Until then, everything you've posted in this thread has been nothing but an opinion.
Now instead of useful information relating to the original post that new players could have been reading on the first, second or even third pages of this post, is now flooded with your opinions.
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Whaat? While I agree with most of what you said, could you maybe clarify what you mean by "sampires are sub-optimal for random group play." Because what it sounds like you're saying is that sampires aren't good for playing with other people.
EDIT: Sampires make a great group player IMO. We call a Sampire template a Sampire template because he's a Samurai in Vampiric Embrace. But it is what it is, a template, and it can be used to do whatever with.
What happens when a Sampire gets to an encounter that has anti-life leech? Simple, he turns off Vampiric Embrace and then becomes a meat shield for some happy-to-help-heal mage. Thus forming a bond between two said players, later on they become the best of friends and invite more of their friends into UO. See how that works?
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Corrected original post, dunno what I was thinking when I wrote that. Probably got worn out from writing and lost track of where I was lol.
120 Fencing/Tactics/Anatomy/Bushido, 60 parry, 99 Necro, 90 Chivalry -729
120 Swords/Tactics/Resisting Spells/Bushido, 60 parry, 99 Necro, 90 Chivalry -729
"The second one has the same damage as the first one, about the same stats but has 120 Resisting Spells."
It has resisting spells because you removed anatomy lol?
again... and again... and again....
You're comparing DAMAGE DONE
This thread is about DAMAGE TAKEN
WELCOME
This should really be in it's own thread but I'm not playing much at the minute and cba...
I highly doubt there are any (both in UO and in this thread), but if there are any new players actually reading this, here's my specific advice:
New players shouldn't even bother making a sampire. Why? Because they're mid-advanced level characters, that to be effective require some money, time training up skills in ways that aren't obvious if you're new, are overkill for 80% of the game, and require you to know more about the game than is worth filling your head with. To even be a sampire you need at least 99 Necro and (I know some people play with less but those people are imo not sampires) at least 100 Bushido. People built/played/invented them to begin with to solo high level game content. Yes the world and it's brother have since made every spin off imaginable but that is/was the purpose of a sampire, the fundamentals haven't changed, they're still most effective in above average situations which new players are not likely to be in because they're new!
Instead, I highly recommend you go with Ninjitsu. Why? Because you need less points in it before it's useful, you need less points in it period, there's no greater damage mitigation than not even being flagged in the first place - it negates both melee and spells - and unlike say Peace (which again would be 2x the skill point investment) the success chance is more consistent. A basic Ninja of around 70 skill can do 80% of the game. I include things like Doom in that. Whenever I start a new shard I build a Ninja dexxer. Why? Because I can farm Doom for artifacts on them to quickly gear up characters.
I've built countless variations of both and I've always been using my Ninja long before my sampire would even be done. I don't think most new players are going to work a template to completion before even taking it out which you more or less do with sampire.
I'd recommend a template like this to new players (this is what you aim for to begin with):
100 Weapon Skill (any - though I wouldn't chose Archery - because 1. cost of arrows and 2. additional weight)
100 Tactics
100 Healing
100 Anatomy
100 Ninjitsu
100 Chivalry
100 Resisting Spells
Start with high Str, 50 Ninjitsu, and either Chiv, Resist or Healing. Buy everything else in New Haven, and take all the quests, you can then gain from forest animals to 70, at which point you're ready to hunt. This all takes about 2 hours.
Compare that to a sampire... in the same time frame, you have to work your stats up to have enough mana to even begin working Necro (this all assumes you have access to a full training suit as well).
I highly doubt there are any (both in UO and in this thread), but if there are any new players actually reading this, here's my specific advice:
New players shouldn't even bother making a sampire. Why? Because they're mid-advanced level characters, that to be effective require some money, time training up skills in ways that aren't obvious if you're new, are overkill for 80% of the game, and require you to know more about the game than is worth filling your head with. To even be a sampire you need at least 99 Necro and (I know some people play with less but those people are imo not sampires) at least 100 Bushido. People built/played/invented them to begin with to solo high level game content. Yes the world and it's brother have since made every spin off imaginable but that is/was the purpose of a sampire, the fundamentals haven't changed, they're still most effective in above average situations which new players are not likely to be in because they're new!
Instead, I highly recommend you go with Ninjitsu. Why? Because you need less points in it before it's useful, you need less points in it period, there's no greater damage mitigation than not even being flagged in the first place - it negates both melee and spells - and unlike say Peace (which again would be 2x the skill point investment) the success chance is more consistent. A basic Ninja of around 70 skill can do 80% of the game. I include things like Doom in that. Whenever I start a new shard I build a Ninja dexxer. Why? Because I can farm Doom for artifacts on them to quickly gear up characters.
I've built countless variations of both and I've always been using my Ninja long before my sampire would even be done. I don't think most new players are going to work a template to completion before even taking it out which you more or less do with sampire.
I'd recommend a template like this to new players (this is what you aim for to begin with):
100 Weapon Skill (any - though I wouldn't chose Archery - because 1. cost of arrows and 2. additional weight)
100 Tactics
100 Healing
100 Anatomy
100 Ninjitsu
100 Chivalry
100 Resisting Spells
Start with high Str, 50 Ninjitsu, and either Chiv, Resist or Healing. Buy everything else in New Haven, and take all the quests, you can then gain from forest animals to 70, at which point you're ready to hunt. This all takes about 2 hours.
Compare that to a sampire... in the same time frame, you have to work your stats up to have enough mana to even begin working Necro (this all assumes you have access to a full training suit as well).
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Please read post you are quoting before answering... read it including the quite.120 Fencing/Tactics/Anatomy/Bushido, 60 parry, 99 Necro, 90 Chivalry -729
120 Swords/Tactics/Resisting Spells/Bushido, 60 parry, 99 Necro, 90 Chivalry -729
"The second one has the same damage as the first one, about the same stats but has 120 Resisting Spells."
It has resisting spells because you removed anatomy lol?
again... and again... and again....
You're comparing DAMAGE DONE
This thread is about DAMAGE TAKEN
WELCOME
So my answer is comparing a "leafblade without feint" with a bladed staff.
It must be obvious that I removed anatomy to make damages equal... or not?
I haven't been offended. I just pointed you just you are incorrect. And it is not only my opinion but truth.
I have already named you templates that are stronger and more all-rounded tanks than fencer sampire: Bushido Paladin and Classic Paladin are good examples.
If you want we could create two list of monsters:
1 = against fencing sampire tanks better
2 = against paladin tanks better
Any fair person confirms that the second list will be very wide. And no one say the same about the first list.
I'm sorry I can't understand what does this mean. (my english is not good enough to understand hints/mod/irony and other tiny things)
Does it mean that I haven't played with tank templates?
I did. Including fencing sampire from this topic. And I even posted fencing sampire template more than one year ago. But I also played with other templates that are able to tank much better.
The only thing you need to understand is that this thread is a suggestion of a template. A break down of the reasons for various parts of it. So that people can then choose to follow if they want.
Unlike to you I'm able to notice the difference between "I suggest this template" and "It is the best tank template in the game".
This is a good example of failure of interpretation. I never said this is the best tanking template in the game. But if you'd like my opinion on it, yes I do believe it is. I said it is the strongest all-around tanking template, evidently our interpretations of this are far and different.
@CorwinXX Do you know what "Damage Mitigation" is? Basically it is the reduction of your enemy's attack effectiveness. Whether that means lowering their damage, increasing your resistance, lowering their chance to hit, increasing your chance to block.
Do you know what isn't damage mitigation? Life leech is a good example of what is not damage mitigation. Life leech is "Survivability," it does not mitigate ANY damage taken. In this entire thread all your points have been towards doing damage and leeching life, when you fail to realize that this template is for MITIGATING DAMAGE. Drinking potions, casting Greater Heal, leeching life, running away, these are all examples of survivability.
There is no template that can mitigate more damage than this one (with the exception of the Spellweaving Spell: Attune Weapon.)
So you keep hitting that reply button and posting "No" and I'll keep hitting the same button and posting "Yes" until you feel like you've made whatever point it is you're trying to make.
Bottom line is, there is no misinformation on the original post.
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BTW I've played your template and this tanking template is better, cheers.
Well, If "strongest all-around tanking template" means "there are a lot of monsters it can't tank at all and for other monsters there are better tanks" than I agree with you here. Otherwise tell me your interpretation.
I see that your template is for mitigating damage. I have just pointed that mitigating damage doesn't make this template better tank then other templates.
Don't repeat the other poster's error: mitigating damage is not the aim - it just a one way to survive better - and more mitigating damage doesn't always mean better survivability.
(I should note you that "always" means "in any situation". So if you say "always does" I need post just one example when it doesn't to refute your statement.)
There is another wrong info from you. There are melee templates that can mitigate more damage than your one.
By the way can you kill EV with your template standing toe to toe and without any way to heal (no VE, no LL, no Healing, no Potions, no Confidence and so on)? If you mitigate damage so well than you must easily do it.
You keep saying this but you have 0 information to back it up (because, you're wrong.)
How about a template to compare it to, and abilities used to mitigate damage.
Leaf Blade = Only weapon in the game with AI/Feint = Best tanking weapon in the game. Period. There's no arguing it. You could, but you'd be wrong.
EDIT: Also, Counter Attack. Thanks.
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3 UEVs simultaneously without using Vampire Embrace and other way of healing? Don't lie please.
It was your idea to compare damage mitigating. So tell us how much damage do you take from UEV, not how much you heal with VE.
I see you don't answer my questions but just post some not related info. I believe it because answering will show that you was wrong.
What is you interpretation of "strongest all-around tanking template"?
Where is your list of monster that this templates tanks better?
Where is your number how much damage you take from one EV?
When I say about tanking you jump to damage mitigation. When I say about damage mitigation you jump to tanking.
Show us your ability to mitigate damage - kill UEV without ANY way of healing (so no leaching life).
And I will list you abilities to mitigate damage that you don't use in your template after this.
If you speak about damage mitigation... you needn't AI to mitigate damage... and there are other weapons with Feint.
If you speak about tanking... you needn't Feint to tank... and there are other weapons with AI.
Who said you that best tanking weapon must have both AI and Feint?
Show us your ability to tank with a leafblade - give us list of monsters that you can tank with leafblade and I can't tank with other weapon of my choice.
Your words are just words. They are not confirmed by experience. Even more - the game practice refutes your words.
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Every time I stop some one restarts few weeks later.
No you are not, as you said yourself English is not your native language, and every pointless argument you have created in this thread has been based on your misinterpretation of what is being said. Ordinarily I start from the perspective of assuming that majorities are usually wrong, however, in this thread, the fact that every single person disagrees with you should to a rational mind suggest that you are not quite grasping the conversation.
Disagree, it's one of the best, interested to know your view then on Ninjitsu/Mirror Images? Or would you not class that as mitigation?