Classic shard.

[Longest Journey]

Slippery slope. The people that are looking for this and that would return don't want changes and don't want the new features. You can not cater to everybody... thats how trammel came about. Classic T2A shard up to a certain publish. Done. Tons would return.

Agreed. I could see maybe.....MAYBE....adding in Ilshenar after about a year or two, minus the McFarlaine steampunk crap. Definitely add in Kahldun to the Lost Lands. And for crying out loud, hire some better writers for the story line!

Also, with the money they'd be making from the Classic Servers, perhaps the development team could, I dont know, make some new lands that make sense? Going back means they can take a new course with UO, perhaps add in lands from previous Ultima games.

I know that if the developers did want to add new landmasses to Classic Servers, I would want to see lands like the Serpent Isles, Pagan, Akalabeth, places like that. Keep things in the Ultima universe.

However, that is a discussion for a possible future.

 

[Guido_LS]

For what it is worth Guido_LS, I have devoted more time to this issue than I should have...and at the end of the day, all I want is exactly what you want. Yet somehow, I have become the 'bad guy' in your eyes. How does that happen? What exactly makes someone like you turn on someone like me...when in the end, all we want is the same things?

Do you remember this question? And you still haven't figured out the answer to that question?

If you like the current game, there are 26 shards up and running almost 24/7 for you to choose from. Enjoy!

From a couple of posts up... when there was no evidence to make that statement/claim...

So your position is made clear...you want a Classic Post-Ren shard. Wonderful. You want what you want.

To me... after I made it clear I wanted a pre-AoS/pre-Ren server...

22 other examples in 4 other threads/topics

I guess we can say that trashing the other guy, without the sake of ANY substance, isn't just for Felucca anymore?

Yet somehow, I have become the 'bad guy' in your eyes. How does that happen?

Call it an astute ability to smell the coffee before it hits the brewer...

 

[tenduil]

Agreed. I could see maybe.....MAYBE....adding in Ilshenar after about a year or two, minus the McFarlaine steampunk crap. Definitely add in Kahldun to the Lost Lands. And for crying out loud, hire some better writers for the story line!

Also, with the money they'd be making from the Classic Servers, perhaps the development team could, I dont know, make some new lands that make sense? Going back means they can take a new course with UO, perhaps add in lands from previous Ultima games.

I know that if the developers did want to add new landmasses to Classic Servers, I would want to see lands like the Serpent Isles, Pagan, Akalabeth, places like that. Keep things in the Ultima universe.

However, that is a discussion for a possible future.

They would get the highest return of players if they guaranteed NO new lands beyond T2A. The dispersion of players ruins the game. It might have made sense for lag purposes 10 years ago but now when everyone has cable/dsl lag is not a problem.

UO T2A is the best bet. As somebody else said... the Lost Lands are basically like a huge open dungeon thats fun to visit but pretty much everybody is in felucca which is the only other land mass which is PERFECTLY FINE.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

To me... after I made it clear I wanted a pre-AoS/pre-Ren server...

So I am still unclear...it sounds like we want the same thing. I just don't feel the need to get mired down in details like how many lock downs houses should have, or what direction items should face when stacked, etc.

You want, what?

Custom housing? - Fine...I'd play on a T2A shard with custom housing. I'd rather it wasn't there, but it is not a deal breaker.

Lands beyond T2A? - I'd still play on it if it included Ilshenar, but I probably would not if it contain Tokuno, Malas, etc.

New skills? - I can't see many of the post AoS skills working as well without all the items...and I would probably prefer not to have them on a Classic Shard.

Artifacts? - I don't see the point if we are going pre-AoS.

Vet Rewards? - I'd still play if there were Vet Rewards...even that god awful ridiculous ridable polar bear.

Neon Colors? - This might be a deal breaker for me...maybe not, but why would anyone want this??



So, did I cover the things we disagree on? Did I miss something? At one point, you and I were on the same page, then somehow, we ended up apart on this...if you require something specific, do tell...I don't really feel like digging back through every post.

 

[dum3886]

Slippery slope. The people that are looking for this and that would return don't want changes and don't want the new features. You can not cater to everybody... thats how trammel came about. Classic T2A shard up to a certain publish. Done. Tons would return.

Slippery slope indeed... but they need to find a balance. The shard cannot stand still in time for the next decade, it will have to change at some point. This is pretty much giving UO another chance. Add in additions w/o screwing up the core ideals of UO. For example my bushido idea... i dun see that being a problem by adding it in. Take 100 slot points u get a bit of parry with 2 handed weapons... obviously less than what parry would give u... but u get extra abilities to compensate.

They would have to change things around so nothing gets screwed over i.e: if bushido gave the same parry advantage as parry itself.. the parry skill would be obsolete.. so if gm parry gives u 30% chance to parry make bushido give 15% but u get a few other skills like lighting strike etc...

*EDIT*
I choose bushido as an example bcz i can see how it would be a decent addition... other ones like ninja,spellweaving etc... i dun see as much hehe...
*EDIT ENDS*

Well thats at least my view of what should happen... but i am very open to having a server stand still in time lol. I just dun think it'll live for another 10 years. UO even back then did not stand still.. T2A was added in... it wasn't something bad it was a positive addition... changes can be made just they have to step carefully so they dun fall into the same pitfalls as they did 8 years ago.

 

[Unsatisfied]

Slippery slope indeed... but they need to find a balance. The shard cannot stand still in time for the next decade, it will have to change at some point. This is pretty much giving UO another chance. Add in additions w/o screwing up the core ideals of UO. For example my bushido idea... i dun see that being a problem by adding it in. Take 100 slot points u get a bit of parry with 2 handed weapons... obviously less than what parry would give u... but u get extra abilities to compensate.

They would have to change things around so nothing gets screwed over i.e: if bushido gave the same parry advantage as parry itself.. the parry skill would be obsolete.. so if gm parry gives u 30% chance to parry make bushido give 15% but u get a few other skills like lighting strike etc...

*EDIT*
I choose bushido as an example bcz i can see how it would be a decent addition... other ones like ninja,spellweaving etc... i dun see as much hehe...
*EDIT ENDS*

Well thats at least my view of what should happen... but i am very open to having a server stand still in time lol. I just dun think it'll live for another 10 years. UO even back then did not stand still.. T2A was added in... it wasn't something bad it was a positive addition... changes can be made just they have to step carefully so they dun fall into the same pitfalls as they did 8 years ago.

Progressive changes are welcome in the long run, but I don't think skills are one of the changes I would back. Maybe my view would change long term but right now it's a no from me

 

[dum3886]

Opinions are opinions i accept that.

But i agree they need to fix a lot of things before they can even think of progressing whether is be expansion of land, skills, etc.. etc... when the time comes, hopefully they will listen to what the people want as no one will truly know what they want till the time actually comes.

 

[Zuckuss]

Re: Classic shard: Narrowing the gaps

10 years and 90,000 emoticons of beating dead horses later, I still vote:


YES!

Let's do it!

For me I am leaning toward t2a.

I would like to add that there have been some improvments over the years that are worth keeping, such as skill and stat locks among other things.

It's refreshing to finally see this topic acknowledged again.

 

[Kaleb]

Dont get me wrong peeps, I want 90% the same as you all do. I however would like to see some things added, that doesn't unbalance skills, combat, gameplay in any form. I don't want any Trammel ruleset, though one is needed being to many a "classic Server" IS pre AOS/Pub-16. even though I dislike the trammel ruleset. I fit the category of "Classic" being defined as the system sometime prior to AOS/pub-16. If i mention lands it don't mean i want the trammel ruleset just the fact that I would rather see more housing available so we don't get the insane housing prices we had up to AOS, if i mention custom houses it means it doesnt include the current housing rules and all the tiles. I would like to see some of the weapon and armors that we have now granted that they are Vanq, Fort, guarding, might whatever. I dont see how any would hurt as long as the shard sticks to the T2a ruleset.

 

[Zuckuss]

Re: Classic shard: Narrowing the gaps

Also I think that allowing players to place a house on the said shard without having to risk their current house decaying, will contribute to the success of this idea.

I will add more as I think of it!

 

[Unsatisfied]

Dont get me wrong peeps, I want 90% the same as you all do. I however would like to see some things added, that doesn't unbalance skills, combat, gameplay in any form. I don't want any Trammel ruleset, though one is needed being to many a "classic Server" IS pre AOS/Pub-16. even though I dislike the trammel ruleset. I fit the category of "Classic" being defined as the system sometime prior to AOS/pub-16. If i mention lands it don't mean i want the trammel ruleset just the fact that I would rather see more housing available so we don't get the insane housing prices we had up to AOS, if i mention custom houses it means it doesnt include the current housing rules and all the tiles. I would like to see some of the weapon and armors that we have now granted that they are Vanq, Fort, guarding, might whatever. I dont see how any would hurt as long as the shard sticks to the T2a ruleset.

I know I've said this before but the large housing prices pre AoS I saw as a good thing. It really meant something to own land. And thats the way I believe it should be. People should have to work hard to afford a house. If not, live out of their bank box like a peasant. Or co-own with friends or guilds once again helping "community"

 

[tenduil]

I know I've said this before but the large housing prices pre AoS I saw as a good thing. It really meant something to own land. And thats the way I believe it should be. People should have to work hard to afford a house. If not, live out of their bank box like a peasant. Or co-own with friends or guilds once again helping "community"

This.

 

[dum3886]

"I would like to see some of the weapon and armors that we have now granted that they are Vanq, Fort, guarding, might whatever. I dont see how any would hurt as long as the shard sticks to the T2a ruleset."


The first sentence.. what does that even mean? does this mean u want fc1, SC, -1 fc, lighitn strike etc... on the items? If it is so... that idea is pretty much everything that is against a classic shard.. we dun want an item based game we want a balanced skill based game. it wasn't the change of ruleset that killed original UO... it was the items that kill the game. If the game just didn't have all these crazy arties right now.. i'd be very happy to leave it as it is.. its just the armour/item system has gone crazy.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

No, I think what he means is that you could have, for example, a Surpassingly Accurate Ornate Axe of Might. Not the AoS item properties, but the items themselves.

I would not have a problem with that per se...as long as the difference between an Ornate Axe and a Battle Axe was purely cosmetic.

The biggest problem I have with the current item-based system, besides needing a spreadsheet to plan your gear, is that too many newer items make too many older items completely obsolete. The simplicity of old UO, and the fact that the weapons and armor were more or less limited, made it better in my eyes...but I can understand the need for aesthetic distinction between characters, as long as it is realistic and retains a 'fantasy' look, I have no issue with it.

 

[Rancid Wolf]

It's cool to see everyone talking about what they would like to see on a "classic server" and as much as I agree that some of these changes people are bringing up will only add people to the server population we need to keep in mind that first and foremost we need a "classic server". No new additions, just a straight up old-school Ultima Online ruleset, the way it was. Improvements can be made from there at a later date if it is successful.

 

[ingsmsico]

is this happening or not?

if so, when does the classic shard open? where will it be located (east coast, west coast)? what era of UO will it be? will there be free gametime?

 

[mikni]

is this happening or not?

if so, when does the classic shard open? where will it be located (east coast, west coast)? what era of UO will it be?

Who knows.

will there be free gametime?

Of course not.

 

[Cal_Mythic]

There's something that those agitating for a classic shard don't seem to get, and it is becoming clear in this thread. At no point in it's lifetime was UO ever perfect. There was no point in UO's lifetime, not even way back in whatever mythical time you happen to think was UO's zenith, where there weren't plenty of complaints about all kinds of issues. If a classic shard is created that reverts to a particular time period all the issues that were present in game, all the imbalances and bugs, all the exploits that have been fixed since then will either have to be fixed, or they will be recreated.

There is something in psychology called "the halo effect". It happens when we tend to think of a subject as all good, or all bad, and in doing so ignore or forget all the evidence that contradicts that general impression. This applies perfectly to the views of many who are asking for a classic shard. They seem to think that at some point in UO's history there was a time when the game was as perfect as it will ever be, and forget that there was never a time when UO wasn't plagued by bugs, imbalances, exploits, cheats, haves and have-nots, anti-social pricks, and the list is endless.

I don't have a problem with a "classic shard" if it replaces Siege and Mugen, but I don't want to see a third rules set being supported that pulls development bandwidth away from the core game as it exists now. Because if a "classic" shard is created the devs aren't going to be able to simply set it up and let it run. There are going to be bugs that will need to be fixed, exploits that will need to be fixed, imbalances that will need to be addressed, and development decisions that will have to be made.

Well-crafted

 

[Storm]

I remember those days and they really did suck ! it was fun but the game has evolved many many bugs have been fixed ! the only way i would go back there is if they got all my old friends long gone back in the game AND payed me to play it or it was free!

 

[Evlar]

There's something that those agitating for a classic shard don't seem to get, and it is becoming clear in this thread. At no point in it's lifetime was UO ever perfect. There was no point in UO's lifetime, not even way back in whatever mythical time you happen to think was UO's zenith, where there weren't plenty of complaints about all kinds of issues. If a classic shard is created that reverts to a particular time period all the issues that were present in game, all the imbalances and bugs, all the exploits that have been fixed since then will either have to be fixed, or they will be recreated.

There is something in psychology called "the halo effect". It happens when we tend to think of a subject as all good, or all bad, and in doing so ignore or forget all the evidence that contradicts that general impression. This applies perfectly to the views of many who are asking for a classic shard. They seem to think that at some point in UO's history there was a time when the game was as perfect as it will ever be, and forget that there was never a time when UO wasn't plagued by bugs, imbalances, exploits, cheats, haves and have-nots, anti-social pricks, and the list is endless.

I don't have a problem with a "classic shard" if it replaces Siege and Mugen, but I don't want to see a third rules set being supported that pulls development bandwidth away from the core game as it exists now. Because if a "classic" shard is created the devs aren't going to be able to simply set it up and let it run. There are going to be bugs that will need to be fixed, exploits that will need to be fixed, imbalances that will need to be addressed, and development decisions that will have to be made.

Well-crafted

Well, I think that just about says it all really.

The only comment in this thread from the one who dangled the carrot - and it's to comment on the pitfalls.

I now honestly believe we have about as much chance of seeing classic shards become a reality as I have (being a British expatriate in Spain) of running for President of the USA.

I'm not going to waste my time or money supporting something that's got worse, instead of better. Neither am I going to hang around and wait for something that's not likely to happen.

There will be a couple of idocs in Europa for anyone interested in "items" soon, I'm closing my accounts permanently.

Adios.

 

[woolygimp]

Well, I think that just about says it all really.

The only comment in this thread from the one who dangled the carrot - and it's to comment on the pitfalls.

I now honestly believe we have about as much chance of seeing classic shards become a reality as I have (being a British expatriate in Spain) of running for President of the USA.

I'm not going to waste my time or money supporting something that's got worse, instead of better. Neither am I going to hang around and wait for something that's not likely to happen.

There's will be a couple of idocs in Europa for anyone interested in "items" soon.

Adios.

"well-crafted"

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

Well-crafted

Given the context of the post you quoted, I would take this a sign that a Classic Shard is probably not in the cards.

I really wish that you guys would have the guts to just say that, instead of dancing around the subject.

From my end, the day a Classic Shard (no Trammel/no AoS) is no longer being considered, is the day I cancel my accounts and walk away from the wreckage of this once great game forever...but I think you know that there are many that share my point of view. So rather than commit one way or another, you keep us all hanging on, paying our subscriptions, in vain.

Just tell us one way or another.

There are plenty of free shards out there that cater to my playstyle...and did I mention they are FREE?? In fact...I happen to be quite handy when it comes to .net and C#...who knows where that might take me.

 

[Storm]

cool idocs cant wait!

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

cool idocs cant wait!

And at least 1 customer supporting the game you play is gone. When it becomes 1000 less, or 5000 less, are you going to be so excited to get your hands on their items?

You, and many other people here...especially the devs, really need to consider the larger picture. UO is a game that is supported directly by its customers...and if they stop paying...you stop playing. Get it?

 

[Storm]

I think they have done a great job for over ten years making it one of the longest running games of its type in history ! I think I will trust there judgment a little longer!

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

I think I will trust there judgment a little longer!

Let's hope their judgment is better than your grammar...

 

[Storm]

lol my bad ! but still why is everyone getting so worked up I did not see where they said no!

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

lol my bad ! but still why is everyone getting so worked up I did not see where they said no!

I was just having fun with you. rolleyes:

 

[woolygimp]

I think they have done a great job for over ten years making it one of the longest running games of its type in history ! I think I will trust there judgment a little longer!

You don't even know who "they" is. UO has changed hands several times, and changed developers/producers even more so.

 

[ProZac]

I love all of the posts about how the old days had their flaws and weren't great and blah blah blah. Either you never played back then and want to pretend you did, or you didn't have a good enough grasp of the game back then to be worth a damn. Then, AoS came along and suddenly you started sucking less and became an AoS advocate without actually realizing what it did to our game.

No, things weren't PERFECT back then obviously. Of course there were bugs, exploits, hacks, rude players - it's an MMO. As it's been noted here by multiple people, there's a reason UO players are lured by original freeshards. If you're misinformed and have no clue what you are saying, do the game a favor and keep your groundless opinion to yourself. If this shard was created it wouldn't be for the players who rely on Trammel, insurance, and the loads of garbage that have been introduced to the game since a development team with a real focus controlled the direction of the game.

At this point I almost hope the abomination that UO has become dies a horrible death and the entire remaining population will move to a T2A freeshard. That would be lightyears more enjoyable than what we have now.

Llewen thanks for your comment, but you can head back to DF forums. The clueless devs don't need anymore input from a player that jumped ship first chance they got.

 

[Storm]

I was just having fun with you. rolleyes:

I know! you should see my hand writing
I just think we are lucky to have this game (and it is just a game just some of us take it very serious myself included sometimes)as long as we have! and instead of complaining about what we dont have maybe be thankful for what we do!

And as A side note I think if enough want it its fine but I for one like you and maybe others here should remember some of the bad things that happened back then it was far from perfect that's for sure

anyway I am done for now need to get ready for my sons b-day

 

[AirmidCecht]

When a "well crafted" comment is made in a long discussion regarding the reality of creating the ultimate Classic Shard, I take that as a good thing.

It means if you want it done right and done right the first go round it takes more than a thumbs up and a pat on the back for those that wish it.

Many may want to pop in with their pvp mindset and toss a javelin through the developers here but to even entertain the discussion is something that was taboo not long ago.

Keep up the discussion not with the mindset that it's just a dangled carrot but with the positive mindset that it eventually will happen and done correctly.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

And as A side note I think if enough want it its fine but I for one like you and maybe others here should remember some of the bad things that happened back then it was far from perfect that's for sure

"Perfect"?

Who ever said anything about "perfect" beyond Trammel/AoS fanbois?

No one here has ever claimed that any time period in UO's history was "perfect".


But you, and Llewen, and apparently Cal_Mythic, need to understand the difference between "perfect" and BETTER THAN WHAT WE HAVE NOW.

This false dichotomy that opponents of a Classic Shard love to setup is nothing more than a straw-man argument.

It doesn't have to be one way or the other!!

It is so frustrating to read the comments of people that just cannot get it through their thick skulls that NOT EVERYONE ENJOYS THE SAME PLAYSTYLE YOU DO!!

We (at least I) am not asking for the current shards to be reverted...not asking for you to have to play on a Classic Shard...not asking for you to give up the safety of your risk-free playstyle.

What we ARE asking for is 1 shard out of what would be 27 live shards, not including test shards, that caters to OUR playstyle. We don't want Siege, we don't want new items to lure us to Fel on existing shards...we just want our game back.

Some of us have paid for this game for 13 years continuously. Some of us have reached a point that it is no longer worth the price of admission...others of us reached that point long ago.

We want a commitment from the Devs that our subscriptions matter as much as anyone else's.

I don't see why this is so difficult for some people to understand...


YOU ALREADY HAVE WHAT YOU WANT!! WHY STOP OTHERS FROM GETTING WHAT THEY WANT WHEN THEIR SUBSCRIPTION DOLLARS WILL GO TO FUND THE GAME YOU PLAY??

I need a drink.

 

[Storm]

And as A side note I think if enough want it its fine

Where was I saying NO? I was agreeing as long as ENOUGH people want it also!

 

[ProZac]

"Perfect"?

Who ever said anything about "perfect" beyond Trammel/AoS fanbois?

No one here has ever claimed that any time period in UO's history was "perfect".


But you, and Llewen, and apparently Cal_Mythic, need to understand the difference between "perfect" and BETTER THAN WHAT WE HAVE NOW.

This false dichotomy that opponents of a Classic Shard love to setup is nothing more than a straw-man argument.

It doesn't have to be one way or the other!!

It is so frustrating to read the comments of people that just cannot get it through their thick skulls that NOT EVERYONE ENJOYS THE SAME PLAYSTYLE YOU DO!!

We (at least I) am not asking for the current shards to be reverted...not asking for you to have to play on a Classic Shard...not asking for you to give up the safety of your risk-free playstyle.

What we ARE asking for is 1 shard out of what would be 27 live shards, not including test shards, that caters to OUR playstyle. We don't want Siege, we don't want new items to lure us to Fel on existing shards...we just want our game back.

Some of us have paid for this game for 13 years continuously. Some of us have reached a point that it is no longer worth the price of admission...others of us reached that point long ago.

We want a commitment from the Devs that our subscriptions matter as much as anyone else's.

I don't see why this is so difficult for some people to understand...


YOU ALREADY HAVE WHAT YOU WANT!! WHY STOP OTHERS FROM GETTING WHAT THEY WANT WHEN THEIR SUBSCRIPTION DOLLARS WILL GO TO FUND THE GAME YOU PLAY??

I need a drink.

Thank you for summarizing my feelings and the feelings of many who do not bother posting here and have long given up.

 

[Chardonnay]

Thank you for summarizing my feelings and the feelings of many who do not bother posting here and have long given up.

QFT...

 

[ProZac]

And as A side note I think if enough want it its fine

Where was I saying NO? I was agreeing as long as ENOUGH people want it also!

You'd have to be pretty oblivious to think there isn't enough people who want this.

I really just assume you know very little about the subject this thread is about.

The people you have here advocating for this are just the tip of the iceberg. For every 1 person here asking for this you have hundreds who don't bother coming here and asking yet again for something we have asked for since the day AoS launched. You know, back when UO actually had a fairly sized player base.

 

[tenduil]

"Perfect"?

Who ever said anything about "perfect" beyond Trammel/AoS fanbois?

No one here has ever claimed that any time period in UO's history was "perfect".


But you, and Llewen, and apparently Cal_Mythic, need to understand the difference between "perfect" and BETTER THAN WHAT WE HAVE NOW.

This false dichotomy that opponents of a Classic Shard love to setup is nothing more than a straw-man argument.

It doesn't have to be one way or the other!!

It is so frustrating to read the comments of people that just cannot get it through their thick skulls that NOT EVERYONE ENJOYS THE SAME PLAYSTYLE YOU DO!!

We (at least I) am not asking for the current shards to be reverted...not asking for you to have to play on a Classic Shard...not asking for you to give up the safety of your risk-free playstyle.

What we ARE asking for is 1 shard out of what would be 27 live shards, not including test shards, that caters to OUR playstyle. We don't want Siege, we don't want new items to lure us to Fel on existing shards...we just want our game back.

Some of us have paid for this game for 13 years continuously. Some of us have reached a point that it is no longer worth the price of admission...others of us reached that point long ago.

We want a commitment from the Devs that our subscriptions matter as much as anyone else's.

I don't see why this is so difficult for some people to understand...


YOU ALREADY HAVE WHAT YOU WANT!! WHY STOP OTHERS FROM GETTING WHAT THEY WANT WHEN THEIR SUBSCRIPTION DOLLARS WILL GO TO FUND THE GAME YOU PLAY??

I need a drink.

Spectacular and exactly the point.

BTW Sam Adams Summer Ale is already out...

 

[Evlar]

Simply put, I've waited and hoped long enough for a classic shard option.

The carrot was dangled and there was hope. Doubtless there would be issues and hurdles to overcome to get it working, I don't believe anyone is in denial of that. Rather, the majority of those posting here do understand all too well the "problems" of the past, because we were actually there at the time.

I think I've made it pretty clear what I think of the item based game. I've tried to remain posative about the possibility of an "official" classic shard. I think those of us that were around pre-AOS do understand the game wasn't "perfect", that to re-create a classic era with it's own shard, whilst also maintaining it, would actually require some work on behalf of the developers.

When the leader of the current developers is so inspired by the prospect of a classic shard that his sole comment since dangling the carrot, is a two word response to a post highlighting the obvious pitfalls, by someone who really couldn't care less about the potential of a classic shard, it doesn't exactly inspire my confidence.

So, lacking any faith that the "idea" will be anything more than an "idea" discussed over a sandwich and coffee whilst planning the next batch of items to implement in the current game, that's why I've finally decided to pull the plug on my time with UO.

Credit to all of you who keep the faith, keep paying your subscriptions and hoping that one day, they actually do release a classic shard or two. I truly do hope they eventually listen and act upon your desires.

I shall always keep an eye on things here to see how far that goes and have every intention of returning to UO if in fact it does happen. No doubt the Stratics "critics" will say that I no longer have "valid" cause to comment, as I no longer (as of about two or three hours prior to this post) contribute financially to the game. To be honest, I care little about people who are blinkered to view only things they agree with, instead of considering different possibilities.

It really is a shame to feel the need to call time on the only MMO that I've ever played, but that's basically where I'm at. No doubt I will visit some of the "free" shards to recapture aspects of the gameplay I used to enjoy. It's also a shame that I no longer feel I can enjoy the current game, given there's just too many things I miss about the classic era, that no amount of "items" or expansions will ever replace.

In another thread, asking how to bring back veteran players, most of whom perhaps didn't hold out as long as I and others have over the years post-AoS, the discussion inevitably seemed to focus on "items" unsurprisingly, such as veteran rewards, blah... blah....

Well, to my mind, the one thing that is of far greater reward is the memories of the classic era. Give veterans an option to recapture just some of those memories via a classic shard. That to me, would be the biggest lure for former players.

Well, that's it from me. As now an "outsider" observer looking in through the window, I wish you all well, whatever your preferences.

Evlar.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

*Feels somewhat refreshed after her first watermelon martini of the evening*

Ok...now that I am more calm, I want to respond to Evlar:

Don't give up. Even if you cancel your subscriptions, despite what anyone else will tell you, you are a UO vet...and always will be. Your opinions are regarded highly by some here, including myself...and if you leave the discussion now, you are basically giving them exactly what they want.

Who is "they"? The people here on Stratics that occasionally troll threads like this, and attempt to belittle those of us that have fond memories of days gone by. They feel entitled, and that their opinions should carry more weight than ours. And they feel this way because they have played UO wrapped in a gossamer blanket they call Trammel for years now. They never have to answer to anyone for their actions...because the game is setup so that they can be just as rude, and selfish, and arrogant as they so desire, and there isn't a blessed thing anyone can do about it. Now I am not saying that everyone that plays in Trammel is like this...but you know exactly who I am referring to...and so do they.

And what is it that they want? They want people like you, and me, and any other old school UO vet that shares our opinions to 'go away', They want us to quit. They want us to stop spreading this message on their forum. Why? Because we are a threat to them...or so they believe...otherwise, what difference would any of this make to them? If they don't want to read about "the old days"...most mouses have scroll wheels these days...it's not so difficult to just scroll right on by a thread like this. But, that's not what they want...they want to silence our message...because they are afraid that a Classic Shard might actually happen...and if it does, then they might find themselves on an even more empty shard. Or worse...they might find out that they were wrong, and that the people that play UO actually DO want a challenge, and risk, and community...and not just some expansion that contains overpowered creatures to kill with even more overpowered items.

But we may never get to find out.

So, I applaud you for closing your account. I have 3 that I am currently paying for...but I have not been able to pull the plug just yet. Mostly, it is because I am convinced that a Classic Shard will happen at some point...and when it does, I want to be there to see it. If I close my accounts, I am afraid that I would just walk away from it forever...and I am not ready to do that.

Anyway...I hope you will remain in this discussion until it either comes to fruition, or it is silenced.

 

[SoulStealer A.O]

Simply put, I've waited and hoped long enough for a classic shard option.

The carrot was dangled and there was hope. Doubtless there would be issues and hurdles to overcome to get it working, I don't believe anyone is in denial of that. Rather, the majority of those posting here do understand all too well the "problems" of the past, because we were actually there at the time.

I think I've made it pretty clear what I think of the item based game. I've tried to remain posative about the possibility of an "official" classic shard. I think those of us that were around pre-AOS do understand the game wasn't "perfect", that to re-create a classic era with it's own shard, whilst also maintaining it, would actually require some work on behalf of the developers.

When the leader of the current developers is so inspired by the prospect of a classic shard that his sole comment since dangling the carrot, is a two word response to a post highlighting the obvious pitfalls, by someone who really couldn't care less about the potential of a classic shard, it doesn't exactly inspire my confidence.

So, lacking any faith that the "idea" will be anything more than an "idea" discussed over a sandwich and coffee whilst planning the next batch of items to implement in the current game, that's why I've finally decided to pull the plug on my time with UO.

Credit to all of you who keep the faith, keep paying your subscriptions and hoping that one day, they actually do release a classic shard or two. I truly do hope they eventually listen and act upon your desires.

I shall always keep an eye on things here to see how far that goes and have every intention of returning to UO if in fact it does happen. No doubt the Stratics "critics" will say that I no longer have "valid" cause to comment, as I no longer (as of about two or three hours prior to this post) contribute financially to the game. To be honest, I care little about people who are blinkered to view only things they agree with, instead of considering different possibilities.

It really is a shame to feel the need to call time on the only MMO that I've ever played, but that's basically where I'm at. No doubt I will visit some of the "free" shards to recapture aspects of the gameplay I used to enjoy. It's also a shame that I no longer feel I can enjoy the current game, given there's just too many things I miss about the classic era, that no amount of "items" or expansions will ever replace.

In another thread, asking how to bring back veteran players, most of whom perhaps didn't hold out as long as I and others have over the years post-AoS, the discussion inevitably seemed to focus on "items" unsurprisingly, such as veteran rewards, blah... blah....

Well, to my mind, the one thing that is of far greater reward is the memories of the classic era. Give veterans an option to recapture just some of those memories via a classic shard. That to me, would be the biggest lure for former players.

Well, that's it from me. As now an "outsider" observer looking in through the window, I wish you all well, whatever your preferences.

Evlar.

Awesome post, man. I for one didn't last a single day past the release of AoS and I played from Dec 1997 on various servers in every era of the game. The only time I took a short hiatus was with the release of "Trammel" but I came back with a lot of others a few months before Pub16 went live.

I hope the Dev's who read this thread, don't get turned off by some of those who post on it and understand that however for or against the cause they are, they don't represent the majority of the people who desire to play a server such as this.

For us Old-School UOers and MMOers who have ventured into the majority of the online games that have released since UO, Old-School Ultima is something that is always a topic of conversation. Of course we hope to see an old school server and most gamers like myself, would stop playing whatever we are currently playing to play. We know all about the "flaws" UO had, we know how pissy people were about them back then but they don't even come close to the flaws with the current games that are released.

You can't make everyone happy, but having a Classic server would be a huge deal for a lot of us and if you want to see how many people will actually play, well- that won't happen unless EA/Mythic says there is actually going to be a classic server. To be honest, I hope they take their time and do it right, whatever their "right" is but for the most part, more then 70% of the possible servers population are all too familar with vaporware. Who knows though, maybe they will pull a Darkfall on us and release it a decade later ;p

It really is too bad that people take things the wrong way and blow them out of proportion. Maybe we could of had a constructive discussion with the lead dev.

 

[Llewen]

...a post...

Well-crafted

Well, I think that just about says it all really.

The only comment in this thread from the one who dangled the carrot - and it's to comment on the pitfalls.

I now honestly believe we have about as much chance of seeing classic shards become a reality as I have (being a British expatriate in Spain) of running for President of the USA.

I'm not going to waste my time or money supporting something that's got worse, instead of better. Neither am I going to hang around and wait for something that's not likely to happen.

There will be a couple of idocs in Europa for anyone interested in "items" soon, I'm closing my accounts permanently.

Adios.

Holy old histrionic reaction Batman! I'm a writer. I'm good with words. It's nice to be recognized for that once in a while. But don't mistake "Well-crafted", for "I agree with you".

 

[Llewen]

YOU ALREADY HAVE WHAT YOU WANT!! WHY STOP OTHERS FROM GETTING WHAT THEY WANT WHEN THEIR SUBSCRIPTION DOLLARS WILL GO TO FUND THE GAME YOU PLAY??

The issue here isn't that I have what I want and I don't want you to have what you want. My only concern in this topic is the long term survival and prosperity of Ultima Online. What you don't seem to "get" is that developer bandwidth is limited.

I don't think you have the faintest notion of exactly how much effort will be required to implement a classic shard. Even if we could come to some sort of consensus on what the term "classic shard" means, it isn't just a matter of finding the code from ten years ago, fixing a few bugs, compiling it, installing it on some spare server box somewhere, and firing up the classic shard.

Not only is there are really good chance that they simply don't have a copy of the code from ten years ago, it wouldn't matter even if they did. So many bugs have been fixed since then, bugs that were a problem ten years ago, and so many changes have been made to the client since then that there is absolutely no practical way that I can imagine that they would be able to do that.

That means they would have to start with the code they have available today, and basically create an entirely new server engine, and then modify the clients so that they will run with both the new "classic" server engine, as well as the regular server engine. Either that or they would have to create an entirely new classic server client to run on the classic shard(s).

I'm not saying it can't be done, I'm just saying the effort involved will be far from trivial, and they will have to be damn well sure that it will actually accomplish it's objective, that of bringing back old clients, and helping keep the ones they have. A few dozen very active and insistent posters on Stratics won't form the basis of a viable business plan, the kind of business plan they will need to present to their managing directors before something like this will get the green light.

And at the same time they have to continue to maintain, support, and develop the core Ultima Online product, which is, like it or not, the product available on the regular shards. Even if a classic shard were to be wildly successful, it would still not replace that core game, and I very much doubt would ever draw, and keep, the number of clients that the core Ultima Online game does.

A game which is, in my opinion, light years ahead of what the game was ten years ago, in just about every way imaginable. That doesn't mean I support every decision that was made between now and then, but Ultima Online, the Ultima Online available on the regular shards, is still the game that I, and thousands like me, keep coming back to, no matter where else they may wander.

 

[SoulStealer A.O]

Yeah, it wont be easy. I'm sure the coding is around. I mean, there have been two hit T2A servers in the last 7 years. I'm sure they got started somewhere. ( I don't know jack about coding so I'm just speculating.)

 

[Storm]

Well no matter what is said no matter what side you fall on the one thing I know for sure is the people that play this game are passionate about it and no matter what happens THAT is a good thing!

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

I don't think you have the faintest notion of exactly how much effort will be required to implement a classic shard. Even if we could come to some sort of consensus on what the term "classic shard" means, it isn't just a matter of finding the code from ten years ago, fixing a few bugs, compiling it, installing it on some spare server box somewhere, and firing up the classic shard.

Are you kidding, or have you just never bothered to read anything I have posted before?

I have a masters degree in computer science. I am a VP in charge of all IT and Development at the company I work for.

If there is ANYONE that understands what this process would entail, it is me.

I find your condescending attitude to be repulsive. YES! It is true! A WOMAN can be a software engineer! And...GASP!...she can even manage their department!!!

I have NEVER claimed that starting a Classic Shard would be possible through using old code alone, I have NEVER even suggested that it should even be approached in such a way, and I have NEVER suggested that the Devs could use Free Shard code. In fact, I have ... on many occasions ... corrected anyone that claims that they could use Free Shard code.

Again...stop trying to set up a false dichotomy. And stop trying to belittle everyone you disagree with.

A game which is, in my opinion, light years ahead of what the game was ten years ago, in just about every way imaginable.

And THERE is the real answer to the question of why you do not support a Classic Shard.

It has NOTHING to do with the effort that it would require, and NOTHING to do with "development bandwidth" (not even a real term).

It has EVERYTHING to do with the fact that you are a fan of the current system and feel threatened by those of us that are not.

but Ultima Online, the Ultima Online available on the regular shards, is still the game that I, and thousands like me, keep coming back to, no matter where else they may wander.

So do it. No one is asking you to stop. All we are asking for is an alternative to it that you DO NOT HAVE TO USE.

 

[Unsatisfied]

I really dont like the fact that people have jumped down Cals throat for writing this response, I am however pretty gutted that his only response after 9 pages on this topic is to a single post that points out that nothing is in fact perfect. We know this but like others have said its far closer to perfect in our eyes than what is here today.

With that said I hope the agressive nature of how people have responded to this doesnt discourage him from any further thinking into the classic shard idea... While I have less confidence that they really wanna get a classic shard going I still have hope that it will.

Thanks to everyone who is supporting the idea, and thanks for Cal for at least attempting to read through this thread, I just hope hes read a little more than what everyone seems to think.

 

[Unsatisfied]

There are plenty of free shards out there that cater to my playstyle...and did I mention they are FREE?? In fact...I happen to be quite handy when it comes to .net and C#...who knows where that might take me.

Lol if I knew anything about coding/writing scripts id totally be down to do this kinda stuff, sucks that I have no freaking idea. But I'd be one hell of an ideas man

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

I really dont like the fact that people have jumped down Cals throat for writing this response

I hope that I didn't come off like that...but I think that Cal has to understand that there are those of us that are extremely passionate about this subject. If he read the posts here, and wasn't just cherry picking (which he could have been) then I think his response was somewhat insulting. It more or less dismisses the concerns and desires that so many of us share...in short, it was a snub.

I really hope I am wrong, and I fully understand the gravity of this subject...but more importantly, I hope the devs do as well.

Cal was the only dev that has ever publicly mentioned the possibility of a Classic Shard...so I hope that he can take some criticism for his post. Feelings and memories run really deep on this subject of some of us, and I think an open and honest approach would be preferable to what we are getting so far.

Thanks to everyone who is supporting the idea, and thanks for Cal for at least attempting to read through this thread, I just hope hes read a little more than what everyone seems to think.

This may not be popular (like anything I have to say ever is)...but we (the players) need to keep in mind that for the developers...this is a job. They are not fans, they are not players (at least probably not before they were devs), and it is not their passion. They do what they do because they are paid to do so, whereas...you, me, and every other active UO player actually PAY to do what we do. So when it comes to issues like this one, their perspective is probably going to be one of 'what will yield us the least work'. This is completely understandable for me. I know that whiny customers that want this and that can be great big pains in the arse!

So in the end, don't expect much empathy from the devs. I don't say that to offend them, or to slam them...but because I can empathize with them. I hate it when my company has a system in place that works, and someone finds something that they don't like...for no apparent reason...but they want it changed nonetheless, and it takes many labor hours to do it. What's funny, is in the end, they generally aren't any happier...because the truth is, they didn't really know what they wanted to begin with! rolleyes:

However...I don't think the Classic UO community falls into that category. We know what we want...because we had it once...and it was taken from us.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

Lol if I knew anything about coding/writing scripts id totally be down to do this kinda stuff, sucks that I have no freaking idea. But I'd be one hell of an ideas man

PM me.