Adding Power Scrolls to Tram

[Merus]

I don't give a rats to pay for something I ought to be able to get for FREE by doing the content... but some wise cracker at BS thinks it's cute to make me go try to compete with a bunch of cheatting, speed hackers... who use all sorts of Illegal 3rd party programs just to play a 20 year old game because they think that makes them "winners".... and this is why they wait till you have the boss up and are 2/3rds dead to come out of hidding and slam you with 1 hit kills... because that's awesome PvP...

CAn't FARM DOOM they RUINED IT!... Why should I give the anti-social (*$(&$(*&$ ANY of my gold?????

I'm sorry, but the rules for acquiring powerscrolls are the same for everyone. You either take the risk to get them for free or you buy them. Quit whining because you don't like taking the risk. There is plenty of other content you can do with no risk, then trade for what you want... it is how most of the world works... or are you growing all your own food, building your own house, drilling for your own oil, etc. etc. There is nothing wrong with finding tram content to do and trading for items from content you don't like doing. I HATE the new Doom, so you know what, I don't do it, I buy what I want from Doom with the money I make from doing the content I do like doing. How is that any different?

 

[leet]

Say what? PvPers aren't bound to Fel. You can go to tram and farm anything there without issue or drawbacks to your play style...

Thats your argument? That i should instead play this game for the reason YOU want me to and go pvm in tram ? My play style isn't doing roof or killing peerless, its killing people.

 

[TheDrAJ]

Thats your argument? That i should instead play this game for the reason YOU want me to and go pvm in tram ? My play style isn't doing roof or killing peerless, its killing people.

and of course there lies the problem - most of us are not murderers.

 

[Bucs Den Inc.]

Correction. You both murder different things.


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[Fridgster]

Correction. You both murder different things.


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They always attack me first. I'm just defending myself.

 

[Bucs Den Inc.]

Pvp just happens to take skill. Pvm is basically "all kill" "Invis"


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[leet]

and of course there lies the problem - most of us are not murderers.

Wow a murderer for playing the game in the manner that pretty much any MMO needs to survive? Are you trolling or..?

 

[Fridgster]

Pvp just happens to take skill. Pvm is basically "all kill" "Invis"


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I don't even have Magery on my tamer. So that comment is inaccurate.

 

[Slayvite]

Did somebody just put 'skill', 'pvp', and 'UO' in the same sentence?

 

[TheDrAJ]

Pvp just happens to take skill. Pvm is basically "all kill" "Invis"


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This is exactly attitude the problem that most non pvp hate. I call it the "Atlantic General Chat Mentality".

 

[CovenantX]

Say what? PvPers aren't bound to Fel. You can go to tram and farm anything there without issue or drawbacks to your play style...

Pvmers aren't bound to trammel either... what's your point?

 

[leet]

This is exactly attitude the problem that most non pvp hate. I call it the "Atlantic General Chat Mentality".

What were you saying again?

 

[Bucs Den Inc.]

Atlantic general chat is a nice and loving place where all questions are welcomed.


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[TheDrAJ]

You realize of course that pvp characters use game mechanics to the fullest.
But you know that because that is you doing the monster hunting.

 

[Aeneas]

How about a compromise?

+ Scrolls @ 105 and 110 can spawn in Tram

+ Scroll powers (both skill and stat) decay with active gaming time - for both pet and player - with a slower decaying rate in Fel. A player logs in with his/her awesome 120xEverything pet and scrolled out char every day for a few hrs, he/she will see that those leet 120 caps become 119, 118 etc after an X mount of hours. He/She will need to collect new scrolls to be at cap again.

That will create an ongoing needs for power and stat scrolls and skill training/refreshing activities.

Inactive chars are not affected. Skill bank chars are saved. In active accounts are fine.

 

[MoxZinnia]

Add power scrolls to tram. Those who pvp will still do fel champs hoping that raiders will show for a fight, right? ...uh, right? If this is a system where no one wants to be the raidee. then it deserves to die. I say put power scrolls also in tram, make them shard bound (only practical if they also drop in tram), and provide pvpers interesting content to do against other pvpers. Put the town rewards in fel and have town battles over them. Add power scrolls to VvV rewards. Poll pvpers input on what would motivate them to fight other pvpers.

 

[TB Cookie [W]]

Up until April 17 when I first started posting on here, to try and get attention towards the state of Fel pvp for pure mages etc, I would have said, Trammel needs to be deleted, EC needs to be deleted, everything needs to revolve around Fel.

I've only ever played in Fel, I like the double resources there, I like the additional luck, and 90% of my time was spent finding fights, or spawning, or creating events to find fights.

I acted like a dickhead to the 2 dickhead guilds on our server, but I was pretty nice to everyone else, and even in Fel, would treat random blues in a good way, I didn't believe in ganking them for no reason.
However, Fel PvP has become so stupid, the players have become so stupid, none of them can even see they are the problem anymore - or that the playstyle is a really bad playstyle.

Up until now, I would have said, no way in hell should powerscrolls go to Tram.

Now I believe they should, because the Fel playerbase is bringing this on themselves.
They don't want PvP, they want to roll over people who cannot fight back.
It shows in every post, in the way they act in Fel, and in every nerf request, I'm over it now.
You are down to the hardcore last few now, who are basically braindead.

I do however also believe, VvV needs massive improvements, Fel PvPers do need a reason to fight.
I used to love factions, and there seemed plenty of reasons for me in those days - before they brought in the stupid faction rewards.
Antique legendaries don't do it.

 

[PaithanTheElf]

Just because something is unique doesn't make it right. Power scrolls are vital to pvm. Therfore yes you are being forced to pvp.
As far as taming goes everything being requested by pvpers is a lot more than tweaking.

You could easily pvm without powerscrolls. It is a want- not a need.

 

[Fridgster]

You could easily pvm without powerscrolls. It is a want- not a need.

Really? Give me the build so I can pick it apart please.

 

[Uvtha]

I don't give a rats to pay for something I ought to be able to get for FREE by doing the content...

You can. You choose not to.

 

[Uvtha]

Really? Give me the build so I can pick it apart please.

Depends on what you want to pvm really. If it's below boss level you really don't need much.

 

[Giles]

I also wish the developers would look into having power scrolls drop in Tram. It has been this way (only in fel) since they first introduced power scrolls. Dropping 105 scrolls in tram is a joke; if you have ever binded them you realize how many it takes to actually produce a 120 scroll.

It would be great addition to the 20 year celebration!

 

[Fridgster]

Depends on what you want to pvm really. If it's below boss level you really don't need much.

Why would anyone prep for below boss level? Give me a build that beats Medusa with no power scrolls. Mind you Medusa is the easiest boss.

 

[Uvtha]

Actually quite a bit. As a mater of fact one could argue that Richard Garriott s social experiment of good overcoming evil is no longer valid due to the current population (or lack thereof). Without enough people to fight off "evil" the concept is no longer valid. One could also argue that because of this perhaps it is time for a reexamination of fel and more importantly forced pvp.

It... was never valid.

 

[Uvtha]

Why would anyone prep for below boss level? Give me a build that beats Medusa with no power scrolls. Mind you Medusa is the easiest boss.

Well you have to prep for anything you want to do. Of course I'm pretty sure you could take down coon for example with no skills over 100. Might take a while, but...

 

[Uvtha]

How is it weak when the whole concept behind the creation and design of the game is based on it?

Well, because a) it never really worked, it was a clusterflock from day one, and b) the game abandoned those principles long before the advent of powerscrolls.

In that context nothing has changed since the inception of PS, and they game clearly has has zero philosophical, or "social experiment" type of focus since like 2000.

 

[Uvtha]

If 98% of the player base is trammel based people, why cant you guys get together and defend off the 2% pvpers. I keep hearing this percentage across so many of these fel/tram based arguments. I find this thread hilarious and sad that people cant get their own scrolls.

They can. They can also run spawns without getting raided assuming they don't play atlantic. Most simply don't try because of fear of being pked.

 

[Uvtha]

Power scrolls are vital to pvm. Therfore yes you are being forced to pvp.

You don't have to pvp to get powerscrolls. I've gotten hundreds and I've never pvped, unless you count running as pvp. The worst thing that is going to happen to you is that you have to walk to a shrine. Who cares?

 

[It Lives]

100% I agree scrolls should be available for both faucets.

 

[Uvtha]

How about a compromise?

+ Scrolls @ 105 and 110 can spawn in Tram

+ Scroll powers (both skill and stat) decay with active gaming time - for both pet and player - with a slower decaying rate in Fel. A player logs in with his/her awesome 120xEverything pet and scrolled out char every day for a few hrs, he/she will see that those leet 120 caps become 119, 118 etc after an X mount of hours. He/She will need to collect new scrolls to be at cap again.

That will create an ongoing needs for power and stat scrolls and skill training/refreshing activities.

Inactive chars are not affected. Skill bank chars are saved. In active accounts are fine.

That would essentially be a scroll tax, so I'll pass. I'm fine with up to 110 dropping in tram honestly. It wouldn't devalue 120's.

 

[Uvtha]

Whatever happened to that incessant posting of the easy button pic any time anyone made a request? It's actually apropos for once.

 

[Fridgster]

Well you have to prep for anything you want to do. Of course I'm pretty sure you could take down coon for example with no skills over 100. Might take a while, but...

Maybe coon himself but I don't think your going to kill the spawn fast enough.

 

[TheDrAJ]

A Cub Fan! hehehehe so am I

 

[Fridgster]

You don't have to pvp to get powerscrolls. I've gotten hundreds and I've never pvped, unless you count running as pvp. The worst thing that is going to happen to you is that you have to walk to a shrine. Who cares?

Ha! That's what the I'm stuck button is for

 

[Uvtha]

Maybe coon himself but I don't think your going to kill the spawn fast enough.

Really? Why not? Nothing in that spawn aside from SS (which are 99/100 under 100) has anywhere near to 100 wrestling which is all that would matter. I'm like... 99% sure that I could make a test character with no skill over 100 and run the rat spawn within an hour. I'm not GONNA... but I don't see why it would be all that difficult. With 45HCI and a repond whirlwind + area damage spawning weapon, and a weapn to kill coon with that has HLD. Shouldn't be much of an issue.

The 120 skills would just make it a bit faster (probs like 20% faster as the skill difference would suggest), mainly noticeable at the boss.

 

[Uvtha]

Ha! That's what the I'm stuck button is for

Seriously though, people of siege can attest... I cannot pvp my way out of a paper bag, I despise being pked, and I will never buddy buddy with someone who killed me and I advocate against it, but I still have done a billion spawns solo and with others. It's really not as bad as people are making it out to be, especially if you do one that's a pain to get to and/or away from peak hours. I've gotten killed doing them, but it doesn't stop me. I even lose all my stuff, unlike you filthy trammies.

 

[Cetric]

As usual, this is going to drum up a whole mess of people who don't understand fel and pvp mechanics/world setting who say "yes give them to tram please thanks" without understanding what it would do to Fel. Champ spawns are a Fel only Encounter. It is the only Fel only Encounter. It is what some of the best pvp in this game is built around, because it was forced to be built around it when power scrolls were introduced. There are no guard zones, no boundaries. They are highly desiredand somewhat necessary item in this game and since all PVM is easy, the PvP you might encounter makes these much more difficult to obtain than any 50k hit point monster could ever grant.

Removing that will just cripple that end of the game that most of the posters here do not take part in.

I'd be willing to compromise though. Add power scrolls to Tram or whatever other facet so you guys can farm them to your hearts content on whatever shard you do it on.

Rip out the current VvV system, build it into a Town Bonus/Governor Dungeons only system that has an "everyone has to have it indefinitely until the game dies" reward like the power scroll, and you'd have the pvpers attention. But thats the key, it has to be a giant carrot on a stick.... and what would happen? Everyone would demand that be added to Tram too. So just leave it alone and do what used to be done, buddy up with a pvp guild for protection, never know, you might enjoy it. Hell, id say Fel needs even more of this stuff, but it'd get slammed so hard by the pvmers saying "we want the content too whhhaaa" even though it is available to them, that i won't bother.

 

[Great DC]

Really? Give me the build so I can pick it apart please.

Sampires would be just as powerful at gm skills as it would be at 120 swords. It would deal slightly less damage and maybe wiff once or twice more but would still effectively kill almost every boss in the game. Cmon now, still is a idiotic argument anyway.

 

[Cetric]

Sampires would be just as powerful at gm skills as it would be at 120 swords. It would deal slightly less damage and maybe wiff once or twice more but would still effectively kill almost every boss in the game. Cmon now, still is a idiotic argument anyway.

One could argue you could make a better build with all/mostly gm skills

Just saying

Some of this would be irrelevant if pets had skill caps

 

[Fridgster]

Sampires would be just as powerful at gm skills as it would be at 120 swords. It would deal slightly less damage and maybe wiff once or twice more but would still effectively kill almost every boss in the game. Cmon now, still is a idiotic argument anyway.

Actually it wouldnt. You wouldn't leech enough.

 

[CovenantX]

Actually it wouldnt. You wouldn't leech enough.

Dunno man, my wammie only has 120 in his weapon skill, there's 0 pvm content that can't be completed solo with it, leeching has never been a problem for that template, except perhaps being overpowered af.

 

[TB Cookie [W]]

As usual, this is going to drum up a whole mess of people who don't understand fel and pvp mechanics/world setting who say "yes give them to tram please thanks" without understanding what it would do to Fel. Champ spawns are a Fel only Encounter. It is the only Fel only Encounter. It is what some of the best pvp in this game is built around, because it was forced to be built around it when power scrolls were introduced. There are no guard zones, no boundaries. They are highly desiredand somewhat necessary item in this game and since all PVM is easy, the PvP you might encounter makes these much more difficult to obtain than any 50k hit point monster could ever grant.

Removing that will just cripple that end of the game that most of the posters here do not take part in.

I'd be willing to compromise though. Add power scrolls to Tram or whatever other facet so you guys can farm them to your hearts content on whatever shard you do it on.

Rip out the current VvV system, build it into a Town Bonus/Governor Dungeons only system that has an "everyone has to have it indefinitely until the game dies" reward like the power scroll, and you'd have the pvpers attention. But thats the key, it has to be a giant carrot on a stick.... and what would happen? Everyone would demand that be added to Tram too. So just leave it alone and do what used to be done, buddy up with a pvp guild for protection, never know, you might enjoy it. Hell, id say Fel needs even more of this stuff, but it'd get slammed so hard by the pvmers saying "we want the content too whhhaaa" even though it is available to them, that i won't bother.

• Thing is, PvPers act like imbeciles these days, so any self respecting PvMer wants nothing to do with them anymore. Any self respecting person tbh.
• So the whole buddy thing/team up/collaborate is past the point of no return.
• I'd give powerscrolls and champ spawns to trammel, because it allows them to play their game, have fun, independently of PvPers.
• PvPers need to get out of this mentality of having someone for a free and easy gank, and develop some balls.
• They don't need to "force" people to Fel for enforced PvP - this actually shows desperation on the part of PvPers that they have to behave like this.
• It's like the dumped guy in a relationship who acts like a dickhead afterwards.
• What I would suggest, is any genuine PvP event {and only VvV really fits this description right now} would be given it's own comparable set of rewards to what PvMers can achieve.
• I would not suggest Unique, or 100% must have to have to play the game, but I would suggest comparable.
• Then you could choose as a player, how you want to obtain your gear/items/etc.
• Do you want to PvP/PvM to achieve your Legendaries? Do you want to PvP/PvM to achieve your Scrolls. etc. etc.
• I'd open up both PvM, and PvP, as a way to get comparable top end items. I'd also bring Crafting in by the way.
• This way, no-one is forced into anything, people can play as per their favourite playstyle, and be a lot more relaxed about it.
• You wouldn't have this PvP v PvM antagonistic thing that has gone on since the beginning of time due to essential resources being in Fel.
• People who genuinely enjoyed their PvP, could PvP.
• The time of Risk v Reward, is well and truly over in UO. PvPers risk nothing, item insurance was certainly the beginning of the end for that.

In the above scenario, I would choose the PvP route, as long as I could compete, and there was any sense of balance to the PvP. If I couldn't, there would be other options available to gear up, then come in and PvP.

 

[Cetric]

• Thing is, PvPers act like imbeciles these days, so any self respecting PvMer wants nothing to do with them anymore. Any self respecting person tbh.

I stopped reading right there. Thanks for the label

 

[TB Cookie [W]]

I stopped reading right there. Thanks for the label

You can't see it.
Your posts haven't been that great, and they are so biased.

The label fits, but don't stress, I just say things how they are.

 

[Great DC]

You do realize if they did go to trammel, you would have mass greifing from people who come in when the boss is up and tank it before you get damage in. Plus the dead shards would have mass scripting/multiclienting farming them without consequence until a 120 magery only costs like 1m. It would be like opening a Walmart and screwing the small business owners out of a job.

 

[Cetric]

You can't see it.
Your posts haven't been that great, and they are so biased.

The label fits, but don't stress, I just say things how they are.

I've tried pretty damn hard to not be biased honestly, but obviously things will bleed into what I know. I don't even mind when PvMers post things that are extremely biased, as long as they make an attempt at understanding the other sides thought process. Its those that have another agenda that turns the attitude.

Take your example, right off the bat you just label all PvPers imbecils... then expect any PvPer to follow what your thoughts are on anything? Every group has bad Eggs. PvPers have the idiots that **** talk in gen chat all day, non-pvmers have people like that idocguy that scams and works people over. I don't label them all base don the ways of a few, and neither should anyone else.

 

[Cetric]

You do realize if they did go to trammel, you would have mass greifing from people who come in when the boss is up and tank it before you get damage in. Plus the dead shards would have mass scripting/multiclienting farming them without consequence until a 120 magery only costs like 1m. It would be like opening a Walmart and screwing the small business owners out of a job.

Exactly

 

[TB Cookie [W]]

I've tried pretty damn hard to not be biased honestly, but obviously things will bleed into what I know. I don't even mind when PvMers post things that are extremely biased, as long as they make an attempt at understanding the other sides thought process. Its those that have another agenda that turns the attitude.

Take your example, right off the bat you just label all PvPers imbecils... then expect any PvPer to follow what your thoughts are on anything? Every group has bad Eggs. PvPers have the idiots that **** talk in gen chat all day, non-pvmers have people like that idocguy that scams and works people over. I don't label them all base don the ways of a few, and neither should anyone else.

If you had any sort of unbiased vision, you would see how the PvPers are presenting themselves in-game, and on forums?
You'd understand what I am saying, you probably can see it a bit, but are brushing it over as being part of life and ok.
I do expect even PvPers, to half see what I'm getting at, even if I am putting them down. It's just how it is now I'm afraid.

Another Edit - yes so much bleeds into PvP and PvM, maybe separating their reliance on each other properly, stops the antagonism, that was one of my points.

 

[TB Cookie [W]]

You do realize if they did go to trammel, you would have mass greifing from people who come in when the boss is up and tank it before you get damage in. Plus the dead shards would have mass scripting/multiclienting farming them without consequence until a 120 magery only costs like 1m. It would be like opening a Walmart and screwing the small business owners out of a job.

Does it really matter?
(Edit - By the way, I'm saying both facets should have them - equal chances for everything, chose how you want to play).

Are we in it for the gold, to promote the gold sellers, the gold hoarders, or are we here to gear characters, pvp, pvm, craft, have fun?

The economy is already bust, breaking it properly cannot hurt now, could make the game fun again.

 

[Cetric]

If you had any sort of unbiased vision, you would see how the PvPers are presenting themselves in-game, and on forums?
.

I thought I made that clear with the bad egg comment. Does that give you some sort of right to label everyone from a certain group as imbeciles? Is that not unlike labeling everyone who has a certain belief a certain way, or looks a certain way as having a particular mindset?