And one quick extra question - casting spells on myself, can they reflect? To whom?
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You should probably test the content on Test Center. On TC, if you successfully cure DP it significantly lowers the damage healed, especially with curses applied. For the purposes of PvP, the poisoning skill is much more important now if you intend to take down a mystic ... however, GCures are still instant, heh.
In choke situations I assume a 120 mage w/ 80 poison or an equiv will help take down mystic groups that rely only on cleansing winds, but the ultimate problem is not cleansing winds if you come with a noxxer, it's once again a problem dealing with pots, and of course, healing stones. There is a period of saturation for GCures though ... so I guess an infectious chainer can get the job done, in part ... but a dexxer can't apply the curses that easy.
If you don't have a noxxer, well, you're going to need to get crafty. There aren't many high level curses ... I mean strangle maybe if you're a necro? Hm. I'll have to test that myself. But poison skill def makes a huge difference. Max cleansing winds doesn't have a 100% rate to cure DP, I don't think.
I think you are pulling numbers out of the air for the HLA and HLD ranged procs. If you think about it no one really can maintain high stamina and I have looked at my stamina during fights and on average my weapons are about 2.5s swing speed or worse depending on the characters being fought rated by the average stamina level during combat. This is with 182 stamina on my suit.
What this means is if the HLA proc is 5 seconds this means only the next two swings would be able to hit a target under the affect. In my experience archers and throwing weapons do not hit targets on repeated swings and it is very common to miss on multiple swings in a row. Test it and you will see.
If HLD proc is 7 seconds then it really is no different than 5 seconds or two swing intervals because it wasn't made 7.5 seconds. So really HLD becomes 2 shots.
If you think about it many melee weapons even with 90 stamina and 20% SSI will swing at 1.25s, which translates to 8/1.25 = 6 swings or 10/1.25 = 8 swings. This means there is a significant affects a combatant can achieve on their target by switching out weapons.
If you take the switch weapon delay penalty a ranged combatant would only get one swing on the HLA and two swings from the next weapon on HLD. This means switching weapons is worthless.
I have no idea what problem your solving with the proc time, but it seems like somehow someone guessed on a solution to something and missed the bullseye.
When defining a duration interval you should consider the events occur in discrete time.
-Lorax
What this means is if the HLA proc is 5 seconds this means only the next two swings would be able to hit a target under the affect. In my experience archers and throwing weapons do not hit targets on repeated swings and it is very common to miss on multiple swings in a row. Test it and you will see.
If HLD proc is 7 seconds then it really is no different than 5 seconds or two swing intervals because it wasn't made 7.5 seconds. So really HLD becomes 2 shots.
If you think about it many melee weapons even with 90 stamina and 20% SSI will swing at 1.25s, which translates to 8/1.25 = 6 swings or 10/1.25 = 8 swings. This means there is a significant affects a combatant can achieve on their target by switching out weapons.
If you take the switch weapon delay penalty a ranged combatant would only get one swing on the HLA and two swings from the next weapon on HLD. This means switching weapons is worthless.
I have no idea what problem your solving with the proc time, but it seems like somehow someone guessed on a solution to something and missed the bullseye.
When defining a duration interval you should consider the events occur in discrete time.
-Lorax
These changes sound great so far =D.
Lumberjacking - change sounds good, But is that Doubled From 60% to 120%? or from 30% - 60% ?
Now there needs to be changes made to - 2 handed melee weapons & Plate Armor so that they would become useful again.
Another thing i was wondering is the mention of Items with Charges, are you referring to the old pre-aos items with spell reflection Or will they be coming back as loot on mobs and/or T-maps ?
Lumberjacking - change sounds good, But is that Doubled From 60% to 120%? or from 30% - 60% ?
Now there needs to be changes made to - 2 handed melee weapons & Plate Armor so that they would become useful again.
Another thing i was wondering is the mention of Items with Charges, are you referring to the old pre-aos items with spell reflection Or will they be coming back as loot on mobs and/or T-maps ?
After some testing I can conclude that the LJ bonus is still 30% and you get 5% chance to get the 60% bonus. This bonus is still arguably too small to be useful it's average of 2 extra dmg (with an ornate axe) against 70 resist.
And please DEVs add a proc animation or at least a system msg to let us know that we have proc'ed the bonus.
Also the detect hidden blocking rehide restealth is NOT FUNCTIONING. It goes like this 100 Detect Hidden vs 100 Hiding/120 Stealth you have around 20% chance to target reveal the stealther. This chance is very low considering there's a 6 second reuse timer during targeted reveal.
After you have successfully revealed the target, they get a 1 second delay (currently display a megacliloc error on the stealther screen when they try to hide again) and they can immediately hide AND stealth again no problem. We tried to do reveal while in stealth mode (1 second rehide delay), hidden but not stealthing (1second delay). Also we tried to do it with 2 stealthers at the same time 1 guilded one un-guilded. Same result. Let me rephrase this, detect DOES BLOCK rehide... for One (1) second.
Ok discuss.
L
Lord GOD(GOD)
Guest
If it takes into account both Hiding and Stealth, then it should be low, as they've invested more points than the Detect Hidden player.
They can rehide in 1s if no one flags on them, which is pretty unlikely given the speed of certain targeting, if they've just shown, hidden, been revealed, it only takes someone spamming attack last for them to be flagged the second they show. Smoke Bombs are a seperate issue, but again the skill points invested are much higher than the revealer.
Invis should not be subject to this, repeated spot Invis is only going to really be used in PvM.
How long does it block rehide for at 80 Stealth?
Speaking of revealing stealthers. How does a mage go about doing this in guard zone? You cannot cast any area affect spell that would hit a hidden player. If someone was hiding and a hailstorm went off on top of them, shouldn't they be hit with that? Also what exactly is the reveal spell supposed to do vs a hider? I invest 240 skill points (mage + eval) to cast that spell. It should go up vs their 220 skill points (hiding + stealth) and you should at the VERY least be able to reveal them 50% of the time. Right now you will never reveal them. On top of that, you have NO chance of revealing a stealther without a conflag pot. Even if you hit the stealther with a conflag, majority of the time, they can walk out of it (staying hidden) then you need to wait 45 seconds to even attempt to throw another pot. And what if you get a revnent on a stealther? Even though it does not do much, it lets you know where they are. Any competent stealther runs it to guards, gets it whacked, and then continues on with his day. Why do devs cater to crappy stealthers?
L
Lord GOD(GOD)
Guest
You can cast Thunderstorm in guard zones.
Hail Storm doesn't hit or reveal Stealthers regardless of location.
Player reveal doesn't work, but if it did it wouldn't be 240 skill points vs 220 as it doesn't take 120 Magery to cast, and probably doesn't require Eval at all.
There are plenty of things that reveal besides Conflag pots: Meteor Swarm, Chain Lightning, EQ (sometimes - depending if they are in auto defend range), Supernova pots, Explosion pots, Poison Strike, fields and Thunderstorm. Plus they can be tracked with JOAT alone.
The Revenant is just a summon and any character type has numerous ways of removing them, so really nothing to do with Stealthers specifically.
Hailstorm doesn't hit hidden players.
If a player is in guard zone, there are several things you can do.
Poison Strike yourself within 1 tile of where they are standing.
Throw an explode pot.
Supernova pot.
Thunderstorm works very well.
Equip a hit area weapon and attack something green or grey to get the hit area affect to go off.
Outside of guards the list goes on...
If a player is in guard zone, there are several things you can do.
Poison Strike yourself within 1 tile of where they are standing.
Throw an explode pot.
Supernova pot.
Thunderstorm works very well.
Equip a hit area weapon and attack something green or grey to get the hit area affect to go off.
Outside of guards the list goes on...
I am well aware that hailstorm does not hit hidden players. I was asking where the logic in that was.
Now lets assume that this stealther has an IQ above 10 and keeps on the move. None of your above tactics will work, except a poison strike (which usually does not even reveal them) and you must be necro. The point is you should be able to cast meteor/eq, etc in guards. Meteor/chain would be the best way to reveal a stealther as you can target where you think they will walk (especially if you have them tracked).
I believe the reason it was taken out was back when people would go to a bank and cast it and 2 guards would summon for every person hit. So you go to brit and cast it and the screen would spam with guards and lag people out of game.
And why are revnants guard whacked again?
Edit: and why doesnt reveal work what so ever vs a stealther?
Actually all of my tactics work. I'm sorry that you're not good enough to make them work.
Thunderstorm has a huge range with a level six circle, and can be casted with JoAT. It reveals almost every time. That is the best reveal method.
Meteor/Chain are not the best ways to reveal a stealther. The cast time is too slow.
I'll answer your stupid question with another stupid question: Why doesn't my character with 100 hiding and 120 stealth have a separate spellbook with offensive spells and healing capabilities.
Your tactics would work vs a terrible pvp stealther (or possibly vs a hider without stealth lol), that is about it.
A. you fail thunderstorm plenty with JOAT. B. a stealther on the move will not be hit with it. C. It does not reveal almost every time.
If you have someone tracked, your best bet is a spell you can cast and target the area they are in.
I am well aware that you play a stealther that precastings spell plague and still manage to NOT kill people at 1/3 life, so I understand why you are defending hiding.
Your hypothetical "lets give hiders a spell book" is just dumb. Mages do HAVE a spell (I am not just making this reveal spell up)- that is supposed to reveal and they invest 240 skill points for that spell to work, but it has not worked in god knows how long.
Feel free to show me incorrect information.
You are just trying to defend it because that is what you play (and very poorly I might add).
GG.
You are just trying to defend it because that is what you play (and very poorly I might add).
GG.
Already posted whats incorrect. You have no idea how to reveal stealthers.
I play just about every type of template, so way to call me out on playing a stealther.
You're just some chump hiding behind an anonymous screen name. I'll gladly spank you 1 v 1 full template in a confined area any time you want. You can even pick which PvP char I use..
I play just about every type of template, so way to call me out on playing a stealther.
You're just some chump hiding behind an anonymous screen name. I'll gladly spank you 1 v 1 full template in a confined area any time you want. You can even pick which PvP char I use..
Agreed, lack of consistency really annoys me
If I was on a stealther, you would not be able to reveal me with any of those methods.
How do you figure that "Paithan the Elf" is an anonymous screen name btw? I just looked up a thread where you said you wanted to bring a guild over to pac to fight chad and paith. Do you know what paith is short for...?
And sure I will gladly fight you. If you have a guy on atlantic, you can use any template except tamer.
What shard do you want me to decimate you on? This will be fun. If you want I can kill you on the east and west coast.
I was wondering if a Software Engineer or a Dev or something could tell me if yall are even CONSIDERING making anymore adjustments to the cleansing wind aside from what was mentioned before:
"Mysticism
Cleansing Winds
Now Factors in Curses
Curse removal no longer based on chance.
Each Curse Reduces Healing by 3 points + 1% per curse level
Eg. Curse = Level 4
Max Heal reduced by 12. Then by further 4%
Curse Power = the Total levels of all curses in effect
Poison reduces healing factor by 15% per level of poison.
"
I was wondering if you guys might do any additional changes to it? More specifically towards the healing aspect or what cleansing wind does as a whole? A lot of people have been asking that something be done with it and I was just wondering if the thought of doing anything else is floating around anywhere for you guys that are making these changes.
"Mysticism
Cleansing Winds
Now Factors in Curses
Curse removal no longer based on chance.
Each Curse Reduces Healing by 3 points + 1% per curse level
Eg. Curse = Level 4
Max Heal reduced by 12. Then by further 4%
Curse Power = the Total levels of all curses in effect
Poison reduces healing factor by 15% per level of poison.
"
I was wondering if you guys might do any additional changes to it? More specifically towards the healing aspect or what cleansing wind does as a whole? A lot of people have been asking that something be done with it and I was just wondering if the thought of doing anything else is floating around anywhere for you guys that are making these changes.
I dont know what the dev is gonna do in this aspect.
I test everything just so you know.
Currently on TC1 cleansing wind still heals a good amount while removing curses.
Assuming 120/120, strangle (the strongest curse I know) drops your 60-65 heal to around 53 to 58.
Poison KILLS cleansing wind effectiveness. Lethal poison makes you heal for like 12.
Mortal Strike blocks all healing done but gets removed when cleansing wind is succesfully cast.
Any clearification on LJ bonus? According to my test it seems to be 30% DI from GM jumberjack, not 60. And the bonus damage is insignificant, I cannot tell if it proc'ed or not. The double DI bonus gives you around 2 more dmg against 70 resist, but with the dmg range it's really unnoticible. Maybe add an animation?
My suggestion on LJ buff.
1. "Burst damage style" Raise GM LJ bonus so it's more than 30 DI (to 50 maybe) and 5% chance to double to 100 DI this is over the item cap of course. Keep in mind even at 100 DI with an ornate it's still only 5-6 extra dmg against 70. Fraction damage gets rounded UP.
2. "Bonus effect style" Keep the damage current, no bonus damage, 5% chance to cause an effect (eg bleed, sleep, frenzy* or curse for x amount of sec) OR a randomly proc one effect from the "list of LJ proc specials"
3. "Sustained dmg style" Keep the damage current, 30% chance to give 60DI. Proc chance is scaled by LJ same as DI up tp 30% at GM. This way it adds the tiny bit of damage at a good chance to raise overall dmg output.
*Frenzy: The axer gains a tick of swing speed overcap for 2 to 3 seconds. Max swing speed is increased to 1.00s per swing.
Just throwing some ideas around. Personally 1 and 3 wont make too much different. The bonus effect should be MUCH MUCH more interesting but should be balanced carefully.
I test everything just so you know.
Currently on TC1 cleansing wind still heals a good amount while removing curses.
Assuming 120/120, strangle (the strongest curse I know) drops your 60-65 heal to around 53 to 58.
Poison KILLS cleansing wind effectiveness. Lethal poison makes you heal for like 12.
Mortal Strike blocks all healing done but gets removed when cleansing wind is succesfully cast.
Any clearification on LJ bonus? According to my test it seems to be 30% DI from GM jumberjack, not 60. And the bonus damage is insignificant, I cannot tell if it proc'ed or not. The double DI bonus gives you around 2 more dmg against 70 resist, but with the dmg range it's really unnoticible. Maybe add an animation?
My suggestion on LJ buff.
1. "Burst damage style" Raise GM LJ bonus so it's more than 30 DI (to 50 maybe) and 5% chance to double to 100 DI this is over the item cap of course. Keep in mind even at 100 DI with an ornate it's still only 5-6 extra dmg against 70. Fraction damage gets rounded UP.
2. "Bonus effect style" Keep the damage current, no bonus damage, 5% chance to cause an effect (eg bleed, sleep, frenzy* or curse for x amount of sec) OR a randomly proc one effect from the "list of LJ proc specials"
3. "Sustained dmg style" Keep the damage current, 30% chance to give 60DI. Proc chance is scaled by LJ same as DI up tp 30% at GM. This way it adds the tiny bit of damage at a good chance to raise overall dmg output.
*Frenzy: The axer gains a tick of swing speed overcap for 2 to 3 seconds. Max swing speed is increased to 1.00s per swing.
Just throwing some ideas around. Personally 1 and 3 wont make too much different. The bonus effect should be MUCH MUCH more interesting but should be balanced carefully.
Sorry, I don't follow your argument. Are you saying that if you don't resist the sleep you should still not get slept? Lol? Regardless of what you believe, even if you don't resist the sleep you can always eat an apple. Good for you because you are no longer slept - good for the mage because now you can't apple the curse he has coming. But yes, we can all agree MA/NB was stupid and will not be missed. A good mystic mage shouldn't need it anyway.none of the other stuff matters to me, just have to run them out of heal stone interupt the cleansing winds.. rest of mystic spells you can deal with but the spell plague barrage and netherbolt magic arrow was stupid.Hate to disappoint some of you, but myst mages will still be very competitive assuming what is active on TC right now doesn't change. Spell Plague is still deadly and Cleansing Winds still wipes out everything. Oh, and there's still these things called Purge Magic, Sleep, Hailstorm, Healing Stone, and Spell Trigger aka Insta-boulder.
If anything the biggest and best change which will hurt bad myst mages is the Magic Arrow/Nether Bolt spam which all too often follows Spell Plague. As of right now on TC anyway, you can no longer cast one right after the other - Way to go dev team!!!
imho sleep needs looked at more, i dont think there has ever been a more unblanced spell. or atleast modified, if you dont resist it at 120 it still slows you for a few seconds.. long enough for a archer to get you ganked on foot etc. just think its too much. and it forces templates now. the way it is until the caster does a certain amount of damage it wont break, how is that fair to other templates?
New weight on pots is ok... but the real problem is the fact there is no cooldown on Cure pots. Apple cooldown isnt long enough either.
After all, you get a message saying (You can not use that potion while paralyzed) whenever you try to use an apple while stunned/casting spells, this should also affect cure pots & heals?
Spellplague should also be removed along with ALL Curses when useing an apple
This is why there are little to no 4/6 chiv players anymore.
changes that should be added now that their doing something for pvp IMO ?
Melee = AI cap should be increased to 40
Archers = should be capped at 25-30 (wont do so much since they get 2 hitspells)
Mystic's = Bombard should have a chance to stun based on the difference between (Mystics Focus/Imbuing vs targets Resisting Spells) 120 vs 120 should not be stunnable!
as a read above the LJ damage bonus isnt enough apparently it shouldnt be hard to tell when it goes off... meaning it should be a noticeable amount of extra damage done, i have a char with 120 tact/anat/swords 100 LJ +100% Di and i cannot make bandages slip without using (crushing blow with an Ornate Axe) to someone with 70 physical.
Seems the only (dexers) that are played anymore are either Nerve strike spammers Or Disarm/bleed - archers... if your a good mage its pretty hard to die to most of these even if they dont miss you almost at all.
Melee needs a buff !!
Archers need a slight nerfing more than just hld !!
Mystics are the real OP, but the changes that are in effect with that seems to be fine so far...
The heal might need to be slightly nerfed a bit more.
After all, you get a message saying (You can not use that potion while paralyzed) whenever you try to use an apple while stunned/casting spells, this should also affect cure pots & heals?
Spellplague should also be removed along with ALL Curses when useing an apple
This is why there are little to no 4/6 chiv players anymore.
changes that should be added now that their doing something for pvp IMO ?
Melee = AI cap should be increased to 40
Archers = should be capped at 25-30 (wont do so much since they get 2 hitspells)
Mystic's = Bombard should have a chance to stun based on the difference between (Mystics Focus/Imbuing vs targets Resisting Spells) 120 vs 120 should not be stunnable!
as a read above the LJ damage bonus isnt enough apparently it shouldnt be hard to tell when it goes off... meaning it should be a noticeable amount of extra damage done, i have a char with 120 tact/anat/swords 100 LJ +100% Di and i cannot make bandages slip without using (crushing blow with an Ornate Axe) to someone with 70 physical.
Seems the only (dexers) that are played anymore are either Nerve strike spammers Or Disarm/bleed - archers... if your a good mage its pretty hard to die to most of these even if they dont miss you almost at all.
Melee needs a buff !!
Archers need a slight nerfing more than just hld !!
Mystics are the real OP, but the changes that are in effect with that seems to be fine so far...
The heal might need to be slightly nerfed a bit more.
S
Shinobi
Guest
I just figured i'd put in my 2 cents.
I have 100 Hiding, 120 Stealth, 100 Detect Hidden, and 50 Tracking in my temp. So, as much as I hate to see thieves get another nerf, I can understand where they're coming from. It is beyond frustrating when you detect someone after their skill timer for hiding has ended allowing them to instantly rehide, then by the time you can detect them again, they have hiding ready to go again. It then turns into a pointless, infinite loop.
When it comes to the talk of the reveal spell needing to be more powerful, I have to disagree. As Paithan said, he invests 240 points between magery/eval to use this spell, versus my 220 between hide/stealth. It is true you invested more points than me, but that is between 64 spells. I've almost matched your amount of skill points, and for what, 2 spells? Technically, your reveal spell should be a 3.75% success rate, considering 240 points divided by 64 spells. My 2 spells better be far more powerful than your 1 out of 64.
Passive reveal is what needs fixing. I'm not saying take it out entirely, but it should be less powerful than the reveal spell, considering NO points were put into it (detect hidden passive reveal excluded). If you get passive reveal just for being an elf, it should just be a cool little bonus, not a full-blown skill in itself. 220 points shot down because you have pointy ears? Make elf passive reveals work on players up to 75 Hiding, because having it work that effectively on 100 Hiding/120 Stealth is just ridiculous. Maybe have 100 Detect Hidden passive reveal work that well, but not a free elf perk.
P.S. I still love you Paithan, and I will steal those inquis of yours one of these days, haha.
I have 100 Hiding, 120 Stealth, 100 Detect Hidden, and 50 Tracking in my temp. So, as much as I hate to see thieves get another nerf, I can understand where they're coming from. It is beyond frustrating when you detect someone after their skill timer for hiding has ended allowing them to instantly rehide, then by the time you can detect them again, they have hiding ready to go again. It then turns into a pointless, infinite loop.
When it comes to the talk of the reveal spell needing to be more powerful, I have to disagree. As Paithan said, he invests 240 points between magery/eval to use this spell, versus my 220 between hide/stealth. It is true you invested more points than me, but that is between 64 spells. I've almost matched your amount of skill points, and for what, 2 spells? Technically, your reveal spell should be a 3.75% success rate, considering 240 points divided by 64 spells. My 2 spells better be far more powerful than your 1 out of 64.
Passive reveal is what needs fixing. I'm not saying take it out entirely, but it should be less powerful than the reveal spell, considering NO points were put into it (detect hidden passive reveal excluded). If you get passive reveal just for being an elf, it should just be a cool little bonus, not a full-blown skill in itself. 220 points shot down because you have pointy ears? Make elf passive reveals work on players up to 75 Hiding, because having it work that effectively on 100 Hiding/120 Stealth is just ridiculous. Maybe have 100 Detect Hidden passive reveal work that well, but not a free elf perk.
P.S. I still love you Paithan, and I will steal those inquis of yours one of these days, haha.
At cost of 100 skill point for 30 more DAMAGE INCREASE is not worth it. You cant even chug. Its like spend 100 extra skill points to gain 2 extra dmg and lose the ability to chug. The ability to chug in current UO is HUGE.
If SP is the new awesome to mages, LJ could be the revamped hotness for melee. Again I've made some suggestions in improving LJ.
At 5% chance to proc the double bonus even if the bonus is DOUBLED from current (60/120 DI) I would probably still rather spending the 100 points somewhere else. You could spent those points on almost anything that makes sense, will be more useful than 2 additional dmg.
If SP is the new awesome to mages, LJ could be the revamped hotness for melee. Again I've made some suggestions in improving LJ.
At 5% chance to proc the double bonus even if the bonus is DOUBLED from current (60/120 DI) I would probably still rather spending the 100 points somewhere else. You could spent those points on almost anything that makes sense, will be more useful than 2 additional dmg.
Agree. Add a cure pot timer and this might be the greatest PvP patch in UO history.
I use LJ on my sampire for hard hitting AIs. I'm curious to see how this double damage bonus affects that, but I am way too lazy to rebuild my suit and template on test.
Maybe they could increase the percentage chance of that actually going off.
Attention Devs Please Read:
Whatever you guys did to magery on TC1 has completely ruined it. You can cast any spell on the run you want to, and mage dueling is impossible because you can't overcast anymore. This patch will ruin magery completely. You've been warned.
Whatever you guys did to magery on TC1 has completely ruined it. You can cast any spell on the run you want to, and mage dueling is impossible because you can't overcast anymore. This patch will ruin magery completely. You've been warned.
Bug confirmed
It was mentioned in the TC1 notes. The portion about consecutive casting leading to words of power and gestures coming out, but no spell coming out. It was a bug in the code, but fixing it also changes the dynamic of spell casting slightly for something that's been that way for so long, which is why this was put onto TC1 this early. We'll keep monitoring and we'd like to hear some constructive feedback on this.
Feedback: It is very bad! Very VERY bad!
It might seem like a slight change, but right now, PvP is pretty much balanced with maybe a slight advantage to mystics. With this change, no warrior type template (except maybe stealthers) stand a chance against a mystic-mage.
Please consider very carefully if you want this to go live.
Me and very likely several other people would be more than happy to form a focus group for some days/weeks and test this thouroughly.
It might seem like a slight change, but right now, PvP is pretty much balanced with maybe a slight advantage to mystics. With this change, no warrior type template (except maybe stealthers) stand a chance against a mystic-mage.
Please consider very carefully if you want this to go live.
Me and very likely several other people would be more than happy to form a focus group for some days/weeks and test this thouroughly.
B
Babble
Guest
Polymorph seems to wear off after 2 minutes again - intended?
Advantage to Mystics? lol i think you're forgetting about the 55dmg Ai's from archers! Both mystics and archers are OP.
Mysticism-The current changes to mystics is a start, but cleansing wind still is insanely lame. removing all curses/curing/healing....makes it almost impossible to kill a group of all mystics cross healing.
Lumberjack- I've done a good deal of testing with this. Each hit does about 2 extra dmg, but the chance of getting the double 60% wep dmg is so slim it's not worth 100 skill points at all. I swung an axe for a good 10-15mins, and didn't see it go off once. Either I'm the unluckiest person around, or it's broken. Has anyone else tested this?
This new (Anti-overcast) isnt a good idea... as great as it sounds, mages will be WAY OP, there will be No dexer that would EVER have a chance to beat a decent mage if this goes live, nerf Archers HLD? why not make them do 60dmg AIs? Mages can run and cast anything they want ANYTIME, thus they cannot be interrupted.
If their going to do something to casting, they should just bring back the rubberbanding with spells as it was say 4-5 years ago? i dont remember exactly might have been a little longer. but anyway this will bring No balance to pvp whatso ever, anyone that isnt good at playing a mage will be decent (if they try) anyone playing a dexer for pvp will quit pvping.
and to read that this is how it was intended? Cmon... you cant be serious!
If their going to do something to casting, they should just bring back the rubberbanding with spells as it was say 4-5 years ago? i dont remember exactly might have been a little longer. but anyway this will bring No balance to pvp whatso ever, anyone that isnt good at playing a mage will be decent (if they try) anyone playing a dexer for pvp will quit pvping.
and to read that this is how it was intended? Cmon... you cant be serious!
Wow... You know, making changes just for the hell of making changes is what got pvp into this mess in the first place. As you can tell by the reaction already, this needs to be thought a little harder on.
People shouldnt be paranoid without actually testing it.
Only thing this casting on the run bug/feature only really works on spells that does NOT have a cursor when cast. eg, wither, essence of wind
When you are using flame strike, the first FS will still freeze you in place and it will let you recast flame strike ONLY IF you have not yet to release a spell and since you were just HOLDING DOWN the key it simply overwriting the cursor over and over.
Facts:
1. You CAN follow people and "moving" wither/wither/wither/wither him down. (basically like holy light spam BUT the first wither will still freeze you in place).
2. You CANNOT follow someone and cast FS FS FS FS FS or SP SP SP SP SP NOT even WEAKEN WEAKEN WEAKEN without stopping. You get frozen in place after you cast ANY TARGETED spell (which requires a frozen casting time), and the macro will sieze to spam after you release a spell.
It will tilt the battlefield in favor of ANY Necro/SW not mages. Mages gets EQ EQ EQ EQ EQ but it does scaled dmg (like 40 dmg at full life and 2 dmg when you have 10hp left) and rarely kills ANYONE.
Only thing this casting on the run bug/feature only really works on spells that does NOT have a cursor when cast. eg, wither, essence of wind
When you are using flame strike, the first FS will still freeze you in place and it will let you recast flame strike ONLY IF you have not yet to release a spell and since you were just HOLDING DOWN the key it simply overwriting the cursor over and over.
Facts:
1. You CAN follow people and "moving" wither/wither/wither/wither him down. (basically like holy light spam BUT the first wither will still freeze you in place).
2. You CANNOT follow someone and cast FS FS FS FS FS or SP SP SP SP SP NOT even WEAKEN WEAKEN WEAKEN without stopping. You get frozen in place after you cast ANY TARGETED spell (which requires a frozen casting time), and the macro will sieze to spam after you release a spell.
It will tilt the battlefield in favor of ANY Necro/SW not mages. Mages gets EQ EQ EQ EQ EQ but it does scaled dmg (like 40 dmg at full life and 2 dmg when you have 10hp left) and rarely kills ANYONE.
So if I run in circles around your melee dexxer on my mage casting wither over and over until you are redlined, pull up a lightning, and drop you without 1 swing on your part, you'd be cool with that? And, yes, I've been on test to see how fast people get owned to a running wither stack. Can you imagine when 2+ mages get that in sync?
You need to read. I am talking about people talking about running FS FS FS FS FS FS FS FS and I have made the statement that wither would work. And saying mages will be god. In fact a nerve wither necro DEXER w/ resist and 150 int will wreck anything even faster than a necromage.
And I didnt say it's fine that this goes live. I said if this goes live, you will see some godly SPELLWEAVING/NECROMANCY varients. And I can assure you, its easier to gimp out a dexer than a mage IF these changes goes thru.
I think it only removes the weapon switch delay... I could be wrong.
I've heard that it makes specials free which I tried and proven to be fake.
I know for a fact it makes switching weapons faster.
And I've also heard people saying it makes chain special at normal mana cost (not double) but I have never tried this before.
Indeed. Did not know whom you were addressing. And yes, wither will become the new spell plague.
Running AOE seems pretty awful for PvP, and overpowered in PvM as well. I'll have to test it though.
Isn't that sort of apples and orange petals? One does solid damage, other gives bursts. I'd be more concerned about spellweaving AOE coupled by mystic sleep.
It's a metaphor. I wasn't comparing the damage type of the two spells, I was comparing the effect each of the two spells had/will have on pvp. This running wither will be just as abused as spell plague was. I'm sure essence of wind will also get its fair share of use against other mages.
The bottom line is, as I said before, don't make changes just for the hell of making changes when you haven't thought them through. I suppose thats partly the purpose of this forum, but, seriously, did some of this stuff really not come up during development? I feel like we should get consulting fees for doing part of the job.
*Edit* That last part was a joke, please don't ban me and burn down my house.
I think we need to take a step back and look at the whole picture. For years it has been nerf, nerf, nerf. People flock to the best available template for pvp, but over the years with each consecutive pvp publish some templates are now worthless and nothing but fond memories.
PvP should be a hazardous occupation of play. Each template should be on par of being lethal in a 1 on 1 encounter. I propose some of these old nerfs be undone or modified and some new things added. I want to toss some things out for consideration.
1. Casting on the run - Ok, so this is stated to be a bug and people are complaining about it. To me though this is a mages dream. Archers can zap you on the run 6-8 tiles away. A good melee dexer can do damage on the run without mana expense, or use special moves if their swing speed is maxed out at 1.25. Often is the complaint that has been echoed for years "he offed screened and got away" Seems to me if spell damage is not considered to be adjusted upward. This would be a good anti speed hacker solution.
2. *umm see 7. I had SDI in here twice. Still waking up...
3. Poisoning - What can I say. In today's PvP it is probably one of the most wasted investments of skill points in the game. It isn't even worth to add to a warrior template for a disrupt healing tactic because of the counters to poison.
4. Tactics - The requisite of tactics for special moves should have never been added to the game. This alone has killed off a number of unique and fun templates. It has crippled melee characters as far as skill balancing (healing skills, magic resist, parry, etc) and has made spell casters roving disarm targets. There was a certain degree of tactics prior to publish 46 on fighting a spell caster who could pre set disarm and cast.
The call for implementing tactics for special moves was never an issue, never a demand for the masses. It was one person view. Much of publish 46 came from a guy named Guildmule (a non pvper) and EA's own Jeremy (community coordinator) It was the most single exploit and usury I have ever witnessed and a lot of changes that were made back then should be reviewed.
5. Parry, The requisite of 80 dex should be removed. Those who have room to invest in parry should not be penalized to meet a dex requirement. With the growing rate of ranged and melee templates parry and the requisite should be reviewed. Also it seems the chance to block has changed, maybe this is the result of the rng, but the code should be looked at and confirmed.
6. Damage caps - Melee - Nearly every melee damage nerf can be attributed to the abuse by archers since publish 22 (The time when archer combat animation and swing speed were addressed). Prior to publish 22 there were little issues. While archers have adapted to the overall changes through the years, warrior type templates have and had to face the severity of the changes often leaving them ineffective with special moves. Nerve strike (though not a special move) is probably the only good melee damage effect left for warriors)
Special moves such as concussion, crushing, ai, are not all that special anymore.. I don't have the answer, but if there is a way to separate the damage by range on these and other things like DS and lightning strike as well as adjusting the caps or eliminating them and replacing it with degradation over distance or over use, perhaps a better method of balance can be found while not breaking the game and bringing templates on par with one another.
7. SDI - In my opinion, for years I have thought Mage spells need a bit extra damage by easing up on the SDI Cap and gradually raising it to find a good but not over powering level. 3-4 seconds frozen in one spot to do some major damage is a bit overkill when an archer can do serious damage in half the time without cost. Something to think about.
So there you go. That is my take on it at this early hour.
PvP should be a hazardous occupation of play. Each template should be on par of being lethal in a 1 on 1 encounter. I propose some of these old nerfs be undone or modified and some new things added. I want to toss some things out for consideration.
1. Casting on the run - Ok, so this is stated to be a bug and people are complaining about it. To me though this is a mages dream. Archers can zap you on the run 6-8 tiles away. A good melee dexer can do damage on the run without mana expense, or use special moves if their swing speed is maxed out at 1.25. Often is the complaint that has been echoed for years "he offed screened and got away" Seems to me if spell damage is not considered to be adjusted upward. This would be a good anti speed hacker solution.
2. *umm see 7. I had SDI in here twice. Still waking up...
3. Poisoning - What can I say. In today's PvP it is probably one of the most wasted investments of skill points in the game. It isn't even worth to add to a warrior template for a disrupt healing tactic because of the counters to poison.
4. Tactics - The requisite of tactics for special moves should have never been added to the game. This alone has killed off a number of unique and fun templates. It has crippled melee characters as far as skill balancing (healing skills, magic resist, parry, etc) and has made spell casters roving disarm targets. There was a certain degree of tactics prior to publish 46 on fighting a spell caster who could pre set disarm and cast.
The call for implementing tactics for special moves was never an issue, never a demand for the masses. It was one person view. Much of publish 46 came from a guy named Guildmule (a non pvper) and EA's own Jeremy (community coordinator) It was the most single exploit and usury I have ever witnessed and a lot of changes that were made back then should be reviewed.
5. Parry, The requisite of 80 dex should be removed. Those who have room to invest in parry should not be penalized to meet a dex requirement. With the growing rate of ranged and melee templates parry and the requisite should be reviewed. Also it seems the chance to block has changed, maybe this is the result of the rng, but the code should be looked at and confirmed.
6. Damage caps - Melee - Nearly every melee damage nerf can be attributed to the abuse by archers since publish 22 (The time when archer combat animation and swing speed were addressed). Prior to publish 22 there were little issues. While archers have adapted to the overall changes through the years, warrior type templates have and had to face the severity of the changes often leaving them ineffective with special moves. Nerve strike (though not a special move) is probably the only good melee damage effect left for warriors)
Special moves such as concussion, crushing, ai, are not all that special anymore.. I don't have the answer, but if there is a way to separate the damage by range on these and other things like DS and lightning strike as well as adjusting the caps or eliminating them and replacing it with degradation over distance or over use, perhaps a better method of balance can be found while not breaking the game and bringing templates on par with one another.
7. SDI - In my opinion, for years I have thought Mage spells need a bit extra damage by easing up on the SDI Cap and gradually raising it to find a good but not over powering level. 3-4 seconds frozen in one spot to do some major damage is a bit overkill when an archer can do serious damage in half the time without cost. Something to think about.
So there you go. That is my take on it at this early hour.
I agree with most if not all of what you said... If they would fix parrying i'd definately be using it now, i'd be running a scribe nox parry mage template. However, the thought of losing 1/3 of my mana and HP to get 80 points into dex, or constantly chug a blue potion and hope I don't get cursed would just be annoying... That 80 dex crap shouldn't be there at all, mages already took a huge hit back in 06 or 07 when Chivalry got nerfd from 4/6 to 2/6 with magery over i think 70 skill. Give us something in return instead of just making these AI spammers even stronger.
On a side note, why is it that archers damage doesn't change depending on how close or far they are from there opponent? Hasn't anyone else ever wondered why the damage isn't say lower when you'r standing next to an archer vs if your 10 tiles away. I would think the damage would be a lot more the further you are away and the closer you are to the archer the less you'll have to endure. Atleast that's how I think it should be... Make those guys actually have to keep a distance to deal more damage instead of standing in one spot hitting the same key over and over. After all, archers can shoot on the run so there's no reason why they can't or aren't able to keep a distance rather then blasting you for 100% of the dmg they deal standing right toe to toe with your char.
On a side note, why is it that archers damage doesn't change depending on how close or far they are from there opponent? Hasn't anyone else ever wondered why the damage isn't say lower when you'r standing next to an archer vs if your 10 tiles away. I would think the damage would be a lot more the further you are away and the closer you are to the archer the less you'll have to endure. Atleast that's how I think it should be... Make those guys actually have to keep a distance to deal more damage instead of standing in one spot hitting the same key over and over. After all, archers can shoot on the run so there's no reason why they can't or aren't able to keep a distance rather then blasting you for 100% of the dmg they deal standing right toe to toe with your char.
And theres too many of those. Seriously, you shouldnt have to go to uoguide or some other webpage to know how to use certain skills/templates.