Do You Want A Classic Shard??

[Laina]

I voted no on this simply because its not a shard I would play. I have been playing UO for 10+ years and yeah there are a lot of things I miss about the way it used to be. I just don't think I personally could go back to the way it was after spending so much time adapting to the way it is now.

I believe the true intention of this poll to be a query as to how many people would actually PLAY on a shard such as this and voted accordingly. I have no objections/complaints to it if enough people said yes and EA was willing to do it.

 

[Bc-]

I voted no on this simply because its not a shard I would play. I have been playing UO for 10+ years and yeah there are a lot of things I miss about the way it used to be. I just don't think I personally could go back to the way it was after spending so much time adapting to the way it is now.

I believe the true intention of this poll to be a query as to how many people would actually PLAY on a shard such as this and voted accordingly. I have no objections/complaints to it if enough people said yes and EA was willing to do it.

Wow, I wish everyone who voted no was as reasonable as you. Point taken.

I think what a lot of people are over looking is that we aren't just doing this for the PvP but I also want to see a community again.

 

[HD2300]

I voted no because it would be another waste of limited resources.

If you want to play a populated classic shard, you can do it now and you can do it for FREE. The business case for EA then becomes only existing users opening extra accounts, so I would be really surprised if it happened.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

I voted no because it would be another waste of limited resources.

Then you call for a Tram only shard in your signature.

Hypocrite much?

 

[HD2300]

Then you call for a Tram only shard in your signature.

Hypocrite much?

The difference is that a Tram only shard would be a totally new product, as opposed to an already available free product. EA's unique selling point on a Tram only shard would be, play in the playstyle of your choice on all facets, only available at EA.

EA's unique selling point on their version of a classic shard would be, its exactly the same as the freeshards except you pay us $170 more a year.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

EA's unique selling point on a Tram only shard would be, play in the playstyle of your choice on all facets, only available at EA.

Wrong on 2 counts.

1 - You would not be able to play in the playstyle of your choice if you want to PK people.

2 - There are free shards out there that are Tram only.

EA's unique selling point on their version of a classic shard would be, its exactly the same as the freeshards except you pay us $170 more a year.

Wrong again.

EA's selling point on their version of a classic shard would be...

It's similar to Old UO, and it is actually running real multi-machine servers instead of on a Win 2k box in some kid's mom's basement. And, we have actual GMs that are not going to be unavailable because they got grounded for the weekend. Also, you don't have to worry about getting banned because you PK'ed the girlfriend of the shard owner.


Come on, freeshards are cute, and they are nifty and all that, but they are not a real substitute for actual EA shards.

 

[Bc-]

The difference is that a Tram only shard would be a totally new product, as opposed to an already available free product. EA's unique selling point on a Tram only shard would be, play in the playstyle of your choice on all facets, only available at EA.

EA's unique selling point on their version of a classic shard would be, its exactly the same as the freeshards except you pay us $170 more a year.

The reason why I do not commit to free shards is because they can go poof over night. Server stability is a huge issue, an EA Classic shard fixes this problem right away.

And yes as Morgan said, there are free Tram only shards, so this idea is not unique. I think a lot of people that didn't play in the pre UO:R days get the wrong idea. Sure in the DL vs. GL days there was an abundance of PKs, but that is only half the equation. There was thousands of players dedicated to protecting those of Britannia from murderers, and they did so on a nightly basis. After rep patch, fighting in dungeons day in and dout, I saw an average of maybe 2 PK's a week. They were very scarce because the penalty for death was so high. I think a lot of people are scared about this factor, thinking they will be easy prey for anyone to kill, while you may be vulnerable you are far from helpless.

Because of this I think if this server did come into play I would join the anti side and help to protect the trades folk who just wish to mine, or kill orcs all day. They are a vital part of the community, this is something we did not realise until it was to late in the old days and by then they had created Trammell and the world was already on its slippery slope.

 

[Maplestone]

Come on, freeshards are cute, and they are nifty and all that, but they are not a real substitute for actual EA shards.

So are you saying you would not be opposed to a Tram-only shard?

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

So are you saying you would not be opposed to a Tram-only shard?

Why should I care? I probably would never set foot on it, but sure...as long as, just like Siege/Mugen, there were no transfers to or from, why not?

I don't see the point of one though. As many people pointed out above, no one goes to Fel on the existing shards anyway...so you pretty much have an all Tram shard already, bunches of them. But I guess this about scrolls. Seems easier to just open up all the Fel-only content to Tram and be done with it.

But quite honestly, if a large portion of the player base were calling for a Tram-only shard, like they are for a Classic shard, I say...why not? It does not affect me one way or another as long as no one can transfer to or from the shard. So sure.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

Sure in the DL vs. GL days there was an abundance of PKs, but that is only half the equation. There was thousands of players dedicated to protecting those of Britannia from murderers, and they did so on a nightly basis. After rep patch, fighting in dungeons day in and dout, I saw an average of maybe 2 PK's a week. They were very scarce because the penalty for death was so high. I think a lot of people are scared about this factor, thinking they will be easy prey for anyone to kill, while you may be vulnerable you are far from helpless.

Because of this I think if this server did come into play I would join the anti side and help to protect the trades folk who just wish to mine, or kill orcs all day. They are a vital part of the community, this is something we did not realise until it was to late in the old days and by then they had created Trammell and the world was already on its slippery slope.

You have a place in the PoV if you want one! That was all we ever did back in the days was fight PKs to protect the innocent. That was community. And the really interesting part was that by the time UO:R came, we had fought so many PKs and red guilds, that we all actually knew each other well enough to settle disputes without killing. That, in my opinion, was exactly why they left PvP open. So that players would find a way to solve problems themselves, rather than enforcing an unrealistic, and anti-social, system.

Some have said that UO started as a grand social experiment. Unfortunately, they admitted that the experiment failed the day they launched UO:R. But I still don't think they gave us anti-PK guilds the support or tools we needed to make the experiment a success.

So they just shut it off.

 

[Laina]

Just out of curiosity why does it seem as though a classic shard automatically negates the possibility of a tram & illshenar side? I thought part of the big opposition to the way it is now has to do with all the insanity of an item based game, armor, artifacts, neon colors, cheats etc. I felt that there was still a huge sense of community and people working together even after Tram came out.

Maybe there would be more support out there for a pre-AOS shard rather than what's beginning to sound like a pre-Renaissance shard? And I think while some may mean pre-AOS, overall it sounds more and more like a call for pre-tram to me as I read through it. Maybe its my imagination...

Again, I am all for this idea if enough people will actually play that shard. I just don't see myself as being one of those people.

 

[Amren]

I want an alpha copy of the game
'
No changes since beta, no upgrades, everything as it was meant to be.

 

[HD2300]

And yes as Morgan said, there are free Tram only shards, so this idea is not unique.

I dont know of any Tram only shard with ML that has more than a 10 people playing it.

fyi any large development effects everyone, because it takes away resources from bug fixing and the creation of new events. The best example was KR, where for 8 months there were no events and during that time many of subscribers left.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

Just out of curiosity why does it seem as though a classic shard automatically negates the possibility of a tram & illshenar side?

I think for a lot of old-time players, myself included, we recognize that Trammel was a mistake.

Certainly, this has always been a point of contention amongst UO players.

Maybe there would be more support out there for a pre-AOS shard rather than what's beginning to sound like a pre-Renaissance shard?

Perhaps...but I think that would be short lived. One of the big problems that the world split caused is lack of risk. This leads to boredom, which leads to a constant need for more and more and more content.

To me, AoS was an almost natural progression from Ren. Something like that was necessary to keep the playerbase interested.

How many times can you run Deceit killing undead spawn before you say to yourself..."been here, done this"? Then where is the challenge?

The Devs more or less replaced risk with item collection. I guess it keeps people busy...but we see where it has gotten us.

Again, I am all for this idea if enough people will actually play that shard. I just don't see myself as being one of those people.

That's the real beauty of having both. A Classic pre-Ren shard would allow those that want to experience UO the way it was to do so. The current shards would allow those that want to experience UO the way it is now to do so as well.

It doesn't have to be a competition. No one, at least not me, is calling for any of the old shards to be closed down or converted.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

fyi any large development effects everyone, because it takes away resources from bug fixing and the creation of new events.

You don't think a Tram-only shard would do that as well?

 

[AesSedai]

Morgana, how would you feel about a Siege ruleset shard that allows 5+ players per account?

If getting rid of the AoS item property system is a must, then it will undoubtedly take some resources to recreate (surely you've read that they do not have any backups from that era because it mysteriously became lost in transistion years ago). My primary concern is the realistic addition of resources necessary for anything like this; otherwise I would be all for making as many variations as anyone could dream up... but money/time is a very real issue with EA & Mythic too & their usage of them does ultimately affect all current (& even future) subscribers.


(If they do create a pre:x shard, I would love to see some sort of thread with usernames that start on it, along with the occasional roll call to see who is still active every few months.)

 

[HD2300]

fyi any large development effects everyone, because it takes away resources from bug fixing and the creation of new events.

You don't think a Tram-only shard would do that as well?

Yes. However it needs far less development. It might be as simple as changing two lines.
e.g. AllowFelNonConsentualPvP = 0; AllowLostLandsNonConsentualPvP = 0;

 

[Mattitracks]

Morgana, how would you feel about a Siege ruleset shard that allows 5+ players per account?

If getting rid of the AoS item property system is a must, then it will undoubtedly take some resources to recreate (surely you've read that they do not have any backups from that era because it mysteriously became lost in transistion years ago). My primary concern is the realistic addition of resources necessary for anything like this; otherwise I would be all for making as many variations as anyone could dream up... but money/time is a very real issue with EA & Mythic too & their usage of them does ultimately affect all current (& even future) subscribers.


(If they do create a pre:x shard, I would love to see some sort of thread with usernames that start on it, along with the occasional roll call to see who is still active every few months.)

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the backups in question were the "pre-uor" ones?
I seem to remember the team claiming that before I even quit. Which would lead me to believe that the backups for most of UO:R still exist. If so, use that to build off of. It wouldn't be that huge of a change. Remove specials, spellbook in hand, lumber bonus, magic in towns, etc. Add insta hit and precast, and some other stuff [It's been 7+ years I can't remember it all!] and you'd be pretty close to the setup needed. Like I said, I don't think anyone expects perfect.

Ohh and horse stam!!! My god it must have horse stam!! That was such a pity to see removed.

Ohh and AesSedai, your name looks really familer. You wouldn't happen to have ran with IB way back in the early days of LS? I dunno what the hell makes me think that, but something is......

 

[Bc-]

You have a place in the PoV if you want one! That was all we ever did back in the days was fight PKs to protect the innocent. That was community. And the really interesting part was that by the time UO:R came, we had fought so many PKs and red guilds, that we all actually knew each other well enough to settle disputes without killing. That, in my opinion, was exactly why they left PvP open. So that players would find a way to solve problems themselves, rather than enforcing an unrealistic, and anti-social, system.

Some have said that UO started as a grand social experiment. Unfortunately, they admitted that the experiment failed the day they launched UO:R. But I still don't think they gave us anti-PK guilds the support or tools we needed to make the experiment a success.

So they just shut it off.

Funny because I can remember times back in the day when disputes were solved with words instead of actions. That is the only MMO I can think of where you talked first and shot second, not always, but sometimes. And you are right that is community.

 

[Mattitracks]

Just out of curiosity why does it seem as though a classic shard automatically negates the possibility of a tram & illshenar side? I thought part of the big opposition to the way it is now has to do with all the insanity of an item based game, armor, artifacts, neon colors, cheats etc. I felt that there was still a huge sense of community and people working together even after Tram came out.

Maybe there would be more support out there for a pre-AOS shard rather than what's beginning to sound like a pre-Renaissance shard? And I think while some may mean pre-AOS, overall it sounds more and more like a call for pre-tram to me as I read through it. Maybe its my imagination...

Again, I am all for this idea if enough people will actually play that shard. I just don't see myself as being one of those people.

In all honesty a "classic shard" could contain trammel based lands.. I wouldn't want it to be that way but UO:R did come out 9 years ago. I guess that would be pretty retro. I wouldn't really care for such a shard myself, but I will admit that it could be considered a retro shard.

Funny because I can remember times back in the day when disputes were solved with words instead of actions. That is the only MMO I can think of where you talked first and shot second, not always, but sometimes. And you are right that is community.

Disputes solved with words?!? I'm lost......

 

[Harlequin]

PEOPLE WHO LIKE TO CONFUSE US (5 people who did not vote but made at least one post in the thread. Are they fence-sitters or just plain cagey?)
Harlequin (3 posts)

For me, I am hoping for a couple of options more, like which era.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

Morgana, how would you feel about a Siege ruleset shard that allows 5+ players per account?

It would be fine with me if they wanted to create it, but I would still call for a true classic shard and probably wouldn't bother to play this one.

But again, I stress, I would not mind if they wanted to create one.

surely you've read that they do not have any backups from that era because it mysteriously became lost in transistion years ago

I have also heard the President of the United States say that he "did not have sexual realtions" with some fat girl in the Oval Office.

Turned out ... not so much.

(If they do create a pre:x shard, I would love to see some sort of thread with usernames that start on it, along with the occasional roll call to see who is still active every few months.)

Sure, as long as they post that same info for other shards, why not? While we are at it, why not have them publicly post our email addresses and maybe our IP addresses?

/sarcasm off

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

Yes. However it needs far less development. It might be as simple as changing two lines.
e.g. AllowFelNonConsentualPvP = 0; AllowLostLandsNonConsentualPvP = 0;

Oh, because it is easier, that is the route they should take?

They did that with Tram in the first place...now look at the mess we have.

 

[Kaleb]

Just out of curiosity why does it seem as though a classic shard automatically negates the possibility of a tram & illshenar side? I thought part of the big opposition to the way it is now has to do with all the insanity of an item based game, armor, artifacts, neon colors, cheats etc. I felt that there was still a huge sense of community and people working together even after Tram came out.

Maybe there would be more support out there for a pre-AOS shard rather than what's beginning to sound like a pre-Renaissance shard? And I think while some may mean pre-AOS, overall it sounds more and more like a call for pre-tram to me as I read through it. Maybe its my imagination...

Again, I am all for this idea if enough people will actually play that shard. I just don't see myself as being one of those people.

The spirit and very foundation of UO did not include Tram, So any "Classic" Retro server could only be either just Felucia or just tram. The 2 sides cannot co exist for balance reasons and crybaby prevention. Since UO:R there has always been a back and fourth between playstyles be it due to pvp nerfs/balance passes affecting pvm playstyles to one side just not liking the other. there would be less headaches for both sides of the line if they were not together.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

Funny because I can remember times back in the day when disputes were solved with words instead of actions. That is the only MMO I can think of where you talked first and shot second, not always, but sometimes. And you are right that is community.

We were able to, eventually, reach a sort of understanding with some of the PKs and PK guilds. That understanding was:

We have like 100 people available, you have like 30-40 people available. Death meant something, so rather than fight an overwhelming force, a compromise was occasionally reached.

Now, in Fel, death means nothing, so no threat of death matters. Its all fun and games, like Quake or Battlefield 2142. Whereas before, it was a matter of community...not just smack talking, although that happened then too.

This is the aspect of Ultima Online that was lost by the Fel/Tram split. Player justice, evil characters, good characters, the chance to actually shape the world in which you lived, worked, and played.

Now, the only shaping of the world is done by devs that throw neon colored candy out for the consumption of the drooling masses, while players left unchecked horde huge fortunes, build eyesore houses, and grief other players with no recourse.

It truly is a different world.

In another thread, I told a poster that old UO was not gone, because UO is us...but after reading the posts in the this thread...I am beginning to believe that old UO is dead...because the community died. Now we live in something like the Matrix...a cheap plastic copy where realism has no place.

 

[Kaleb]

UO was all about community until UO:R, Now all uo has become is a Diablo/sims/Counterstrike/WOW Hybrid, a deadly mix that killed off its community. To alot of us a felucia only sometime Pre AOS server can provide US with that feeling of Real UO. I play A free server with this setup (UO:Rish fel only) and the only reason I do is because EA/mythic dosnt provide it. Biggest problem is that there is only britannia and t2a and too many people Hot spots are packed with people sometimes its to hard to find a good spawn so you go out and murder lol, Some lands for the "classic style" ish, or tok may be a good idea lol.

 

[AesSedai]

- & I smile, again.

Agree on what is true pre:x UO + agree on some true forecast of the amount of players that would occupy the true / then approach the subject again,
eh?

Bring the rainbow of shards! But bring the reality too, please.
We are all here because we love UO (in some way or another, aye).

(disclaimer: nothing against Morgana nor anyone else in this thread)

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

I take no offense to your disagreement with me, because you do not reduce your argument down to immature personal attacks. That is an all too common tactic on internet forums of all kinds, not just this one. Heck, this one is tame. Go to a political message forum sometimes...YIKES!

I think the request for agreement on a time period is reasonable. And I agree with what Draconi said...T2A. But really, until the shard got populated, and characters started becoming skilled enough to tackle tougher challenges, I don't see the point with going beyond original release, as far as lands go.

It would be great to actually ride from Skara to Trinsic and actually see someone along the way for a change. Even if they wanted to slit my throat and take my skirt!

 

[Kaleb]

- & I smile, again.

Agree on what is true pre:x UO + agree on some true forecast of the amount of players that would occupy the true / then approach the subject again,
eh?

Bring the rainbow of shards! But bring the reality too, please.
We are all here because we love UO (in some way or another, aye).

(disclaimer: nothing against Morgana nor anyone else in this thread)

Yah thats the hard part. It does have to be balanced PvP and PvM and Economy wise, That is why none can agree Alot want just X time period with out thinking about some of the things that made that system slightly unbalanced say stat Increase items for example invis items, teleport items, Scroll spell stacking, Wand charges, controll 1/2 dozen drags/wyrms the list goes on and on no what about all the things that have been added to the game that are not unbalancing to combat? All the addons? Weapon/armor types (not properties or mods, like bukuto weap its self)? Custom housing? Vendor system?

Thats why when I think of classic UO it just has to be based around the foundation UO was built on. UO:Renish Combat/items/skills (yes no skills that have been added since aos) only one ruleset and both would be available.

The key is it has to be pre aos and one rule set and both have to be provided if they make a fel only version they need to make a tram only version.

 

[Surgeries]

I cannot see how EA can afford to not create a classic shard.

See, Morgana...this is the part that is going to be the hardest for you to swallow, and the most difficult for you to grasp, due to your paradigms.

I will preface by saying that what you do see is exactly what you want to see, or what fits what you already know, just like me, and everyone else. We filter our stuff, and some makes it, and other stuff just doesn't. That's how paradigms work.

You cannot see how EA can't understand how huge the demand is for a classic shard...how people are standing in line, money in hand, if they would just do it. Since Free Shards do it...for free nonetheless...why in the world doesn't EA?

Think about it. Do you really think that after like 8 years of daily pleading, begging, and people on Stratics telling EA what an opportunity awaits them to the point of the Mods prohibiting such shards...that EA hasn't had it looked at at least a few times, particularly in light of what would appear to be declining subscriptions? I certainly would think they have, and probably in depth, at that.

But...unless they are delusional, absolutely averse to making money, even in modest sums...unless EA has chosen to completely turn it's back on doing what it is supposed to do, for it's shareholders, and make money...

Then they...EA...do understand, at least one would hazard to guess, that the chance for profits doesn't exist in a large enough measure, in putting out a "Classic" shard to warrant the expenditures required to achieve it. They no doubt have crunched the numbers...weighed the variables...looked at models. How could they possibly not have done this?

And at the end of it all...with the actual data like Focus Group results, actual shard and facet populations, and percent of population etc. etc. etc. that you nor I have, right in their hands, and they are able to be evaluate the data seven ways to Sunday...the real numbers...the ones that could make or break someone's livelihood if misinterpreted...

EA hasn't yet, and so far still can't see the reason to do it. And that is, after all, what really counts.

So, unless you are able to convince them with your numbers and data, that whatever they are looking at, that is causing them to not act favorably can be overlooked, and they can take the dive because you and your fellow Stratics posters that are proponents believe, with all your hearts, that a Classic Shard will be a huge success....

I am thinking this Lead Zeppelin may not fly.

And, in closing, I will say again that if a Classic Shard would help UO, and bring in the revenues that proponents claim it would, I would say go for it, in a second.

But only if.

Nothing is impossible.

I will hereby hope that whatever data they are looking at gives them the impetus to undertake a Classic Shard for all of you that really want it, and that it would be wildly successful. Maybe Draconi and other could figure out a way that no one had thought of before, or something, and make it profitable.

Cheers!

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

Maybe Draconi and other could figure out a way that no one had thought of before, or something, and make it profitable.

Here's the thing...


I don't know what it costs EA to set up a shard. I am sure it's not cheap. But it's not like each shard pays a separate subscription fee. Setting up a classic shard would be no more costly than setting up any other shard most likely, and right now...if we all want to be honest...EA is currently maintaining about twice as many shards as they should be for the total number of players they have.

I hear a lot from current players about "what's good for UO" and "use of existing resources" but I wonder where that self-sacrificing and pious attitude would take these same posters if EA stepped in and mentioned shard merges or contracture for the shard they were currently playing on.

It's all "think of the good of the game" when we are discussing a classic shard, but when they really decide to crunch numbers, it will be "not in my back yard!"

Right now, most of the newer shards are not even close to full at any given time...I don't see all the "resource conservationists" calling for closing them.

The real issue here is that a certain subset of the playerbase feel a genuine threat from the existence of a classic shard. Why? Are they concerned that the players will try it, and decide 'wow, I had no idea that UO could be like this'...and then start demanding changes for the existing shards? Or are they concerned that a classic shard would be something that they would envy, but be afraid to play??

Or is it simply that some people just like to argue, and to play devil's advocate?

There would be an initial cost to set up a classic shard. There would be some ongoing cost from doing so. But it is not like EA's revenue from UO is going to decrease because of it. They only stand to gain by doing it, from a subscription point of view.

 

[Kaleb]

See, Morgana...this is the part that is going to be the hardest for you to swallow, and the most difficult for you to grasp, due to your paradigms.

I will preface by saying that what you do see is exactly what you want to see, or what fits what you already know, just like me, and everyone else. We filter our stuff, and some makes it, and other stuff just doesn't. That's how paradigms work.

You cannot see how EA can't understand how huge the demand is for a classic shard...how people are standing in line, money in hand, if they would just do it. Since Free Shards do it...for free nonetheless...why in the world doesn't EA?

Think about it. Do you really think that after like 8 years of daily pleading, begging, and people on Stratics telling EA what an opportunity awaits them to the point of the Mods prohibiting such shards...that EA hasn't had it looked at at least a few times, particularly in light of what would appear to be declining subscriptions? I certainly would think they have, and probably in depth, at that.

But...unless they are delusional, absolutely averse to making money, even in modest sums...unless EA has chosen to completely turn it's back on doing what it is supposed to do, for it's shareholders, and make money...

Then they...EA...do understand, at least one would hazard to guess, that the chance for profits doesn't exist in a large enough measure, in putting out a "Classic" shard to warrant the expenditures required to achieve it. They no doubt have crunched the numbers...weighed the variables...looked at models. How could they possibly not have done this?

And at the end of it all...with the actual data like Focus Group results, actual shard and facet populations, and percent of population etc. etc. etc. that you nor I have, right in their hands, and they are able to be evaluate the data seven ways to Sunday...the real numbers...the ones that could make or break someone's livelihood if misinterpreted...

EA hasn't yet, and so far still can't see the reason to do it. And that is, after all, what really counts.

So, unless you are able to convince them with your numbers and data, that whatever they are looking at, that is causing them to not act favorably can be overlooked, and they can take the dive because you and your fellow Stratics posters that are proponents believe, with all your hearts, that a Classic Shard will be a huge success....

I am thinking this Lead Zeppelin may not fly.

And, in closing, I will say again that if a Classic Shard would help UO, and bring in the revenues that proponents claim it would, I would say go for it, in a second.

But only if.

Nothing is impossible.

I will hereby hope that whatever data they are looking at gives them the impetus to undertake a Classic Shard for all of you that really want it, and that it would be wildly successful. Maybe Draconi and other could figure out a way that no one had thought of before, or something, and make it profitable.

Cheers!

Lets just base this on the amount of people online at this time there are many other shards and this is having a slow night I seen near 2k the other night.

Classic server Fel only Even at 868 people online @ $14 a month thats $12,152 that = $145,824 a year just with those accounts. if you think of all the other people not logged in or playin other places that can easy be 4-10x as much. Theres plenty of profit in it. For piece of mind that you dont kill a gm's friend and get banned its worth it to pay EA, alot to most would come back.

 

[Bc-]

- & I smile, again.

Agree on what is true pre:x UO + agree on some true forecast of the amount of players that would occupy the true / then approach the subject again,
eh?

Bring the rainbow of shards! But bring the reality too, please.
We are all here because we love UO (in some way or another, aye).

(disclaimer: nothing against Morgana nor anyone else in this thread)

And again as I said before.. the best way to do this is a poll sent out to all current and former subscribers via their registered EA account email. This is what Mythic did, they got a lot of answers, and believe me there was some very strong opposition for a Classic shard in DAoC. It isn't like it was a simple one day yes/no type thing and then two weeks later the server was up. It all started just like this, posts on VN asking for it, followed by a poll, then we had our shard. We actually already have one up because Draconi has already acknowledged the fact there is a "want" for the shard. So as I see it, we are ahead of schedule compared to the progress DAoC made.

I find it hard to believe now that the two are joint companies, and Mythic can share their numbers with EA for the shard, that EA will not do this. I can sit back and patiently wait at this point.

 

[Lord Patapon]

Hey Kaleb, don't get ahead of yourself with those numbers, because don't forget most free-shards allow multi clienting, even if a lot of those have a number of account limit for your IP.

Thing is, there still are lots of people playing on those shards, but I believe most old UO players didn't even bother going on those free shard; they have looked and often found other MMORPGs, even if those are ... well, are what they are. (UO players know this )

Many people regret those times, and didn't want to join an unstable, illegal shard when this era ended; Im pretty sure this wouldn't be a tsunami of old players returning, but it still can bring a lot of people back.

As for the poll by mail, yeah, it would be great, and a lot more relevant than this one; I guess Classic is really not the thing they can put time into at this moment, and I understand that because I hope SA will be great; but if SA is a good new client, AND they put in a Classic shard ... now that would be amazing.
And a nice blow to the few ones who're saying that UO is dieing (or already dead).

But, what I would like right now, is a state from a Dev, saying "this goes on the to do list" or "this goes to the trash bin" or even "we'll think about it seriously for a while, then we'll tell you what".

Please ?

 

[Tina Small]

Here's the thing...


I don't know what it costs EA to set up a shard. I am sure it's not cheap. But it's not like each shard pays a separate subscription fee. Setting up a classic shard would be no more costly than setting up any other shard most likely, and right now...if we all want to be honest...EA is currently maintaining about twice as many shards as they should be for the total number of players they have.

I hear a lot from current players about "what's good for UO" and "use of existing resources" but I wonder where that self-sacrificing and pious attitude would take these same posters if EA stepped in and mentioned shard merges or contracture for the shard they were currently playing on.

It's all "think of the good of the game" when we are discussing a classic shard, but when they really decide to crunch numbers, it will be "not in my back yard!"

Right now, most of the newer shards are not even close to full at any given time...I don't see all the "resource conservationists" calling for closing them.

The real issue here is that a certain subset of the playerbase feel a genuine threat from the existence of a classic shard. Why? Are they concerned that the players will try it, and decide 'wow, I had no idea that UO could be like this'...and then start demanding changes for the existing shards? Or are they concerned that a classic shard would be something that they would envy, but be afraid to play??

Or is it simply that some people just like to argue, and to play devil's advocate?

There would be an initial cost to set up a classic shard. There would be some ongoing cost from doing so. But it is not like EA's revenue from UO is going to decrease because of it. They only stand to gain by doing it, from a subscription point of view.

Hey Morgana, did you read the March 6, 2009 interview with Draconi that was posted on UOForums? ( http://www.uoforums.com/interview-a...ma-online-lead-designer-march-6th-2009-a.html ) I thought this Q&A was particularly interesting:

With the shard populations decreasing on some shards, will you close shards? Combine shards (like Mythic did with DAOC)? Or leave the shards intact the way they are?

Shard populations are far too strong to even begin considering mergers.

 

[Tina Small]

And just as another tidbit of info, I notice at the moment Cal Crowner from Mythic is looking at this thread....so yes, it's getting some notice from the folks that you want to have notice it.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

Well, if read my stories from the Atlantic section, you know one thing about me...I am a hopeless blabbermouth!

You never get what you want in live by sitting by and remaining silent.

 

[Surgeries]

The real issue here is that a certain subset of the playerbase feel a genuine threat from the existence of a classic shard. Why? Are they concerned that the players will try it, and decide 'wow, I had no idea that UO could be like this'...and then start demanding changes for the existing shards? Or are they concerned that a classic shard would be something that they would envy, but be afraid to play??

So, Morgana...it's an evil plot isn't it, then?



*Rubs Hands Together Evily*

Morgana...I am pretty sure no one is "Scared" of a classic shard. I don't do any PvP, and I am not "Scared" of Siege. I just don't play on Siege.

There is no secret player cult that pays EA to not put out a classic shard.

There is, however, people like Draconi, and Cal, who could do this, if the Pro-Forma pans out.

So far...it hasn't. Maybe you need to apply at EA, and use use your argument on them, face to face? Maybe then you can show them just how much money they can make?

Keep those fingers crossed, though!

Maybe Cal and Draconi are crunching the numbers right now, and the announcement will be out later! Maybe they will will grant your folk's wish!!

 

[Bc-]

Once again, nobody expects this shard to pop up over night. I can't remember the exact timeline but I am pretty sure it was close to a year from the Email/Login poll to server release when Mythic did their classic shards in DAoC.

Like I have said many times it isn't a matter of IF it will happen at this point, but just a matter of when. Eventually the server will be created, might be a year from now, or 5. But whenever it goes up I will be there to play on it.

And again, why do I have to repeat myself so much, the server isn't just about PvP, it is about community. A reason for Rpers to come is that there will be a great sense of community returned to the game through the process of a revived economy. No more will mob dropped artifacts dominate the weapons/armor scene, at least not in mass. All of the forgotten trades will be remembered. Have we all forgot what it used to be like to play in dungeons in this game after rep patch? Every single spawn had an active population, sure there were theives and murderers, but the population as a whole banded together to combat them. A community banded together, and as time moved on they became less and less common. Guilds warred, tradesmen sold their goods, banks had PEOPLE at them! Not just NPC's.. but actual PC's!

On Sonoma we had Oasis Fight Night, once a week the shard got together to battle it out for prizes and fame. Sure there were PK raids, but the city had PC guards, I was on both sides of that battle more than a few times. Guilds would come strictly to help defend the city during the event. The City survived, the community thrived.

 

[Surgeries]

Once again, nobody expects this shard to pop up over night. I can't remember the exact timeline but I am pretty sure it was close to a year from the Email/Login poll to server release when Mythic did their classic shards in DAoC.

Like I have said many times it isn't a matter of IF it will happen at this point, but just a matter of when. Eventually the server will be created, might be a year from now, or 5. But whenever it goes up I will be there to play on it.

And again, why do I have to repeat myself so much, the server isn't just about PvP, it is about community. A reason for Rpers to come is that there will be a great sense of community returned to the game through the process of a revived economy. No more will mob dropped artifacts dominate the weapons/armor scene, at least not in mass. All of the forgotten trades will be remembered. Have we all forgot what it used to be like to play in dungeons in this game after rep patch? Every single spawn had an active population, sure there were theives and murderers, but the population as a whole banded together to combat them. A community banded together, and as time moved on they became less and less common. Guilds warred, tradesmen sold their goods, banks had PEOPLE at them! Not just NPC's.. but actual PC's!

On Sonoma we had Oasis Fight Night, once a week the shard got together to battle it out for prizes and fame. Sure there were PK raids, but the city had PC guards, I was on both sides of that battle more than a few times. Guilds would come strictly to help defend the city during the event. The City survived, the community thrived.

My first girlfriend, that I fell in love with had no blemishes. The ones she did have I remember fondly. She was a Goddess, and could do no wrong.

My first "Guys Club" was more fun than any club since.

My first dance I ever went to was magical...I wish I could have another "First Dance".

My first Kiss was something i will never forget. I wish I could re-live my First Kiss.

Jethro Tull has a song called "Living in the Past".

Great tune.

 

[Bc-]

And when the server goes live and I am playing on it.. will I still be living in the past.. in the present?

Or how does that work.. and that song is alright but I prefer Green Day - Good Riddance.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

There is no secret player cult that pays EA to not put out a classic shard.

You sure? I thought for certain I heard black helicopters circling my house last night...and I've got my tin foil hat all ready to go!

But seriously, I am not meaning to come off as a conspiracy theorist...I am just listing various reasons why someone would not want a Classic Shard and debunking them...

Like so:

Objection: It would take too many resources, and cost EA too much money.

Debunk: It wouldn't take any more resources than doing any other shard, the shards we currently use are not full as it is, and this idea could only serve to increase subscriptions. No one is going to cancel their accounts if a Classic Shard is made, because no one is forced to play it.

Objection: No one would play a Classic Shard.

Debunk: There are at least as many people here that have stated that they would play one as there are who said they would not. If Stratics can be used a sample of UO players, and the inhabitants of free shards can be as well, then I think that someone would play it. (Probably twice as many as several of the dead shards we have now.)

Objection: No one can agree on what time period.

Debunk: That is a separate discussion. Once EA announced plans to make the shard, details can be sorted. But the overwhelming response from most "Classic" Shard players is something Pre-Trammel and No AoS rules.

Objection: The code doesn't exist anymore, it just magically disappeared.

Debunk: That may or may not be true, but EA is one of the largest game companies on the planet, and if they cannot take existing code and edit it down to a point where it would mimic the old code, then they need to sell UO to someone else because they suck.

Objection: Having a Classic Server will further dilute the player pool

Debunk: Having people get bored with Trammel and AoS has caused the player pool to become over half empty. Which do you think is causing dilution more, a Classic Shard, too many Shards, or World of Warcraft? The people that seek nothing but 100% safe play and items are, or already have, moved on to WoW...or a great deal of them have. Do you really think that adding a few re-hued items with mega-stats is going to bring those people back? I don't.

Ojection: EA/Mythic should concentrate on SA

Debunk: Agreed. We can wait...but we call 'next'.

 

[Tina Small]

How do you think people would react, especially current subscribers, if EA announced it would offer a new "classic shard" (or pair of shards) as a replacement to Siege and Mugen?

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

How do you think people would react, especially current subscribers, if EA announced it would offer a new "classic shard" (or pair of shards) as a replacement to Siege and Mugen?

Not sure.

I have a character on Siege, but I haven't played there in a while.

But I imagine that the Siege and Mugen players would be just as PO'ed about it as the, for example, Atlantic players would if they announced that Atlantic was going to be made a Classic server.

I think the key in doing this thing is to not impact any existing server directly. Maybe Test Center for a while to work things out, but not the prodo shards...including Siege and Mugen.

 

[Bc-]

That was the main opposition in DAoC, the current population. They were scared they would lose a large number of players on their servers. Initially they did, but this was negated by returning players. Eventually it settled out. Actually right now DAOC is throwing around the idea of an Origins server, which would be even more classic than the Classic servers featuring Old Frontiers. So anyone who thinks that EA is ignoring this idea.. or won't do it, when they have already released one classic server type and are currently working on ANOTHER for DAoC.. is foolish.

 

[Tina Small]

Just curious and wondering if anyone knows if many Japanese play on UO "free shards" and if yes, which rulesets those shards use.

 

[Bc-]

That is a good point, I know that on Sonoma before the Asian shards went up a good potion of the population was from the far East. Mostly Korean.

You can bet if this shard went up there would be a strong Asian presence on the server, most of which I imagine do not even read these boards.

 

[Kaleb]

Just curious and wondering if anyone knows if many Japanese play on UO "free shards" and if yes, which rulesets those shards use.

Quite alot really. I wake up around 4am pac time every morning and when I log on their all over the place. The asian writing bugs the hell out of me sometimes in WWB. Felucia ruleset only, PreAOS, Just Britannia and t2a.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

Quite alot really. I wake up around 4am pac time every morning and when I log on their all over the place. The asian writing bugs the hell out of me sometimes in WWB. Felucia ruleset only, PreAOS, Just Britannia and t2a.

I should be Asian.

 

[Malimus]

Ive looked at a few free shards... Came accross one a few nights ago. Downloaded client, framework, and another prog like UOassist to run it. Logged on and it was like being taken back in time. It is pretty much exactly how a classic shard should be. No tram, 500-600+ players on at all times so far. People mining, hunting, talkin and hanging out at good old Britain bank.
Players running around all over. Its thriving. I couldn't believe how good of a job they have done. EA should take a look at this and take some notes.

Now i know someone is gonna say "So just play that then" but once again it comes down to stability. Who knows when the guy running the free shard is gonna dump it. Anyway im not sure if i can post free shard links so ill just tell ya's the name. "UO Second Age - The way it was". This is purely to show those who dont know what classic uo is and was like and possibly a start to getting something to model a production classic server around. Or here's an idea. Hire these guys or buy the shard and hire them and somehow make it accessible like a production shard? The staff and the means to do this are there. Make it happen.

Brief feature list. nearly reproduced the 1999 OSI UO experience (T2A)

* Balance of PvM, PvP and RP
* Era accuracy is our top priority
* Helpful and Knowledgeable Player Community
* True Risk, Epic Battles
* T2A Era Crafting System
* T2A Era Housing
* Rare Items and Classic Quests
* Murderer Bounty System
* Magic Clothing and Jewelry
* Spell imbuded magic weapons
* Authentic Combat and Magery Systems
* Pre-Casting / Insta-Hit
* Unique PvM / PvP Events
* Authentic Economy
* Great Player Community
* Helpful, Responsive, Dedicated, Professional Staff