They're gonna do what to cheaters?

[Talula]

No, it's you who doesn't get it

If this is turned into yet another wishy washy wrist slapping exercise, players like myself will give up on EA and UO. The same players who've been walking out for a long time now, believing that EA don't care about managing their game properly. You might not care, but the day you login to find yourself surrounded by AFK bots, perhaps you'll wonder about the game you could be enjoying. And funny thing is, that situation will kill UO too. And what a shameful way for a game to die. Death by lazy players and crooks. You really think that's better? Wanna pay for a game where you can't even find a real player?

On one hand there are the players who MIGHT leave or MIGHT come back if EA doesn't do anything to deter scripting. On the other hand there is the substantial subscription hit that EA WILL take if they ban all accounts that have used 3rd party programs.

 

[Fink]

With respect to the dev team, who have been hard at work on this for some time, I am skeptical of their ability to identify cheats with 100% accuracy. When has any new system gone live without a hitch?

Now I don't mind if one in ten cheaters gets away with it. Nine out of ten is a pretty good strike rate and vastly superior to the current rate of zero out of ten. But I do wonder if we might also see one in ten honest players incorrectly identified as cheaters. I truly hope they've done the math, because I do want to see this system strengthen the game for legitimate players, perhaps draw former players back, and encourage more PvP.

Also, I do hope they've considered making disguise kits, incognito, and name change tokens off limits to these pink-hued cheats or whatever they may be. I'd hate to see someone outed as a cheat take the name Basara or Poo or something. We don't have exclusive, unique names so I don't see that visually identifying the cheater is a positive step. Add to that, many of the PvPers where I play use identical names and costumes. Which is which? And don't they all suffer by association?

To me "having fun with cheats" doesn't really seem like a mature or responsible approach to the problem. I'm sure in the spirit of fun we'd all like public stocks or effigies or whatever, but a script miner is anonymous and this doesn't shame them in any way. It might work on PvP hacks, but it's often obvious who those people are anyway so I doubt it will affect anyone's reputation. Also it doesn't work on people who simply have no shame.

That said, burn the bastards.

 

[shadowgate]

LOL I KNOW SHOULDN'T ,but god lovem I can't I help myself on this. These nuts and the anti scripting if that bugs them this will make em nuts.

I have 5 accounts on my main account is my GM Tamer, and Paladin.
On my second account is my GM Bard.
AND PLEASE BE SURE TO READ CLOSELY AND CAREFULLY AT THIS POINT.
My computer can run two separate instances of UO or WOW without any third party programs.
So often times I am logged in with my Tamer or Paladin and my Bard always is with them to calm what I fight or provoke other creatures. OH PERISH THE THOUGHT I even get a message running two instances of Ultima Online is not supported.
At this point I say and quote Johhny from Fantastic 4 FLAME ON!!!!!
Now consider this I have 3 pc's in my house if I ran my two accounts on two of my pc's none of you babies would care ,but the fact I am running two on 1 pc will upset you and some of you will even say I am a liar that I can't be running uo twice without a third party program but believe me I am and can.

LOL

 

[Llewen]

I'm sure in the spirit of fun we'd all like public stocks or effigies or whatever, but a script miner is anonymous and this doesn't shame them in any way. It might work on PvP hacks, but it's often obvious who those people are anyway so I doubt it will affect anyone's reputation. Also it doesn't work on people who simply have no shame.

And you just hit a very large nail square on the head...

Now consider this I have 3 pc's in my house if I ran my two accounts on two of my pc's none of you babies would care ,but the fact I am running two on 1 pc will upset you and some of you will even say I am a liar that I can't be running uo twice without a third party program but believe me I am and can.

Running multiple accounts even on the same pc has been legal for a long time. For a long time it was only legal to do it if you used fast user switching, but now with Windows 7 you can run two instances of either client (at least I think you can with the CC although UOA complains) perfectly legally. I do it often when I am training pets.

 

[yars]

a couple of points,
1.) you cant stop a thief, you can only slow them down
2.) if the cheaters get banned, prices will go up, probably send us back to the dark ages
3.) i really dont think "witchhunting" works. RL or gamelife so hang or publicly humilate whoever you want.
4.)its just a game
5.) see post 4.)
6.)i thnk if your caught sitting at luna bank too long or spewing nonsense and spamming in global chat., then you should be banned. it makes about as much sense as what ive read so far and probably have the same chance of getting done.
7.) false accusations of cheaters should also be dealt with harshly.IE reporting nonstop on folks just because you have no life outside UO. sadly this happens, and NOT EVERYONE IS A CHEATER,MAYBE YOU JUST SUCK AT WHAT YOU DO, its called survival of the fittest or natural selection.
8.) maybe if you spent more time playing the game then crying here about cheaters, you could keep up with them.
12 year vet, never bought gold, trained all my skills the hard way(no pain no gain), i dont use uoassist(thats for mortals).
seriously, theres waaaaaaaay better things the devs could be working on, like actual game content and bringing new players i. then we can have something to work with for your little "cheater inquisition"

 

[shadowgate]

a couple of points,
1.) you cant stop a thief, you can only slow them down
2.) if the cheaters get banned, prices will go up, probably send us back to the dark ages
3.) i really dont think "witchhunting" works. RL or gamelife so hang or publicly humilate whoever you want.
4.)its just a game
5.) see post 4.)
6.)i thnk if your caught sitting at luna bank too long or spewing nonsense and spamming in global chat., then you should be banned. it makes about as much sense as what ive read so far and probably have the same chance of getting done.
7.) false accusations of cheaters should also be dealt with harshly.IE reporting nonstop on folks just because you have no life outside UO. sadly this happens, and NOT EVERYONE IS A CHEATER,MAYBE YOU JUST SUCK AT WHAT YOU DO, its called survival of the fittest or natural selection.
8.) maybe if you spent more time playing the game then crying here about cheaters, you could keep up with them.
12 year vet, never bought gold, trained all my skills the hard way(no pain no gain), i dont use uoassist(thats for mortals).
seriously, theres waaaaaaaay better things the devs could be working on, like actual game content and bringing new players i. then we can have something to work with for your little "cheater inquisition"

IF what you say is true then I tip my hat to you because that is dedication

 

[Tanivar]

I'm not surprised......why not give them amnesty, like Obama.

After the worst 25 of each shard get axed, to get the point across to those who got email warnings, the rest can avoid the axe by no longer doing things that would qualify them to stay on the list. An amnesty that would last until they qualified for the list again.

Add a pic of a guillotine to the emails, and plant one by the stables of Luna. Subtle reminders for the slow among our cheaters.

 

[Tanivar]

They won't do mass bannings because they cannot afford to lose the subs

More fear-mongering.

I suspect if cheaters saw the axe falling on other cheaters and they loved playing UO, they would stop.

Those who love the cheating more than the game can leave by themselves to cheat elsewhere, or wait for the axe to send them on their way. Their choice.

 

[Arcus]

I haven't posted on the boards in years. However I can say this post got my attention. I have been playing this game off and on and paid for well over 10 years of my account. When I first started playing Ultima I was a miner and I absolutely loved and enjoyed clicking my mouse and raising the skill .1 at a time. However now at age 36 with a 4 year old son and a wife. I do not have the time I had 12 years ago.
I love Ultima Online. I love all of the newest changes. This argument is as old as the game itself. Perhaps 12 years ago we had the time available to indulge in Ultima skill gaining. Today there is World of Warcraft, Conan, Star Trek, Etc and all of the different Facebook apps aka Farmville.
Today when I login to Ultima. If I have to start a skill for example imbuing. In order to get that skill to 120 doing the skill NONE STOP is 20 straight hours. I do not have that kind of time and thank god my characters are at the skill cap. If I had to do LOCKPICKING over or Animal Taming I can guarantee I would just cancel my account and walk away.
You whine and cry as a player who does mining. If the player is not at the computer or off at work I get that. However if a player is sitting at the pc and wants to play Ultima ,but doesn't wanna sit there and click over and over and they have been doing this for 12 years. GIVE IT A REST!
Its ok for a player to spend 6 buck and get an advanced character token. Yet if a player is intelligent enough to write a script that allows them to have the character perform the 20+ hours to gain in a skill he / she is cheating.
Forget this entire argument altogether you are talking about a game thats graphics are based off of a game that was created in 1992 for those who don't know (Ultima 7 The Black Gate) Even using the Enhanced Client the game is not GREAT / AWESOME Eye Candy. If you aren't going to revamp the way in which players advance the characters then don't get mad because people don't wanna spend 12 a month for a game that is more work then the 8 hours they spend paying for it at REAL LIFE JOB!!!

Can you go back to not posting? Thx. :gun:

 

[StaticOnAtlantic]

Most of you have missed the turn off to crazy land. Mass emails will go out it will curve the issue for awhile until the "programs" find a way to go hidden, which isn't hard, then its going to be a constant game of cat and mouse. Nothing Is going to change that drastic.

 

[StaticOnAtlantic]

More fear-mongering.

I suspect if cheaters saw the axe falling on other cheaters and they loved playing UO, they would stop.

Those who love the cheating more than the game can leave by themselves to cheat elsewhere, or wait for the axe to send them on their way. Their choice.

Fear Mongering? Its it fear mongering when the "program" that is in question has more accounts than UO Stratics? Not saying all UO players use stratics but I would venture to say 90% do, And I would Venture to say that 90% of UO players use these programs at some degree.

Thinking about it from an business point of view, Closing out EVEN 50% of your customer base is, well suicide.

There is no fear mongering my friend only truth, is it hard to tell whos ideas are skewed now?

 

[Arcus]

no such word as "spelt" as you use it... spelt is a wheat-like plant, not an alternate tense of "spelled."

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/spelt
http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/spelt
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/spelt

Haha owned.

 

[Arcus]

Fear Mongering? Its it fear mongering when the "program" that is in question has more accounts than UO Stratics? Not saying all UO players use stratics but I would venture to say 90% do, And I would Venture to say that 90% of UO players use these programs at some degree.

Thinking about it from an business point of view, Closing out EVEN 50% of your customer base is, well suicide.

There is no fear mongering my friend only truth, is it hard to tell whos ideas are skewed now?

Spoken like a true cheater. Its easy to see you the pathetic little people are here.

 

[Picus of Napa]

The biggest issue that I have with the current systems as it releates to the CC(this is the only client I play) is the lack of macros. Scripting takes care of this without my having to shell out a extra $15 bucks to some shmuck who wrote a program 10+ years back and has collected hundreds of thousands of dollars from UO players(lets just think he's sold 50K UOA at $15 = $750,000.00 and I'm sure it's more than that).

The dev team has, over the years, relied upon UOA to fill the void that a lack of an effective macro system left us players with. You can't even drink a heal pot with out it in the CC and this is after 11 years of release(only 11 because I believe you can do this in the EC). The release of the scripting program highlighted the grind of skill/item building and the lack of anything done about it over the same length of time only made it legal by default.

Could anyone comment on this? IMO the macro system is a huge hinderence to the game and needs to be addressed.

 

[Tanivar]

More fear-mongering.

I suspect if cheaters saw the axe falling on other cheaters and they loved playing UO, they would stop.

Those who love the cheating more than the game can leave by themselves to cheat elsewhere, or wait for the axe to send them on their way. Their choice.

Fear Mongering? Its it fear mongering when the "program" that is in question has more accounts than UO Stratics? Not saying all UO players use stratics but I would venture to say 90% do, And I would Venture to say that 90% of UO players use these programs at some degree.

Thinking about it from an business point of view, Closing out EVEN 50% of your customer base is, well suicide.

There is no fear mongering my friend only truth, is it hard to tell whos ideas are skewed now?

Refer to the trext in green & red in the quote above. If cheating is that important to their enjoyment of the game, they need to be gotten rid of.

And yes, it's fear mongering. rolleyes:

 

[StaticOnAtlantic]

Spoken like a true cheater. Its easy to see you the pathetic little people are here.

Here we go again, looking at it from a business side of view it doesn't make sense to ban 50% of Uo players. If EA/Mythic has already made cuts to staff and budget Why in the hell would you think they would do a mass banning and loose there bottom line? The game will shuffle to a complete almost stop.

There goes any planned ideas for "Advertising, Staff, Support", I mean good lord, why not look at this issue instead of posting nonsensical rants.

 

[StaticOnAtlantic]

Refer to the trext in green & red in the quote above. If cheating is that important to their enjoyment of the game, they need to be gotten rid of.

And yes, it's fear mongering. rolleyes:

you missed the point, you didnt even address the issue I quoted, nor did you even read it. and I love the Christmas color mspaint banner.

 

[shadowgate]

Can you go back to not posting? Thx. :gun:

Well perhaps I could ,but you haven't even said Why?

 

[Tanivar]

you missed the point, you didnt even address the issue I quoted, nor did you even read it. and I love the Christmas color mspaint banner.

The fear mongering routine has gotten boring to read. <shrug>

It was actually green for go, red for stop.

 

[Tanivar]

Here we go again, looking at it from a business side of view it doesn't make sense to ban 50% of Uo players.

Wow! We're down to only losing 50% of the players now! That's a lot better than it had been in weeks past.

 

[StaticOnAtlantic]

Wow! We're down to only losing 50% of the players now! That's a lot better than it had been in weeks past.

to kill with kindness you get the award. I dont want people to take it personal on what I say, but I think we have to be logical about the issue at hand.

Its not just a single solution, thats what I want people to see.

 

[PlayerSkillFTW]

One very simple way to stop the speedhacking/pot chug scripters in PvP, would be to flag those offending accounts with "perma stat loss" on death, like Perma Reds had to deal with in the oldschool days. For each week they go without cheating, their' char regains 10-20% of it's lost skillpoints (Which is more merciful than what us oldschool PKs got).

I can tell you first hand just how effective that method was at stopping any "anti-social" activity. I eventually deleted my oldschool perma red Fencer because his skills had fallen so low from being rez kill camped at the Chaos Shrine by Blue griefers. Back then, the only way to regain those lost skillpoints, was to spend hours or days training them back up, which you'd likely die from getting ganked by blues in the proccess of training those skills back up, getting even more perma skillpoint loss.

 

[Violence]

Re: Nothing serious.. So keep playing.

Always refreshing to see the fanaticism and whining and attempts to actually sound serious, with which cheaters defend their choices. Give it another couple of months and we'll be seeing posts of theirs telling legitimate players to find another game instead of them getting kicked out. To me it is now apparent that cheating is Here To Stay.

Furthermore something is very fishy about this 3rd Party Detection. If you add it all up it doesn't make sense. For example, last time I checked before this Producers' Letter they hadn't even completed the thing and now they have pin-pointed a couple of accounts. This sounds wrong in more than one way. So does "Having fun with cheaters.".. I think they had enough fun, either remove them from the game or tell us we'll have to live with them, official statement and all. And if you add up previous discussions and attempts, and the reactions those caused it reeks with F4iL.

Then we've got that exciting information about the Town Hall Meeting or whatever those are called- "Where great things will be revealed concerning the future of the game!" or some-such claim. Yadda, yadda, yadda. And then Blah, blah blah blah.. Oh and they're building Arenas, and new Factions, mean-while though everything under the hood of this game is rotten to the core. Like, YAY!..

It's come down to admitting that without cheaters there would not even be enough competition in the game among players and that from someone who, earlier, would not consider the possibility of cheaters existing in UO in large numbers.

I've already de-activated as I had said, done it before this Letter. I'll check the Meeting logs and see if I read something like "WE R BANZ THEM ALL.." that will have me coming back 100% but just in case that I don't -Which I'm almost certain I won't- And without any more xX{Drama}Xx I'm out!

Fix this mess and I'll be back in. But nothing else will ever make me PAY or invest my free time and for the matter, hope to actually have fun in UO. Especially not another reply from the Devs until they prove they're not full of it through ACTIONS.
Indeed then, not another Cent, not another split second, not one more post about this game getting PWNED by cheaters. I'm tired of the situation, simple as that.

 

[Going Going Gone]

All excuses appart, I am waiting for a mass ban and I have my finger over the button [reactivate account] if they happen to take severe actions against the players who have cheated their way thru the years. Otherwise, the accounts stay closed.

There is no such thing as a small cheat. I am disgusted when I see players saying: " i am not going to get carpal tunnel syndrome repeating the same action again and again to train... lets say, mining". You know what? If 9/10 players think the same thing and only one did the training as it should be, then the 9 other players are robbing that legit player as there should be very little ingots available if he is alone and the price could be alot higher. Then that pvper that says: "poisoning takes so long to train, who would do it without a script?". You know what again? That one day that I ran out of cure pots, that cheater wouldn't have killed me and grab that 120 magery I was carrying if he had to train poisoning manually. Add to that the speedhackers, scripted ressource harvesters, and name whatever other cheat available and the picture is complete.

I am not coming back to UO, a game I adore, unless EA decides to apply a standard as high as what is effective on WoW: advanced cheating detection and the big banhammer at the second a punk tries to cheat.:gun:

 

[HD2300]

Re: Nothing serious.. So keep playing.

I've already de-activated as I had said, done it before this Letter. I'll check the Meeting logs and see if I read something like "WE R BANZ THEM ALL.." that will have me coming back 100% but just in case that I don't -Which I'm almost certain I won't- And without any more xX{Drama}Xx I'm out!

Fix this mess and I'll be back in. But nothing else will ever make me PAY or invest my free time and for the matter, hope to actually have fun in UO. Especially not another reply from the Devs until they prove they're not full of it through ACTIONS.

It’s important that we do not do “mass bannings” for offenders. One, it’s not just, and also it’s more fun to make a public display of cheaters … at times.

Guess you wont be coming back then SL.

Since "it's not just" to ban cheaters, why not just allowing cheating? Then EA can put banner adz all over the Internet to market UO as the only MMO where you can legally cheat.

 

[Aurelius]

I don't give a damn what they do with genuine cheats as long as it gets them out of the game.

However, I have no confidence at all that EA/Mythic can get a significant proportion of the cheats without also banning some innocent people, they have never managed to get it absolutely right before and I just don't believe they are going to get it right this time either.

As for the folks who always chime in saying 'well some incorrect bans are a price worth paying', stop talking such utter c**p. You'd be the first here screaming if your accounts got banned incorrectly....

Something needs to be done - something has always needed to be done. Whether this upcoming 'something' is going to work well enough, who knows.

 

[popps]

They won't do mass bannings because they cannot afford to lose the subs

I don't know about that, reading this post from Cal_Mythic at [http://vboards.stratics.com/showthread.php?p=1797902#post1797902] I understand that "manageable" means, at least to me, "possible to be dealt with" which includes the banning hammer......

 

[popps]

.......so than CHEATING OR SCRIPTING the heart and sould purpose of Ultima Online is to find someone you can get there goat and get them upset............

I totally disagree.

Playing the Ultimas, I learned that the history of the Ultima's Saga is all about VIRTUES.

I cannot possibly think that the heart and soul purpose of Ultima Online might be to find someone to get their goat and get them upset.....

"IF" the game might have become this, then I can't help thinking that at some point some Developing team which have happened to handle the game might have failed in maintaining the heritage and the real soul of the Ultima Saga (the Virtues, that is...).

Perhaps it is time to bring back on track Ultima Online within the boundaries of the VIRTUES ??

 

[popps]

1.) you cant stop a thief, you can only slow them down

Well, I guess it all depends on the chosen way to deal with the problem.

2.) if the cheaters get banned, prices will go up, probably send us back to the dark ages

Dark Ages ?? No way.

It will, instead, and finally, bring the game back to those players who have been deprived of it.

Players who wanted to mine, chop wood, do Bulk Order Deeds, Library Collectibles and so forth but where hindered in doing it by scripters who effectively devalued their gaming time because of the ability to script 24/7.

Stopping scripting will bring no Dark Age, IMHO, it will instead make the game again possible for all those who may want to engage in activities which were made not worth doing by scripters.

3.) i really dont think "witchhunting" works. RL or gamelife so hang or publicly humilate whoever you want.
4.)its just a game

And what is the fact that it is just a game supposed to mean ?
I do not know others, but personally, I do NOT enjoy playing games when I see my fellow players cheating at them.....

seriously, theres waaaaaaaay better things the devs could be working on, like actual game content and bringing new players i. then we can have something to work with for your little "cheater inquisition"

I disagree. Dealing with cheating in Ultima Online IS, IMHO, the # 1 priority of the game. It is about time that Ultima Online, finally, becomes a cheat-free game and I could not think of a better way usefull to Ultima Online for Developers and programmers to spend their time on.

 

[Lord Chaos]

The funny thing is that it will reward those who have already cheated and have stockpiled chars, resources and gold already, they're sitting pretty.

 

[popps]

Resource Scripters : what to do about their ill-gotten vast resources ?


How about, in order not to have them benefit too much from whatever they have already stocked up through resource scripting, how about the Developers change the resources tree in a way that resources prior to the anti-cheat code will loose their worth and get replaced by newer resources that will only be available after the anti-cheat code goes live ?

For example, just to make myself understood, let's consider iron ingots.

Let's say that now, to make an item some 10 iron ingots are needed.

The Developers will now create a "new" item, it can use the same icon of the current iron ingots as well as the same name because all previous items of the same kind will now get a tag "old" and become, for example, "old iron ingots".

So, all current iron ingots will become "old iron ingots" while the new mineable iron ingots will be just "iron ingots".

Now, let's go back to the shield, the 10 iron ingots requirement will now ONLY apply for the "new" diggable iron ingots, not for the old ones. Should players want to use the old ones, they will need to use more of those, say on a 10 to 1 ratio. That is, to make the shield players will either need to use 10 new iron ingots or 100 old iron ingots.

Basically, resource scripters will be at a disadvantage and players digging and chopping anew will be back in business.

Slowly, over time the new resources will completely take over the old ones and solve the issue, completely. Of course, this change considers the stopping for good of resources scripting as it would not make much sense to introduce new resources to replace the old ones if then scripting could continue for the new resources as well....

Sure, this change will also hurt those players who legittimately digged and chopped their resources but it would not hurt them as much as it would with the scripters who got large stocks of resources to benefit from.

If it was possible to pin point all resources scripting accounts and just delete the resources from them then I think this would probably be the best way to handle the situation but, unfortunately, I do not see this as much possible.

Several scripters use a dummy, disposable account to script their resources and then transfer them to a legit account which do not script and so, it is quite hard to find where the resources ended up to to delete them.

Hence, no solution can be perfect and any solution has some cons.

Letting the scripters continue to benefit from the tens, hundreds of thousands of resources which they got through scripting though, I do not think would be right and something should be done to deal with this problem.

I think that devaluing, though gradually, the worth of the current resources to have new ones slowly take over and replace them (once the anti-cheat code is fully 100% up and running) might perhaps be a good and reasonable way, all in all considered, to deal with this issue.

 

[popps]

The funny thing is that it will reward those who have already cheated and have stockpiled chars, resources and gold already, they're sitting pretty.

See my post above........ there might be ways to avoid scripters to benefit too much from their ill-gotten resources from scripting....

It just needs some thinking and planning but good ways to deal with this might be thought over.........

 

[Splup]

Well my quess is:

1. Warning

2. Characters on some public cell or something, anyways so people can see you have cheated (this counts also as 24 or 48h ban cause chars can't be used).

3. 48 or 72 hour ban or permaban

4. If third was 48 or 72 this is perma.

I don't believe in itemloss or skill loss.

 

[popps]

I don't believe in itemloss or skill loss.

Well, the problem is still what to do with those accounts that stop to script after the warning. They still would have a lot of resources which they might have obtained through scripting before they received the warning and stopped any scripting activity.

Allowing those stocks of resources gotten from scripting stay untouched, would basically mean as I see it letting the resources' scripters benefit from their scripting without much consequence.

I think something should be done to deal with those stocks in some way.

 

[Dakkon Blackblade]

More fear-mongering.

I suspect if cheaters saw the axe falling on other cheaters and they loved playing UO, they would stop.

Those who love the cheating more than the game can leave by themselves to cheat elsewhere, or wait for the axe to send them on their way. Their choice.

Fear-mongering? Uh no if they ban all scripters the game will likely tank, what exactly is to be feared I am not certain. The game needs to die, it long ago became an awful parody.

You have a delusional view about the current state of the game if you think it's that easy to take care of, do you really believe that scripters/cheaters are a minority in game?

If it were as simple as ban all the scripters they would have done that a long time ago, think about that for a minute.

I don't know about that, reading this post from Cal_Mythic at [http://vboards.stratics.com/showthre...2#post1797902] I understand that "manageable" means, at least to me, "possible to be dealt with" which includes the banning hammer......

I would take anything Cal writes on this matter with a grain of salt, of course the devs won't say anything other than it is manageable.There is also a reason they won't release their subscription numbers, no developer is going to throw a negative message out about the health of the game it wouldn't really make sense to do so.

 

[Lord Chaos]

A lot of people have been stopping cheating and simply not playing too much ever since the first announcement, so its likely the number they've seen is lower than normal, plus there are the occasional cheaters like skill trainers that they won't catch either, plus the search site cheaters. So likely the number atm is fairly low.

Not to mention, if they're only detecting in the CC, they'll miss another batch of cheaters as well.

So their list is likely not that long really.

Likely they've painted themselves into a corner of a mess right now.

 

[Llewen]

A lot of people have been stopping cheating and simply not playing too much ever since the first announcement, so its likely the number they've seen is lower than normal, plus there are the occasional cheaters like skill trainers that they won't catch either, plus the search site cheaters. So likely the number atm is fairly low.

Not to mention, if they're only detecting in the CC, they'll miss another batch of cheaters as well.

You have no clue what you are talking about...

 

[popps]

I don't know about that, reading this post from Cal_Mythic at [http://vboards.stratics.com/showthre...2#post1797902] I understand that "manageable" means, at least to me, "possible to be dealt with" which includes the banning hammer......

I would take anything Cal writes on this matter with a grain of salt, of course the devs won't say anything other than it is manageable.There is also a reason they won't release their subscription numbers, no developer is going to throw a negative message out about the health of the game it wouldn't really make sense to do so.

Well, I may be wrong in my thinking but personally, I think that since most games sail with the banner of a Company which usually has other games or will have other games in the future, if a game is known to be rigged with cheating it exactly ain't good reputation for the Company that lets the cheating be that wide spread, is it ?

I mean, I do not know others but personally, I do not exactly enjoy playing my games with fellow players who cheat a go-go.....

So, if I get to learn that a Company has a too relaxed policy towards cheaters in their games, my picks would hardly consider any game from that Company no matter how cool it might be and/or look.

I would imagine, that out there there might be other players who think like me and would refrain to play games from Companies they learned to know where too relaxed over cheating in their games.

Bottom line is, as I see it, that letting cheating go on and continue in a game might go well beyond that single game and, who knows, perhaps also impact other games from that same Company even some yet to be released.

That's why I think that addressing the cheating with no tolerance is very important, it is important for Ultima Online but also, as I see it, for the Company that owns the game for all of their other games.

At least, that is how I see it.

Furthermore, why couldn't it be that once cheating is stopped once and for all in Ultima Online those players who will return to it to finally be able to enjoy a cheat-free UO won't be more than those who left because cheating is no longer possible ?

 

[popps]

A lot of people have been stopping cheating and simply not playing too much ever since the first announcement, so its likely the number they've seen is lower than normal, plus there are the occasional cheaters like skill trainers that they won't catch either, plus the search site cheaters. So likely the number atm is fairly low.

Not to mention, if they're only detecting in the CC, they'll miss another batch of cheaters as well.

So their list is likely not that long really.

Likely they've painted themselves into a corner of a mess right now.

I guess time will tell who was right and who was wrong.

We "just" need to wait (hopefully a reasonable amount of time) and see what happens and what findings will be found and actions will be taken.

As I see it, it also is a matter of reputation which can be more valuable than a single game.

When a Company publishes several games, that a few do not go well is not as important as maintaining a high standard of a reputation for the other games they have, even the ones yet to be released.

So, as I see it, even at the risk of having Ultima Online loose a considerable number of subscriptions, it STILL is very important in order to maintain a high standard of reputation, that the action against cheating is inequivocable and firm.

At least, so I see it.

 

[Tanivar]

I don't give a damn what they do with genuine cheats as long as it gets them out of the game.

However, I have no confidence at all that EA/Mythic can get a significant proportion of the cheats without also banning some innocent people, they have never managed to get it absolutely right before and I just don't believe they are going to get it right this time either.

As for the folks who always chime in saying 'well some incorrect bans are a price worth paying', stop talking such utter c**p. You'd be the first here screaming if your accounts got banned incorrectly....

Something needs to be done - something has always needed to be done. Whether this upcoming 'something' is going to work well enough, who knows.

And the fear monger posters pull out the next tactic to try and protect cheaters.

Yes it could happen to a few, probably due to usually hanging around with cheaters. Keep in mind though, EA does not want to ban any more accounts than it has to to convince people to stop cheating. Remember that line you've all been harping on about losing so many players?

Read my sgnature below. It says it bluntly.

 

[canary]

Likely they've painted themselves into a corner of a mess right now.

Between this and the announcement of a possible classic shard, easily.

 

[Tanivar]

If they are in such a corner they need to come out and hang a few heads on pikes. Then let the rest of those on their list know, offically, that there is a choice. You can stay and play UO without cheating, or not play UO at all. If you want to keep playing UO, do it by the rules. or else.

Simple enough.

 

[Aurelius]

And the fear monger posters pull out the next tactic to try and protect cheaters.

Fear mongers? Exaggerate much?

I don't trust EA to get it right - sorry if me having an opinion bothers you so much you need to spout such utter nonsense....

 

[Lord Chaos]

Read my sgnature below. It says it bluntly.

Now who's the fearmonger, lol

 

[Wenchkin]

On one hand there are the players who MIGHT leave or MIGHT come back if EA doesn't do anything to deter scripting. On the other hand there is the substantial subscription hit that EA WILL take if they ban all accounts that have used 3rd party programs.

Well as I said, whatever course EA takes this late in the day carries risk. Go down fighting or roll over and let cheats win. No game developer with any interest in their reputation/shareholders ought to be picking the latter option there.

Listening to some posters, you'd think cheating was a 1 way thing, once a cheat always a cheat. That everyone and their dog will get caught and banned. I think the chances of EA Mythic being too strict in the light of Cal's statement are slim to nil and falling. I think all the cheats are gleefully rubbing their hands together at this squealing, "yay, we're in the clear for good now!" And sadly, if they just put in some bans then ran the detector again, perhaps they'd realise that many casual cheats do so because of the lack of risk. UO can be saved, but it'll take some guts to do what's needed without panicking about the bean counters before you've even tried!

This is important though, because now is probably the last chance Cal and his team have to convince us that they care, that action will be taken. Fail on that and those of us who waited patiently for a fix will walk.

I stand by my view that this is a risk which needs to be taken. Pick a few really determined cheats and ban them publicly, check the detection figures again, repeat. If it isn't working, by all means re-evaluate. But what we've had so far hasn't worked. It has to get tougher or it's pointless.

Wenchy

 

[Lord Chaos]

Well as I said, whatever course EA takes this late in the day carries risk. Go down fighting or roll over and let cheats win. No game developer with any interest in their reputation/shareholders ought to be picking the latter option there.

They've "rolled over" for 13 years, its not going to matter in regards to their reputation any longer.

Listening to some posters, you'd think cheating was a 1 way thing, once a cheat always a cheat.

For many, this has been part of the game for 13 years, so its highly unlikely they're going to stop all of a sudden.

I think the chances of EA Mythic being too strict in the light of Cal's statement are slim to nil and falling. I think all the cheats are gleefully rubbing their hands together at this squealing, "yay, we're in the clear for good now!" And sadly, if they just put in some bans then ran the detector again, perhaps they'd realise that many casual cheats do so because of the lack of risk.

Lack of risk maybe, but certainly because its what makes the game bearable to play. So many things are either impossible to do in CC or a mess to do in either client. UO has the undisputed most boring training system in the history of MMOs.

UO can be saved, but it'll take some guts to do what's needed without panicking about the bean counters before you've even tried!

Who said UO was in need of saving?

This is important though, because now is probably the last chance Cal and his team have to convince us that they care, that action will be taken. Fail on that and those of us who waited patiently for a fix will walk.

Which is why they should have ignored the issue from the get go. Now they lose people regardless of what they do, though likely a lot less if its just a few stratics babies leaving.

I stand by my view that this is a risk which needs to be taken.

And why does it need to be taken now? Has anything changed from how things were 5 years ago, 2 years ago, a year ago?

Pick a few really determined cheats and ban them publicly, check the detection figures again, repeat. If it isn't working, by all means re-evaluate. But what we've had so far hasn't worked. It has to get tougher or it's pointless.

UO is alive isn't it? So its obviously worked. UO had its peak of subscribers and massive influx of players when cheating was at its highest as well, so to honestly say that cheating has had any real bearing on subscriber numbers is silly to say the least.

 

[popps]

I stand by my view that this is a risk which needs to be taken. Pick a few really determined cheats and ban them publicly, check the detection figures again, repeat. If it isn't working, by all means re-evaluate. But what we've had so far hasn't worked. It has to get tougher or it's pointless.
Wenchy

I agree.

I think that the importance of getting Ultima Online rid of cheating might even go beyond UO alone....

As I said, whenever I consider playing a multiplayer game, the reputation of the Company publishing and maintaining it, and their policy and attitude towards cheating in their games, is one important thing I look at.

If I do NOT like to play a game where I risk bumping into fellow players cheating a go-go (which I really do not like nor enjoy...), I tend to stay away from those games where I have a feeling that the Companies running them are too relaxed towards cheating in their games. This, no matter how cool and nice these games might look.

So, the anti-cheaters battle is one that can go beyond a single one game and perhaps, one worth to be fought firmly ??

 

[Lord Chaos]

So you only play WoW? Thats the only MMO out there thats relatively cheat free. (relatively, still loads of illegal RMT and botting even there)

You're expecting UO to do what no other (not even Blizzard) company has managed and somehow think it matters to business? Are you that deluded?

 

[Crystal Canyon]

UO has the undisputed most boring training system in the history of MMOs.

Hmmm...Lets think about this.

If your training swords, don't you go fight to gain the skill? Is fighting what you are going to do with the skill once you hit cap? If you dont like to sword fight while training, why would you chose it as a skill?

If your training Inscription, don't you make scrolls to gain the skill? Isn't making scrolls what you are going to do once you hit cap? If you hate making scrolls, why would you chose to do it?

If your training lumberjacking arent you going to go lumberjack to gain the skill? Isn't lumberjacking what your planning on doing with the skill once you hit cap? If lumberjacking is so boring, why would you train a character to do it?

I think training in the game is really so much like in real life. You chose a profession you would like to do and you train for it. You go to college or trade school. The ability and knowledge to succeed in a profession in real isn't handed to you on a silver plater either.

Oh yeah, and training in real takes time.

 

[popps]

Well as I said, whatever course EA takes this late in the day carries risk. Go down fighting or roll over and let cheats win. No game developer with any interest in their reputation/shareholders ought to be picking the latter option there.

They've "rolled over" for 13 years, its not going to matter in regards to their reputation any longer.

I cannot remember when EA got Ultima Online and maybe I am wrong in my thinking, but I do not think it was 13 years ago.

For many, this has been part of the game for 13 years, so its highly unlikely they're going to stop all of a sudden.

Well, if it now carries consequences they will need to make a choice and either risk their accounts or stop it.

Lack of risk maybe, but certainly because its what makes the game bearable to play. So many things are either impossible to do in CC or a mess to do in either client. UO has the undisputed most boring training system in the history of MMOs.

There are players out there who enjoy mining, chopping wood or doing BODs or Library Collectibles if their time doing those activities is worth it.
Those who do not enjoy doing those things can well resort to those players who actually want to engage in those activities without any scripting.

Which is why they should have ignored the issue from the get go. Now they lose people regardless of what they do, though likely a lot less if its just a few stratics babies leaving.

Personally, I tend to think "better late than never"....
Besides, fighting the war against cheaters, firmly, can either (hopefully) help UO and also gain a reputation for their games as being anti-cheaters which, for those players who do not enjoy playing their games together with cheaters, might be an added bonus when picking up games to play..........

And why does it need to be taken now? Has anything changed from how things were 5 years ago, 2 years ago, a year ago?

Perhaps now is when they came up with a good and feasible plan ? That they had the resources or people to do it ? It can be many things, who knows, bottom line is, better late then never, IMHO.

UO is alive isn't it? So its obviously worked. UO had its peak of subscribers and massive influx of players when cheating was at its highest as well, so to honestly say that cheating has had any real bearing on subscriber numbers is silly to say the least.

Might be alive but over time it lost many players and, part of the reason was also because of cheaters.

We will never know if a cheat-free Ultima Online can have more players than a cheat-filled Ultima Online until that happens. Before then, it is all speculations and guessing.

Perhaps UO will get more players returning to it to enjoy finally a cheat-free virtual environment, perhaps it will not. We simply do not know.

We can only hope for the better and think that at least, it was or it seemed the right thing to do for the better sake of the game.