Why were REDs left out of this event?

[Emil Ispep]

Thinking about it more w/ no item insurance for Reds.. yea, find/buy and use the cursed Artys. It'll be fun. It will bring back that old element of Risk to the game.. because you'll not only loose everything if you die, you get skill/stat loss too! (maybe you can turn blue when your crimes are repented/justice served when you get killed, with the stat/skill loss.. and it'll give you somthing to do

)

And you still can't go in any town cept Bucs..

And you have to sail there..

Yarr..

 

[Emil Ispep]

Thinking about it more w/ no item insurance for Reds.. yea, find/buy and use the cursed Artys. It'll be fun. It will bring back that old element of Risk to the game.. because you'll not only loose everything if you die, you get skill/stat loss too! (maybe you can turn blue when your crimes are repented/justice served when you get killed, with the stat/skill loss.. and it'll give you somthing to do

)

And you still can't go in any town cept Bucs..

And you have to sail there..

Yarr..

 

[Guest]

This is one of the silly side effects after Tram was set up as a mirror of Fel. We have 1 town where nothing is happening and yet on the other facet the same town has an event. For a RPer it's silly. Never mind for reds who can't get involved. I'm blue and I'd rather be on the Fel side too. I'm sick of moving from my home facet to engage in events. This isn't a penalty for being red, it's one for anyone who just wants to play in Fel.

From the outset, when Tram was opened, we should have had new town names so there was no confusion and ideally some city changes so the facet had a bit of distinction. If nobody cared to produce a truly new land mass, that's the least they should have done.

I wonder if the city does get destroyed, what then happens to the fel side... This is where it gets really daft.

Meet me in Moonglow?
But it's destroyed!
No the one they didn't destroy...
What?!
Fel side is ok... Honest!
But why?
Oh never mind, just get in the freaking gate already!

Wenchy

 

[imported_GalenKnighthawke]

<blockquote><hr>

This is one of the silly side effects after Tram was set up as a mirror of Fel. We have 1 town where nothing is happening and yet on the other facet the same town has an event. For a RPer it's silly.

[/ QUOTE ]

Only one who refuses to acknowledge the official fiction, which was that Nystul used magic to create Trammel so that we could flee from Minax.

-Galen's player

 

[Der Rock]

------------------------------------------
A lot of players MAIN is Red, and they pay the same $12.99 as everyone else does.....
------------------------------------------


????
Red player are for PvP, accurate?
there is NO PvP event, right?
each account have a max. of 7 character slots,correct?
so jump on ure blue character and participate
nothing wrong here in this event.

 

[DrMcguilicudy]

RTLFC

Who cares?

 

[Guest]

You pay for your account like everyone else, true, and your playstyle is to kill other players. If your MAIN character is a murderer then this says to me that you choose to kill players more than anything else.

Sorry but I say just use another character. If theyre all red, this just enforces my idea of you as a murderer (in UO).

I dont kill players, I kill monsters. Thats why I like this event.

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

There's got to be some consequences left for going red. What would you suggest they be?

[/ QUOTE ]Why should there be any consequences?

The people they attacked and killed consented to PvP by deciding to step through a red moongate. Its not like the old days before Tram you know.

I also see zero reason that reds couldn't travel to any facet - and be subject to local rules of course.

[/ QUOTE ]

But Fox didnt you consent to being Fel bound by killing?

Why change the rules now?

 

[Guest]

Hail: There is nothing unclear about it . I play in the event, as i have 4 accounts. But my main account, and my main charater, 117 months old, chose to RPG as a Red and Bandit. Rember, Killing certain NPC's used to count as a Murder Charge also. Yesterday i saw 3 more former players i knew in Fel, Quit.

Why? Because we/they do not cheat, speedhack, dupe, script, use game hacks of any kind. So, it is impossible for a Red player, who will never be able to be blue, to continue in that play style without cheating.

The real options are this.
1. Start cheating.
2. Just go kill monsters, and stay away from the cheaters, if possible.
3. Transfer all his skills to a soulstone, transfer them to a blue charater, and delete your 10 year old main charater.

Punishment for being RED should be from the game mechanics, and in a RPG type way. Not, No access to events, no access to expansions, no access to expanded housing area's, almost NO NOTHING. Oh, btw, since we will not let you become blue, please choose one of the above 3 options. I have not, but as you can tell, a lot of others did choose one of those options.

What if the game took your main charater away, A Tamer" as example? Made it so any Pet Kill, no matter how it was done, makes the corps lootable by anyone, right after the kill?
You would cry your butt off. And if someone said, "Hey, you choose to let your pets kill for you", this is the penalty for that. And it does not matter if that was NOT the way it used to be, that is the way it is now, stop crying.......

Come on Tamers, respond to that&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;

 

[Guest]

RTLFC

I am SO sick of people using the old "Well that's what you get for going red" line. Not all reds are bad, and not all blues are good. Don't believe me? Log onto Siege some time. (No, I don't play on Siege.)

My 2 main characters are red. They got that way from defending spawns, not from running around randomly killing anyone and everyone I saw. Also, the "You can participate when we can get scrolls in Trammel" thing is a line of garbage too. Blues are free to go into Fel and at least attempt to get scrolls. Reds do NOT have the same ability to participate in this event. Stop comparing apples to oranges when it suits your agenda.

 

[Guest]

Guards are not working on the tram side anyway. Mongbats are attacking all with no attacks from guards.

 

[Setnaffa]

Reds are PvP characters. This is a PvM event. If you want to participate, create a PvM character and join in.

I do wish EA would stage some PvP events. Maybe some kind of sanctioned tournaments with rules (built-in rules) and prizes.

 

[Fayled Dhreams]

Why were REDs left out of this event?

why don't blue's Rule Fel?

Cause there is NO "player justice"

Life just ain't fair

Which on further reflection ... 'tis a good thing ...

IF life were fair ... then allllll the "bad things" that happen in each and every course ...

would be deserved

Heh!

and still complained about and moaned and wailed ... ie ...

no different

 

[RaDian FlGith]

<blockquote><hr>

yes then you have the wanna be pvper following you around going im l33t i could kick your @$$ and griefing you all day long ive been here almost since day one i remember what its like i pvped all the time with no choice always someone who is gonna rock my world i think for game play purposes its fine the way it is pvpers have there world we have ours the problem with the pvpers is they only have each other to fight now and thats not near as much fun as killing someone who cant defend themselves you could make resources 100 times the regular amount and you have fun with that ill stay where im at fell can go to well you know what i mean

[/ QUOTE ]Once again... YOU would set the flag. If you really think someone would follow you around going, "Flag, I'll kick your ass!" then you're really missing the fact that this happens in Trammel anyway (ie: "Come to Felucca where I'll kick your ass!").

I was here in October 1997 myself. I know what it was like. Nowhere did I suggest reverting to the old days of "everyone has to be involved in PvP whether they like it or not." I simply suggested that a PvP flag (ie: one you control) would allow them to do away with Felucca and open up the world to everyone to play in.

Additionally -- if they really wanted to make PvP challenge areas, they could do like other games have done and have PvP+ specific areas (that would likely be hosted on a separate server much like the dungeons are hosted on dungeon servers), and that could warn you "Hey, you're entering a PvP+ area.

Obviously any system would have to be adapted to fit UO. But the one we've got now is broken, outdated, and based on old dogmas that no longer even apply to the game.

 

[RaDian FlGith]

<blockquote><hr>

I hate to disagree but consentual PvP wont work mostly because alot of PKs would hate it. You have a large number of them who only pick fights they know they can win (IE killing a miner trying to get some extra ingots) and avoid ones they have a chance of losing. It would burn them up if some trammy comes along with his pvp turned off and says "no thanx, i'm just here for some frostwood." LOL!

[/ QUOTE ]It might drive some of those people off, but I think you'd actually find an INCREASE in PvP.

The flagging system would have to be set so that you couldn't just turn it off to avoid a fight. Like, you turn it off, and five minutes later you deflag, as an example.

But I don't think a majority of the PvPers would go "Oh no... now I can go anywhere and look for a fight... Forget it!" I think that people who TRULY enjoy PvP enjoy the PvP aspect of it, not specifically the ganking aspect of it. Sure... there are some who do nothing but gank, and that's fine too... but really, I think the overall PvP community enjoys the PvP aspect, not the gank aspect.

 

[RaDian FlGith]

<blockquote><hr>

Because they're bad, bad people, and most likely in league with the Shadowlords.

[/ QUOTE ]This comment, while obviously meant with wit, is the epitomized issue with the whole red system as it stands. And I have to be honest, these days, even &gt;I&lt; forget that not all reds are jerkwads.

I've been red before.

It was through defending other players, and doing things like taking out blue healers (which can still happen, because the gray-blue timer's still borked), and yeah, it sucked, but even today, there exist reds who are every bit as fun to sit down and talk to as they were back in the day.

Being red != being evil. But in UO, that's the perception, and perception becomes reality. Which is yet another reason this overly tired system needs a SERIOUS upgrade. And hey, maybe if they upgraded it, their subscription numbers might go up as old PvPers came back to check out what's going on. *shrug* Not that they have the staff to devote to programming these days.

 

[Der Rock]

--------------------------------------------------
PvP flag (ie: one you control) would allow them to do away with Felucca and open up the world to everyone to play in.
---------------------------------------------------------

i posted for a pvp button years ago,
never understood why ea rather let player quit the game in hordes as implement a pvp switch or a pvp area

 

[RaDian FlGith]

<blockquote><hr>

Red player are for PvP, accurate?

[/ QUOTE ]Right... here's a strange notion for all you Black &amp; White people...

There are, indeed, different colors in the universe, and something called shades too...

Which is to say, have you ever considered that PvPers might also enjoy PvM? That PvP and PvM don't have to be exclusive of each other?

Of course you didn't. Red's are bad.

 

[RaDian FlGith]

<blockquote><hr>

Reds are PvP characters. This is a PvM event. If you want to participate, create a PvM character and join in.

[/ QUOTE ]Wow. Even the mods are in on this whole black and white thing.

I'd hate to see some of you deliberating whether a glass was half empty or half full. One side would start screaming that it contains 50% volume, and the other side would start screaming that it's simply 50% empty.

I don't even have a red anymore (and haven't had since, gee, I don't know, maybe 2000 was the last time one of my characters was red), and ya'all drive me crazy with your single-sided, overly jaded views of things.

Hey, did you know there's another effect of having gone red in 2000? In 2008, any vendors that character places pay 3x or 5x (I don't remember which) the vendor fees because you were once red. Right. EIGHT freaking years ago. But that's the typical mindset of this borked system. Black and white.

 

[RaDian FlGith]

<blockquote><hr>

i posted for a pvp button years ago,
never understood why ea rather let player quit the game in hordes as implement a pvp switch or a pvp area

[/ QUOTE ]Because EA likes to hemorrhage customers. One wouldn't think so, but then, given UO's history, it would be extremly hard to deny it to be true.

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

Only one who refuses to acknowledge the official fiction, which was that Nystul used magic to create Trammel so that we could flee from Minax.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ah so that's the excuse is it? In the interests of making a good MMORPG, I don't agree that we should have stuck to the fiction in that case. It's boring to mirror maps, and it's a joke to RP around. I've had this problem umpteen times, folks rushing to warn my guild about some evil sweeping the lands. Then it turns out they're not sweeping our lands, but somewhere in Tram instead.

I've rushed to places so many times, then realized it's Tram I should be in. And that's packed out with antisocial kids screaming "gimmie sash!!!" at the poor EM/GM etc. The fiction doesn't justify this, we've veered from fiction before. It's just daft, frustrating and I'm sick of being pulled out of Fel just to take part in an event.

Wenchy

 

[Der Rock]

-------------------------------------------
Which is to say, have you ever considered that PvPers might also enjoy PvM? That PvP and PvM don't have to be exclusive of each other?

Of course you didn't. Red's are bad.
------------------------------------------------------------

yes i have,
and no, i never say red´s are bad
i am up for it, if red´s could go to trammel,as long as they have to play under trammel rules.
i only say, begging for weaker opponents into a pvp area under the suggestiuon of a demand for event content in fel, is not the nicest behavior.
dont misunderstand me in this case

 

[Guest]

Normally they DO put many of the events on both facets. Magincia was, the prior Moonglow ones all were etc.

Maybe they can respond to your query ? !

I know when they tauted the ML expansion that Heartwood was part of buy it now u too can enter Heartwood but only if you buy said expansion. Then when it went live ..Siege found out the reds could not enter Heartwood..after EA got their rl money for buying said expansion. NO where in the buyin did it state REDS could not enter Heartwood least none anyone recalled seeing. To tell em they could use Sanctuary much uglier..when maybe their red is a crafter oddly that needed a recipe easier to get in Heartwood and they DID pay for expansion.

After some outrage HERE Siege reds were able to enter Heartwood. *since we only have ONE Heartwood not two. I can not recall if that also permitted reds to enter Heartwood on the other shards or not.

But when they *mirrored* the game to two facets *usually* what they put on one facet they also put onto the other facet ..save for.......all aos lands all se lands and etc. There were 2 Hearwoods though so no logical reasoning to keep reds out of the FEL Heartwood if some one so paranoid to enter then the fel Heartwood at least all shards also HAD the tram Heartwood to use..unlike Siege.

So no clue why when they do events some surely ARE duplicated on both facets and some never are ! Guess they forgot..or had some *reason* but yes if a customer is paying the same..to some degree when they can *mirror* on two facets why they do not always do so..esp with smaller things like temporary events. There ARE 2 Moonglows/mirrored ..so they could use both.

 

[Guest]

*Read half of the thread*
*Feels sick of listen to the "red is bad BS"*
*Remember why she hate Trammel shards*
*Wonder why so many so many reds can stand this, why they don't move to Siege*

Siege do allow reds to join all events
Siege do allow reds to go to all facets
Om Siege actions count more than color.
Don't waste more time on Trammel shards, they are not worth it if you love to PvP or just love PvP to be a part of the game.

*Walks away from the thread with a sick feeling in her stomach*

 

[Guest]

Maybe a justified gripe for having a red main char ...but surely nobody as got an account with purely 6 red chars...that would be plain silly if not totally impractable to play the whole game?

 

[BadManiac]

<blockquote><hr>

*Feels sick of listen to the "red is bad BS"*

[/ QUOTE ]Might wanna talk to Richard Garriot, you know, the guy that made the entire Ultima series and the guy that wrote the virtues, about that...

Red IS bad, there SHOULD be drawbacks to being red, in fact originally the game was designed so that reds would have literally NO advantages, and they were not able to take part in ANY of the regular gameplay. They have been more than generous enough with reds over the years. Nothing short of giving reads a weapon that kills everyone in Trammel and dry loots them all is going to make reds happy.

Close Fel on all production shards, give all players a one way free char transfer to a fel only shard, for all their characters. Fel on regular shards will never work, period.

 

[Lady Tyg]

<blockquote><hr>

Might wanna talk to Richard Garriot, you know, the guy that made the entire Ultima series and the guy that wrote the virtues, about that...

[/ QUOTE ]

You mean the same guy that left before trammel was created?

 

[Lord Kotan]

<blockquote><hr>

There's got to be some consequences left for going red. What would you suggest they be?

[/ QUOTE ]

Character deletion

 

[BadManiac]

<blockquote><hr>

You mean the same guy that left before trammel was created?

[/ QUOTE ]When there were still HUGE drawbacks to being red. Yes the one and same.

 

[Guest]

Close Fel on all production shards, give all players a one way free char transfer to a fel only shard, for all their characters. Fel on regular shards will never work, period.
---------

You do realise that such blanket statements would close down some very historic player run towns that STILL function and may not even have REDS nor pks at all on their roster at all. To close down the fel side of any existing shard for some *fel only shard* is denying each shard their own unique history of the *original* land and the player towns still existing upon them. Fel works where and when players permit it to work and if one is not interested to go there on any shard ........the option is there NOT to go there.

There is a relatively large massive *still* alive player run town on Chesapeake for prime example ..so by your statement that would be exterminated and gone if fel side were to close down or players be told transfer to some shard we are going to make just for fel. It would negate entire player run towns existance that still exist. . and all the history behind and still in them all. One of the main large towers in that fel town on Chesapeake has a plaque signed by *Lord British* himself.......so where would all the go if they just shut down fel on all shards and told every GO play this newbie fel only shard that they would be making ?? Obviously some look at the fel side as only some hellhole per shard..others see some very wonderful player run towns full of players, in still functioning player run cities yes less populated than in olden times but still there still alive still used...oft by roleplayers not even pks pvpers nor pvpmers or a wonderous collection of ALL of that on one pile of tiles choc full of shard history like on Chesapeake and the fel side player run towns STILL there...10 yrs old ! That can not be found on some newbie shard they make just to satisfy some whom want *fel* removed from their sight...dont GO there ya wont have to SEE it..option is there as it is now to go or not go or to remain tram side.

IF one does not wish to be or go into felucca they do not HAVE TO, leave it as is where it is not dissolve it for some no history newbie new UO shard last thing EA needs to do is waste time money to make some new fel only new no history in em shards ..when they need to fill up the shards they DO have..all across the board.

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

I'm actually rather surprised to hear there isn't a Fel version - looking at the world maps (in KR), it looks like Fel has an alternate Moonglow on it, ready to go.

[/ QUOTE ]Yes... how promising...

 

[Lady Tyg]

It is rather ironic that you mention the creator of UO that envisioned a world that was based on risk and reward where all types of people played together in one world. But then call for the banishment of his original creation of the game.

 

[RaDian FlGith]

<blockquote><hr>

Maybe a justified gripe for having a red main char ...but surely nobody as got an account with purely 6 red chars...that would be plain silly if not totally impractable to play the whole game?

[/ QUOTE ]Would it surprise you to know then that in 10 years of playing UO, I have precisely 2 "complete" characters, and 1 crafter? No tamer, no bard, not even a complete thief. One mage, one warrior. That's the extent of my fully developed characters.

Six character slots does not mean that everyone plays 6 characters. I could have survived on UO with one character slot per account, honestly.

Which is to say that just because someone has 6 character slots doesn't mean they have (or should be obliged to have) a red and a blue both fully developed.

 

[RaDian FlGith]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

*Feels sick of listen to the "red is bad BS"*

[/ QUOTE ]Might wanna talk to Richard Garriot, you know, the guy that made the entire Ultima series and the guy that wrote the virtues, about that...

Red IS bad, there SHOULD be drawbacks to being red, in fact originally the game was designed so that reds would have literally NO advantages, and they were not able to take part in ANY of the regular gameplay.

[/ QUOTE ]Clearly you're reciting rhetoric that you weren't actually around to participate in.

First, and foremost, you should be aware that our current fame/karma system is the REPLACEMENT system for the old notoriety system that, because it did not work properly, was replaced. Just because something is designed in a particular way does not mean it is the most logical progression that one could take -- it just means it's what made sense at the time.

And many UO designers of the past (and who knows, maybe of the present) have acknowledged that the current system is imperfect and that reds do not always become red through "bad" actions.

So, uh, seriously... stop running around with the idea that RED = BAD. It only shows the limits of your intellect.

 

[RaDian FlGith]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

I'm actually rather surprised to hear there isn't a Fel version - looking at the world maps (in KR), it looks like Fel has an alternate Moonglow on it, ready to go.

[/ QUOTE ]Yes... how promising...

[/ QUOTE ]How about commenting on maybe giving the PvP system a major overhaul?

Right. Not enough time.

 

[BadManiac]

The thing my dear friend is I did play back then, that is WHY I have a very firm and unshakable belief that red = BAD. Because as soon as anything red showed up on your screen, you lost everything you had gethered during your hunt, plus all your armor, weapons, potions, bandages and all other items, and to top it all of the red then proceeds to either mock you, or make sure that you died again as soon as you found the nearest shrine or wandering healer.

Red back then was, to many players, the end of that UO session, and meant a few hours of the next day gathering gold to buy new equipment. THAT is why many people, me included have and will always hate reds, passionately.

 

[RaDian FlGith]

<blockquote><hr>

The thing my dear friend is I did play back then, that is WHY I have a very firm and unshakable belief that red = BAD. Because as soon as anything red showed up on your screen, you lost everything you had gethered during your hunt, plus all your armor, weapons, potions, bandages and all other items, and to top it all of the red then proceeds to either mock you, or make sure that you died again as soon as you found the nearest shrine or wandering healer.

Red back then was, to many players, the end of that UO session, and meant a few hours of the next day gathering gold to buy new equipment. THAT is why many people, me included have and will always hate reds, passionately.

[/ QUOTE ]And unless you happened to be on a server occupied by nothing but 12-year-olds, you're broad-stroking more broad-strokes than an Olympic swimmer.

I used to be an anti-PK. Believe me, I KNOW how some/many of them were, but they weren't ALL like that. I've also acknowledged the past problems. However, that doesn't mean that because of a gameplay style that existed prior to 2000 has to be the culminating factor in any decision regarding making PvP better.

And really, I don't care how many people reds killed... the idea of "You're red, you're bad" is still stupid, and frankly, tired. Get over it. Learn to view things from outside of your pretty little pink-ribboned box and give other people's opinions more than a "I'm right, you're wrong" shake.

 

[imported_GalenKnighthawke]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

Only one who refuses to acknowledge the official fiction, which was that Nystul used magic to create Trammel so that we could flee from Minax.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ah so that's the excuse is it? In the interests of making a good MMORPG, I don't agree that we should have stuck to the fiction in that case. It's boring to mirror maps, and it's a joke to RP around. I've had this problem umpteen times, folks rushing to warn my guild about some evil sweeping the lands. Then it turns out they're not sweeping our lands, but somewhere in Tram instead.

I've rushed to places so many times, then realized it's Tram I should be in. And that's packed out with antisocial kids screaming "gimmie sash!!!" at the poor EM/GM etc. The fiction doesn't justify this, we've veered from fiction before. It's just daft, frustrating and I'm sick of being pulled out of Fel just to take part in an event.

Wenchy

[/ QUOTE ]


Well there you go.....lol...When you're willing to ignore anything that goes against you wanting to remain in Fel, there's no limit. There are people who play UO and RP under a Star Wars mythology. So hey, knock yourself out....

What's sad, though, is that you are so insulting to people who (shock!!!) like to stick to the fiction of the game we're actually playing, to every extent practicable.

I was on Europa for awhile some years back. Had a grand time there, got to participate in a lot of great RP. (Galen was one of the ones who dug what may, or may not, have been TwoThumbs's corpse out from under his mansion near Vesper.) Got to be in some great fights in Felucca too, fought the Apple Infantry many times.

When I was on Europa anyway, I had no impression that the official fiction was generally ignored. It'd be a shame if that's changed.

-Galen's player

 

[Fayled Dhreams]

<blockquote><hr>


And really, I don't care how many people reds killed... the idea of "You're red, you're bad" is still stupid, and frankly, tired. Get over it. Learn to view things from outside of your pretty little pink-ribboned box and give other people's opinions more than a "I'm right, you're wrong" shake.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well then ...'twould seem tis the ball IS in your court ... bring on these "better" red participating events ... in fel ...

would be a welcome change from dealing with the yammering trammies ... the gimme gimme's ...

bring it ...

oh ...

you want the devs to do "it" for you ... ...like ...

more than a "I'm right, you're wrong" shake ...done

now bring it

 

[Setnaffa]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

Reds are PvP characters. This is a PvM event. If you want to participate, create a PvM character and join in.

[/ QUOTE ]Wow. Even the mods are in on this whole black and white thing.

[/ QUOTE ]Why are you rambling on about Black and White? It's <font color="red">Red</font> and <font color="blue">Blue</font>. This is a PvM event in Trammel. There's nothing discriminatory here. <font color="red">Reds</font> chose to be <font color="red">red</font> and they knew they couldn't go to trammel. I have <font color="red">red</font> and <font color="blue">blue</font> characters, so I'm just using my PvM Paly for this.

Now if the question had been asked "Why isn't there a version of this event in Felucca?" then I would have answered differently, because I believe the event should have been in both facets.

 

[imported_mr.blackmage]

I think the issue is deeper than it just being reds not being allowed, and is moreso the fact that the red "murderer" status means absolutely nothing now. It is an archaic system, and only reverting the game or changing the pvp system would resolve this. The system died when trammel was created, so it's been quite awhile now.

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

Might wanna talk to Richard Garriot, you know, the guy that made the entire Ultima series and the guy that wrote the virtues, about that...

[/ QUOTE ]

You mean the same guy that left before trammel was created?

[/ QUOTE ]

My thoughts too. I feel he left because Trammel would destroy the world he tryed to create and it sure did.

Trammel should never had been added to normal shards, Devs should had made a few non PvP shards but with roaming red npc and monsters to fill the role of the PK's.

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

Close Fel on all production shards, give all players a one way free char transfer to a fel only shard, for all their characters. Fel on regular shards will never work, period.

[/ QUOTE ]

I do agree with this and I had said it for years.

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

The thing my dear friend is I did play back then, that is WHY I have a very firm and unshakable belief that red = BAD. Because as soon as anything red showed up on your screen, you lost everything you had gethered during your hunt, plus all your armor, weapons, potions, bandages and all other items, and to top it all of the red then proceeds to either mock you, or make sure that you died again as soon as you found the nearest shrine or wandering healer.

[/ QUOTE ]

That quote clear tells, that you did not play back than or you stayed in town and if you ever walked out of town, you did follow the roads where brigands would hang out to rob you.

I lived in East Brit and hunted in Covetues or the east brit forest. True, there was alot of reds but only few of them would dry loot you, grief you or rez kill you. Most of the reds I meet never killed me more than one time, maybe because I tryed to learn to know tham instead of showing them disrespect and trash talking them.

Dying is not always bad, special not if the red turn out to be a cool guy, willing to tell/teach you how to be better to fight.
A 1 vs 1 fight took more than 10 sec at that time, if you was running around with both potions and bandages, and I guess some magery for recall too, why did you not use it to fight or at least stay alive.

I don't think you ever did leave town.

<blockquote><hr>

Red back then was, to many players, the end of that UO session, and meant a few hours of the next day gathering gold to buy new equipment. THAT is why many people, me included have and will always hate reds, passionately.

[/ QUOTE ]

You hate reds because your fear was to strong and you never got to know any of them or learned the joy from fighting them back and maybe kill them or at least gain respect from them from trying.

I do not say, that UO back then was for all, but I loved every minut of it and I was not red yet. Thieves and Reds was a part of the game and should always be.

Just make non PvP too, shards where the Thives and the PK are red npc's roaming the land.

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

Reds are PvP characters. This is a PvM event. If you want to participate, create a PvM character and join in.

[/ QUOTE ]Wow. Even the mods are in on this whole black and white thing.

[/ QUOTE ]Why are you rambling on about Black and White? It's <font color="red">Red</font> and <font color="blue">Blue</font>. This is a PvM event in Trammel. There's nothing discriminatory here. <font color="red">Reds</font> chose to be <font color="red">red</font> and they knew they couldn't go to trammel. I have <font color="red">red</font> and <font color="blue">blue</font> characters, so I'm just using my PvM Paly for this.

[/ QUOTE ]

Who say reds do not PvM?
When UDL still was on Siege, several very deadly reds would also farm for gold and items and they sure know how to get money and PvP gear that way.

In the Siege version of the event, red and blue enemies are seen fight side by side to beat the spawn. Siege had before finished events like this before most of the Trammel shards.

Reds love PvP but that do not mean they never do PvM.

The world are not black and white or red and blue. The UO world is blue, red, orange, grey and green.

<blockquote><hr>

Now if the question had been asked "Why isn't there a version of this event in Felucca?" then I would have answered differently, because I believe the event should have been in both facets.

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe the Fel version will start when the Trammel version is done and we will hear a mega cry out from Trammel players saying it's unfair that they can't join.

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

Well there you go.....lol...When you're willing to ignore anything that goes against you wanting to remain in Fel, there's no limit. There are people who play UO and RP under a Star Wars mythology. So hey, knock yourself out....

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't ignore the fiction of UO, I just don't read up every little thing about it, or bash folk over the head with it. I RP my chars in the situation they find themselves in, not as mini historians. I'm more interested in RL history so that's what I'll research and use to play characters. Languages too. But as my chars haven't been scholars, there just wasn't a need for me to really read the lore. It's as simple as that I've dipped into it quite a bit, but I certainly wouldn't try quoting it. I also avoid beating anyone with rulebooks and fiction, because I'm in UO to RP not argue over books. UO is a constantly changing game, which reflects the players actions as well as the lore.

What I was trying to say was that in the interests of a game that is easier to RP in and makes sense, we shouldn't have duplicate cities that are partly duplicated but partly different. That are sometimes both involved in an event, yet excluded for others. With no explanation. At the very least there should be an explanation, and a good reason for it. The devs should use the game fiction, but ensure that the event is open to all, not just those who like Tram. Their job is to bring their ideas to us all, not just the Tram residents.

If the shoe was on the other foot and Fel got all the action, you know full well there'd be a LOT of crying on the boards about it. But it's ok to mess with Fel. Yes I'm angry. UO grew from Fel, yet it's the least supported facet of them all. Again, if the shoe was on the other foot you'd be screaming blue murder. The “we want new content/events” crowd would have closed accounts years ago if they were Fel players lol.

Wenchy

 

[imported_Desolation87]

Lmao. Can't believe how many people are trying to justify murder...

I'm sure some real smart person will say, in a war people kill people. Yes and if your guild is at war you can kill without penalty.

Jeez, to say that go around murdering(and turning red) isn't bad. Wake up!!!

 

[Chango Pelon]

Part of the reason I left Baja was because of the 4 count murderers in a certain guild. You know, the MURDERS who use the game mechanics just enough without having to face the consequences. To me, those are the worse then reds. At least with a red you KNOW what their intention is. Try talking to a couple blues and have them kill you then say "I need to macro before doing that again, lolzerz" "yeah, what a noob."

I don't know how many times I helped strange people while being on my red. Now if you were on the seas...

So again, Red is not ALWAYS bad, and Blue are not ALWAYS good.

 

[Razeial]

RTLFC..

Reds were left out of the event because we have an extremely inconsiderate and horrible dev team. For the past 6 years PvP has been utterly neglected. When this game debuted, PvP was taken into great consideration, the original dev team recognized that not everyone wants to fight monsters or craft things day in and day out. If ANY of you played the original Ultima series, then you would know how extremely difficult it was to take out a thief or a murderer. All I hear from whiny trammelites is "PLEASE GIVE US ALL THE ADVANTAGES IN THE WORLD TO KILLING REDS BECAUSE WE ARE ALWAYS RIGHT". Seriously, why should reds be penalized for being red, because we're different? That is so reflective of the whole "you have to look like a supermodel or you're ugly" complex that has disgustingly engulfed Americans. If i want to be fat as a elephant, should i be outcasted, penalized and ostricized for it? No. You all should say, "hey, good for you. You found something you like doing/being. It's not for me, but more power to you"

Personally, i think Felucca should be dictated BY the reds. If you step out of that moongate, expect to be griefed, murdered, looted, and asked to try again. Guard zones should not exist in this oh so neglected facet. Champ spawns aren't even a valid argument any more. With the amount of gold scripters that STILL exist (despite the devs valiant yet unsuccessful attempt to stop it) all a little trammy char has to do is go into Luna and buy it. Don't have gold? Don't worry, you can buy it online (from those same gold scripters mind you). Reds have been shafted so many ways it's not even funny.

Penalties:
Cannot go to any other facet.
Cannot buy from NPCs.
Cannot use virtues
Can be attacked in guard zones, almost without being able to defend themselves.

Rewards :

None. Other than the pure satisfaction of the fight, which half the time, isn't worth it


UO used to have a balanced PvM AND PvP system. AoS killed that, quick fast and in a hurry. This game transfered from skill-based to item-based. What a waste. But what do the devs keep doing? Adding more items. They couldn't even get things like bushido (which historically is horseback archery) and ninjitsu (which does NOT mean "Ninja") right. Reds should have SOME setbacks. Stat loss worked in the old days because this game wasn't item based. Bounty system worked in the olds days because this game wasn't item based. You want reds to have stat loss? Then you don't get to use an orny or pet in PvP. Hows that? You want to make it fair? Remove the necessity for items in PvP, and the game will INSTANTLY be balanced. Leave reds alone, we haven't gotten a break in 7 years. All you pvm/trammy types want to make it to where we can't even survive just because you don't like the way we play. Everyone uses the "Murderers are penalized for RP reasons". Guess what, the Post-Pub16 abomination we call a development team killed that aswell. This game doesn't even REMOTELY follow the original story line created by Richard Garriot.Thanks EA!!!

*end rant*

*let the flaming wars begin*

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

Lmao. Can't believe how many people are trying to justify murder...

I'm sure some real smart person will say, in a war people kill people. Yes and if your guild is at war you can kill without penalty.

Jeez, to say that go around murdering(and turning red) isn't bad. Wake up!!!

[/ QUOTE ]

Why does wanting events in Fel justify murder? I don't even have a red. I just prefer my home facet sometimes. I would love to see a change to the reputation system so there was a point to fighting reds, not where reds are given everything on a plate. But whether you like the playstyle or not, it doesn't change the fact that we also pay our subs and Fel should see all, not some, of the event content.

Wenchy