Guys - would it be better if you discussed the 'material bonuses' idea in its own thread? Even if it should be adapted by the devs, it's not likely to be a part of publish 81?
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False in my opinion. most try to use the metal/leather type that gives the best amount of resist, but sometimes it is not necessary. I actually use horned and verite more than val and barbed, for instance.
Well.. let me re-phrase that. if you are into enhancing after imbuing, then this is how its best done. if you just go on material bonus without an enhance, then ya, you will want to aim for the higher of the resists more than likely.
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Okay then make it LMC, or SDI, or whatever. If I were actually developing this idea as a publish, either for a private shard or in a magical fantasy world where I was the boss of real UO, I'd tell you to relax because most of those bonuses wouldn't survive playtesting in their current forms anyway.
No one is going to sit around thinking hard about whether they want HCI or DCI (or whatever) as their bonus if it doesn't go over the cap. They're just going to pick whichever is cheaper and then imbue that much less of it on their jewelry. If the bonuses don't go over the caps then they're all just fancy ways of handing out a few free imbuing points, and if you're going to do that then you may as well skip the pretense and just increase the imbuing points on armor.
I greatly suspect that this is the reason they changed inherent LMC to let it go over the cap. A plate warrior with an extra 5 LMC that doesn't go over the cap just imbues (or otherwise obtains) 7 instead of 8 LMC on a bunch of his gear and otherwise goes on like nothing has changed.
Plus, look, let's not pretend that UO is such a precision-balanced game that this or that small percentage bonus is going to destroy things. I just ran the math, and do you know what an advantage of 12 HCI, for example, actually gives you against an otherwise equal opponent? Your chances of actually hitting go from 50% to 54%. Oh noes how will anyone cope?
If anything I worry that these bonuses might be too small to matter much.
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Scrap the new system and just make all new exceptional armor medable. This new exceptional medable armor mod will not count against it when imbueing. Simple for everyone to understand and shouldnt be to hard to code. Tweek the caps of the other mods (hld, hla, lmc, etc) to simulate the new system.
Here is my final draft for incorporating Players Feedback into Dev’s Publish 81. It has taken me a long time but I’ve added subtle changes to how HLD is calculated, Mage Armor works and included a new inherent quality on Clothing Jewelry and Light Armor (which was always there just not specified). The numbers properties, how they are calculated should all be the same as the Dev's Changes. Assuming I did this right, it will look like nothing is different and it will hopefully help the players understand the details of the changes in Pub 81. If you are confused already, then I probably messed up (this does not include any feedback not directly in Publish 81)
This does not include any of the community thoughts on different properties or changes people wanted in Pub. 81, it just addresses what was given in Publish 81 and issues discovered during testing. I am not trying to start a debate about what would be better then publish 81 rather if this fixes the issues that had arisen in testing.
-Lore's Player
PUBLISH [81.Players]
Armor has inherent properties based on its type: Clothing/Jewelry, Light, Medium or Heavy. The total bonus from each will be derived from the 5 pieces of with the highest modifier to each inherent bonus.
-----------------------[Med]---- [Defense Cap Increase] -----------[Stamina Protection]-------- [LMC Bonus]
Clothing/Jewelry:-- Yes ----------------10%----------------------------------No-------------------------------No
Light Armor: -------Yes ----------------10% ------------------------------Yes(Light)--------------------------No
Medium Armor:---- No#------------Refinement*(1-10)-----------------Yes (Medium) -----------------Yes (3%)
Heavy Armor: ------No# -----------Refinement*(1-10) -----------------Yes (Heavy) -------------------Yes (1%)
*Refinement is a process which allows an increase of max resistances in exchange for lowering Defense Cap or Increasing Defense Cap at the cost of max resistances.
#Mage Armor: Armor with this property allows the wearer to absorb mana using the mediation skill. In exchange it will lose a level of stamina protection and -1 to its inherent Lower Mana Cost. The armor retains the ability to be Refined.
Clothing & Jewelry: Regular clothing, jewelry and enchanted items occupying an armor slot. These items are naturally medable, and increase the wearers Defense Cap. They provide no protection against stamina loss and can not be Refined.
Light Armor:Armor crafted from light materials such as leaf, leather and Cloth. This Armor is naturally medable and gives a bonus to a player’s Defense Cap. Light armor provides a small measure of protection against stamina loss, and can not be Refined.[Includes Leather, Leaf and Clothe Armor Types]
Medium Amor: Armor crafted from medium weight materials such as, Studded, Bone, andHide. Thisarmor is not naturally medable but provides the highest inherent bonus to lower mana cost and good protection from Stamina loss. Medium armor is Refineable*. [Includes Studded, Bone, Hide, Wood* ]
*Due to the magical nature and procedure of creating woodland armor, Armor has No Inhernet Lower Mana Cost but does retain its stamina protection.
Heavy Armor: Crafted from the heaviest materials and such as Stone, Metal and Wood. This armor is not naturally medable. Heavy Armor provides the highest amount of stamina protection while giving a small bonus to Lower Mana Cost. Heavy armor is Refineable*. [Plate, Chain, Stone, Scale]
Question & Answer:
Q: What’s the difference between Defense Chance, and Defense Cap?
A: Defense Chance: the amount of Defense Chance Increase you receive from items and spells capped at 45.
Defense Cap: the maximum amount of Defense Chance Increase can you achieve over the 45 effective cap. Your Defense Cap is derived from 5 items that will give you the highest amount. Completely unarmored in just clothes and jewels (or naked for that matter) you would have the highest Defense Chance Cap Attainable (95). On the low end with a refined suit you would have a cap of (-5).
Defense Cap = (Defense Chance Increase Cap (45) + (5 Highest Defense Cap Increase Pieces)
Q: Why would anyone want 95 Defense Chance if I can only take advantage of 45??
A: There are magical effects in game that can lower your Defense
Chance. By increasing your defense chance cap and using items
with the defense chance increase property, a character can reduce
the negative effects. Your Defense Chance Increase will never be
higher then your Defense Cap but your Cap could be higher then the
amount of Defense Chance Increase you have available.
Q: How do I calculate my Defense Cap?
A: Defense Cap = (Defense Increase Cap[45]) + (5 highest Defense Cap Increase Pieces[range from 0-10)
Q: Can you give me an example… my character has an all leather suit except for DCI 25 glasses and a Lav necklace and has a total of 80 DCI.
A: First start with your base of 45. Now find your 5 pieces that will give you the highest Defense Cap Increase. Start with any clothing and jewels that occupy an armor slot.
You have two, glasses and Lav. These are both considered Clothing/Jewels and add 11 to your Cap. Now the rest of your armor is Leather so we will take into account 3 leather pieces that raise your cap by 10 each.
So 45(DCI CAP)+10(Lav)+10(Glasses)+ (10)legs+ (10)Chest+(10)arms = 95 Total Defense Cap.
This means you have an effective Defense Chance of 45 and can take advantage of all 80 of your Defense Chance Increase (up to 95 if you could fit it in) to Buffer Defense lowering effects.
Q: If I wear Plate and don’t do any refinement what is my Defense Chance Cap?
A: Your Defense Cap will be 45 so you can still take full advantage of Defense Chance increase, however you will not be able to overcap to buffer negative effects unless you Refine your armor.
Q: What happens if I get hit with HLD, I heard it now takes away 55% but it wasn’t working right when I tried it on Test?
A: Hit Lower Defense will take 55% from your Defense Chance up to your Total Defense Cap… meaning for you 55% of 80. If you had 95 Defense Chance Increase is equal to your Defense Cap, Hit Lower Defense would take 55% of 95.
Q: Can I become Hit Lower Defense Proof like before?
A: No, though 55% of 95 = 43 DCI so under the effects of HLD
you’d be only 2 points lower in your defense chance which is capped
at 45. Significantly protected but still a little under the cap.
Q: Isn't Hit Lower Defense super powerful now?
A: Its less powerful until you hit 45 Defense chance where they are both the same and more effective after that point.
Q: Why use light armor when I can Refine medium and Heavy Armor to the same level and also receive benefits of LMC and Stamina Protection, that seems overpowered!
A: Light Armors natural Defense Cap Increase doesn’t come at the cost of losing max resistances whereas Refining Heavy or Medium armor to that level would require losing 5 max resistances per piece. Heavy and Medium armor are also not naturally medable and you would have to sacrifice a mod to gain the ability as well as lose some of the benefits of both Lower Mana Cost and Stamina Protection.
This does not include any of the community thoughts on different properties or changes people wanted in Pub. 81, it just addresses what was given in Publish 81 and issues discovered during testing. I am not trying to start a debate about what would be better then publish 81 rather if this fixes the issues that had arisen in testing.
-Lore's Player
PUBLISH [81.Players]
Armor has inherent properties based on its type: Clothing/Jewelry, Light, Medium or Heavy. The total bonus from each will be derived from the 5 pieces of with the highest modifier to each inherent bonus.
-----------------------[Med]---- [Defense Cap Increase] -----------[Stamina Protection]-------- [LMC Bonus]
Clothing/Jewelry:-- Yes ----------------10%----------------------------------No-------------------------------No
Light Armor: -------Yes ----------------10% ------------------------------Yes(Light)--------------------------No
Medium Armor:---- No#------------Refinement*(1-10)-----------------Yes (Medium) -----------------Yes (3%)
Heavy Armor: ------No# -----------Refinement*(1-10) -----------------Yes (Heavy) -------------------Yes (1%)
*Refinement is a process which allows an increase of max resistances in exchange for lowering Defense Cap or Increasing Defense Cap at the cost of max resistances.
#Mage Armor: Armor with this property allows the wearer to absorb mana using the mediation skill. In exchange it will lose a level of stamina protection and -1 to its inherent Lower Mana Cost. The armor retains the ability to be Refined.
Clothing & Jewelry: Regular clothing, jewelry and enchanted items occupying an armor slot. These items are naturally medable, and increase the wearers Defense Cap. They provide no protection against stamina loss and can not be Refined.
Light Armor:Armor crafted from light materials such as leaf, leather and Cloth. This Armor is naturally medable and gives a bonus to a player’s Defense Cap. Light armor provides a small measure of protection against stamina loss, and can not be Refined.[Includes Leather, Leaf and Clothe Armor Types]
Medium Amor: Armor crafted from medium weight materials such as, Studded, Bone, andHide. Thisarmor is not naturally medable but provides the highest inherent bonus to lower mana cost and good protection from Stamina loss. Medium armor is Refineable*. [Includes Studded, Bone, Hide, Wood* ]
*Due to the magical nature and procedure of creating woodland armor, Armor has No Inhernet Lower Mana Cost but does retain its stamina protection.
Heavy Armor: Crafted from the heaviest materials and such as Stone, Metal and Wood. This armor is not naturally medable. Heavy Armor provides the highest amount of stamina protection while giving a small bonus to Lower Mana Cost. Heavy armor is Refineable*. [Plate, Chain, Stone, Scale]
Question & Answer:
Q: What’s the difference between Defense Chance, and Defense Cap?
A: Defense Chance: the amount of Defense Chance Increase you receive from items and spells capped at 45.
Defense Cap: the maximum amount of Defense Chance Increase can you achieve over the 45 effective cap. Your Defense Cap is derived from 5 items that will give you the highest amount. Completely unarmored in just clothes and jewels (or naked for that matter) you would have the highest Defense Chance Cap Attainable (95). On the low end with a refined suit you would have a cap of (-5).
Defense Cap = (Defense Chance Increase Cap (45) + (5 Highest Defense Cap Increase Pieces)
Q: Why would anyone want 95 Defense Chance if I can only take advantage of 45??
A: There are magical effects in game that can lower your Defense
Chance. By increasing your defense chance cap and using items
with the defense chance increase property, a character can reduce
the negative effects. Your Defense Chance Increase will never be
higher then your Defense Cap but your Cap could be higher then the
amount of Defense Chance Increase you have available.
Q: How do I calculate my Defense Cap?
A: Defense Cap = (Defense Increase Cap[45]) + (5 highest Defense Cap Increase Pieces[range from 0-10)
Q: Can you give me an example… my character has an all leather suit except for DCI 25 glasses and a Lav necklace and has a total of 80 DCI.
A: First start with your base of 45. Now find your 5 pieces that will give you the highest Defense Cap Increase. Start with any clothing and jewels that occupy an armor slot.
You have two, glasses and Lav. These are both considered Clothing/Jewels and add 11 to your Cap. Now the rest of your armor is Leather so we will take into account 3 leather pieces that raise your cap by 10 each.
So 45(DCI CAP)+10(Lav)+10(Glasses)+ (10)legs+ (10)Chest+(10)arms = 95 Total Defense Cap.
This means you have an effective Defense Chance of 45 and can take advantage of all 80 of your Defense Chance Increase (up to 95 if you could fit it in) to Buffer Defense lowering effects.
Q: If I wear Plate and don’t do any refinement what is my Defense Chance Cap?
A: Your Defense Cap will be 45 so you can still take full advantage of Defense Chance increase, however you will not be able to overcap to buffer negative effects unless you Refine your armor.
Q: What happens if I get hit with HLD, I heard it now takes away 55% but it wasn’t working right when I tried it on Test?
A: Hit Lower Defense will take 55% from your Defense Chance up to your Total Defense Cap… meaning for you 55% of 80. If you had 95 Defense Chance Increase is equal to your Defense Cap, Hit Lower Defense would take 55% of 95.
Q: Can I become Hit Lower Defense Proof like before?
A: No, though 55% of 95 = 43 DCI so under the effects of HLD
you’d be only 2 points lower in your defense chance which is capped
at 45. Significantly protected but still a little under the cap.
Q: Isn't Hit Lower Defense super powerful now?
A: Its less powerful until you hit 45 Defense chance where they are both the same and more effective after that point.
Q: Why use light armor when I can Refine medium and Heavy Armor to the same level and also receive benefits of LMC and Stamina Protection, that seems overpowered!
A: Light Armors natural Defense Cap Increase doesn’t come at the cost of losing max resistances whereas Refining Heavy or Medium armor to that level would require losing 5 max resistances per piece. Heavy and Medium armor are also not naturally medable and you would have to sacrifice a mod to gain the ability as well as lose some of the benefits of both Lower Mana Cost and Stamina Protection.
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The thing where there are two DCI caps, a cap on DCI and then a cap on how much you can overcap your DCI (an attribute which I shall henceforth refer to as capcap), is bound to make peoples heads explode. I mean Pub 81 is too complicated as it is.
The thing about what I typed isn't the specific bonuses, those can change completely for all I care. It's that each armor type is defined by one thing, not three or four.
The thing about what I typed isn't the specific bonuses, those can change completely for all I care. It's that each armor type is defined by one thing, not three or four.
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You didn't realize you could get HCI on armor at all, but you are willing to toss around ideas like armor should inherently have ssi, sdi, cf, etc?
Do you not realize the implications of such a suit?
Cmon dude, get it together!
the devs came up with what appears to be a semi decent idea for making non-medable armor actually matter between stam loss, overcapped lmc, and refinements (whatever they do with it). It is not overpowered, and really just serves its purpose.
the proposals you are tossing around would create an imbalance in suits. everyone would have max speed high damage output weapons, max sdi with free'd up mods for other mods that beef them up, etc. Normally i'm all for abusing this kind of stuff, but i also recognize when it is pushing the boundries of overpowered.
what next, are you going to recommend they allow over 45% hci? Hell ill cancel my account the second that makes it into the game. 50% on gargoyles, as low as the numbers say the difference is, showed a MONSTEROUS difference in their ability to hit practice/real situations, and coupled with their damage output needed a nerf. all overcapping hci would do would force everyone to have to run overcapped dci to match it, and as such, would just be a never ending cycle.
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I do enjoy watching cedric and KLOMP go at it back to back lol. Gives me something to read in the mean time.
Klomp I totally agree, I have a version of that document which has differnt changes then this one but in the end for clarity and hopefully moving things forward with Player feedback on the changes being proposed I stayed true to all the numbers and caps used in Pub 81 (DCI Cap of 45 and overcap of 95 were not mine but the numbers I had to work with.)
For example in my own notes, I have HLA & HLD changed to take 50% of DCI and no less then 40. That way you don't even have to talk about an over cap issue. Both can be greatly reduced, neither completely nullified.
-Lore's Player
PS: I know you have taken flack on some of your ideas but don't sweat it. Whenever I do a brain storming session I ask everyone to put everything on the table no matter how silly it might sound. Then we work through all the ideas related to a specific topic... for instance say 4 different people had ideas of re-vamping chain... we'd bounce all those ideas around, find what aspects of each had positives and negatives, what the concepts had in common and where there was a disconnect. You would be surprised at how many times the initial "stupid idea" ended up being the clever innovation we needed to bring the everything into focus. and balance.
Do I beleive things like mass spell focus or over-capping max on hci and damage are likely to cause balance issue, yes. Do I think bouncing those ideas and getting feedback was dumb, absolutely not. Hell if you really want feedback on a topic the best way to gather info from community is post something intitially bad, you'll get 100 30 page responses in 5 minutes
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Clarification Question on Refinement to crafters on Test:
Is the ratio of DCI and max resist 2:1 or 1:1? If you add 10 DCI do you lose, 5 or 10 max resist? Or something else?
Thanks
-Lore's Player
Is the ratio of DCI and max resist 2:1 or 1:1? If you add 10 DCI do you lose, 5 or 10 max resist? Or something else?
Thanks
-Lore's Player
I've had some interesting back-and-forth with guys like you, Chise, and Gibb. The only issue has been with a few of just the absolute worst posters on the site who apparently can't read. I mean I'll post....
"Let's split armor into 4 categories, and put a dexer bonus on two of them, a mage bonus on one, and a universal bonus on the last. Here are some examples to demonstrate. Yes some of them are overpowered, but they're just examples and would get nerfed in testing anyway."
...and some poor illiterate child will still come up and scream "DUR DUR THOSE EXAMPLES ARE OVERPOWERED" like I'm going to go be surprised. It's just sort of pathetic. Yes, I know some of them are overpowered, that's why I said it.
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This is how I learn all things UO..........if you really want feedback on a topic the best way to gather info from community is post something intitially bad, you'll get 100 30 page responses in 5 minutes
and then I just ask G.
Some posts have been removed.
The gargoyle HCI cap is an example of how a small imbalance (HCI 5) can have a large effect. I offered constructive criticism to your idea. Adjusting several property caps is a dangerous course. If you are going to adjust caps, you may want to start with "more forgiving" properties such as LMC. If you were not open to feedback, you should have said so up front.
Stayin Alive,
BG
Very well thought out idea. I prefer the proposed publish idea to this one, though they are similar in most respects. Giving out "free" (no trade-off) cap increases can be imbalancing (e.g. the gargoyle +5 HCI Cap, which is going away).
Regarding Mage Armor, I think you hit the nail on the head. Minus the mana absorbtion, the stamina protection loss and LMC loss could be directly applied to the publish.
Here is how it currently works:
There are essentailly three levels of Stamina Protection (SP) (numbers used for simlicity, more SP with higher number): 0 (leather), 1 (studded), 2 (plate).
There are three levels of LMC Bonus: 0 (leather), 3 (studded), 1 (plate).
Type / SP / LMC Bonus
Leather / 0 / 0
Studded / 1 / 3
Plate / 2 / 1
If you apply the LD's Mage armor to this:
Type / SP / LMC Bonus
Leather / 0 / 0
Studded / 0 / 2
Plate / 1 / 0
Studded Mage Armor acts as leather in regards to SP (both have 0), but still retains some LMC bonus. Plate Mage Armor acts as leather in regards to LMC Bonus (both have 0), but still retains some SP.
I am in favor of this comprimise, from the current publish behavior of Mage Armor (acts as Leather). It gives meaningful benefit to the Mage Armor property.
Stayin Alive,
BG
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2 DCI Cap = 1 Max Resist
Increasing your DCI Cap by 10 results in losing 5 max resists.
Stayin Alive,
BG
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2 to 1 (10dci requires a loss of 5 resist)
I was playing around with it by raising dci on 2 pieces, lowering 2 or 3 resists, then raising resist on another 2 pieces, while lowering dci.
in effect you can then end up with caps such as 72/72/68/68/70, and maintain 45dci.
But i have a feeling refinements will change, now that i've got a solid grasp on them
The Material Bonus discussion was started in one of the Pub 81 threads, as many expected to see something of the sort as part of the Armor Phase 2 changes. Sadly it was not. This thread will be OBE when the team pushes "round 3" to TC. If there is no indication of material bonuses in that iteration, than it may warrant a seperate thread. As of now, there is no harm in leaving it in this thread (the topic is well imbedded throughout). Leaving it here is just one less place the team has to look.
Stayin Alive,
BG
Fair enough
Eh I still think it needs more work before it goes to live servers! Not to mention there is more going in it then just the armor/weapon revamp. I am hoping though that tonight we will get some sort of update. Would like to know for instance what they are doing to fix DCI overcapping and how refinements are changing. Not to mention any other changes that might have occured. Be nice to have some new stuff to discuss/argue about lol.I was hoping this publish was going to be out this past Tuesday.... maybe next week it goes to origin?
If I remember right, we were warned at the start that this publish would be on test for a long time.I was hoping this publish was going to be out this past Tuesday.... maybe next week it goes to origin?
Putting it in the patch notes, isn't first discussing it with the community and seeing how we'd like it
Ermmmm... no? "Everyone else understands that?" lol. Where do you come up with this crap? lmao. I love it when someone speaks on behalf of "everyone." A ton of people don't want animal form nerfed. At least not as bad as it is being nerfed. How about *YOU* look back and read the posts and -FYI- Don't just read the posts; look at the "likes" too... those count as someone agreeing with the statement. Dismounting is in a way, overpowered, simply because wayyy too many noobs rely on it alone... or at least it would be overpowered if not for animal form. Animal Form balances it. Dismounting is still effective, even against someone with ninja, it's just no longer *overpowered.* Animal form still has to wait for the remount timer, giving groups plenty of time to dump the person on foot. You also can't use any abilities while in animal form, and you can't even remount until you *UNDO* Animal Form. If someone has to invest 80 skill points just to run as fast as everyone else, *WITH* all of the limitations I just stated, it can hardly be considered overpowered. Besides, if you actually chase and follow someone while they're in animal form, you can disrupt them once they "un-form" and try to remount. It's not difficult, and it's definitely not overpowered. It's only overpowered to *YOU* if you play with noobs who absolutely need to dismount someone to kill them, and if you can't kill someone just because they turned themself into a llama...Ok bro
Do you think that anyone playing Atlantic doesn't know that you only play your crappy mage when you have a group on?
"a huge Ninja nerf" Huh?? They tweaked one spell and changed nothing else for Ninja. That's your huge nerf?
Its only a huge nerf if that is the only Ninja spell you use and rely on bro. The rest of us are quite okay with it as we aren't mashing it all day long.
About the only thing that everyone in this post has agreed on is that animal form needs to be nerfed.
Except for you of course lol. Please read the entire thread and tell me I am wrong.
If you rely on animal form to fight solo you really aren't fighting solo. You are simply running away in form. Everyone else understands that.
-Bro
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You contradict yourself nicely
Dismounting is overpowered? Its only overpowered if you cant fight 1 vs 1 bro.
Funny though how you just stated that dismount is overpowered and animal form is not.
I contradict myself nicely? wtf? lol. Please tell me exactly where I contradicted myself (nicely? lol). Anyhow, just so you know, I'm not making this argument to convince you of anything. It would be nice, but judging by you're... uhhh... amazing intellect it would seem like an unrealistic aspiration. I'm making this argument for everyone reading these posts to see and think about logically. No offense, but somehow I doubt you'll do that.You contradict yourself nicely
Dismounting is overpowered? Its only overpowered if you cant fight 1 vs 1 bro.
Funny though how you just stated that dismount is overpowered and animal form is not.
First off, I'd like to clarify that whether something is "overpowered" or not is a matter of opinion. Now that said, I did not say that Dismount is completely overpowered as it is, although it is significantly powerful (lets be honest). By nerfing Animal Form you are MAKING it overpowered. Animal Form can logically only be as overpowered as dismounting is; considering the only thing that Animal Form is, is a *reaction* to another ALREADY powerful move (the dismount). In other words, You can not logically say that Animal Form is more overpowered than the dismount, when the Animal Form is merely a *REACTIONARY RESPONSE* to the dismount... unless you think that there should be no counter for being dismounted; meaning it should be even more overpowered than it already is. Animal Form would not be necessary if dismounting wasn't so overpowered. Think about it, why else would people invest 80 skill points in Ninjitsu, just to save them from ONE ability (the dismount)?? Dismounting (*imo*) is definitely overpowered. Animal Form only *alleviates* the consequences of being dismounted. There's nothing overpowered about that. Once again, Please do NOT nerf Animal Form. It is *NOT* overpowered.
As I said, " Animal form still has to wait for the remount timer, giving groups plenty of time to dump the person on foot. You also can't use any abilities while in animal form, and you can't even remount until you *UNDO* Animal Form. If someone has to invest 80 skill points just to run as fast as everyone else, *WITH* all of the limitations I just stated, it can hardly be considered overpowered. Besides, if you actually chase and follow someone while they're in animal form, you can disrupt them once they "un-form" and try to remount. It's not difficult, and it's definitely not overpowered." And that's all besides the fact that it is a *REACTIONARY RESPONSE* to ANOTHER ALREADY POWERFUL ability (dismount).
And btw how the hell is "dismounting overpowered if you can't fight 1v1"? Would it be underpowered if you could 1v1? What the hell does that even mean? lol
-Bro
One more thing I'd like to request. Can we get rid of the resistance of poison ticks for people who don't have poisoning? (human or non-human). I'm talking about when someone is already poisoned and they resist the tick when it comes, causing them to be cured. I don't mean for people with poisoning, I approve of people with the poisoning skill having a natural resistance to poison; but there's no reason someone without poisoning should be able to resist the ticks. This is something that normally wouldn't be a big deal, but just happens to be due to the complexity of mage dueling. Making poison ticks "un-resistable" to players who don't have poison is a change that I doubt will upset anyone, but will definitely make the community of mage duelers a lot happier. After all, it is only really relevant to the mage dueling community; and duelers prefer less to be left to chance. Thank You.
-P.S. Like this status if you'd like this change to be made.
-P.S. Like this status if you'd like this change to be made.
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"considering the only thing that Animal Form is, is a *reaction* to another ALREADY powerful move (the dismount)"
Uhh, sorry to inform you but Animal Form is a valid Ninjitsu spell that serves alot more purposes then simply being used by people like you to invest 80 skill points for the sole purpose of running away. Or do you cast Animal Form and stay onscreen?
The extra stats and regens of certain forms compliment multiple templates quite well. Ever hop into dog form after a rezz so that you can regen full health quick enough to get back in a fight? I have.
You quite obviously have only looked at Animal Form from your own personal pvp perspective and have issues fighting outnumbered.
People do dismount 1 vs 1
I do it quite often. Its a very good way to ensure that your opponent hangs around to finish a fight.
Good job though thinking your reaction theory all the way through Einstein
You use dog form? lol. What *other* forms do you use? Let me rephrase my statement; the only thing *Ostard/llama/Wolf* forms are, are *REACTIONARY RESPONSES* to an already powerful move (The Dismount). Either way, you can't say that ostard/llama/wolf form are overpowered in *PvP* (it's being nerfed for PvP purposes btw/so your argument about non pvp purposes for animal form is irrelevant) if they are *ONLY* done in *RESPONSE* to dismount. My argument still stands, thank you."considering the only thing that Animal Form is, is a *reaction* to another ALREADY powerful move (the dismount)"
Uhh, sorry to inform you but Animal Form is a valid Ninjitsu spell that serves alot more purposes then simply being used by people like you to invest 80 skill points for the sole purpose of running away. Or do you cast Animal Form and stay onscreen?
The extra stats and regens of certain forms compliment multiple templates quite well. Ever hop into dog form after a rezz so that you can regen full health quick enough to get back in a fight? I have.
You quite obviously have only looked at Animal Form from your own personal pvp perspective and have issues fighting outnumbered.
People do dismount 1 vs 1
I do it quite often. Its a very good way to ensure that your opponent hangs around to finish a fight.
Good job though thinking your reaction theory all the way through Einstein
No offense, but you hardly have a coherent thing to say. You seem to be arguing the point that people dismount 1v1, and that that is somehow relevant to the argument that dismounting is not overpowered. You said, "Dismounting is only overpowered if you can't 1v1." I replied, "What does that even mean?" You then went on to say, "People do dismount 1 vs 1. I do it quite often. Its a very good way to ensure that your opponent hangs around to finish a fight." You're making the argument that dismounting is only overpowered if you can't 1v1, and you then go to on to explain how you dismount people 1v1...? lol. If anything you seem to be making my point for me. As you said, "You contradict yourself [nicely]" lmao. I wasn't going to honor such an incoherent post with a reply, but it was too funny of an opportunity to pass up. This constant one upping stuff needs to stop though. Please don't post unless you have a meaningful argument to make.
-Bro
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Anytime you nerf something like Ninja form or faction horses etc you indirectly make dismounting better which DOESN'T need to happen. Being on foot these days without either of those means certain death the majority of the time in a group fight. Almost all faction fights are group fights or ganks. What part of this do ppl not understand?
There is no argument to make.
Animal Form is being nerfed and the huge majority of pvpers posting in this thread agree that is a good thing.
But keep on trying to convince anyone that it shouldnt be nerfed because you say it balances dismount.
I guess the devs should not fix bs game mechanics so that you can pester large groups by yourself and then form off when they attack and dismount you. That makes alot of sense lol.
You have a funny sense of balance. You want to fight outnumbered and stay alive for no other reason then you invested 80 skill points. Thats real talented bro
Thank you Cetric for showing me how this could be used in a practical way.2 to 1 (10dci requires a loss of 5 resist)
I was playing around with it by raising dci on 2 pieces, lowering 2 or 3 resists, then raising resist on another 2 pieces, while lowering dci.
in effect you can then end up with caps such as 72/72/68/68/70, and maintain 45dci.
But i have a feeling refinements will change, now that i've got a solid grasp on them
- Awards
- 1
Yes was stated from the start that it would be long time coming
Apologies for keeping an older post alive, but I am finally catching up with the last 5+ pages of this thread! I wanted to respond to this post/idea directly, and then it's time to start with the newest Pub 81 post...
I posted an off-the-wall idea in the warrior forum a little while back, intended to to provide a Chivalric "ability" to replace vamp form (though not quite as strong, since this idea frees up 99 skill points on a warrior). My idea was more Life Leech based, while Logrus had an excellent follow up modifying it to be more of damage reduction based. So, just wanted to send a link to those (like KLOMP) who were intrigued by an idea to separate the Chiv/Necro template. I even subtly suggested making vampiric embrace a negative karma based effect - making it harder to pair chiv (positive karma) with necro (negative karma) (this is how I can see Devs eventually "nerfing" sampires, btw).
Post link here.
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