Year End Approaching...No Classic Shard

[StaticOnAtlantic]

The code is everywhere..... The server side code is on the shard Emulation sites. Its on my OLD UO cd's, its still runs. there are a handful of pre tram shards still running around. They have that code.

Maybe I dont understand "coding" but....... just saying.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

It's not the same. What they are using on freeshards is an emulator. While it might look the same on the surface, the two are completely different underneath.

 

[Babble]

We could help them a lot easier if they used the freeshard code

 

[Uriah Heep]

It's not the same. What they are using on freeshards is an emulator. While it might look the same on the surface, the two are completely different underneath.

Ahhh, now we have the solution! Instead of digging out old code, or coding us up a classic shard, let's start asking the devs to Emulate us a classic shard

 

[Gunga_Din]

This. Exactly.

Exactly Not. You a moron like the post you quoted.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

The developers certainly could emulate a shard...but the questions around that are:

- Can they use the emulator without legal issues arising? (which is funny if you consider that the emulators themselves are in a very dark grey area)
- Would a shard created with an emulator be able to support the number of players that would potentially log on to it?
- Would a shard created with an emulator be able to function along side the other shards? You have to consider things like patching, etc.
- Would it actually, in the end, be even more work to create the shard using an emulator...considering that you would have to support it differently (different framework, etc.) than the existing shards?
- Would the emulator even work on the existing server hardware (most likely in a VM...but that goes back to #2).

There are probably other questions that would need to be answered, but those are the ones that I would think to be the most pressing.

 

[Fayled Dhreams]

It's not the same. What they are using on freeshards is an emulator. While it might look the same on the surface, the two are completely different underneath.

Ahhh, now we have the solution! Instead of digging out old code, or coding us up a classic shard, let's start asking the devs to Emulate us a classic shard

how IRONIC ... a very very clever way around:
G. Advertising of player-run shards is prohibited. Additionally our forums are not designed to provide technical support for shard emulators and as such all discussions related to building and maintaining a shard are prohibited.

 

[Clx-]

I'm one of those Darkfall players who would come to UO Classic in a heart beat. In trying to become something different games tend to warp straight forward concepts. I have yet to play a game with UO's depth of interaction that didn't force dependency on groups. Darkfall's existance should actually be read almost entirely as a pro-classic UO argument. The large number of guilds who came out at release despite core members being unable to purchase accounts (if you didn't get a pre-order you didn't have another shot at an account for over 2 weeks) and the roughly 5 months all of these classic UO era guilds battled it out in a game with no content, more bugs than UO ever had, and less over sight to manage issues shows there is a definite interest. Darkfall was a game made by PvP gamers for PvP gamers and while delivering on PvP it oddly lacked all other aspects you would expect from a game. Yet many of us continue to play because it is the only harsh world available.

I'm not sure how you can cite the classic response on these forums as a decider of anything. UO made a business decision to break the interaction aspect of their game to protect the larger subscription base. By the very nature of that decision the primary user base of this forum is people who will be wholely against classic project. That was over a decade ago and this is far from the first time a classic UO server has been teased which only adds to the impropability of non-actives chiming in regular to defend a classic server. I started the guild I still play with almost 13 years ago on Chesapeake and in the last 2 games we've broken 150 active players. When this topic came up last spring over 40 were in favor of a classic server and others would go where the group went. How many of those are watching this forum for classic info? Only 1 other than myself that I know of. If you need an example of why many of us don't post often take a look at the thread where you went pages arguing against classic with made up numbers and no one called you out and compare it to the number of responses MLF gets whenever he/she says something silly. Anti-classic has home field advantage here and realistically we have no reason to believe putting up a "good fight" on these forums means anything. We've been through this tease before.

Lastly, could you and others please refrain from comparing Siege Perilous to a potential classic server. Siege Perilous was a bone thrown to PvPers to keep their subscription fees. It was released and wiped at least once which lowered return as people got fed up starting over and after dominant guilds had taken hold there was a 200+ count ban for massive duping. Go to Lum the Mad's archives and look up "Hammerfall" posts to get details. Essentially SP was gutted and never recovered. Battle Vortex forums were active but there were way more trolls than players. As Trammel drained life from Fel guilds would move to SP only to find their old server had more life on Fel than SP had period. SP never had a chance.

What a fantastic post. Could not agree more.

Siege did recover to an extent from it's wipe but was killed by p16.

 

[Uriah Heep]

how IRONIC ... a very very clever way around:
G. Advertising of player-run shards is prohibited. Additionally our forums are not designed to provide technical support for shard emulators and as such all discussions related to building and maintaining a shard are prohibited.

If this is your contribution to the thread, then by >strict< definition you are trolling, since nothing you posted has anything to do with the topic at hand.
Grade: Fail

Not discussing nor advertising player run shards...we are talking about a Mythic owned and operated shard, tossing around ideas on how to get them to run a classic shard, and how they might go about it, nothing more, nothing less.
Try again...

 

[Fayled Dhreams]

*yawn*

You said he said ... yeah so?
You ALSO said that that doesn't mean it is >usable<

Which pulls the legs back off of "pro-classic" (leaves it in the same state as when you came in on this dead-horse)

*le sigh*
You want a "fresh build" ... of a known bad design(no tram) ... by a Company that
Can't get UOGamecodes running smoothly
Can't run their own website (well, it's "running" but archives and front page are a mess)
Can't run their own "subscribers only" forums
Can't provide 24/7 in game support
Can't figure out how to keep accounts updating age wise
Can't "get the word out" about server outages (until AFTER it's pointed out here)
Can't get christmas/anniversary/vet rewards ... done did and done, first pass, without "tweaking"
Can't sell "exclusive/one time only" bonus items(soulstones) ...re-coloring IS NOT "NEW"
Can't "balance PvP"

Can't "properly do" a LOT of things ... and the things they HAVE done ... such as trammel
You consider a "tragic error" ... yet Most All following games
LEARNED from UOs "mistake" (solution) ... and pre-built a "trammel" INTO their games

huh! something is not logical here ... I strongly suspect that it is you.

IF EA was, as a few diehards have said,
Was >only milking the player base< ... errr ...
doesn't that mean that they are actively AVOIDING milking the classic base?


something is not logical here ... I strongly suspect that it is you.

Fool me once, shame on you
Fool me twice, Shame on me

Fooling yourself is just endlessly shameful ... tsk! tsk!

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

We get it. You like Trammel.

So go and play there. This discussion is about alternative options to Trammel, which caused a lot of former players to leave the game...and how to entice those players to come back.

Arguing that Trammel is a good thing in a discussion that seeks to find ways to bring back players that left because of Trammel, well..."something is not logical here ... I strongly suspect that it is you."

 

[Vlaude]

Debating with Fayled is like debating a 5-year old, it just continues on until it ends up in a "nu uh, ya huh" state and then he/she holds an endless grudge and never gets over being wrong. Fayled also has big struggles with the English language and typing like an adult. It would be cute and funny except Fayled is older than 5.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

Debating with Fayled is like debating a 5-year old, it just continues on until it ends up in a "nu uh, ya huh" state and then he/she holds an endless grudge and never gets over being wrong.

 

[Fayled Dhreams]

If this is your contribution to the thread, then by >strict< definition you are trolling, since nothing you posted has anything to do with the topic at hand.
Grade: Fail

Not discussing nor advertising player run shards...we are talking about a Mythic owned and operated shard, tossing around ideas on how to get them to run a classic shard, and how they might go about it, nothing more, nothing less.
Try again...

I disagree
I stand corrected
but I will proffer an explanation

All this talk of freeshard this and freeshard that and freeshard freeshard freeshard ... HAS led to someone suggesting/implying that >Free shards/emulators<
would be the way to go for the paid professionals to find their solutions ...
On behalf of the EA paid types: I object!

I object on the grounds that EA types, should not be held in disregard (beyond the normal name calling (fool, idiot, moron etc))
by having it, even merely, "suggested" ... that someone/some group ... is doing "the job" better ... per the EULA
You may not reverse engineer, decompile or disassemble the Software, including any proprietary communications protocol used by the Software. You acknowledge that you do not have the right to create, publish, distribute, create derivative works from or use any software programs, utilities, applications, emulators or tools derived from or created for Ultima Online unless specifically authorized in writing by EA.com.

Of course ... that may only apply to ME as a PAYING subscriber.

Again:
Thank you for your leniency in not interpreting your rules "strictly".

I remain: Your Fayled Dhreams

 

[Sevin0oo0]

Remember that Cal said he would hope to have an answer

/this - I say give him a chance, and December, especially the last 2 weeks in December are usually Not a good time to start releasing data about new projects. I'd give it till mid-March before I announced it dead

 

[kelmo]

Some folks are pushing it... I will not likely take this thread out. I am not adverse to taking some posters out. *smiles*

A classic shard would likely mean the end of me. I understand this... Yet, it is a worthy discussion. I have visited with many of the "classic" folk. We understand one another for the most part.

While the demise of my shard saddens me deeply, and it will surely be the death of Siege. EA will not run that many rule sets. As much as Mythic may want to... It is business.

 

[kelmo]

I will continue this train of thought on my forum. While we have some few that love Siege here... This is not the thread for it.

 

[Gunga_Din]

I didn't return to the game in hopes of a Classic Server, but i got one foot out the door because there isn't one now

 

[Uriah Heep]

I object on the grounds that EA types, should not be held in disregard (beyond the normal name calling (fool, idiot, moron etc))
by having it, even merely, "suggested" ... that someone/some group ... is doing "the job" better ... per the EULA
You may not reverse engineer, decompile or disassemble the Software, including any proprietary communications protocol used by the Software. You acknowledge that you do not have the right to create, publish, distribute, create derivative works from or use any software programs, utilities, applications, emulators or tools derived from or created for Ultima Online unless specifically authorized in writing by EA.com.

My last word on the subject to you is this:

the EULA doesn't apply, there's no decompiling, disassembling, reverse engineering, blah blah blah problem here. And this is why...Let me say it again, real slowly so that all may follow along.

I t ' s - n o t - a g a i n s t - t h e - t e r m s - o f - s e r v i c e - ' c a u s e - i t ' s - t h e - C O P Y R I G H T - O W N E R S - w e - a r e - t a l k i n g - a b o u t - h a v i n g - d o - i t.


I'm done here, see y'all in another thread.

 

[StaticOnAtlantic]

Some folks are pushing it... I will not likely take this thread out. I am not adverse to taking some posters out. *smiles*

A classic shard would likely mean the end of me. I understand this... Yet, it is a worthy discussion. I have visited with many of the "classic" folk. We understand one another for the most part.

While the demise of my shard saddens me deeply, and it will surely be the death of Siege. EA will not run that many rule sets. As much as Mythic may want to... It is business.

I dont understand if you play siege why it would be the "death" of you. I would think all Siege players would be (gun ho) for a classic shard. The Demise of Siege is not the "idea" of a classic shard, Lets be honest here, Siege was doomed from the start. Little or no attention was EVER devoted to it in the start and well.... In the ending.

I would hope that Siege players would be happy about the THOUGHT of a Classic shard. They could have had what they were seeking in the first place when Siege was made live. Maybe my time in Siege I 100% missed the point...

 

[Barry Manilow]

No one's suggesting or saying trammel will be the single reason UO will shut down, if they did point it out and take it up with them rather than basically empty quoting someone.

I would go as far to say, that Trammel actually saved UO from dying off. Let's face it, UO:R was the high point and brought back alot of player who quit the game out of frustration from the out of control player killers and griefers. I remember the "classic" era of UO and unless you were a die hard Pker/PvPer or in a guild with those types you were out of luck even going outside a town without getting instantly killed by a band of griefers. I know because I and others who didn't play hard core speak from experience. I joined with 8 others who I knew from my personal real life. We all having jobs, and really new to this MMORPG thing, had no idea what was going on except that UO was not fun but extremely frustrating. We all were thinking we are paying 9.99 dollars a month for this? All of us quit UO for the other and new MMORPG that bragged that they didn't have open ended PvP. Everquest went live and of course the rest was history.

People have to remember, that the Devs at the time didn't just create Trammel out of no where. There were very important reasons why a land for Player vs Environment needed to be created. UO was bleeding players especially with the huge succeed of Everquest and other EQ-clones. So UO:R basically revived UO back to life and the player base grew to 250kish. No where near EQ, but it was at least at a respectful level.

The wild west of UO was just that wild and total choas. Where the worse and more terrible you were, the better you did in the game.

So you can ask and ask for a classic shard all you want but it will never ever be the way it was back in the day when 95% of the player base was forced with no choice to play with you. 13 years of experience in UO will make sure that easy marks will not be easy to find. I mean who would want to move to a classic shard, start over from nothing leaving all you have in your home shard. It's easy for some of these ex-players who might number in the 100s, to come back and start over in a new classic shard. However, I would predict at the end this "classic" pipe dream shard will end up being another failed project.

We had a "classic" era and it didn't work. What makes anyone besides the die hards, think that 13 years later that it will work now?

 

[Barry Manilow]

I dont understand if you play siege why it would be the "death" of you. I would think all Siege players would be (gun ho) for a classic shard. The Demise of Siege is not the "idea" of a classic shard, Lets be honest here, Siege was doomed from the start. Little or no attention was EVER devoted to it in the start and well.... In the ending.

I would hope that Siege players would be happy about the THOUGHT of a Classic shard. They could have had what they were seeking in the first place when Siege was made live. Maybe my time in Siege I 100% missed the point...

Siege is not popular for a number of reasons for most. It is a tough shard with tough rule set. It is the big leagues of UO, but as you can see not many people want that. Another reason is it's very challenging to make updates for all these different rulesets in publishes. Especially when the Devs are pushed to the limit because of lack of resources. Now people want to push them with more rulesets?

To me as long as there are choices for players to avoid PvP, most will take it. Being on Siege or a "classic" shard will not bring back mass players back to the game. That type of shard will be as popular as Siege, another really low pop shard.

 

[Vlaude]

I would go as far to say, that Trammel actually saved UO from dying off. Let's face it, UO:R was the high point and brought back alot of player who quit the game out of frustration from the out of control player killers and griefers. I remember the "classic" era of UO and unless you were a die hard Pker/PvPer or in a guild with those types you were out of luck even going outside a town without getting instantly killed by a band of griefers. I know because I and others who didn't play hard core speak from experience. I joined with 8 others who I knew from my personal real life. We all having jobs, and really new to this MMORPG thing, had no idea what was going on except that UO was not fun but extremely frustrating. We all were thinking we are paying 9.99 dollars a month for this? All of us quit UO for the other and new MMORPG that bragged that they didn't have open ended PvP. Everquest went live and of course the rest was history.

People have to remember, that the Devs at the time didn't just create Trammel out of no where. There were very important reasons why a land for Player vs Environment needed to be created. UO was bleeding players especially with the huge succeed of Everquest and other EQ-clones. So UO:R basically revived UO back to life and the player base grew to 250kish. No where near EQ, but it was at least at a respectful level.

The wild west of UO was just that wild and total choas. Where the worse and more terrible you were, the better you did in the game.

So you can ask and ask for a classic shard all you want but it will never ever be the way it was back in the day when 95% of the player base was forced with no choice to play with you. 13 years of experience in UO will make sure that easy marks will not be easy to find. I mean who would want to move to a classic shard, start over from nothing leaving all you have in your home shard. It's easy for some of these ex-players who might number in the 100s, to come back and start over in a new classic shard. However, I would predict at the end this "classic" pipe dream shard will end up being another failed project.

We had a "classic" era and it didn't work. What makes anyone besides the die hards, think that 13 years later that it will work now?

I don't doubt that trammel saved UO, in fact I've mentioned that before in some of my posts. I even said AoS probably prolonged UO's life in some ways. That isn't to say that there weren't other means of prolonging or saving the game. Those may not have been the only options, just the ones they went with. Both trammel and AoS in some ways are more meant to appeal to people psychologically than created to be fun in my opinion.

For me a classic UO shard is more of something I personally want, which is why I ask for it... I can't say whether or not it will happen, but I would like it to. But we don't always get what we want, I understand that. If the answer from Cal is a no, I will gracefully bow out of these discussions and say "oh well." I've pretty much conceded to the fact it won't happen, but some of the reasons people bring up such as "it can't be defined," or "you're just trying to bring back the past" are wrong. If it doesn't happen it will be because it's not deemed good for business, not for any other reason.

 

[Barry Manilow]

I don't doubt that trammel saved UO, in fact I've mentioned that before in some of my posts. I even said AoS probably prolonged UO's life in some ways. That isn't to say that there weren't other means of prolonging or saving the game. Those may not have been the only options, just the ones they went with. Both trammel and AoS in some ways are more meant to appeal to people psychologically than created to be fun in my opinion.

For me classic UO is more of something I personally want, which is why I ask for it... I can't say whether or not it will happen, but I would like it to. But we don't always get what we want, I understand that. If the answer from Cal is a no, I will gracefully bow out of these discussions and say "oh well." I've pretty much conceded to the fact it won't happen, but some of the reasons people bring up such as "it can't be defined," or "you're just trying to bring back the past" are wrong. If it doesn't happen it will be because it's not deemed good for business, not for any other reason.

That I totally agree with. If it good for business, I would see a need for a classic shard. I am not against a classic shard per say. It's not my cup of tea, but if people want it that's fine.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

That I totally agree with. If it good for business, I would see a need for a classic shard. I am not against a classic shard per say. It's not my cup of tea, but if people want it that's fine.

*That* is the right attitude to take towards it. I wish more current players would do the same...instead of making it about Trammies vs. Fel players.

The idea behind the Classic Shard is to offer something to bring back people that left because they didn't like Trammel, or they didn't like AoS. Currently, the online petition is at about 750 people. I have about 30 people registered at my site, and there are hundreds, maybe thousands, more playing free shards. If you discount all of those by half...some people will not come back at all, others will not want to pay, etc. I would guess that you are looking at something like 2500-3000 players. I consider that a pretty conservative estimate. Take the mid point in that, 2750...multiply that by the monthly sub fee...2750 x 12.99 = $35722.50 per year. Doesn't sound like much...but over 5 years it's over $175,000 of revenue the game would otherwise not see.

I don't consider that figure to be unrealistic, on the low end really...but again, it is just simple speculation, I have nothing to back that up with.

So it comes down to the question of, how badly does EA want our money? If it isn't worth it to them, they won't do it...it's that simple. And honestly, if they don't want my money enough to cater to my likes/dislikes...I shouldn't be giving it to them.

 

[HD2300]

It doesnt make good business sense, because EA will lose more current Siege and PvE players than what a Classic server will gain in new subscribers.

Gain 300 new Classic players long term
Lose 11000 existing players
Net Loss 10700 players
Say Goodnight Everyone

SOTD showed that if you rebrand Siege, it will be a success.

"Classic" is essentially very "creative" marketing at its very best or very worst depending on your beliefs.

 

[Zosimus]

Take the mid point in that, 2750...multiply that by the monthly sub fee...2750 x 12.99 = $35722.50 per year. Doesn't sound like much...but over 5 years it's over $175,000 of revenue the game would otherwise not see.

If I'm looking at this right 2750 (players) x 12.99 ( monthly fee) = $35722.50 per month not year. Correct me if I am wrong but I think you flubbed on your wording. You would have to mutiply your answer by 12 months and get $428,670.00 a year. Like I said I may be looking at it wrong but I dont think I am.

 

[Zosimus]

Lets not get in a debate over subscrition numbers on the 3 games that are run by Bioware Mythic. In this model I'm just making all 3 games, with made up subscription numbers, all equal subscritpions to show that it is feasible money wise for them to work on a classic shard. Not feasible with a skeleton crew but feasable with money.

I understand overhead costs and such since its a business and some EA corporate officer is lining his pocket a bit but still the argument is these games make money. Yes, it cost alot of money to make them and make a return on their investment but UO has been around for 13 years it has more then paid itself back over and over. My opinion they could invest into a classic shard but thats just me

Formula

Game Name: Subscription number x Monthly Fee x 12 months = yearly income before costs ( meaning by costs is wages, sevices, ect ect ect).

DaoC: 100,000 x $14.95 x 12 = $17,940,000.00

Warhammer Online: 100,000 x $14.95 x 12 = $17,940,000.00

Ultima Online: 100,000 x $12.95 x 12 = $15,540,000.00

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

If I'm looking at this right 2750 (players) x 12.99 ( monthly fee) = $35722.50 per month not year. Correct me if I am wrong but I think you flubbed on your wording. You would have to mutiply your answer by 12 months and get $428,670.00 a year. Like I said I may be looking at it wrong but I dont think I am.

LOL! What the heck was I doing. You are right of course!

 

[Rakoth]

Gain 300 new Classic players long term
Lose 11000 existing players
Net Loss 10700 players
Say Goodnight Everyone

Normally my eyes just sort of slide past HD23300 posts because they are vacuous of poignancy, but...

Why would eleven-thousand players leave the game if a new shard was put up? -Boggle.-

 

[Cal_Mythic]

Just to clear things up ... Morgana and I did have a chat, and I misunderstood the question she was asking me.

I thought she was asking if we have server backups for our game, and I said of course.

It was a miscommunication.

As for the rest ... The reason there is no announcement is that after a lot of thought I didn't want to push two paragraphs out that don't entirely address the subject that consistently gets so much attention.

This topic is as emotional as it is one of technology for Ultima Online, so I wanted to address it in a venue where you can hear and see what we have to say that is the dev diary we are doing on video.

One last thing:

I've flown in the backseat of F-16s for training. When training, pilots often operate anywhere between 1500-3000 feet AGL (above grown level). When doing air-to-air normally above 15,000. When things get hazardous over the channel you will hear "knock it off." IT means rise to a safe ground level and await the next stage of training.

I do understand every person's insight and investment in this topic ... I personally do not wish to have any person think this topic is neglected. There are 1,000s of viewpoints and well ... a lot of fighter pilots.

Many of you have some very sound points of view ... but this topic is one which requires a bit more info that I am definitely going to share, just not in a forum where it does not allow you to grasp the entire scope of what we've evaluated.

- C

 

[copycon]

As for the rest ... The reason there is no announcement is that after a lot of thought I didn't want to push two paragraphs out that don't entirely address the subject that consistently gets so much attention.

This topic is as emotional as it is one of technology for Ultima Online, so I wanted to address it in a venue where you can hear and see what we have to say that is the dev diary we are doing on video.

Is this something that we can expect to see before the end of the year Cal?

 

[Cal_Mythic]

Is this something that we can expect to see before the end of the year Cal?

No. As stated in the Producer's Letter it takes a while to get all the pieces together for a video. Plus, everyone has been slammed.

We really never had a moment to breathe from July through ... oh this past Friday.

There is much more going on than boosters and publishes. But we couldn't can't say anything until stuff is solid. Well we COULD it's just best not to.

We are aiming for mid-January to get the "State of the Game" video together, but that is a moving target.

It's most important to know we do do our best (and I do my best) to answer and try to respect both expectations and delivery to the community.

In this instance we simply ran out of time,

- C

 

[copycon]

This looks an awful lot like more empty promises and more of the same game of smoke and mirrors.

I don't appreciate being lied to.

Good luck!

 

[Martyna Zmuir]

No. As stated in the Producer's Letter it takes a while to get all the pieces together for a video. Plus, everyone has been slammed.

We really never had a moment to breathe from July through ... oh this past Friday.

There is much more going on than boosters and publishes. But we couldn't can't say anything until stuff is solid. Well we COULD it's just best not to.

We are aiming for mid-January to get the "State of the Game" video together, but that is a moving target.

It's most important to know we do do our best (and I do my best) to answer and try to respect both expectations and delivery to the community.

In this instance we simply ran out of time,

- C

Oh, Calvin…

Just how far out can you reach with that carrot on a stick before you drop it? You said you’d have an answer “by the end of the year” not “mid-January” of 2011.

Thou hast lost an Eighth!
(And a lot of credibility!)

Give these people a Yes or a No. Don’t wait to spin it, don’t run it past marketing. Just answer their question bluntly and honestly. Give simple bullet points as to why you will, or will not, make a ‘Classic’ shard. You don’t need to wait to do a silly video, you haven’t run out of time.

The carrot is moldy and you’ve dropped the stick.

Perhaps you can pick it back up by living up to your prommise by midnight on 12/31/10.

 

[koris]

Cal is joking. He's waiting to post a real answer for us at 12am on 12-25-10 as a present for us.

 

[OneLakeSuperior]

Is this something that we can expect to see before the end of the year Cal?

No. As stated in the Producer's Letter it takes a while to get all the pieces together for a video. Plus, everyone has been slammed.

We really never had a moment to breathe from July through ... oh this past Friday.

There is much more going on than boosters and publishes. But we couldn't can't say anything until stuff is solid. Well we COULD it's just best not to.

We are aiming for mid-January to get the "State of the Game" video together, but that is a moving target.

It's most important to know we do do our best (and I do my best) to answer and try to respect both expectations and delivery to the community.

In this instance we simply ran out of time,

- C

Just a Simple Yes/No ...I think is all we need. Go on and do the vid mid Jan. To give details to the Yes/No . A one word post, no explenations needed for now.
I need to move on with my life and stop reading these damn forums!

 

[Hanokh1967]

Is this something that we can expect to see before the end of the year Cal?

No. As stated in the Producer's Letter it takes a while to get all the pieces together for a video. Plus, everyone has been slammed.

We really never had a moment to breathe from July through ... oh this past Friday.

There is much more going on than boosters and publishes. But we couldn't can't say anything until stuff is solid. Well we COULD it's just best not to.

We are aiming for mid-January to get the "State of the Game" video together, but that is a moving target.

It's most important to know we do do our best (and I do my best) to answer and try to respect both expectations and delivery to the community.

In this instance we simply ran out of time,

- C

Yes or No does not require a video. An explanation would be nice but not really necessary. Patronizing us by telling us the topic is too emotional for you to even be able type out an answer is ridiculous. We are all adults here talking about a video game. Yes or No.

 

[Sargon]

I have a bad feeling that Cal's response means the answer will be no, but they need time to craft a long explanation in attempt to pacify the classic shard supporters.

 

[HD2300]

I have a bad feeling that Cal's response means the answer will be no, but they need time to craft a long explanation in attempt to pacify the classic shard supporters.

Of course it is no. It would be a kamikazi project. Draconi's two polls just backs this up. I'm betting playable Orcs will be announced as the next booster expansion in Jan and everyone will go nuts and forget about "Classic".

 

[Sargon]

I have a bad feeling that Cal's response means the answer will be no, but they need time to craft a long explanation in attempt to pacify the classic shard supporters.

Of course it is no. It would be a kamikazi project. Draconi's two polls just backs this up.

Please explain how Draconi's polls support your statement. 2/3 of respondents voted for the T2A timeframe, while 2/3 of respondents also voted for their flexibility being between Very Little and Moderate. If you read the descriptions for each of those poll options, the difference between them is minor. Based on those non-scientific results, I would estimate that a majority of respondents want a T2A era server and are mildly flexible toward the design. Where is the problem?

 

[canary]

The only thing I've gathered is Cal is still baiting players with talk of a classic shard, well beyond the timeline he allowed himself, and Morgana is wrong yet again... as usual.

Does that sum it up or am I missing something?

 

[AesSedai]

... - C

- Aye, thank you for the understandable answer before the end of the year.

(If one anticipates this working-without-any-rest-since-July Dev team may have the resources to be tackling the aforementioned 'technological hurdles'.. soon, and in addition to all else that remains on the proverbial plate... then I suppose the answer was: yes)

But if you would rather wait for round two of the dev diary video (Star Wars MMO video beta test.. I've wondered), then by all means keep hope alive for this to happen until the details are given in more detail.

Also, I'm pretty sure he meant above ground level rather than above grown level... maybe I'm wrong but I think it was just a wee slip.

Regardless of the answer, I look forward to the future evolutions of UO.

 

[Vlaude]

I can see it now...

15th January 2011: Cal says yes(!) to the possibility of a classic shard. However, it will take an undisclosed amount of time to develop it and make it live.

12 years later: no classic shard exists because it is still being researched, worked on, and looked into.

Face it, it isn't happening. Nothing left to see here.

 

[StaticOnAtlantic]

I just hope that cal takes advice from the community instead of slapping us in the face with the same results as "shard of the dead"

 

[NuSair]

I think Cal has it right in the way that he's doing it. It is something that means a lot to more than just a few people (and for the record, I am against a classic shard).

 

[AesSedai]

- Aye, he was indirectly (or directly? not sure which one or whether both atm...) called upon.. and now he has responded with as much class as, I believe, one could muster within this touchy context. I give him a(nother) bravo for that. I will take the suggestion? and knock it off until training resumes.

 

[Bill Gates OSD]

No. As stated in the Producer's Letter it takes a while to get all the pieces together for a video. Plus, everyone has been slammed.

We really never had a moment to breathe from July through ... oh this past Friday.

There is much more going on than boosters and publishes. But we couldn't can't say anything until stuff is solid. Well we COULD it's just best not to.

We are aiming for mid-January to get the "State of the Game" video together, but that is a moving target.

It's most important to know we do do our best (and I do my best) to answer and try to respect both expectations and delivery to the community.

In this instance we simply ran out of time,

- C

Well put and very much appreciated, Cal. I disagree with the whole concept of a classic shard but I have to give you credit for stepping up and providing a no BS answer for the community.

 

[Fayled Dhreams]

- Aye, he was indirectly (or directly? not sure which one or whether both atm...) called upon.. and now he has responded with as much class as, I believe, one could muster within this touchy context. I give him a(nother) bravo for that. I will take the suggestion? and knock it off until training resumes.

Ah AesSedai, old would be friend ... sorry ... but no.
You know, and I know ... and Cal >should know<

this here *waves hands* ... ain't no fricking training mission.

Now is it?

and he -didn't actually SAY- knock it off ... TO the forums ... re-read it
He told a tale of how HE had heard others say it ... and went on from there ...

Again:
You know, and I know ... and Cal >should know<
This here *waves* is "Look'em in the eye time", and pass the orders of the day ...
I forget if you had prior service also, but ...

Managing scuttlebutt and mis-communications, is BEST handled by looking them in the eye and putting an end to it ...

Which, to be fair ... can't actually be done for this current topic ...
You know, and I know ... and Cal >should know< (now that he HAS had some "training in the topic")

it will come up again.
and again
oh wait! one more time
Tsk! it JUST occurred to me ...

Anyway ... moving on ...
Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year
May all your pink slips be
the titles to cars/houses you've won

Fayled

 

[Lugh Lamfada]

Well put and very much appreciated, Cal. I disagree with the whole concept of a classic shard but I have to give you credit for stepping up and providing a no BS answer for the community.

First off: that is the antithesis of a no-BS answer. A no-BS answer would be either "Yes" or "No."

And why exactly do you disagree with a classic shard? Because it would take so-called "resources" away from everyone else? I find this argument particularly amusing. What if EA/Mythic announced that they were expanding an opening a new shard for, say, the Caribbean, and that they were going to customize it to include Carib weapons and magic? Would you have a similar problem with it? After all, developing that new shard would take some of the dev team's time away from all of the other shards (at least according to your logic), so would you have a forum signature saying JUST SAY NO to a CARIB SHARD!? Of course you wouldn't, just like I never had a problem when they added Chesapeake, or some of the Asian shards, or Drechenfels.

A classic shard is no different, except you probably don't like the idea because you don't like what UO meant to us back then: stealing, non-consensual PvP, player killing, risk, rewards. It may not be your cup of tea, but it's ours, and we're the reason why UO was successful in the first place. If people like us didn't play it nearly 14 years ago, then it wouldn't exist now. I'm not begrudging you your right to play the style you want to play, but don't crusade against ours because you don't like it, and don't use the dev team's time as a straw man to rail against the concept of a classic shard.

Right now there are dozens of free UO shards out there right now with various rulesets, some are custom maps, some are classic shards, some are RP-only shards, etc. These shards look and for the most part play like older versions of UO, yet are being managed by ordinary people with ordinary jobs, not industry professionals with huge budgets. So exactly what kind of resources are you talking about? Are you talking man hours? The man hours of a dev team that is frantically trying to put off the inevitable demise of UO?

If four coders and a guy with a server can put up a UO shard with a population of over 1,000, then a group of industry professionals can do it better, faster, and with a minimum investment of liquid resources and man hours. There is a sizable veteran community out there that would jump at the chance to play classic UO again. We may be older, grayer, and with spouses, houses, and kids, but we still love this game and would welcome the chance to play it again, and EA would turn a nice profit on us as well. It's a win-win.