[UO Herald] Got another Survey For You!

[Black Sun]

It's about knowing if the players asking for it will suffer more from not implementing the idea than players hating the idea would suffer from the implementation of the idea.

If colored animals are going to cause you suffering, pixel shades in an online game are the least of your worries.

Also, I don't see why UO Stratics users or UOHerald readers wouldn't be a representative portion of the UO players. There's always a margin of error, but there's no difference between 1,000 random UO Stratics users and 1,000 random UO players ingame.

It's not just because it's a group from Stratics or UOHerald, it's because it's a small segment of the overall population. Stratics is further skewed because it has a larger percentage of vets who have been playing nearly since day one who are very resistant to change, and want a return to the old days of UO. If you take 1000 random stratics posters and 1000 random active accounts, that Stratics group is going to have a much lower amount of newer players because many of them don't read stratics as faithfully as vets do, either that or they just don't know about it.

Not that it matters either way. By the sounds of it the dyes are in game, they're just tweaking color choices. I'd be very surprised if it didn't happen at this point.

 

[Godiva_DF]

This can only be an american idea

What a load of rubbish

 

[JC the Builder]

There is a tasteful way to handle pet coloring and then there is the tasteless way. Hiryu coloring was an example of how to deal with the situation properly. A pet that was designed to come in different colors. Giving players a dye tub and telling them go to town is an example of the wrong way. Cu Sidhes are an example of the wrong way also, they were obviously never designed for coloring as are most pets.

 

[Tina Small]

There is a tasteful way to handle pet coloring and then there is the tasteless way. Hiryu coloring was an example of how to deal with the situation properly. A pet that was designed to come in different colors. Giving players a dye tub and telling them go to town is an example of the wrong way. Cu Sidhes are an example of the wrong way also, they were obviously never designed for coloring as are most pets.

I have to agree with you on this, JC. In the Classic client, it's obvious with some of the hiryu hues that someone spent some time figuring out where the hues should go and didn't just leave the animal looking like it was dropped in a bucket of dye. Unfortunately, that careful work didn't carry over to hiryus in the Enhanced client. The creatures are head to toe one solid color. It's the same with colored plants, regardless of client. They could look so much better if someone had spent some time making sure the color only landed on parts of the plant. Or look at deeded items in the Enhanced client made with the colored woods......awful and cheap looking in comparison to the look they have in the Classic client.

If the same care that went into putting colors into the hiryus in the Classic client were being used for this project, I would more than likely not have much of a problem with it. However, the end result here is going to be disappointing to me because it could have been done so much better if EA would have spent the money to do it right. I'm not trying to fault Regine, the developer that worked on this. I applaud her for the effort. I just wish she had been given the resources to do something truly great with this project.

 

[XLaCeDX]

What, exactly, are they going to fool us into believing? That their Greater Dragon is indeed a White Wyrm? What's the risk here? We might accidentally buy a White Wyrm and instead it turns out to be a Greater Dragon (and just who would the joke be on in that case)? Or that we might accidentally PvP against a White Wyrm and it turns out to be a Greater Dragon (because, you know, we can easily tell the difference between a Greater Dragon and a Regular Dragon because the Greater Dragons all have 1337 nam3z unlike the Regulars)?

I mean, uh, could you please explain this to me, because aside from the clarification that they would read [dyed] in their names, I just don't see some risk of me being fooled by a white Greater Dragon.

Maybe if it snuck up on me and gave me a wedgie... but... that's more for a Bully Dragon.

Oh yes I forgot dragons can't be mounted and therefore 'disguise' the fact they've been dyed until some poor pk meets his sudden doom when the mount's owner dismounts AND IT'S TOO LATE.

Lol.

So yes we can use the whites (my favorite UO color) to dye dragons after all!

Yay!

Sorry after reading about the poor, poor pks getting massacred by dyed pets in disguise posts I was beginning to think that Pac is the only shard with intelligent pvpers.

 

[Maija]

Eesh, why are so many people anti-pink armor? *kicks stones* If my girl's already covering her armor with a pink robe, does it matter? Is a set of pink armor really more obnoxious than a full set of bloodwood wood armor? XD Further, does it matter if someone enjoys the game more because their suit, or their pet, is a color that is pleasing to them? I totally understand the arguments against things like the horses being dyed, for the trouble they can cause. But is it going to absolutely kill you if somebody dyes their giant beetle white? I can't understand the attitude of pounding your pitchforks over someone wanting to play the game their own way and enjoy their own belongings any way they want. Is that not what UO is all about - getting to play anything you want, from a shepherdess to a mass murderer?

 

[XLaCeDX]

There is a tasteful way to handle pet coloring and then there is the tasteless way. Hiryu coloring was an example of how to deal with the situation properly. A pet that was designed to come in different colors. Giving players a dye tub and telling them go to town is an example of the wrong way. Cu Sidhes are an example of the wrong way also, they were obviously never designed for coloring as are most pets.

I agree.


I have wanted pet dyeing for at least as long as the Origin shard has been in existence. Origin was formerly Test Sosaria, which I like to refer to as the 'colored' shard since we had the use of universal dye tubs and pets dyed in every imaginable color there.


I dislike the current pet freshner colors on test shard and don't want to see them on real shards.

You are correct that the devs should take time to do a proper job with pet dyes.

I doubt they have that kind of time at the moment, though, so I suggest they just include white and black dyes to begin with, then do the proper coding or artwork for more natural looking varieties of pet colors and randomly add new hues as puzzle rewards as they become available and without announcing they have done so.

That way the puzzles would be more fun because we'd never know we have new hues ready to be discovered until we actually get one.


Or if time allows, just do tails, manes, legs, etc, or the parts of the pets that are already a darker hue in the new colors rather than the whole pet, because yes total immersion in a dye tub just doesn't look very good and does not make for the best immersion in the game.

As much as I love and want pet dyeing, I'd be willing to wait so it could be done tastefully as JC says.

 

[Chrissay_]

We received an overwhelming response from everyone. We have received tons of feedback regarding this reward.

First I would like to clarify with everyone that there will be a dye tag on the pet and there are NO neon colors.

On our first pass with the feedback we added some additional pets to the exempt list.

• Dread Warhorses
• Faction Horses

Previously it was just Hiryus, Lesser Hiryus, Cu Sidhes, Chicken Lizards, and Battle Chicken Lizards that were exempt from the pet dye.

We have also removed several colors right off the bat.

The ones that will not appear in the game are:

• Bright Blue
• Bright Red
• Dull Orange
• Orange
• Dull Green
• Blue
• Red

The timer for the dyes has also been updated to 7 days in game instead of real life time.

 

[Nastia Cross]

I can understand using dye on clothing and armor and weapons, there is a feasible mechanism for this (both in UO and IRL) but the use of dye on a pet IRL is just cruel

What about the cruelty of sending your pet into danger and forcing it to do your fighting for you?

Cruel, if done improperly, yes. But taming and training a pet to assist you in hunts and to fight along side you actually has a basis in reality; a long history actually. Hunting dogs used to sniff out prey, fighting dogs trained to fight a pack of wolves, war horses trained in battle field combat. All of these things are real. Pets may have been painted with special symbols for power and the like (think native american horses) but actually using dye on their skin I don't think I've ever heard of.

 

[Nastia Cross]

We received an overwhelming response from everyone. We have received tons of feedback regarding this reward.

First I would like to clarify with everyone that there will be a dye tag on the pet and there are NO neon colors.

On our first pass with the feedback we added some additional pets to the exempt list.

• Dread Warhorses
• Faction Horses

Previously it was just Hiryus, Lesser Hiryus, Cu Sidhes, Chicken Lizards, and Battle Chicken Lizards that were exempt from the pet dye.

We have also removed several colors right off the bat.

The ones that will not appear in the game are:

• Bright Blue
• Bright Red
• Dull Orange
• Orange
• Dull Green
• Blue
• Red

The timer for the dyes has also been updated to 7 days in game instead of real life time.

Chrissay, you really should add Nightmares to that exempt category (for the same reason as dread warhorses). Also, what about the rare SL warhorse color? That should be removed from the possibilities as well (though I would rather the entire thing be scrapped, but I see that's not going to happen at this point in time).

 

[Hildebrand]

Decision had been made to put pet dyes.
Thank you Chrissay for giving us the opportunity to give feedback. This is great lately how it's open to discussion ( beta SA Expansion and all).

 

[RaDian FlGith]

Here you forgot history. When ToT were introduced, players were asking for metal dye tubs and expecting metallic colours. MrTact even discussed about the dyes saying it would please the players, and from the discussion he decided to put 50 uses instead of 10. At that time we were still believing it would be metallic colors. When ToT actually went out, we discovered the horrible hues they chose. A few were good, but there's been a storm on Stratics because that wasn't what we were asking at all.

So... ToT1 dyes... history... what players want...
I'm not sure you have a clear vision of all that.

Okay, interesting way of mixing two completely different paragraphs. SOME of you discovered how "horrible" the hues were that they chose. Others of us liked some of the hues some of you thought were horrible, others liked just about any of them. Again, it's about choice.

This weird idea that just because someone else uses something to change the color of something is somehow negatively impacting your game is silly, and if you're willing to quit UO over it, I can link you the Account Cancellation page.

 

[RaDian FlGith]

If your choice is making my game less enjoyable, then maybe I will ask for this choice not to be. And of course if your choice hasn't much impact on my part, I won't whine/cry/complain.
Just remember you are not alone in this game. If pet dyes aren't implemented, you'll be able to continue playing like you did before. If it is implemented, we won't be able to do as if they weren't there. So be careful about what you ask.

Okay, aside from "I don't want to have to look at that color," please qualify and quantify just how this is making your game "less enjoyable."

I understand I'm not alone in the game. Hell, if they put in these dyes, it's highly unlikely I'd ever even use them. But I AM aware that people have been asking to do this for a long time, and that Mythic's working to meet that request seems like a good thing.

Aside from your oversensitive retina, I'm not sure just exactly how your game is less enjoyable. Do you see someone walking down the street in bright colors and tell them to go home and change because the color of their shirt is somehow making your life less enjoyable?

I mean, honestly, this whole "I don't like the colors" thing is a straw man.

 

[GalenKnighthawke]

Upon reflection I have decided I have no issues or problems with this.

7 in-game days seems too short, isn't that like 1 RL day at most?

*shrugs*

I'm not using it so I'm reluctant to talk too much about it....Even in the timer change I'm really speaking too much about something I have no intention to use and doesn't effect me much. (This is unlike, for example, Imbuing, where it does effect me in a substantive way though I have no current plan to use it.)

I can make some money doing the quest and selling the dyes, I reckon, since there'll always be a need.



-Galen's player

 

[Tina Small]

I think this is the updated palette of colors for the pet dyes:

Regine, will you be giving us any hints on the rarity of the dyes for particular colors?

 

[Hildebrand]

Can we get pics of what they will look like in Enhanced Client?

 

[RaDian FlGith]

Please show me anywhere in all my posts where is said anything you have ranted about. You might even find a post of the colors I said I like.

Err... how about:

That is your opinion and you certainly have a right to it. On something like this I would hope that a 30%-40% majority would not be enough to sway them. You really think EA wants to upset 60%-70% of there player base at this time?

Which would have been responded to with:

If 60-70% of UO's players would be upset by this implementation, it's time for Mythic to pull the plug on UO for good. Frankly, the number of "I DON'T WANT TO HAVE TO LOOK AT THOSE COLORS, OW MY EYES" cries of exaggerated disgust are as melodramatic as the people who whined and cried about "neon" in the game.

The REMAINDER of my post is directed at the general tone of the thread, which is indicated by the words "Why some of you..." Now, unless you've become multiple people, I think I can safely say that I communicated extremely well that I was, at that point, communicating with more than just you (given that this is a public message board, and other people do tend to read posts even if they are largely between two people... and might even *gasp* then make their own comments).

I think the line "I've never seen a group of people..." might have reinforced the nature of that communication, but I suppose if you'd like to bear the brunt of my entire post, you're more than welcome to.

You, however, mentioned something about a 60-70% of people getting upset, and my response was that if that's the case, that 60-70% would be upset about dyed pets, that it's time to pull the plug on the game. The end all of that statement is: "This is not a change/addition that impacts anyone's game play in any tangible way other than the color of someone's pet, and if someone's going to get upset about that, they might as well have quit the game the first time someone walked around Brit Bank in a garish bright yellow, bright blue, bright pink outfit that could be made just from a normal dye tub."

So, are we clear now that I'm not accusing YOU of anything in particular, but that I was responding to the notion that you presented, and then directed the remainder of my post at the people who are vociferously exclaiming that their retinas might spontaneously combust?

 

[Maija]

RIP pink unicorn I don't know why everybody hated pink so much.

 

[Flora Green]

I voted for all of the colors and put my reasoning that if the dyes are to be added there should be a wide range of choice for everyone. I also stated that I think the dye time is far too short.

That said, I likely won't ever use a pet dye, but I'm very fond of the Dark Orange for some reason.

 

[guum]

The timer for the dyes has also been updated to 7 days in game instead of real life time.

Well that pretty much kills it right there. 7 in-game days is what, like a real-life afternoon? I certainly won't bother with pet dyes if I have to redye my pets every time I log on, and I can't imagine too awful many others will either.

Victory for the whiners! Yay.

Also, funny that most of the sorta natural colors got axed but that the bright primary colors are still in.

 

[RaDian FlGith]

There is a tasteful way to handle pet coloring and then there is the tasteless way. Hiryu coloring was an example of how to deal with the situation properly. A pet that was designed to come in different colors. Giving players a dye tub and telling them go to town is an example of the wrong way. Cu Sidhes are an example of the wrong way also, they were obviously never designed for coloring as are most pets.

And yet you'll see a number of people decrying these dyes who also believe that the hiryu colors are already garish enough.

There is going to be no pleasing everyone.

Now, I will say I agree with you fully, that if the animals were changed so that portions of them would dye (though, dragons, save breath weapons, should dye completely), it would be a better solution. However, I also believe that the SA and ML clothing should have been grayscale like the original UO clothing so that dyes could apply to them properly, and we've seen how well that worked (older Dev Team, not this team's fault).

Yes, there are better ways for them to handle this, but given limited time and resources, is this implementation really that hard to accept? I mean, it is absolutely not going to bother me seeing a dyed dragon anymore than seeing someone dressed in all blaze does. I might snicker. I might call the person tasteless. But above and beyond that, I really don't care... it's THEIR choice.

 

[The Fallout]

Well that pretty much kills it right there. 7 in-game days is what, like a real-life afternoon? I certainly won't bother with pet dyes if I have to redye my pets every time I log on, and I can't imagine too awful many others will either.

Maybe they mean 7 days of playing, if it is 7 days in the UO world, I am not even going to bother. I do enjoy the colors they kept though.

 

[Maija]

Yes, I am pretty sure it means 7 days of play time. It was phrased "seven days in game", not "seven in-game days".

 

[Crysta]

You should put a visible timer that shows how much time is left on the dyes, if it is indeed "seven days of time spent in game".

Yes, this comment is mostly me just wanting to make the things look even uglier to spite the people that use them, but it would also be useful to those people.

 

[JC the Builder]

Yes, I am pretty sure it means 7 days of play time. It was phrased "seven days in game", not "seven in-game days".

If someone plays 2 hours a day it will take 84 days or nearly 3 months before the dye wears off!

If these dyes get in we will only be one step away from this:

 

[Poo]

all i can picture is horrible neon dragons everywhere, and as one poster said, people dying their dread mares faction horse colors and confusing people. Tamers don't belong in fel anyways, and i try to avoid putting myself on foot to dismount a tamer...what a terrible surprise that would be.

that brings up an interesting thought..... faction pets SHOULD be rehued to the color of that faction.

no?

that would make them easilly seen for what they are.
faction pets.

like a red tamers pets are red.
a COM guys pets should all be powder blue, a TB purple, a SL green and a MX that deep red.

interesting.

 

[wrekognize]

We received an overwhelming response from everyone. We have received tons of feedback regarding this reward.

First I would like to clarify with everyone that there will be a dye tag on the pet and there are NO neon colors.

On our first pass with the feedback we added some additional pets to the exempt list.

• Dread Warhorses
• Faction Horses

Previously it was just Hiryus, Lesser Hiryus, Cu Sidhes, Chicken Lizards, and Battle Chicken Lizards that were exempt from the pet dye.

We have also removed several colors right off the bat.

The ones that will not appear in the game are:

• Bright Blue
• Bright Red
• Dull Orange
• Orange
• Dull Green
• Blue
• Red

The timer for the dyes has also been updated to 7 days in game instead of real life time.

Neon or not, With all those colors, our world is going to look tacky. It's a bad idea.

...

 

[Sakkarah_]

To answer a couple of the question and another misunderstanding:

When it says 7 in-game days, it actually means the duration of 7 real life days of played time. So the same way you have to spend 40 rl hours in game to work off a murder count, your pet remains hued for 168 hours in game. Note that the timer starts from the moment the pet owner logs in. So if that pet is stabled, the clock is still ticking.

About rarity, you have an equal chance at getting any of the colors unless the RNG starts acting up.

Nightmares and fire steeds are currently still dyable.

 

[The Fallout]

If someone plays 2 hours a day it will take 84 days or nearly 3 months before the dye wears off!

If these dyes get in we will only be one step away from this:

Um, no.

 

[Chrissay_]

If someone plays 2 hours a day it will take 84 days or nearly 3 months before the dye wears off!

If these dyes get in we will only be one step away from this:

This is not correct. If you scroll up to the above picture with the X's on them those are the colors that you will be able to dye. As mentioned before there will be NO neon colors.

 

[The Fallout]

This is not correct. If you scroll up to the above picture with the X's on them those are the colors that you will be able to dye. As mentioned before there will be NO neon colors.

He's just whining.

 

[AirmidCecht]

To answer a couple of the question and another misunderstanding:

When it says 7 in-game days, it actually means the duration of 7 real life days of played time. So the same way you have to spend 40 rl hours in game to work off a murder count, your pet remains hued for 168 hours in game. Note that the timer starts from the moment the pet owner logs in. So if that pet is stabled, the clock is still ticking.

About rarity, you have an equal chance at getting any of the colors unless the RNG starts acting up.

Nightmares and fire steeds are currently still dyable.

Regine,

May I respectfully ask why this reward was considered? I mean the process that led developers to this conclusion? It may help the community grasp on if an understanding behind it took place.

Thank you,
Airmid

 

[Petra Fyde]

JC knows what the colours are Chrissay, he's using part of the original graphic in his sig. He's indulging in a little 'scare tactics' trolling.

 

[wrekognize]

This is not correct. If you scroll up to the above picture with the X's on them those are the colors that you will be able to dye. As mentioned before there will be NO neon colors.

We know the colors are different. I believe his point by posting this pic is to show how ridiculous our world will look with multiple colored animals...all over the place.

...

 

[Crysta]

Not to mention that these things always tend to "expand" over time with new options added in... which I think was his point. This is the "foot in the door" moment.

 

[Specialshoes]

This is not correct. If you scroll up to the above picture with the X's on them those are the colors that you will be able to dye. As mentioned before there will be NO neon colors.

No Chrissay JC has a legitimate concern. At one time when colored animals became available it was stated that they would stay on whatever that weird test shard was. Now they have made their way to the main shards. I now legitimately share the concern that neons and glacials will make their way in.

After doing some searching it was the Test Sosaria shard.

 

[JC the Builder]

JC knows what the colours are Chrissay, he's using part of the original graphic in his sig. He's indulging in a little 'scare tactics' trolling.

I'm just saying that once the first colors are in people are going to want more. The development team has put in those colors on Cu Sidhes, except for the Glacial Blue.

 

[christy1221]

I like the colors and look forward to using them.

Of course I like having animals with different colors. I love my ice white
cu sidhe and would love to have a blaze one.

 

[RaDian FlGith]

[Question already answered...]

 

[Godiva_DF]

We received an overwhelming response from everyone. We have received tons of feedback regarding this reward.

First I would like to clarify with everyone that there will be a dye tag on the pet and there are NO neon colors...........
.........

I wonder why you bothered to put up a survey if it is already decided. After one day. I only got my fellow german forumites interested in the survey today.

I am sure europeans are not amused...

 

[RaDian FlGith]

If someone plays 2 hours a day it will take 84 days or nearly 3 months before the dye wears off!

If these dyes get in we will only be one step away from this:

Great job, JC, in flying off to the opposite end of the spectrum and failing to take note that the Dev Team has indeed been listening to feedback regarding this and has eliminated colors from the list based off of feedback, and did not even consider the colors you are considering I'm going to bet simply because they themselves did not want to get to that point.

They chose a palette that they felt would be acceptable, and because of some feedback, they have lessened the palette.

Would you care for an acorn to the head? You could rush through the forums claiming the sky is falling too.

 

[Tina Small]

I'm still not crazy about the whole idea of dyed pets but at this point I think I'm finished wasting any more energy on it. I'm happy Regine took the time to put up a survey for people outside the closed beta to provide their opinions and I'm glad she was willing to compromise on several issues. Now I hope she's able to cross this issue off the list of last-minute tasks for the SA expansion and move on to the next one.

 

[Tanivar]

Definitely NO!

If this dye job atrocity has to become part of this game then at least include the option for 2D & SA players to filter out the dye colors and see the natural ones.

Let the player color his pets any way he likes so he can tell his pet from the others, but spare the rest of us the choice of putting up with it or not playing.

If this pet dye bit is done, at least make it require SA to see it. That will give some of us a way to avoid it. We can just stick with ML. I'll give up the neat Crafting changes to avoid the joke of bizzare pet colors.

The Pet Color con counterbalances the pro of the Crafting Changes without a doubt.

 

[Nastia Cross]

When it says 7 in-game days, it actually means the duration of 7 real life days of played time. So the same way you have to spend 40 rl hours in game to work off a murder count, your pet remains hued for 168 hours in game. Note that the timer starts from the moment the pet owner logs in. So if that pet is stabled, the clock is still ticking.

Yeah wow, that's way too long a time frame.

 

[Merik]

I just wanted to point out I could do the survey over and over and over.
Hows that work for seeing how many responses you get?

How do you make up your minds to put it in game after 1 single
day? Do you know how many people don't play daily?

 

[Petra Fyde]

Yes, the team that did ML did put in blaze cu sidhe - but the current team has been actively moving away from neon and to more muted colours in every recent introduction of coloured items - ie, the acid slime colours and the recent tokuno dyes. - All colours are more muted in the enhanced client. Neon colours do not feature in the plans of the current development team.

 

[RaDian FlGith]

I wonder why you bothered to put up a survey if it is already decided. After one day. I only got my fellow german forumites interested in the survey today.

I am sure europeans are not amused...

Because there's been plenty of discussion on it in the course of that one day, because I'm sure the survey probably showed them what they already suspected was true.

Don't think that Sakkarah just woke up one morning and thought, hey, let's make pets ugly... she's the person who decided -- arguably incorrectly, but that's her call to make -- that the new plants wouldn't come in the new colors because of how they looked. While I may respectfully disagree with her decision regarding those particular plants (different color flaxes and dark blue hedges, myself), I do appreciate she's trying to keep certain aesthetics in the game.

So while maybe some of us are thinking this is the end of the UO world as we know it and we're 12 feet from blaze dragons and hot pink ostards, I think we need to also understand that people have, indeed, wanted to dye pets for quite some time, and while maybe not the palette that some people want, there is now an option for those who wish to do so.

And this is good for personal play choice, the core foundation of UO.

 

[RaDian FlGith]

Yeah wow, that's way too long a time frame.

Yeah, uh, no it's not.

The hardcore players who will be getting the dyes by the droves will be able to dye their pets, and they'll cycle through them pretty quickly (relative to the original 7 days).

Casual players won't be penalized for not having played their tamer every day of the week to appreciate their dye colors.

It's still not a permanent dye job, but it does allow a greater sense of fairness in the casual vs. hardcore spectrum, and for that very reason, I applaud the decision to handle it this way.

 

[RaDian FlGith]

The Pet Color con counterbalances the pro of the Crafting Changes without a doubt.

Way to blow it out of proportion.

I'm amazed at how the color of a pet is now affecting potential enjoyment of the remainder of the SA content.

What next? Blaze cloaks have completely ruined my ability to kill a mongbat because I get so distracted when someone runs by in one that my avatar freezes in place, stunned by the attrocious color, and I die in one fell swoop?

I really need to find a way to charge for tickets to view this thread. I could make money on the explosive melodrama by the billions.

 

[Specialshoes]

What next? Blaze cloaks have completely ruined my ability to kill a mongbat because I get so distracted when someone runs by in one that my avatar freezes in place, stunned by the attrocious color, and I die in one fell swoop?

This is already the case.