The truth about Gold in Uo..

[Loriel]

Tina, the amount of hours those guys put in compared to the hours they get paid, they are practically doing it for free anyway for the love of the game.

I am suggesting a consolidation of resources yes because less is actually more Lady Cat.

For people who want events all the time certain players on each shard should be responsible for arranging boss fights etc.. @Escaflowne has been doing a good job of that on Europa.

I will be clear the turn out whilst very good was nothing like what it could be should the whole of UO turn up on one shard all fighting for a those few elusive pieces of powerful equipment once a month.

It also allows a real story line and plot to evolve rather than simply a mish mash of ideas and isolated stories.

I think its great how they tied that Europa Event into the new Expansion but it would have been better still if that event item... the eye had to be brought to the next one because it would unlock this etc etc and carrying it on your person granted invulnerability in the next fight or a buff etc, it doesn't necessarily have to even be permanent but perhaps in certain zones becomes active.

There are loads of ways to make those EM event items uniquely useful for players and more desirable and investable should someone want to purchase.

 

[Loriel]

Lady Cat can I also suggest that the content gets a little worn out by so many events happening so frequently... its that vicious cycle again... really it is about quality not quantity or a balance of both.

 

[Tina Small]

Tina, the amount of hours those guys put in compared to the hours they get paid, they are practically doing it for free anyway for the love of the game.

I am suggesting a consolidation of resources yes because less is actually more Lady Cat.

For people who want events all the time certain players on each shard should be responsible for arranging boss fights etc.. @Escaflowne has been doing a good job of that on Europa.

I will be clear the turn out whilst very good was nothing like what it could be should the whole of UO turn up on one shard all fighting for a those few elusive pieces of powerful equipment once a month.

It also allows a real story line and plot to evolve rather than simply a mish mash of ideas and isolated stories.

I think its great how they tied that Europa Event into the new Expansion but it would have been better still if that event item... the eye had to be brought to the next one because it would unlock this etc etc and carrying it on your person granted invulnerability in the next fight or a buff etc, it doesn't necessarily have to even be permanent but perhaps in certain zones becomes active.

There are loads of ways to make those EM event items uniquely useful for players and more desirable and investable should someone want to purchase.

So your goal is to drastically reduce EM events so just one player per month, out of all of UO's players, will get some god-like piece of equipment to keep or to sell for major amounts of gold or cash, while everyone else either goes away from the event disgusted because they didn't get something, or is disgusted because they spent the entire time crashing because the server was overloaded, or reads later about the event and is disgusted because they weren't able to log on at that time?

 

[Loriel]

Well maybe not one but whatever the drop rate per event is now, that way if someone doesn't show up to the next one with that item that unlocks such and such then the other couple who do can make sure the next event goes forward.

The whole point is even if they didn't get the powerful item, they still turned up to a meaningful event... still got some very good loot (better than what they could normally) and still joined into something major that was happening to Sosaria.

Also time zones are a factor.. I was being deliberately effusive about it being the "entire" of Sosaria showing up to these events... but it would encourage a fair few more than usual.

The servers can handle it I am sure, I've seen some big events that have been fine with a lot of players but its as much about how the spawns operate as the number of players. If its just loads of spawn in one area then it can get clogged a bit but do a spawn in one area then move somewhere else... have pitched battles on open fields etc... rather than just repeated spawn over and over and make it feel more immersive.

 

[Loriel]

Another point about the platform handling that many players at once... I play on EC which can handle a lot more than the classic client... it might encourage a few more players to move with the times and upgrade their clients if they want to be a part of the next big events.

 

[Tanivar]

Another point about the platform handling that many players at once... I play on EC which can handle a lot more than the classic client... it might encourage a few more players to move with the times and upgrade their clients if they want to be a part of the next big events.

It wouldn't be moving with the times Loriel, or an upgrade. The EC, while it has more bells & whistles, the graphics are worse, the animation isn't done well, and it's a fairly mediocre UI. You may be right in that it can handle more going on than the CC can which is certainly a positive point in it's favor, but it's certainly doesn't rate being called an upgrade. Play with both clients and it quickly becomes apparent there's a clunker hidden under the bells & whistles.

What would encourage more players to get involved would be each player having the same chance of getting the big prize which can't happen when some players run ten characters at once.

 

[Zosimus]

No Matter what they use! Today is Gold, tomorrow can be Diamond or anything, the new currency will have the same value of the gold

Cutting the Zeros would not help at all, if the tangle was 50M and now is 5M, people will still pay the 5M, This will only make the Current value of the gold go up... and people will still pay whatever price...

I will repeat what was posted here before! "If I play 15 Hours a Day to make my Gold, and you play 2 hours a Week, Why I have to share my gold with you??, I work really hard for my Gold, I pay for well over 30 Accounts, I invest a lot of my real life time on it, and PLS explain me, why I have to share with someone that only play 2 hours......I dont think is fair at all!!

People need to stop crying and playing their own game... It is SO easy to make 100M a day, and If you are smart and work hard, you can raise 1 Billion in 1 week of work!!.

I will give you example, that dont require any type of Brain... If you just sit on Luna Bank and listen to the Gen Chat, you can buy and resell Items, Houses and so many other things to different type of players all day long.

I can buy the soulforge for 90M if someone is "desperate" for gold to buy whatever they need, and I can resell for 140M (I just made 50M)
and you can do that ALL day long....

What my comment means is once they turn gold into digital form tied to an account the current method of gold duping will become extinct.

 

[Loriel]

It wouldn't be moving with the times Loriel, or an upgrade. The EC, while it has more bells & whistles, the graphics are worse, the animation isn't done well, and it's a fairly mediocre UI. You may be right in that it can handle more going on than the CC can which is certainly a positive point in it's favor, but it's certainly doesn't rate being called an upgrade. Play with both clients and it quickly becomes apparent there's a clunker hidden under the bells & whistles.

What would encourage more players to get involved would be each player having the same chance of getting the big prize which can't happen when some players run ten characters at once.

I have to disagree with you about what you say regarding the graphics and animation on the EC because if you have spent more than five minutes playing on it you will see that everything is a lot smoother and user friendly.

People seem to say they took one look at it and didn't give it a chance because it was not how they remembered UO to be like in terms of how it looks.

True to some extent but what is more true is that the CC is very outdated, the old monster models for things like elementals etc look shocking these days and the proportions and dimensions within the isometric frame look totally squashed and boxy.

Do you think the developers that want to move the game on and make it more accessible, up to date graphically, faster and more reliable would even bother to keep the CC if people weren't demanding that they would quit if it got scrapped ?

 

[Tina Small]

I have to disagree with you about what you say regarding the graphics and animation on the EC because if you have spent more than five minutes playing on it you will see that everything is a lot smoother and user friendly.

People seem to say they took one look at it and didn't give it a chance because it was not how they remembered UO to be like in terms of how it looks.

True to some extent but what is more true is that the CC is very outdated, the old monster models for things like elementals etc look shocking these days and the proportions and dimensions within the isometric frame look totally squashed and boxy.

Do you think the developers that want to move the game on and make it more accessible, up to date graphically, faster and more reliable would even bother to keep the CC if people weren't demanding that they would quit if it got scrapped ?

Have you watched videos of the dev team from the last three to four years that included any kind of discussion of the two clients? It's pretty clear in several of them, from comments she has made, that Mesanna is still very attached to the Classic Client. So it's a little tough for me to believe at this point that the developers as a whole are anxious to completely get rid of the Classic Client.

 

[Loriel]

Well that is called being political Tina.

At some point they will have to scrap it to move forward and be really competitive.

They will have to scrap the isometric viewpoint as well at some point but that will be gradual.

One possible suggestion on this front is for EA to simply buy up all the work Richard Garriott has been doing over the last few years, employ all the polish that EA have at their disposal to the structure and framework he has put in place and tie together all the content that has been produced by fans of the Ultima series and specifically Ultima Online.

I can't think of any better way to complete a return to Virtue in Sosaria then welcoming Lord British back into the fold.

 

[Loriel]

There's an interview I watched after making that last comment and you can probably see a bit better what I am talking about regarding adding that commercial polish that EA specialise in to the foundations, structure and framework these guys have been developing.

 

[Loriel]

I don't know what the figure would be to create a brand new MMO from scratch, concepts, artwork, branding, storyline, mechanics, world building, modelling etc. but it certainly would be a lot more than taking these two very well developed projects and forging them together.

 

[Loriel]

Could be very exciting for all involved and "The" MMO of the next generation.

 

[Tanivar]

I have to disagree with you about what you say regarding the graphics and animation on the EC because if you have spent more than five minutes playing on it you will see that everything is a lot smoother and user friendly.

I've spent more than five minutes using the EC Loriel. I have it installed on my computers because it has it's uses, and no, if you spend time using both clients, the CC is the better UI.

People seem to say they took one look at it and didn't give it a chance because it was not how they remembered UO to be like in terms of how it looks.

The clients graphics are very similar other than the quality of how the client displays them. Aside from all the screen clutter the EC has.

True to some extent but what is more true is that the CC is very outdated, the old monster models for things like elementals etc look shocking these days and the proportions and dimensions within the isometric frame look totally squashed and boxy.

The clients graphics are very similar other than the quality of how the client displays them. Aside from all the screen clutter the EC has.

Do you think the developers that want to move the game on and make it more accessible, up to date graphically, faster and more reliable would even bother to keep the CC if people weren't demanding that they would quit if it got scrapped ?

They have to keep the CC until they produce a client that is at least as good a UI as the CC is so the bulk of their customers will switch to it. They've tried three times now and have failed, though at least they gave this latest try some handy bells & whistles. They need to outsource the creation of a new UI to a company who knows what they are doing and get it done right. Such companies are out there has other games have good UI. People with a clue at making UI are out there. A graphically faster and more reliable client would be nice to have.

And yes, given my experience playing UO using the EC, if it was the only client, I'd be spending my time playing another game. Not even all the good content UO has could keep me playing. A game is only enjoyable if it has good content and a good UI to reach that content.

My career was in electronics quality control, the EC would never have been released upon our customers.

 

[Lord Nabin]

I actually clicked "Unwatch" on a thread.

Now that is a first

*picks up knarled oak staff, adjusts robes, and exits the tavern through the side door*

 

[Loriel]

Lol @Lord Nabin

@Tanivar did you work for a electronics hardware company is that what you are saying ? The quality standards in terms of stability are a lot different between hardware and software. Think of the EC as the latest debug development kit in terms of its utility.

As you can see I don't think the EC is the long term future but it is pretty vital in terms of getting people to accept that UO needs to make some serious changes to compete and be self sustaining.

I think of it as a ford in the river for UO.

To this effect I have had a look at Shroud of the Avatar and where it is at right now in terms of development.

Yes the basic framework and crucial role playing aspects seem to be there but you can see that there is still a lot of work to be done in a very condensed amount of time.

Conceptually it is great but without the necessary components tying together in a fluent gaming experience, people will not come back to it.

I honestly think Richard has put too much distance from himself and what UO is and was to make Shroud of the Avatar the next step for UO.

One of the major areas for improvement is the combat...it seems stifled, slow and clunky trying to appease WoW fans and UO fans at the same time.

To really give this type of game the edge it needs to reflect on the fast and frenetic pvp gameplay of UO but also include the interactivity and action orientated combat of a game like the Witcher 3 (which has just been released).

To be honest Shroud of the Avatar is miles off anything close to that yet and the "deck" of abilities seems to serve only to slow the combat down rather than allow for fluidity.

In terms of taking a real combat RPG as an example the Gothic series by Pyranha Bites/Deep Silver was cutting edge.

Everything is based on timing your attacks correctly in the window of opportunity between when you have avoided/blocked an enemy attack to when that enemy returns to its defensive stance ready to block and avoid you.

Each enemy has its own specific timing and attack combinations, some have ranged attacks and you need to work your way towards them with evasive manouvers etc. or put up a magic shield as you cast towards them.

These are not just conceptual ideas they have been implemented for a long time... the Gothic series is fairly old now at least ten years since the first.

 

[Tanivar]

I actually clicked "Unwatch" on a thread.

Now that is a first

*picks up knarled oak staff, adjusts robes, and exits the tavern through the side door*

Client discussions keep turning up don't they.

EDIT: I dealt with hardware and the software running it. Some engineers and programmers did nice work, some didn't.

Back to the gold discussion.

 

[Loriel]

Well in terms of the level of gold Richard Garriott can expect to receive from EA for his work on SOTA - A decent salary with limited financial control over the project, in order to immerse his creative ideas with where the main area of his content is located in UO.

EA can then utilise their resources to build the world to a high level of functionality on their own terms.

I don't like to say it but SOTA is still basically an interactive story board... I reiterate all the substance of the game he is looking to make is still locked into Ultima Online.

 

[Loriel]

Get hold of the people who engineered the combat system for the Gothic games, now repackaged and remade as the Risen series.

They themselves had a company split and Risen emerged from that as the more successful, whereas Arcania took on a linear and ultimately unsuccessful route with the Gothic rights being handed back to the original developers after its failure.

Developer Pyranha Bytes - split from Jowood.... Spellbound developed Arcania for Jowood - rights reclaimed by Pyranha Bytes. TrueStory.

 

[Loriel]

Pyranha Bytes is a pretty small company really... what would be the buyout cost at that auction ?

 

[Loriel]

Well in terms of the level of gold Richard Garriott can expect to receive from EA for his work on SOTA - A decent salary with limited financial control over the project, in order to immerse his creative ideas with where the main area of his content is located in UO.

EA can then utilise their resources to build the world to a high level of functionality on their own terms.

I don't like to say it but SOTA is still basically an interactive story board... I reiterate all the substance of the game he is looking to make is still locked into Ultima Online.

On the flip side of this... no one apart from Garriott himself has enough understanding of the depth of Ultima Online to successfully translate the content to a modern and fully immersive platform.

 

[Loriel]

What I mean by this is as follows

1) Leading the story arc on from where it is now as opposed to simply borrowing from other narratives and histories. - The Return of Lord British enabling..

2) Development of a cohesive Virtue system in which the Virtues are interdependent upon one another for the development of the Virtuous Character. - This is an area which remains very interesting but still somewhat shallow and under utilised in the game's current iteration.

3) Freedom of choice that is so integral to what UO is really about... no other MMORPG comes close and that means what consequence are there to the game should you choose to be virtuous in your actions... both in dealing via trade etc. with other players and within the virtue/vice system of combat.

Point 3 in particular is the most relevant I feel as this is where everything can be tied together... there was nothing wrong with the system of faction crafting etc. so how about integrating all of UO into being involved in VvV in some way.

Naturally most crafters don't want to be killed or be in a war zone so the fighters be they magic wielding or warrior builds have a duty to protect them... this gives them virtue gains in this area etc etc... some Virtues are harder to achieve than others depending on what build u have for example Warriors naturally are valorous as they fight in combat whereas a crafter would find a valour gain more difficult but a courage gain less so.

 

[Loriel]

What I mean by this is as follows

1) Leading the story arc on from where it is now as opposed to simply borrowing from other narratives and histories. - The Return of Lord British enabling..

2) Development of a cohesive Virtue system in which the Virtues are interdependent upon one another for the development of the Virtuous Character. - This is an area which remains very interesting but still somewhat shallow and under utilised in the game's current iteration.

3) Freedom of choice that is so integral to what UO is really about... no other MMORPG comes close and that means what consequence are there to the game should you choose to be virtuous in your actions... both in dealing via trade etc. with other players and within the virtue/vice system of combat.

Point 3 in particular is the most relevant I feel as this is where everything can be tied together... there was nothing wrong with the system of faction crafting etc. so how about integrating all of UO into being involved in VvV in some way.

Naturally most crafters don't want to be killed or be in a war zone so the fighters be they magic wielding or warrior builds have a duty to protect them... this gives them virtue gains in this area etc etc... some Virtues are harder to achieve than others depending on what build u have for example Warriors naturally are valorous as they fight in combat whereas a crafter would find a valour gain more difficult but a courage gain less so.

To expand upon this a crafter would find humility gains less strenuous than a warrior would as warriors are often arrogant in their strength.

A Samurai would find Spirituality reasonably quickly compared to others and use that to advantage in combat, whereas the spirituality of a tamer... effectively a shepherd would be useful in another way to them.

Of course then if these virtue gains were then used to perform evil acts then they become vices.

Depending on how far you have developed a virtue... if you performed an evil act using the bonuses it would drop your karma way below the requirement to use that virtue gain again, until you have regained your good nature.

 

[Lord Frodo]

FACT
UO has already stated that they WILL NOT GET RID OF THE CLASSIC CLIENT, EVER. What part of that statement is so hard to understand. The Dark Lady has restated this also and this dates back to when they dropped KR and started EC. They DID NOT get the support for their shiny new client and stated that BOTH CLIENTS WILL BE SUPPORTED FOREVER.

FACT
Turn off CC and UO dies.

FACT
Turn off EC and UO dies.

 

[Merlin]

Be aware that mods are going to close the thread if this goes off topic and veers into comparisons of the EC versus the CC.

Don't we already have plenty of threads related to this 'great debate'?

 

[Tanivar]

On the game's gold problem, the main problem symptom is the inflated prices on things that put so much out of the reach of so many who haven't put in the 100,000 hours of play to build up the needed bank balances and can't because of RL timesinks. There needs to be a cost control system set up on everything but rares and the very high end items so that those who come back or start new are not a 100,000 hours of gold gathering away from being able to play with the big dogs. PvPers want more PvPers to fight but the new ones can't fight with any hope of winning because they lack the super uber gear. PvP isn't Player vs Player anymore, it's Equipment vs Equipment.

And while those with humongous bank balances can easily make millions & billions, not to mention kazillions in a mere afternoon, building up enough gold to take part in such high level deals takes time many can't put into the game.

 

[Yadd of Legends]

How many off-topic posts in a row does it take to qualify as trolling? And yet there are people who complain the forum moderators are too strict

 

[Merlin]

There needs to be a cost control system set up on everything

And while those with humongous bank balances can easily make millions & billions, not to mention kazillions in a mere afternoon, building up enough gold to take part in such high level deals takes time many can't put into the game.

1) No there doesn't need to be a cost control system on anything. Having a max item price of 175M is enough of a cost control.

If you don't have the time to play as much as another player, quite frankly, that's just too bad. Survival of the fittest. Cry us a river about real life getting in the way. We all have RL responsibilities outside of UO that take us away from the game. The people who play the most and make the most gold are the ones who should be able to afford the most high end items. And if you can't play that much or make that much gold... then there is a pretty decent number of gold brokers and sellers whom you can get gold from at a fair price.

2) People with "humongous bank balances" don't just easily make gold by snapping their fingers. That's a fantasy.

Most of the gold brokers and rare item brokers take risks and invest their own time and actual money into what they have. Their reward is whatever profit made for the risks they take. If you're not taking similar risks, you shouldn't be expecting similar rewards. And even then, its really usually not that much money. Of the few gold brokers I know, most only make $10 to $20 of profit for every billion gold they sell. There are other brokers out there who act as pawn shops for rare items, and in some cases, have gotten stuck holding the bag. That's capitalism. That's how risk and reward works.

 

[Loriel]

You've just been reported mate.

 

[Loriel]

I had hoped they would make a new thread so I could link it in with this one btw but as no one seems interested in discussing that topic... I don't really see the point.

I wrote it for the developers to look at anyway really... anyone else who sees it well... they are entitled to their opinions.

 

[Tanivar]

I'm thinking of getting more players in the game by wanting price controls on necessary to compete items. For the unnecessary to compete rares and such I couldn't care less about the prices.

If people who want to play PvP they need high end gear to compete. having to play weeks or months, if not years, to get enough gold is required, they'll go play another game, and of course we'll lose some PvPers who are bored with the game because there is hardly anyone to fight. They to will wander off to another game.

My own play, when I play, is the gatherer/crafter scene. I've no use for the high end mega-million priced items. I make anything I need with my Crafter's skills. The upwards of a couple hundred million I have in checks just ties up bank storage on several characters. I could lose every gold piece I have and keep right on playing.

 

[Tanivar]

You've just been reported mate.

Must be me you reported. Only you and I have gone so badly off topic that we've drawn corrective comments from others.

 

[Loriel]

nah I reported that merlin creature

 

[Loriel]

against TOS etc etc

 

[Loriel]

must have nothing to lose if he is being that blatant now

 

[Tanivar]

against TOS etc etc

You following the same TOS we are? His posts above look fine.

 

[Loriel]

You following the same TOS we are? His posts above look fine.

Well you are blind by what you look at then... too shiny to see straight.

 

[Merlin]

nah I reported that merlin creature

Reported me for what?

Can you maybe post your comments in one post at a time, like everyone else on Stratics? Or do you have to post 3 or 4 times in a row to inflate your total post count?

Even the person I was disagreeing with, Tanivar, doesn't see wrong with my post. We may have totally different ideas, but we're not the one trolling this thread... i.e., bringing up the EC vs CC debate, talking about virtues, so on and so forth.

 

[Loriel]

corruption corruption everywhere but not a drop to drink... what's it like on your desert island mate ?

 

[Merlin]

corruption corruption everywhere but not a drop to drink... what's it like on your desert island mate ?

Supporting free-market unregulated capitalism is reportable corruption? Please. Quit the act, dude.

But we all know what this is... unable to add to the conversation, you pull those type of semantics. Taking us off topic and away from the conversation...

 

[Riyana]

This thread has gone off the rails too many times now. It's done.