Should guild size be limited?

[Lady Lavendar]

Guild size used to be limited by the size of a guild stone--which would only hold about 140 members before it overloaded. Although it was inconvenient, guilds simply got additional stones to put the folks on who wished to be in the guild, and divided it by age, or template, or some other means. It became an administrative problem for the guild leaders to handle additional stones. Since guilds currently can stone ally, it would not really make any difference to limit the guilds to 25 members--since you could have multiple guild alliances.

As I have managed guild stones and guild membership when we had stones and limitations, and now when we don't, I vastly prefer the system now, and would say no way should we go back to a limitation on guild member numbers.

So, short answer is NO.

 

[Exgirlfriend]

This by far is the most unbalanced thing in UO. You either belong to one of these massive guilds or you go without and die trying everytime.

 

[Duskofdead]

Small groups can be extremely competitive as long as they are managed well. Unfortunately you don't see much of that anymore.

You make it sound like it's individual players' fault for not forming elite, small guilds and standing up to the huge zerg ones.

The huge zerg ones exist in the first place because people in game will always take the path of least resistance. If you have to be 98% on your game to compete in a small guild, and only have to be 40% on your game to compete in a large guild with tons of backup, which are you going to do?

It's a no brainer.

 

[Nastia Cross]

The real problem with champ spawns is the fact that somehow the main 1 or 2 guilds magically seem to know if someone's doing a spawn, no matter which spawn or what time you do it. Not the fact that they have a lot of people.

its called scouting...perhaps you should try it sometime.

stealth...hiding...ninja...all you need.

THANK YOU!! about time someone with some actual sense posted... seriously ppl, you want to know what's going on at champ spawns, scout them yourself. hiding and stealth for the win...

 

[RichDC]

You make it sound like it's individual players' fault for not forming elite, small guilds and standing up to the huge zerg ones.

The huge zerg ones exist in the first place because people in game will always take the path of least resistance. If you have to be 98% on your game to compete in a small guild, and only have to be 40% on your game to compete in a large guild with tons of backup, which are you going to do?

It's a no brainer.

Im going to disagree with this...

Now i may sound hypocritical being in last i checked the 4th largest guild in uo...but my point is that even with a large guild we only have a few members who go to fel, however, we GO to fel!

And we are always outnumbered!!and usually ...strike that...always outskilled i could have chosen to leave this guild and go to one of said ZERG guilds, but i chose not to, i want to play with the group im with as i happen to get on with them and enjoy playing alongside them.

Large guilds give more of a community feel if maintained properly hence i say no to the rule otherwise how would you have a MASS multiplayer??

 

[Exgirlfriend]

One last thing, sence day one of powerscrolls, well i mean sence the red changes they made back then. Everyone has said make a bigger guild to compete, but to this day the exact same massive guilds still control this part of the game on every shard. Sure they might have a bad day, but 99% of the time it's these exact same guilds that win.

I hope the games dev's address this issue, it's simply not fair.

 

[Duskofdead]

Im going to disagree with this...

Now i may sound hypocritical being in last i checked the 4th largest guild in uo...but my point is that even with a large guild we only have a few members who go to fel, however, we GO to fel!

And we are always outnumbered!!and usually ...strike that...always outskilled i could have chosen to leave this guild and go to one of said ZERG guilds, but i chose not to, i want to play with the group im with as i happen to get on with them and enjoy playing alongside them.

Large guilds give more of a community feel if maintained properly hence i say no to the rule otherwise how would you have a MASS multiplayer??

Well you're outnumbered in Fel by the huge zerg guilds. Why do so many people want to join the big zerg guilds? Don't "real" PvP'ers want challenge? Thrill? Danger? I guess real PvP'ers are a small minority. Most just want to be l33t and kill other players and congratulate themselves on how awesomely l33t they are afterwards.

In this regard, I think UO PvP is unfixable in terms of this issue you guys are talking about. UO PvP was designed for a game and era where RPG'ers populated UO. Guild wars, murderers, bandits, that kind of thing. You did have griefers and occasional guilds of griefers but that didn't get really bad until the year before Tram/Fel. It was when people with the more Quake/Diablo 2/Starcraft/Doom/Halo mindset "discovered" PvP in online RPG's, and more or less flooded and took it over (when people killing you in online RPG's stopped being named "Chaos" and started being named "dRuG PiMp") that PvP turned into zerg grieferfests and stayed that way. Unfortunately the 13 year old "but I wanna be an alpha male anyway" immaturity strain of PvP, now entrenced, will never go away unless rulesets and restrictions in game design mechanics prevent it from manifesting. (More advanced games have already headed this direction to some degree.. for instance, battlegrounds in World of Warcraft placing you in equally sized teams for PvP)

 

[Gellor]

Everyone has said make a bigger guild to compete, but to this day the exact same massive guilds still control this part of the game on every shard. Sure they might have a bad day, but 99% of the time it's these exact same guilds that win.

And the issue still is: PEOPLE HAVE NOT FORMED LARGER GUILDS TO COMPETE!!!

Here is a good example: The largest guild on Pac WAS FL. During their four+ year reign on Pac, not ONE large guild was made to compete. What killed them was infighting... nothing more.

Let me guess, you are not in a large guild nor are you willing to join/make a large guild to complete

 

[Exgirlfriend]

From my experence and yes ive been in small guilds, large guilds and played solo...the large guilds simply wait untill the small guild gets the spawn to near the end then raid them. it takes almost NO effert on there part.

This happens on every shard every day and it's totaly unbalanced.

 

[BloodstoneGL]

From my experence and yes ive been in small guilds, large guilds and played solo...the large guilds simply wait untill the small guild gets the spawn to near the end then raid them. it takes almost NO effert on there part.

This happens on every shard every day and it's totaly unbalanced.

It is not unbalanced, it ia the way it should work. Now should you get some more members and go over some tactics to hold the spawn, you would become self sufficient in completing many spawns yourself. If you don't want to be part of a large guild then you have no right to complain against those that do and you should not partake in the rewards that they earn. It is a Big Fish eats Little Fish world.

Just because you don't like huge guilds doesn't mean others don't like love them. I for one love them, they offer me more targets considering I run solo or 3 members max at a time.

 

[Duskofdead]

And the issue still is: PEOPLE HAVE NOT FORMED LARGER GUILDS TO COMPETE!!!

Here is a good example: The largest guild on Pac WAS FL. During their four+ year reign on Pac, not ONE large guild was made to compete. What killed them was infighting... nothing more.

Let me guess, you are not in a large guild nor are you willing to join/make a large guild to complete

LOL and I return to my original point. People go with the path of least resistance and if they're going to have to perform at 95% efficiency to survive in a smaller/building guild, or perform at 40% efficiency to survive by joining the already existing dominant guild, guess what they'll do.

The definition of insanity is what again? Doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result, right?

That could easily apply to looking at the problems with PvP guilds, how they have been since Tram/Fel, and merely lecturing players to do things that haven't worked to create a lasting change. If it hasn't happened in what, six, seven years, I fail to see how you expect that lecturing players to keep trying a failed suggestion will make a difference.

You probably know it won't, you're probably just on some kind of "I'm a crusader against whining" kick.

 

[Exgirlfriend]

Will some people be upset if they have to try harder for the same reward? im sure they will. But then again why should there effert be so much easyer then those who dont join these massive guilds.

 

[Gellor]

LOL and I return to my original point. People go with the path of least resistance and if they're going to have to perform at 95% efficiency to survive in a smaller/building guild, or perform at 40% efficiency to survive by joining the already existing dominant guild, guess what they'll do.

The definition of insanity is what again? Doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result, right?

That could easily apply to looking at the problems with PvP guilds, how they have been since Tram/Fel, and merely lecturing players to do things that haven't worked to create a lasting change. If it hasn't happened in what, six, seven years, I fail to see how you expect that lecturing players to keep trying a failed suggestion will make a difference.

You probably know it won't, you're probably just on some kind of "I'm a crusader against whining" kick.

My comment has nothing to do with joining existing guild... but actually forming a large "anti-PK" guild.

On Pac, as I said, NOBODY tried to form a large guild... EVER. In the 4+ years that FL was dominating the shard. There were smaller l33t guilds but nothing more than 10 active players.

But as you said, people are going to do the one that requires the least amount of effort: join an existing "dominant" guild or whine for the devs to spoon feed them everything. *rolls eyes*

I won't say I'm a crusader against whining... just anti-whining over things that the players CAN take care of their own(aka large guilds, "make scrolls tram too", etc) I'd be the first to jump on the anti-evil omen whine or anti-trapped box whine... those are dev fixable only.

 

[BloodstoneGL]

Will some people be upset if they have to try harder for the same reward? im sure they will. But then again why should there effort be so much easier then those who don't join these massive guilds.

Because life isn't fair. Think of it like WWII when Hitler was building his armies and taking over smaller countries, someone had to step up to stop him. Whining about it at home wasn't going to fix the problem. It's the same situation with these guilds, someone just needs to step up and take them on at their own game. Just don't let greed overcome you and then you become the enemy....

 

[Duskofdead]

My comment has nothing to do with joining existing guild... but actually forming a large "anti-PK" guild.

On Pac, as I said, NOBODY tried to form a large guild... EVER. In the 4+ years that FL was dominating the shard. There were smaller l33t guilds but nothing more than 10 active players.

But as you said, people are going to do the one that requires the least amount of effort: join an existing "dominant" guild or whine for the devs to spoon feed them everything. *rolls eyes*

I won't say I'm a crusader against whining... just anti-whining over things that the players CAN take care of their own(aka large guilds, "make scrolls tram too", etc) I'd be the first to jump on the anti-evil omen whine or anti-trapped box whine... those are dev fixable only.

Well, players CAN do almost anything. But if you waggle a finger in front of the room and dictate grandiose solutions to old problems which would just be "so simple" if people would just get on board and try/stop whining/whatever, without taking human nature into account, it's just being preachy and pendantic, and uselessly so. It's like saying "we could end world hunger.. if people would just stop whining about it and share and distribute food more evenly." That statement is a true statement. It's just never going to happen, at least not within the present.

Likewise, giving people "die slow or live happy" as a choice.... c'mon. Or any similar no-brainer choice. Such as "make your own PvP guild from scratch and capture Fel spawns" or "join the ones that already defacto own them."

 

[Exgirlfriend]

Because life isn't fair. Think of it like WWII when Hitler was building his armies and taking over smaller countries, someone had to step up to stop him. Whining about it at home wasn't going to fix the problem. It's the same situation with these guilds, someone just needs to step up and take them on at their own game. Just don't let greed overcome you and then you become the enemy....

LOL UO isent life its a game. A game all people who play should have a equal chance to benifit from. Something i dont think you understand.

 

[BloodstoneGL]

No actually I don't think you understand. UO was created to be an online world where your actions had hard lasting effects on the world around you. It was not created to be a solo game, it was not created to be a game where everyone gets spoon fed. UO was created to be a lviing breathing online "life".

You're just want something that isn't designed to work the way you want it to change to please you. Sorry, "life" isn't fair.

 

[ColterDC]

Let me guess, you are not in a large guild nor are you willing to join/make a large guild to complete

While I can understand the point the OP is trying to make, that large dominating guilds can have a stranglehold on Fel, limiting guild sizes will do nothing to stop this.

Also as always I agree with Gellor, have you ever tried running a large guild?

It is a pain in the ass, keeping people happy, making sure everything is divided fairly, avoiding letting scammers into the guild, etc.

If it was so easy to get a large group of players together and keep them together for a long time, everyone would do it.

 

[Exgirlfriend]

I want to improve the game, hence my idea. maybe more people would pvp let alone actully play UO if this issue wasent so unbalanced.

Most people want to advance themselfs past being gm. if your forced to join a massive guild or pay them for that then its not in the best intrests of the game.

 

[Gellor]

Well, players CAN do almost anything. But if you waggle a finger in front of the room and dictate grandiose solutions to old problems which would just be "so simple" if people would just get on board and try/stop whining/whatever, without taking human nature into account, it's just being preachy and pendantic, and uselessly so. It's like saying "we could end world hunger.. if people would just stop whining about it and share and distribute food more evenly." That statement is a true statement. It's just never going to happen, at least not within the present.

Likewise, giving people "die slow or live happy" as a choice.... c'mon. Or any similar no-brainer choice. Such as "make your own PvP guild from scratch and capture Fel spawns" or "join the ones that already defacto own them."

However, you are using a RL example of billions of people. A guild of 50 RL players is a far cry from that. *rolls eyes*

Getting a large guild together isn't an EASY solution which is what all the anti-large guild people want. Most of the whiners I've seen on Stratics are of the mindset of "if I don't get it in 10 minutes, system X MUST be broken"... they want instant AND easy solutions. To quote myself, "kind of like a spoiled child"

Have I started or run a large guild... no... I'm too antisocial for it(aka I hate all people equally ) But I've been in leadership positions on three large guilds in the past and was a plain member in a fourth. They are possible to get going but a little difficult. Lots of conflicting personalities and such.

Handling the current "large PK guild" monopoly CAN be handled within the current game mechanics. But as I said, most people are too lazy and don't want to invest some time into the solution

 

[Gellor]

FWIW, everytime I read one of these type posts, I'm reminded of my 5 year old step-grandson when he see something he wants. He starts stamping his feet and chanting "but I want"... And eventually throws himself on the ground.

 

[Exgirlfriend]

However, you are using a RL example of billions of people. A guild of 50 RL players is a far cry from that. *rolls eyes*

Getting a large guild together isn't an EASY solution which is what all the anti-large guild people want. Most of the whiners I've seen on Stratics are of the mindset of "if I don't get it in 10 minutes, system X MUST be broken"... they want instant AND easy solutions. To quote myself, "kind of like a spoiled child"

Have I started or run a large guild... no... I'm too antisocial for it(aka I hate all people equally ) But I've been in leadership positions on three large guilds in the past and was a plain member in a fourth. They are possible to get going but a little difficult. Lots of conflicting personalities and such.

Handling the current "large PK guild" monopoly CAN be handled within the current game mechanics. But as I said, most people are too lazy and don't want to invest some time into the solution

Im not looking for an easy or instant solution, im trying to improve the game by making it more competitive, something you dont seem to understand or care not about.

 

[Limlight]

The way I see it....you have several options:
1. Start your own big guild to compete.
2. Join an existing guild to help them compete
3. Throw your hands in the air and join the enemy.
4. Cry like a litle girl.

 

[Bara]

Do you know what vent is and how it works?

You could eleminate guilds entirely and nothing would change. Do you understand that?

People would use vent / skype / teamspeak and still work together.



Several people have brought that up already. I can't fathom why you aren't getting it.

 

[Divster]

LOL UO isent life its a game. A game all people who play should have a equal chance to benifit from. Something i dont think you understand.

Something i fear YOU don't understand is limiting guild size would change NOTHING. how would it stop people cooperating between the smaller guilds? As numerous people have stated people will still join forces to play just as they did before. Your trying to limit the way people cooperate in a game designed partly for cooperation between players. In the end it would probably hurt the current "smaller guilds" you are so keen on helping more than those you wish to see "balanced"

 

[Exgirlfriend]

Do you know what vent is and how it works?

You could eleminate guilds entirely and nothing would change. Do you undersand that?

People would use vent / skype / teamspeak and still work together.



Several people have brought that up already.

Yes i understand that, but...if a guild of say 300 was forced to become 12 guilds of 25 all the people on teams d, e, f, g, & h ect ect wouldent stay allied. after all, would you if you where considered a 5th tier player? It would make more competition. and with that more people would try and with that more people would play UO.

im not wrong, alot of people are just affraid LOL

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

It wouldn't stop people working together, which is the fundamental problem.

Where you might have had "ZergGuild"
You'll then have "ZergOne" "ZergTwo" "ZergThree" and so on.
Sure, some of the mechanics would change, but you're still going to have large groups rolling in. Because it works.

You are very bright. A very good response. Changing a system doesnt necessarily fix the problem.

 

[BloodstoneGL]

Y

im not wrong, I'm just in denial

Fixed

 

[Exgirlfriend]

Zerg teams b, c, d, & e would be affected by fields and aoe spells, limiting there effectiveness quite a bit. Anyone who spawns knows this.

 

[Divster]

so alliances are to be chopped for your plan too eh?

 

[Exgirlfriend]

so alliances are to be chopped for your plan too eh?

well if you actully read my op, you'd might understand what im talking about.

 

[BloodstoneGL]

Zerg teams b, c, d, & e would be affected by fields and aoe spells, limiting there effectiveness quite a bit. Anyone who spawns knows this.

You don't spawn do you?

 

[Exgirlfriend]

You don't spawn do you?

I do, everyday! But then again sitting around the guilds home and waiting for a smaller guild to do the work isent what i call PVP unlike you and your pals.

 

[Divster]

actually that is pvp, the exact definition of. If they were to fight the spawn that would be pvm....

regardless even the problems you envisage caused by fields and area effect spells could be easily managed thanks to vent and teamwork.

 

[BloodstoneGL]

I do, everyday! But then again sitting around the guilds home and waiting for a smaller guild to do the work isent what i call PVP unlike you and your pals.

LOL don't act like you have me pegged. I have not completed but maybe 10 spawns since AoS came out, I have bought 90% of the scrolls I have used. I am in factions and when I fight or "raid" I'm either solo or with a max of 2 other guild mates. I have nothing to gain by the current system in place and the style of which I play. But then again, I don't moan about it either because I understand that this is how it works.

 

[Exgirlfriend]

actually that is pvp, the exact definition of. If they were to fight the spawn that would be pvm....

regardless even the problems you envisage caused by fields and area effect spells could be easily managed thanks to vent and teamwork.

It's a little deeper then that, what you and alot of people dont seem to understand is that a change like this, even tho it might not help alot would give the pretence that it would. That alone would get more people to try and maybe even more people to play UO. All im after is to better the game, to make it more competitive.

Alot of people are afraid of a change like this, but most critics are the ones that gain the most from being in these massive guilds.

I am sure the games dev's understand what im saying here!

 

[BloodstoneGL]

OK let's just put all else to the side. No pointing, kicking, screaming, name calling, or pouting. Let's understand one significant thing...

They are not going to limit the size of Guilds. It would affect more than just Spawning guilds, it would affect RP and PVM Guilds as well. The best thing you could do at this juncture would be to focus on a different route to acheive a balance in this area of the game.

On a side note though, how many people are you getting raided by? Because on Great Lakes I see maybe 15 people on at a time on these large spawn guilds. The majority of the people on their stones are alternate characters from several accounts and a lot of inactive. I have yet to see a large spawning guild field anywhere close to the numbers they boast on their stone.

 

[Exgirlfriend]

OK let's just put all else to the side. No pointing, kicking, screaming, name calling, or pouting. Let's understand one significant thing...

They are not going to limit the size of Guilds. It would affect more than just Spawning guilds, it would affect RP and PVM Guilds as well. The best thing you could do at this juncture would be to focus on a different route to acheive a balance in this area of the game.

On a side note though, how many people are you getting raided by? Because on Great Lakes I see maybe 15 people on at a time on these large spawn guilds. The majority of the people on their stones are alternate characters from several accounts and a lot of inactive. I have yet to see a large spawning guild field anywhere close to the numbers they boast on their stone.

Sir:

Please read my op before commenting any more.

Thanks

 

[Ender]

its called scouting...perhaps you should try it sometime.

stealth...hiding...ninja...all you need.

Oh I don't care at all if they do it legally. IF they did it legally, that is. At least it would require effort.

 

[BloodstoneGL]

Sir:

Please read my op before commenting any more.

Thanks

What only PvP based guilds are based in Fel? Only PvM guilds are based in Tram? You're painting with a wide brush there. So what prevents a 500 person Tram based guild from coming to Felucca and taking over the spawns using fields to keep people at bay and taking a few counts here and there when necessary?

Your OP is still as full of holes as your LP.

 

[Kratos Aurion]

A little late into this thread but the current problem with fel IMO isn't just numbers, but abilities.

For instance, there are particular guilds who cheat with as low as 5-10 players who can spawn and hold against raids of players of equal or slightly greater numbers. So in theory your idea might sound good but is questionably inaccurate to the current condition of fel.

I observe that most fel guilds don't really have an etreme amount of players, but a small group of players who play with a centralized style (meaning they all pvp in the same mannor) making them an effective force in fel.

But don't get me wrong that there are those guilds who have unquestionable numbers who do monopolize certain aspects of fel but I don't see that being as big of a threat as having a group of 15 players using scripts who can hold there own against the "big" guilds.

And then theres also the small guilds of elite pvpers who actually dedicate themselves to the aspect of the game and are judgementally good at it.

 

[Gellor]

Okay... let say you got your limit guild size to 25.

Here is what the big mean PK guilds are going to do:

1. Create a bunch of mini guilds... like Zerg1, Zerg2, Zerg3, etc. Then, when it comes time to raid, figure out which one of the mini guilds has the most on. They do the brunt of the attacks while the others hang back and block off retreat.
2. Create on the fly guilds and a lot of placeholder guilds. So, you have a bunch of Zerg1, Zerg2, Zerg3, etc. But when a raid comes, everyone on drops their current guild and creates a new "Roxor's your Soxors" guild to wipe out the spawners.

Method two is patented by Reebdoog. All large guild submit LARGE quantities of beer to use.

End result, same problem of "large" PK guilds... but now you have a bunch of RP and PvM guilds complaining because they can't mock PvP or do spawns in their own large groups.:gun:

I have been on both sides of the spawn. Although when I was on the wrong side, the opposing guild was fielding MAYBE 10 and wiping out 10-20 of us. Of course, they were able to run 4/6 magery and super high SDI. Some days we were able to hold them off and get the spawn done. Other days we got wiped out

 

[Ender]

This quote pretty much sums up my thoughts on this idea.

"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."

Just replace Mr. Madison with Exgirlfriend <_<

 

[Exgirlfriend]

What only PvP based guilds are based in Fel? Only PvM guilds are based in Tram? You're painting with a wide brush there. So what prevents a 500 person Tram based guild from coming to Felucca and taking over the spawns using fields to keep people at bay and taking a few counts here and there when necessary?

Your OP is still as full of holes as your LP.

If that happend it would be very cool and im sure the fel based guilds would try to join forces, the point is how many trammy guilds come now?

It's all about competition. what are you afraid of?

 

[Ender]

It doesn't seem that beneficial to competition really... So it goes from zerg red guilds against small blue guilds to small red guilds against zerg blue guilds? The hell kind of balance is that?

 

[Exgirlfriend]

It doesn't seem that beneficial to competition really... So it goes from zerg red guilds against small blue guilds to small red guilds against zerg blue guilds? The hell kind of balance is that?

Right now and sence the day powerscrolls started a couple guilds on each shard control this facet of the game. This is wrong and needs to be addressed. if people join a massive guild so it's easy for them i say change the game and make it just as hard for everyone.

And tell me your the leet pvper who's actully afraid of a trammy guild LOL I solo them just for the competition!

 

[Ender]

Right now and sence the day powerscrolls started a couple guilds on each shard control this facet of the game. This is wrong and needs to be addressed. if people join a massive guild so it's easy for them i say change the game and make it just as hard for everyone.

And tell me your the leet pvper who's actully afraid of a trammy guild LOL I solo them just for the competition!

.......where the **** did you get the idea that I was a "leet pvper who's actully (should be actually by the way) afraid of a trammy guild LOL"?

I'm just trying to see the consequences of a (genuinely stupid) change like this going in, from both sides. I'm not even really playing UO right now.

 

[Exgirlfriend]

.......where the **** did you get the idea that I was a "leet pvper who's actully (should be actually by the way) afraid of a trammy guild LOL"?

I'm just trying to see the consequences of a (genuinely stupid) change like this going in, from both sides. I'm not even really playing UO right now.

Then save your two cents!

 

[Tina Small]

It's a little deeper then that, what you and alot of people dont seem to understand is that a change like this, even tho it might not help alot would give the pretence that it would. That alone would get more people to try and maybe even more people to play UO.

If I'm understanding you correctly, all you want to do is make a change that makes UO look like other games that limit guild size on the chance that doing so will be enough to lure a few folks into trying out UO or coming back. However, as quoted above, you don't seem to think that in the long run the change will really help all that much.

I'm sorry, but I just don't understand why most people who still play UO would support a change like this that would be very painful for many to go through, when you yourself admit in the above quote that it only has a "pretence" of helping the game to any significant extent.

Im not looking for an easy or instant solution, im trying to improve the game by making it more competitive, something you dont seem to understand or care not about.

When I first read statements you've made like the one directly above, I thought you were trying to make groups of players in UO more competitive with each other. However, now I'm inclined to think that you are merely coming up with ideas to make UO look more like other games on the market. You're basically saying screw whatever worked in UO's past, it's now necessary to copy yet another idea from other games.

So, exgirlfriend, are you really here because you think large guilds have true monopolies in UO or because guild size in UO just doesn't match what you've found in other games and therefore it must be a flaw?

 

[BloodstoneGL]

If that happend it would be very cool and im sure the fel based guilds would try to join forces, the point is how many trammy guilds come now?

It's all about competition. what are you afraid of?

I don't compete for scrolls, I'm not afraid of anything. I'm just realistic and in being so I'm giving up on this thread.