Poll on Client popularity

[BeaIank]

I don't think there is even a remote fear of this happening, even if only like...10% of the population used it (which is obviously low). At this point they probably don't want to alienate anyone.

I wouldn't mind it being scrapped in favour of yet another new client, fully in 3D with a better engine (Unreal 4 has a far more permissive usage license nowadays, for one), but that too ain't happening with the skeleton team we have, and the need for more investment.

The EC is nowhere finished, nor will ever be, which is quite sad.
Making it sprite dependent was poor design planning as well, and limits the client greatly.

 

[Smoot]

Just wondering, does anyone actually play EC for the graphics? i find the biggest problem most players have with EC are the terrible graphics, that it doesnt look like or have the feel of original / real UO. I think it would be vastly more popular if the devs had stuck to the retro graphics to keep the retro appeal that is the reason people keep playing UO after all these years. Just saying, why would anyone ruin a 1965 Mustang by putting in a modern hybrid engine?

The EC was behind the times even when it was created. I just wish a client could have been made that had the classic look and feel while adopting some of better features of the current ec UI.

 

[Picus at the office]

Just wondering, does anyone actually play EC for the graphics? i find the biggest problem most players have with EC are the terrible graphics, that it doesnt look like or have the feel of original / real UO. I think it would be vastly more popular if the devs had stuck to the retro graphics to keep the retro appeal that is the reason people keep playing UO after all these years. Just saying, why would anyone ruin a 1965 Mustang by putting in a modern hybrid engine?

The EC was behind the times even when it was created. I just wish a client could have been made that had the classic look and feel while adopting some of better features of the current ec UI.

http://www.tomorrowstarted.com/2011...-new-trouble-free-engine-by-mechatronik/.html

 

[BeaIank]

Just wondering, does anyone actually play EC for the graphics? i find the biggest problem most players have with EC are the terrible graphics, that it doesnt look like or have the feel of original / real UO. I think it would be vastly more popular if the devs had stuck to the retro graphics to keep the retro appeal that is the reason people keep playing UO after all these years. Just saying, why would anyone ruin a 1965 Mustang by putting in a modern hybrid engine?

The EC was behind the times even when it was created. I just wish a client could have been made that had the classic look and feel while adopting some of better features of the current ec UI.

I play it for usability, not graphics, that is granted. But the graphics don't bother me at all. I mean... I look at my face every morning, so I am used to ugly.
3D would have been the way to go. Sprites suffer a lot when you scale them up and down, which causes some of the EC ugliness.

 

[Uvtha]

3D would have been the way to go. Sprites suffer a lot when you scale them up and down, which causes some of the EC ugliness.

Personally I think the ugliness comes from the mishmash of art more than the low res.

 

[Thrakkar]

Just wondering, does anyone actually play EC for the graphics? i find the biggest problem most players have with EC are the terrible graphics, that it doesnt look like or have the feel of original / real UO. I think it would be vastly more popular if the devs had stuck to the retro graphics to keep the retro appeal that is the reason people keep playing UO after all these years. Just saying, why would anyone ruin a 1965 Mustang by putting in a modern hybrid engine?

The EC was behind the times even when it was created. I just wish a client could have been made that had the classic look and feel while adopting some of better features of the current ec UI.

EC has the same tiles as CC has. The only drawback is the scaling algorithm, which just makes it either blurry or it has these ugly saw-tooth edges (even when you use the calculated zoom factor; it is almost gone, but not completely).
Same goes for the items in a backpack. Blurry mess as well because of scaling.
It would be next to awesome, if the EC could display the graphics as is, without any scaling applied. That alone would increase the quality by 300%. (And only apply scaling, when zoom >101% or <99%, including a "snap back to 100%" button).

I like the CC character graphics more than EC, but I got used to them.
CC dragon is still far superiour than EC dragon.
On the other hand, a cu sidhe looks like pure crap in CC and just plain awesome in the EC.

I play EC mainly because of the free scalable game window, smooth scrolling of the game world and enhanced user interface.
Should they ever deliver the high-res gfx for EC, I'll happily add a 4th reason to play the EC.

Bottom line:
Yes I would play the EC for the graphics, if EC would have its own high-res graphics.

 

[Capt. Lucky]

I'm pretty sure the whole thing is Obama's fault.

 

[MalagAste]

EC has the same tiles as CC has. The only drawback is the scaling algorithm, which just makes it either blurry or it has these ugly saw-tooth edges (even when you use the calculated zoom factor; it is almost gone, but not completely).
Same goes for the items in a backpack. Blurry mess as well because of scaling.
It would be next to awesome, if the EC could display the graphics as is, without any scaling applied. That alone would increase the quality by 300%. (And only apply scaling, when zoom >101% or <99%, including a "snap back to 100%" button).

I like the CC character graphics more than EC, but I got used to them.
CC dragon is still far superiour than EC dragon.
On the other hand, a cu sidhe looks like pure crap in CC and just plain awesome in the EC.

I play EC mainly because of the free scalable game window, smooth scrolling of the game world and enhanced user interface.
Should they ever deliver the high-res gfx for EC, I'll happily add a 4th reason to play the EC.

Bottom line:
Yes I would play the EC for the graphics, if EC would have its own high-res graphics.

Exactly. I get over the ugly stuff... and use it in favor of the added functionality... Sure the Hiryu looks hideous and I liken it to a plucked chicken turkey dragon.... but so what... I've gotten used to my dragon looking stupid and the fact that it only comes in ONE color.... I LOVE the fire beetles... sheep, horses... Kirins look silly... but more like they should. I enjoy watching the Elementals..... Earth ele's the put themselves together... the fire elementals dancing about... it's fun.

And yes my character looks like smeg.. I've gotten over how all the males look scronny and weak..... and how they are always stooped over like they have some sort of back hip problem... Or how the females look more like a linebacker than a female... they did get a "bit" of a boost at one point... but they still look more like a linebacker than a woman. I really like the interchangeable faces and bodies. I wish they would add more and I wish they would fix them as some of them just don't "sit" right on the head...

I certainly wish they would fix some of the "graphical" errors that occur. Just last night while I was riding back and forth to Britain on a dozen shards or more I was noticing that when I travel left to right across my screen my character literally rides right out of their shirt..... and my arms show thru... Crazy stuff there! The shirt rides slower than my character. But it's just small stuff compared to many of the problems plaguing UO right now.

 

[old gypsy]

I'm pretty sure the whole thing is Obama's fault.

Can't be. He certainly hasn't even heard about it in the news yet.

 

[Kuzan]

Enhanced client gives me a headache

 

[GarthGrey]

...

I can now claim that I really no longer care what the numbers are anymore. Without a plan to actually finish the client, bring back high resolution artwork and fix the issues that are apparently cropping up in the new UI, it really doesn't matter.

Congratulations all of you who refuse to move outside of 1998, may you enjoy your continuing slide into 640x480 obscurity.

Other than emptying ore carts on a ~weekly basis, you'll have a better chance of finding me in Shards Online or Shroud of the Avatar, both which which are a better fit on a modern monitor.

You're just mad because "Dermotts" didn't have as nice a ring as "Pincos"..no offense though, i've tried EC and don't particularly care for it.

 

[Warpig Inc]

They need an in game clicky machine put at WBB on both sides for those pure red accounts. Once per account can click machine and pick between the CC or EC statuette. And a red version of the statue gotten only by a red character. This needs a town cryer and other outputs about the machine. This will end the Who uses what and how many accounts even PVP. And ya if your a bank sitting, pardon sucking blue. Oh well.

 

[Ultimaholic]

I used Dermotts way back when and loved it. I think Smoot hit it on the head and has always been my contention.

While all the static art is the same, its the char model and mounts/pets that look like hell. Yes, I got over it and played exclusively in the EC because it is vastly superior as far as utility. But at first, it was a very hard sale for me because of that difference in art on a few things.

If they would have stuck with everything CC and just added the utility the EC brings, I think the CC would have been discontinued a long time ago. Seriously, all you EC haters..... if the char models and the mounts/pets looked like they do in CC, would that change your opinions toward the EC? Since those are the most common cause of the "uglyness" criticism.

 

[The Craftsman]

They need an in game clicky machine put at WBB on both sides for those pure red accounts. Once per account can click machine and pick between the CC or EC statuette. And a red version of the statue gotten only by a red character. This needs a town cryer and other outputs about the machine. This will end the Who uses what and how many accounts even PVP. And ya if your a bank sitting, pardon sucking blue. Oh well.

Why? Im sure EA can get the login info for either client at any time they like. No clicky is required and if EA want to release those numbers to us (which they wont) then they can.

 

[Warpig Inc]

Funny thing is my EC stocked vendors still sell out. So if a CC player doesn't get what they need over an EC player. Win Win

Think is a perfer thing and not what someone is forced to at that time. Their counter program wouldn't know why someone uses both. Or if they had a choice to can one for the other.

 

[Tomarke]

Honestly, the only reason I play the CC exclusively is because I cannot stand to look at the art of the EC. If there was an EC with the CC art I would start playing it in a heartbeat.

 

[MalagAste]

Honestly, the only reason I play the CC exclusively is because I cannot stand to look at the art of the EC. If there was an EC with the CC art I would start playing it in a heartbeat.

The flora mostly and the walls and such and even all the items are CC art..... the only things that are EC art are mobiles and the ground.

 

[Tomarke]

The flora mostly and the walls and such and even all the items are CC art..... the only things that are EC art are mobiles and the ground.

Yep. I don't even like looking at own characters and pets.

 

[MalagAste]

Yep. I don't even like looking at own characters and pets.

I can totally understand.... I miss the way my character looked sometimes.... though I do like much of the way items look way more detailed on my character.... he went from having a nice figure and 6 pack to looking like he might have a serious back injury and have developed dunlap disease with some sort of muscle decay.... since he looks fairly scrawny now in the EC... but I have gotten over that. ..... .... Or that my females look fairly manly now.... and the only thing they are missing is the enlarge adams apple... to know they are some sort of transvestite... and I've gotten over that too.... ....

I just ignore that and the fact that my poor Hiryu looks like a plucked chicken turkey dragon now.... poor baby... I just can't function in the 2d client anymore. Heck I don't remember how to talk in that client anymore. I didn't really bother to put it on the new PC this time. I thought about it. But then decided meh. Didn't want to bother doing the whole key thing with UOAssist either ... and I barely recall how to get them anyway.

 

[Ender]

The flora mostly and the walls and such and even all the items are CC art..... the only things that are EC art are mobiles and the ground.

I don't understand why we can't just get a KR toggle if they're not going to do the high-res update. The landscape and tiles and such all looked so much better.

 

[Dot_Warner]

Probably due to the ridiculous assertion that KR art made some graphics cards "smoke." That was said in 2009.

While modern graphics cards are super powerful for 3D, they've lost a lot of ability to process sprites efficiently. However, that can be mitigated by using a good rendering engine (which the EC has) and tight coding...which UO has never been known for.

All the KR art assets are sitting in the client. Re-enable the KR world art and restore the hi-res mobiles, leave the CC item art (KR item art looked like it had melted in the rain).

 

[Uriah Heep]

I was told by a few beta testers for KR, that the KR art was awesome! And these were CC players saying it. I was also told that what we got with the release was nothing like what they tested. Always have wondered about that

 

[TimberWolf]

I beta tested KR...I dont remember it being any different from the last time I loaded EC to check thing out!

From a business perspective one thing is clear....KR was a huge failure. and for many...it still is!

 

[utilitron]

Something is just off about the EC. It doesn't look right.
I am assuming it is because the ground/NPC/Players appear to be done in 3d and placed to look like 2d

The problem is they appear to be in Isometric Projection rather than Oblique Projection
They are both forms of Parallel Projection but Isometric is closer to Perspective than Oblique.
In fact, Ultima uses a rarer form of Oblique Projection called Military Projection (bottom left).
Here is a paper on how to calculate an Oblique Projection matrix.
Even more information here.

 

[Dot_Warner]

I beta tested KR...I dont remember it being any different from the last time I loaded EC to check thing out!

This pretty much just shredded any credibility your opinions on the EC may have.

The difference between KR and EC is rather quite noticeable.

 

[Ender]

From a quick google search, a familiar spot in Moonglow in the KR client... Way better environmental art than the CC or EC (since they both use the same, low-res and all)

Now for fun, let's compare to a screenshot I just took of the EC while zoomed in slightly from optimal setting, but not as much as the KR one.

 

[Merlin]

CC's general usability and interface sucks. I won't ever use it for that reason. Graphics don't really impress me on either client, so I think it's rather silly to base client choice on that, but that's just my opinion. A real 3D client would give this game some new life, but chances of that happening are probably zero.

 

[TimberWolf]

This pretty much just shredded any credibility your opinions on the EC may have.

The difference between KR and EC is rather quite noticeable.

It was what 7 years ago (cira 2008)?? excuse me if I dont remember things exactly how you do..... and ohhh no...I am gonna lose a lot of sleep over the fact that you dont agree with my opinion!!! LOL frankly I dont give a rat's **** if my credibility has been shredded as far as you are concerned.....it was an opinion...I was there I am entitled to it....lil miss "rather quite"!

LOL

 

[BeaIank]

Odin, that KR screenshot... it is gorgeous. And we don't use it on the EC...

 

[the 4th man]

This was a poll to start some arguments....it always does.....EC with Pincos.

 

[Zosimus]

It was what 7 years ago (cira 2008)?? excuse me if I dont remember things exactly how you do..... and ohhh no...I am gonna lose a lot of sleep over the fact that you dont agree with my opinion!!! LOL frankly I dont give a rat's **** if my credibility has been shredded as far as you are concerned.....it was an opinion...I was there I am entitled to it....lil miss "rather quite"!

LOL

And you had the nerve to call me a Troll? LOLOLOLOL

El Burro le dijo al perro 'Orejón'

KR was obviously different than the EC. I was one of the few that really thought the KR client rocked. Mythic basically made 3d models but it was still 2d client.

 

[Gb8719]

I've never understood why they don't try and modernize the CC.

The only reason that I opt for the CC is because of features that I think should be mandatory in games now: an interactive area map, hotkey bars, easy to use inventory/paperdoll, and a larger viewing screen. If they could somehow find a way to implement those features while still maintaining the CC graphics, I would be a very, very happy man.

 

[TimberWolf]

And you had the nerve to call me a Troll? LOLOLOLOL

El Burro le dijo al perro 'Orejón'

Since I must be the dog in that statement...I guess that makes you the Jack A$$!!

 

[Mirko 75]

I only play Classic Client

 

[drcossack]

CC all the way for me. I originally played on the old 3D Client (around the time of AoS), but eventually went to (what was, at the time) the 2D Client & haven't looked back. If I need to find something in my backpack, I log in on the EC.

 

[Pandora_CoD]

I absolutely 100% cannot use the EC.... omg...

ITS CC or BUST!

 

[drcossack]

Honestly, the only reason I play the CC exclusively is because I cannot stand to look at the art of the EC. If there was an EC with the CC art I would start playing it in a heartbeat.

This. If the EC looked better, I would use it. I love some of the things it offers: it gets enemy/ally bars for you, backpack is much easier to sort through, auto-looting monsters, etc. I don't like how my character looks in the EC, nor do I like how my pets look. And then there are the monsters. I've seen pics of their EC counterparts on uoguide, and they all look stupid.

 

[The Craftsman]

Lets also remember that EA stated that the CC would be retired when the EC reached a certain level of take up. Guess that time will never come. Another gross miscalculation by EA with regards what this game is about.

 

[Zosimus]

Since I must be the dog in that statement...I guess that makes you the Jack A$$!!

*Yawn* That's what you for from that statement? lol . That wasn't the point of that statement. Guess I have to use something you may understand the quote old-timer.. The pot calling the kettle black. How can you not see that is beyond me but I can understand with the rogaine deprived gamer as you just aren't up to speed with the new generation thinking

Do a little more creative thinking in insults please in the future.

 

[Smoot]

Glad to see this poll has been kept open; under the "old regime" i had several of these posts with similar percentages, but they were always locked after around 50 votes.

currently, it looks like 71% prefer CC to 25% prefering EC. Seems very accurate from what i see in game, vent, guild etc. Now, i dont blame Mesanna saying is 50/50, that only makes sense to rationalize the "success" of any product.

 

[Ultimaholic]

It really doesn`t matter what this poll says since these forums prolly represent the tiniest fraction of the playerbase. Like 183 votes says jack about anything.

If you people honestly think it does.............

wow

 

[Tanivar]

It really doesn`t matter what this poll says since these forums prolly represent the tiniest fraction of the playerbase. Like 183 votes says jack about anything.

If you people honestly think it does.............

wow

Take a course on Statistics at your local community college, you clearly have no idea of how they work and are done.

National polls may only include a few thousand people out of the entire population of America. A very small percentage, which is likely smaller in proportion than the one here. Clearly the EC is on the way to suffering the same fate has the last two clients intended to replace the CC, failure. <shrugs> It's just holding out longer than the first two replacements. Until they pay some company capable of making a good replacement client to do just that, the CC will still reign. Fewer bells & whistles or not.

 

[Uvtha]

It really doesn`t matter what this poll says since these forums prolly represent the tiniest fraction of the playerbase. Like 183 votes says jack about anything.

If you people honestly think it does.............

wow

View attachment 30874

Really depends on how many players there are over all, and what level of confidence and margin of error you are looking for. For a sample size of 184, and a population of lets say... 20k (generous) if you allowed for 8% margin of error and 95% certainty that sample would work. That would obviously only be for general idea not an exact estimate, the more common and more exact 95%/4% would need a sample size of 583.

 

[Uriah Heep]

Really depends on how many players there are over all, and what level of confidence and margin of error you are looking for. For a sample size of 184, and a population of lets say... 20k (generous) if you allowed for 8% margin of error and 95% certainty that sample would work. That would obviously only be for general idea not an exact estimate, the more common and more exact 95%/4% would need a sample size of 583.

LOL 20k! oh wait, you were probably including Asian shards too. For the 250-300 players still left in the U.S., the poll is probably about right.

 

[petemage]

For me the poll looks reasonable. Of course I dont know better, but from the feel I met 3 times CC users over EC users. I like my EC, but I'm not bitter enough to not realize most people in-game dont. I never bought that 50/50 thing.

 

[Marisa Kirisame]

I'm new to UO and I use CC! I don't like EC graphics and all this circular ********)

 

[Uvtha]

LOL 20k! oh wait, you were probably including Asian shards too. For the 250-300 players still left in the U.S., the poll is probably about right.

Yeah, I was being generous. I would assume that subs are below 10k honestly, and below 5k active individuals. But there's really no way to know.

Anyway I think the poll is probably accurate enough despite the small and dubiously sourced sample. I wouldn't use it to place any bets or anything, but... I'm guessing its around 80/20, 70/30.

Of course it doesn't matter. It's not a popularity contest, and neither client is going anywhere.

 

[Tanivar]

I did not email Mesanna about this thread. Given how one sided it is, I suspect the official numbers are likely much the same anyway. Probably old news given the two earlier threads that were similar in results.

 

[Uriah Heep]

Yeah, I was being generous. I would assume that subs are below 10k honestly, and below 5k active individuals. But there's really no way to know.

Anyway I think the poll is probably accurate enough despite the small and dubiously sourced sample. I wouldn't use it to place any bets or anything, but... I'm guessing its around 80/20, 70/30.

Of course it doesn't matter. It's not a popularity contest, and neither client is going anywhere.

While neither client will be going anywhere, I think it might be an indicator of what is best to spend the time the 4 devs we have on. If the CC is really this much more popular, they should leave the EC to the modders, and concentrate on adding to the CC, thereby pleasing the majority of the player base. Simple business decision really...

 

[MalagAste]

Does it really matter? No. It's be stated 100 times over that they won't be getting "rid" of either client.

Also ...... we all know they aren't going to go hiring anyone "new" to fix the woe's of the graphics or anything else.

It's a fact that they have never since the beginning been able to satisfy the community with new clients. One of their biggest mistakes is trying to "change" the look of the game into something that doesn't even resemble the current look. Even the new fellow Onifrk can't seem to figure out how to design stuff to "blend" in with the current art. It annoys the crap out of me to have all the round pots and things not have the same perspective. They should take a close look at what we do have that looks "right" and just keep it consistent. Look at the barrels, tubs, the Cauldron.... etc.... and make the perspective match. The smaller plant is close to the "right" look. The base of the larger one looks all wrong. Take the rocking horse we got awhile back..... the thing is HUGE... totally not in proportion with the game. Much of the furnishings and things with the Kings Collection don't sit properly in the tiles making them unworkable in the game. I had to play tricks with goza mats and such to "float" the tables so they sit properly in the tiles but if you actually SIT at the table then it looks stupid again... and chairs on some sides look ok but on others look a million miles away from the table.

The metal tables look..... wrong and out of place. Love the shelves but they aren't practical for use since they not only block movement but you can only place ONE on a tile. Which makes them not really work for building a storage shelf and trying to place stuff to "sit" on them right is difficult.

The alchemist bookcase looks great... but some of the other new items just look out of place.

If they actually hired a team to rebuild a client I highly doubt they would get it right either.