Has anyone tested the “Reactive Close Wounds” property of these shields? If so, how does it work? Is it impacted by FC/FCR? Thanks!
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Paladin Shields
- Thread starter ultima2005
- Start date
- Watchers 3
I recall someone posted they couldn't get it to work but never heard anything else
You need to parry a hit to have a chance to activate the effect.
Bushido + shield = massively reduced parry chance.
Wouldn't you Want both?
Please tell me that you do not have any characters with parry + bushido and a shield.
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I have but don't use bushido
So, I played around with the shields a decent amount tonight. I did get the effect to trigger, though it wasn't too often. In a long fight, expect it to trigger 2 - 3 times at most. I'm guessing 30% Reactive Close Wounds means it triggers 30% of the time on a successful parry (which is 35% of the time at 120 parry with a shield and no Bushido). There is substantial RNG involved, like it won't trigger if you are at full health, obviously. I don't think I saw any healing when I was poisoned, but I can't definitively say. I am also not sure if it costs any mana, though I don't think it does.
The healing effect is nice, though - at 120 Chiv, the most it healed me for was 40 hp. Not bad. That combined with the shield's damage eater gives some extra ways to heal, though I wouldn't build my suit relying on the effect.
The healing effect is nice, though - at 120 Chiv, the most it healed me for was 40 hp. Not bad. That combined with the shield's damage eater gives some extra ways to heal, though I wouldn't build my suit relying on the effect.
basically the rule of thumb is:
Parry + Shield = Good
Parry + Bushido + Shield = Bad
Parry + Bushido + 2 Handed Weapon = Great
you will actually do better using a 1 handed weapon vs using a shield if you have both parry and bushido.
that is just strange.
it took me a while to get my head around that but that is how it works.
you have to decide if your a 2 handed weapon kinda person or a shield kinda person and then that will dictate if your a Parry + Bushido kinda lifestyle.
I fought Navrey three times without using any special moves to extend the fight and see if the Reactive Curse Wound would trigger if poisoned. I didn't notice the effect ever trigger while poisoned, so I'm guessing it doesn't, but I'm not 100% sure.
Since "Reactive Close Wounds" only has a 30% chance to trigger on successful Parries, that means overall there's about a 10.5% chance for it to proc per swing against you when you have 120.0 Parry (35% Parry chance with a shield). It's 14.1% chance if you have both 120 Parry and the "Heighten Senses" Parry Mastery ability active (which gives a total Parry chance of 47%).
I quickly put together a suit around a Paladin Shield of Earth. The stats are pretty good: 150 HP, 210 Stam, 115 mana, 30% Kinetic Eater, 45/45, 35% SSI, etc. I use a Divine Sanctifier for single target and a whip for AOE. The skills are 120 Macing / 120 Tactics / 120 Anatomy / 120 Chiv / 110 Parry / 100 Resist / either 115 heal (+15 from Azarok's Leggings) or 100 Necro. It makes for a terrific tank between stagger, hit fatigue, kinetic eater, 100 LL, heal or vampiric embrace, and the occasional heal from Reactive Close Wounds. Basic pieces:
Head: Legendary with 10% kinetic eater
Body: Balron Bone Armor
Ear: Solaria's Secret Poisons
Hand: Gloves of the Holy Warrior
Back: Serpent Skin Quiver
Legs: Azarok's Leggings
Nec: Sentiel's Mempo
Shoulders: Lord Morphius' Epaulettes
Chest: Spell Focusing Sash
Talismans: Cameos
Jewels: +50 skills and a bunch of other stuff
Head: Legendary with 10% kinetic eater
Body: Balron Bone Armor
Ear: Solaria's Secret Poisons
Hand: Gloves of the Holy Warrior
Back: Serpent Skin Quiver
Legs: Azarok's Leggings
Nec: Sentiel's Mempo
Shoulders: Lord Morphius' Epaulettes
Chest: Spell Focusing Sash
Talismans: Cameos
Jewels: +50 skills and a bunch of other stuff
While I can see the theory of getting well-timed 30-40hp "reactive heal" being welcomed when needing it, I have a hard time seeing it in practice.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong but at 180-200 Stam, you are self bandaging a 2-3 seconds (not sure if there is a cap). Assuming a paladin has healing (not relying simply on Chiv to heal), there is a good chance they are healing up to near full HP with each heal every 2-3 seconds, especially if they are parrying hits. This doesn't even account for any sort of damage eater giving you HP back or a leech life weapon. The only thing that's really going to be damaging you at that point is magic spells...which you can't parry.
So again I could be wrong here but in practice, that 30-40hp heal is only happening 10% of the time there is a swing AND you cannot be poisoned and needs to happen in between a bandage or after just taking a huge hit. I don't know... I feel like that's too small of a window and not something you can even remotely rely on. If anything, it might mess up your bandage cadence because you try to start using a bandaid right after one of those reactive heals kicks in.
So like I said, cool in theory and I like they are trying something like that on the paladin shield but I think it should have likely been something like "reactive remove curse" or even stack some more reactive holy light for added offensive ability.
Are you just not running fc/fcr, or are you running something like : ju'onar belt + mantle of archlich + 1/3 on jewels?
I believe that it is more like ~5% of the time.
I may be wrong, but I believe that weapon skill blocks have to miss before parry comes into play. So assuming ~1/2 hits are blocked by your weapon skill, then you have ~30% parry chance, then you have around a 30% activation chance if you successfully parried.
Please correct me if I am wrong.
No fc/fcr, though this suit isn’t really optimized. I tried using the shield on my 4/6 build and didn’t love the results. Rather use a shield with FC if that’s a priority on the build.
Ya the first thing I said about the shield is, remove curse would be much better than close wounds.
@Keven2002 healing speed is based on Dexterity level, so you can't get faster than 4 or 5 seconds on self bandaging. Stamina would be nice, I have 200 or more on all my warriors.
Healing others is lots faster.
@Keven2002 healing speed is based on Dexterity level, so you can't get faster than 4 or 5 seconds on self bandaging. Stamina would be nice, I have 200 or more on all my warriors.
Healing others is lots faster.
I may be way off base, but I believe you are both wrong and right. From my understanding, a block and a parry are the same. A parry with a shield is a block with the shield, and a block with Bushido is a block with the weapon.
What you’re referring to, I think, is the chance to be hit. That is a complicated formula involving skill, DCI, HCI, etc. But yes, a good percentage of swings miss, and parry is calculated only on successful hits. So you’re probably right — the actual odds are closer to 5% than 10% that any single swing will trigger Reactive Close Wounds, and that’s assuming you’re not at full health, which is often the case after a parry.
By the way, I’m pretty convinced that Reactive Close Wounds won’t trigger if you’re poisoned. To test, I soloed Navery like five times using only regular swings to prolong the fight. Not once did Reactive Close Wounds trigger when I was poisoned.
Bandage Healing speed increases with DEX, and caps out at 140 DEX with 4 second self bandage heals (which is halved to 2 secs when cross healing).
Yep. Parry only comes into effect if the attack would've otherwise hit you, so the odds of Reactive: Close Wounds triggering is even lower.
Close Wounds can't be used on targets that are Poisoned or under Mortal Strike, so it makes sense that Reactive: Close Wounds wouldn't either.
Overall, i'd say the Bulwark of Light is actually better than the Paladin Shields for most Paladin builds.
yea i expected it to be around that.
what bothers me even more is that, when you talk Paladin aka Chiv, is that in order to replace the missing FCI of that shield you either have to use Robe, Belt in addition or on both jewels, along the imbu weight of 1 FC (140 or 150) kills basically 15 of the 20 skill points on the shield i just dont see it.
i run the pala with FC on shield, 1 jewel, robe and townbuff and i was pretty happy to have that room on the other jewel for skills, also the Bulwark has so many other useful things which makes even more space on jewels
what bothers me even more is that, when you talk Paladin aka Chiv, is that in order to replace the missing FCI of that shield you either have to use Robe, Belt in addition or on both jewels, along the imbu weight of 1 FC (140 or 150) kills basically 15 of the 20 skill points on the shield i just dont see it.
i run the pala with FC on shield, 1 jewel, robe and townbuff and i was pretty happy to have that room on the other jewel for skills, also the Bulwark has so many other useful things which makes even more space on jewels
Yeah, the vast majority of the time, I will be reaching for the Bulwark.
I will say, however, the shield can help make an excellent single target tanking paladin with the Divine Sanctifier. I've been playing around with equipment builds that have 30% Kinetic Eater from my shield and helm + 15% Damage Eater from my arms to cover all other types of damage. You could also use the shield to mix and match Damage Eaters types depending on the fight. It can make certain fights laughably easy, with the occasional Reactive Heal as a bonus.
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i mean, the hammers could have beed a great thing,
make it a 1 hand wepp, liittle weaker than a double axe so the only 1 hand is taken into account but stronger than the usual 1h. put a damage type matching slayer on, boom job done.
You don’t like the new hammers? I love them. The shields are fun to play around with. The hammers are absolute game changers for me.
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nah i dont like them, iam either a palading with a shield, or i use 2 handed weapons.
and the shields are ****, as you can see the math up in this post
I'm confused. The new hammers are 2 handed? They basically have replaced the Double Axe for me when I want to run macing rather than swords in my non-shield builds.
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I tweaked this template a bit - I replaced the Azarok's Leggings with Britches of Warding (Damage Eater) and the arms for a legendary with damage eater. This gives me 30% Kinetic Eater and 18% Damage Eater. I'm finding I prefer Necro over Healing because of the resistance to poisoning, which allows the Reactive Close Wounds to trigger more often.
Between Stagger, Hit Fatigue from the Divine Sanctifier, 180 HP from Toughness, 100% LL, 30% constant LL from VE, kinetic and damage eating, and the occasional reactive heal, the build is very hard to kill, haha.
I'm trying to put together a suit with 30% Kinetic Eater, 30% Fire Eater, and 18% Damage Eater, but I have to sacrifice a lot to make it happen.
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Are you noticing if you're better off with Necro over Healing?
What other weapons are you using?
With this particular template, I think I like Necro more than Healing. Vampiric Embrace's resistance to poison allows the Reactive Close Wounds to trigger more often.
I was also able to put together a viable "total eater" suit. 30% Kinetic Eater, 30% Fire Eater, 18% Damage Eater.
30% Kinetic Eater - Paladin Shield of Earth and Helm
30% Fire Eater - Hands and Chest
18% Damage Eater - Arms and Britches of Warding with Damage Eater.
The baselines stats are adequate, if not overly impressive -- 150 HP, 180 Stam, 85 mana. If I forewent the Damage Eater property and replaced the arms and legs with Corrupted Paladin Vampraces and Azarok's Leggings, I can get 30% Kinetic Eater and 30% Fire Eater with 150 HP, 200 Stam, and 100 mana.
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maybe stupid question, wasnt it like that the eaters only restore when you not get hit for a few seconds? if so that would mean if you are in a hard fight they maybe restore after your done (i think to remember something like that)
I’ve found eaters are more effective with macing than swords. Stagger slows down the fight, and Toughness adds a significant amount of additional HP to recover. They are by no means necessary, but they do add tankiness to a macing build.