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Is it gonna be BUDDY BUDDY ? or by the RULES?

Hazel868789

Adventurer
Stratics Veteran
OWNER did NOT pay to keep account active. KEEP, LS, north of Bog, east of crossroads. Owner stated several times they have recently lost other houses, did not pay to keep accounts active. Its in the chat logs. This one was IDOC, and went OSI. Then, after "big popular" players blasted Broadsword with ICQ, email, etc etc. KEEP is owned is MESSENA. Time will tell if this is issue is processed by the rules. Oh, and there was NO identity theft either. Also in the chat logs. Time for BROADSWORD to show their true colors. Will it be BUDDY BUDDY? Or will it be BY THE RULES. (Sorry in advance if this pisses people off, but its not about who you know, its about rules (that even you want enforced))
 

Pawain

I Hate Skilling
Governor
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I have no idea who the person was. Others tried to contact them when the first stuff fell. He activated the account that owns the house in question before it fell.

IMO he should not have had to email to get his home out of IDOC. It should have went to the owner as soon as he paid for the account.
 

Hazel868789

Adventurer
Stratics Veteran
I have no idea who the person was. Others tried to contact them when the first stuff fell. He activated the account that owns the house in question before it fell.

IMO he should not have had to email to get his home out of IDOC. It should have went to the owner as soon as he paid for the account.
Chat logs say otherwise. People that were there heard his reasons (will not post them here). NON Payment.

BTW, House Decay does NOT start on an active account. Starts after 90 days of nonpayment. So what if they payed and logged back into account, it was PAST the 90 days and the house should go **POOF**
 
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Pawain

I Hate Skilling
Governor
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
He paid before the house fell. The guy was in the game on a paid account standing at his house in IDOC.

That's my reason he should be able to keep it.
 

Dorset

Adventurer
Stratics Veteran
UNLEASHED
First thing I new about one of my houses dropping was on the recent youtube clips between the IDOC's nerd rage wars.
It was the house on Oceania with the St Georges Cross on the roof. (My feck up, CC ran out- no complaints)

IDOC's have had their day, with the pool of people playing now I can't imagine they are not already self sufficient until the lights go out. Its just pure greed from a small group, just delete the stuff.
 

Mr. Mayhem

Journeyman
How about introducing one of the best gold sinks in the game? When a house goes IDOC all items are put up as an auction instead of dropping to ground. Gives everyone a fair chance at loot. Gets rid of scripters and all the foul play. Problem solved.
 

Coco_Zamis_DF

Sage
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Gold sink, lol. To late.

Greed is always there. Prove your avatarness and your virtues. Broadsword can check payments. If they decide to give back, it's a BS thing. Maybe BS shows a virtue.

IDOC items on auctions? This is worth another thread. IMHO richer people get richer then. Delete all non account bound items. Move the rest into bank of owner. And don't argue that then idoc people will left game and shards will get emptied. This guy are the void, they are empty. Most of them will not show up at any non idoc themed action. So you will not see them if you are not an idocer. That's my opinion to the idoc stuff.
 

Uriah Heep

Grand Poobah
Alumni
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I think the issue here is that quite a few people have lost things thru no fault of their own. Remember people losing rubble in Magincia because the system was deleting it? Most never got it back. Lots have lost items when placing a chest and it fell thru the floor and our quality support staff showed up after it had decayed....sorry, we cant replace that.

It happens, to all of us. We move on and get over it.
Main issue is, where to draw the line?? I personally believe that once a house starts the decay process, there should be no stopping it. That means 90 days have passed, that's time enough to give.
 

Lore

Lore Keeper
Ya'll need to keep all the players you can. Especially long term ones like that. If he was there on an active account then what's the big deal? Messana did the right thing. IDOC is fun, but it's preying on someone else. If you miss out on an IDOC just so the bunny rabbit prey gets to keep playing happy for once... good for them.
 

Modoc

Journeyman
Stratics Veteran
OWNER did NOT pay to keep account active. KEEP, LS, north of Bog, east of crossroads. Owner stated several times they have recently lost other houses, did not pay to keep accounts active. Its in the chat logs. This one was IDOC, and went OSI. Then, after "big popular" players blasted Broadsword with ICQ, email, etc etc. KEEP is owned is MESSENA. Time will tell if this is issue is processed by the rules. Oh, and there was NO identity theft either. Also in the chat logs. Time for BROADSWORD to show their true colors. Will it be BUDDY BUDDY? Or will it be BY THE RULES. (Sorry in advance if this pisses people off, but its not about who you know, its about rules (that even you want enforced))
,,,,and how does this effected you, I mean realy ??? Are you just pissed you missed out on Goodies ?
 

Cyrah

Slightly Crazed
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I will find you 400 more metal boxes... :) It is over and ended well. Thing is Idk what chat you refer to with that information. You have a copy of this? Yes? And I helped him with it AND I never met him until yesterday. The better thee than me idea could have happened. For what purpose?? One less player? Next time it could be thee. He lost one other house. One. A long time ago.

It is no secret that I am not her fan. Nope. But she stepped up and helped. Next time she might be helping you. Just saying.
 

Hazel868789

Adventurer
Stratics Veteran
How does it effect me?? Does that really matter?? It effects this GAME. It effects YOU, the player.
It is NOT a bug that houses go into DECAY because the account is "ACTIVE"
It is NOT a bug that you can repay and relog into ANY "INACTIVE" account AFTER RE RE REACTIVATING it, ie PAYING to play.
Rules-->> 90 day NONpayment. Houses go into DECAY status and account goes inactive and account aging stops. We can all agree on this rule.
Player """PAYS""" to REACTIVATE, yes RE RE RE REACTIVATE account after this time, logs in to now RE ACTIVATED account. 90 day "GRACE" period has EXPIRED !! Should the rules be changed to 95 day grace period?
Should Broadsword EMAIL inactive accounts that thier "GRACE" period is over?
Should Broadsword post on the house sign that decay will start in an additonal XX days because "INACTIVE" account?
Should the "GRACE" period be extended to give the "90 day gamblers" a free pass when they " RE RE REACTIVATE " an account??
IF you think they should be given a FREE PASS, then change the RULES.
If you think they should be given a FREE PASS, then dont complain when "active" players make carbon copies of thier main players and LEGALLY transfer them to other shards for the purpose of "winning" that EVENT "pixel art" (DROP).
If you think they should be given a FREE PASS, then dont complain when "active" players make carbon copies of thier main players and LEGALLY transfer them to other shards for the purpose of "winning" that IDOC "pixel art" (rares, etc).
KEEP putzing.
 

Hazel868789

Adventurer
Stratics Veteran
Ya'll need to keep all the players you can. Especially long term ones like that. If he was there on an active account then what's the big deal? Messana did the right thing. IDOC is fun, but it's preying on someone else. If you miss out on an IDOC just so the bunny rabbit prey gets to keep playing happy for once... good for them.
House started decay process, ie NON ACTIVE account !!!
 

Hazel868789

Adventurer
Stratics Veteran
EPIPHANY. a moment of sudden revelation or insight.

Maybe BROADSWORD should make a SHARD and call it """ Heavenly Grounds """".

NON Playable, just for collection of all IDOC items that show History of the game.

On this """ Heavenly Grounds """ shard, place one ever expanding HOUSE per current shard. Hallways, per year since inception, and collect ALL Historically relevant content from IDOC houses, and place them in the corresponding hallways.

Nothing LOST, available for VIEW on this non playable "SHARD". For all to see and relish the long forgotten days.

Keep putzing!!
 

Lady Michelle

Sprite Full SP
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
How does it effect me?? Does that really matter?? It effects this GAME. It effects YOU, the player.
It is NOT a bug that houses go into DECAY because the account is "ACTIVE"
It is NOT a bug that you can repay and relog into ANY "INACTIVE" account AFTER RE RE REACTIVATING it, ie PAYING to play.
Rules-->> 90 day NONpayment. Houses go into DECAY status and account goes inactive and account aging stops. We can all agree on this rule.
Player """PAYS""" to REACTIVATE, yes RE RE RE REACTIVATE account after this time, logs in to now RE ACTIVATED account. 90 day "GRACE" period has EXPIRED !! Should the rules be changed to 95 day grace period?
Should Broadsword EMAIL inactive accounts that thier "GRACE" period is over?
Should Broadsword post on the house sign that decay will start in an additonal XX days because "INACTIVE" account?
Should the "GRACE" period be extended to give the "90 day gamblers" a free pass when they " RE RE REACTIVATE " an account??
IF you think they should be given a FREE PASS, then change the RULES.
If you think they should be given a FREE PASS, then dont complain when "active" players make carbon copies of thier main players and LEGALLY transfer them to other shards for the purpose of "winning" that EVENT "pixel art" (DROP).
If you think they should be given a FREE PASS, then dont complain when "active" players make carbon copies of thier main players and LEGALLY transfer them to other shards for the purpose of "winning" that IDOC "pixel art" (rares, etc).
KEEP putzing.
Unless it was changed the decaying process starts before the 90 days is up on the 90th day it idocs and falls. thats how I remember how it went. I don't do the 90 days game anymore so don't know how it works now. I love idocs do them to get stuff for me, but the best is when a player comes back and the house doesn't fall. A player should be able to reclaim their house by clicking on the house sign if it is a minute before it falls.
 

Pawain

I Hate Skilling
Governor
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Nice find. Sounds like they are following the rules. Thanks

The owner found out because others yell in chat. Does anyone know "Owner name" ? Can you contact them because their house is IDOC.
The owner was contacted by a player. The owner paid their account and came into the game.

I am glad Mesanna does something like this on a weekend.
 
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Pawain

I Hate Skilling
Governor
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
House "DID" go OSI.
Read the article it says: if the house goes OSI ...blah blah. You have no legs to stand on here. They followed the rules. If the house were to have fallen then, too late. The house did not fall.

Give up, you were not aware of this change to the rules. Accept defeat gracefully.
 

Hazel868789

Adventurer
Stratics Veteran
Would love to find the current published by UO or Broadsword Policy about this. Full, complete and no questions asked Policy.

Is it "TRUE" that your house goes into "DECAY" before your account expires?? That just doesn't sit well with me.

Thank you for looking that info up. I searched and searched for something like that.
 

Modoc

Journeyman
Stratics Veteran
Wow, I mean really just Wow. Never seen someone so upset over something that has absolutely nothing to do with them. SMH
 

Hazel868789

Adventurer
Stratics Veteran
How does it effect me?? Does that really matter?? It effects this GAME. It effects YOU, the player.

PLEASE point me in the right direction where this information about Inactive Accounts, when house decay starts, etc etc is PUBLISHED?

That would put the nail in this coffin. A little snippet from here and there just doesn't cut it. Where is the PUBLISHED information available to be viewed?

Time for someone to contact the powers that be to PUBLISH this, or point us in the direction where we can find it.
 

Johnny Black

Adventurer
so two things I want to point!
  1. so with that not from mesanna, than the person have over 90 days free house? Because the owner of the house can just rent vendors to his 2nd account and close account for 90 days, than house will go Idoc but Not fall bc , since there is vendors rented to another account, House will go OSI, than owner of the house have another 5 days to contact BS and get back???, so they are allowing this now?.
  2. I agree, amazing how upset and greed some people can be, because something that dont even belong to them will no long be free to grab after house go idoc? it is just wow, people get really mad because some people contacted Mesanna and were able to save the house?
 

Hazel868789

Adventurer
Stratics Veteran

Thanks,

And it states: NOTE IDOC ( IN DANGER OF COLLAPSING ) which said house WAS in:

"When a house reaches the IDOC stage house will become set to ‘private’ and all access will be removed. Provided it has no rental vendors, it will drop after 5, 10 or 15 hours, the house and all add ons will disappear, all other content will fall to the ground, grubbers may spawn and steal some of the content. Chase and kill them to recover the stolen goods.

Condemned houses with rental vendors will cycle completely through two IDOC states before they fall. They will enter a state noted on the house sign as ‘Demolition Pending’. At this point reactivating the account will not save it.

The ‘Demolition Pending’ state is also used for accounts that have been suspended, these houses will not fall until any questionable contents have been dealt with by games staff."


Said house did go OSI and Demolition Pending.

My take aways:
So, house decay starts after 90 day grace period, not before.
So, Owner must be present before IDOC state.

Those that were there KNOW what happened. Thusly, the name of this thread.

Thanks for the info.

Keep putzing.
 

Promathia

Crazed Zealot
Premium
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend

Hazel868789

Adventurer
Stratics Veteran
Maybe the above should be added to the House Ownership Page, sure wouldn't hurt to have all the "snippets" and useful information in one spot.

IMHO, IDOC state should be the "RED LINE", Period.

Keep putzing.

Thanks all for keeping the discussion professional and non personal. Love the PLAYERS !!!!
 

Modoc

Journeyman
Stratics Veteran
How does it effect me?? Does that really matter?? It effects this GAME. It effects YOU, the player.

PLEASE point me in the right direction where this information about Inactive Accounts, when house decay starts, etc etc is PUBLISHED?

That would put the nail in this coffin. A little snippet from here and there just doesn't cut it. Where is the PUBLISHED information available to be viewed?

Time for someone to contact the powers that be to PUBLISH this, or point us in the direction where we can find it.
 

Modoc

Journeyman
Stratics Veteran
May I get you some Cheese to go with that Whine ???
As you stated, it does'nt affect you so why are you so upset. Really what was in the house that you wanted so bad you go on this Tirade ?
 
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Hazel868789

Adventurer
Stratics Veteran
Not into "pixel art" Give away anything of value to those who want or need it. Just the process. Hopefully, with the attention this thread has drawn, something finite will come of the 90 account gaming.l

Be safe, keep putzing.
 

Laura_Gold

Lore Master
Stratics Veteran
I wish that the contents of a house would not fall all over the ground. I wish that they would be taken up into OSI storage elsewhere, and when the owner places a house again, that everything goes into a moving container of the new house.
You know that everyone comes back eventually, right?
 

Mr Bug

Journeyman
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
I think if a house goes worn there is no way to know that is in a state of decay for the general population. If a house falls and someone happens to be lucky enough to find a huge clearing full of stuff than so be it. No one has an advantage. That puts an end to camping idocs and scouting idocs etc.. Most people will not probably agree with this. It is fair and balanced. Go out more, explore the heritage, and not exploit it.
 

Modoc

Journeyman
Stratics Veteran
Not into "pixel art" Give away anything of value to those who want or need it. Just the process. Hopefully, with the attention this thread has drawn, something finite will come of the 90 account gaming.l

Be safe, keep putzing.
Wa
I think if a house goes worn there is no way to know that is in a state of decay for the general population. If a house falls and someone happens to be lucky enough to find a huge clearing full of stuff than so be it. No one has an advantage. That puts an end to camping idocs and scouting idocs etc.. Most people will not probably agree with this. It is fair and balanced. Go out more, explore the heritage, and not exploit it.
This is the Best idea I've ever heard concerning the IDOC crisis. No forward warning except to the owner. No visible sign that the house is wore. Brave Adventurers might be Blessed by coming up on fallen house and be rich over night. This would Promote folks to get out and explore our lands and heritage. If no one is there to see it fall and it all poofs it is what it is !
And yes I realize this will never happen because like in Government " It makes too much Sense "

Anyway IMHO this is a perfect fix. * Waits for the Veltures Venomous replies*
 

Pawain

I Hate Skilling
Governor
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
The people who find the items laying about will be the ones who already explore the lands looking for IDOCs.

That's their style of game play, they should be the ones who find most of them.

There are players who look for IDOCs hoping to warn the owners. That is why this owner was warned.
 

Conleth

Seasoned Veteran
Awards
4
@Hazel868789

'Time for BROADSWORD to show their true colors. Will it be BUDDY BUDDY? Or will it be BY THE RULES. '
That's an easy question to answer - it seems to be BUDDY BUDDY. The reason that many people take issue with Mesanna, the producer of Broadsword, is in no small part due to the favouritism within the game. If the original poster was correct with respect to the events and timeline? Much as I have hated to see anyone lose their house/items, the house should have fallen. Period. Either fall for all or fall for none.

What becomes of items from idocs is another matter (I personally would cast my vote for porting to a lock box that a return player must pay to access, which gives an incentive to return. At the very least remove the house sign status, or make the 'in danger' sign linger and remain well past the actual house fall, if Broadsword is inclined to leave the items on the ground to be pillaged. That is one change that should be fairly simple. Additionally, delaying and staggering the release of the items could help).

With the fiasco that idoc'ing has become, and multiple, potentially free accounts leading five pack horses per account, it seems unlikely that said idocers are incentivized to pay a monthly fee.

I'm not certain how many of you would remember this; early in Ultima Online, houses did just vanish for non payment. No decay status, just *poof*. I learned this as I was adventuring and came upon a house outline shaped pile of goods/containers. It remained this way for some years, and I consider/ed it a fair in game event (though admittedly not conducive to enticement to return).

@Sellingahouse

'He stated he has played for 22 years. '

I fail to see what this has to do with house decay. Whether you play for two months or two years or twenty, the rules pertain, or they should pertain, to all. Not to be left open to interpretation, or luck. Else this game simply becomes or remains a playground for Broadsword to lawlessly handle, or mishandle.

@Promathia

With respect to '...if you resubscribe and the house is owned by OSI you have to contact us and we have to alter the warehouse to allow you to get your house back...'', it is precisely statements such as these that reek of favouritism within the game. For example, there is a house in Luna on Oceania that has been owned by OSI for years now - what of that potential player benefit? Should such a person also be entitled to message Mesanna to have that property returned to him or her if they ever decide to return to the game? If so, do you think the people who HAVE supported this game with their hard earned dollars would agree?

(edited for typo)
 

ShriNayne

Certifiable
Stratics Veteran
Awards
5
Personally I think that 90 days should be reduced to 30 days, most of us that had houses paid EVERY MONTH to keep them, if you don't pay every month you are not entitled to a house, same as EJ accounts. There is no good reason why a small group of people are only paying a few times a year and getting a house full time. 30 days should be plenty of time if things go wrong, lots of people now buy game-time for 6 months at a time, very few people still pay month by month.
The reason for having that 90 days has long since gone. I don't know any other game where people are actually encouraged to not pay for the things they want to keep!
 

petemage

Certifiable
Stratics Veteran
Personally I think that 90 days should be reduced to 30 days, most of us that had houses paid EVERY MONTH to keep them, if you don't pay every month you are not entitled to a house, same as EJ accounts. There is no good reason why a small group of people are only paying a few times a year and getting a house full time. 30 days should be plenty of time if things go wrong, lots of people now buy game-time for 6 months at a time, very few people still pay month by month.
The reason for having that 90 days has long since gone. I don't know any other game where people are actually encouraged to not pay for the things they want to keep!
I just joined them on the fun :p Money saved on UO is money I can spent elsewhere. I just couldn't fool myself anymore thinking the money would help the game rather than end up in few individuals pockets. It's the memories that make this game great for me anyway, none of the nonsense the current team keeps coming up with..
 

The Zog historian

Babbling Loonie
Stratics Veteran
Personally I think that 90 days should be reduced to 30 days, most of us that had houses paid EVERY MONTH to keep them, if you don't pay every month you are not entitled to a house, same as EJ accounts. There is no good reason why a small group of people are only paying a few times a year and getting a house full time. 30 days should be plenty of time if things go wrong, lots of people now buy game-time for 6 months at a time, very few people still pay month by month.
The reason for having that 90 days has long since gone. I don't know any other game where people are actually encouraged to not pay for the things they want to keep!
House decay was turned off completely for a while after 9/11, and I think it was after Hurricane Katrina that it was extended to 90 days. Have you ever been uprooted from your house by a major disaster? One month is hardly that long when you're trying to get services restored and insurance to pay for things.

The Powers That Be likely believe it's better to keep it at 90 days, and not even lower it to 60, so that some accounts will be paid for a few times a year, rather than closed completely. It's not just "a small group of people" who are doing that. I've been doing it myself for most of the last five years that I get to play only off and on, and for maybe 10 years I've been doing that for a friend who likewise returns occasionally. The other type are those who do it for storage space, and though you might not like housing spots being occupied for three payments a year, the game designers are very well aware of how it's used. They know it would hurt revenues more than if they forced a payment every month.

Now as far as being able to refresh a house after it's gone IDOC, the game has always been that way, even back to the original refresh method of opening the door with a key in your pack. Whoever doesn't like it is welcome to that opinion, but that's not how the game is operating.
 

The Zog historian

Babbling Loonie
Stratics Veteran
That's an easy question to answer - it seems to be BUDDY BUDDY. The reason that many people take issue with Mesanna, the producer of Broadsword, is in no small part due to the favouritism within the game. If the original poster was correct with respect to the events and timeline? Much as I have hated to see anyone lose their house/items, the house should have fallen. Period. Either fall for all or fall for none.
I'm not personally aware of Mesanna intervening and cannot say either way if she's favored some players over others, nor do I know why this IDOC was saved. I will say that I don't know what the problem was with the owner refreshing the house normally, but sometimes there are errors or fraud alert false positives when trying to charge a properly working credit card. Of course, if someone was shamming, a temporarily UO-owned house should be forcibly decayed on the spot. An arbitrarily chosen time in the middle of some night might be nice.

There's only one "Owned by OSI" house I'm personally aware of that should not have lasted so long. Keys on Sonoma was a notorious PK, but I never knew him to cheat until he got a Counselor friend to teleport his red into Trammel, just after the first facet split. He killed a bunch of blues, got caught quickly, and was banned right away for such flagrancy. Maybe it was his way of going out in a blaze of glory. His old tower outside Fel Skara stayed up and "Owned by OSI" for years, and with the friends list wiped, nobody could get in. I don't know if it went IDOC or was just deleted.

Once I returned to the game just in time when one of my account's houses were IDOC. Only one refreshed, and the other houses (grandfathered) remained IDOC. Forgetting that grandfathered houses once IDOC cannot be refreshed, I e-mailed Mesanna on a weekend afternoon, not counting on a response. Well, it was my mistake, so when she replied that nothing could be done, that was that.
 

Conleth

Seasoned Veteran
Awards
4
Now as far as being able to refresh a house after it's gone IDOC, the game has always been that way, even back to the original refresh method of opening the door with a key in your pack. Whoever doesn't like it is welcome to that opinion, but that's not how the game is operating.
With respect, you are muddying the waters. The issue; following a full idoc stage, should (some?) houses remain in suspended animation whilst 'Owned By OSI' and be able to (maybe, possibly, perhaps only for some lucky, clever, or?? people) retrieve them at some undisclosed/arbitrary later length of time?

If the OP is correct in the time line and course of events, the house should have fallen. I can only say that I myself have seen a number of 'Owned By OSI' homes that stand for months and years. As @Promathia pointed out in his screenshot RE: the reacquiring a house owned by OSI (being able to be retrieved sometimes? Always? Maybe?), what does this say about idoc 'rules' and 'payment requirements'?
 

Hazel868789

Adventurer
Stratics Veteran
To clarify house went OSI
--->>> I'm having troubles with my house being OSI, even though my account is active <<-- from the owner of the house in question. from uo .com

OLD school house decay was 30 day "process" ALL THE TIME No renew, **POOF** in 8 hours.

Intervention? Mesanna now the owner Heavenly Grounds (edited to add this)
 
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