@SwordofExcalibur
--- Not from static game content thats for sure (except for the first 2 weeks after an expansion release, or limited time content such as global events, invasions, EM events)
I made alot of gold farming conjurers trinkets. limited time global event. after i had that initial gold, mostly buy / sell (most of that cheap loot came from idocs which i did not do myself, but cheap enough that its easily bought in bulk and resold. Other than that, building suits and EM events (ive already explained how i wish EM items were account bound, but if there not, yeah im going to make gold from them. plus i do have a nice rares collection) Yes, crafting is game content. Crafting in UO i think is very healthy, but in my opinion you should be able to make just as much profits from killing bosses, doing quests, etc as spending a few hours making suits.
So you made some gold from farming and selling. Ok, that's doing a form of content. If it's not farming from mobs and bosses, its just using the existing player economy which is a part of the content. So still, I don't see the point of your argument. IDOCs are simply content that has been completed and available for transfer to the first person that grabs the item.
If the IDOCs introducing a flood of new items into the game potentially causes said items to drop in gold price, then, what is the problem? Prices dropped. Items are affordable.
I took a break this year. Last Christmas season, Animal Taming 3 skill mastery books were easily 100-150MIL on player vendors. This Christmas season, I was actually able to afford one finally. I purchased one for 45MIL off a player vendor. I also noticed prices on scrolls have decreased. I'm not paying the 50-65 ON ATL for 120 Tactics. I actually found them going for 35-45.
So, unless you are targeting specific items causing a swell of market saturation, perhaps maybe arties, then I really have to disagree with you that IDOCs are a problem in UO. Cheating on IDOCs, on the other hand...
currently, this is not the case because of the flood of items from idocs.
You need to be more specific. What items? What flood?
My point in this is that all the content the devs spend so much time to develop, its not the best way to make gold. actually if your doing that game content, itll take way longer to get items than just buying them. Yes, you can do it for fun. but i dont agree that actually doing the content holds someone back is good game design.
1. Farming gold is a staple of Massively Multi-player Online RPGS. That is a fundamental. It exists in UO. This fact cannot be argued.
2. There are significant, albeit, slow ways of farming gold in UO. I don't see farmers farming gold in 2018 like I used to see farmers farming gold in 2000. Shame was literally the farming playground. Shame these days is not busy as it used to be.
3. The roof, the exodus encounter, and champion spawns are not the current generally accepted means of farming content for gold and items in the game? Then why are they priced, imo, so terribly high?
4. Pet trade is vibrant and lucrative, if you are patient enough.
I just fail to understand where your argument says that content is not present to farm gold. The game is 22 years old, so its full of -old money.- That old money is exchanging hands.
Gold is duped. That is a fact. I agree that thread should be necro-ed.
The problem is there is absolutely no lack of content. we have tons of it. lots of bosses, mobs, lands, etc.
Contradiction to your original premise.
the items gained from those activities tho are just relatively worthless,
I disagree. It stilll costs 15-20MIL to get a tangle. It still costs 35+MIL to get a 120 Tactics. It still costs 20+MIL to get a Hawkwind's robe. Cameos start out at 150MIL. I feel this is inflated, but these items are generally heavily sought after. Your point is not working.
again because of idoc loot. to the point where the content isnt worth doing.
You need proof. I don't see any. But I'd be interested, if there is proof, that IDOCs are hurting the economy and game-play. Currently, I think duping and scripting is what has hurt the economy. These notions are standard MMO issues not always easily addressed. It's kind of the industry stanard. It happens in every MMO, generally speaking.
Is it better to have a game where the main focus is NOT doing content the devs design such as bosses and pvm? This does allow a player to focus on things like RP, rares collecting, and PVP, being able to totally ignore the dev provided pvm content.
I think I am able to intuit your complaint: you dislike the current treasure table system. You feel IDOCs are an infringement on an already poor treasure table system. I don't know, the Devs felt that IDOCs are not infringing by their historic actions, but that could quickly change given a particular circumstance they are unhappy with; point being that is, if IDOCs are truly out of control today to the point Mesanna is having to intervene. But that needs to be eloborated on.
OR
is it better to have worthwhile pvm content, and essentially force players to do that content if they want to gear their character and make it better. In this scenerio you of course could also do all other activites, like PVP, collecting, RP, etc. but you would have to do the normal, everyday content as well to gear a character.
Farming gold has already been implemented by the original game design. So you're point of forcing characters to farm gold doesn't work. "Worthwhile pvm content" is present in the game. You and a certain group of players may not like that content, but you can't argue that it is not there. This is evidenced to the fact that Cameos from Minax are so highly sought after.
If you want better content, more content, or better treasure tables from trash mobs, that would be a different argument entirely, not one related to IDOCs.
Being a sandbox game, perhaps im wrong. perhaps PVM content should only be a minor distraction.
I don't think OSI ever intended PVM to be a distraction. I think it is intended to be a fundamental component. But introducing more content under a sandbox game philosophy is an entirely different topic. And, even though I don't care for IDOCs, IDOCs do seem to work with a sandbox gameplay mentality. Its an event, it brings traffic, there is socialization, the possibility of wealth, and this equates to joyful gameplay.
But i hear players complain everyday about how its so hard to get ahead and buy that 10 billion gold castle when the only good options to make gold do NOT include normal content.
Ah, but how are IDOCs at fault for this? I've stated the game is full of -old money.- Old money is buying the 10-50 billion castles, not to mention, cheaters and unscrupulous users; some who were given power, some not.
It is possible to afford housing in UO. That's not an issue IDOCs are at fault for.
On a side note, of course you can make some gold doing PVM content. but like you said its very difficult and time consuming. I just wish it were a little more balanced, and eliminating idoc loot would help achieve that.
Unfortunately, you have not proven that eliminating IDOC loot would help achieve that. You haven't actually addressed core concerns like cheating, the game engine's future, or the support available to OSI to innovate and support the game. Your premise seems to be your unhappiness with treasure tables and the availability of faster ways to farm gold to match up to the current OVER-INFLATED economy and the presence of old money.
And that is where I empathize: the game is broke here in the current age. The economy is super inflated and the game design does not match up to meet the problem of quick gold accumulation in order to meet a level of gamer happiness. In order to find a level of happiness, as a gamer, we have to circumvent the current content gold farming method, hope for a rare artie, and sell it; or farm pets, or sell RMT items from the UO store, or sell things from seasonal events, etc. etc.
So, ultimately, here are two issues: farming gold in the game is broke or the over-inflated economy is broken.
To sum it up: I think farming gold is actually decent (could be better, but that's a gripe) and the economy is just broke.
IDOCs would then -actually- be a way for financially insecure players to be able to compete in the current economy age. Taking that away, seems rather harsh, wouldn't you say? You'd be forcing those players to farm gold, something you attest to dis-liking, or have them farm items from the Roof, Exodus, etc, or craft, or get lucky and attend an EM event to sell a rare, or do a seasonal event, or farm pets.
In conclusion, IDOCs are not a problem in the game at the moment; old money and cheating are.
Necro that thread!
....i really dont care what any player in this game does I just do what I enjoy. My whole point is people should be free to give an opinion or idea without being chastised because they may not have the experience another has. I dont attempt idocs as my time is limited, i dont want to spend all my time running around looking at house signs, marking runes, and then camping or waiting on timers for a house to fall, then race to grab what I can. If you read any comment ive made has nothing to do with changing the mechanics as I dont know how they used to be compared to now. What i have replied is based on the theory that scriptors are the only ones racking up. Obviously they arent doing anything about them so what other solutions are there? Which is what I thought these threads were about? Just an example someone posted they should put the item drops on random top end mobs. Well why should they? Top end mobs already drop better stuff, so if thats a solution why not put on random mobs so anyone may get it? If scriptors are the only ones getting stuff then just delete it...problem solved. It doesnt take an experienced idocer to make these common sense doable suggestions.
