FAO: DEVS re: WINTERMOORE TOWERS

[Bomb Bloke]

I couldn't disagree more. The company that refined RPGs was Squaresoft and no games have ever come close to the Final Fantasy line of games. I also was a huge fan of strategy roleplaying games and espcially Shining Force I and II.

Ah, sorry, I tend to forget that there are different types of RPGs.

I was referring to those along the lines of Diablo, where they basically took Ultima 8 and ripped out everything except the combat system. You know, the sort of RPGs that mostly turn up on PCs... Games that are just a combat system and little more.

Mind you, U8 is hardly held as a shining example of Ultima. Ironic, that.

Speaking of Ultima 8, you should take a look at some screen shots of that one. UO plays like a mix between that, U7, and Ultima Underworld. If you feel like burning some time you should try those later two (or at least look up some reviews). U7 can be played via Exult.

 

[Giani Saran]

* just shakes head and goes to read a different thread * !

 

[Beefybone]

Good for you...I was 1. Then I grew up and played games that didn't suck. Sorry, but the Ultima game series itself totally and utterly blew. The game was already eclipsed by FF as soon as the FF line came out and pretty much everything SquareEnix made has done around 100% better than Ultima games.

The Ultima series began almost 30 years ago, and you're going on about "Warcraft has lore that goes all the way back to the mid/late nineties!" like that's a lot, because you're a kiddie who thinks RPG gaming began with the Super Nintendo.

Final Fantasy is garbage played by millions of anime dorks and teenage girls who write slash fiction about Sephiroth getting frisky with Cloud. And Warcraft lore is even sillier and more broken-down than UO lore come the Lich King expansion, with gnomish death knights riding their motorcycles into combat with space-demon aliens and crap.

Oh, and Final Fantasy was just a big fat Ultima ripoff for the longest time anyway. The tile graphics, separate combat screens, walking over city icons to enter them, and standing next to NPCs to hear their bit of dialogue? Ultima invented all that crap before you were born.

Heck, Ultima had added time-sensitive AI and open conversation systems for NPCs before the end of the eighties. Meanwhile Final Fantasy kept the "NPCs that stand in one spot saying one thing forever" crap in place for eternity.

 

[Experimental]

Better question...

Who actually cares? The only thing developers should do with any and all rares is DELETE them. If you go through that list, the majority of them were obtained through exploits and cheats. The same people that whine about exploits and cheats in this day and age are obsessed with the rare markets. Those items should have been deleted and the person that created them banned the second they were created. The only true rares are event item rares, and other than that the "true rares" were items created by exploiters and cheaters.

DELETE ALL RARES THEN YOU HAVE ROOM TO COMPLAIN ABOUT EXPLOITERS.

From another thread:
"This tool honestly makes me glad I gave up on UO a long long time ago to play a game where they actually ban the correct people."

Why do you still post?

 

[Connor_Graham]

if you chose UO over WoW then you need to learn how to make better choices.

Then why are you still here and not playing WoW full time since you have a sub to it?

If the game sucks so bad then leave.


Please.

:loser:

 

[walter_mitty]

mods can you lock this topic please its gone way off the mark.

 

[Fizzleton]

this one - mr. or miss galefan - is on a trip that sounds like a disdained lover. I don't think that an online game deserves this kind of - say, enthusiasm; and especially negative enthusiasm, like a 9-years old that didn't get the icecream it liked. Man or woman; get over it. Really.

 

[Limlight]

The only thing sad about all this is that people seem to call suspicision of a shady situation as jealousy.

Some of you people are the kind of gophers I despise. You think no one should ever ask questions about a situation that looks shady...and your idea of calling it jealousy is idiotic.

Some of you people obviously dont realize the gates that action could have created. Once you give a player something in game that he shouldnt have recieved....you open the floodgates for requests like it.

I dont know Link that well, so I dont know his true intentions.

What I know is this...
Some towers went IDOC
They magically appeared from Eager Meager to Link.
I asked a question to Link on his HOT forums.
He dodged it and made jokes about it.
My response was and SHOULD BE to question his intent and integrity in the issue...if history was his goal..jokes and a HUGE RARES AUCTION would not be the response.

 

[AmanitaMuscaria]

The only thing sad about all this is that people seem to call suspicision of a shady situation as jealousy.

Some of you people are the kind of gophers I despise. You think no one should ever ask questions about a situation that looks shady...and your idea of calling it jealousy is idiotic.

Some of you people obviously dont realize the gates that action could have created. Once you give a player something in game that he shouldnt have recieved....you open the floodgates for requests like it.

I dont know Link that well, so I dont know his true intentions.

What I know is this...
Some towers went IDOC
They magically appeared from Eager Meager to Link.
I asked a question to Link on his HOT forums.
He dodged it and made jokes about it.
My response was and SHOULD BE to question his intent and integrity in the issue...if history was his goal..jokes and a HUGE RARES AUCTION would not be the response.

You hit the "nail-on-the-head," Lim. That was my intention as well and somehow I get ganged-up on by people for asking some questions about the shady events that you, yourself had clued me in to. If not for your posts on the JC Boards, I would not have been able to research these events and uncover their dark depths.

People like me and Lou get picked-on for standing up for what's right and true. Violation of TOS, transferring of towers/rares from IDOC status to Player right before your own eyes, with only one party present, just begs the question and warrants further investigation.

Whistle-blowers are never popular people. But it's a cross that some are willing to bear.

 

[Thangorodrim]

I have to strongly agree that it seems entirely inappropriate for ANY IDOC for ANY reason to be transferred by a GM to a different account.

In addition, since billions of gold will be accumulated subsequent to this event it raises questions of the motivation of the transfer.

Even the appearance of corruption and impropriety is unacceptable.

This gives the appearance of GM collusion with a player to sell UO assets for cash.

My comments are predicated on my understanding of the events in question and subject to adjustment if there is clarification or correction of said events...

Having said that, whatever passes for internal affairs overseeing EA in game support needs to examine this situation and make a statement.

 

[Thangorodrim]

Additionally, it is entirely inappropriate for Stratics to attempt to quash this discussion when it is a serious matter that merits community attention.

 

[Harb]

Limlight & Amanita, sorry if any of you were offended way back in the thread when we were on point (pre-Galefan, about 2000 B.G.). Where this came from was the other, currently locked thread, where emotions were clearly rising, animosity crept into postings, and nobody explained - as many assumed we all knew what they were talking about. The theme in that thread was a player suspension, which many of us felt improper, and for me - I continue to support the player on that issue. On this one, I'm "leaning" the other way, but JC has chosen not to repsond with further information and clarification.

The point we were discussing here were allegations that 1) EA/ Mythic "gave" a player an in game "icon," a structure that has meaning to many players there, separate of normal gameplay. Continuing, 2) that the player freely given the structure is assumed to have been entrusted, possibly to include some form of unknown agreement, with maintaining the structure and it's contents. Finally, 3) that the player, for personal gain and profit, is selling the structure and it's contents for personal gain. Did I get that right, or did I miss something?

If this is an actual reflection of what's occurring, I believe it does justify the response, the discussion, intervention and corrective action. Not to mention the fact that the link you provided displays in game sells of around 2 billion gold, from what may be a murky scenario - not so different, at least in theme, from other issues dominating the boards the moment. Maybe we can get back on track, and possibly even get a repsonse from JC!!!

 

[Lord Gareth]

Well im going to have to jump in on this one because we ran into this in another Em blessed building (not paxlair)

The blessed items/Rares were being sold and it has always been the standpoint of whoever is running UO at the time that blessed items for a community CAN NOT! and WILL NOT! be sold. If attempting to Sell them they will be deleted from the game.

Now I am not sure what changed but if a petition was made to get the tower you would need to see what they agreed to. if in the agreement they said they wish to preserve THE TOWER! (Which means not sell it) (No preserve the rares) then the company would have to make its own decision.

But from what I remember when someone tryed to sell this two story house that has blessings and full bookshelfs of books (The cool ones) A gm came by and the house went BOOM! and the items went

delet delet delet delet


So you would need to know what they agreed on before the transfer and I am NOT SHOCKED! that they transfered the Towers to another player and not let them fall. For the ones complaining from what im reading on a few posts is:

Its all about them making profit and you didnt get to make profit which is 100's of millions of gold. Sooooo all the rares dont stay in the tower. They arnt being deleted. They arnt being thrown in the trash they are just changing hands so. (But like I said you didnt use to be able to do that) im just saying it sounds like people are geting upset because they dont get to sell the rares because all the people complaining are talking about how much they are making. and IM POSITIVE anyone paying that much owns a museum and so really they are still in a museum your just not making the profit.

 

[Lord Gareth]

And I wish to make one last comment before i finish. The person who owned the tower who all this stuff belonged to LEGALY. None of this belonged to any of you it belonged to the person who owned the tower.

yes it may have been a community building. Yes it may hold memorys but obviously the person who owned it didnt care thats why it started to go Idoc.

So if the OWNER who legaly OWNED the tower and its contents is leting it fall and EA who really OWNS the game and ALL of the game contents can do as they please with it.

I still dont understand I guess about the items and the houses (Paxlair city the mage and necro twin blessed towers mean allot to me but if they fell that does not change our community.) If our community is just built around a blessed building then it isnt much of a community.

Things fall things fail and its the memories that hold it together. Would it be nice to still have the Rares and the tower and such. Heck yes it would but that isnt going to happen. So I suggest once the items sell try to figure out who bought them and what museum they are going to.

Just because all the stuff isnt in one building anymore does not mean you cannot go to another museum or what not to see the items.

An Item is an Item

A house is a house

A community is people and thats what matters.

 

[hawkeye_pike]

"The in-game admin faces a bizarre problem. He is exercising power that the ordinary virtual citizen cannot. And he is looked to in manyways to provide a certain atmosphere and level of civility in the environment. Yet the fact remains that no matter how scrupulously honest he is, no matter how just he shows himself to be, no matter how committed to the welfare of the virtual space he may prove himself, people will hate his guts. They will mistrust him precisely because he has power, and they can never know him. There will be false accusations galore, many insinuations of nefarious motives, and former friends will turn against him."

 

[D'Amavir]

No offense to either side, but my opinion on this issue and issues like it is a little bit different than what may be considered the norm. I am one that appreciates the history of UO itself. The written history as done by the devs, the in game history as created by the players, the in game perks (blessed buildings, etc...) as given by the devs and the in game items that came about during major events (know as rares of course).

I am not a rare collector, I don't go after every new piece of pixel crack. Its not my thing. However, I think those items (rares) that actually came about from historic events on a specific shard are important to those like me that appreciate the story behind them and the shard itself.

As such, I feel that any recognized (by the devs through special features and such) items and places should remain in the state that they were placed in by the devs regardless of the player behind those items and places. If a blessed building goes empty due to the owner leaving, the devs should step in and take ownership of said building in order to ensure that the community itself doesn't lose a part of their history (and a part that the devs obviously agreed was a true part of the shards history because they chose to take the steps to bless it or tweak it, etc...).

As for items, thats a bit trickier. But not impossible. If a blessed building is full of historical shard items, those items should be given a new designation defining them as such. That designation would prevent them from being removed from the building in question. This would keep them from being sold for real cash, given away to people that don't appreciate their historic value or destroyed. The devs could name a caretaker or caretakers to manage these items (move them around in the blessed house in order to change the decoration scheme for example) but not give them ownership of them. Same goes for the blessed buildings. You could give a player guardianship of a blessed building but not true ownership.

This would both secure the life of these items and buildings but also allow a player or players to be recognized as the guardian or caretaker of them.

 

[Harb]

"The in-game admin faces a bizarre problem. He is exercising power that the ordinary virtual citizen cannot. And he is looked to in manyways to provide a certain atmosphere and level of civility in the environment. Yet the fact remains that no matter how scrupulously honest he is, no matter how just he shows himself to be, no matter how committed to the welfare of the virtual space he may prove himself, people will hate his guts. They will mistrust him precisely because he has power, and they can never know him. There will be false accusations galore, many insinuations of nefarious motives, and former friends will turn against him."

A rock solid observation that is well said here. At least for me, this is not the person in question. An effort made to preserve environment, even if going astray at a later time, remains a noble intent. A players actions, at that later time, for me are what may be in question now. Had EA made an announcement that they were giving away 2 billion to the single player making the strongest contribution external to the game through personal efforts, sincerely the first deserving person who would have popped into my mind would have been the creator and keeper of UOGuide, JC the builder - the man at the center of this controversy. I don't play ATL and have no idea of how he chooses to interact there, but am very aware of the work he has done on his website. Others that come to mind are the creators of UOA and UOAM, but one of those was done for profit. So my vote would be for JC. That said, if the situation actually is as some portray, then JC may need to do some soul searching on this one and make a course revision. But for now, we don't really know the whole story!

 

[AdamD]

I asked JC is the rares for sale on his site, were from the Wintermoor towers and he said no, they weren't.

 

[Harb]

I asked JC is the rares for sale on his site, were from the Wintermoor towers and he said no, they weren't.

Correct, as I bumbled through trying to separate issues above, I blew this one sorry. His account was suspended for 2 low density items he sells to recoup operating costs on UOGuide. Someone with animosity toward him had paged the GM, who acted IAW EA policy. The thread we were discussing that on was locked, as it had gotten out of hand. During that discussion, the issue of a keep and it's contents, and JC's intent to sell the contents through his other website also arose. It appeared this action, through his site other than UOGuide, was the true source of player concern. One of the concerned players began this thread. This auction is not for actual $, it's for in-game gold, about 2 billion worth. Earlier posts in this thread explain further, and I think there is a link somewhere to the auction from JC's other site. If not, it is toward the end of the other thread.

(Edit) Oops, one minute, an edit/ clarification is required. The items for sell on UOGuide are not, at least one of the two isn't for sure, the items for auction on his other site do seem to be.

 

[AmanitaMuscaria]

If you read through the original thread http://vboards.stratics.com/showthread.php?t=95370 it's just strange how, at one point, we're told that there's "nothing" to worry about, as he was simply given "empty" towers, yet later in the thread he goes on to admit they are littered with rares... I just don't get it.

The more I think about it, though, I'm the fool -- I've done free advertising work for this guys "private rares sale."

I'm the fool, here. But at least we all got to go along for the ride. Some clarification would still be nice, however.

I'm sure people are laughing all the way to the bank on this one. And I'd venture a guess that the billions in gold the sales will generate will be sold for RL $$.

 

[Harb]

The items in question, the source of the items, and the "ethical dilemma" to some of the ATL players are at http://www.hot-guild.com/raresale.html

 

[Spellbound]

All from EA's own customer support Knowledge Base:

QUESTION
How can I claim this inactive house?

Answer
It is unfortunately not possible to "claim" a home. Only the home owner can trade away a house in game.
http://support.ea.com/cgi-bin/ea.cf...XNlIGdtIGJsZXNzaW5nIGlkb2M*&p_li=&p_topview=1

***
QUESTION
What is the role of a Game Master?

Answer

This is an excellent question that we are asked very often. Game Masters serve many functions: mediator, problem solver, police, and customer service. The most important thing to remember about a Game Master is that they are not here to change the rules of the game. While we will extract people from situations in which they are not able to continue playing, but Game Masters should not be used as divine intervention. We don't resurrect the dead, tell you how many people you have murdered or slay beasts for you to take their treasure.
In fact, we believe the less interference from the Game Masters, the more rewarding a game Ultima Online will be. We want to encourage players to solve problems on their own, within the community. We firmly believe that the more players come together and form a community, the less they have to worry about anti-social behavior. However, certain times a Game Master must step in and clear up misunderstandings or remove harmful players. We ask that at those times you respect that a Game Master is only doing what is best for the game.

http://support.ea.com/cgi-bin/ea.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=2

***
QUESTION
Atlantic Shard History





Wintermoor: This was another famous player run town of Atlantic. It was most famous for its Rare Museum which contained examples of rares that could not be obtained anymore. In the early days of UO, items around the world were not locked down and thieves could (and did) steal just about everything. A fine collection of those items appeared in the Rares Museum for players to view.
http://support.ea.com/cgi-bin/ea.cf...XNlIGdtIGJsZXNzaW5nIGlkb2M*&p_li=&p_topview=1

***

Seems like EA dropped the ball by skirting their rules. Time to do the right thing. You know giving one player a billion gp's worth of rares to sell is wrong.

 

[MolaRom]

And, remember, a key point here is that Limlight from LNR said that he was present at the time the towers went from IDOC to "Owned by ..." status and there weren't not two parties present.

The person who now owns these locations stated, by his own words, that he "convinced EA to give him the towers":

(FROM NEW OWNER'S OWN BOARDS):
Re: SO... who all in ViP do you think got banned for duping?

Postby Link Wed Aug 06, 2008 8:03 pm

"I didn't want them to decay so I convinced EA to give them to me rather than have Atlantic history lost."

then it goes on:

Limlight wrote: I will make sure to recall there every now and then just to make sure the Magic Doors and Two-Story Statues are still there then...

:-[

Link:

"They asked if I wanted them boxed up, but I said I'll just page when I want them moved."

It's not like people are making these things up!!! I mean, it's already been admitted to by the person involved!

But he just says it's all a "joke" now. So, I guess that takes it all away. And we should just forget it.

Nothing in his posts indicated he was joking....

 

[Spellbound]

Best course of action. Take the tower back and set it to public and OSI owned. Don't let it decay to preserve history. Don't let the rares be sold to dupers and a few of the unscrupulous high rollers. Restore the integrity this game deserves, and not the profiteering of one.

 

[MolaRom]

It's just the whole nature of the "slippery slope" situation here -- if they gave him the IDOCs, what's next? Where do they draw the line?

I don't think we will ever know what happened here. Facts are:

-Player mysteriously took over these location while another player was purportedly present and witnessed no formal transaction;
-Towers were said to be empty by player who received the locations, but are in fact full of rares;
-Said player is now selling rares for billions in gold through this own website which has been listed here already;
-Said player admitted in his own words the towers went from EA into this hands, based solely on the fact that they have "historical" merit;
-Said player now claims that he was merely joking and that his statements should not be taken seriously.

That's about all anyone will know about this. the Devs won't respond but will just say they can't comment. It does seem dirty though, but it might not be.

**edit: oh, and I think those arguments that he is deserving of the locations are BS. Just because he runs some UO sites doesn't mean that he should be given special treatment in game.

 

[RaDian FlGith]

Okay, here's the question then...

Aside from a couple of items that appear to be quest related, the majority of the items that are listed in that rare sale are simply server-birth items. I would think that these two towers a vocal minority are referring to house a heck of a lot more than server birth items.

Additionally, I don't know if anyone's made the connection or not, but the two towers certainly wouldn't look like one castle.

Now, maybe someone's got a list of all the stuff that was in the two towers, from a reliable source other than the small handful of people causing waves mostly, it appears, out of spite -- and if so, then a comparison against those lists could occur, and maybe a link could be established.

But right now, we've just got baseless accusations.

 

[Harb]

It's just the whole nature of the "slippery slope" situation here -- if they gave him the IDOCs, what's next? Where do they draw the line?

I'm really not sure that's the encapsulating issue, though certainly it is to some, it's not the aspect of this that I find disconcerting. To your point, Hawkeye defined it well above. I personally appreciate environmental preservation, and refuse to judge in any way intent, method, or judgement of the staff on this one. What seems most relevant to me has nothing whatsoever to do with player actions either, it is the lack of current communication from our dev folks, and what may be derived by many as an underlying apathy leading to said communication - or lack thereof. Secondly, I have concerns of current trends toward non-intervention, detecting and "righting" ethical "wrongs" as they exist now, and doing so in a timely manner. Were it not for these concerns, my only take on this is less appreciation for contributions of another player, which would not lead to all my babbling on the subject.

I don't think we will ever know what happened here.

Possible. Likely. Very likely indeed. But JC can shed some light if he so chooses. But it is his choice, and matters only from a perspective of reputation. I'm not ready to "sail him down the river" yet. Silence however, is consent.

**edit: oh, and I think those arguments that he is deserving of the locations are BS. Just because he runs some UO sites doesn't mean that he should be given special treatment in game.

I dont recall anyone saying that, but will assume it's there somewhere. Again, please read Hawkeye's comment above. For the "admin" making that decision, I suspect options were few, and he/ she did at least move toward someone demonstrating strong interest in the game and community. I won't judge, I can't really place myself into this persons shoes a year or so ago.

 

[Vyrquenox]

I can only speak for myself, but when I signed up I had to choose been UO WoW and I choose UO because of its history.

That would make you a minority in the player base and if you chose UO over WoW then you need to learn how to make better choices. One game has players and the other does not. One game has function systems and tech support and the other does not. One game reminds me of playing consoles in 1992 and the other does not. So, I guess if you really dig history then this game would be for you. If you dig relics then this game would definately be for you. But, you don't have to see long gone exploited items in game for that sense of history just log into the legacy client and you see all the history you want with its pretty 1992 graphics.

The even funnier thing about this post is that WoW is actually based on old school Warcraft lore and that lore actually existed before UO even did. Warcraft lore started in around 1995 (or whenever WCII was released) and that lore is still referenced to a HUGE extent in WoW today. However, they have actual lore to build on those that follow it know what the lore means for the game. They don't need proof of long ago exploits as a substitution for history.

regardless of who is right or wrong in the opinions of ultima online history and such, warcraft did not exist in any way shape or form whatsoever in mass market until 1994 while Ultima I was released in 1980. If Warcraft is based on 'old school warcraft lore' which existed before uo even did, well UO is based on 'old school' ultima lore which existed probably before you did, and at any rate long before blizzard or warcraft did.

'old school' is a stupid term anyway.

 

[Vyrquenox]

The items in question, the source of the items, and the "ethical dilemma" to some of the ATL players are at http://www.hot-guild.com/raresale.html

Due to unwanted attention the auction is ending immediately. All high bidders are the winners of their respected items. The items need to be picked up ASAP or you will forfeit your bid.

wow that sounds awesome!

 

[Spellbound]

EA needs to respond to this mess. Your turning a deaf ear does not reflect well on how to run an honest game.

 

[MolaRom]

Due to unwanted attention the auction is ending immediately. All high bidders are the winners of their respected items. The items need to be picked up ASAP or you will forfeit your bid.

wow that sounds awesome!

WOW!! I thought that was a joke... he seriously did change the Webpage to reflect that. If you ask me, this implies guilt as well -- why would you have to sell it off and end the auction so quickly, due to the "unwanted" attention? You'd think an "auction" would want as much attention as possible... unless it was dealing in "HOT" goods!

Sketchy!

 

[MolaRom]

is there any way he can attempt to hack our accounts from that link... the only reason i clicked on it was because it was part of the normal HOT guild website and didn't appear to be suspicious... but maybe it was put up here to try to gather sensitive information for hacking purposes...?

any thoughts? maybe i'm just paranoid....

it seems like just a simply HTML page... i don't see anything to be concerned about, but i'm no expert

 

[Ken of Napa]

is there any way he can attempt to hack our accounts from that link... the only reason i clicked on it was because it was part of the normal HOT guild website and didn't appear to be suspicious... but maybe it was put up here to try to gather sensitive information for hacking purposes...?

any thoughts? maybe i'm just paranoid....

it seems like just a simply HTML page... i don't see anything to be concerned about, but i'm no expert

Hmmm, another new poster that has only posted in two spots to try and disparage one person as much as possible? :loser:

I wonder what you're normal posting name is?

With the attempt by a few (or perhaps only one or two) people to drag anything this guy does through the mud, it's no wonder he cancelled the auction. Personally, with all the accusations flying around these days, I don't think I'd sell anything right now.

Hopefully things calm down soon, but people really need to stop making wild accusations that can't be confirmed (except by a real wierd stretch of the imagination).

 

[MolaRom]

Hmmm, another new poster that has only posted in two spots to try and disparage one person as much as possible? :loser:

I wonder what you're normal posting name is?

I lurk and only post when I'm concerned what's wrong with that? Do you think everyone posting a concerned post is the same person? And i thought i was the paranoid one about the link that was posted to another site....

 

[Beefybone]

Some GM passed the IDOC full of uberloot to his friend. It's pretty obvious, and I don't have any particular stake here.

 

[Stigmatas]

Good for you...I was 1. Then I grew up and played games that didn't suck. Sorry, but the Ultima game series itself totally and utterly blew. The game was already eclipsed by FF as soon as the FF line came out and pretty much everything SquareEnix made has done around 100% better than Ultima games.

The Ultima series began almost 30 years ago, and you're going on about "Warcraft has lore that goes all the way back to the mid/late nineties!" like that's a lot, because you're a kiddie who thinks RPG gaming began with the Super Nintendo.

Final Fantasy is garbage played by millions of anime dorks and teenage girls who write slash fiction about Sephiroth getting frisky with Cloud. And Warcraft lore is even sillier and more broken-down than UO lore come the Lich King expansion, with gnomish death knights riding their motorcycles into combat with space-demon aliens and crap.

Oh, and Final Fantasy was just a big fat Ultima ripoff for the longest time anyway. The tile graphics, separate combat screens, walking over city icons to enter them, and standing next to NPCs to hear their bit of dialogue? Ultima invented all that crap before you were born.

Heck, Ultima had added time-sensitive AI and open conversation systems for NPCs before the end of the eighties. Meanwhile Final Fantasy kept the "NPCs that stand in one spot saying one thing forever" crap in place for eternity.

Bwahahahaha! QFT!

FF sucks. Anime crap indeed. I'm sure Brittany Spears music is more popular today than Mozart, but that don't make Brittany suck any less

Godsmack, Metallica, Mozart > Brittany Spears

Ultima >>>>>>> FF

I think it's a pretty accurate comparison

 

[Teeshy]

Nevermind - apparently I misread something somewhere along the line

 

[Alvinho]

I asked JC is the rares for sale on his site, were from the Wintermoor towers and he said no, they weren't.

Maybe not anymore all the rucus has been made this is directly from his site

Private Rare Auction
Due to unwanted attention the auction is ending immediately. All high bidders are the winners of their respected items. The items need to be picked up ASAP or you will forfeit your bid.

 

[Mordocuo]

Some GM passed the IDOC full of uberloot to his friend. It's pretty obvious, and I don't have any particular stake here.

If exactly what you say hasn't been known to happen quite a few times in UO's history, this thread would not even be here.

I remember when GM's would place castles for friends, then the friends would sell them for rl cash. That and other horror stories are also part of UO history.

 

[Lord Kynd]

Then why are you still here and not playing WoW full time since you have a sub to it?

If the game sucks so bad then leave.


Please.

:loser:

amen

 

[Limlight]

This is even more ridiculous and it points to guilt.

For someone to hold a rares auction and then end it abruptly with the prices being far below their actual value makes me think he is worried that something could happen to the items.

I am sorry, but this does nothing but point to guilt.

 

[Halister Marner]

This is even more ridiculous and it points to guilt.

For someone to hold a rares auction and then end it abruptly with the prices being far below their actual value makes me think he is worried that something could happen to the items.

I am sorry, but this does nothing but point to guilt.

The rares auction was a prank.

The towers, I can't say, I assumed Xanthar transfered them to JC, but I'm confused as to what happened now as well.

The rares auction was definitely a joke though as EA still has the items in their possession.

Just thought I'd dispel that part of it at least.

 

[Limlight]

So...

2 IDOC towers go into Links hands...

Someone calls him on it...and he makes a "fake" auction...

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight....

This reminds me of that time I was "just cleaning" the top of the cookie jar....I wasnt reaching for cookies...I swear.

 

[Halister Marner]

So...

2 IDOC towers go into Links hands...

Someone calls him on it...and he makes a "fake" auction...

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight....

This reminds me of that time I was "just cleaning" the top of the cookie jar....I wasnt reaching for cookies...I swear.

*sighs*

The items weren't in the towers, they were taken by a dev team member. Xanthar's collection has not been in those towers for years.

Xanthar's friend Vasmatrix was charged with selling the items, and unfortunately he trusted them to a certain broker who was previously banned for duping, and was still carrying on illegal activities. The broker was banned, and the keep (not towers, it was a keep near the Trinsic swamps) was taken by EA, and the items in that keep (the wintermoor collection) were put into storage.

Any items in Xanthar's towers were not the Wintermoor collection.

The rares auction JC made is an exact copy of the post that was made in the Stratics rares forum by the broker originally selling them, including the screenshot and spelling errors, and was easily shown to be a joke for those in the know.

Had the rares been for sale, you would have seen me tearing up a storm unprecedented in Stratics history, as many can attest that I am a rabid protector of Atlantic's history.

 

[Restroom Cowboy]

If you read through the original thread http://vboards.stratics.com/showthread.php?t=95370 it's just strange how, at one point, we're told that there's "nothing" to worry about, as he was simply given "empty" towers, yet later in the thread he goes on to admit they are littered with rares... I just don't get it.

The more I think about it, though, I'm the fool -- I've done free advertising work for this guys "private rares sale."

I'm the fool, here. But at least we all got to go along for the ride. Some clarification would still be nice, however.

I'm sure people are laughing all the way to the bank on this one. And I'd venture a guess that the billions in gold the sales will generate will be sold for RL $$.

Dont get it? What I dont get is how one minute you are accussing him of doing something then the next you are stating you have done *advertising* for the same individual on the same matter. Gee, doesnt take a rocket scientist to find something wrong with your statement.

What I DO get is that you have an obvious personal issue with JC just as Lou did, as you have both been removed from the UO Atlantic boards for posting content against the TOS...much akin to your posting here.

 

[Restroom Cowboy]

This is even more ridiculous and it points to guilt.

For someone to hold a rares auction and then end it abruptly with the prices being far below their actual value makes me think he is worried that something could happen to the items.

I am sorry, but this does nothing but point to guilt.

You ought to be ashamed. You know as well as the rest here that JC hasnt done anything wrong, but you are trying your hardest to make it look that way. Time and time again you were explained the situation, yet you come here and act like you dont have a clue. Beyond a personal vendetta, what reasons can you give us for not knowing what you know?

This is in not meant as a personal attack, but I will be damned if I am going to just sit back and listen to you slander a decent person.

 

[Limlight]

*sighs*

The items weren't in the towers, they were taken by a dev team member. Xanthar's collection has not been in those towers for years.

Xanthar's friend Vasmatrix was charged with selling the items, and unfortunately he trusted them to a certain broker who was previously banned for duping, and was still carrying on illegal activities. The broker was banned, and the keep (not towers, it was a keep near the Trinsic swamps) was taken by EA, and the items in that keep (the wintermoor collection) were put into storage.

Any items in Xanthar's towers were not the Wintermoor collection.

The rares auction JC made is an exact copy of the post that was made in the Stratics rares forum by the broker originally selling them, including the screenshot and spelling errors, and was easily shown to be a joke for those in the know.

Had the rares been for sale, you would have seen me tearing up a storm unprecedented in Stratics history, as many can attest that I am a rabid protector of Atlantic's history.

Hmm, I will admit I have 0 knowledge of the original auction...tell me something...how many around now days would?

Either way, the fake auction was in poor taste with the recent accusations...

and you still havent explained why the Tree Ornament Jewelry has been moved and why the Magical Doors were as well...

Those items are movable...so obviously...you are in-correct that it is all unmovable.

Lastly, am I supposed to just take you and Link's word that those 12+chests of 70+ items were full of crap...junk...utterly useless items...?????

 

[Restroom Cowboy]

Hmm, I will admit I have 0 knowledge of the original auction...tell me something...how many around now days would?

Either way, the fake auction was in poor taste with the recent accusations...

and you still havent explained why the Tree Ornament Jewelry has been moved and why the Magical Doors were as well...

Those items are movable...so obviously...you are in-correct that it is all unmovable.

Lastly, am I supposed to just take you and Link's word that those 12+chests of 70+ items were full of crap...junk...utterly useless items...?????

So its guilty until proven innocent? GTFO of here with that crap. If you dont like the answer you were already given thats a pill you have to deal with trying to swallow...not JC. Slander is not a good aternative for truth.

 

[Limlight]

You ought to be ashamed. You know as well as the rest here that JC hasnt done anything wrong, but you are trying your hardest to make it look that way. Time and time again you were explained the situation, yet you come here and act like you dont have a clue. Beyond a personal vendetta, what reasons can you give us for not knowing what you know?

This is in not meant as a personal attack, but I will be damned if I am going to just sit back and listen to you slander a decent person.

What in the blazes are you talking about?

Vendetta? What vendetta do I have against Link?

I used to love Link...but this whole situation raised my eyebrows...

Are you not listening?

I was at the IDOCs when they magically changed hands...

I have been in the towers when owned by Eager Meager..and items have been moved...

Lastly, I dont have a freaking clue...thats why I asked questions.
You sir, are completely clueless.

Go to the HOT boards...I posted a question to Link when this happened.
I didnt start attacking him until his response was:

"EA gave me the towers to preserve history...it doesnt matter they were empty anyways"

Then when I pointed out they were indeed NOT empty...he started backpedaling.

You can choose to not sit there and let me attack Link...but I ask you a question...what would I be doing if I didnt ask these questions that arose when I saw something fishy going on?

You can keep calling it a Vendetta or something stupid...but I have never been in HOT...never applied...never even saw Link in fel until a few months ago...so this Vendetta reason is garbage.

Bottom line is...I was at some IDOCS...they changed hands in an odd way.

I asked Link a simple question...
He lied...
I called him on his lie..

Then its been nothing but "jokes" from him.

Yeah, you sit there and defend your "honest" friend.

 

[the 4th man]

That would make you a minority in the player base and if you chose UO over WoW then you need to learn how to make better choices. One game has players and the other does not. One game has function systems and tech support and the other does not. One game reminds me of playing consoles in 1992 and the other does not. So, I guess if you really dig history then this game would be for you. If you dig relics then this game would definately be for you. But, you don't have to see long gone exploited items in game for that sense of history just log into the legacy client and you see all the history you want with its pretty 1992 graphics.

The even funnier thing about this post is that WoW is actually based on old school Warcraft lore and that lore actually existed before UO even did. Warcraft lore started in around 1995 (or whenever WCII was released) and that lore is still referenced to a HUGE extent in WoW today. However, they have actual lore to build on those that follow it know what the lore means for the game. They don't need proof of long ago exploits as a substitution for history.[/QUOTE/
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, Ultimas history goes back to 85 if not earlier.....As for minority status, you can't seriously make absurd statements without proof as to who plays what, per UO players.

Sure, you can ASSUME, by the handful that post here....in my opinion, WoW is for kids, tried it, waste of time.

later