Change Monster Curse Back Devs!!!!

[Still Frame]

"Melee chars" have to stfu the curse affects everyone the same, everyones resists gets lowered and get hit for the same ammounts. "archers and mages have ranged" please read the other posts here alot of these monsters teleport! If anything mages are at the most disadvantage because either they're always getting fizzled and cant heal by them or they built an lrc suit which either lacks them in lmc, mr, dci or resists.

Heres something for you. You CHOOSE to play a melee warrior if you dont like how things are going for it heres the beauty of uo you can CHANGE. Right now my GL red archer is become a red scribe mage and OMG!!! hes even going from elf to human.

You cant cry about templates in a thing like pvm, theres no such thing as "cheap" against monsters. They dont cry gank or hax or lag. They simply die and respawn to get killed again by whatever character your on. If warriors arent what they used to be, you cant hit for your 200 whatever anymore on any monster please try changing templates and see how much harder it is without enemy of one and actually takes some skill. If you cant tell im talking about a mage!

 

[Connor_Graham]

"Melee chars" have to stfu the curse affects everyone the same"

Except that only melee characters have to stand toe to toe to kill anything.

You do realize that what you've just suggested is for everyone to put their warriors away again and not play them, but instead play mages?

Yep, back to mages online I see.

Thanks for lending more weight to my point that they nerfed warriors yet again.

"If anything mages are at the most disadvantage because either they're always getting fizzled"

Not when Magery only takes 3 skills, leaving the other 4 able to have things like taming or bard skills. Warriors need all of their skill points to be warriors, unless they want to leave a big gap somewhere and add maybe one other skill like SW.

"You cant cry about templates in a thing like pvm, theres no such thing as "cheap" against monsters."

Oh, so balance only belongs to PvP huh? =/


"theres no such thing as "cheap" against monsters. They dont cry gank or hax or lag."

According to this train of thought, you shouldn't be arguing against changing curse back then. Glad to see you agree with the PvM'rs. Good for you for being man enough to realize your mistake and turn your thinking around.....

 

[Still Frame]

"theres no such thing as "cheap" against monsters. They dont cry gank or hax or lag."

According to this train of thought, you shouldn't be arguing against changing curse back then. Glad to see you agree with the PvM'rs. Good for you for being man enough to realize your mistake and turn your thinking around.....

Umm how the hell does that even make any sense? You trammys dont deserve special treatment just because you cant step up. UO is a game meant for SKILL not enemy of one double click and then loot. You guys get honor, slayers, and enemy of one that all do something what more can you complain about? Pvm is easy enough but because they finally did something that made it a tiny bit harder you need to go and cry? YOU SHOULD NEVER BE ABLE TO SOLO PEERLESS! warriors got nerfed? is that why there the only template that can solo peerless? If you dont agree with that go look on youtube theres 1 bush necro dexer who has solod all of them.

I have never heard a tamer or as mage talk about being able to solo one!

""You cant cry about templates in a thing like pvm, theres no such thing as "cheap" against monsters."

Oh, so balance only belongs to PvP huh? =/"

Again that makes no sense at all.

Your right about 1 thing, i do believe this game should be only mages. I hate going to doom and seeing 20+ archers shooting a dark father doing their 150-200 dmg a shot while even with 120 eval gm scribe and a slayer i cant keep up on damage. i can do over 300 with a flame strike but in the time it takes me to cast it they get atleast 2 shots off then i have to wait a second to cast again because of the reflect dmg from the DF while a warrior template does nothing but put on a bandaid. I actually get fizzled unless im running protection but then guess what, my casting still sucks and i lose a ton of phsy which makes me a 1-2 hit to high end monsters huh?

Wheres your so called "balance" on warriors vs mages in pvm?

Mages need 3 skills my ass!

Mage eval med resist wep skill, if you dont run resist your an idiot! pots and trap boxes are for newbs and pots run out, i dont like having a 2 minute strangle and mind rot on me or never resisting a poison and either spam chugging or spam casting cure (which with mind rot i'll run out of mana fast)

No wep skill means monsters will hit you everytime and you have to keep on the run to even get a spell off which means if its a group of people fighting a monster less looting rights. Theres a reason tamers are so good in pvm, they SUCK to work up and if theyre wearing a luck suit it can be pretty hard to get good resists.

This thread has nothing to do with curse being unfair to warriors, its you crying for the sake of crying. You dont like whats happening in the game? Alot of people don't either get over it or follow everyone elses trent and go Pvm on WoW where i've heard no complaints about the bosses.


Pvm warriors cant complain especially because i've seen alot of tamer archers! you can play the same damn template they do and mix it with a wep skill and tactics please dont cry anymore and just adapt.

 

[Connor_Graham]

"is that why there the only template that can solo peerless...I have never heard a tamer or as mage talk about being able to solo one!"

Guess you don't know that tamers are now soloing even peerless that the warriors can't. Several of the people that I hunt with can now solo almost all of the Peerless with Greater Dragons.

"Your right about 1 thing, i do believe this game should be only mages."

That's obvious. Your bias against any other template being successful is plain to see.


"I hate going to doom and seeing 20+ archers shooting a dark father doing their 150-200 dmg a shot while even with 120 eval gm scribe and a slayer i cant keep up on damage."

Necro/Spellweaver/Mages do more damage than any archer can.


"Mages need 3 skills my ass! Mage eval med resist wep skill"

-0 Skill Mage weapon takes care of the wep, not that you need one in PvM. Mage, Eval, Med are the only 3 skills to be a mage, then you can add SW/Necro, Or Taming/Vet/Lore, or you can add Music/Peace/Provo. Puhlease.....


"Mage eval med resist wep skill, if you dont run resist your an idiot! pots and trap boxes are for newbs and pots run out, i dont like having a 2 minute strangle and mind rot on me or never resisting a poison and either spam chugging or spam casting cure (which with mind rot i'll run out of mana fast)"

Sounds to me like you need some PvM practice. You sure do seem to have a lot of problems where someone who PvM's regularly doesn't.


"This thread has nothing to do with curse being unfair to warriors'

It has everything to do with it. You just want UO to be mages online, as you've already admitted to, and don't care that an entire class got beat over the head with the nerf bat once again.

"Pvm warriors cant complain especially because i've seen alot of tamer archers!"

Melee warriors sure as hell can.

Also, by that train of thought, Mages can't complain about anything because they can be tamers and bards as I've already said.

 

[Connor_Graham]

Bottom line for this whole thing is that monsters can deal more damage faster to a player than another player can, so shouldn't be using the same mechanics when it comes to curse, since it increases that amount of damage, and is, as I've said, instant death in many cases.

 

[Coppelia]

"Then explain to me why, from 4-5 screens away, through buildings, I'm still being hit with Flamestrike? LoS does not work in PvM. If the monster loses LoS, then the spell should fail. It doesn't.
Because the flame strike was cast while you were within 10 tiles. 4-5 screens away is a riddiculous exaggeration unless your speedhacking out the wazoo. LoS being lost in no aspect of the game makes the spell fail so theres no reason for it to with PvM. It works in a very simple way if your within 10 tiles when the monster casts (which you can't see so have no way of knowing - except exploision which makes them step/turn/tab or however you like to think of it) then the spell will go off even if you move out of range or round a corner. If what you were saying was true then something flagging on you from the other side of a wall would be able to cast on you and (aside from certain walls in hythloth etc & auras/aoe) doesn't happen. Go in to the time rift and find a wisp trapped in a building and see if it can strangle/pain spike/flame strike you through a wall.

First of all, mobs can target you without checking line of sight. But if you aren't in the line of sight, you can hide safely.
Secondly, mobs have to be in the casting range and have a line of sight to cast spells. BUT... They don't cast like players at all. In fact there's a buffer of one spell on your head, meaning that mobs can cast one spell on you (it triggers immediately) and put one in the buffer. Then you can run away, recall away, teleport, go out the dungeon, w/e... if there's a second spell in the buffer it will strike you.
This is not new, I already posted about it being stupid long time ago. It's been tested, not my imagination. So yes you can break the line of sight all you want, if the mob has cast a additional spell, it will trigger. It's particularily shocking when you have run several screens away and are redlined and a flamestrike comes from nowhere. And of course if the second spell is Explosion, you can go even further before getting hit. It's funny also when you run away from range, you start casting Greater Heal and a Poison spell hits you just as you start casting.


Clearly, mobs don't cast spells as players do, they're "cheating".

 

[Lord GOD(GOD)]

"Except that only melee characters have to stand toe to toe to kill anything."
No they don't, they can joust. Plus they can leech life/mana/stam.

"Not when Magery only takes 3 skills, leaving the other 4 able to have things like taming or bard skills. Warriors need all of their skill points to be warriors, unless they want to leave a big gap somewhere and add maybe one other skill like SW."

Mage = Mage & Eval
Dexxer = Wep & Tactics
It is easy to build hybrid dexxers in all classes just the same as mages can.

"This thread has nothing to do with curse being unfair to warriors"
It affects all.

 

[o2bavr6]

Conner,

With that logic I could say that Melee templates deal more damage than mage templates, yet we still have to deal with it.

And Conner I know where you are coming from, but I think that you should play a mage for a bit to actually see the disadvantage they are at.

A Tram Mage may only have the 3 skills required, but a Fel mage will have Magic Resist and either Wrestling or Inscribe.

So again following your logic I can say "Tram rule set is unfair because mages there only need the 3 skills where in Fel to compete I have to have at least 5 to compete".

You also say that we should change our mage templates to add necro to deal more damage, yet you don’t want to change your template or armor to help get around curse.

Lastly a mage will eventually run out of mana, meaning they can not continue at the same pace of damage a dexer can do. You see even if the dexer runs out of mana, he can still hit for some damage. A mage can not do this.

So if you have the time or the care play a mage template exclusively for about a month and then come back and tell me about curse being imbalanced.

 

[Lord GOD(GOD)]

This is not new/It's particularily shocking

As it isn't new, I don't find it shocking. The most I ever get hit by one monster when out of range/sight is 2 spells. Conner exaggerated his point to absurdity.

 

[Connor_Graham]

"No they don't, they can joust."

Which means nothing. They still have to be toe to toe to deal the damage which means they're also in range for the physical attack from the creature as well every single time they want to deal damage themselves.


"Dexxer = Wep & Tactics"

Wep
Tactics
Parry
Chiv (if they want to do any real damage)
Bushido (if they want to be able to handle the high end)

Try taking on Abscess or Rend without all of those. See how long you last.

Now....back to ignore you go. I'm not going to waste my time on someone that tries to use jousting as an argument. Because once again:


Bottom line for this whole thing is that monsters can deal more damage faster to a player than another player can, so shouldn't be using the same mechanics when it comes to curse, since it increases that amount of damage, and is, as I've said, instant death in many cases.

Q.E.D.

 

[Lord GOD(GOD)]

"Parry
Chiv (if they want to do any real damage)
Bushido (if they want to be able to handle the high end)"
All completely optional. You don't need all that parry or dodge if your building a discord dexxer, prov dexxer, tamer dexxer, or a necro dexxer.

"Try taking on Abscess or Rend without all of those. See how long you last."
Why would anyone fight those? Does Rend even cast curse? lol. 110 Ninjitsu>Rend.

"Now....back to ignore you go"
Except you clearly didn't put me on ignore or you wouldn't still be replying to me. Ignore the stem of ignorance so fitting for you.

 

[Connor_Graham]

"A Tram Mage may only have the 3 skills required, but a Fel mage will have Magic Resist and either Wrestling or Inscribe."

We're talking strictly about how Curse now works in Tram, so the Tram Mage skillset is applicable while the Fel one isn't.


"You also say that we should change our mage templates to add necro to deal more damage, yet you don’t want to change your template or armor to help get around curse."

There is NO WAY to avoid the hit to resists with any skill whatsoever. If you get Cursed, your resists drop, period, end of story. The MOST you can do is reduce the amount of time you're cursed, but 9 times out of 10, you're just going to get re-Cursed as soon as it wears off or you use a spell or apple to remove it yourself.


"So if you have the time or the care play a mage template exclusively"

I have several mages with different builds, and as I said, since we're talking about the Tram rulseset and how Curse works in Tram, the skillset for Mages that I described is applicable, especially since we have soulstones. Prior to soulstones that argument might have held water, but it doesn't work now when multiple skills can be swapped over.

 

[Lord GOD(GOD)]

"There is NO WAY to avoid the hit to resists with any skill whatsoever."
Targeted peace & killing it before it casts anything works well. So does using a pet. So does Ninjitsu.

Another epic failure on your part Conner.

 

[o2bavr6]

Conner how about the remove curse spell? Just cast that and your problems are over.

Then you say "but the monsters spam curse" and I say to that "get a better suit of armor and items"

Even though the resists don't techically go over 70, my Mage suit is 3/6, 100+ LRC, 88Phys, 86 Fire, 60 Cold, 78 Poison, 75 Energy, with 9 Mana Regen, 41 Lower Mana Cost, 35 Defence Chance Inc, so when i get cursed my resists are all at 60.

There is also one important thing that you are leaving out of your posts. THis is special moves; mages dont have special moves unless you have wrestling. This also puts melee temps at a huge advantage over mage temeplates, but you dont hear us crying about how our spellbooks should have certain special tied to them, different spellbooks with different specials.

And am I mistaken but I thought I read in one of your posts that it shold be the same for Fel and Tram.

 

[Connor_Graham]

Conner how about the remove curse spell? Just cast that and your problems are over.

Then you say "but the monsters spam curse" and I say to that "get a better suit of armor and items".......when i get cursed my resists are all at 60."

Exactly the point. You can remove the curse, but will then just be cursed again, and no matter how high the resists are on the armor you have, you'll be cursed to all 60's except for physical and energy if you happen to be an elf.

"There is also one important thing that you are leaving out of your posts. THis is special moves"

I didn't include it because it has nothing to do with how much damage monsters deal to players. We're not talking about what players can do to monsters, but how having lower resists increases an already large amount of damage that is dealt using mechanics that players don't have.

 

[o2bavr6]

I didn't include it because it has nothing to do with how much damage monsters deal to players. We're not talking about what players can do to monsters, but how having lower resists increases an already large amount of damage that is dealt using mechanics that players don't have.

Yes but it seems to me that you want a change to the game that only directly effects your type of template. After all mages archers and even tamers are ranged fighters.

So let me get this straight:
You want your template to deal the most damge, which it probably does as far as tempaltes go.
You want your template to deal the fastest damage, which it probably does as far as tempaltes go.
You want to be able to chug pots and eat petals and any other buff item on your template.
You probably even poison you weapon.
You can heal on the run, cure on the run and hit on the run.
You can do double the damage to a monster than a mage can for a longer period of time.
You want to be able to solo monsters that no mage can solo. You talk about soloing some high end monsters, but mages cant do that, by the time they get more mana to attack again, the monster is at full health again.

There are certain monsters that a mage can not solo but dexers can.. is that fair? Also don't forget how many times they have one of the events and it's in a location that a mage can't summon, yet tamers are welcome and everyone else gets to use their full arsenal.

Imagine if you were trying to do the new event and they said to you,,, 'Oh ya, you cant use specials at this event". You wouldn't be too happy would you? again you don't hear us mages pancakes about it.

 

[Kith Kanan]

" Your right about 1 thing, i do believe this game should be only mages "

That quote makes everything ell's you post void , and it makes you look silly.....

 

[Diggity]

I'll repeat. I am solely a PVM. Bush/Paly/Parry. I like the change. It brings more challenge. It also looks like it separates the real PVM warriors from the cookie cutter warriors who only know one way of fighting.

So Connor and others who don't like the change got knocked down a peg. So what? If you are fighting for the challenge, new opportunites have opened up for you. If you are a cookie cutter farmer type, bleh.

 

[Connor_Graham]

"Yes but it seems to me that you want a change to the game that only directly effects your type of template."

What I said was warrior templates got nerfed the hardest. The change affected every PvM template.


"So let me get this straight:"

You weren't straight on any of that. Crooked as a 3 dollar bill....


"There are certain monsters that a mage can not solo but dexers can"

Mage/Tamers are soloing things now that even warriors can't.

 

[o2bavr6]

What I said was warrior templates got nerfed the hardest. The change affected every PvM template.

Mages, Tamers and Archers are not as affected by it as someone who has to stand next to the monster is.

Mage/Tamers are soloing things now that even warriors can't.

WOW!! I don't want to flame you here so let me take a breath first....
First of all a Mage/Tamer is not a mage, hes a TAMER!!

Secondly I said in my posts we are talking pure mage templates just like your talking the pure melee temp.

So I say to you again, a template with Magery, Eval, Med, Resist, Inscribe, Wrestling can not do the same damage as a pure Melee template.

So how is that fair?

 

[ColterDC]

I have several mages with different builds

Haha... That makes me laugh. Connor playing a mage......LOL


Cast EV, invis, wait for monster to die, collect gold, recall to bank


You got some mad skillz.

 

[Connor_Graham]

"Mages, Tamers and Archers are not as affected by it as someone who has to stand next to the monster is."

I do believe that's exactly what I said.

"First of all a Mage/Tamer is not a mage, hes a TAMER!!"

He's a Mage/Tamer, with all the benefits of both skills.

"Secondly I said in my posts we are talking pure mage templates"

Pure mage templates are a nerf unto themselves, no different than a pure warrior is in today's UO. Put that way, a pure mage would outlive a pure warrior, be more versatile, and do more damage.

Which is still getting away from the point, which once again is:

Bottom line for this whole thing is that monsters can deal more damage faster to a player than another player can, so shouldn't be using the same mechanics when it comes to curse, since it increases that amount of damage, and is, as I've said, instant death in many cases.


This isn't a mage vs warrior discussion. It's a curse needs to be reverted one.

 

[Sam the Scribe]

...One thing I noticed when i was killing regular balrons and waiting for the paragons to spawn was that a balron had significantly worse loot than a Dark Wisp at Moonglow... doesn't seem right, eh?

I'm gonna jump in on this one. Not quite the topic but I agree. Though it is nice to have the occasional creature with "bonus" gold that makes it profitible for my mid-level fighters. I am dissapointed when I spend a great deal of time fighting and dying and get loot that makes hunting Ettin look profitable. I am not a gold farmer but I do need to factor insurance vs. profitability when I sent lower/mid level fighters up against paragons and some of the tougher critters.

Sure they are more fun...

Safe Travels, Sam

 

[ColterDC]

Bottom line for this whole thing is that monsters can deal more damage faster to a player than another player can

How would you know? You openly admit that you do not PvP and that you only "tried" it once about 2 years ago. So how the hell would you know what goes on in PvP????

I've seen several times someone go from full health to dead in 2 seconds fighting another player.

You continue to talk about aspects of the game that you SELF ADMITTED have no freaking idea about. Don't you realize how narrow minded and uninformed this makes you look?

 

[o2bavr6]

He's a Mage/Tamer, with all the benefits of both skills.

Now your just insulting Mages.

Pure mage templates are a nerf unto themselves, no different than a pure warrior is in today's UO.

I guess you haven't been to Fel in a long while because most mage templates there are pure mage with wrestle and inscribe, although some have necro instead.

Bottom line for this whole thing is that monsters can deal more damage faster to a player than another player can, so shouldn't be using the same mechanics when it comes to curse, since it increases that amount of damage, and is, as I've said, instant death in many cases.

Monsters have always been able to do more damage to players than players can do to each other since day one.

Explain to me why curse from a monster should be different than curse from a player.

Do you then feel that monsters should also be limited to 2/6 casting?

This isn't a mage vs warrior discussion. It's a curse needs to be reverted one.

Let me ask you this: Why is it that no mages or archers are complaining about this to the level you are?

Also, I've been playing this game significantly longer than you have, and I have had to adapt to game changes much more than you have, so in all fairness, it's your turn to adapt.

 

[Lord GOD(GOD)]

This isn't a mage vs warrior discussion. It's a curse needs to be reverted one.

Yet it is you has filled it with comments about how it 'mainly affects dexxers'. Now that you've been shown to be wrong with all of your side tracking rubbish you now say it's not about that.

 

[Wolfthistle]

So I say to you again, a template with Magery, Eval, Med, Resist, Inscribe, Wrestling can not do the same damage as a pure Melee template.

So how is that fair?

*smiles*
I think I have to agree with you on this point. I also run a 6x legendary mage:

magery/med/focus/eval int/resist/wrestle

And I can't even come close to the type of damage that my melee dexxer does. Not to say that she's not useful, but on this point you are very correct. Maybe this change does add some balance, especially when you look at it from that point of view.

Regardless, either you roll with the punches and adapt, or you don't. My dexxer has already made his changes - and he rather likes them.

I wish you all good luck as you learn to adapt to this change.

Sincerely,

Wolfthistle.

 

[Connor_Graham]

"I guess you haven't been to Fel in a long while because most mage templates there are pure mage with wrestle and inscribe, although some have necro instead. "

This has not one single thing to do with Fel and the templates used there. Not one.


"Monsters have always been able to do more damage to players than players can do to each other since day one."

Yep. Which is why the mechanics for combat need to be different.


"Explain to me why curse from a monster should be different than curse from a player."

Because monsters can cause more damage at a faster rate and at higher amounts than a player can.


"Do you then feel that monsters should also be limited to 2/6 casting?"

Casting speed is only a part of the whole.


"Let me ask you this: Why is it that no mages or archers are complaining about this to the level you are?"

Probably because the nerf hit warriors harder than anyone else. In order to deal damage, warriors have to deal with both physical and magical attacks while the ranged attackers primarily only deal with the magical.


"Also, I've been playing this game significantly longer than you have, and I have had to adapt to game changes much more than you have, so in all fairness, it's your turn to adapt."

How long you've been playing has nothing to do with anything. We're talking about the current nerf, not something that happend years ago.

 

[Lord GOD(GOD)]

"This isn't a mage vs warrior discussion.
"Probably because the nerf hit warriors harder than anyone else."

 

[o2bavr6]

This has not one single thing to do with Fel and the templates used there. Not one.

The fact is you want them to make a change becuse it affects your template directly more than anyone elses. This does affect people in Fel when they are doing champ spawns yet we deal with it. Also some spawns teleport mages and archers next to the Monster so we take phys damage too.

Yep. Which is why the mechanics for combat need to be different.

This is why most dungeons are empty. They are too easy and give you no reason to go there. Yet you want to be able to solo ceratin monsters that most other templates cant, and then when they change curse you get mad.

Because monsters can cause more damage at a faster rate and at higher amounts than a player can.

This is a complaint not an explanation as to why curse from a monster should be different than curse from a player.

Archers can two hit kill some people and we don't like it but we had to adapt, yet there is no way a mage can two hit kill anyone unless they are naked.

Probably because the nerf hit warriors harder than anyone else. In order to deal damage, warriors have to deal with both physical and magical attacks while the ranged attackers primarily only deal with the magical.

So as I said before you want to not only be able to kill them faster than anyone else but you also want to take the least damage as well. Have you considered playing Quake and then typing in the God Mode commands instead. This way you can be invinsible and kill everything really fast too.

How long you've been playing has nothing to do with anything. We're talking about the current nerf, not something that happend years ago.

I have to disagree.. In the past we have had many, many, many, many nerfs to templates, but none as bad as the mage template that got nerfed and continualy gets nerfed to this day, yet we have to deal with it. Now it's your turn to deal with it

 

[Wolfthistle]

All we asked for was an icon in the debuff bar for a monster's Curse.

What do we get?


A Curse similar to the PvP curse which drops resists by 10 from the max resist. So are we expected now to create all 80's suits in order to counter this?

Why, yet again, have you nerfed the warrior class when it had finally gotten to the point where it could compete on an even playing field?

From the patch notes it really wasn't clear that this was how it would be at all, I was under the impression that what needed to be fixed was curse being stuck on the bar (not that I use the bar). I only found out while taming a greater dragon and wondered why he was suddenly doing 80 damage breath. So I agree it should be changed back.

*looks around nervously*
*adjusts flameproof suit*

So, I've got you both quoted as saying that the change needs to be reverted. Yet you, Lord GOD, argue with Connor as bitterly as if you were on completely opposite sides.

Do you have ANY idea how FOOLISH that makes you look?

So you don't agree with his reasons for the change. Nobody asked you to. You've stated that you and he are on the same side of the issue. So what's up? Do you want the change reverted or not?

I mean, this is what they mean when they use the term "divide and conquer". How on earth do either of you ever expect anyone to take you seriously when you can't even come together on an issue - despite you're opinions and reasons on why it needs to happen?

So you don't like each other. So what? I don't know if you've noticed, but nobody particularly likes me - doesn't stop me from standing up for issues I believe in, even if its with people I don't like (NO, this is not a reference to you Connor, I rather enjoy your posts).

Both of you need to stop acting like children and either agree on the issue and fight for it, or change your stance.

Anyway, I had to say my piece. Now it's said and you can both flame me as much as you want. Please forgive me if I don't reply - I'm getting ready for a work related absence from UO right now - packing, doing laundry, etc. But I'll try to get on to respond before I leave tomorrow, if I can.

Sincerely,

Wolfthistle.

 

[o2bavr6]

Consider a Liche Lord against a pure mage template with an undead slayer spellbook.
If the mage gets to precast he will mst likely win. but if the Liche Lord gets to start dumping first, look out.

They cast so fast and so often that sometimes mages can barely keep up with cures and heals and dispels for the revenants. Let alone the fact that the AI on spellcasters is almost better than most wanna be Tram mage Pkers. They interupt your spells better than a player can. And we haven't even talked about the mages offensive spells toward the Liche Lord yet, because he is still running to get cured and healed up.

Yet this same scenario with a melee template and the Liche Lord dies in 2 seconds.

 

[Still Frame]

" Your right about 1 thing, i do believe this game should be only mages "

That quote makes everything ell's you post void , and it makes you look silly.....

How exactly does it do that? Everyone is affected by curse the same way, EVEN PVM IN FEL, such as spawns. Stop crying, get over it it's not as crippling as you say!

 

[NBG]

To be honest, the change was unexpected so it is understandable that it would be a tough pill to take for anyone.

All I see so far is pretty much a back and forth banter about "haha you got the stick deal with it" or "you don't know how to play except push 1 button", ect .. ect..

Should this change be reverted? lets consider some of possible outcomes please do not quote me for blah blah blah because all I am doing is stating what would happen.

Melee char: Runs up to hit a spellcasting monster gets cursed runs away remove curse
runs back in jousting as you call it, remove curse does cost abit of mana.
Runs out of mana since jousting doesn't really doesn't count as a steady
source of leech that everyone raves about. Sure it will work, takes longer
to kill stuff.

Ranged char: Have to keep distance with mage having to deal with interrupts and archer
archer having to deal with movment timing. Not as bad when cursed but,
burst damage increases resulting in mage having to heal more and archer
would need a way to get stam back faster. Overall killing stuff takes
longer than usual.

Pet/summon char: Nothing changes go about your business you still can just spam 1-2
1-2 buttons.

Over all it makes things tougher for most of the template and sure its more of a pain for melee char but to be honest if I remembered it right they changed the way curse worked in the beginning as a PvP implementation because from the start people already saw the problem that it might have in PvM. Lets not get into the PvP vs. PvM argument please. Everyone have their playing styles and such and hey anyoe can always take one for the good of overall change that could benefit the game. I don't see this change would be of any benefit at all though, answer this question for me without getting into which side, whose tamplate and all that bs. Are there any balance at all with the sudden change?

Revert or not I don't really care, but a PvP "feature" just simple jump over to PvM without any testing or thought is reckless.

I guess on the bright side, Hey now it is easier to make suits since all you need is to hit 70/60/60/60/60-65..... eh and think about this... curse and corpse skin stacks.. PvM against a monster that is FS happy? hmmm lots of run collecting robes. Who here hasn't gotten blasted with exp fs fs combo from a spellcasting monster within about 2 seconds please raise your so I can call you a liar. >.O

 

[Fayled Dhreams]

NBG Should this change be reverted?

*shrugs*
the only change I've noticed ... is that the curse icon appears when cursed by a monster ...
which was a requested item ...

>I< have not been dieing any more ... or less ... using a little bit more mana than before ...
Removing the curse ... now that I know (by icon presence) that "its on me".

so

hard to say, from my experience, that there has been any "change" more than as advertised ...
ie. just the icon ...
gonna take a Dev confirmation .... that anything MORE than the icon .... went in (as regards "whuat happened")

Until then ... just sounds like a case of unfounded "panic" ...

From My perspective ... keep the icon

 

[Diggity]

NBG Should this change be reverted?

*shrugs*
the only change I've noticed ... is that the curse icon appears when cursed by a monster ...
which was a requested item ...

>I< have not been dieing any more ... or less ... using a little bit more mana than before ...
Removing the curse ... now that I know (by icon presence) that "its on me".

so

hard to say, from my experience, that there has been any "change" more than as advertised ...
ie. just the icon ...
gonna take a Dev confirmation .... that anything MORE than the icon .... went in (as regards "whuat happened")

Until then ... just sounds like a case of unfounded "panic" ...

From My perspective ... keep the icon

there is definitely a change, but you need to have more than 60 elemental resists and you have to be attacked by something that does elemental damage to notice. In the worse case, if you had 70 resist, you now have 60 resist when cursed. So instead of 30% damage, you take 40% damage. This IS a big change in potential monster damage you now receive. Only some people are panicing about this, with some foundation for doing so. Others adapt.

It is interesting that you don't notice any damage increase, yet you do notice that you use a little more mana. As far as I know, curse always reduced your intelligence stat by a bit, thus possibly lowering your med rate. Maybe lower med rate leads to lower mana pool leads to perception that more mana is being used?!? Should we also be panicing over possible nerf to mana pool or regen as well?

 

[Diggity]

...
I guess on the bright side, Hey now it is easier to make suits since all you need is to hit 70/60/60/60/60-65..... eh and think about this... curse and corpse skin stacks.. PvM against a monster that is FS happy? hmmm lots of run collecting robes. Who here hasn't gotten blasted with exp fs fs combo from a spellcasting monster within about 2 seconds please raise your so I can call you a liar. >.O

I believe corpse skin and curse work differently. Curse reduces your cap while corpse skins drops fire and poison resist by 15. So if you plan on being corpse skinned, you don't really want to lower your fire/poison resists to 60. Else when you are corpse skinned, you will have only 45 resist.

 

[Fayled Dhreams]

It is interesting that you don't notice any damage increase, yet you do notice that you use a little more mana. As far as I know, curse always reduced your intelligence stat by a bit, thus possibly lowering your med rate. Maybe lower med rate leads to lower mana pool leads to perception that more mana is being used?!? Should we also be panicing over possible nerf to mana pool or regen as well?

... yet you do notice that you use a little more mana.

using a little bit more mana than before ...
{BECAUSE I am} Removing the curse ... now that I know (by icon presence) that "its on me".

before ...didn't use mana ... removing curse ... cause I didn't know it was "on me"
NOW
using a little bit more mana than before ...
{BECAUSE I am} Removing the curse ... now that I know (by icon presence) that "its on me".

ergo ...
NO (Should we also be panicing over possible nerf to mana pool or regen as well?)

Least wise I wont be calling and/or spreading panic

 

[Lord GOD(GOD)]

"So, I've got you both quoted as saying that the change needs to be reverted. Yet you, Lord GOD, argue with Connor as bitterly as if you were on completely opposite sides.

Do you have ANY idea how FOOLISH that makes you look?"
As foolish as someone who quotes the begining of an argument skips the middle and posts the conclusion?

If you had quoted one of my later posts you would have found that I bothered to ask someone who would actually know wether it is getting reverted or not, got a clear answer (which I a) can't go in to and b) conner dismissed because he thinks it's my opinion) and said I am no longer asking for it to be reverted. (as I know it isn't going to be and that it is now working how origionally intended)

"So you don't agree with his reasons for the change. Nobody asked you to. You've stated that you and he are on the same side of the issue. So what's up? Do you want the change reverted or not?"
If someone repeatedly claims things that are not true about the game then I feel that in the intrest of people who don't know either way I should correct what was said, with plausable and logical statements.
No one asked him for his opinions either he still posts them.
I did origionally want the change reverted, since then I found out the reality of why it happened and accepted it. Therefore no longer wanting it reverted.

"How on earth do either of you ever expect anyone to take you seriously when you can't even come together on an issue "
I'm not looking for approval of people I don't know. How I see it is he posts inaccurate information I correct it and he turns it in to a load of name calling because it's easier than saying that he exaggerated many things. Wether you see it the same is entirely up to you, make up your own mind, if you think I'm wrong with something I say then say so (I would) and I'll discuss it like I've discussed it here. These things only 'go on and on' when one person is being irrational.

"So you don't like each other. So what? "
I don't dislike him. I just don't agree with the things he has said.

"doesn't stop me from standing up for issues I believe in"
Thats what I am doing. He's exaggerated simple things, I've explained why (he even asked in his first reply), he's ignored it and gone off on one.

"Now it's said and you can both flame me as much as you want."
No reason to, you just asked some questions. I hope you find the answers illuminating.
--------
"Yet this same scenario with a melee template and the Liche Lord dies in 2 seconds."
Depends on the player and the suit.
--------
"I believe corpse skin and curse work differently. Curse reduces your cap while corpse skins drops fire and poison resist by 15. So if you plan on being corpse skinned, you don't really want to lower your fire/poison resists to 60. Else when you are corpse skinned, you will have only 45 resist."
Corpse skin also puts your physical and cold up by 10 so with the resists in the right places could improve or have no effect on your suit. The combination of corpse/curse do not stack.

 

[Wolfthistle]

If you had quoted one of my later posts you would have found that I bothered to ask someone who would actually know wether it is getting reverted or not, got a clear answer (which I a) can't go in to and b) conner dismissed because he thinks it's my opinion) and said I am no longer asking for it to be reverted. (as I know it isn't going to be and that it is now working how origionally intended)

No reason to, you just asked some questions. I hope you find the answers illuminating.

*smiles*
Actually, I did find the answers illuminating. I appreciate that you reply in a concise and rational manner.

What I found most illuminating is that some individual players can ask, and have questions answered "by someone who would actually know" while the rest of us are kept in the dark. If EA wants to release information to the player base it should be through official messages made by EA employees, not through individuals who doubtless know someone on the design team that used to (or currently) play(s) UO.

As for the rest, again, thanks again for a rational, concise answer. And, as for what you said about needing to make up my mind on the issue - I already did it as I posted above - My warrior made some changes that allowed him to add 120 resisting spells to his template. Although it doesn't help with the resist loss, it does help with the stat loss and the timers as well as the MULTIPLE paralyze's that he is regularly subjected to. There are some other changes he underwent in regards to gear and skills, but this is not the thread to get into that.

Again, Good Luck to everyone as they learn to adapt to this change.

Sincerely,

Wolfthistle.

 

[Lord GOD(GOD)]

Perhaps they will change or adjust it at some point if it causes too much wide spread hassle but who knows.

I found out getting hit for 80 firebreath from a greater dragon I was taming for someone. Normally when their doing 60ish I can heal through it ok, it only makes it a bit more challenging. Most things have work arounds anyway, if I'd known it would be breathing me for 80 I would have knocked it's hp down first.

 

[Basara]

The greater dragon is a good example, as I pointed out before. If the dragon pulls the curse, then breath/tele on you-melee/spell combo it so loves on you, it's insta-death for you - there's just no defense. You're busy trying to remove curse/eat apple, and before you can get it off, 3 damages go off at the reduced resist levels and you're toast. Even running doesn't help as it has a "long as you're on the same level" teleport range, if it starts the spell with you within a screen and a half.

Died 3 times to one that way tonight; same method every time, and I WAS jousting it. It would curse me as I ran in, start the breath up as I passed through, probably miss as I hit, then tele on me & hit me a second later with both melee and a spell, AS the breath resolved and hit.... 80s+60s+spell that I never get to see the damage for all at once (as the 140-150 from the first two did me in)...

 

[Lord GOD(GOD)]

What are your suits mods?
How are you healing?

 

[Basara]

Suit: medable 70/68/70/70/70; 10 HPR, 3 StR, 3 MR, 20% HCI; only 90 parry skill because of the stupid special move nerf forcing me to move 20 points from healing and parry to tactics to get to 90 real (was at 70 real, 101 total tactics before then). only about 10% DCI, currently, and no way to add more in unless I can come up with god's own leather sleeves to finish the suit after adding Fey Leggings.

Healing with Bandages, 100 dex, GM anatomy, 90 healing, plus supplementing with close wounds when the aids taking too long.

of course, healing doesn't help when you're not down any hp yet as it lands 150+ points in a half-second on a 110 HP character from its breath/melee/spell combo, after it curses you. Prior to the curse change, sometime's I'd get lucky and have single digits left for HP.

 

[Joyous2K]

I say cast remove curse and then keep whacking. Then cast remove curse and keep whacking. You know what they say if you run out of mana. Get smarter! Or better mr or focus or whatever. I loved remove curse when I played a warrior.

 

[NBG]

I say cast remove curse and then keep whacking. Then cast remove curse and keep whacking. You know what they say if you run out of mana. Get smarter! Or better mr or focus or whatever. I loved remove curse when I played a warrior.

To be honest with you even with good mr or leech if you keep removing curse, you are not hitting the monster and no damage is done. The only thing that I have noticed so far spell casting monsters can keep curse on pretty well. When you cast remove curse you won't swing and if you don't have fc 2 its a good while casting and a good chance to be interrupted. So you pretty much have to run and have the monster chain cast on ya then remove curse.

Overall mr and fc and fcr is pretty important now just for casting remove curse. Leech won't be as reliable if you plan on removing every remove curse just because you don't swing while casting.

I have mix feeling about the change but eh over all I just don't even bother removing curse anymore unless I get corpse skin as well. I do find that I die to the chain combo + melee hit alot more often now. To be honest some balance need to be found if this is to be a perma change.

What kind of change?.....
1 change the way monster chain spells/spell dump
2 add casting timer to monster casting?
3 lower the frequency for monster to cast fs back to back ( to be honest this is pretty much the worst thing )

I think they need to revamp how the monster ai work anyway for melee and spell casting monsters. Like more specialized attack instead of brainless spell dumping or high damage hits.

The overall damage output from players versus monster is high depending on slayer but if you look at the damage output from high end monsters it kind of balance it out.

 

[Still Frame]

They should change it so monsters maybe dont hit so hard ever physical hit but instead actually need to use their mana and their 80+ dmg hits are special moves that they sometimes use. With the player rules about casting spells and specials so they cant spam huge hits in spell combos

 

[MysticLlama]

Chivalry lets you remove curse IF you have mana to do so and IF you can do so uninterrupted and is no guarantee that you won't just get cursed with the next spell cast

I'm with Graham. I play my warrior at this event (i played a pure mage at the rift - and I've got a wide range of developed characters) but this is ridiculus. First of all, every mage type at the cove invasion can just cast invisibility while pets and warrors get flagged by the monsters.
When a lich, guardian, and or dark wisp all start dumping on a warrior, we're pretty much gone. Even one of those critters can instantly take away at least a third of 160 stamina, poison, strangle, damage you insanely, and now they curse our resists too.. c'mon.
Remove curse? That's one of the most mana-costly spells a warrior can cast.

Devs, you gotta look at how this affects different player classes. A warrior has no choice but to stand there and keep getting hit by everything, with the lowered resists, while trying to heal self with bandages, which is quite slow already because everything pain spikes and strangles and poisons. I've played my necromage on my 2ndary shard, cuz thats all I've got there, and I can even miniheal/cure through most of the monster ganks, and cast an invis if in real trouble.

 

[MysticLlama]

See now theres a good attitude, and i am very sorry for missing your post theres just too many to read all of them. I only looked for the ones with my quotes in them

And then you say:

"archers and mages have ranged" please read the other posts here alot of these monsters teleport!

 

[Lord GOD(GOD)]

Basara:

Bandages are without a doubt the slowest way to heal, you could drink a greater agility potion which would make them 1 second faster (or 2s if you can get to 140), but their still pretty much not good enough vs high end monsters. Your suits medable, do you have med on the template? If you dropped healing for med and can get 4/6 casting healing that breath will be much easier with chiv (I assume you have over 55) and allow you to move in for the hit quicker.

As you can see and hear when the dragon is going to do his breath attack, you need to stay back and heal it first then run in and take the melee hit. You could stagger your bandages so they land at better times by drinking strength pots (or re equipping hp+ items).

I don't think DCI is going to help much as they have more wrestling than you can have weapon skill anyway.