Attention Jeremy: concerning Event rewards

[Tiamat]

I wonder which dumped more points into the economy. This quest thing, or all those heritage tokens? /curious

...this event is silly

 

[Madrid]

So your complaining about something that you yourself have taken full advantage of. Hypocrite. Just like a conservative elitist. Sure it's rather dirty to see the farmers on dummy accounts farming like mad, but all that means is these items will be WORTHLESS. Just like they would be anyway, since its just a game and everything in it is in reality...worthless.

I like the fact they won't (hopefully) be on Luna vendors for millions of gold. I like the fact these things will be COMMON. That means the elitists (like you find in Luna price gouging everything) will not profit from this. And that makes me tingle in my happy places.

The fact people complain about things becoming common just tells me they will not be able to profit from their OWN EXPLOITATION of certain systems. Goody.

You can call me a hyprocrite or any other name you want. What I'm not is a sucker and as I said I was one of the first on my shard to jump all over this because I knew very well what was about to transpire and that doesn't mean I have to like it. You'd have to be an idiot not to take advantage of the points while everyone else is.

My position is the Event never should have been mixed up with the Spring Clean Up. And since it was it should have been once per account. What has transpired has been totally excessive and ruined the turn in. There has been no moderation.

And about you babbling about these elitist Luna vendors is a bunch of garbage. Don't pay the damn prices if you feel it's not worth it. It's quite simple and any argument that you have is totally baseless.

 

[Madrid]

I could see your point until this part. Point values were a bit devalued. If I run a script that gets me millions of gold or thousands of valorite ingots, that's better than running through a few extra characters through this quest? Calling scripting ok, but calling this I'm not attacking anyone who capalitized on maximizing their turn in points what I'm saying is that itmisuse of a quest a dupe? That's a flawed point of view.

I've said I did this quest a few more times. If I had believed getting these points were a dupe or a cheat, I wouldn't have done it. You believed it was a dupe, and you still did it. You've basically said "I am a cheater by my own strict definition of cheating." While attacking those who followed your lead?

I went through the quest completely with a lot of characters because I wanted a few extra chests for events down the line. I've gone through the quest in part because I wanted an extra bloody scroll or two. I've gotten a few extra points, but the funny thing is, I'm still going to finish cleaning out my house so I have room. Having 40 SOS bottles won't mean as much to me as having no SOS bottles and a reason to collect them again. Same with maps and power crystals and extra recipes and such. The intention was to get rid of some junk and get a few deco and other items. The magic of the beehive is still there, it just means there will be a few more pots of honey.

Landicine,

I'm not going to get into the ins and out of AFK macroing and scripting. I do know carpel tunnel is a nasty thing but that is for another thread.

The Event turn in is opened ended. One can literally get as many points as one wants. An infinite number until they shut down the event. Therefore it's just like duping.

And again the problem I have with it that this is with full knowledge of those who are in charge of UO. It's completely opened ended ready for blatant abuse, they know about it and little has been done.

Personally I think the DEV team ruined the spring cleanup by intertwinning it with the EVENT which was great. Hell the cloak was reward enought they didn't have to throw in an unlimited about of turn in points and as one poster said made the turn in items 'less special'.

So at this point it's time to move on. I'm now braced and won't be suprised in the future when similiar things happen. And I won't be on the message boards 'crying' foul or ranting. Now I know what to expect

 

[Landicine]

Ingot gathering is open ended. Gold gathering is open ended. You can actually spend any amount of time doing it and get some amount of ingots equivalent to the time spent. Something being open ended doesn't make it duping. Duping is the doubling of an item or collection of items in a way that uses bugs or other exploits. Something being too easily obtainable because it wasn't planned through isn't duping. To call it such is problematic.

I've noticed a trend on this board to take a major problem and basically attach so many nonrelated gameplay things so as to completely devalue the original crime. Those who don't like UOAssist call it a script program and every UOA macro a script. Those who don't like a certain quest giving too many spring points call it a dupe. This hyperbole undermines the arguments of these people. Instead of talking about the real problem, the threads break down into debates on semantics, and real concerns are lost in a sea of babble.

The argument:
1. This quest made points too easy to get, devaluing the points from other items that may have been harder to get.
2. In the future, this shouldn't happen.
3. Here are proposed fixes.

Is a lot better than the argument:
1. This quest is akin to duping, the one of the seven deadly sins in UO.
2. It is far worst than scripting, one of the seven deadly sins that I don't have a problem with.
3. It destroyed this event for me.
4. I abused the system myself since everyone was doing it.
5. Now my feelings are hurt since people pointed out that I was crying foul while doing the same foul.

This isn't the first time people have used legitimate means to take advantage of free pixel candy (clothing bless deeds, heritage tokens, soulstone fragment tokens, blessed AoS clothing, mini houses). It isn't duping to take advantage of these things. It may be cheap and cause problems (like clothing bless deeds on Siege), but it isn't duping.

The problem with once per account stuff is that roleplayers get in a tiff over it because their evil dark elf smith isn't the same as their noble paladin detective. While I understand this, sometimes RP has to take a back seat to mechanical concerns (i.e. vet rewards).

The other alternative is to make the difficulty and reward scaled to the character doing it. Making branching quests where crafters and warriors get different tasks would make sense as well. Sometimes for quests, one size doesn't fit all.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

Ingot gathering is open ended. Gold gathering is open ended. You can actually spend any amount of time doing it and get some amount of ingots equivalent to the time spent. Something being open ended doesn't make it duping. Duping is the doubling of an item or collection of items in a way that uses bugs or other exploits. Something being too easily obtainable because it wasn't planned through isn't duping. To call it such is problematic.

I've noticed a trend on this board to take a major problem and basically attach so many nonrelated gameplay things so as to completely devalue the original crime. Those who don't like UOAssist call it a script program and every UOA macro a script. Those who don't like a certain quest giving too many spring points call it a dupe. This hyperbole undermines the arguments of these people. Instead of talking about the real problem, the threads break down into debates on semantics, and real concerns are lost in a sea of babble.

The argument:
1. This quest made points too easy to get, devaluing the points from other items that may have been harder to get.
2. In the future, this shouldn't happen.
3. Here are proposed fixes.

Is a lot better than the argument:
1. This quest is akin to duping, the one of the seven deadly sins in UO.
2. It is far worst than scripting, one of the seven deadly sins that I don't have a problem with.
3. It destroyed this event for me.
4. I abused the system myself since everyone was doing it.
5. Now my feelings are hurt since people pointed out that I was crying foul while doing the same foul.

This isn't the first time people have used legitimate means to take advantage of free pixel candy (clothing bless deeds, heritage tokens, soulstone fragment tokens, blessed AoS clothing, mini houses). It isn't duping to take advantage of these things. It may be cheap and cause problems (like clothing bless deeds on Siege), but it isn't duping.

The problem with once per account stuff is that roleplayers get in a tiff over it because their evil dark elf smith isn't the same as their noble paladin detective. While I understand this, sometimes RP has to take a back seat to mechanical concerns (i.e. vet rewards).

The other alternative is to make the difficulty and reward scaled to the character doing it. Making branching quests where crafters and warriors get different tasks would make sense as well. Sometimes for quests, one size doesn't fit all.

The quest ease didnt devalue points.
They have been devalued since it started.

Phase I, Phase II, Phase III. Everything and my mom counts as points. Come on. Its a clean up event not a value event. Not a rarity event. As much as I like playing a merchant... This event is NOT for value.


If you want value. The new gems, maybe the pearls, a magical box.

And other drops.

As for the turn ins. I already found its cheaper to buy the rewards that are now on sale in luna on vendors then it is to turn in points and farm points.

What do I mean. I can find luck jewelry and armour pieces for sale well under 500k per 10,000 points. Why is that important. Well this was like 2 weeks ago before this quest started.

Why is it cheaper. I can sell my points for 600k per 10,0000.
So I sell them and buy the items of vendors.

 

[Landicine]

I'm not saying that this event alone devalued points. However, while I could have gotten a lot of points farming plague beast cores, the point per minute rate is better for this quest. I think the argument of a lot of people here has been that points are now too easy to get. I agree they are easier to get now, but since the quest has been in for 6 days now, it is probably too late to do anything about it now. In this case, I refer to "value" as a relationship to how hard they are to get.

Gold value is another thing. Prices for the points have been crazy. I bought items before the turnin with a final exchange rate of ~10 gold per point which beats the 50-100 per point people were charging. This Spring Cleaning fad has been a wonderful boon for merchants. Sell one item worth 5,000 points for more money than I spent buying one worth 20,000 points; I have done this a few times. Buying items worth X points for 10 gold per, selling the tickets for 50 gold per is another one. Like the value of gold, the gold value of these points is mostly a matter of perception.

 

[THP]

At The End Of The Day

The Devs Were Told Within 48 Hours That The Event Was Screwed And U Did Not Even Have To Start The Event...merely Turn Up At The End And Finish It For 25k Points Per Char...

They Let It Happen....they Have Not Stoped It...yes The Horse Had Bolted But They Could Have Shut The Gate Quicker...the Gate Is Still Open!!!!

Its No Longer An Event Its Turned Into A Farse!!!!

It Takes Less Than 25 Minutes On A Free Noob Account To Collect 125k Points- 5 Chars X 25k Point Token , By Simply Running Form Haven To The Moongate, Running To The Temple - Quick Fire Passwords..jeepers Even If U Die U Can Get Ressed In The Final Room To Collect Ya Ill Gotten Gains...

Was A Great Event... Untill Its Flaws...now Its A Farm!!!

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

At The End Of The Day

The Devs Were Told Within 48 Hours That The Event Was Screwed And U Did Not Even Have To Start The Event...merely Turn Up At The End And Finish It For 25k Points Per Char...

They Let It Happen....they Have Not Stoped It...yes The Horse Had Bolted But They Could Have Shut The Gate Quicker...the Gate Is Still Open!!!!

Its No Longer An Event Its Turned Into A Farse!!!!

It Takes Less Than 25 Minutes On A Free Noob Account To Collect 125k Points- 5 Chars X 25k Point Token , By Simply Running Form Haven To The Moongate, Running To The Temple - Quick Fire Passwords..jeepers Even If U Die U Can Get Ressed In The Final Room To Collect Ya Ill Gotten Gains...

Was A Great Event... Untill Its Flaws...now Its A Farm!!!

I cant disagree with the ease.
It stopped mattering (if thats a word) to me when Heritage Tokens could be used for 10k.

As a merchant I still make gold. Thats my goal. Buy and trade, bring in wares and weapons, items, etc. etc. Now coupons are on the out. Rebuying items to resell is the in.

Heck, i stopped trying to get pearl necklaces. Its just as easy to buy and resell them.

 

[Landicine]

I cant disagree with the ease.
It stopped mattering (if thats a word) to me when Heritage Tokens could be used for 10k.

As a merchant I still make gold. Thats my goal. Buy and trade, bring in wares and weapons, items, etc. etc. Now coupons are on the out. Rebuying items to resell is the in.

Heck, i stopped trying to get pearl necklaces. Its just as easy to buy and resell them.

Cheapest Heritage Tokens on my shard were 200k a few weeks back (I was one of the people selling them), now they are a bit higher. Even at 200k, that's 20 per point, which again is higher than I paid for most of the points I got. I have a ton of Tokens, and even before the event this weekend, I wasn't going to use any of them for a few extra points. There were too many farmables and people were still selling some items (like stealable artifacts) at really low prices.

I understand your point about being merchanting. UO is pretty cool in how it is actually profitable to be a merchant and know prices. I think there are some slight differences between shards, but the same general theory applies: knowledge is worth more than gold.

The event wasn't a farce. I've enjoyed killing Melissa a few more times with characters that long ago got their cloaks. I've seen a few other roleplayers i know who enjoy banging a sword against FoA. I'm looking forward to the next part of the story.

 

[hawkeye_pike]

I think, the problem is not the event (yes, the Dev's could have considered people "exploiting" the rewards and could have taken appropriate action). But the problem is that many players do not seem to bother about the storyline and the fun of solving the event riddles anymore, and only care about items and rewards. Ok, the rewards are nice to have (I'm also trying to get them with all my characters), but solving all the riddles of this event was the main object and has been a lot of fun.

Maybe we should try to change the perspective a little and just enjoy what has been given to us, instead of worrying about items so much. Would you really feel disadvantaged if you could not get a set of Sorcerer's Armor??

I hope the Devs will learn from this event and make each station of future events obligatory for receiving the reward.

 

[RavenWinterHawk]

I think, the problem is not the event (yes, the Dev's could have considered people "exploiting" the rewards and could have taken appropriate action). But the problem is that many players do not seem to bother about the storyline and the fun of solving the event riddles anymore, and only care about items and rewards. Ok, the rewards are nice to have (I'm also trying to get them with all my characters), but solving all the riddles of this event was the main object and has been a lot of fun.

Maybe we should try to change the perspective a little and just enjoy what has been given to us, instead of worrying about items so much. Would you really feel disadvantaged if you could not get a set of Sorcerer's Armor??

I hope the Devs will learn from this event and make each station of future events obligatory for receiving the reward.

it be interesting to create unique puzzles.
Lots of common pieces. But lets say every player gets a random puzzle or variation.

For instance.
NPC
"I need the follow rare item to manage this problem."
1 of the 100 decay items on monsters for quest is needed.

"I need the follow items to mange this problem"
5 of the 100's of item in UO are needed

"Here is a coded map that needs to be deciphered. The message will mean little but I need the key for the work I am doing."

We are given a coded letter we must decoded and figure out on our own

Lots of stuff can be done.

 

[Landicine]

I had fun doing the event. My treasure hunter event stopped for a bit to clear the FoA house of most of the traps (except those stuck in the wall) to sort of roleplay a member of a bomb squad. I made a copy of most of the journals since they were interesting and will go with other random books I've collected over the years. It was so neat to see a return of the FoA since I still remember the Lord British speech after one of their spells opened the Second Age and their secret base in Vesper.

This has been debated for years, the strange relationship between story and reward. Would as many people have gone to Magincia if they couldn't cart bits of it home with them? Some events like the Fall of Trinsic had many people, but no reward. People will choose what they care about and act accordingly.

I like the ideas of variable quests. It would be neat if each of my characters got a different experience.