Insane Vendor Fees Are Still Killing The Shards

[Capt. Lucky]

Atlantic sure. Great Lakes arguable. Every other shard is being killed by insane vendor fees. Smell the coffee Mesanna. Make some changes that will actually help us. Another land to explore and another creature to kill for the 100th time is great. But how about doing something to save this game and our home shards? Us low volume shards need help. NOW!

 

[Tanivar]

Vendor fees costing you millions because your charging trillions? Aren't vendor fees a mere 0.6%? 60 cents on a 'hundred' dollars? Bring your prices down to something reasonable and your vendor costs will drop dramatically. Try it, it works well.

Greed is expensive.

 

[Fridgster]

Vendor fees costing you millions because your charging trillions? Aren't vendor fees a mere 0.6%? 60 cents on a dollar? Bring your prices down to something reasonable and your vendor costs will drop dramatically. Try it, it works well.

Greed is expensive.

Wait so your solution is to sell for less? That's just silly. And if it is 60 cents to the dollar then that is defiantly way too high.

 

[OREOGL]

Isn't it 1 gold per 500 every 8 hours?

Why is this unmanageable?

 

[GarthGrey]

Siege also agrees that vendor feels are too high.

 

[Capt. Lucky]

Vendor fees costing you millions because your charging trillions? Aren't vendor fees a mere 0.6%? 60 cents on a dollar? Bring your prices down to something reasonable and your vendor costs will drop dramatically. Try it, it works well.

Greed is expensive.

Said from someone from Atlantic by chance? I guess the idea is to lower the price to something ridiculously low so someone from Atlantic can swoop in and make a killing? My vendor sells out whenever we have an event and the vultures from Atlantic swoop in to grab the drops. Isn't that odd? It clearly isn't the price. I can tell if there was an event simply by what my vendor has done. We're low populations that don't consume like madmen. I think it's absurd we are suppose to have vendors so Atlantic dealers can make a killing. I sell things like cheap spell books and plants just so when someone settles on Legends they can get started. There's no money in it. It's a service. Pretty much how all the vendors work on any shard but Atlantic and possibly Great Lakes. The point is to be able to have things available to the players on "our shards" so hopefully they will settle with us and make a home. A simple solution is a percentage of the sale price. An outdated system that worked well at UO's peak is seriously in need of a revamp. Pricing something at a 3rd of it's value so Atlantic tourists can grab it and sell it for 3 times the price doesn't seem like a reasonable option to me.

 

[OREOGL]

Someone correct me if
I'm wrong here or if this is outdated.

If it's the equivalent of 1 Per 500 3x a day, for every million it would be 6k a day right?

60k for 10m etc, 600k for 100m.

Let's say you put a 1m item on a vendor, at 6k a day it's about 167 days for it to break even.

Some people in the buy and sell game may cringe, but that's the chance you always take.

Someone explain the real issue here?

I leave more gold on the ground from a (now) 30 minute spawn.

What changed?

 

[Tanivar]

Siege also agrees that vendor feels are too high.

Not all of Siege *glances down at his sig*

Sell what there is a demand for at reasonable prices and it costs you little and sells well. Put stuff on a vendor that doesn't sell well and it sits forever and that 0.6%, 60 cents on a hundred dollars, vendor fee adds up eventually.

Demand on Siege is what it is, just make stuff by order as people decide they want it.

 

[GarthGrey]

Not all of Siege *glances down at his sig*

Sell what there is a demand for at reasonable prices and it costs you little and sells well. Put stuff on a vendor that doesn't sell well and it sits forever and that 0.6%, 60 cents on a hundred dollars, vendor fee adds up eventually.

Demand on Siege is what it is, just make stuff by order as people decide they want it.

You're the only one that gave that Sig an official stamp of approval, no one else did.

 

[Tanivar]

Said from someone from Atlantic by chance?

*points down at his sig with a grin* Got to make a more noticeable sig I guess.

 

[Capt. Lucky]

So if you tour the shards.... unless your on Atlantic, you don't find vendors. They're practically nonexistent. So EVERY vendor owner on EVERY shard is just greedy? That's the problem? Really? Sometimes I'd like to buy that odd thing that doesn't sell very often. You can't sell those items on 95% of the shards. They make vendor search. They make it easier to make mass quantities of stuff with the new veteran rewards. Super. But hey! Where are the vendors that these services are suppose to promote? It's like giving a guy with a flat tire new lug nuts lol To say the only shard that has vendors isn't greedy is nuts. I've seen their prices, they're about 2 or 3 times my price lol

 

[Capt. Lucky]

It's not about the money people. It's about being able to offer items to the other people on our shard. It's about making the game fun. It's about all those people that play a crafter to have a purpose.

 

[Captn Norrington]

Someone correct me if
I'm wrong here or if this is outdated.

If it's the equivalent of 1 Per 500 3x a day, for every million it would be 6k a day right?

60k for 10m etc, 600k for 100m.

Let's say you put a 1m item on a vendor, at 6k a day it's about 167 days for it to break even.

Some people in the buy and sell game may cringe, but that's the chance you always take.

Someone explain the real issue here?

I leave more gold on the ground from a (now) 30 minute spawn.

What changed?

That was the old system, I'm not sure exactly when but it feels like it changed. Also it doesn't just charge 3x a day anymore, it charges a small amount every few seconds and then more when the item sells.

These days it seems to charge about 1% of the items value per day, which doesn't sound like a lot but if you have an item for 100m that sits on a vendor for a month.... you just lost almost half of the items value and it still hasn't sold.

 

[OREOGL]

That was the old system, I'm not sure exactly when but it feels like it changed. Also it doesn't just charge 3x a day anymore, it charges a small amount every few seconds and then more when the item sells.

These days it seems to charge about 1% of the items value per day, which doesn't sound like a lot but if you have an item for 100m that sits on a vendor for a month.... you just lost almost half of the items value and it still hasn't sold.

I can't find the new formula all i see is what I'm referring to.

(Item fee/500)*3

The only difference i see now is that it charges throughout the day instead of once where people would pull the item off and add it later.

If you find a new formula let me know

 

[Tyrath]

I would love to be able to buy things on legends and there was a time that there were vendors well stocked with everything you could want or need on legends. Try finding a power scroll on legends, a stat scroll, rares, vet rewards, resources, you might get lucky now and then but overall you can't find anything because it cost more to stock a vendor than it is worth. I have spent a month watching vendor search for a 110 or 120 tactics scroll on vendor search and NADA, Nothing. I am going to probably end up taking stuff to sell on Atlantic buying stuff I need on Legends and transferring back. Not how I like to do it and I know plenty of scrolls are being spawned and someone has to have tactics scrolls laying around or they have all been transferred to Atl. Even been doing spawns trying to land one and keep getting bard scrolls. LOL Anyone want to trade a 120 tactics for a 120 disco, provo and peace? on legends The cost of stocking the vendor is a big problem on low pop shards where things move a lot slower.

 

[OREOGL]

I think this being blown way out of reality.

If it's even 1% of the item fee a day which publish 80 doesn't even hint towards increasing vendor fees,
That's 10k a day.

So you have 100 days to break even.

I mean if it's the small things like repair deeds, they shouldn't have a vendor fee, or anything under like 10k. I could see that argument.

But if you're selling 100m items chances are you can handle the fees.

And if I recall Lucky is a rares collector, so I have troubles buying into the argument.

 

[OREOGL]

I would love to be able to buy things on legends and there was a time that there were vendors well stocked with everything you could want or need on legends. Try finding a power scroll on legends, a stat scroll, rares, vet rewards, resources, you might get lucky now and then but overall you can't find anything because it cost more to stock a vendor than it is worth. I have spent a month watching vendor search for a 110 or 120 tactics scroll on vendor search and NADA, Nothing. I am going to probably end up taking stuff to sell on Atlantic buying stuff I need on Legends and transferring back. Not how I like to do it and I know plenty of scrolls are being spawned and someone has to have tactics scrolls laying around or they have all been transferred to Atl. Even been doing spawns trying to land one and keep getting bard scrolls. LOL Anyone want to trade a 120 tactics for a 120 disco, provo and peace? on legends The cost of stocking the vendor is a big problem on low pop shards where things move a lot slower.

It seems people are getting confused between population and pricing.

You're not seeing less vendors because of pricing, you're seeing less vendors because of lack of population.

There may be a couple that may not stock items because of pricing, but I'd expect it to be the former not the latter.

 

[Captn Norrington]

It seems people are getting confused between population and pricing.

You're not seeing less vendors because of pricing, you're seeing less vendors because of lack of population.

There may be a couple that may not stock items because of pricing, but I'd expect it to be the former not the latter.

I think their concern is that yes on a shard like Atlantic where stuff sells in a day or two it isn't a big deal to pay vendor fees, but when you live on a shard with a tiny population it will take much longer to sell anything because there are no buyers.

The same 100m item (doesn't have to be rares, could be a slither, a box of 120 power scrolls etc.) that would sell in under a week on Atlantic might take 3+ months to sell on a tiny shard like Legends or Origin, if it ends up selling at all.

So since the sellers won't make any money by running vendors due to how long it takes to sell things, there are no vendors. When there are no vendors, it makes it nearly impossible for new people to play there because they can't even find the simplest things like power scrolls or veteran rewards.

That leads to an endless cycle of dead shards becoming even more dead because new players can't play there, and all the merchants have to ship things off-shard to Atlantic to make any gold.

If vendor fees were reduced or eliminated the merchants might be willing to let items sit on their vendor for months, instead of sending it to Atlantic. Since there would be stuff on vendors, new people could come to that shard and find things to buy which allows them to stay and continue playing on that shard.

 

[OREOGL]

I think their concern is that yes on a shard like Atlantic where stuff sells in a day or two it isn't a big deal to pay vendor fees, but when you live on a shard with a tiny population it will take much longer to sell anything because there are no buyers.

The same 100m item (doesn't have to be rares, could be a slither, a box of 120 power scrolls etc.) that would sell in under a week on Atlantic might take 3+ months to sell on a tiny shard like Legends or Origin, if it ends up selling at all.

So since the sellers won't make any money by running vendors due to how long it takes to sell things, there are no vendors. When there are no vendors, it makes it nearly impossible for new people to play there because they can't even find the simplest things like power scrolls or veteran rewards.

That leads to an endless cycle of dead shards becoming even more dead because new players can't play there, and all the merchants have to ship things off-shard to Atlantic to make any gold.

This seems to be an extreme example.

I'd have to see how many slithers are sitting for 3 months.

Though if the population just isn't there to buy that 100m item, it wouldn't matter if you tweaked vendor fees down, you'd still lose out using that logic.

I don't think that people will come flocking back, or stay for that matter, if a slither can sit on a vendor a little longer.

It comes off as wishful thinking.

But what I'd like to see, instead of "vendor fees are too high" is what they think they should be at.

 

[Tyrath]

It seems people are getting confused between population and pricing.

You're not seeing less vendors because of pricing, you're seeing less vendors because of lack of population.

There may be a couple that may not stock items because of pricing, but I'd expect it to be the former not the latter.

No it is one and the same things take a lot longer to move due to the lower population therefor the loss in vendor fees and time for a item to sell makes it not worthwhile to stock the vendor and lose gold trying to serve your home shard. Thus creating the cycle of one must transfer to atlantic and back to the home shard to to purchases what may have very well been farmed on the home shard and to atl to start with. At least shard shields make this feasible for accts old enough to have them.

 

[CovenantX]

The players caused this problem, most of them keeping the majority of their gold on Atlantic, because of this, Most items are Sold/Traded on Atlantic, or for Atlantic gold.
Some people just want to play where there are more people to play with, it has a negative effect on those that don't.

There needs to be some way to get a more balanced population between shards to even come close to fixing this, We'll have to wait until the "big" announcement planned for the end of this year... I guess.

 

[OREOGL]

No it is one and the same things take a lot longer to move due to the lower population therefor the loss in vendor fees and time for a item to sell makes it not worthwhile to stock the vendor and lose gold trying to serve your home shard. Thus creating the cycle of one must transfer to atlantic and back to the home shard to to purchases what may have very well been farmed on the home shard and to atl to start with. At least shard shields make this feasible for accts old enough to have them.

Seems to be the chicken or the egg argument.

Given that people left even when the economics were better, I'd rationalize it's merely the population on average.

Again you could probably apply it to some parts of the population as fees.

Ps. Paragraphs are your friends.

 

[Tyrath]

"big" announcement planned for the end of this year...

"Thanks to Tyrath spending a small fortune on UO the first half of 2016 we have enough money to run a add in two local newspapers for 6 months" LOL

 

[OREOGL]

The players caused this problem, most of them keeping the majority of their gold on Atlantic, because of this, Most items are Sold/Traded on Atlantic, or for Atlantic gold.
Some people just want to play where there are more people to play with, it has a negative effect on those that don't.

There needs to be some way to get a more balanced population between shards to even come close to fixing this, We'll have to wait until the "big" announcement planned for the end of this year... I guess.

10m says they're releasing it for Steam.

Any takers?

 

[Tyrath]

Seems to be the chicken or the egg argument.

Given that people left even when the economics were better, I'd rationalize it's merely the population on average.

Again you could probably apply it to some parts of the population as fees.

Ps. Paragraphs are your friends.

Go play gram police with someone else unless you want Capt. to issue me a warning

 

[Tanivar]

But what I'd like to see, instead of "vendor fees are too high" is what they think they should be at.

How about a tier system? Zero fee on prices up to 10,000 gold, 0.06% on prices up to 1 million, 0.6% up to 100 million, 6% on everything above 100 million. Prices have got so idiotic due to greed, they need some restraint.

 

[OREOGL]

Go play gram police with someone else unless you want Capt. to issue me a warning

If I were policing grammar I would have told you to add punctuation etc.

Your replies are simply hard to read as run on sentences in large blocks.

 

[OREOGL]

How about a tier system? Zero fee on prices up to 10,000 gold, 0.06% on prices up to 1 million, 0.6% up to 100 million, 6% on everything above 100 million. Prices have got so idiotic due to greed, they need some restraint.

Sure, or even add a fee cap.

There's probably a lot of ways to tackle it, but I don't see much wrong with it other than the items on the low end shouldn't have fees.

 

[BeaIank]

I would love to be able to buy things on legends and there was a time that there were vendors well stocked with everything you could want or need on legends. Try finding a power scroll on legends, a stat scroll, rares, vet rewards, resources, you might get lucky now and then but overall you can't find anything because it cost more to stock a vendor than it is worth. I have spent a month watching vendor search for a 110 or 120 tactics scroll on vendor search and NADA, Nothing. I am going to probably end up taking stuff to sell on Atlantic buying stuff I need on Legends and transferring back. Not how I like to do it and I know plenty of scrolls are being spawned and someone has to have tactics scrolls laying around or they have all been transferred to Atl. Even been doing spawns trying to land one and keep getting bard scrolls. LOL Anyone want to trade a 120 tactics for a 120 disco, provo and peace? on legends The cost of stocking the vendor is a big problem on low pop shards where things move a lot slower.

Give me a shout next time I login and you are around.
I am sure that one will end up slipping out of my backpack near a bank through that pesky backpack hole that no matter what I do, never stays patched up.

 

[Arcus]

Shard transfers should have never been implemented. Hate them in UO , hate them in WoW.

 

[Merlin]

We need gold sinks in this game and vendor costs help keep prices reasonable.

You can always use the Stratics trade forums and individual shard trade forums if you don't want something sitting on a vendor running up fees.

Prices aren't going up because of "greed", they're going up because of inflation. There is more and more gold in the game every day (counting for nearly 20 years), and our player base isn't as big as it used to be. These are just natural market forces, unfortunately.

 

[Angel]

Zero Fees, No cap on price. Perfect

 

[OREOGL]

We need gold sinks in this game and vendor costs help keep prices reasonable.

You can always use the Stratics trade forums and individual shard trade forums if you don't want something sitting on a vendor running up fees.

Prices aren't going up because of "greed", they're going up because of inflation. There is more and more gold in the game every day (counting for nearly 20 years), and our player base isn't as big as it used to be. These are just natural market forces, unfortunately.

This.

In fact, if you looked at it using inflation, vendor fees should be going up.

 

[Tyrath]

If I were policing grammar I would have told you to add punctuation etc.

Your replies are simply hard to read as run on sentences in large blocks.

Easy solution put me on your ignore list

 

[Uriah Heep]

The biggest problem for me is the daily fee. I proposed in the past, make the fee a commission type deal, a set %, of what the item is up for sale for. And make it charge it only when the item is sold.

So if I put a full set of 5-8 circle scrolls out, just in case someone needs to fill a spellbook, it will charge me 10% of what I priced em for...when they sale, and only once. that way I can figure it into the cost of the product made.

TBH I'm thinking of shutting the scribe vendor down, what little bit does sell won't keep up with the daily fees, and it's basic stuff I try to sell-gate scrolls, 5th circle and up sets, runebooks, a few spellbooks...

A flat fee paid when the item is bought should be sufficient and not gamebreaking. And before yall start, who the hell cares if someone puts something on their vendor priced way high just to use the vendor for extra storage. Does that seriously affect anyone's gameplay in a negative way??? No, it's just that people will gripe because it's never been done that way before.

Yeah Mesanna, give us a break, make vendors like the auctions, a set fee paid when the item is sold.

 

[Uriah Heep]

Set percentage, paid when item sells. Just like an auction would be.

 

[Tyrath]

We need gold sinks in this game and vendor costs help keep prices reasonable.

You can always use the Stratics trade forums and individual shard trade forums if you don't want something sitting on a vendor running up fees.

Prices aren't going up because of "greed", they're going up because of inflation. There is more and more gold in the game every day (counting for nearly 20 years), and our player base isn't as big as it used to be. These are just natural market forces, unfortunately.

The inflation is largely due to one shard and the amount of gold bought from 3rd parties and transferred there from other shards. The lower population shards reap the consequences of that mechanic and none of the reward. While I do not pretend to have the solution to balancing things out, it is a problem that needs some attention. Of course I was one of those backward folk that hated the idea of shard transfers. Mainly because it did not take a genius to see where they would eventually lead. Now we are there.

 

[Capt. Lucky]

I think their concern is that yes on a shard like Atlantic where stuff sells in a day or two it isn't a big deal to pay vendor fees, but when you live on a shard with a tiny population it will take much longer to sell anything because there are no buyers.

The same 100m item (doesn't have to be rares, could be a slither, a box of 120 power scrolls etc.) that would sell in under a week on Atlantic might take 3+ months to sell on a tiny shard like Legends or Origin, if it ends up selling at all.

So since the sellers won't make any money by running vendors due to how long it takes to sell things, there are no vendors. When there are no vendors, it makes it nearly impossible for new people to play there because they can't even find the simplest things like power scrolls or veteran rewards.

That leads to an endless cycle of dead shards becoming even more dead because new players can't play there, and all the merchants have to ship things off-shard to Atlantic to make any gold.

If vendor fees were reduced or eliminated the merchants might be willing to let items sit on their vendor for months, instead of sending it to Atlantic. Since there would be stuff on vendors, new people could come to that shard and find things to buy which allows them to stay and continue playing on that shard.

BINGO! lol

 

[Tyrath]

The biggest problem for me is the daily fee. I proposed in the past, make the fee a commission type deal, a set %, of what the item is up for sale for. And make it charge it only when the item is sold.

So if I put a full set of 5-8 circle scrolls out, just in case someone needs to fill a spellbook, it will charge me 10% of what I priced em for...when they sale, and only once. that way I can figure it into the cost of the product made.

TBH I'm thinking of shutting the scribe vendor down, what little bit does sell won't keep up with the daily fees, and it's basic stuff I try to sell-gate scrolls, 5th circle and up sets, runebooks, a few spellbooks...

A flat fee paid when the item is bought should be sufficient and not gamebreaking. And before yall start, who the hell cares if someone puts something on their vendor priced way high just to use the vendor for extra storage. Does that seriously affect anyone's gameplay in a negative way??? No, it's just that people will gripe because it's never been done that way before.

Yeah Mesanna, give us a break, make vendors like the auctions, a set fee paid when the item is sold.

I have always like your idea of flat % vendor fees. If it sits for a year before it sells it makes no difference. And as you point out it is not game breaking in any way. And I can't see any more harm in someone placing vendors with extreme over priced items for storage than someone using multiple accts to place more castles for the same purposes. The flat % when it sells would be probably the best solution, but you are right a lot of people will find someway for it to be unfair, even if it does not affect them one way or the other.

 

[Capt. Lucky]

10m says they're releasing it for Steam.

Any takers?

EA corporate has an issue with Steam. It competes with their Origin platform. Since Origin is sooooo much better than Steam well there ya go. Doesn't matter that UO would do 10 times better on Steam, it would be an insult to EA's Origin platform. Wonder how that day went at Broadsword when they did all the work to get UO ready for Steam to have EA tell them they aren't allowed to do that? Can't support the competition. Lovely.... if your saying UO will be released to Steam, let's say in the next year, I'll take your 10 mill

 

[Tyrath]

EA corporate has an issue with Steam. It competes with their Origin platform. Since Origin is sooooo much better than Steam well there ya go. Doesn't matter that UO would do 10 times better on Steam, it would be an insult to EA's Origin platform. Wonder how that day went at Broadsword when they did all the work to get UO ready for Steam to have EA tell them they aren't allowed to do that? Can't support the competition. Lovely.... if your saying UO will be released to Steam, let's say in the next year, I'll take your 10 mill

Unless of course EA bought Steam

 

[PaithanTheElf]

I would love to be able to buy things on legends and there was a time that there were vendors well stocked with everything you could want or need on legends. Try finding a power scroll on legends, a stat scroll, rares, vet rewards, resources, you might get lucky now and then but overall you can't find anything because it cost more to stock a vendor than it is worth. I have spent a month watching vendor search for a 110 or 120 tactics scroll on vendor search and NADA, Nothing. I am going to probably end up taking stuff to sell on Atlantic buying stuff I need on Legends and transferring back. Not how I like to do it and I know plenty of scrolls are being spawned and someone has to have tactics scrolls laying around or they have all been transferred to Atl. Even been doing spawns trying to land one and keep getting bard scrolls. LOL Anyone want to trade a 120 tactics for a 120 disco, provo and peace? on legends The cost of stocking the vendor is a big problem on low pop shards where things move a lot slower.

The low population shards either don't spawn enough or don't want to sell them there. Either spawn or go to shard where people want to sell them. It isn't because of the vendor fee.

 

[Tyrath]

The low population shards either don't spawn enough or don't want to sell them there. Either spawn or go to shard where people want to sell them. It isn't because of the vendor fee.

Still can't read Paith? As usual you missed critical information.

 

[BeaIank]

If you price the "good" power scrolls too low, they will be on ATL the next day. If you price them fairly, the daily vendor fee will eat away any profit, whereas if it was a flat fee on sale, even a 50% one, you would still know what sort of profit you would be bringing home.
I had a vendor and dropped it because of that. It is easier to just have scrolls "slip out from a hole on my backpack" when someone is looking for them than to deal with this vendor hassle.
Last year I had a 10 uses forged tool sit on my vendor for almost 2 months at Legends, and it was priced well below market price, but it was still eating away my vendor reserves at a pretty fast rate. Again, not worth it.
On ATL they sell fast enough for that to not be a worry. But that is not the case for smaller shards.

 

[PaithanTheElf]

Still can't read Paith? As usual you missed critical information.

You crying about wanting a tactics scroll on a dead shard?

I read it.

 

[Uriah Heep]

:sighs:

And so the conflict begins. And all for nothing, I predict nothing will be changed, and even if it does get a change, given the history of how things are done here, it will take a government lawyer and an IRS accountant to figure out what the difference is and how it works LOL.


A reasonable flat fee sure does sound good and simple tho...

 

[Yadd of Legends]

Well, I started a thread just like this a year or so ago, also proposing a flat commission when the item sells instead of a daily fee (like a sales tax, like any other store) and it was argued against and nothing done. So +1 to the op but I'm not getting my hopes up

 

[Tyrath]

You crying about wanting a tactics scroll on a dead shard?

I read it.

So you can read....... it is the comprehension part that is getting you

 

[OREOGL]

Easy solution put me on your ignore list

I value you your input, just not your presentation.

It seems like a minor request to have you hit enter once in a while.

But we are creatures of habit aren't we?

 

[OREOGL]

EA corporate has an issue with Steam. It competes with their Origin platform. Since Origin is sooooo much better than Steam well there ya go. Doesn't matter that UO would do 10 times better on Steam, it would be an insult to EA's Origin platform. Wonder how that day went at Broadsword when they did all the work to get UO ready for Steam to have EA tell them they aren't allowed to do that? Can't support the competition. Lovely.... if your saying UO will be released to Steam, let's say in the next year, I'll take your 10 mill

Hmm I don't know man, but you're
On.

Let's say January 31st if they haven't announced the releaseto steam, it'll be 10m to the shard of your choice.

Agreed?