Final Appeal Before the Video

[Harlequin]

I enjoy this game a lot too, but -oh my ged- please realize that there is life outside of the boundaries of your computer screen.

To some degree a better analogy is something like this: I wish I could be 16 again, but with all the knowledge and experience I have now. Would be fun, and this premise is the basis of several movies, but it is so not realistic... Time can not be turned back in this portion of the multiverse.

The video has already been made. Don't think they will make any changes coz it will require PR to go through it again and delay the release further.

However, your analogy isn't quite right either.

Not all that want a classic shard are thinking of rewinding the clock back so that they can replay their 16 year old lives. For those that are, I have been trying to disabuse them of this notion.

Here's an alternate analogy:

Classic UO is like the wild west. A lawless era where the right of way goes to the ones with the biggest guns, the bravest men/women, the baddest ruffians, the cornered commoners that have no where else to turn to. Commoners that had to learn to take up arms to defend themselves. A place/time where justice is meted out swiftly.

Yes, we have progressed to our current age of modern amenities, computers, lawyers and judicial system. But there people that find the wild west attractive.

Yes, with our current knowledge, there are no more unexplored frontiers, but that doesn't stop folks that would have loved to have lived through such a time for the joy of the other aspects.

Besides the wild west, there are other eras that lots of people would have loved to live through, ancient times of ninjas and samurais, medieval times of knights and armour etc.

And to an extent, you and I play UO exactly because we can play knights and castles (and mages/dragons of course). If we wanted modern day trappings, we would have played SIMS/Second Life.

So is it right to deny or belittle people that like the wild west era of wanting to play in a different setting?

 

[Zosimus]

Resources resources and resources.....I so see that word and cringe when I see it. For any player in the UO community believes the devs are using their "noggins" and coming up with new fresh ideas that make a client better or implement a features that is new to UO are not fresh. A fresh idea is an idea that no other game has. Dont copy similar systems and try to fool the community that its unique to UO itself and was well thought out.

The devs are taking features from the War Client and adding them slowly into UO. Does UO client need updated? Yes imo it does. The EC has many features similair to DaoC and War. They should be similar. They are using the same game engine so why not the EC. UO should be and stay UO not become similar to DaoC and War. UO should keep its own identity.

Mods being made by modders are excellent for the devs. Why do I say that? Because, they (the devs) don't have to do the work while the modders can make better editions to the game that the client allows them. Modders actually make better features then a dev can. War has them and DaoC. Hell you can make your game client look the way you want it and like it then the actual game client features they give you. I actually tip my hat off to the modders because I have used some very cool mods before in War.

New ideas? They dont need to come up with them when they can borrow the same type of quest sytems from DaoC and War. DaoC probably has the best quests in any game I have played. I'm pretty sure they have over 1000 quests in DaoC from what I was told. I would have to take time to verify it from a site I used to help with quests. Both war and DaoC have RvR and PvE quests. One thing UO needs is a shot of new updated quests.

High Seas was basically a badly needed long update graphic feature of the game. So the next new idea will be another needed update of the game that should of been done years ago? Who knows but to charge for a update in game graphics and mechanics was not a good decision. Oh they added new boats and "purty" new aquatic life. Yes new quests and made saltpeter a nightmare to get. Stuff like that could of been added instead of new land masses spreading out the thinning community even farther apart.

Originality is a lost word. Why think when we can borrow from the other 2 games an slightly change it to work with this game. 3 games tied into the same company. Hell one day I may want to play War again and sign back up and find out I accidently signed up for UO because it looks the same as War in the near future.

I miss Draconi, Wilki, and Leucerian (sp). Why? They communicated with the community more then this current dev team does. Video? PR? Its all blah to me anymore. Hell the devs may not code very well and hardly communicate (even simple hand gestures would do) but, they sure can dance around issues and wording like any dancing with the stars pros.

 

[hawkeye_pike]

Let's be realistic. The days of classic UO are over. The last Valentine's gift was was a cuddly bear! What can I say? From PvP and chopping corpses we went to cuddly bears and useless items. UO has changed indeed.

I don't wish back the UO from 1998, because it was a bug-ridden hell where griefers and cheaters would pi$$ 90% of the players off. What I wish back is the days where UO was not a game of items, but a game of risk and adventure.

I don't want another parallel world to modern UO, but I'd want modern UO to change in order to become a fun challenging game once again. But I realized that this will never happen.

 

[Fayled Dhreams]

No bet.

Heh!

shoulda doubled down on the long shot ...

If stratics ain't here ... I would have to pay ...

All long shot bets are now closed ...
no takers ... no loss ...

anceb:

 

[Nexus]

Few thoughts on this.....

However...I absolutely must make one last appeal, on behalf of the thousands of players that loved this game prior to Trammel, prior to AoS, that you...the Powers That Be...consider us, consider the history, the heritage, of this once proud pioneer in the MMO industry before you pass judgement on the past.

This is a major issue, what one considers "Classic" isn't the same person to person, not to mention most people's remembrances of what existed in a particular era are not always correct. Sure a Pre-Trammel Shard my bring in one group, but what about people who are only apposed to AoS but didn't like Pre-Trammel? There have been more than one major turns in UO's evolution and if they pick one over the other those people who preferred one over the other are still being left out, the desires of those individuals as well as their views and opinions are equally important and I'm sure regardless of the decision the Dev Team made it's a no win. No matter what they have decided it's only going to please one sect or another, not the entirety.

You are the last line of defense between MMO games as they were meant to be, and what they have become.

You will be the last to decide how this chapter in MMO history is written.

You will decide whether the heritage, the history, the true soul, of Ultima Online will preservere.

Honestly the first statement here makes no sense... Games, even MMO's are designed withing the scope and imagination of it's creator, and their relative skill as a programmer. That's saying everyone should write in a style similar, and on related topics to those texts left by the ancient Sumerians, because they did it first. Evolution and refinements in technique, and thought are natural.

The Second Statement? No that won't be the developers decision, I'm sure some of them, as players would have loved to see UO go in other directions at one point or another. They don't call all the shots, they have deadlines, and requirements that must be met in order to maintain their positions. If market trends dictate going in Direction A even if they prefer Direction B, guess which one wins? The one that makes EA more money. UO is a Product to EA nothing more or less, one that has already risked cancellation at one time and probably more.

The Third... That's somewhat true, thing is what ever direction they take UO is part of it's heritage, High Seas and SA are part of that heritage, so is ML, SE, AoS, LBR, 3rd Dawn, Renaissance, T2A, and the original release. You can't change the past that easily especially not in something like UO that's "Optional" you won't fall over dead from lack of UO. Some of us might get withdrawals, but it won't kill us. For some of us AoS is all we've known, others remember pre-Trammel, to validate one era over the other besmirches that heritage of every other era in the evolution of the game. To say the existence of other eras of game play is anathema to what UO should have been is opinion, some of us actually like AoS, others prefer UO:R, it's all about taste and opinion. Some of us would like multiple era shards myself I'm all for UO:R up... I don't mind AoS, myself for example, and would be interested in a UO:R era server as well.

It may not seem like much on the surface. It may not seem like much to many, but to some of us...it would be like destroying the Declaration of Independence.

Honestly I take offense at that statement. That statement totally compares the value of what is the most historical document in US History (even beyond the Constitution as the Bill of Rights is largely written to ensure the sentiments of the Declaration of Independence) with a Video Game, beyond anything else UO is that, at it's simplest a collective of structured statements that when passed through a Language Runtimes translates it's information into structured Bytecode that a System processor can execute. It does not and cannot effect the flow and direction of a living breathing nation of people beyond the daily activity of a minority of it's individuals. If you can not tell the difference between a Video Game, and and the foundation of an entire nation...

Please take a moment and consider the ramifications of your decision.

If you decide to deny the Ultima Online community a chance, a final chance, to see, to relive, to embrace, the roots of this...the true ancestor of all MMO games, to see where it all started...you are essentially killing that heritage, that root, that soul.

They haven't announced Yea or Nay yet, and there will be no ramifications at least not negative that will account for much. There is an equal amount of risked negative ramification for saying Nay as to saying Yea on the concept of a "Classic Shard". Mainly if they say Yea there is a slow down in development cycles to support it possibly costing subscribers, along with development and maintenance costs, with an undefined number of returning players. And if they say Nay, there is the risk of a handful of players leaving over dislike of the decision. Like many who do so a number of them will return deciding "New UO" is better than "No UO".

No, it might not draw back thousands of players. No, it might not ensure that Electronic Arts will make additional millions of dollars next year, or the year after ... but it will ensure one thing:

Electronic Arts, Origin, and Mythic will be remembered for doing the right thing by the very people that made them successful.

You are right it might not draw thousands of players, it might not draw 500 or 50. It might be another Siege where players start demanding and causing additional headaches for Developers. On the other hand it might draw 500 or even 1000 players in which case they might consider a second "Classic Shard"

And no EA won't care if they did the "right" thing, they are a business, businesses in general care about profit margin. If a Classic Shard poses a risk to Profit Margin when the data was looked through you can forget it.


All that being said I'm not opposed to a Classic Shard though I am realistic....

If it was done I could only see it happening one way....

1. Limited Support - No EM's No Event Arcs No New anything mainly bug fixes and balancing.
2. No Guarantee of Updates - If they decide to go T2A era, the it's T2A era it doesn't progress.
3. No Guarantee of Permanence - If the Server falls to a unprofitable level of players for a set amount of time then it is pulled.

Now if it is a "Yay" things I would love to see....
If after 1 year it proved profitable, a second "Classic Shard" was released aimed at the end of the next major juncture in UO Era's... Namely start with a T2A Shard, then if it goes well make a LBR era server. Each was the last before a major shift in how we played UO. This would eventually satisfy the largest number of people, while leaving none of the 'Classic' promoters out, or at least coming close to what they want.

 

[Derium of ls]

Few thoughts on this.....

This is a major issue, what one considers "Classic" isn't the same person to person, not to mention most people's remembrances of what existed in a particular era are not always correct. Sure a Pre-Trammel Shard my bring in one group, but what about people who are only apposed to AoS but didn't like Pre-Trammel? There have been more than one major turns in UO's evolution and if they pick one over the other those people who preferred one over the other are still being left out, the desires of those individuals as well as their views and opinions are equally important and I'm sure regardless of the decision the Dev Team made it's a no win. No matter what they have decided it's only going to please one sect or another, not the entirety.

too tired to reply to too much, however. We already did our best to come to an agreement on what we want in a classic shard. There was a list stuck in Uhall about it. Quick explanation is anything pre-Chilton is what we want. The rest is just minor details.

 

[jaashua]

You don't want a classic shard. You are still going to want to design your own houses. You're still going to want plants. You're still going to want ethereal mounts. You're going to want elves. You're going to want pre-AoS armor. You're going to want necromancy.

There is no one unified vision of what a "classic" shard should be. You have yours. But nobody shares it entirely. They created Siege as a good middle ground of classic shard ideas. That wasn't good enough. Nothing save your exact vision is going to be good enough. That's your problem.

I loved UO back in the 1997-2000 days. But I don't want those days back....nor can they actually be recaptured because we, as gamers, have evolved. There was a lot great about the 60's, but that doesn't mean we need to revert 50 years to appreciate it or learn from it.

Rather than whining for the devs to implement your narrow vision of what a classic shard should be, what you should really be asking for is for the developers to use mechanics to revive a lot of what was right about the game in the early years....keeping in mind that the VAST majority of UO players don't get the same thrill from peril as you and I.

1. Shut down Ishenar and move those spawns to classic dungeons. We don't need dozens of levels of dungeons filled with ettins, lizardmen, and scorpions. Effectively shrink the game world.

2. Get rid of Insurance and allow each player to bless up to 10 items at a time. Removing a bless from an item destroys it and free up a new bless slot. People will now be dropping something good when they die. Crafters will be needed like never before.

3. Rework factions. It's still extremely uncompelling. Most of all, give outnumbered factions an advantage. By FAR the best part or WAR was early level keep defense. Something like that, on a grander scale, would be 10x better than this sigil nonsense.

4. Let's get people back in plate freaking armor. Change maximum resists on different types of armor material. So nobody is running around with all 70's.

I just pulled those ideas out of thin air to make a point. We don't need to take a huge leap back in order to recapture the magic of the early game. There have been a lot of huge improvements to the game. We need to keep those and to keep moving forward....just with more of an eye on staying true to the spirit of the classic game.

 

[Aristillus]

It may not seem like much on the surface. It may not seem like much to many, but to some of us...it would be like destroying the Declaration of Independence.

As for the declaration of independence bit, I agree it's exactly like destroying that.

This is ridiculous......Step away from the computer, take a shower, go out and join the real world.

Comparing a video game to a document representing the founding of a nation, is evidence you may have lost connection to reality.

 

[Vyal]

Who cares what it is just as long as there is fighting, simple...
all fel facet no matter what thats all I want. That and to cut bodies up when I kill someone.

 

[Derium of ls]

This is ridiculous......Step away from the computer, take a shower, go out and join the real world.

Comparing a video game to a document representing the founding of a nation, is evidence you may have lost connection to reality.

comparing the founding of a nation to the founding of MMOs seems reasonable to me. A founding is just that, a founding. If we as humans are not allowed to compare two things and use them as a point, that would make explaining many things difficult. When I had kidney stones the nurse compared the pain to natural child birth. Should I have told her she was stupid and needed a reality check because mine was a rock, and hers was alive? nope, I understood her point she was making. I didn't assume she was trying to tell me I was going to pee out a 9lb living person

I'm not saying UO is as important as the USA... if you are misreading it then it's you who needs to reconsider your reading skills

 

[Derium of ls]

You don't want a classic shard. You are still going to want to design your own houses. You're still going to want plants. You're still going to want ethereal mounts. You're going to want elves. You're going to want pre-AoS armor. You're going to want necromancy.

There is no one unified vision of what a "classic" shard should be. You have yours. But nobody shares it entirely. They created Siege as a good middle ground of classic shard ideas. That wasn't good enough. Nothing save your exact vision is going to be good enough. That's your problem.

I loved UO back in the 1997-2000 days. But I don't want those days back....nor can they actually be recaptured because we, as gamers, have evolved. There was a lot great about the 60's, but that doesn't mean we need to revert 50 years to appreciate it or learn from it.

Rather than whining for the devs to implement your narrow vision of what a classic shard should be, what you should really be asking for is for the developers to use mechanics to revive a lot of what was right about the game in the early years....keeping in mind that the VAST majority of UO players don't get the same thrill from peril as you and I.

1. Shut down Ishenar and move those spawns to classic dungeons. We don't need dozens of levels of dungeons filled with ettins, lizardmen, and scorpions. Effectively shrink the game world.

2. Get rid of Insurance and allow each player to bless up to 10 items at a time. Removing a bless from an item destroys it and free up a new bless slot. People will now be dropping something good when they die. Crafters will be needed like never before.

3. Rework factions. It's still extremely uncompelling. Most of all, give outnumbered factions an advantage. By FAR the best part or WAR was early level keep defense. Something like that, on a grander scale, would be 10x better than this sigil nonsense.

4. Let's get people back in plate freaking armor. Change maximum resists on different types of armor material. So nobody is running around with all 70's.

I just pulled those ideas out of thin air to make a point. We don't need to take a huge leap back in order to recapture the magic of the early game. There have been a lot of huge improvements to the game. We need to keep those and to keep moving forward....just with more of an eye on staying true to the spirit of the classic game.

did you not read the threads? We already beat into the ground the siege talks and the custom AoS crap. Hell, even Siege players know there is a massive difference between the two.

I'm not trying to troll you. Just saying we already spoke in massive depth about what you brought up, and it was all solved on the most common ground possible.

I like the points you make, but you're missing the single most important problem with UO... item stats. That's why every single classic person wants pre-Chilton. How much earlier than him? We don't really care. As long as it's before him. period.

as for custom houses ect ect, just find the threads that are hundreds of replies long, all of it is answered in there for you.

 

[Beer_Cayse]

This may be too little, too late Morgana. However I would accept anything prior to AOS as a classic/custom shard.

AOS screwed the game more than anything before or since.

 

[Woodsman]

*sigh* it looks like Woodsman still enjoys making personal insults and derogatory statements rather than joining in a real discussion of the merits of the issue.....I saw, from the discussions about a classic shard, that the free shards had evolved into something much better than they used to be, so I tried a couple. I found that they have now become what UO used to be.

Take it as a personal attack, but I don't see how you could have forgotten it, because we had about 3-4 years in a row of bad decisions from going with Tram instead of PVP toggles up through power scrolls and then turning it into an item-based game. Those decisions were made to deal with short-term issues, but they ended up having severe long-term repercussions. We knew it was going to be bad when player-run communities were gutted by Tram.

You did happen to make an argument for me about why classic shards wouldn't be as much of a success in bringing players back:

that the free shards had evolved into something much better than they used to be

There are a lot of people who have made their homes on the free shards and have invested years into them, and they are not going to just up and move to a classic shard because EA winked at them These people play these shards because they have gotten burned by EA at least once in the past, and because they found a shard that suits their particular playstyle.

People assume that these free shards are just fly-by-night with no real depth, but as you yourself have discovered, there is a lot more to them. I don't believe there are a million people who are actively playing free shards either, especially since I and others have played multiple shards and you probably have as well - I could easily be counted as 15-20 players alone.

UO's peak player population was the post-UO:R - AOS era as well, so you have to take that into consideration. There weren't hundreds of thousands of people playing during UO's "classic" era - those players all came after UO:R.

Looking at it this morning, I still think the bigger picture in regards to a classic shard has to take into account things like defining what a classic shard is. Anybody making a serious argument for a classic shard should spell out in the very first sentence of their post what they think a classic shard should be. There is/was a sticky, but those arguing should explain their view.

Part of the popularity with the free shards is that there is such a huge variety of them, from RPing to incorporating things from later publishes to strict, bare-bones no-frills T2A and earlier, etc.

Even if there were a quarter of a million actively playing the free shards, you're asking people who are playing dozens of different shards with different playstyles and additions and who have devoted years to building up their communities, to come play a single classic shard that is defined as classic by EA, and that they have no input into.

You're asking people who watched EA gut their communities with Trammel, to voluntarily disrupt the communities they've built up on the free shards.

If everybody who played a free shard agreed on what "classic" UO is, then we wouldn't have dozens and hundreds of different free shards floating around, everybody would be focused on a few.

That's why ultimately I don't think it will happen, because you'd have to reach a large consensus on what should be in a classic shard. Like I said, you could have 5,000 players supporting a classic shard, but if EA said "this is what a classic shard will be", you're going to have 4,000 who are going to say "wait a minute, that's not what I think a classic shard should be, EA is screwing us again, screw you, I'm canceling my accounts."

 

[Woodsman]

New ideas? They dont need to come up with them when they can borrow the same type of quest sytems from DaoC and War. DaoC probably has the best quests in any game I have played. I'm pretty sure they have over 1000 quests in DaoC from what I was told. I would have to take time to verify it from a site I used to help with quests. Both war and DaoC have RvR and PvE quests. One thing UO needs is a shot of new updated quests.

I don't know how many are in DaoC, but there are a lot, and many are fun even for vets. WOW added 3,000+ quests with the last expansion, Cataclysm, but many are just grinding away-type of quests - I'd rather see well-thought out quests. One thing WOW does get right occasionally with its quests is that it forces players to travel all over the place, and UO needs that.

I'd rather see the UO quest system vastly upgraded to the level of DaoC. Should UO choose to pursue new blood, players who haven't played UO before, they have to have a better quest system to get them familiar with Sosaria.

An 18 year old would not have experienced Ultima lore the way we did - they would have been born when the last great Ultima game came out - Ultima VII, and chances are they probably haven't bothered finding a copy and loading up DOSBox or playing it through iDOS on their iPhone or iPad. Even if you bump the age up, you're still talking about a group that primarily used Windows or Macs growing up and wouldn't have experienced the DOS days.

It's crazy, but I'd love to see all of the stand-alone Ultima games incorporated into UO as quests (maybe not Ultima VIII or IX ). Every single objective from those games incorporated into UO as quests. I know that some of the important characters in those games were killed off in UO or toned down or whatever, and some of the settings changed, but I think it could be worked out.

 

[Woodsman]

This may be too little, too late Morgana. However I would accept anything prior to AOS as a classic/custom shard.

AOS screwed the game more than anything before or since.

It's a toughie, because Tram destroyed many player communities and arguably those communities kept a lot of people playing beyond what they would have normally played. AOS kind of sealed the deal, but Tram really divided the game geographically. Tram basically split each shard into two separate shards, and it set the stage for AOS. Tram also destroyed the economy by making resource-gathering cheap and easy for players who didn't do the duping thing, and AOS compounded that.

Effectively shrink the game world.

I would agree with doing away with Ilshenar, but I would open the game world up - I would bring back live trees to Fel and I would make PVP a player-based toggle instead of facet-based. I know the tree thing can be done client-side, but it's a symbolic thing. At the time, it was supposedly to help players know when they were in Fel among other reasons, but it just so happened to push the message that they thought PVP was dying.

I would also do away with banks in certain towns in an effort to bring people back to certain areas. If you were a new player and wandered onto a shard that was not in the top 3 in population, you're going to be visiting the old lands first, and it would seem like a completely dead world until you got around to Luna.

 

[Ganondorf00]

These population speeches are nonsense, you have to consider UO's population as a % of the total MMO population, so the increase after AOS came because the MMO population increased alot, not because UO got better. In that regard, classic UO had a huge portion of the total MMO players, there just weren't enough players to make it to modern mmo numbers. Maybe you're young, there was no dsl, pcs able to support video games properly were 5-10 times in price compared to today. EA just got emo about everquest and wanted UO to attract that public, without considering that they were losing their own (mostly to games like daoc and lineage).

Now it's only a game for nostalgic gamers or a small niche who still enjoys what little is left of the Ultima universe. As i stated before, they have also no respect for lore, a spaceship was more in line with the Ultima lore than some recent expansions.

A classic shard would bring UO to the scene as a sandbox mmo to play today, if done right. There's so many things that can do wrong, and i'm not talking about what period or which features. I think it's obvious the more features the better, game content is always good (exluding the new combat features which ruined pvp). I'm talking about bugs, old and new, lag (it is one shard, will it be in the US ? i'm in europe and would most likely be at a disadvantage ping-wise), cheats old and new, exploits, and lack of proper dev and gm support.

Also someone said the devs have deadlines, well they may have some, but they never respect them and ea lets them get away with it so that surely is a weak argument

No video still, and even then, personally i'm not reactivating until the classic shard goes live.

 

[Aristillus]

comparing the founding of a nation to the founding of MMOs seems reasonable to me. A founding is just that, a founding. If we as humans are not allowed to compare two things and use them as a point, that would make explaining many things difficult. When I had kidney stones the nurse compared the pain to natural child birth. Should I have told her she was stupid and needed a reality check because mine was a rock, and hers was alive?

Comparing giving birth to passing a kidney stone is a viable comparison. Both instances are of passing an object, out an orifice that is smaller then said object. The state of the object is unimportant.

Comparing the destruction of a historical document (representing the beginning of a war, that would eventually lead to the establishment of one of the great countries of the world) to the founding of a tired MMO is Ridiculous.

I'm not saying UO is as important as the USA... if you are misreading it then it's you who needs to reconsider your reading skills

My reading skills are fine, I understood the point you both were trying to make. I was just bringing up the absurdity of the over-dramatic, ridiculous comparison.

 

[Evlar]

Comparing the destruction of a historical document (representing the beginning of a war, that would eventually lead to the establishment of one of the great countries of the world) to the founding of a tired MMO is Ridiculous.

It was a throw-away comment. A comparison.

I understand and appreciate the patriotism on display here, but heh... lighten up.

Anyhow, if it wasn't for Britain, Americans would all be speaking Spanish by now...

Umm...

 

[Aristillus]

It was a throw-away comment. A comparison.

I understand and appreciate the patriotism on display here, but heh... lighten up.

Nothing to do with being patriotic, I would find the use of any important real world history in such a comparison equally as silly.

I know it was just a throw away comment, I just felt like commenting on how over-dramatic, and ridiculous it was.

Anyhow, if it wasn't for Britain, Americans would all be speaking Spanish by now...

Umm...

And if not for the U.S., Brits could all be speaking German right now.

And as for us all speaking Spanish, I think you may have just held off the inevitable.

 

[Calis M^N]

what is they make a classic shard an account upgrade??
yiou pay xxx money to have access to what ever they have chosen to be a classic shard??
no one thought of that??

 

[yars]

this whole thread sounds like the new coke,classic coke fiasco.

 

[Evlar]

It was a throw-away comment. A comparison.

I understand and appreciate the patriotism on display here, but heh... lighten up.

Nothing to do with being patriotic, I would find the use of any important real world history in such a comparison equally as silly.

I know it was just a throw away comment, I just felt like commenting on how over-dramatic, and ridiculous it was.

Anyhow, if it wasn't for Britain, Americans would all be speaking Spanish by now...

Umm...

And if not for the U.S., Brits could all be speaking German right now.

And as for us all speaking Spanish, I think you may have just held off the inevitable.

On the plus side though, we'd all be driving reliable cars... in fact, we might even still have a car industry.

Good stuff. Last time I added a little harmless country specific leg-pulling like that, I was accused of being racist. Glad to see you take it in good humour.

this whole thread sounds like the new coke,classic coke fiasco.

 

[Dicimiie]

Here's a few things I'd like to say about why I want to see a classic UO shard. Agree with me or not. This is my position.

First, I'll say that my idea of a classic shard is nothing more and nothing less than Pre-AoS. In my opinion, UO stopped being UO when AoS came out. The game mechanics were completely changed at that point. I say this because:

1) No longer were you able to find a Vanquish weapons; I'll use a dagger for this example. Instead, you found a dagger with 50% Hit Change Increase, 10% Hit Harm, 25% Lower Defence.

2) Before, you could look at your equipment (mostly exceptional and nothing else) and know pretty much how good it was. Now, you need a calculator or spreadsheet to keep track of it all.

3) Before, there was one type of damage. Now, there are five, and you have to intuitively know which type is best for each creature, or at least have a cheat sheet somewhere... a very large cheat sheet.

4) Before, crafters (specifically blacksmiths, tailors and bowcrafters) were a necessity. Now, apart from creating repair deeds (a personal slap in the face for me), they're all but useless without playing the lottery that is the BOD system. Insurance, PoF and the weapon stat system all made crafted weapons all but useless without the BOD madness.

5) The pure warrior became unplayable in PvM. Without chivalry, bushido, necromancy, etc., you're pretty useless.

6) Before, you had passive weapon abilities that would come into play... specifically stun. Now, you have to queue it up, blowing through mana you didn't have to have before, further making the pure warrior inferior.

7) Certain skills became useless after AoS came out. Item ID is the first one to come to mind.

8) Power Scrolls became a necessity in most instances. Being GM (100.0%) wasn't good enough anymore. Of course, you had to buy the stupid things if you were a Trammie (which I was) to avoid having the boss taken from you. Yay... super fun.

My list could go on and on, but I think most get the idea. The game Ultima Online as we know it was destroyed, and in its place was a poorly thought out, poorly implemented WoW wannabe that destroyed more than it created.

Before AoS, quite a few players (myself included) had repeatedly asked that necromancers be added to the game. If I'd known that AoS was to be the result of that, I'd have kept my mouth shut. It's not what I wanted. It's not what I was playing. And it certainly isn't what I enjoy.

I really couldn't care less whether I had custom houses. I don't care if Felucca and Trammel are separate (I started playing the game after they'd already split). I don't care if all of the artifacts are removed. I want the game mechanics I enjoyed before AoS. It really is that simple. I'd play if it was Fel only.

I'm actually one of those people that canceled my account after AoS. Why am I still here on the forums? I'm here because there is always that hope that someone at EA will realize their mistake and correct it.

I'm still waiting.

 

[Derium of ls]

what is they make a classic shard an account upgrade??
yiou pay xxx money to have access to what ever they have chosen to be a classic shard??
no one thought of that??

We did talk about that a lot. It seemed to be a bit split though. I myself would be willing to pay a $49.99 upgrade charge and an extra $15 a month to play on a classic shard. However, the more you make people pay the greater the odds the server will fail.

 

[Derium of ls]

Comparing giving birth to passing a kidney stone is a viable comparison. Both instances are of passing an object, out an orifice that is smaller then said object. The state of the object is unimportant.

Comparing the destruction of a historical document (representing the beginning of a war, that would eventually lead to the establishment of one of the great countries of the world) to the founding of a tired MMO is Ridiculous.



My reading skills are fine, I understood the point you both were trying to make. I was just bringing up the absurdity of the over-dramatic, ridiculous comparison.

Both are symbolic, the declaration of independence is actually even less important than UO right now. It's an outdated piece of paper that only carries a meaning. It's actual use died off a long time ago. Yet UO is still alive, so that by default makes UO more important. Hell, brushing my teeth is more important than the declaration of independence at this current time.

BTW, I'm just being a smart ass... even though what I said is actually true.

I know you see our meaning, just for some reason you don't want to understand it and allow us to express our passion for this game. You understood the kidney stone, but you're failing to see how UO and the declaration of independence both founded a land of freedom and choice.

however, I don't wanna argue this too much, it derails from the topic a lot

 

[silent]

I think what people want is the way things were. Even if a classic shard is made IT WILL NOT BE THE WAY IT WAS. The game may look the same but the WORLD will be very different. Back then you had wolves and sheep and many many people in the middle trying to become a wolf or live a peaceful life as a sheep. Just like Siege only the wolves will come to a classic shard not the sheep, the sheep are happy in Trammel.

 

[Dicimiie]

I think what people want is the way things were. Even if a classic shard is made IT WILL NOT BE THE WAY IT WAS. The game may look the same but the WORLD will be very different. Back then you had wolves and sheep and many many people in the middle trying to become a wolf or live a peaceful life as a sheep. Just like Siege only the wolves will come to a classic shard not the sheep, the sheep are happy in Trammel.

Go back and read every post that has been created about a classic shard, and then come back. After having read a good portion of them, I can tell you that we are not asking for the glory days. We are looking for the old game mechanics... when the game was a more simple, less randomized system than what we have today. A time when certain play styles, skills and templates were viable. A time where having a certain piece of armor or weapon wasn't a necessity to be effective. A time where personal skill was the most important thing. A time where a community feel was actually there.

To think that the game could go back to being exactly the same would be foolish. However, it would be a good deal closer than the multi-single player game we have now.

 

[Evlar]

I think what people want is the way things were. Even if a classic shard is made IT WILL NOT BE THE WAY IT WAS. The game may look the same but the WORLD will be very different. Back then you had wolves and sheep and many many people in the middle trying to become a wolf or live a peaceful life as a sheep. Just like Siege only the wolves will come to a classic shard not the sheep, the sheep are happy in Trammel.

You really haven't got a scooby-doo what you're talking about have you?

Siege is a separate shard. Doubting that you've ever set foot on that shard... ever... then I think I can safely assume that if there was a single facet, pre-Renaissance orientated "classic" shard, you wouldn't set foot their either. So being separate shards, how would they affect the gameplay on your production shard?

If you were so concerned about "wolves and sheep", you would happily stay on one of the many Trammel provided production shards, blissfully unaware and safe from all the nasty, horrible things going on in those awful Siege and Classic shards.

Simple as that. Instead of spouting crap like that, why not just be honest and say you're against a classic shard, for fear it might pull players and developer resources, away from what you currently enjoy on the production shards.

 

[Aristillus]

Both are symbolic, the declaration of independence is actually even less important than UO right now. It's an outdated piece of paper that only carries a meaning. It's actual use died off a long time ago. Yet UO is still alive, so that by default makes UO more important. Hell, brushing my teeth is more important than the declaration of independence at this current time.

Of course the Declaration of Independence is still important, not only is it a historical document and symbol of American heritage. It is a priceless priceless article of history, and its monetary value alone makes it more important then UO. UO is a video game, it has never been important, and it never will be.

I know you see our meaning, just for some reason you don't want to understand it and allow us to express our passion for this game. You understood the kidney stone, but you're failing to see how UO and the declaration of independence both founded a land of freedom and choice.

I am not stopping you from expressing anything, I don't have that ability. Again, I was just pointing out how over-dramatic, and ridiculous the comparison was. The Declaration of Independence lead to the founding of a land of freedom and choice. UO was the founding of a land of pixels in a video game.

however, I don't wanna argue this too much, it derails from the topic a lot

Yeah, it's not like a "classic shard" hasn't been discussed before, and I'm sure it won't be the last.

But I digress.......Carry on.

 

[Petra Fyde]

I think this one's so far out in left field it crossed the road.