EM NERFS (Or changes) NO NO NO!

[Kratos Aurion]

Because those people really went for it.

Went for it? How can you consistently score "highend" rares of unique or extremely rare creation by just attending an event and waiting for the handout? I mean most of the time these were handouts where the EM would take us to a field, we would slay the "invasion" and some random ass sitting on over 2 bil gold would be waiting at the castle and the EM would reward him for "his" work.

JC if you had any idea how bad it was on some shards (don't forget we're talking about the OLD events not the NEW events).. but ignorance is bliss.

And like I pointed out not all events ended up like that but it was always the same consistent "richies" that would be handed the reward over the active playerbase.

As for the current EMs being Mythic employees, nay sir (unless they hired all the contestants). The old EMs for sure were voluntary (which are the ones I'm refering to in my rant). I hope things go differently for the second round.

 

[JC the Builder]

JC if you had any idea how bad it was on some shards (don't forget we're talking about the OLD events not the NEW events).. but ignorance is bliss.

One time I was blazing through an investigator event on some shard ahead of another group which consistently were able to come out on top of these events. I would just get done talking to the NPC and off to the next location when they would arrive. I didn't go to events that often. I reached the end and the EM was there to say hello, confirmed I was the first to arrive and let me know that there was nothing else to do until the next event. I waited around a bit before logging and the other group who used to be close behind didn't show.

If you know a lot about UO and have very good deduction skills, you can do it too. For example if something calls for an abandoned Troll room my first thought goes to the back of Wrong. Even if the quest hasn't told me to go there yet and may very well mention Wrong later on, I might go now to investigate.

You can't say the same people get the rewards all the time either because as a guild we've done events and all types of people get them. It depends on how the event is setup.

As for the current EMs being Mythic employees, nay sir (unless they hired all the contestants). The old EMs for sure were voluntary (which are the ones I'm refering to in my rant). I hope things go differently for the second round.

Event Moderators have always been paid contract employees.

 

[Lord Patapon]

Give several items per event, even different unique, non-stat items.
One reward per person is silly... what's the point in having a reward if everyone have it too ? That's not a reward, that's just ... something very common.
I wasn't much in rares, back in the old days, but bringing that market back to life could be a cool thing.

One or two is just too few, considering the number of people generally involved in those events, but a few more would be nice.

 

[Gildar]

what's the point in having a reward if everyone have it too ?

Evidence that you attended the event (albeit circumstantial, since you could've just bought it off somebody). Something that you can sell to get some gold (much less than if the item were unique... but something that you are guaranteed to get instead of a 1/40 shot [chance may be better or worse depending on turnout]).

More importantly, however... it's something to hold on to that helps you remember the fun time you had at the event.
If none of that matters to you, you can always leave before rewards start being handed out (assuming the EMs don't decide to be foolish and force everybody to wait through reward ceremonies before they get closure on the event).

 

[Pom Pom]

The only comment I have to make at this time is why is it that this post by Mesanna is buried somewhere deep in the middle of a thread and not published to the Herald, not put on the flash screen, not included in the FoF, or not published in some official way? Many I have spoken to that do not read Stratics, or have not followed the thread it is posted in, were not even aware that any changes were about to take place. I think that is in very poor taste and extremely bad communication.

 

[christy1221]

Evidence that you attended the event (albeit circumstantial, since you could've just bought it off somebody). Something that you can sell to get some gold (much less than if the item were unique... but something that you are guaranteed to get instead of a 1/40 shot [chance may be better or worse depending on turnout]).

More importantly, however... it's something to hold on to that helps you remember the fun time you had at the event.
If none of that matters to you, you can always leave before rewards start being handed out (assuming the EMs don't decide to be foolish and force everybody to wait through reward ceremonies before they get closure on the event).

That's the only reason I want anything. I have never sold anything I have got from an event. I have a whole floor dedicated to just event items I have got over the years. It doesn't have to be anything anyone would want, I just want it for the memories.

I still think the winners should get a totally different reward that is better then the ones handed out to everyone.

 

[DHMagicMan_1]

I don't see why EM led events have to have anything at all to do with "Rare Collectors".

If EMs are allowed to give out "Unique" prizes to individual participants then there will always be cries of favoritism...

This way is MUCH better. Everyone will get the same thing, with maybe a slight hue or text difference and first place gets their name on it or whatever... Great move. No one can say EMs are giving XXX guild better treatment or this person cheated or whatever.

This is about community and participation... we don't have the tools to make it a truly "fair" or "objective" contest so just rewarding participation is the right way to go.

Thanks!

 

[Maplestone]

So here's my perspective ...

I want to go out, have some fun, maybe socialize a little (because it's rare to get everyone out to one place) and get a little prod to my imagination with a little fiction. I'm not interested in competing with anyone - I don't mind if there's competition, but I don't want it to be the only thing people are thinking about while they are there. I would like little keepsakes to use as props in remembering particularly good events. Items are the way we record our memories in this game.

We're all paying the salaries of the EMs. The idea that "only" people who play the competitive game should get anything seems silly to me. I have nothing against there being rares too (well, aside from a little fear of them becoming duping/cheating/corruption-bait), but I think that some people in this thread have overdosed on greed.

 

[Capricious]

I'm probably in the minority, but I personally am glad for the changes. I've had my share of getting the event items personally so when I say this it isn't because I didn't earn any. Honestly, I'm an rper and what matters to me more than anything is just getting something memorable to display in my house and feeling inspired to write a story on the experience for my characters. My only problem with everyone getting one is the way it might be done. I enjoyed the Valentine event on Atlantic until the turn-in. It was crushing to stand there for hours and listen to the spam. I don't really want it to be a silenced area, but some sort of policing would have been nice. I just hope there is a better method than us having to stand there for so many hours while another tiny part of our sanity is crushed.

 

[It Lives]

*cough*you're*cough*...la

You are one of those grubby little souls too.

 

[Lord Gareth]

Hey excuse me! Why the hell are Hockey Teams getting a Stanly Cup? That is NOT FAIR I want ONE GIVE ME ONE even though I didn't do jack and I didnt win the Stanly Cup it is only fair!!!!

 

[christy1221]

Hey excuse me! Why the hell are Hockey Teams getting a Stanly Cup? That is NOT FAIR I want ONE GIVE ME ONE even though I didn't do jack and I didnt win the Stanly Cup it is only fair!!!!

We may not be able to get the cup but we can get souvenirs.

 

[Petrify]

Hey excuse me! Why the hell are Hockey Teams getting a Stanly Cup? That is NOT FAIR I want ONE GIVE ME ONE even though I didn't do jack and I didnt win the Stanly Cup it is only fair!!!!

Hey I just won the world series of poker and everybody else gets the same bracelet as me... and prize money! Yay, fun!

 

[Heartseeker]

Petrify, not sure about truth hurting but your posts are full of something else.

Hint: It stinks

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

Hey excuse me! Why the hell are Hockey Teams getting a Stanly Cup? That is NOT FAIR I want ONE GIVE ME ONE even though I didn't do jack and I didnt win the Stanly Cup it is only fair!!!!

Good point, but what if 18 NHL teams tied for the conditions to win the Cup (of course they can't...but just suppose)?

Then what? Gary Bettman just picks a team to win?

"Here you go Red Wings...here is another Stanley Cup for you."

That's great if you are Wings fan...but if you are a Flames fan, you are screwed.

Get it?

 

[Heartseeker]

"I thought it was stated that this time was going to be different? It has turned out exactly the same. People whine, Mythic cancels. So much for taking these forums as a tiny proportion of the actual UO player base."

QFT

 

[DHMagicMan_1]

Hey excuse me! Why the hell are Hockey Teams getting a Stanly Cup? That is NOT FAIR I want ONE GIVE ME ONE even though I didn't do jack and I didnt win the Stanly Cup it is only fair!!!!

Don't compare UO to some sort of Professional Sports event or Olympic Event or something... There's no way to build a "Truly Fair" competition within UO or to enforce any "Unbiased" set of rules within the current game or within EM events anyway.

• Someone is "Speedhacking" or cheating in some other way!
• EM So and So is always giving stuff to his/her favorites!!!
• I got there / turned this in FIRST... Where's my prize??? Not fair!!!

In the current UO World, I say the EM rewards should be for participation and everyone should get the same things... accross all shards with maybe slight variations as they described.

There's enough "Rares" for people to chase... we don't need EMs creating more.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

Don't compare UO to some sort of Professional Sports event or Olympic Event or something...

Really?

The Stanley Cup = "some sort of Professional Sports event OR Olympic Event OR SOMETHING"???

I have always thought that the reclusive geek stigma against gamers was unfair until I read that statement...and I am a girl!



Get out of the house once in a while!

 

[Petrify]

Petrify, not sure about truth hurting but your posts are full of something else.

Hint: It stinks

How am I full of crap?

By the way if anybody wants to see the event outline, send me a message (go on see if I'm full of crap).

 

[GreyPawn]

I am reminded of the internet meme "DOING IT WRONG" with the guy on the bike about to smash-face into a telephone pole, or the Romanian armored tank on its back like a turtle, treads whirring wildly.

I was in attendence at the last event on the Atlantic shard, where I witnessed what was quite possibly the absolute worst way imaginable to distribute quest rewards for an EM Event. Corastine, our EM's RPC, literally going through thousands of players one-by-one, quality checking books and handing individualized copies of specially-hued books back as reward. I'm not kidding. This happened on Atlantic, which is quite possibly the most populated server in Ultima Online. Some players waited for 6 hours as the EM went, at random, one-by-one, through the crowd.

I commented to an old Seer colleague of mine about the event, this was literally "the absolute worst way imaginable to handle quest rewards". It boggles the mind to comprehend what our EM was thinking in terms of making this thing happen. Even worse than the actual travesty was the fact that the EM had done so very much in the way of homework on the Virtues. The only other two people I've known with that level of knowledge about the Virtues was the player Inia Geofrensis that ran the Temple of the Avatar, and former UO Community Manager Jeremy Dahlberg.

Then I found this thread and read the comment from Mesanna. Mesanna, you and Brak listened to me once during Test Factions, I shouldn't have to build a whole new EM-based website for you to listen to me again on this particular topic. Changing the method of quest reward distribution to an egalitarian, sheer participation-based system is a mistake. If implemented, you would have in one fell swoop taken the entirety of the Event Moderator program and reinitiatlized it as a wing of Live Content rather than Live Events. If the same thing happens on all shards, if the same item is distributed for the same quest at the same time for the same reason on every shard, you lose the very quality that makes Event Moderators worth having - unexpected, surprising, quantitative immersion.

It is very likely that you came to this decision over the opposition of at least a third of your EMs.* I understand why, and how this decision was arrived at. It is a simple solution to a compound problem and in the immediacy of now looks like a good cure for the complaints of the players. Yes, some shards ran events that resulted in a scant handful of quest rewards being doled out, while others distributed meticulously like candy with way too much entitlement. I say with the greatest of conviction, the solution to this very old problem is NOT a centralized, order-driven, clear cut, pre-arranged schedule adherent methodology. Do that, and you render useless the strengths of the EMs to affect a positive change on subscriber retention.

The solution is in training. You have to train your EMs to scale their efforts with regards to population. You have to teach them how to handle macro-level events, spread the event incident over a large area and stagger the quest reward system to accomodate. Right now, you have a core of EMs, some of which still do not quite grasp the immense powers they have access to, even in the limited Ancient Seer format they possess. You also have EMs that lurch back and forth between systemic Out Of Character speech and In Character pronouncements. If the EM/RPC is to gain respect and political capital which is absolutely required for crowd control, they simply must establish a firm lock on the fourth wall.

If an EM flits from robed character to event actor, and the storyline is obviously a storyline and the quest is so blindingly obviously a quest, then what is the point? Obfuscate the thing a bit, grant purpose and intent but without a reliance on arcane references. Have the EM get involved in local scene, get in some RP and PvP and make sure the notables are on board, because it is those folks that can help steer the audience in a pickle.

I encourage and solicit you to rethink the approach to EMs. The current program is taking the playerbase down a path that is dangerously close to "push the button, get the pellet" style expectations. If that's the aim, a five minute talk with Draconi and Sakkarah can tell you that such a thing is far easier to accomplish as a system feature than with a troupe of psuedo-content aggregators.

* - Conservative estimate. You are likely to actually have one or two classically trained EMs quit as a result of this policy. The remainder will consider it, but will likely remain quiet. *sigh* This almost makes me long for the days of Eidolon and "because I said so".

 

[LordNoximos]

My "Doomsayer" quote, was simply based on this;

Do you want to hand out 80+ Items to every player in attendance, every time an event is ran, for free? Being a decent person gets you so far, this does not cut the ultima mustard.

 

[GarthGrey]

Good God, UO players are the most sickening group of people ever, in the history of Everness. Yeah I know, I have to be included too. But holy crap, I can only imagine what other gamers think of Uhall when they stop in as a guest. And I"m bad at times with regards to UO, but some of you folks.....damn!!

 

[MissEcho]

At least GL gave out good rewards (white lantern), I won both events on Oceania and got rubbish

The only reason the majority of the shard would be happy if I didn't attend would be the fact they would have a chance of winning and getting the rewards yourself.

I was upset because on the first day I received a good reward, then on the second I got shafted and received the same rewards as 4th and 5th, whereas 2nd and 3rd got better rewards than me. Here's a prime example of why I get annoyed about what EM's hand out:

1. Two winners on great lakes recieved Ice White lanterns which were named - easily worth 100m+.
2. I won BOTH times on my shard and received a crappy, non unique colour named necklace (lucky to get 40m for it) and a honeypot that was handed out to ten other people (10m tops).

So me winning twice is only about half the value of somebody winning on GL. Is that fair? Nope. Not to mention I have NEVER received anything good from an EM, which is odd considering I win 95% of the events on our shard (you can't deny this)... an example of this is the "Cassandra the meer" event where you had to solve a riddle and find a remote island (you weren't meant to find it she was meant to die). Nobody on our shard had any idea where to go, I found it in about 40 minutes (time limit of 1hr) before anybody had even figured out that the books were co-ordinates. Okay, so I find her, gate everybody in... we rescue her... I go back to the castle and recieve a PLAIN SASH that says "Rescued Cassandra the Meer" or something.

The day I receive a usable item (in terms of decoration or pvp/pvm) is the day I will actually be satisfied with the EM program. Because right now, I find that the people who the EM's seem to love who manage to win 5/100 events somehow manage to receive an item worth 100x more than the items which I win 95/100 times.

I'm not satisfied knowing I won something because I win them all the time. Winning doesn't mean anything to me because I'm used to it, in fact I'm extremely disappointed if I don't win events. I'll be satisfied when I actually win something useful.

I don't play GL (I showed upto there event though). But I'm glad that GL has some players like me, i.e real UO players, not the carebears who can't handle griefing and created trammel.

Actually here is how it went down:

I did 90% of the things and they helped me where I needed it (e.g went down to covetous to see what the dragon was called). I got the answers. I handed them in and told them the answers. We then brought down several accounts and reaped more rewards.

Two new event items
4 of a kind item, 3 of them owned by my guild and 1 owned by another person who isn't selling it:
10 of these exist, 8 belonging to my guild and 2 others. One I believe belongs to Manticore and the other person is not selling it.

65 is the best offer right now, I have it on Oceania or can take it to Atlantic (free of charge but you may have to wait a week or so).

And today:

First of all, this system was put in place so people wouldn't care about items however all this system is doing is encouraging people to just show up on MULTIPLE accounts for more items (yes I will bring every account I own down to an event just to receive more items now on EVERY shard's event, and yes I will do it illegally).



If EA continue with this, they will feel sorry for hiring Oceania's EM's.

LOL are you serious? You don't care about items???? Read up, lmao. The event system should never be about items and was put in place to give players 'fun' things to do that involved the whole community.

You know, the reason I and many others don't really 'bother' with some events on Oceania is due to the attitude displayed by you. And now that you see they are attempting to 'do' something about this, you totally 'spit the dummy' and intend to make threats against Oceania EM's. This isn't the first time either is it? I fully recall the day you stood on blackthorns roof when Sienna and Cerulean were EM's and abused the hell out of then, swore at them, and carried on with threats towards them and to other players.

Did it ever occur to you that YOU are the reason the devs are pretty much forced to change this system? Do you think your attitude in anyway fosters community building, making events fun for all?

And now with our new EM's, you stood complaining and giving them a hard time of over the 'rewards' you received this time, making it totally uncomfortable to the players forced to watch that carry on and no doubt making the new EM's feel pretty upset that their first 'go' at an event on our shard should end with a petulant child carrying on about what they 'received'.

My feedback on 'events' as such is clearly stated 3/4 of way down in this thread: Event Feedback

I have never had a problem with people selling event items, nor with their being 'unique' items to winners, however, when there are rewards to be given out I have always felt that a memento reward should also be given to all participants as a reminder of the event. When this happens those items still have 'value' as not everyone participates so those who do receive something can either keep it for a reminder or sell it if they are not into keeping stuff, hence why all who attended the obstacle course and completed it (in the previous Event Manager period) got 'sienna/cerulean sandals' or 'robes' both of which were limited in number (about 40 or so to participants) and still sell for reasonable profit 10-30mil and will get rarer as time goes on, but NO ONE missed out.

As for the comments about people complaining as it is due to them not winning things etc etc, this is not the case. I have 'won' a few events, generally those not involving 'races' where it is first come first win etc, as I tend to get caught up helping other players with gating and trying to help them figure clues etc. Do I care if I 'win', no, or I wouldn't bother stopping to help others. I do care about the fairness of events that run that are not aimed at the majority, such as races and clues going back to expert knowledge of the game as in locations and lore and past history, as they are not inclusive and cater only to vet players such as yourself and pretty much wipe out the chance for any newer player or casual player from having an even remote chance of winning.

I know you are a great 'player' Petrify, and I know when it comes to events you are really good at figuring out clues and locations, however, when your attitude is as it is do you really expect that anyone will sympathize with you?

I would rather NEVER have the opportunity to win a 'unique' event item than put up with the way things are now. Messana's answer to put my 'name' and the event title on a reward when other participants just have a 'plain' one is reward enough for me if it means change.

btw if you do intend to follow through on your implied threat:

If EA continue with this, they will feel sorry for hiring Oceania's EM's.

all I can hope is that there is a GM present to monitor your disruption and ban your account. There is nothing worse than someone prepared to 'wreck' any event for all because they didn't get their own way.

 

[Kiminality]

Really?

The Stanley Cup = "some sort of Professional Sports event OR Olympic Event OR SOMETHING"???

I have always thought that the reclusive geek stigma against gamers was unfair until I read that statement...and I am a girl!



Get out of the house once in a while!

We could pretend that there are people for whom the Stanley Cup doesn't apply to. Like, those that live in the rest of the world.
Also, we could pretend that there are people who have an active disinterest in sport.

Anyway, this change isn't so much playing for the "whiners", or against those that "always win".
I figure it's more for the majority of people who attend the events.
30 people show up for an event. 5 people win, 5 people rant and scream about not getting a reward, 20 people remain politely quiet.
Sure, it looks like the "whiners" are winning, but are they? They likely want a big reward...

 

[Petrify]

LOL are you serious? You don't care about items????

Where did I say that?

all I can hope is that there is a GM present to monitor your disruption and ban your account. There is nothing worse than someone prepared to 'wreck' any event for all because they didn't get their own way.

Gotta love trial accounts.

 

[Salivern_Diago]

Ugh.. GUYS! Stop with all the playground crap! This thread if for the reasons WHY NOT TO CHANGE THE EM PROGRAM and discuss. I dont want it changed as unqiue items is commonplace in UO and makes it UO.

So what if someone sell's thier reward, thier loss for selling it and more the fool for buying it. What I dont want is people getting shirty with other people in this thread as it'll end up getting it closed down!

Stay on topic please everyone and keep it civil.

 

[MissEcho]

First of all, this system was put in place so people wouldn't care about items however all this system is doing is encouraging people to just show up on MULTIPLE accounts for more items

By inferring that this system is going to encourage people to just show up for items you 'imply' that the current system does not. I was being sarcastic when I said you 'didn't care' about items but then went and used this quote as to why the 'new' system if implimented was put in would encourage it.

You know I would like to say the 'ONLY' reason you show up is for the items, however I don't believe that is the case, I know you actually 'like' doing the events and challenging yourself and that you are very good at them. There was a time, a long time ago, when you were fun to have on events and when the challenge was what you enjoyed. Now unfortunately the greed has set in, plus your attitude to pretty much anyone not in your guild is woeful, you are 'miffed' that others might get something just for participating, which in your eyes will 'devalue' any reward you get, especially if it is the same item only with your name/event title on it. You care about items, so much so that you now cannot stand the thought of anyone else getting anything, especially if it goes to the 'lesser people' (your term)

as for :

Gotta love trial accounts.

they can ban that just as easily as your main. Perhaps they need to make 'trial accounts' not able to renounce their 'young' status to identify event griefers?

 

[Maplestone]

Why the hell are Hockey Teams getting a Stanly Cup? That is NOT FAIR I want ONE GIVE ME ONE even though I didn't do jack and I didnt win the Stanly Cup it is only fair!!!!

Of course, someone could point out that everyone who plays gets their face on a hockey card but those who "win stuff" get a special fancy border/symbol on their cards.

( the players also don't actually get to keep the cup ... so your metaphor is, um, interesting )

 

[DHMagicMan_1]

They are "just getting" the EM events back up to speed... maybe they will create a "Unique Key" for each event and at the end they will simply open a few gates... you go through, your toon gets tags as getting it's reward and you get the item... you go through again... OOPS you already got yours!!!

No hours waiting... no "I WON"... whatever...

Like I said, it's the participation, not the competition that should matter.

 

[JC the Builder]

Don't compare UO to some sort of Professional Sports event or Olympic Event or something... There's no way to build a "Truly Fair" competition within UO or to enforce any "Unbiased" set of rules within the current game or within EM events anyway.

You are saying sports are truly fair? Have you missed all the news about the Baseball players taking steroids?

If an event is prepared and executed well, it can be very fair. Everyone has the same chance to reach the finish or prize first (if there is one). This new system is akin to how educators are now pressured to give all students the same star on their report, even if they didn't deserve it. Just because they don't want to hurt anyone's feelings.

 

[MissEcho]

Ugh.. GUYS! Stop with all the playground crap! This thread if for the reasons WHY NOT TO CHANGE THE EM PROGRAM and discuss. I dont want it changed as unqiue items is commonplace in UO and makes it UO.

So what if someone sell's thier reward, thier loss for selling it and more the fool for buying it. What I dont want is people getting shirty with other people in this thread as it'll end up getting it closed down!

Stay on topic please everyone and keep it civil.

Sorry, but you can't expect to post a thread for discussion with only those that agree with your view, it wouldn't be a discussion would it?

The thing is ANY item given at an event is unique and will become rare as time goes on, as only those there and participating will get the item.

I don't have a problem with any item that people get and then sell if they don't want it. Gee I collect event items for my public museum, and would hate it if I couldn't possibly buy one if I couldn't attend etc.

It is the 'way' items get distributed that is the issue, the way it currently stands has resulted in:

* the 'vets' on a shard being 99% more likely to 'win' an event at the expense of anyone else for some type of events,
* the bad manners, and griefers attending events which result in people being 'put off even attending' as the 'reward content' rather than the 'event' encourages this type of behaviour,
* worse, where the actual 'winners' complain that their reward isn't good enough and are rude to the EM's
* for people like yourself who attend events time and time again to come away with nothing each and every time resulting in disappointment.

You guys really need to understand that because an event item is given out to all participants it doesn't mean that it is not rare or is worthless. The following 'items' were given out to all who participated on our shard in previous events. (taken from the rares forum, sell prices at the end are a 'guide' only and were paid at the time) No one missed out, everyone was 'happy' that they got an item and all items become rarer as time goes on and you have idocs, and players leaving etc etc.

Aqua, Blue, Brown, Crimson, Green, Grey, etc etc (15 teams) with robes marked: Team Color - Oceania Orienteering Challenge, October 2004 (?) (~25 mil)
I Participated in the Oceania PvP Tourney (Doublet, No Mods, Unique Color) (16-32)(~45 Mil Sold For)
I Participated in Oceana PVP Event 11/02/04 Gloves (14) (35 mil)
Royal Sand Miner Sash (~100) (15 Mil Sold For) - all who completed the hand in
Order of the Serpent (Kite Shield) (~40 So Far) (15 Mil) all who attended
Sneakers Sewn by Cerulean (~60) (~30 Mil) or
Sneakers Sewn by Sienna (~60) (~30 Mil) all who completed the course got one or the other color
Fitness Race Contestant (Neon Blue Surcoat) (~35) (~25 Mil) or
Fitness Race Contestant (Neon Green Surcoat) (~35) (~25 Mil) all who completed the course got one or the other color
Minions of Surano Robe (41) (~25-30 Mil)
Terathan Recruit Pack (Blue pouch) (38) (~25 Mil) all who completed the hand in
Arachnid Libram (Blue Book Different Players Name as Author) (38) (~25 Mil) all who completed the hand in

Now you cannot say that just because an item is given to all participants it makes the event worthless can you? In each of the above not a single person who participated was left out. Each had something they could keep, as I do, or sell if they didn't want it. The fact they state that items will be hued differently per shard etc will be enough to make them 'rare' for xsharders and those who wish to collect 'sets' of rewards from each shard etc.

I have received other 'rewards' for 'winning' or placing in an event so it is not like I wish rewards to go to 'all participants' because 'I' can't win one. I have won and kept every one of these as I don't participate in events for the $$ value.

Champion Archer - Second Place (1) (?) - I won
Archery - Finalist (15) (1-3 mil sold for) - received 1
Royal Architect Sashes (6) (75 Mil) - received 1
Royal Toolkit (Deep Blue House Deco Tool, Blessed) (2) (~100 Mil) received 1

These items are pretty 'unique' as in limited ie from 1-15 given out, but the 'best' reward to date is the WBB renovation contest (whoop I won!! for Oce) because while I do not actually 'get' a reward as such that I can sell I do get a plaque put up with my main char name, which is a MUCH better 'reward'. In fact, it would have been so much better don't you think if that 2nd place archer bow I won a few years ago was a 'plaque' on a wall somewhere commemorating my char's skill in placing in that event rather than me getting a bow? (kind of like a 'Hall of Fame' or something) I know the other two bows were xsharded to the highest bidder (1st and 3rd, although not sure if one came back or not) and the 'winners' of those bows are a forgotten memory on our shard, I for one can't remember who 'won' those and I seriously doubt anyone 'remembers' that Lady Jenay Elandi, my archer won hers.

So OP, I cannot AGREE with your position on the change to the EM events, I only hope they DO go through with it.

Regards

 

[northwoodschopper]

I posted this in another thread, it's still a valid point:

"I'd personally rather see event 'rewards' be something that affect the shard. Statues built in recognition of winners for all to see rather than an obscure item that no one will ever see outside a select few. A hall of heroes, where statues of players forever live on with a description of their feat with the competitive events, for all to see and enjoy. Perhaps these statues can give players a once a day buff visiting.

Events to promote community building could result in rewards improving the look and functionality of the shard, creating bridges, tunnels, gardens, fortifications, new buildings, etc.

These things would be for all to enjoy and also permanently show those that changed the shard for the course of existance, rather than just items.

I suppose if the item route is the only way to go, at least allow the rest of the shard to acquire replicas through the museum or a prominent NPC."

I feel the EM's should focus less on item rewards and more on community rewards.

 

[MissEcho]

You are saying sports are truly fair? Have you missed all the news about the Baseball players taking steroids?

If an event is prepared and executed well, it can be very fair. Everyone has the same chance to reach the finish or prize first (if there is one). This new system is akin to how educators are now pressured to give all students the same star on their report, even if they didn't deserve it. Just because they don't want to hurt anyone's feelings.

I know where you're coming from, however, there are very 'few' events that I have seen staged over the years that could be deemed 'fair' to all participants. Case in point, in this current round of events was the one on our shard, where you HAD to have an in depth knowledge of past story arcs and total knowledge of the entire UO landmass if you had any hope of figuring out the 'clues' to locations or answer the questions to compete. The ONLY players who stood any chance of 'winning' this were vets. In fact a LOT of vets had a pretty hard time figuring them out. Any new player within the last 12 mths wouldn't have stood much hope, nor any 'casual' player of a few yrs or less. Basically because it was put up as a 'race'. My other thoughts on 'events' re this issue are in that thread I linked above so I won't repeat them here. However, rewarding people for 'participation' is not the same as giving a 'star' on the report as they didn't 'deserve' it. If you participate, you participate, it has nothing to do with being rewarded for having 'won' or whatever. It is a reward for attending a community event and participating in it and obtaining a memento that you can keep as a reminder of the UO community.

 

[JC the Builder]

However, rewarding people for 'participation' is not the same as giving a 'star' on the report as they didn't 'deserve' it. If you participate, you participate, it has nothing to do with being rewarded for having 'won' or whatever. It is a reward for attending a community event and participating in it and obtaining a memento that you can keep as a reminder of the UO community.

If they want to make a greater effort to reward all participants that could be a good plan. Eliminating interesting and unique rewards because people feel left out is not.

 

[Jhym]

*shrug*

Ideally the developers would spend a little effort and add in an EM token/purchasing system. The EM would give out tokens for the event (with a few types, one for those that just showed up, maybe others for those that did most of the real work or otherwise did something great) then each EM would have a specialized vendor, perhaps in their RP area or the counselor's guild, where you could turn in your token for a reward that is designated for that event.

So I get a 'Event Token 2/11' that when I turn it it I get a cloak engraved with "Helped rebuild the Oasis tavern 2/11".

If I did something spectacular, perhaps I get a special silver or gold token, the silver gives me a 'mini-house' engraved with "Oasis tavern rebuilding event Captain" Perhaps the gold one gives you a special engraved hat or glasses.

All of these things would be saleable if you wanted to, but if you really enjoyed the event you'd keep them. The EM would have the responsibility to generate the reward items for the vendor (or whatever the interface is) and to give out the tokens at the event. It wouldn't be that hard a system to put together and it would make it more consistent for those involved.

Admittedly, I've never gotten anything even from the old events, but if I ever do I'd like them to be something I want to enjoy or keep, not just "a t-shirt" that gets thrown into a chest or a hat that I can only wear once a year.

I have gotten one or two small things from Seers years ago that I've kept always because they meant something to ME (and my characters.) I've always been mildly upset that people are so quick to sell off their memories, but I guess that's their losses, not mine.

 

[aavie]

Greetings Everyone,

We have been keeping a close eye on EM events and player feedback regarding rewards. After careful consideration we have decided that everyone that does the event should receive a reward. This reward will be the same reward across all the shards, with small differences in text on the item or the hue of the item. We will, of course, take precautions to ensure that only people who take part in a specific event receive the reward. The 1st and 2nd place winners will have their names on the item along with the event name and a year added to the item. When rewards are given out by the Event Moderators it will be announced with the post of shard times that the EM will be giving the applicable reward.



For future events, all locations will be announced with the times to stop any confusion for future events.

Mesanna

So does this mean that those that show up for the last 20 minutes of a two hour event get the same treatment as the 25-50 people that showed up at the proper time and killed hundreds of Balrons? Or are they planning on handing out the rewards before we actually complete the event to 200 people so that over half of of them can recall away with out doing any work at all? I'm still a little confused on how this system is suppose to make things more fair.

 

[Ailish]

I have never won an item for an EM even, and I still think this is a poor idea. Noximos idea is probably the best compromise (unique items for the winners, small token items for the rest). And for GODS SAKE dont make them be the same on every shard! You may as well use GMs for the EMs then, as you are taking away what little creativity they are allowed. I though the Napa EM's did a nice job with top 3 getting a bow and the next 7 getting a plate of cookies. Would I have like to get cookies? you bet ... would have been a nice way to remember the event. Am I broken up that I didnt? nope.

Besides all that, I been trying SO HARD to convince EM Sezja to let me have an "EM Kaen Voodoo Doll" and I will NEVER get one if all shards have to have the same items!

 

[Cear Dallben Dragon]

whats happening to the EMs sucks.

in all seriousness. in deep theory the EM program isnt going away. so it makes since that there would be events that return a single item to a winner, events that give a top 20 prize, events that anyone who participates can have, events that actually require knowledge about ultima/uo like the last one did, and ones that are obvious to anyone who has played UO in the last month. theres is no reason but a bad idea to make it so whenever there is an event, anyone can just say they were there and get the same reward as the people who teamed up with strangers to join minds and overcome a tough challenge.

Until now the EM program wasnt dead, it could have gone on until everyone had a chance. Now its dead. I'll still do the events im sure, if i can. but i'll just log in in a few years and ask for all the rewards.

 

[Salivern_Diago]

So Devs, here you have it! People DONT want the changes (although some do), are you GOING to take notice of this thread like you did of the other? I ask you to speak on this matter and stop hiding!

Listen to the people, we DONT want to changes so DONT change them! At most give a token gift to everyone who attends BUT let the EM's be creative, DONT nerf them.

Or do we have to get a petittion going to make you take notice?

[EDIT]

Or we could just send in Feedback to make you listen/comment on this! Actually thats a good idea.. Feedback!

 

[Apetul]

People DONT want the changes (although some do)

No, no..
People WANT the changes (although some don't)

let the EM's be creative, DONT nerf them.

The EM's must be creatives doing EVENTS.
Please don't confuse creativity with highly priced event items.

 

[Salivern_Diago]

No, no..
People WANT the changes (although some don't)

Thats your opinon

The EM's must be creatives doing EVENTS.
Please don't confuse creativity with highly priced event items.

I disagree, they should be creative period, no ifs or buts. And as I stated before about the highly priced items... If the person wants to sell thier reward and not have something worth keeping, its up to them. And if someone wants to spend loads of gold on the item, more fool them.

And the funny thing? All the items the EM's have already given out will sky rocket in value when these changes come in becuase they will no-longer be given out. I just want to see people rewarded accordingly, and the DEV's not bow to moaners who didnt get anything.. I didnt get anything either and I'm happy with how it goes, the changes make it so I dont have to do anything to get a reward...

Actually, thats rather good thinking about it. I'll just turn up and get rewarded! Woo! I'll use both my accounts and get double rewards!!

I win!

[Insert Sarcasm here]

 

[Hemisphere]

No, no..
People WANT the changes (although some don't)




The EM's must be creatives doing EVENTS.
Please don't confuse creativity with highly priced event items.

If I were an EM with free reign over my abilities, I would VERY rarely spend 3-5 hours on an actual "event".

If I was limited in the amount of hours I could spend making events (as I understand EMs are), I would prepare a set of flexible 10 minute scenarios, designed to reach out to groups of 1-10 players, I would then research the shard I was playing, find out where all the hotspots are, and catch players, in the middle of playing the game, and give them some entertainment. In 10 minutes I can transform myself into a powerful monster and storm a dungeon, killing players until somebody manages to defeat me. Or I could play a jester, and put on a "magic show" at the bank, or a damsel in distress chased by a pack of orcs, who rewards her saviour with no more than a kiss.

I don't really understand the obsession with trying to force a storyline into a freeform game - all the most fun EM events I attended were small scale affairs completely unrelated to any ongoing event "arc". The ones related to the arc seem more like they've been shoe-horned into the story - a quest for the sake of continuing the fiction, rather than purely for fun.

It seems the devs are very keen to put the "Ultima" back into "Ultima Online", but what they're forgetting is that Ultima was a single player game. I'd like to see more attempts at putting the "Ultima Online" back into "Ultima Online" - ie bringing back some of Raph Kosters early designs of a functioning "world" with adventure and mystery around every corner - designs which were largely dropped due to the technical limitations of the day.

 

[IanJames]

Part of the creativity of the EM's is coming up with a couple of unique prizes that fit the theme of the event. For instance on Siege, the prizes recently were several roses of different colors. The prizes were a great idea of giving someone who won part of the competition a nice piece of deco.

This aspect of EM'ing has now been neutered.

 

[Chiera]

Actually, thats rather good thinking about it. I'll just turn up and get rewarded! Woo! I'll use both my accounts and get double rewards!!

I win!

[Insert Sarcasm here]

well if that is what makes you happy...

I think it is a real waste of resources and potential human creativity to set up events as a kind of lottery or contest. That's as redundant as can be, as we already have enough systems hardcoded into the game that do exactly this. You want a contest, go pvp. You want a lottery do champs or doom...

What I expect from an event is that its a kind of shared experience for the players of the shard, to have fun, to meet people, chat a bit, engage in common activity and generally have a good time. And to faciliate such an experience is where the EMs creativity and problem solving capablities should be put at.

As for the items, well I for one couldn't care less if there are items given out or not. Maybe it would be nice to have some kind of souvenir, but that's it then. Items should never be the incentive to attend or the purpose of an event. Insofar I think the changes now are a step in the right direction.

 

[MissEcho]

We have been keeping a close eye on EM events and player feedback regarding rewards. After careful consideration we have decided that everyone that does the event should receive a reward. This reward will be the same reward across all the shards, with small differences in text on the item or the hue of the item. We will, of course, take precautions to ensure that only people who take part in a specific event receive the reward. The 1st and 2nd place winners will have their names on the item along with the event name and a year added to the item. When rewards are given out by the Event Moderators it will be announced with the post of shard times that the EM will be giving the applicable reward.

I for one can't see what the fuss is about. I wonder if anyone has actually read the intent behind this? Lets break it down a bit

1. After careful consideration we have decided that everyone that does the event should receive a reward. Read my post above and actually 'look' at the rewards that were available to 'all participants and what they 'sell' for. These are not bad rewards and were given to those who participated and 'completed' the event. You didn't get them for just showing up, you had to actually 'do' something, people who 'missed' the event missed out, the items are 'rare' now and getting 'rarer' by the day. All of those events meant you had to participate in 'full' due to the design of them, you couldn't just rock up and get something for doing zip. For any event you would be lucky to get 25% of the active/semi active players attend in the first instance, let alone all the players that come 'after' the event and new players in the years to come who don't get them. And you know what, I can't think of ONE player who wasn't happy that they got a one of those rewards, some sold theirs instantly to people who couldn't attend, others took a while to filter onto the market as people freed up lockdowns, some will never hit the market as they are treasured by their owners as keepsakes.

2. This reward will be the same reward across all the shards, with small differences in text on the item or the hue of the item. Thus each shard is likely to get different colored items and text re name of shard etc, still worth trading across shards to collectors to obtain 'sets' etc They have not stated the reward will be the 'same' every time, and given that each event is likely to issue a 'different' reward the EM's will have input as a group into what should be given each 'event' so their input is not likely to be 'nerfed'. In fact it is more likely that rewards decided as a 'group' by the EM's will be 'better' in that as only one type is issued more thought will actually go into the item as peer support will allow them to be more creative knowing they are all on the same page and doing the 'right' thing, instead of them all 'individually' thinking something up and 'hoping' they are doing the right thing.

3. We will, of course, take precautions to ensure that only people who take part in a specific event receive the reward. So where is the free for all of people not doing a thing and getting a reward? Not what they say is it? People abuse the system now by running multiple chars through events, and one person doing stuff and giving the answer to their friends who sat at the bank waiting. I hardly think there will be any 'more' abuse of this system, maybe it will be improved.

4. The 1st and 2nd place winners will have their names on the item along with the event name and a year added to the item. So who wouldn't want a robe or cloak saying "Mr Wiggles Robe - 1st Place - Shard - Event - Date - Your name" on an item, as a reward instead of just Mr Wiggles Robe? Do all of you complaining really think that some 'white lantern' or whatever is any 'better' a reward for coming first or second. Any item named and dated when only 1 or 2 are issued are rare as.

As for all those screaming about the EM's powers being 'nerfed' I would think a lot more time and effort will go into the actual events and free the EM's up worrying about what rewards to give, how many, if they will be 'accepted' or not by the miserable player base that seems to think that they are 'owed' something. It will also free the EM's of being slammed for issuing 'not as good' a reward as something they hear of on another shard for the same event, and free them up from copping the abuse by people 'disappointed' with what they did get.

I have yet to see one valid argument for why something like this is going to bring the 'end of events' or 'nerf the EM program' it has the potential to actually improve the 'event' process for ALL involved, the players and the more importantly the EM's who have a hard enough job without putting up with the gimme gimme expectations.

The only people who 'may' be put out are those looking to make mega millions on 'one off' totally unique items which always end up with the same 'rares' collectors and never seen again. The sale of those items issued to 'all' participants for 25 or 30 mil obviously aren't enough 'profit' for some.

Instead of trying to look at changes as a total negative, or on a personal 'I want, gimme gimme'' basis, why not look at how 'positive' this can be for the whole of the UO event program, I see ONLY positives here, and potential to actually make events not about 'rewards' but about fun for 'ALL'.

 

[Petrify]

EA seriously needs to change this back (bump).

 

[THP]

Thankyou so much.....

Common sense prevails at last.... the olde EM events nearly killed this game once before due to the unfairness and PURE GREED of playes with silly uber items selling for stupid gold amounts or real cash too ...for the shard hopping - every event - in the know gang....

I for one.... and the main bulk of people will be gratefull to hear this fabulous news....well done again....Em events are about taking part ...and not selling items quicker than u can get em in ya backpack!!!!!!!!!! [end]

 

[IanJames]

Glad you're happy. Now, stop necroing a topic we've been done with for a week.

 

[Speedy Orkit]

This program is garbage. Cry babies killed UO when it was good, and now they're even killing it when it's BAD.

 

[Hoffs]

Thankyou so much.....

Common sense prevails at last.... the olde EM events nearly killed this game once before due to the unfairness and PURE GREED of playes with silly uber items selling for stupid gold amounts or real cash too ...for the shard hopping - every event - in the know gang....

I for one.... and the main bulk of people will be gratefull to hear this fabulous news....well done again....Em events are about taking part ...and not selling items quicker than u can get em in ya backpack!!!!!!!!!! [end]

Yes, thanks THP for ruining things for the folk that like some uncertainty in a game. Now go off and start on your next whining campaign.