Time to look into the spawn cams

[Wulfgar]

I have been thinking of a way to stop these spawn cams. For those that dont know what im talking about a spawn cam is where some one has the 15 day trial accounts( many of them) and take a chars down to the champ spawns in fel( take 50 hiding) and have a loop or script or somthing that logs them in every so often to check spawns on another pc. this is how the pvp guilds know who is doing what and what lvl its at.
my suggestion is to do what they did in the invasions. If you log out of a spawn area you get booted to the nearest fel town or set town like brit. This way when they log out they get tosed out and have to run (or boat) back to the place like the rest of us have to do.
it gets real old to work a spawn to 3rd lvl and every time have them pop in at the same time. When we find the cams we kill them and exorcis them. This happens at EVERY spawn in legends.
any one have any other suggestions?

 

[Dermott of LS]

...

*points to UOHerald.com*

Read there first.

 

[Redxpanda]

They are already stopping the trial accounts from going to spawn regions. I think that the truly dedicated cams will just become paid accounts. Considering that this is fel though, do they need to do anything else? I thought fel always went by the anything legal goes rules. I guess it's ok to have cams as long as you are not abusing game mechanics to keep them there.

 

[Gellor]

How do you know they are scripted?

Let me guess, they "MUST" be scripted because it is a raid guild *rolleyes*

Using ghosts, stealthers, hiders, or whatever attended method someone comes up with should be none of your affair. Either spawn faster or set up some sort of defense.

Personally, I have characters logged out in spawn areas for various reasons. I do nothing with them but log in, take a look, and log off. Guess I'm scripting

I think there is a saying about making a mountain out of a molehill I'd take a random guess and say there MIGHT be 5 shards that are script cam'd.

The dev's need to get off their duff and handle the other big issues: current busted scroll distribution, speed hacks, treating all markets the same(aka the Japanese BS preference going on now), PvP taming issues, etc.

 

[Arch Magus]

They already are.
Check the news.

 

[Madrid]

Yeah but let's discuss paid subscriptions...

No timing out in Felucca Champion Spawn server areas...not any of this 90 tiles or some way for someone who get around it...basicaly all of Felucca T2A the other 4 Felluca Champion Dungeon Spawns. If you log out your teleported to Chaos Shrine just like Exorcism. I believe it was ColterDC who suggested that and I agree that makes for a very good start.

 

[Wulfgar]

How do you know they are scripted?

Let me guess, they "MUST" be scripted because it is a raid guild *rolleyes*

Using ghosts, stealthers, hiders, or whatever attended method someone comes up with should be none of your affair. Either spawn faster or set up some sort of defense.

Personally, I have characters logged out in spawn areas for various reasons. I do nothing with them but log in, take a look, and log off. Guess I'm scripting

I think there is a saying about making a mountain out of a molehill I'd take a random guess and say there MIGHT be 5 shards that are script cam'd.

The dev's need to get off their duff and handle the other big issues: current busted scroll distribution, speed hacks, treating all markets the same(aka the Japanese BS preference going on now), PvP taming issues, etc.

i knew id get atleast one person that would cry they are doing nothing wrong. Its people like you that need them for some reason.
now i am in a medium sized guild who went to 4 spawn sights that we know they cam at (easy to do with tracking).. we timed the time between log in and log out of the cams and they would log in every 20 minlike clock work. we got there times down and as i said we killed cams and sent them out. i am saying it is time to stop the issue.
no they have not stoped the 15 day accounts from getting into fel i just did it all you have to do is denounced your young player status. seems my idea here good sir has struck a nerv with you i hope they take your cams away because they need to.
From what im getting there are alot more than "5" shards that run cams.

 

[Teeshy]

...

*points to UOHerald.com*

Read there first.

Do what he said =)

 

[Arch Magus]

i knew id get atleast one person that would cry they are doing nothing wrong. Its people like you that need them for some reason.
now i am in a medium sized guild who went to 4 spawn sights that we know they cam at (easy to do with tracking).. we timed the time between log in and log out of the cams and they would log in every 20 minlike clock work. we got there times down and as i said we killed cams and sent them out. i am saying it is time to stop the issue.
no they have not stoped the 15 day accounts from getting into fel i just did it all you have to do is denounced your young player status. seems my idea here good sir has struck a nerv with you i hope they take your cams away because they need to.
From what im getting there are alot more than "5" shards that run cams.

Geez, get your panty's out of a bunch and look at the news...

 

[Maggie]

If someone has timed out then they are no longer there. You cannot teleport someone who isnt there. If you teleport people when they just log out that would upset legitimate players who crash or lose connection. KR at a spawn is crashy city and my wireless isnt perfect.

This needs a fix, but you are suggesting creates problems too. IF it were such an easy fix they could have fixed cams ages ago.

 

[Viper09]

...

*points to UOHerald.com*

Read there first.

Do what he said =)

What he said about what the other person said.

 

[Madrid]

If someone has timed out then they are no longer there. You cannot teleport someone who isnt there. If you teleport people when they just log out that would upset legitimate players who crash or lose connection. KR at a spawn is crashy city and my wireless isnt perfect.

This needs a fix, but you are suggesting creates problems too. IF it were such an easy fix they could have fixed cams ages ago.

Kinda like they could have fixed trial accounts being able to do all the things posted in UOHerald a long time ago? You mean like that?

Maggie I'm sorry but this is the answer. If your actually online and playing then getting back to the Champion spawn should not be an issue. It's not a big sacrifice to make..gimme a break. The benefits totally outweigh any negatives.

Also I'd imagine they could code it so if you crash your fine...so long as you re-connect within a certain time period. Either way...the sacrifice is worth it by a long shot.

Just how it worked with getting teleported to Jhelom during the "War of the Shadows" it should be for all of T2A Felucca and the 4 Felucca Dungeon spawns except switch Jhelom with the Chaos Shrine.

Unless someone presents a better idea..that will work. This is first step to putting an end to this issue once and for all.

 

[Wulfgar]

Thank you Madrid. This was the only way i could see to fix it.

 

[Annienox]

well hmm first id like to say cams are between something i steped on and that little white spit that get on the corner of your mouth when you realy want a drink. now back to cams (COME ON GROW UP AND CHECK THE FREAKING SPAWNS YOUR OWN DAMN SELF). ohh wait im probly out numbered 3 to one so here let me just check this and (RING HEY TOM **** AND HARRY SPAWNING IN WHERE EVER YA YA YA BE RIGHT THERE) .come down bet me one on one kutos to you.come down bet me 40 to one and talk about it like your the 3rd army rolling threw france please ea thank you for supporting our cause and thank you for stopping this lazy i want to raid way. make them earn there gold :gun:

 

[Splup]

Post shards which have spycams please.

I play Drachs and Europa and I'm pretty sure there isnt any on either.

 

[RD Gumbie]

Post shards which have spycams please.

I play Drachs and Europa and I'm pretty sure there isnt any on either.

May not be one right now because theres not a huge amount of spawning But i'm 100% sure there was at least 1 running on Europa for quite a while. And I know of at least 3 other shards too in the recent past.

I would venture to guess most shards with an active pvp/spawn sceene have some type of ghost cam script happening. At least 1 iv'e seen up close didn't have anythign to do with free 15 day accts.

 

[Gellor]

Didn't strike an issue with me at all. I just find it funny when people whine about a 1% issue like it is the end of the world.

Post up some shard that you are 100% certain are SCRIPT cam'n. I bet I get no reply from you on this.

I can name three that were NOT cam'd in the last year and were raided fairly religiously by ONE guild:bowdown:

I have never said there were NO script cams... just the fact that you are exaggerating it because of your ONE shard.

And I had thought I made it clear why I have chars logged out in spawn area: TO LOOK AROUND *rolleyes* But also to get to one where people block by boat which IS illegal.

The only part about this whole thing that IS an issue is the SCRIPT part. Of which I'll still maintain it is a 5 shard issue. They have bigger issues that need to be handled that should take them less time than designing an appropriate fix.

As for your "FIX", as mentioned, the server can't differentiate between a logout and a crash. The result would be fixing five shards with SCRIPT issues and adding all shards to the whining list of "I missed out on my spawn when I crashed" people

If the devs fix the SCRIPT issue, that takes care of the automated issue. The other "issue" was already stated by the devs as a legal tactic as long as it wasn't automated

 

[Divie]

I know for certain that spawn cams are used on Europa and Atlantic to name two, i used to be in a guild (that is still active) that used spawn cams on Europa and have looked around Atlantic and seen them in action there. While I agree about the suggestion of removing players from these areas on logout (albeit with a timer to prevent being removed on con loss) I fear this could be abused easily much the same as people use the help recall option to get scrolls/items out of a danger area without having to deal with the intended game mechanics.

 

[CatLord]

Post shards which have spycams please.

I play Drachs and Europa and I'm pretty sure there isnt any on either.

Ditto.


On the other hand...

On Cats any character with detect hidden and tracking can have some fun killing the Cams...

 

[Lady Michelle]

1. Should be you cannot enter a champ spawn area as a ghost.

2. You die in the champ spawn area once your body decays your ghost is booted out of the area.

 

[CatLord]

most cams are based on hiding and stealth...

 

[Dragonchilde]

1. Should be you cannot enter a champ spawn area as a ghost.

2. You die in the champ spawn area once your body decays your ghost is booted out of the area.

Simple, and elegant solution.

 

[RichDC]

Once the body is decayed you can boot the ghosts yourself using necro...

Rather than push and annoy people by re posting an age old problem for the i dunno how manyeth time WAIT AND SEE WHAT THERE ACTUAL PLAN IS THEN MOAN!!!

I know once they make whatever change they intend (which they cannot state until its implemented so people dont have time to plan around it!!) people are going to moan again about something else.

 

[BardMal]

Ghost cams have been a problem on Legends for a long time.

There is a certain very intelligent programmer who enjoys writing programs and manipulating game mechanics to the detriment of the entire player base. This "Evil Einstein" once went by the name of Golgaroth I think it was, and he surrounds himself with others of similar talent and mindset.

Ghost cams are a small part for these guys. They are merely an inter shard digital snitch system in place to notify these guys when players enter "their turf".

No one in UO stands a chance against these guys.

They are a digital gang who's "blood in, blood out" credo is formed around providing new and unknown bugs in the system to join. One of my old pk friends who used to watch my back at spawns was a part of this organization. I rode his coat tails for awhile before the whole group was banned.

To pretend the average player has a chance against these guys is like pretending the Iraqi army had a chance against the American invasion. It just isn't realistic.

Until they get bored and go away on their own, EA has no ability over them. They were up and running within a week of the HAX banning, with a no mercy mindset because one of "their own" had sprung a leek, posting some of their dupe pics on stratics.

Using legal game mechanics and going up against these guys is like being a Palestinian with sticks and rocks and taking on the Israeli Army - you will not prevail; you will die; there is no question about the eventual outcome.

 

[Madrid]

1. Should be you cannot enter a champ spawn area as a ghost.

2. You die in the champ spawn area once your body decays your ghost is booted out of the area.

That will have very little impact. It's the hiders and stealthers that are doing most of the spawn cams. Many times I've tracked down killed stealth spawners and exocrised them but it did very to deter him because he can simply come back and log out right in the area of the altar.

Anyone who believes that tracking players is the answer is a fool. The chances of tracking a player who can time out in 5 mins only to check the spawn every 20 or so minutes is not practical. You can be tracking one second and see no one in the area and then 5 mins later he can log right in and see whether or not the spawn is active.

And the suggestion that people logging out to get booted from the server after receiving scrolls/replicas is an exploit and will be blatantly abused...please...give me a break.

As someone else posted on another Forum..."I pay my monthly fee I should be able to use the damn help system as much as I want".

I don't care what anyone says using the help option hurts no one and sure as heck ain't an exploit in my book.

Mindblowing that so many people can't see the big picture when there is a very simple solution to start things in the right direction.

 

[Ironhand1]

"Ghost cams have been a problem on Legends for a long time."

Bardmal, I disagree with this statement if you are referring to scripted/unattended cams. While legends did have scripted cams in the past, legends currently does not and hasn't had any scripted spawn cams for over a year (at least).

As part of a pvp guild, I run spawns constantly when I am on and I have stealthers logged off in some harder to reach places (island, deceit, etc). Spawns happen that we do not catch. However, with the recent spawn activity we check constantly. If i see you doing a spawn, i immediately log into a stealther and run him down into the spawn to monitor the progress, time a raid, and group everyone up.

Unless someone instituted script cams in trammel on legends, there are no script cams on legends.

While your argument that they were on legends in the past has merit, your current statement is false.

I think statements like yours (this is not an insult because I have enjoyed your well thought out post in the past and enjoyed playing with you in the past) are part of the problem. This is reflective of the misconceptions of what actually happens in fel and at spawns with respect to legends. I think people beleive what they want to believe sometimes instead of learning/understanding from the other side.

If you want to PM me we can talk about this further and maybe i can change you mind about legends or you can change my mind about legends.

BTW, i am sure other shards have script cams, just saying it isn't happening on legends now.

 

[Vandetta]

What about a timer on how long you can be a ghost in Champ areas. For example Fel Dungeons and all of Fel T2A. Once the timer is up it will transport you to some sort of shrine or random area. I mean if your at a spawn and can't get ressed by a guild mate then you might as well just get teleported somewhere. It would pose an issue with fights but just make the timer long enough.
Just an idea...

Also the timer keeps going once you log out.

 

[Wulfgar]

Once the body is decayed you can boot the ghosts yourself using necro...

Rather than push and annoy people by re posting an age old problem for the i dunno how manyeth time WAIT AND SEE WHAT THERE ACTUAL PLAN IS THEN MOAN!!!

.

I am not moaning. I simply made a suggestion and wanted to hear what others thought of it. man people get all bent out when some one put out an idea that puts a damper on there little deceiving ways lol

 

[Wulfgar]

"Ghost cams have been a problem on Legends for a long time."

Bardmal, I disagree with this statement if you are referring to scripted/unattended cams. While legends did have scripted cams in the past, legends currently does not and hasn't had any scripted spawn cams for over a year (at least).

As part of a pvp guild, I run spawns constantly when I am on and I have stealthers logged off in some harder to reach places (island, deceit, etc). Spawns happen that we do not catch. However, with the recent spawn activity we check constantly. If i see you doing a spawn, i immediately log into a stealther and run him down into the spawn to monitor the progress, time a raid, and group everyone up.

Unless someone instituted script cams in trammel on legends, there are no script cams on legends.

While your argument that they were on legends in the past has merit, your current statement is false.

I think statements like yours (this is not an insult because I have enjoyed your well thought out post in the past and enjoyed playing with you in the past) are part of the problem. This is reflective of the misconceptions of what actually happens in fel and at spawns with respect to legends. I think people beleive what they want to believe sometimes instead of learning/understanding from the other side.

If you want to PM me we can talk about this further and maybe i can change you mind about legends or you can change my mind about legends.

BTW, i am sure other shards have script cams, just saying it isn't happening on legends now.

Beg to differ with you we set up trackers and stelthers at 4 doungon spawns and ice east and west and could time the cam at each of them ON LEGENDS. So are you saying you just log in and out all day looking for spawners in a perfict timed sequence?

 

[Wulfgar]

What about a timer on how long you can be a ghost in Champ areas. For example Fel Dungeons and all of Fel T2A. Once the timer is up it will transport you to some sort of shrine or random area. I mean if your at a spawn and can't get ressed by a guild mate then you might as well just get teleported somewhere. It would pose an issue with fights but just make the timer long enough.
Just an idea...

Also the timer keeps going once you log out.

that would work for that but what i am talking about is the people who log there chars out in spawn area so they can keep an eye on there cash cow. If they cant control the 120 scrolls then the price comes down and you know they dont want that. My idea( and it is just an idea) was to eliminate the cams completly and give some of the smaller guilds a chance to do spawns.

 

[BardMal]

"Ghost cams have been a problem on Legends for a long time."

Bardmal, I disagree with this statement if you are referring to scripted/unattended cams. While legends did have scripted cams in the past, legends currently does not and hasn't had any scripted spawn cams for over a year (at least).

I defer to your current knowledge of felluca status. It has literally been years since I went there. When all my fel friends have either quit or passed on, I have been unable to make new friends there, and after months of trying have simply given up.

Currently, trammel players basically spawn champs for your guild apparently.

Thank you for your kind words. Legends is so lonely for me now I am very sensitive and prone to misunderstanding comments about UO.

 

[WildWobble]

The spawn cams are exploiting the spawn system!

the trial account thing they are bringing out is a nice start but the idea of booting to a town is a good idea! but only when the character logs out completely it would suck to get disconected and relog in yew or some place else

and yes this will only mean that people will go couple screens away from a zone and log but at least they have to do a little walking now.

 

[Ironhand1]

Beg to differ with you we set up trackers and stelthers at 4 doungon spawns and ice east and west and could time the cam at each of them ON LEGENDS. So are you saying you just log in and out all day looking for spawners in a perfict timed sequence?

Wulfgar,

Seriously, it just isn't happening. Unless nix (which you are in) or that X guild have them- it just isn't happening. If those guilds had cams, i would be getting raided a lot, and I don't get raided a lot.

If it were happening I wouldn't waste hours of my play time running spawns. I also would have tracked them, revealved them, killed them and exorcised them easily. After all they would be on a 20 minute timer like you mentioned.

I don't know what else to say other than you are wrong or misinformed on this issue. I know it happens on other shards, just no legends anymore.

 

[ColterDC]

If someone alive or dead times out in a champ spawn dungeon (not just the champ area, but the entire dungeon). They should be booted.

It would solve alot more problems then it would cause.

 

[Gellor]

If someone alive or dead times out in a champ spawn dungeon (not just the champ area, but the entire dungeon). They should be booted.

It would solve alot more problems then it would cause.

I beg to differ on your "solve more problems than it would cause" comment.

Right now, you have a handful of people complaining about scripted cams that may or may not exist on their shard("it must be scripted because I timed it"*rolleyes*)

If they implement your "fix", you will have MASSES of people whining about getting booted out of the dungeon due to UO dropping them... which DOES happen frequently.

As mentioned, the devs have already stated that ghosts or people hidden at an alter is a legal tactic. I would have to agree even having been on the butt end of scouts.

EA's restriction of trial accounts is a step in the right direction. I doubt champ guilds would pay for 17 accounts to check spawns automated that way.

A way to curb the ghosts is to expand the exorcise spell. Maybe make it so it works in ALL fel dungeons and ALL t2a. *shrugs*

 

[Wulfgar]

you know if im in on 3rd lvl rikki and i lose con id love to log back in to game some place like yew alive ( maybe dead lol it happens).the only spawn that would be an issue getting back to would be island. Yes there will be a handful of people that complain if this idea would go into play, but as im seeing here the majority of the posters think something needs to be done ( even after they stop the trial accounts)

 

[Wulfgar]

Wulfgar,

Seriously, it just isn't happening. Unless nix (which you are in) or that X guild have them- it just isn't happening. If those guilds had cams, i would be getting raided a lot, and I don't get raided a lot.

If it were happening I wouldn't waste hours of my play time running spawns. I also would have tracked them, revealved them, killed them and exorcised them easily. After all they would be on a 20 minute timer like you mentioned.

I don't know what else to say other than you are wrong or misinformed on this issue. I know it happens on other shards, just no legends anymore.

we dont have them lol we have been finding them and killing them and sending them out. why do i need to take a count to get your cam out of a spawn. Why is it you need them anyway. X may be doing it or even bna( BNA????? NOT lol) i would not put it past x or L*D or even $CAM but all i know is we are finding them and killing them. The last one i killed was so loaded with gear(75 heal pots 60 cure 60 or so refresh 20 orange peddles 300 aids) and did not move for 4 min then poof was gone logged back in 20 min later and wow it was dead and L*D was pissed off. and you know what happen next( ring hey pug we need help, ring ring hey get in game we need to raid ring ring ring........)

 

[Shioni]

any one have any other suggestions?

Every possible counter measure to block script bots can be taken but, "when there is a will, there is a way."

However it is very possible that we will be seeing champ spawn areas becoming blocked off like peerless in the distant future. This would also cause a problem witch would be countered by a second plan to remove the spawn timer when more players trigger the "waiting room"

And here we are right back at square one leaving one last possible fix making it only possible to enter a champ spawn area every 48 hours per character


Then we have the fail safe plan, that makes champ spawns instanced events lol

No matter how they fix it pvp in UO is going to take a major blow...

My first suggestion was to have EA run bots that give information about all the spawn area at West brit Bank to make it fair.

 

[Wulfgar]

Every possible counter measure to block script bots can be taken but, "when there is a will, there is a way."

However it is very possible that we will be seeing champ spawn areas becoming blocked off like peerless in the distant future. This would also cause a problem witch would be countered by a second plan to remove the spawn timer when more players trigger the "waiting room"

And here we are right back at square one leaving one last possible fix making it only possible to enter a champ spawn area every 48 hours per character


Then we have the fail safe plan, that makes champ spawns instanced events lol

No matter how they fix it pvp in UO is going to take a major blow...

My first suggestion was to have EA run bots that give information about all the spawn area at West brit Bank to make it fair.

ummmm ???????????????

 

[Gellor]

90% of what I have seen so far in this thread is complaints about what devs themselves have stated is a legal tactic: using a character logged out in a champ area no matter what state they are in.

Until the devs claim otherwise, might as well complain about the color of the daisies in front of your house.

The only issue I have is the potential of automation of this ability which may exist. And even if they did knock out the popular automation utility used specifically for UO, there are generic ones out there:bowdown:

Getting rid of the ability of trial account will knock down the amount of characters logged out in a champ spawn area. As I said earlier, I doubt many spawn raid guilds will keep around 19 paid accounts JUST for this purpose.

The player run solution is VERY simple: use one of your 5-7 character slots and create a champ spawn hider killer Surely within a large "tram" guild there is at least one player with a slot available to go red by killing the champ spawn hiders. You don't even need to scroll the char out: GM mage, GM eval, GM track, GM poison, and whatever. Track the hider, poison field the hider, kill the revealed hider, then exorcise. Seems simple enough especially if the claim of them being automated.

Devs don't need to get involved beyond figuring out a permanent fix to the automation portion of it. But then again, that goes completely against the tram mindset of "give me everything yesterday without me doing any work" that is so prevalent.

 

[BardMal]

Did they fix "exorcise"? Last time I tried exorcise was just off the bridge in Despise, and I got messages that I was too far from the alter. I pretty much gave up spawns in disgust, and spawns were my favorite part of game play.

Parking a ghost to scout, so you can summon the gank squad is so far removed from the "risk reward" that most advocates of increased fel incentives advocate.

This whole risk/reward slogan is a threadbare cover for a tactic similar to luring fatherless teenage girls to a frat party with promises of marriage and a life of luxury. It's not "risk / reward", it'ss cruelty. Plain and simple, the whole power scroll system is a broken game system forcing the less inclined to become victims to those who enjoy preying on the weak.

When someone's real motivation is to "PvP", they don't use ghost cams to wait until the spawn is on the last level. They come as soon as they see population, like Keeper of Souls and Sandman used to on Legends.

A significant majority of the players whom I have encountered that use tactics like this are the types of people who just like to "get over on someone". I prefer not to interact with these types of individuals if I can avoid it, much less do their farming for them.

In fact, most people don't want to interact with, or reward people who are of the "get over on someone" mind set. That is why "the PvP environment" requires disingenuous promise of wealth to bait victims. In real life this type of activity is illegal, but in game it is an interesting glimps into the mindset of corporations.

The fact that scrolls are necessary for char templates, and that UO forces players to interact with many of the excessively diseased mentalities that rule this area of game play I consider reprehensible.

But I do love working spawns. We worked the Tokono spawn at half level to farm leather for years, after the ToTs were removed. And having deco related reasons to work Tram and Ilsh spawns is a great idea.

I wish they would add scrolls to tram, so that all the sick minds who enjoy preying on the weak would more quickly learn that such mind sets lead to lives of loneliness.

Just remember this, for all of you "risk/reward" types - when you work all your life and find out your retirement pension was lost due to the "risk/reward" tactics of investors, and that the people who sold your retirement into poverty are living in wealth and in luxury - you, yourselves advocated this type of mentality, and therefore condoned their behavior.

 

[Gellor]

The fact that scrolls are necessary for char templates

Short of PvP, there are very few skills that MUST be 120'd. There are a lot that would be NICE to have 120 but not MUST be.

Weapon skills? 110-115 is only 2-3% worse than 120. According to stratics, 100 vs 120 skill is only 7% Okay, not needed.

Fighting augment skills? (Anat, tact) You miss out on 2 hits worth of damage maybe 3 for 100 vs 120. Again, not needed.

Chiv and necro? I can't think of anyone who really runs more than 105 in either skill other than bragging rights... "yah me, I've got legendary chiv"

Eval and spirit speak? Almost arguably needed to be 120 skill. OTOH, in a PvP, the odds of running into someone with resist is slim.

Magery? Another arguably needed to be 120 skill.

Vet and healing? Anything beyond 100 isn't a big deal.

Bard skills? This is probably one that has a "super" benefit from being 120.

Taming skills? This is another one that has a "super" benefit from being 120. But then again, it isn't strictly needed.

Most of my chars run only 115 unless I happen to have gotten a 120 I could use. In fact, I think I have ONE char with 120 magery... it was more lucrative to sell the three or four I've gotten to idiots who thought it was better than 115.

 

[Shakur]

Post shards which have spycams please.

I play Drachs and Europa and I'm pretty sure there isnt any on either.

there is

there just isnt enough people active for anyone to care!!

 

[Lord Kynd]

how do you find 'ghost cams' ?
i've tried searching and couldn't find any
guess it would be nice to see what 'they' see .. then i can plan accordingly.

 

[BardMal]

Bards below 120 suck.
Tamers need minimum 110 across to really work.

The 15-20 fizzles on EV at GM magery make 120 magery most benificial, 115 virtually mandatory. The 20 scroll is also extremely desired on nox mages. Raising poison to GM is an extremely joyful experience. That is, if you enjoy things like paying alimony & root canal.

120 spirit speak is way, way better than gm. I don't really know about 120 eval, I have a scroll, but can never decide who to put it on.

120 dexers - I have em, don't like playing em, but there was a time when my lumber jacker wifed once and it ment his death, (specifically against Keeper of Souls). The added hit chance makes a big difference in PvM too. 120 tactics and anat are over rated, they make better soul stone deco than use on a char.

The chars that least need 120 skills are pvpers.

The chars that most need scrolls, are the templates that are the least pvp related. With the exception of maybe archers. (I see few "real PvPers" defending archers as "real PvPers".)

Why should the most anti social play style be rewarded with the most consistently needed high end loot? Specially in a multi player, community based game. One could argue Doom arties are the most valuable, but at least one purchase of those can be swapped around chars.

I need scrolls for every one of my templates, and every time I think about smelting valorite, I wish I had a 120 mining scroll.

So here's my "tally" (I include necros as mages for brevity)
4 bards X four skills = 16 +20 scrolls
12 mages 8 @ 110/115, and 4 @ +20 = 36 scrolls(inc. 10 eval/med)/ 5@20
4 tamers X 3 skills = 12 X 110 scrolls or better = 12 scrolls / 4 @ +20
4 X "tank mages" - 20 weapon/20 magery/ 115 eval/ 20 resist = 16 / 8@ +20
then there are my dexers, I won't even include those, cause I rarely play them. Lets add stat scrolls - 24

That's 88 scrolls I need to in order to engage my play style templates.

Is it fair that I am forced to reward or interact with a play style I (strongly) disagree with, in order to create and enjoy the play style I prefer?

 

[Lord_Puffy]

I am not moaning. I simply made a suggestion and wanted to hear what others thought of it. man people get all bent out when some one put out an idea that puts a damper on there little deceiving ways lol

I could make the same arguement about your orignal post, your making it sound as if it isnt fair someone is typing in 16 account infos and passwords logging in and out to check the spawns.

Even when they make it so trail accoutns dont have access to the spawns people will just ghost with veteran accounts. For some people this is a way of life/income so I dont see them giving it up when they could spend 100-150 on account per month to make a great deal of millions on uo. I mean whats the big deal, just get a larger amount of spawners and defend it. You say it happens every single time at level 3, so Id take a guess and say why not get ready for them? Are you really that unable to pvp?

That may be the real problem, just stick to trammel and let the fel players sell you your scrolls.


I guess even 4 years of crying about this hasnt changed the devs minds. Im glad to see they are wanting people to have to interact with the felluca playerbase.

In my opinion it isnt a big deal at all, Its been this way for a few years now, 3-4?


Goodluck try a less populated server if you cant cut it on the one your currently playing.

 

[Wulfgar]

I could make the same arguement about your orignal post, your making it sound as if it isnt fair someone is typing in 16 account infos and passwords logging in and out to check the spawns.

Even when they make it so trail accoutns dont have access to the spawns people will just ghost with veteran accounts. For some people this is a way of life/income so I dont see them giving it up when they could spend 100-150 on account per month to make a great deal of millions on uo. I mean whats the big deal, just get a larger amount of spawners and defend it. You say it happens every single time at level 3, so Id take a guess and say why not get ready for them? Are you really that unable to pvp?


I guess even 4 years of crying about this hasnt changed the devs minds. Im glad to see they are wanting people to have to interact with the felluca playerbase.

In my opinion it isnt a big deal at all, Its been this way for a few years now, 3-4?


Goodluck try a less populated server if you cant cut it on the one your currently playing.

That may be the real problem, just stick to trammel and let the fel players sell you your scrolls.
I do not do alot in tram( maybe dreed or one of those) i stay in fel mostly. I might bank in luna but im in fel most of the time. I have been there since 1999. My guild is a primary a fel guild. I have yet to buy a 120 scroll. Not the issue at all.
its all good lol i read your stuff and you dont cate anyway. Only care about your self lolso i dont know why i even typed this since it was realy a waist of time on a waisted peace of space.

 

[Wulfgar]

how do you find 'ghost cams' ?
i've tried searching and couldn't find any
guess it would be nice to see what 'they' see .. then i can plan accordingly.

The ones we are finding are not ghost cams they are live. but not realy there. so we kill them and send the out. we track them and have a red poison feild the location.

 

[Wulfgar]

BardMal i like what you have said in this thread. Seem like you have your hed on strait. Nice to know we have some decent people on legends. Nice to know there are like minded people there out side my guild. Would like to meet ya in game some time.

 

[Annienox]

what your looking for in cams are rat form and grey wolf forms. both of these can be found on the tracking animals button. most stealth cams run in rat form thats were i find my cams in tracking. hint when you find a cam and kill him.you better be hiding some where cuz man those guilds running those hate there cams dieing. right down to i have not found any cams in there usual spots in 2 days. another thing to remember is the tracking couser is about 6 tiles off so if the couser is point down here guess about what 6 tile up would be and throw your conflag pot there. now you dont have to be right on target just needs to be close. that being said since i have been tracking and killing cams the raiding at my spawns has dropped way off.we can chain ice west for a very long time before and scouts show up. now with the cams not being used this makes the raiding guilds have to work harder to find when anyone is working spwans. that is fine by me you find me spawning kutos. you dont find me well that is realy great by me. here is a list of scrolls we got to day because we only got raided 3 times


2 120 magery

1 120 archery

3 120 bush

4 120 music

1 120 provke

1 120 mace

5 120 eval

1 120 taming

2 120 vet

3 oak clokes 8 swamp times 1 fang
when cames were running

maybe 1 120 all day




as you can see why cams should be made unuseable

thank you :gun: