To the Devs...*yes, Thief related*

[Guest]

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<blockquote><hr>

There are good players, and there are bad players. Thieves can be looked at as "bad", but, we also provided some challenge to players who were interested.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am all for this.

But instead of a Grey Tag for the Thief, just make it so that the "Interested" players can turn on their own flag, and thereby give them a choice of whether to be "Excited" today, or not, by a leg humping thief!!

Great Idea!!

[/ QUOTE ]

It's already in the game. That little button, marked Felucca on the moongate. That's the on and off button, you asked about...la

 

[Surgeries]

<blockquote><hr>

As the "victim" of a thief, losing my silver vanq axe to one, I can say I had a blast chasing the little bugger down with a group of friends to try and get it back. I didn't, but my perspective was that it's a game, my axe wasn't the only one in the game and if I hadn't let him get that close to me in the first place, I wouldn't have lost it.


[/ QUOTE ]

OK...fun experience with a thief noted.

*Counts*

One

OK...let's get ALL the rest of you "wanna be" victims lined up right...over...here...

*Points to a broom closet*

Perfect...that way we won't over-allocate a queue area...

And don't worry...the Leg Humpers will be right along to provide your daily dose of excitement...

Oh...I ALMOST forgot...

...la

 

[Guest]

Count me in as another. The whole reason I started playing a thief was because of the fun I had with my first encounter with one.

Back in the day of Fel/Trammel stones. I used one without knowing what to expect. I wondered where all of the leaves went, and why all of the tombstones popped up. After a week of running around wanting to get back to Trammel (no, I had no idea there was a map that would have pointed me in the direction of the moongates, lol) I killed a lizardman who had a trammel stone. It was about 2 minutes later that I noticed the stone go *poof* out of my pack. The odd thing was there was a character asking me if I wanted to buy one, lol. He was grey, so I attacked...I was still new, so I couldn't kill him, but we did spend much of the day running around playing chase.

The next day, I read up on the thief profession and created a disarm thief. I haven't switched back since then. Have you ever stolen any goods from other players?...la

 

[imported_silent]

I used to play my thief on prod shards pre tram days but have since got rid of him after all the nerfs. I made a thief on Siege and played him for a while gathered lots of pretty pixels but started to find it hard to find marks so he's parked for now. I have a couple videos at home I'll have to dig up and post...

 

[Der Rock]

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The whole reason I started playing a thief was because of the fun I had with my first encounter with one.
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and the whole reason MANY player quit UO for ever was the fact of completly destroying boring antisocial behavior from some playstyles in UO.

fact is, almost no one want that this playstyles return back to UO

 

[Guest]

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fact is, almost no one want that this playstyles return back to UO

[/ QUOTE ]

Link?...la

 

[Arcus]

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Count me in as another. The whole reason I started playing a thief was because of the fun I had with my first encounter with one.

Back in the day of Fel/Trammel stones. I used one without knowing what to expect. I wondered where all of the leaves went, and why all of the tombstones popped up. After a week of running around wanting to get back to Trammel (no, I had no idea there was a map that would have pointed me in the direction of the moongates, lol) I killed a lizardman who had a trammel stone. It was about 2 minutes later that I noticed the stone go *poof* out of my pack. The odd thing was there was a character asking me if I wanted to buy one, lol. He was grey, so I attacked...I was still new, so I couldn't kill him, but we did spend much of the day running around playing chase.

The next day, I read up on the thief profession and created a disarm thief. I haven't switched back since then. Have you ever stolen any goods from other players?...la

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm quoting this just to save me some time typing. Pretty much the same reason why I started a thief.

 

[AshOfCaine]

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and the whole reason MANY player quit UO for ever was the fact of completly destroying boring antisocial behavior from some playstyles in UO.

[/ QUOTE ]

Those are the players that are out for items alone, but last I checked this was a MMORPG. Note the RP, it doesn't stand for bank sitter. Besides, it has been stated over and over, that it really was only a little bit of effort to protect against thieves. It only took someone stealing from me once before i figured I better protect myself and it never happened again.

I can't stand Necros, lets make it where they can't play either.

I don't think people should be allowed to camp spawn areas, let's have a 5 minute limit on how long someone can stand in a 5 screen radius.

Oh wait, I forgot the G in MMORPG, it's a GAME. People forgot that, got upset because they didn't protect their valued items and that is why they left. I survived for years without insurance or even blessed items way before Tram, so can others.

 

[Der Rock]

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Link?...la
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sure, go to WoW forums, 9 Million content customers LA?
hardly to get 30k together in UO these day´s LA?

LaLa La Luna

 

[Der Rock]

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Oh wait, I forgot the G in MMORPG, it's a GAME. People forgot that, got upset because they didn't protect their valued items and that is why they left. I survived for years without insurance or even blessed items way before Tram, so can others.
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one word in there is correct,one word

"survived"

UO is surviving,
but other games RULES the game industrie,they make billions of income with
millions of content costomers

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

-----------
Link?...la
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sure, go to WoW forums, 9 Million content customers LA?
hardly to get 30k together in UO these day´s LA?

LaLa La Luna

[/ QUOTE ]

I just left WoW. Why? Because I can't steal.

Oh, and by the by, if you hadn't noticed. WoW is no UO, Uo should not try to become WoW. People play UO for the content, many more people play WoW for the pretty graphics...la

 

[Der Rock]

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Oh, and by the by, if you hadn't noticed. WoW is no UO, Uo should not try to become WoW. People play UO for the content, many more people play WoW for the pretty graphics...la
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Link???? LA

 

[Guest]

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I just left WoW. Why? Because I can't steal.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, you can "steal" technically, just not from players, so it is definitely PvE not PvP. I stole a rubber squeaky toy from a golem's pocket, and felt terrible about it afterward, so I killed him so he wouldn't suffer over the loss of his squeaky toy. I am nice that way.

-Skylark

P.S.

 

[Guest]

link

...la

 

[Arcus]

link

...la

[/ QUOTE ]

Rico Rolled.

 

[Fluffi]

RTLFC


I have yet to see a creditable thief advocating PvP stealing in Trammel, so let's disregard that facet completely.

I don't have a thief on Siege, so I won't comment on that shard.


Non-Siege UO has become an increasingly item-based game, and I am honest enough to say that I don't want a thief to steal the weapons I carry in my pack - they cost me in both time and money, and (unfortunately), are a necessity for todays' UO.
As one of the Europa thieves who had a lot of fun during our "farming the artie farmers" event, I'd like to think that I can approach this debate from both sides.



Anyone who steps through a Felucca moongate has signed-up to the fact that they can be attacked by anybody.
As long as the murder victim has kept their insurance up to date, all that they lose will be their uninsurable items and a bit of cash.

Why not apply similar rules to PvP theft: If I "steal" an insured weapon from your backpack, I don't get posession of the weapon, but I do get the insurance cost.
The thief gets to play their risky game, and gets a small reward for their effort, while their mark loses nothing but 300GP, and possibly their temper

.

The additional tweak of having the "stolen" item removed to the victims' bankbox adds even more potential.


This system has been proposed a few times in the past, and always draws the "no-risk leghumper griefer" argument from those opposed to it.

Anyone who is prepared to enter a red gate should be prepared to deal with this risk in the interests of bringing some life back to an entire class of characters.

 

[Guest]

This ground has been broken and turned and tilled and fertilized with so much manure there is no accounting for it all.

Fact: This game did pump a lot more adrenaline when there was absolutely no telling when a fellow player would make your day more challenging or exciting.

Fact:The necessity of living with reds and greys drove many a blue to EQ or something comparable at the time.

Fact:The lesson persistent blue players learned was that far more of their kind would give up than stand up.

Fact:The absence of darkness makes our world, for those of us who choose to walk only in the light, seem dim simply for lack of contrast and comparison.

For all those facts, and regardless of the effort taken to produce something from the ground so ardently tended, it is simply not fertile.

I would like for fel to be more like it was in the time that I started playing the game. Much of what made it compelling has been lost. But the world changes. Other things do we have to divert us. Not better things, and not worse things. Just, different... things.

UO has soooo much play area, and so many systems with huge potential. It seems a shame we utilize so little of it. Yet every time I log in I have to make a choice between cursing in my own dark, or lighting candles for those that have come behind. Because really the strongest and most compelling reason we ever had to play the stupid game in the first place, was the MM, in the MMORPG.

...beh.

 

[Der Rock]

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The additional tweak of having the "stolen" item removed to the victims' bankbox adds even more potential.
This system has been proposed a few times in the past, and always draws the "no-risk leghumper griefer" argument from those opposed to it.
Anyone who is prepared to enter a red gate should be prepared to deal with this risk in the interests of bringing some life back to an entire class of characters.
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i support 100% ure idea, if :

IF: they implement champspawn and harrover in trammel, then let the PvP area to those player who love to PvP exclusivly,
maybe then i also will jump from time to time into the red gate with my PVP-CHARACTER and not with my weaker pvm template.

understood? accept?

 

[Prudentis]

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The catholic religion is based on control of the masses and wealth acquisition.


[/ QUOTE ]
You are right, what I wanted to say was christianity, but I always mix them up

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As for Buddhism, not sure where you are coming with that. The Middle Way is certainly not interested in self indulgence in any form, virtual or tangible.


[/ QUOTE ]
And that is not what I meant. It was the view on mind/matter I was talking abot since you said, that someone not noticing the difference between "virtual" and "real" had to reconsider his views on life

<blockquote><hr>


I get your point about the emotional. Trust me. I would choose as you would. But if its gone its gone, and people need to move on in life.


[/ QUOTE ]
Sure, but again I was not referring to anything you are talking about now.
All I meant, was that losing something is losing something, independent of what it is and the value is only emotional = virtual = subjective. So saying that you shouldn't get attached to pixels is all fine, but not acknowledging, that someone who does, is not anymore wrong than someone attached to real money.
And since money is earned by investing time (either than the reallife griefers who count in intrest rates) than there is no distinction between money and virtual items.

<blockquote><hr>


And just to drag reality into it, in UO the "teddy bear" is not yours in the first place. You are only renting it. If you are naive enough to get attached to something that you know will never be "yours" anyway...well then who is the naive one now?

[/ QUOTE ]
As you are renting everything in live. Even life itself is rented, or do you know how to insure it?

 

[AshOfCaine]

I always thought the concept of power scrolls only in Fel was much like the job/experience problem. Can't get a job without experience and can't get experience without a job. So, in order to do champ spawns now you need a char that has 120 scrolls already, but can't get them yourself. So, if you are lucky you can save up millions and finally find the one you need for sale, but more than likely the good ones are kept for the guild's use that did (or raided) the champ spawn.

I am all for giving scrolls in Tram.

 

[Fluffi]

How can you link PvP theft in Felucca with a request for Champs in Trammel?

Surely you're not suggesting that I shouldn't be able to steal from your champing character in Felucca, just because you are set-up for PvM rather than PvP?


(Sorry if I misinterpreted your response.)

 

[Der Rock]

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Sorry if I misinterpreted your response
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no problem

but pls also understand, that i have not that much time to
to illustrate it

 

[Arcus]

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As you are renting everything in live. Even life itself is rented, or do you know how to insure it?

[/ QUOTE ]

Ask anyone from the &lt;insert random deity based religion here&gt; religion. They seem to know.

 

[Guest]

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As you are renting everything in live. Even life itself is rented, or do you know how to insure it?

[/ QUOTE ]

Ask anyone from the &lt;insert random deity based religion here&gt; religion. They seem to know.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually, I think he was referring to the fact that every breath is a gift. Place value on it appropriately, because like all things in the creation, it is impermanent.

But we digress, we were talking about thievery in UO. Please discuss.

 

[Prudentis]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>


As you are renting everything in live. Even life itself is rented, or do you know how to insure it?

[/ QUOTE ]

Ask anyone from the &lt;insert random deity based religion here&gt; religion. They seem to know.

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly, now we are talking.
But I admit, that being under influence of Alc, my perspective changes a bit.
Knowledge is just subjective perspective. Ther is no knowledge other than believe, besides "I know that I do not know".
But let me end this here, because I think, that philosophic debates are not meant for a gameing forum.

And to Scoundrel. Pixels - Believe me, I am no more addicted to them than you are. Of course you didn't understand, what I was implying, but again, that is not your fault, probably just my inability to express my thoughts, which might be also influenced by the fact, that english is only my third language.
Let me just repeat in the simplest way I can muster:
You may do as you please as long as I have the same power to avoid you, as you heve to hurt me.
And, yes, I am a perfect 100% carebear. At times. It might surprise you, that other times I am not. Maybe if you would have the chance to meet me in my dojo.

And now again on thievery:
I don't really care, what is done to thievery as long as I have the ability to enjoy the game in it'S fullness without having to deal with it

 

[Guest]

I am not sure i have ever understood this to a full view, but people are in this game for a few reasons, the two i can think of are: of course, interaction with people from around the globe in real time, and a release, but the other is adventure, and though some prefer a computer controlled being that is predictable to provide their adventure, why is it that you cannot see fun in PvP? a mobile char that you cannot predict, nor dictate in anyway its movements, and reactions. if there were no hacking, or scripting, what would be your quarrel with a challenge to such extents? this world was not named OZ for a reason....
i personally do not enjoy a game where we are all sitting on rainbows, and the birds sing back to us, and every morning we wake up and it is colorfull and wonderfull.... no risk = a less gainfull reward.... no risk = no sense of achievement... no risk = no game.... so why hate on those wanting to expand their horizons into PVP? your game isnt so different, the only thing is, you prefer to be able to know the next move of your opponent... and to tell you the truth, i still watch the carebears with my daughter every now and then too

enjoy yours, but do not say that ours is anyhting the worse.. I'll have my Red Pill... then i will follow the rabbit down the hole

 

[vanecrox]

I don't know why you're complaining about item insurance Rico. On Siege we don't have item insurance (even though I know the real reason for complaining is because you're moonlighting another shard

). You want to steal blackrock? Leave that to the PVMers. All they're using the junk for is to blow up shadowlords. What do shadowlords give? Cursed robes. Need I say more?

 

[Surgeries]

<blockquote><hr>

Now substitute emotion with time, another virtual (as immaterial) value, and you might get my point.


[/ QUOTE ]

They will pick apart your point, and tell you that you need to re-evaluate your life...if you would take a bear over a sports car...that's my bet.

I get what you are saying...but Arcus, and the rest, will not, no matter what you say.

They never capitulate, not ever, even when presented with the most logical, and cogent points that can be made...not ever.

They are ALWAYS correct...and whomever disagrees...well...they just aren't.

<blockquote><hr>

I really hope you understand what I wrote above, because it is a valuable lesson

[/ QUOTE ]

They won't, Prudentis. I can assure you of it.

They will argue that allowing Thieves to steal from whomever they would like to adds real Value to UO.

What they mean to say is THEY like to steal from others, regardless of how that can affect others (as that is the OTHER person's problem, not theirs), and so...from THEIR perspective, being able to steal from others is really FUN...for them...and they really could care less if YOU don't like it.

But I am guessing you have figured that out already, or will real soon.

They miss that they CAN'T steal because it is so obnoxious to MOST other people, EXCEPT the small band of people that love to steal from others, and watch them writhe, as they show how smart/cunning/quick/responsive they are.

And chances are good, that they never, ever, ever will.

Not ever.

And it'ss OK.

It gives Rico a chance to say "la"...a lot more...la.

 

[Surgeries]

<blockquote><hr>

Link?...la

[/ QUOTE ]

You just need to log into UO...there's your la la la link.

The proof's in the MMORPG.

Most people do not, and did not, la la la like it.

Otherwise, you would la la la likely still have your thief...la.

 

[AshOfCaine]

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I get what you are saying...but Arcus, and the rest, will not, no matter what you say.

They never capitulate, not ever, even when presented with the most logical, and cogent points that can be made...not ever.

They are ALWAYS correct...and whomever disagrees...well...they just aren't.

[/ QUOTE ]

You need a ladder for that high horse?

Sounds to me like you are describing yourself in that last line there, as I have seen many thieves post compromising solutions on how everyone could play the way they want and attempt to cater to all, but all you have to say is you (the majority) don't like it so thieves shouldn't be allowed at all.

Will you take those blinders off your eyes and see the concept of thieving would be Fel based and thus no different than PKing, in that you accept the risk when you step foot on the soil. I don't like being PKed, so I am a trammie. You don't want to risk being stolen from, you got the same choice. You want to sit there and talk down to thieves about always being correct, when they are the ones that are being open minded. What YOU effectively are saying is we all must play the game the way you want.

So explain how again you look at it from another perspective since you put the thieves down for being one sided? Because I find no trace of it.

 

[imported_Chad Sexington]

<blockquote><hr>

It gives Rico a chance to say "la"...a lot more...la.

[/ QUOTE ]

Rico's been saying "la" for years.

 

[Guest]

Surgeries, please stop posting in threads if you have such an opinion against them unless they specifically call you out, or your wellbeing in your world out, also, if you were so well educated, and enlightened, you would understand that the whole purpose of communication is so that the people or person you are communicating with can understand what you are saying, tossing out words that the average person has to look up just to make yourself seem more educated or intelligent kind of contradicts your seemingly unspoken point....

there are reasons everyone plays their own playstyle, thief and fairy alike, btw, i would have to say you are leaning toward the "fairy" side with these posts...

 

[imported_Mr. Sly]

I think u guys are just waffles who dont want to get their "uber" gear stolen. Back in the day nobody carried the best they had because it would be taken. Everyones always talking stupid [censored] "oooo i want UO the way it used to be" now its pathetic to see u people on here pancakes about wanting old UO and then turning around and saying that thieves have no skill and should not be able to take the goods, or even play at all. Yea lets all steal [censored] for INSURANCE WTF thats the dumbest idea ive ever heard on this damn website. I think your all just way to overprotective of your pixle gear. SP FTW!!

 

[Guest]

I suppose that is un un-edited view... but sly, try to restrain yourself, this is the just something that they will use as fuel for their fire saying that everyone who comes to fel is just a hot tempered something or other... let them have their play style, no matter how we feel, just let them stay out of ours if they are that opinionated about it...

 

[Guest]

Aye, it's a simple choice to step through a Fel moongate or stay in Tram. No nasty thieves or PKs in Tram... well unless you guild one

You'd have thought that once players could leave Fel and never return, they'd stop trying to nerf players who live there. If you're not going to ever put yourself in the situation where you can be PKd or stolen from, you surely ought to keep out of Fel discussion threads. But no... the meddling and nerf requesting goes on.

Wenchy

 

[Fluffi]

*points to a quote on a previous page...*

I have yet to see a creditable thief advocating PvP stealing in Trammel, so let's disregard that facet completely.


Still they keep coming with their "I don't want to be griefed by thieves" nonsense.

Whilst I have no evidence for this; I would guess that the "plays on both facets"" population is at least equal to the "only play in Trammel" population; but the Trammel-only types are far more vociferous on the forums, thus giving them an inflated sense of their importance inUO.




In the light of recent posts concerning Felucca-only aspects of the game, I'd be interested to see a Stratics Plus user post a poll with the following options:

1) None of my characters ever visit Trammel. (I don't beleive you)
2) None of my characters ever visit Felucca.
3) I play both facets, but mainly in Trammel.
4) I play both facets, but mainly in Felucca.


My money would be wagered on the last two choices.

 

[vanecrox]

Sly, that's because the only people who really want an old-world shard are the ones playing SP, or playing on a free shard. The rest just use it as another reason to complain. If they really made an old world shard, it would end up being like Siege is today. People would log in with a newbie character, play for about a week and quit.

Honestly though, it's easier to steal now (stealth changes, ninjitsu, and powerscrolls) and it's more worth it to steal now that the game is item based.

I really don't see why people think thieves get a kick out of people's suffering. Maybe some do, but really it's just the thrill of stealing and an even greater thrill when the item is worth it. I have just as much animosity for a target, as they do for the monster they looted the item from in the first place.

 

[Guest]

An old school shard, supported by EA/Mythic would get many of the players running around on PRS and many who are playing other games that miss the UO content. For the first year, I'd bet it would be the most popular shard in the inventory...la

 

[imported_BlacK RaiN]

<blockquote><hr>

I'd bet it would be the most popular shard in the inventory...la

[/ QUOTE ]

As would many of us.