The Dragoon (Bushido Paladin V.2.3)

[Garrisons Rage]

Tuan,

I went back and looked over everything and I'm beginning to understand where personal trade-offs will come into play.

Here's a piece of Armor with Armor Refinement



I see where the +1 has been added to each of the 5 resists and where DCI was reduced by 5 points .....

I also looked at the total picture .... in this case DCI is not at cap .... 20 rather than 45




So this is a case where one needs to understand the pluses and minuses of each and decide for themselves which is more important.


Thanks to EVERYONE .... for all the help and explanations

 

[Tuan]

You need 75 "real". Then you apply the refinement and it raises the cap of the suit so it takes effect. If you are wearing a suit of all 70s real values, and you apply refinements, you'll simply be at all 70s, with a lower DCI cap.

 

[Duncan Drake]

Yes your dci cap will be reduced by 25 if you refine max possible in resistance. In pvm higher resists are imo better because its a constant dmg reduction and its useful against spells / breath attacks.

 

[Garrisons Rage]

Thanks Tuan and Duncun .... like I said .... I've got lots to learn

 

[Tuan]

Yes your dci cap will be reduced by 25 if you refine max possible in resistance. In pvm higher resists are imo better because its a constant dmg reduction and its useful against spells / breath attacks.

Against most of the biggest things, this isn't true. Almost everything hits harder in melee (and with only 1 or 2 damage types) than they cast, especially over the long haul of a fight to do 50k damage. Even the best casters in the game, like the Blackthorn Wizard Master ultimately will do more melee hits to you than spell damage hits, and most of the melee hits will be for more damage than most of the spells.

Luckily, this is not, in fact, a matter of opinion - it is a math question. With a good enough DB of the base melee damage, skills, and str/int of a mobs, I could model this.

 

[Garrisons Rage]

Lucked out this AM ..... picked up an Obi Bearing the Crest of Blackthorn ....

 

[Garrisons Rage]

Duncan,

I'm stumped again .....

Your Essence of Battle Ring ...... here's what I see ... and estimated imbuing weight

STR bonus +5 ... 68
DEX Bonus +8 ... 110
Faster Casting 1 ... 140
Faster Cast Recovery 3 ... 120
Damage Increase 30% ... 120

Totaling ... 558

I have an Essence of Battle and I'm seeing 500 max .... it's not Exceptional (not sure if you can make an exceptional one) and not sure what the cap ould be if you could ....

What am I lacking knowledge of this time?

 

[Duncan Drake]

the imbuing weight of damage increase on essence of battle is lower than on normal items.

 

[Duncan Drake]

Against most of the biggest things, this isn't true. Almost everything hits harder in melee (and with only 1 or 2 damage types) than they cast, especially over the long haul of a fight to do 50k damage. Even the best casters in the game, like the Blackthorn Wizard Master ultimately will do more melee hits to you than spell damage hits, and most of the melee hits will be for more damage than most of the spells.

Luckily, this is not, in fact, a matter of opinion - it is a math question. With a good enough DB of the base melee damage, skills, and str/int of a mobs, I could model this.

Personally i always prefer more steady dmg income with a higher dmg reduction over more random avoidance. And while being more resistant against spelldamage most creatures do (think of medusa or stygian dragon) is fine too. This way life leech and self healing is better predictable and dmg spikes get rarer that can instantly kill. (One melee hit + dragon breath e.g.)

Additionately you lose less stamina when getting weaker hits.

The lower the creatures weapon skill is the better refined resistances are. With the same weapon skill overall incoming dmg is about the same as with 45 dci. The higher the creatures weapon skill is the better more dci becomes but again this just reflects melee dmg. The curve in real combat would be more flat.

I made good experiences here. Total incoming dmg of an overall fight is just a theoretical discussion and obsolete. Practical means is surviving and that works best with minimizing the randomness of a fight and dci is such a randomness.

 

[Garrisons Rage]

Something is a miss over here ......

Here's my E_O_B after lowering STR from 7 to 5 and Raising DEX from 7 to 8 .....



And here's what I am seeing when I get ready to imbue faster casting on it .... I'll end up with 438 imbuing used .... 62 left .... and FCR 3 will need 120

 

[Ender]

Where do you get your refinements? I did t-maps for quite a while and had zero luck getting any platemail ones. Like, not even crap low level ones.

 

[Tuan]

I used to regularly loop through the felucca shops lockpicking the crates and looking for the refinements. This is MUCH faster than doing a Tmap or Champ or Peerless.

 

[Duncan Drake]

Something is a miss over here ......

Here's my E_O_B after lowering STR from 7 to 5 and Raising DEX from 7 to 8 .....

View attachment 43944

And here's what I am seeing when I get ready to imbue faster casting on it .... I'll end up with 438 imbuing used .... 62 left .... and FCR 3 will need 120

View attachment 43945

This is very strange. I did craft this item some time ago. I dont know if anything was changed. When i get home ill investigate further

 

[Duncan Drake]

I used to regularly loop through the felucca shops lockpicking the crates and looking for the refinements. This is MUCH faster than doing a Tmap or Champ or Peerless.

This

 

[Ender]

I used to regularly loop through the felucca shops lockpicking the crates and looking for the refinements. This is MUCH faster than doing a Tmap or Champ or Peerless.

Hmm, okay. I guess I have to train up a thief.

Do I have to empty crates for them to respawn or what, what's the deal?

 

[Duncan Drake]

Something is a miss over here ......

Here's my E_O_B after lowering STR from 7 to 5 and Raising DEX from 7 to 8 .....

View attachment 43944

And here's what I am seeing when I get ready to imbue faster casting on it .... I'll end up with 438 imbuing used .... 62 left .... and FCR 3 will need 120

View attachment 43945

ok I tested this and I have no idea why you get this result. Here is a picture of an essence Ive just crafted

 

[Garrisons Rage]

The one you have a screenshot of above only has STR = 1 ..... the one that's in the Dragoon thread has STR = 5 .... and you're at 498 .... pretty sure that's the difference

 

[Ender]

The one you have a screenshot of above only has STR = 1 ..... the one that's in the Dragoon thread has STR = 5 .... and you're at 498 .... pretty sure that's the difference

Look at the imbuing menu though. He has it selected to imbue 5 which would put it at 498/500.

 

[Duncan Drake]

Yes its the 5th property i want to imbue here. 5 str brings it to 498 weight as you can see on the screenshot.
Try it this way. Craft an esence and bring dx and str down to 1.
Then imbue fc1 and fcr3. After that imbue dex 8 and then 5 str

 

[Ender]

I gotta say I do really like the idea of this suit, I just have to find a suitable bracelet now. Ugh.

 

[Duncan Drake]

Yes unfortunately the bracelet is a bit problematic here.

 

[Garrisons Rage]

I'll try bringing them down to 1 ... add fc and fcr .... then bring them back up


thanks ..... its like working a rubic cube

 

[Garrisons Rage]

Doesn't work for me ...... I took str and dex down to 1 .... added FC 1 ..... then FCR 3 ..... when I try to raise dex to 8 (str is still 1) it would put me to 503 ....

I'll have to make another one and try it again ..... maybe somethings screwed up with this one ..... got to get some Captured Essence .... don't have any :-(

 

[Duncan Drake]

If you were on Europa i could give you one or craft the ring. I dont know if this is of any difference but try using the ec client.

 

[Tuan]

Hmm, okay. I guess I have to train up a thief.

Do I have to empty crates for them to respawn or what, what's the deal?

I typically just stole all the refinements, and the ones that were junk (bone armor etc) I tossed in the trash for points. If memory serves, they repop on about a 1 hour or 1.5 hour cycle. Travel light, even with 120 stealing you'll occasionally get guard whacked. You don't need 120 or even 100 lock picking. With 30 imbued onto jewelry you can get up to 70 natural skill in an hour or two. Same with stealing, if I recall.

 

[Ender]

Well I've got the lockpicking GMed already, it's just stealing that's only like 40 or 50.

 

[Duncan Drake]

If you can get your hands on shadowdancer leggins you get an additional 20 in stealing

 

[Garrisons Rage]

If you were on Europa i could give you one or craft the ring. I dont know if this is of any difference but try using the ec client.

Thanks for the offer ... I tried the EC this morning .... same deal. I'll see about getting some CE today and try it again. In the meantime I'm also looking around for Jewelry that might be for sale. Also ... the Bracelet looks like it's reforged ? (Animated Bracelet of Wizardy) .... another roadblock for me .... I can't find a tool that allows me to reforge a bracelet. Any thoughts or hints?

Thanks for all your time ... HEY looks like the thread has come alive

 

[Duncan Drake]

The bracelet is not reforged. Bought one with the right stats and imbued the Rest.

Bracelets cant be reforged.

Your questions are good. This way people that want to try it out too will have it easier when they read through this thread

 

[Garrisons Rage]

I picked up a Ring and Bracelet ..... gonna see what I can do with these ....





My plan is to look everything over and see what I need to tweak/adjust to fit the plan the best ... I'm beginning to understand the goals .... and how I may be able to move things around.

I for sure thank everyone for their help getting me this far .... I've learned allot about "building a character" .... I'm thinking this will be the easy part ... I still need to set up macros/hotkeys and actually learn how to do battle with what I've got (or should I say "getting")

 

[Garrisons Rage]

OK .... so here's where I am now ......

No Divine Fury, No Potions, and No Armor Refinements ..... and I have to work on Karma

And No Weapons in Hand .....











Any thoughts? Recommendations?

 

[Duncan Drake]

Looks quite good. Some suggestions:
1st. With df you have 25 ssi. Your stamina is 195. for a bladed staff more than enough. For a double axe youll swing at 1,5 if you drop under 180 stamina. I tried this some time ago and didnt like it. Hard hitters though having good stamina loss prevention through platemail really fast damage enough stamina. Because of that i go for 35% ssi. Swing speed drops at 150 stamina. This normally enough to always swing at max speed.

2nd. You need at least 30 di on jewelry for 100% di. (30 + 20 df + 50 weapon)

3rd. I guess you will drop dexterity for using greater agility pots and put the points into int?

 

[Garrisons Rage]

Looks quite good. Some suggestions:
1st. With df you have 25 ssi. Your stamina is 195. for a bladed staff more than enough. For a double axe youll swing at 1,5 if you drop under 180 stamina. I tried this some time ago and didnt like it. Hard hitters though having good stamina loss prevention through platemail really fast damage enough stamina. Because of that i go for 35% ssi. Swing speed drops at 150 stamina. This normally enough to always swing at max speed.

2nd. You need at least 30 di on jewelry for 100% di. (30 + 20 df + 50 weapon)

3rd. I guess you will drop dexterity for using greater agility pots and put the points into int?

Let me see if I get this right ....

#1 ... DF will give me 25 SSI .... without a Weapon I have 10 ... that puts me at 35 ... I should be able to put 30 on my weapon putting me at 65 ... does that work?

#2 ... I'm kinda screwed on this one ... I don't think I can do anything with the Bracelet/Ring ... I'll see what I can do .... maybe dropping some stuff and increasing others .... we'll see

#3 ... didn't think of that but good idea ... whats your thoughts

 

[Duncan Drake]

#1 no df increases ssi by 15 so you will have 25 with trade buff 30. You need 35 for what i said above so 5 more. Never ever imbue weapons with ssi because this will lower leech properties and you will miss an imbueing slot.

That means You Need 10 ssi on jewelry

#2 try vendor search on Atl are good offers sometimes

# i think 125 dex is enough unbuffed. Gonna check this

 

[Duncan Drake]

I have 120 str. 119 dex 54 int unbuffed,
Really depends on if you are useing resisting spells. if not a bit higher value in dex and str. would be appropriate

 

[Ender]

Personally I like to go Elf and leave intelligence at 10. I still have 70 mana I'm pretty sure, I'll have a look when I get home later today. My gear is basically what Duncan used before he added FC/FCR, though not quite as good. The only 10 SSI jewel I found with acceptable mods had EP so I'm just rocking 25 on each jewel instead of switching to one just to drink potions. I'll upgrade the jewelry eventually ideally.

 

[Garrisons Rage]

OK .... I had a 2nd Bracelet so I am comparing both of them .... here's what I got

 

[Garrisons Rage]

Also .... I got some Captured Essence .....



I f you do it on paper .... even along the way after each piece ..... it won't fit ..... but the last one makes it ..... VERY STRANGE

 

[Tuan]

You don't need 45 HCI w/o divine fury, because you get a buff from the spell. Some will tell you that 'having' to be in DF all the time is troublesome, but I don't find it to be an issue.

38 LMC is probably a little lower than you want, especially with only 64 mana.

150 DEX w/o pots is way overkill. As far as I know, there are only 2 or 3 mobs that have 200 Eval. At 200 Eval you'll get cursed for -28 stats (assuming you have 0 resist), so having 150 + 30 is overkill. Given that enchanted apples are cheap/easy to come by, I wouldn't worry too much about being cursed.

Same goes for STR. With STR you can get 30 from a pot and 5 from petals from rose of trinsic. You can tweak your +str and +hp gear accordingly.

I agree with Duncan. Unless you're running 3.5s weapons, you shouldn't even consider putting SSI on your weapon.

I personally have neither FC nor FCR, and I don't find this to be a particular impediment. This is even more so since they reverted much of the swing timer resetting issues that introduced a few fixes ago.

 

[Tabin]

Garrison, there are many ways to successfully play a dexxer. It really comes down to play style. Ask yourself how you want to play your dexxer and build it around that.

For example, I personally don't need to cast DF. Honestly, you can get 45% HCI, 35%DCI, 100% DI, 35% SSI all in your gear. Then you won't even have to spend precious mana casting the spell. You also won't need FC/FCR if you drop DF, which will allow you to max out the stats I just mentioned.

Do you want to be chugging potions to keep max STR/DEX all the time? I personally hate carrying around 15 greater strength potions, 15 greater heals, 15 greater agilities, 15 invis potions, 15 total refresh....so instead, I got near max STR and DEX in my gear. If I get cursed, I can care less. I'm still above 150 stamina and swinging at 1.25 per second. My max HP drops down to 140 instead of 150. Also consider what happens when you die and the boss loots your potions/apples...after you res, how are you going to swing at 1.25 per second without greater agilities/apples?

Also agree with Ender. Race change cost 3mil or do the quest? Go elf and get +20 mana, +5 energy cap, and free night sight. Run 125 str/125dex/10int. You should still have 70-80 mana that way. If you prefer humans just because you like the look, that's fine too. You'll need to make small sacrifices to make up for it.

In the end, as long as you have all the essential stats max (regardless of how you achieve it), you should be able to solo most of the PVM content in this game.
Finally, from looking at your spreadsheet, go with bracelet 2 and start killing stuff! It's honestly good enough.

 

[hirikawa]

Great stuff, reminds me a bit f my Paladin. Would love to see that temp in action someday on Europa.

 

[Garrisons Rage]

Tabin,

Thanks for your insight. I have never played where I've needed to stay in DF .... and even extensively use potions, petals, apples, etc ... whole new word to me ... I'm glad you brought up the point.

So I guess I'll ask ... how does one keep in Divine Fury? Do I need to press a key every so many seconds? Do I have a macro that casts DF ..... waits just short of it wearing out, and casts it again .... many of these "loops of sorts" in a macro? The potions, petals,apples, etc I think I get ..... maybe go to a one handed weapon if needed .... munch/use, go back to your two handed weapon ....

 

[Garrisons Rage]

Did a couple of Tweaks this AM .... became an Elf .... and tweaked two pieces of Armor ... here we are now

 

[Duncan Drake]

ok some things have to be clarified:

1st: you dont need to always keep the greater agility and str buff up. Only use it against bosses. Normal mobs and spawn dont really dmg your stamina so swing at max speed even without potions. And all leech abilities are enough.

2nd: i dont use apples. For fights without 120 resist I use the protection spell and remove curse if needed and thats the next thing. Fc2/fcr6 is perfect for spell casting while fighting. A fast close wounds spell or cleanse by fire or remove curse is very handy.

3rd: As a human you have joat and can carry more, i like this better than being an elf

4th: divine fury boosts your stats really good. With max karma the dzration 23 sek. So no need spamming. Just recast it when the duration ends, fc2fcr6 helps here as well.

5th: @Tabin
This thread is about the bushido paladin (dragoon) build. This build uses divine fury with 120 chivalry. If it is removed the whole idea of this template is screwed up. Sure we can remove this and that and say its better playing a mage or sth. Talking about dexxers or other templates in general should be done in another thread though. The df spell is extremely powerful imo and should not be underrated and its a vital part of the bushido paladin build.

And some things are wrong. Its not needed to carry so many pots. I never have more then 15 ag. 15 str pots with me. No apples, healing pots, invis pots or whatever except i want to do a special boss where its needed. But there are not many.

And as mentioned above you swing at max speed even without the pots. So no problem getting back to your corpse if you died. The pots just boost you up so you get more hp and more stamina for this buffer.

 

[Garrisons Rage]

Thanks Duncan ....

Changing back and forth between Elf and Human is a piece of cake .... been playing long enough to have a supply of Race Change Tokens .... I did notice that I typo'ed my weight numbers ... it did drop 60 stone. I did like the extra 20 Mana

That sounds fine on using DF .... that isn't a biggy .... the rest I can learn about as I go ..... I have 120 Resist on a Soul Stone anyway ... can swap that in/out any time.

Two things on my short list .... Trade Deal to get the extra 5% SSI .... and I've got to make my weapons.

OH YEAH ...... KARMA

 

[Duncan Drake]

Isnt there a quest to revert from elf to human? I dont think you need a race change token.

The extra carrying capacity is useful. You will carry many weapons and still want to loot. With being human i still can carry 35 k gold before i have to use a bag of sending.

And with joat having at least 20 skill points in all skills boosts your dmg a bit if you use resisting spells and no anatomy. And hey 20 lumberj for those double axes.

 

[Tabin]

Why do you think human JOAT is better than being an elf? Just curious. The only benefit I see is mana regen from focus and 20 LJ which adds 1dmg or 2 if you DS. Mana regen isn't necessary when you're leeching so much from your weapon. ANY spell that requires 20 skill can be cast as an elf. Is there even a spell worth casting on a dexxer that isn't bushido/chiv?

As a human, you need to sacrifice -5 max defense chance inc just to get energy cap to 75. Or you can run 80 energy resist, which is what you'll want against the hardest hitting boss in roof, Virtubane. You also need an additional +20 mana (that's 2.5 imbue slots in your armor). You also will need night sight earrings, which could be earrings of protection...that's a free 2% in any resist. You also get access to both human and elf armor.

The difference between two races isn't huge and you can get away with being anything you like, but my opinion is that elf is slightly better than humans. I am open to hearing why I may be wrong though.

 

[Duncan Drake]

I didnt and dont say you are wrong here. I said i like being human better because of the previous mentioned reasons, not more and not less.

 

[Garrisons Rage]

Isnt there a quest to revert from elf to human? I don't think you need a race change token.

Yup ... there is a quest .... to go each way .... I just happen to have a bunch of Tokens

 

[Garrisons Rage]

Hey Duncan ....

I'm playing with a Bladed Staff .... made a bunch ... and played with some Runic Hammers .... only had lower end ... DC, Shad, Copper, Bronze, and Golden.

I see that I can imbue HLL to 75 ... HLA to 50 ... DI to 50 ... HSL to 50 ... BUT HML only to 75 ... so HML is the guy that I get with ReForging I'm assuming.

I am using Powerful and Not Powerful, Grand. Inspired and Vampiric / of the Vampire ..... haven't come close with the hammers that I have. Is it just a matter of burning more hammers until I hit it or do I need a specific hammer?