How many subscribers has EA lost over the years by allowing griefing?

[canary]

Maybe, but we're talking about griefing, not third party programs.

OK, I can honestly say I've never met anyone who quit post Tram over griefing.

 

[Arcus]

At least ABC used a real word and not some teeny bopper wording like leet or uber, or whatever you gimps say.

So you use "gimp" but make fun of troll, leet and uber? Interesting...

Kinda like making fun of crack and coke addicts whilst shooting heroin.

 

[phantus]

At least ABC used a real word and not some teeny bopper wording like leet or uber, or whatever you gimps say.

So you use "gimp" but make fun of troll, leet and uber? Interesting...

Kinda like making fun of crack and coke addicts whilst shooting heroin.

It's perfectly ok. Gimp was in pulp fiction and you are cool if you liked that movie.

 

[phantus]

Maybe, but we're talking about griefing, not third party programs.

OK, I can honestly say I've never met anyone who quit post Tram over griefing.

That makes no sense at all. It's easier to grief post tram than it was pre tram.

 

[Arcus]

It's perfectly ok. Gimp was in pulp fiction and you are cool if you liked that movie.

I met Travolta on a plane once and we talked about Pulp Fiction. What does that get me?

 

[Jester_GL]

This is about terrorism. The root of terrorism is a desire to control others. It comes from feeling powerless.

"Terrorism is the systematic use of terror especially as a means of coercion"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism

You wouldnt by chance be a neo-conservative would you? Because you sure like to throw out 25 cent words without truly understanding the meaning and then providing a definition that suits your purposes.

Griefing is part and parcel of UO and in fact I'd go so far as to say 3 out of 4 players of this game have at some point griefed another ingame - and enjoyed it. The ability to do what you wish, when you wish with minimal GM/EM intervention is one of the greatest things about this game. That's what playing a sandbox style game is all about - and if you dislike that, you probably would be better off playing WoW, DAOC or whatever linear, flat-line leveling game you choose, as would any others that feel that way.

Quit trying to bend a situation to fit your specific desires. THAT is what has been systematically ruining this game since the spring of 2000.

 

[Lord Chaos]

That makes no sense at all. It's easier to grief post tram than it was pre tram.

lol, let me guess, another classic shard plug.

 

[Evlar]

It's perfectly ok. Gimp was in pulp fiction and you are cool if you liked that movie.

I met Travolta on a plane once and we talked about Pulp Fiction. What does that get me?

Have a lollypop!

 

[Lady Storm]

ACB1961 you are correct, the few years Orgin owned UO it was not tollerated. And here is the But...
EA bought out Origin and quickly replaced every DEV they could get away with dumping, and replacing the CS with their own. After that the lead Sunsword ( I think that was his call handle) I think it was revamped the whole thing and suddenly griefing was "OK". Beleave you me it was not Popular with many. So yes you can with a clear mind say: "Griefing has helped kill off the population in UO ".

 

[Evlar]

That makes no sense at all. It's easier to grief post tram than it was pre tram.

lol, let me guess, another classic shard plug.

Actually, I would suggest not. But there is a good and valid point to what phantus said.

Players in pre-Tram days, Fel or on Siege ruleset, could and can take the griefers to task. They could "punish" the griefers themselves, or resolve issues.

What happens now in Trammel when a player encounters a griefer? What can they do themselves, apart from walking away? Call a GM report the griefer, then wait in a queue for countless hours for a canned response?

Really, is it any wonder at all why griefing upsets players now, as much as it does? Not in the slightest, because there's very little that they can do about it themselves. Hence the calls for the developers to do something about it for them.

 

[Trebr Drab]

That makes no sense at all. It's easier to grief post tram than it was pre tram.

lol, let me guess, another classic shard plug.

Actually, I would suggest not. But there is a good and valid point to what phantus said.

Players in pre-Tram days, Fel or on Siege ruleset, could and can take the griefers to task. They could "punish" the griefers themselves, or resolve issues.

What happens now in Trammel when a player encounters a griefer? What can they do themselves, apart from walking away? Call a GM report the griefer, then wait in a queue for countless hours for a canned response?

Really, is it any wonder at all why griefing upsets players now, as much as it does? Not in the slightest, because there's very little that they can do about it themselves. Hence the calls for the developers to do something about it for them.

I agree with this. But there's an issue even with that. The griefed player had better be able to handle the griefer. Even in the old days, the griefer often did it to get the other player(s) to attack them, knowing that they had the better stats, equipment, template, whatever.

 

[Taylor]

Maybe, but we're talking about griefing, not third party programs.

OK, I can honestly say I've never met anyone who quit post Tram over griefing.

Canary, meet Tina:

I'm doing something about it. Finally making good on all my idle threats over the years to quit. It's cleaning and packing time. Then it will be time to transfer houses to guild mates that want them. The ones they don't want...I guess the IDOCers can locate and sit and wonder for months whether or not I left anything worthwhile in them. Next comes uninstallation time and some long-awaited free hard drive space and time, oh so much time, to spend on people and other things I never seem to get around to because of UO. And after that it will be time for big smiles when I look at my bank account statements and see all the money still sitting there because it is no longer being used to subsidize the development of game content that caters to pathological losers who glory in their ability to control and cause distress to other people with no consequences whatsoever.

EA, you finally did it. You got my attention in a big way this time. In all sincerity, thank you, Mark, for doing what no one else had managed to do yet. Don't know if I'm making a mistake in shutting things down this way versus just walking away, but my heart is telling me it will be easier and less tempting to return. No panic attacks in two months that prompt me to reinstall and log on again because I somehow left behind some kind of "unfinished business" or didn't save something I might foolishly want later. I will be able to write the end of the chapter without bitterness or a heavy heart, close the book, set it on the shelf, and walk away.

 

[Percivalgoh]

Canary, meet Tina:

Now that's sad considering Mark was saying that the spawn will stay untill it seems that everyone who wants one has one.

 

[Taylor]

Now that's sad considering Mark was saying that the spawn will stay untill it seems that everyone who wants one has one.

Read the post. She refers to years of grievances. It's bigger than bane dragons.

 

[olduofan]

Now that's sad considering Mark was saying that the spawn will stay untill it seems that everyone who wants one has one.

I think her main reason was because make and some of the others attitude towards grief-in other players and how the seem to keep rewarding those that do and tell use by being good their is know reward and the game seems to be heading in wrong direction more ever before.

they are so out of touch with the players at this point

 

[LordDrago]

I will have to say that on my shard, I have nopt seen this. As a matter of fact, when I went down to tame a bane dragon, someone already there was taming one (looking fro another, and he tamed one for me (would have taken me much longer given our skill differences). There were also other people there helping out with the healing, curing, etc.

 

[Taylor]

I will have to say that on my shard, I have nopt seen this. As a matter of fact, when I went down to tame a bane dragon, someone already there was taming one (looking fro another, and he tamed one for me (would have taken me much longer given our skill differences). There were also other people there helping out with the healing, curing, etc.

Not sure what this has to do with the OP, but I'm happy to hear that you haven't experienced what many of us have.

 

[Quenchant]

While not quite on topic as far as how people have left cause of griefing, the number of threads on the topic got me thinking. A solution was suggested by the best smashing watermelon comic out there .... Gallagher.

His solution was aimed as a remedy for inconsiderate drivers. It works like this. A guy cuts you off in traffic, you pull out you dart gun and fire at his vehicle. The dart sticks to the car and streams a flag that says "Ass Hat". The effect of this is 2 fold, other folks get to know this guy is an ass hat and they can watch out for him and if he gets enough darts on his car, the police just pull him over and give him a ticket for being an ass.

While that wouldn't work in real life, everyone would want to do that to the person that cut them off in traffic. We all want our own little personal justice against the folks that are asses and are doing it just because they can.

If we were to apply this to UO, you just page on the guy for disrupting game play. After enough pages, the GM's would get a little red bleeping light on their monitor and they could come investigate. Just sit in the shadows and watch the guy being an ass. After the GM has determined that he is indeed disrupting game play, he picks him up by the scruff of his neck and deposits him in an Inn somewhere on a different sub server and breaks his connection to the game. No ban, no days off for the first offense.

I know this wouldn't work in UO, as it would require better response from GM's than I have seen in the past, but I can always dream my own little way to feel justice was being done to the greifer.

Q

 

[Taylor]

I hear ya, Envi.

 

[Percivalgoh]

Read the post. She refers to years of grievances. It's bigger than bane dragons.

In which case it's barely related to the OP.

 

[Taylor]

Read the post. She refers to years of grievances. It's bigger than bane dragons.

In which case it's barely related to the OP.

Which would be relevant, if she had posted here. She didn't. Let me break it down for you:

1. Canary says that he has never met anyone who has left UO due to griefing.
2. Tina leaves UO due to griefing - not only bane dragon griefing, but years of griefing.
3. I introduce Canary to Tina by re-posting her post.

 

[LordDrago]

I will have to say that on my shard, I have nopt seen this. As a matter of fact, when I went down to tame a bane dragon, someone already there was taming one (looking fro another, and he tamed one for me (would have taken me much longer given our skill differences). There were also other people there helping out with the healing, curing, etc.

Not sure what this has to do with the OP, but I'm happy to hear that you haven't experienced what many of us have.

Just thinking that it might be interested to see how meany people left uo for griefing on which shard? It seems to me that some shards may have a higher proportion of griefing than others. Perhaps trying other shards instead of full out quitting may be an option for people (although advertising lack of griefing on shards would probably lead to an increase in griefing to that shard as the griefers would probably transfer over as well)

 

[LordDrago]

Canary, meet Tina:

OP: I guess so far, the answer is 1!



Although my answer is 84,342 people have quit specifically due to grieving.

Am I closest? Do I win a prize?

 

[Evlar]

Well, griefers need an audience right?

Some shards, the known griefers are ignored to the extent of solitude. One they realise nobody is taking notice of them, they soon get bored.

Now I would much rather there be some "official" solution, or some form of true player "justice", such as would be exacted in Fel or Siege, but if you don't let them get a rise out of you, you're the winner, not them.

The more people interact with them, the more they'll grief. Try to blank them out as if they don't exist. Difficult, I know sometimes, but giving them your precious time and response, gives them all the more fuel to continue their "jollies" at your expense.

Let's face it, the GM support isn't there any more, so that's not the solution. I remember often, many moons ago, when GM's would warn players quite readily.

 

[Percivalgoh]

Which would be relevant, if she had posted here. She didn't. Let me break it down for you:

1. Canary says that he has never met anyone who has left UO due to griefing.
2. Tina leaves UO due to griefing - not only bane dragon griefing, but years of griefing.
3. I introduce Canary to Tina by re-posting her post.

Ok thanks..got it

 

[Aristillus]

Well, griefers need an audience right?

Some shards, the known griefers are ignored to the extent of solitude. One they realise nobody is taking notice of them, they soon get bored.

Now I would much rather there be some "official" solution, or some form of true player "justice", such as would be exacted in Fel or Siege, but if you don't let them get a rise out of you, you're the winner, not them.

The more people interact with them, the more they'll grief. Try to blank them out as if they don't exist. Difficult, I know sometimes, but giving them your precious time and response, gives them all the more fuel to continue their "jollies" at your expense.

Let's face it, the GM support isn't there any more, so that's not the solution. I remember often, many moons ago, when GM's would warn players quite readily.

I agree griefers do need an audience. lot's of people will say just ignore them, or leave. But if you are there for an event and you end up leaving because of griefers, then how is that winning?

Isn't it a bit ridiculous that players have to deal with people causing problems at EA santioned events like this current event, and those ran by EM's because even EA staff wont intervene?

What I think some players have decided is that the griefers numbers are large enough that you can't just ignore them, and the best option is to leave....But not just in game, they are leaving the game itself.

 

[Cogniac]

This thread blows my mind. It is a troll about trolling. It is a meta-troll. It is a Möbius strip of trolling. It is an HD trollavision with troll in troll technology. Kudos to all involved.

Some notes on specific points:

...(time before anyone under 18 couldnt play uo legaly)...

ACB1961 you are correct, the few years Orgin owned UO it was not tollerated. And here is the But...
EA bought out Origin and quickly replaced every DEV they could get away with dumping, and replacing the CS with their own. After that the lead Sunsword ( I think that was his call handle) I think it was revamped the whole thing and suddenly griefing was "OK". Beleave you me it was not Popular with many. So yes you can with a clear mind say: "Griefing has helped kill off the population in UO ".

None of this is in any way true or accurate.

...His solution was aimed as a remedy for inconsiderate drivers. It works like this. A guy cuts you off in traffic, you pull out you dart gun and fire at his vehicle. The dart sticks to the car and streams a flag that says "Ass Hat". The effect of this is 2 fold, other folks get to know this guy is an ass hat and they can watch out for him and if he gets enough darts on his car, the police just pull him over and give him a ticket for being an ass...

This system is incredibly easy to troll. I just go out on the roads and shoot dozens of darts at every car I see, no matter what. Now the real asshats are hidden amongst the non-asshats, and everyone gets tickets. Troll: Successful.

 

[HD2300]

This is the 2nd event in a row where there has been griefing.

The first event the griefing was by design.
This 2nd event I dont believe and hope it wasnt by design.

There is a huge outcry in protest in both events.

Surely this shows, is it more ideal to let the carebears play seperately on their own shards, and let those that prefer a non-consequence world can play seperately on their own shards.