The value of PvP gear on Siege

[FrejaSP]

This Sundays events had been great for the shard. They gav new and returning PvP'ers a chance test their skills and their gear. It was fun as long it last. I hope we can bring it back.

A good suit is very expensive here or it take very long time to gathering the resources. What is the value of a good suit? 1 mill? 2 mill? or more? We never see them on the vendors as the PvP'ers can't afford it, the PvP'ers are making their own suits but even then the resources or time to gathering them way to expensive.

What would a good suit cost in insurance if you die on normal shards? I'm sure less than the buy back prices we had seen this last week. I really don't want Item Insurance but I also know, PvP will die again, and with no PvP, the shard will die.

What can we as player do until @Mesanna get time to help us making the cost of suits pay able and the time to get the resources doable. Here I also ask Virem and Hey Arnold. How do we keep the returning PvP'ers we had seen the last month? They can't afford paying several mills a week to PvP, same with new PvP'ers, if they have to do PvM for hours/days to PvP 5 min, then it's not fun and they will give up.

Be nice and positive in this thread and lets find a way to balance it

 

[-Hey Arnold-]

The main problem is the population is so low there are no vendors/people farming ingredients/gear. Increasing the population i think should be the #1 priority of this server.
I know people wont like it but i think if they got rid of the rot gain system every one would have a character on siege..its 2016 no one wants to spend 50 hours training one skill when they could train a full char in 24 hours. Removing this does not hurt or ruin the cool style of siege imo and would increase the population dramatically. That would be the best change to come to siege imo...in the mean time i think maybe lowering the value of black thorn artifacts needed to get a item might help...but then that makes it so there is only 1 good spot to farm which is not good so im not sure.

 

[virem]

The ROT system is silly. Its an extra barrier of entry to the shard that isn't at all needed. Having one character, no transfers, and difficultly getting power scrolls and soulstones is enough.

 

[virem]

Also... the economy on Siege is horrible.

 

[virem]

Can we get a Siege focus group? I think most people want some sort of change. This shard just needs a bunch of small changes, it could easily be the best shard in the game. @Mesanna @Kyronix @Bleak

 

[FrejaSP]

I don't think RoT is the biggest problem, the daily cap is gone and a new player can train all skills on same time. Where I see a problem is, when a trained char choose to put some skills on a soulstone and train a few new skills. With only one char, you will be weak until you are done training the skills. With 2 char slots, you could have one char ready to play, while training the other when no actions was going on.

We had a periode many years ago, without RoT and with powerhour. You could build a char in 7 days and start to PvP, that was really nasty as some new players came with all the red vs blue hate from Prodo shards and did not have time to learn a little about the Siege community before they was ready to kill.

I also agree with Hey Arnold, that one hotspot, you would have to go to, to farm items would be bad unless you could gain the items on other ways too or other items/resources, that also would let you build a good suits.

A suit like mine, may not be the most powerful, still take a lot time or gold to get the resources for it.

First I need 5x70 resist, that take time, gems and use a imbuing slot on each piece.
- 15% extra basis resist on both crafted and looted (new loot) items would make it much easier to put a 5x70 suit together from loot or crafted items or a mix

Then I want LMC, that was a problem before new loot but not now, relic is very easy to get and you only need 22 relic and gems for a suit unless want 8 LMC on 5 pieces, then you need 25 relic, gems and 50 Essence of order and the Essence can be a problem as they still are expensive.
- Increase resource drop 2-3x for all resources would help and drop vendor fee for items below 100k and drop 3x NPC prices in town to make gems cheaper to buy.

Next thing I could want, would be some stats increase or regeneration Here I will need Luminescent fungi or Seed of Renewal to max it out.
- Luminescent fungi is a problem because no one need wood at the moment, so very few lumbers and the SoR is so slow to grow and I fear very slow to farm too. I would like to see a way better drop of it from Cavern of the Discarded Mini-Champ.

Now Jevelry and weapon too need lots of Essences and other expensive imbuing resources.

Now I could use reforging for my suits, that works for metal and somewhat for tailoring but runic saw and fletching tools are a pain to get. There are no runic tinker tools
With metal armor, my 60+ hammer do help, when enhancing it after but with tailoring, carpentry and fletching, it will mostly break unless I buy this forged tools.

I really don't mind looting if players easier could replace it. I was looking at the cost of my suit and Virem is right, the resources are worth way more than 1 mill, more likely 3-4 mill, so if I should sell suits like that, it would cost 3-5 mills, depending off it I buy my resources or get them myself. That's a lot for a suit you can lose in a 5 min fight.

So
- do away with 3x prices. Gems to normal shards price and better drop of gem from spawn
- Less vendor fee, also for stall vendors
- Better drop of all imbuing resources
- 15% more basis resist on crafted and new loot items
- Better drop of runic tools in heartwood
- Better drop of artifacts, all kind except deco
- 2 char slots
- Maybe half the time between RoT gain

That's what I ask for

 

[Eärendil]

Excellent suggestions, Freja. And to be honest: It cannot be in one´s interest to lure in "quick-and-dirty-"-PVPers or PKs. Siege should be different and I don´t think the economy here is bad. The opposite is true: Siege is the ONLY shard left with a reasonable economy.

Besides: Please no focus group with notorious PKs only ;-)

 

[Max Blackoak]

Please no focus group with notorious PKs only ;-)

No reason to worry. Just look at the last expansion we got, ToL. There were lots of Siege folks on the focus group and still we got an entire encounter that is instanced!!! I mean seriously? Instanced encounters on the shard that is supposedly riskier than others? Not only did they make the whole thing instanced, they also added an ankh right in front of shadowguard so that IF you ever get killed there you will be back to life in no time and you can simply jump to one of the encounters to be out of harms way.
If any serious PK would have had any say in this then this would have been changed. Make it accessable with keys like doom or the peerless but don't make it instanced. That being said I believe this is the least problem Siege has at the moment...

To get back on topic with Frejas suggestions: I support all of her ideas, except the second char slot. Keep it at one char per account.

 

[Eärendil]

Yea, excellent: I was making some jewelry with FC 1, HCI and DCI and Skills. Imagine, losing - let´s say - 3-4 of these sets due to looting within one night, 2-3 days, even one week... In the current situation, it is really hard to replace them because of the material costs and the droprate. Not to mention the looooooong way to get imbuing to 120. I mean: It is nice to get that far only with unraveling, way cheaper than on prodo-shards. But it takes weeks, because you have to gather heaps of loot for unraveling...

Freja´s suggestions are very convincing, and I would join you in one point: I would like to keep the one-char-rule...

 

[Uvtha]

But it takes weeks, because you have to gather heaps of loot for unraveling...

Just imbue luck, it's faster/easier.

 

[Eärendil]

...but more expensive ;-)

 

[FrejaSP]

Besides: Please no focus group with notorious PKs only ;-)

The word Focus group do sounds like the people invited was asked about what changes to make, that was not the case, Beta tester had been a better word as they already had decided what to make. I don't know about the focus group for VvV but guess they just was Beta tester too.

 

[virem]

the VvV focus group had more impact on what was implemented than the ToL group.

 

[La Z Susan]

For some people a second character slot would be their ideal farmer/crafter character rather than second PK or PvM toon. Personally I don't want to buy or pay for an account to purely only farm or craft with because that's not my desired playing. Would it help the economy if we did have more farmers and crafters though? Certainly but it wont happen from needing even more seperate accounts... Considering you can only play one at a time too unless you script or bot

 

[FrejaSP]

I can afford several accounts but not all can, I believe 2 char slots would be fair. I have 6 active accounts but do only use 4 of the chars, the 2 last are played of a friend who else would not have the money to play at the moment. I mostly use them for house holders. My friend had done a nice job train the skills on them I do need so I may use them a little more in the future.
I really can't see how 2 char slots would be bad, I would not make more chars unless I needed to train new skills for soulstones but they would be great for players who can't afford 2 account.

 

[SlobberKnocker]

I wouldnt mind a second char slot. i can tell you that since I've started actively playing here again I've dropped 50 bucks alone in soulstones.

i really dont think crafting a suit like I would on a prodo shard is worth it here as I've been in guilds with guys who spent literally weeks crafting and farming to find the exact right piece to make a build work. to do that here and walk out the door and lose it in the first spawn just makes it seem like the juice isn't worth the squeeze.

 

[Troll The T Hunter]

"wants to spend 50 hours training one skill when they could train a full char in 24 hours."

why stop there why not just log on with a fully trained character?

 

[virem]

The game is 18 years old the time it takes to train skills is 100% irrelevant.

 

[virem]

In fact, people should be offered free one way transfer to siege with a naked character.

 

[SlobberKnocker]

i dont mind the time to train here.

i'm all for the gathering of ingredients in less time however. would make equipping yourself much easier.

 

[La Z Susan]

What about something crazy like a new skill? "Forgery: Allows the skilled craftsman to create an identical version of a current item at a discounted rate"

 

[La Z Susan]

And just put some level of diminishing retuens on the original and forged items cant be used to create equals

 

[HoldenCaulfield]

I run quite a few vendors and the fees don't bother me. What do people sell that the fees are a source of problem? I find most vendors to be empty and not sitting with goods.

I also don't get the gem argument, I sell them on a vendor stall in NM and no one ever buys them. Maybe my prices on them are too high, I'll have to check what they sell for on prodo. But, kill solens and do the translocation quest, especially if you are a new player, it is a good source of income. I've never had trouble selling the powder at 1k per charge and you get 100 for the quest and tons of gems from the solens you kill. In fact, that is the first vendor I ever ran back at Patty Pickaxe's old place.

IMHO, I also don't believe gear is an issue. Suits with necessities are very easy to make and you can do all the hunting and whatnot with them. You can even PvP in them, sure might have difficulty against the people with amazing suits, but sometimes you get lucky and kill them and perhaps get their suit for the few junky suits you lost along the way. Rarely is a fight ever 1 v 1 in matching gear anyways. Just go out, do what you enjoy, if you get a good suit piece, keep it and carry on. I personally like that on Siege, the average gear is not completely worthless.

It'd be nice to see some requests that aren't just make this or that easier.

 

[HoldenCaulfield]

I logged into Catskills Production to see gem prices and compared to mine, I see I was slightly off on some, but on others was very close. Anyways, I set all my prices to exactly what they are on Catskills (Luna Jewel Vendor).

Star Sapphire: 134gp
Emerald: 112gp
Sapphire: 130gp (I don't have a good supply of these, see note below)
Ruby: 108gp
Citrine: 116gp
Amethyst: 108gp
Tourmaline: 100gp
Amber: 95gp
Diamond: 228gp

Stall E-2: I stocked 500 or more of each gem *except for Sapphire

There is a bug with gem carts in which they don't ever give Sapphires. I've submitted a bug report several times and it never gets fixed. Seems so easy to add that to an array or whatever is driving the gem carts . They give all the other little gems, including star sapphires, but never the regular sapphires.

Curious to see if my vendor sells these gems!

Edit: Corrected spelling errors and added prices

 

[FrejaSP]

In fact, people should be offered free one way transfer to siege with a naked character.

I could accept that.

 

[FrejaSP]

Stall E-2: I stocked 500 or more of each gem *except for Sapphire

Thanks, did not check your vendor, but good to know.

If we got fel bonus to all resources including gems and resources on other facets I believe it would be great.

The problem with the stall vendors is, they do not show in vendor search.

 

[kelmo]

I could accept that.

*shakes head*

 

[Drakelord]

In fact, people should be offered free one way transfer to siege with a naked character.

disagree.

 

[Arradin]

No, making it easier to gain skill is not the answer.

 

[virem]

Siege is the only shard in the game that offers something different, and an old pvp experience. The RoT system is accomplishing nothing except keeping old and production shard players away.

 

[Eärendil]

I logged into Catskills Production to see gem prices and compared to mine, I see I was slightly off on some, but on others was very close. Anyways, I set all my prices to exactly what they are on Catskills (Luna Jewel Vendor).

Star Sapphire: 134gp
Emerald: 112gp
Sapphire: 130gp (I don't have a good supply of these, see note below)
Ruby: 108gp
Citrine: 116gp
Amethyst: 108gp
Tourmaline: 100gp
Amber: 95gp
Diamond: 228gp

Stall E-2: I stocked 500 or more of each gem *except for Sapphire

There is a bug with gem carts in which they don't ever give Sapphires. I've submitted a bug report several times and it never gets fixed. Seems so easy to add that to an array or whatever is driving the gem carts . They give all the other little gems, including star sapphires, but never the regular sapphires.

Curious to see if my vendor sells these gems!

Edit: Corrected spelling errors and added prices

Wanted to buy your gems, but somebody was faster... :-(

 

[Mr. Jamison]

Wanted to buy your gems, but somebody was faster... :-(

Me!!!!

 

[Tanivar]

The RoT system is accomplishing nothing except keeping old and production shard players away.

Play the game and RoT is no problem. Your skills gain as you play.

 

[virem]

No percent of the population of this game outside of Siege are killing monsters to gain skill.

 

[Tanivar]

No percent of the population of this game outside is siege are killing monsters to gain skill.

We PvMers must not exist then.

 

[Eärendil]

I

No percent of the population of this game outside is siege are killing monsters to gain skill.

I do

 

[FrejaSP]

Siege offer more than just PvP, just like in old UO, we had to live together and find a way to co-exist. That's a part of what make Siege special.

 

[-Hey Arnold-]

Its funny people cry about the population of siege and how its low and nothing is for sale then when people offer ideas to 100% increase the population by a lot the same 4-5 people who i never even see on siege cry about changes like every thing is ok on the server lol.

 

[Arradin]

Its funny people cry about the population of siege and how its low and nothing is for sale then when people offer ideas to 100% increase the population by a lot the same 4-5 people who i never even see on siege cry about changes like every thing is ok on the server lol.

Its funny how you Think that rot is the barrier which prevents people from playing here.

 

[-Hey Arnold-]

Its funny how you Think that rot is the barrier which prevents people from playing here.

Sorry sir i dont think it is...i know it is

 

[FrejaSP]

But I had seen several first give up after they are done training and start to PvP. The problem with gear is what make them give up.

 

[GarthGrey]

Advertising that you have a boat load of gems for sale at what appeared to be a good fair price, and then them all getting bought up by one person, does not a Good Economy make. LOL Although I'm sure Mr Jamison there is happy

 

[FrejaSP]

I brought half of them

 

[FrejaSP]

But was not near enough for my need, so I believe I did buy for more than 7 mils of gem from NPC, no wonder I feel poor.

 

[HoldenCaulfield]

Advertising that you have a boat load of gems for sale at what appeared to be a good fair price, and then them all getting bought up by one person, does not a Good Economy make. LOL Although I'm sure Mr Jamison there is happy

Haha yes before this post they had sat on there for over a month. In fact I turned all my gem carts to ore carts my sales were so bad. Will have to reverse that now.

Put another 1k of each on there before bed last night and sold out again!

So I guess there is a huge demand for gems and I just had no/bad marketing until now. But at this rate I will run out quickly so definitely need other sources of supply.

P.S. I will stock another 1k of each (except Sapphire) tonight.

 

[virem]

There is a problem with gear, population, and RoT. All of which need to be addressed. The thing is, RoT is the activity keeping players from wanting to even try Siege, and it's literally there for no reason at all. No one who still plays UO needs to spend 100 hours with a sword in a dungeon training to learn anything. RoT absolutely 100% pointless, it doesn't make the game harder, or better, or more interesting. It just makes it annoying.

Maybe this makes sense 16 years ago when the shard was made, but now it's just stupid.

In fact, they added in stuff (sots, alacrities, soul stones) to make training take LESS time because they realized that the point of UO, regardless of if you kill monsters or players, isn't anywhere near as much about training skills as it was in 1998.

 

[Eärendil]

Write a PM plz when you do it so that I have a chance this time ;-)

 

[Mr. Jamison]

Me 2!!!

 

[FrejaSP]

When it comes to skills using resources, RoT is way cheaper, and any tamer will tell they love RoT.

 

[Eärendil]

Aye. Imbuing is slow but cheap!