Ways to bring veterans back to UO...

[Megilhir]

So because Richie Rich has the extra income to waste paying for a game he's not playing he should be rewarded over Joe Sixpack who had to take some time off because continuing to pay for UO meant stretching his already thin budget even thinner, and possibly meant other bills wouldn't get paid?

Oh yeah, sounds fair to me. rolleyes:

Sugarcoat it all you want, a system like you describe it is a class system. Vet rewards should not be (and to most people's way of thinking are not really) an incentive to continue paying/playing. Rather it's a thank you gift for the time you have spent as a subscriber.

It's not always as black and white as wanting or not wanting to play. Sometimes it's a matter of not having the funds, a soldier who get's deployed to someplace where playing UO isn't possible, a new parent who not only has less money, but much less time while caring for a newborn.

Bottom line is that pixel crack is not going to make most players come back. You have to fix (if possible) the problem that caused them to leave. As far as I'm concerned the current reward system is working just fine, no need to do anything to it.

You continue to harp against a class system as though it were a bad thing. Well Sunshine, despite your desire to recognize it or not, a class system exists in most, if not all, societies.

The singular aspect that makes America different from most societies is the mobility between the classes. This is beneficial for me as I have invested in education, been an officer in the Army and continue to work diligently to earn over 6 figures annually.

Is that classist? I certainly hope so. I do not ascribe to the false ideal that you should get anything free for my labor. And that is the perspective that launched America to become THE global superpower (with all the positives and negatives) that she is today.

There is too much “we need to go as slow as the slowest so we don’t leave anyone behind” attitude emerging in America today. BS I say. I don’t want the leaders of America to be the center-mass mediocrity (though they are at times unfortunately). I want the best and brightest in charge of industry, business and medicine.

I don’t want equal opportunity cops or firemen who cannot drag my unconscious 230 pound six foot frame from a burning building because, “Oh my, we don’t have enough (insert minority statute) on the force”. Hell no!

When I was in combat I wanted strong, brave, intelligent soldiers beside me. I wanted someone who could hit what they were aiming at and follow or give clear, concise orders. I care not for their gender or ethnic origin. I wanted, no I demanded, competency.

Now taking these tenets back to UO; you left.

You did not show loyalty. Now you are back and acting as a Moderator for this board. Well done, excellent. You have different privileges related to Stratics than I. Why? Is that not a class system as you have defined it? It most certainly is. You deserve those enhanced Stratics rights which I do not. Nor have I displayed a right to them.

Point being, there is a class system in all things. It may not be as apparent as a Brahmin system but it is there. Your railings about “unfair—classism—unfair” are no more viable from their repetition or volume. No indeed. And as far as being a soldier deployed somewhere who couldn’t play…damn straight. And I got an in-game friend to manually refresh all 10 (yes 10!!) of my homes on Pacific during the years I was away. I also paid the monthly fees.

Again, you did not.

My son is now 4 months of age. I have played UO about 10 days out of the past six months. Yet I choose to keep my subscription. I have made the reoccurring fee a part of my budget. I CHOOSE to support UO. And yet again, you DID NOT.

So sit down and realize that although valid to yourself, your view is not valid to everyone else. Nor is mine for that matter. But until I see a check from you to me for the 3 years you were NOT paying for UO, my decision will remain firm. As will my financial commitment to UO.

I do agree with your other points about fixing the bugs/exploits/etc…I think everyone who plays UO honestly does as well.

Lastly, my name is not Richie Rich nor Joe Sixpack, nice class labels though they be.

 

[Surgeries]

I will say that there is a reply from a Dev...actually from Cal Crowner, about a Classic Shard and that they are looking at it still. I stand corrected from my earlier comment, and apologize for not researching it more before posting.

Here is the link I was provided.

http://vboards.stratics.com/showthread.php?p=1669512#post1669512

As I said in a PM, and I have said publicly...if a Classic Shard will work and help UO I am all for it. I won't play it, but I am not myopic enough to say there shouldn't be one, if it helps keep the game alive.

If it would be a detriment, hopefully those that know these things will keep it from happening.

Anyway...just wanted to set the record straight on that point.

 

[Lorax_Pacific]

Would this bring UO players back...Two things.

1) Cloth maps of all the worlds

2) A manual on every skill and how to play the game. I have an Origin's Official Guide to Ultima Online and back then it was a reasonable reference. Maybe people out there won't search the massive amounts of information in the stratics and other web sites.

This game has very complex dynamics now and one of the problems that my old vet friends have is they don't understand the game. The don't understand the economy and a chapter on making gold in UO not the old fashioned way.

Basically, take all the herald, ea, and other information and put it in the 2011 Official UO manual. It must also include how to outfit a character for Sosaria travel so it would need experts in the game to write it. It must also have the interesting new character classes people have architected through skill combinations with explanations on why they work.

-Lorax

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

GM camping...FTW.

-Lorax

You make a valid point. I wouldn't pass on a Classic Shard because it had skill locks, but I wouldn't pass on it if it didn't either.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

...if a Classic Shard will work and help UO I am all for it. I won't play it, but I am not myopic enough to say there shouldn't be one, if it helps keep the game alive.

I wish more people would take that kind of attitude.

Thank you for that post.

 

[Chardonnay]

I got to thinking about this yesterday, when I was reading about the devs (hopefully) fixing the 3rd party cheat programs in an upcoming publish. I also found myself reading about Classic shards. A "classic" or "hybrid" shard seems like it would be good for the community as a whole, but especially good for any veterans that longingly troll the forums once every few months, but just can't bring themselves to re-up their subscription.

So I started to brain storm and come up with some ideas that might be worth discussing...

1) Fix 3rd party apps [REMOVED]... I don't consider the "free UOA" a cheat app, and I think that allowing it (possibly with some mods to it) would be a good gesture to vets.

2) A classic shard or possibly some kind of "hybrid" rule set. I think this has been beat to death, but one or two shards (at least) would fill up quickly, if done correctly.

3) If there was a classic or "hybrid" shard of sorts, it would be nice if the economy could be controlled somehow. What do I mean by controlled? Well... by having zero gold sellers. Impossible? Maybe. But, a Fel ruleset would go along way to getting rid of gold sellers. Maybe even a Fel-only shard that still had Factions controlling resources. I don't know. Something new. Not just a "pick a random publish and go" shard.

4) Allow players' veteran rewards to be based on their account's creation date and not their active time. This would allow vets to come back and get a few non-game-breaking goodies. Sort of a welcome back gift of sorts. This would only apply to existing non-Siege shards, imo.

It sounds like the first two are at least being looked at, which is a good sign.

But, I think the engine is there to do some creative things to entice long time vets and new players alike.

Ways to bring veterans back to UO...

Open a free server?

 

[Lorax_Pacific]

Ways to bring veterans back to UO...

Open a free server?

Interesting, so one classic shard is free, but you have to pay to play a production shard?

-Lorax

 

[Chardonnay]

Interesting, so one classic shard is free, but you have to pay to play a production shard?

-Lorax

You didn't get the joke so i'll hold your hand like a small child and explain it to you...

The devs don't listen to the needs of ea players unlike the people who run free servers...

 

[popps]

But I am also concerned that a new, classic shard besides attracting new or returning players, it could also attract existing players from current shards thus emtying them out more.

If that is the will of the players...so be it. Let the people play the playstyle they enjoy.

If a Classic Shard is a huge success, then perhaps it would be a clear message to the Devs and Producers that the current shards need to be changed.

If a Classic Shard is not wildly successful, you have nothing to worry about.

To avoid emptying the current shards even further, besides not allowing transfers to the new shard I think it is necessary to allow there separate housing.

That is, putting up a house on the new, classic shard will not force decay wo whatever other house that account may hold on another shard.

This, to allow the player to be able to play both the new, classic shard and the old other shard where that account has housing.

I agree, to an extent...but I think because a Classic Shard would not have Trammel and Malas, that housing space would be in short supply. I would suggest something more like, you can place a house on the Classic Shard, and you have 30 days to decide if you want to keep it. This would be a ONE TIME thing per account. If you decided to keep the Classic Shard house, any other houses you have on other shards should fall.

Otherwise, once they will put up a house on the new, classic shard, chances are they will not go back to the their originary shard where they once used to play.

That might happen. It might not. It depends entirely on the preferences of the players...as it should.

Endangering current existing house, even with a 30 days delay, I am afraid will damage the chances of a Classic shard to be a success.

How many existing players will want to take their bets and make a one way change to the new shard with no chance to get back to their former house ?

I mean, let's face reality.

Chances are that on their main shards, where their house is, existing players have quite a good load of items.

Now, if the classic shard will be closed to transfers as it should be, and if players have to destroy the house on their current shard to be able to place one on the new, classic shard, where will they supposed to put all of the items currently located in their house bound to be destroyed if they will be unable to transfer them to the new house on the new classic shard ?

Hardly any existing players under such harsh conditions will make the move to the classic shard, I am afraid.

Not to mention that, should the players then not like the classic shard they will have no house to go back to on their former shard AND, they lost a bunch of items there also. All that where stored in that house...............

No, I am convinced that the very only way to really test the popularity of a classic shard is allowing there separate housing in addition to that which existing players currently have. Sort of like it is possible to do with the test server.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

How many existing players will want to take their bets and make a one way change to the new shard with no chance to get back to their former house ?

You have 3 accounts right here that would do so. Anyone else?

Chances are that on their main shards, where their house is, existing players have quite a good load of items.

Yep. And if items are that important to those players...they should stay where they are.

Now, if the classic shard will be closed to transfers as it should be

Absolutely. 100% agreed.

and if players have to destroy the house on their current shard to be able to place one on the new, classic shard, where will they supposed to put all of the items currently located in their house bound to be destroyed if they will be unable to transfer them to the new house on the new classic shard ?

'I wish to place a trash barrel'

 

[Unsatisfied]

I agree with the need to first get rid of scripting, hacking cheating before any other shard omes up.

But I am also concerned that a new, classic shard besides attracting new or returning players, it could also attract existing players from current shards thus emtying them out more.

To avoid emptying the current shards even further, besides not allowing transfers to the new shard I think it is necessary to allow there separate housing.

That is, putting up a house on the new, classic shard will not force decay wo whatever other house that account may hold on another shard.

This, to allow the player to be able to play both the new, classic shard and the old other shard where that account has housing.

This to prevent the other shards to empty out for good because of the new, classic shard....

If players can keep a foothold in those shards (their house), they will keep going back from time to time and never really empty that shard out.

Otherwise, once they will put up a house on the new, classic shard, chances are they will not go back to the their originary shard where they once used to play.

I agree with this 100% having the new classic shard is like playing another game entirely, having houses on it should not collide with having a house on the other UO (current UO) in saying this, house decay is a must on the classic shard, 14 day timer for idocs so you need to manually refresh it. This will prevent people from the main shards who dont really wanna put much time into the classic shard for simply putting a house up, then leaving it and not returning to it. Sure they could just manually refresh it every now and then but chances are they will forget and we will have IDOCs. Its not a 100% solution for people doing this but it sure helps, and I do believe people need to be able to keep their houses on their original servers.

 

[Unsatisfied]

Hardly any existing players under such harsh conditions will make the move to the classic shard, I am afraid.

I dont understand, if this is your opinion then why are you so worried that so many players are going to leave their current servers to join a classic one? If this is your opinion wouldnt you be satisfied that its just going to bring in new/returning players that want to play the classic shard and your current prodo shards will continue without much change?

 

[Capt.E]

there have been players in my various guilds that are returning vets. They generally stick around for a few months, get up to date on gear and new stuff then disappear again.

I don't see anything wrong with that. It's how some people play these games.

I really feel that UO needs new players to check it out. We are far more likely to get some players that will stick around.

SOME advertisement of SOME type might work. Most people I talk to have never heard of the longest running mmo. WHY??

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

there have been players in my various guilds that are returning vets. They generally stick around for a few months, get up to date on gear and new stuff then disappear again.

I don't see anything wrong with that. It's how some people play these games.

I really feel that UO needs new players to check it out. We are far more likely to get some players that will stick around.

SOME advertisement of SOME type might work. Most people I talk to have never heard of the longest running mmo. WHY??

I had a phone conversation with someone tonight that played from day 1 through 2003. I told him that EA was considering a Classic Shard.

He laughed.

I asked him why he was laughing, and he said he was honestly shocked that EA was still even running UO. He plays WoW and basically is oblivious to UO. I asked him if he would come back for a Classic Shard, and he said probably not. When I asked why, and started talking about the old days...his response was:

"That game has ran its course. It still looks like it was made 10 years ago! Why would I want to come back to a game like that?"

Of course, I tried to explain about the new client...but his only question was "is it still 2d?" ... I had to answer yes. And with that, he was done with it.

There are some people that are graphics fiends, and they will not play UO for that reason alone. It's sad, but true.

 

[Unsatisfied]

there have been players in my various guilds that are returning vets. They generally stick around for a few months, get up to date on gear and new stuff then disappear again.

I don't see anything wrong with that. It's how some people play these games.

I really feel that UO needs new players to check it out. We are far more likely to get some players that will stick around.

SOME advertisement of SOME type might work. Most people I talk to have never heard of the longest running mmo. WHY??

Exactly people return now, get up to date on gear and leave after a couple of months. Thats what this game has turned into.

Classic days people would play for a few years and then leave... if at all, not a few months.

 

[Guido_LS]

Most people I talk to have never heard of the longest running mmo. WHY??

You're correct - most people haven't heard of The Realm Online Or Meridian 59. Or Furcadia... or Tibia... or Nexus... because they are even older than UO (yeah, UO is #6 in the longest running list - surprised?)

The problem with UO is there hasn't been a retail box since SA was released, and that was nigh impossible to find - it still is, with the rare exception of ebay. There's been no advertising since, well, the Sims Online was introduced... that's going back to pre-AoS times...

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

"Where would you go?"

"What would you do?"

Remember that??

 

[ingsmsico]

This would only apply to existing non-Siege shards, imo.

news flash: if EA creates a classic shard, siege is dead.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

news flash: if EA creates a classic shard, siege is dead.

You mean its not dead now?

 

[XavierGL]

What about just closing some of the shards down completely, for example Lake Supirior, Great Lakes and Atlantic are in the general same area, close all 3 and make 1 supper server. The same for all the rest of the shards out there, have to give the players involved an incentive of course, but also make sure these are players that actually play these shards and not hoppers that are just trying to corner the market on stuff.

Secondly,as a returning vet myself it's the uo economy has really turned a ton of uo vets from coming back. If you left 3 or 4 years ago with 3 or 4 mil in the bank you were rich, now days 3 or 4 mil you are the poor kid on the block.

 

[popps]

I dont understand, if this is your opinion then why are you so worried that so many players are going to leave their current servers to join a classic one? If this is your opinion wouldnt you be satisfied that its just going to bring in new/returning players that want to play the classic shard and your current prodo shards will continue without much change?

Maybe I expressed myself wrongly, sorry.

I will try to explain my concerns again, hoping that this time I can make myself better understood.

If current, existing players, will need to make a hard choice of either their current house on the shard they play now or a house on the new, classic shard, they will either not move their playing time to the classic shard or go play it for good and forget about their former shard since now, their house there with all of its contents will be gone thus making it quite less worthy to go play it.

Either scenario is a loss, IMHO.

If existing players do not go play the classic shard then it won't be possible to know how succesfull it has been and if they do, this will hurt the current shards because most likely for these players it will be a one way choice.

Allowing instead to have housing on both the classic shard and one of all of the other shards will allow players to play both completely and so, they will never really completely leave their originary shard but, perhaps, go back there from time to time.

Of course, should a classic shard be a great, ovewhelming success, then some rethinking would need to be done also for the existing shards....

 

[Unsatisfied]

Allowing instead to have housing on both the classic shard and one of all of the other shards will allow players to play both completely and so, they will never really completely leave their originary shard but, perhaps, go back there from time to time.

Of course, should a classic shard be a great, ovewhelming success, then some rethinking would need to be done also for the existing shards....

I think people should be allowed to have a house on both, but an idea needs to be thought up to make it so that people dont log onto the one classic server, play enough to get a house and then leave it standing there being automatically refreshed while they play their other shard.

My suggestion is just the original house decay system, 14 days untill it falls without being refreshed. It probably wont solve the problem entirely but its a good place to start.

 

[Morgana LeFay (PoV)]

The devs just have to be careful, because if there is zero housing available on a Classic Shard because everyone rushes in and grabs it all, then goes back to playing their regular shards...the Classic Shard would not be able to grow.

But I do completely get where you are coming from...and if it would help a Classic Shard to be successful, I am behind the idea.

I really don't give a care what happens to the current shards anymore however.