URLs in UO - Oceania's Thoughts?

[Amathist of PoC]

There has been a hot topic on Stratics Uhall about bannings for quoting urls in game - now this is suposidly not only dodgy or illegal trading - ones but ANY non uo ea owned site. So even stratics is a no go.

I just sent this PM to Jermy of EA Mythic on stratics because the rules are as clear as mud I am hoping that we get a response soon -

please take the time to read this thread and give a really clear answer because no one seems to really know for 100% and it is open to interpritation.

http://vboards.stratics.com/showthread.php?t=95269

it is mainly the last couple of posts about guild urls I am in need of an answer too.

I really hope I get a positive answer as this does not only affect guilds it affects - Auction Houses, Player Run Event Sites, Gamer Radio Stations, Even some sites that just offer information and quest details....surely some of these can be seen as GOOD for the community and should be there for allowed.

If anyone agrees with me or has a point of view on this please let me know or go post your support.

I think as a smallish shard such urls are useful for us as we may not have completed some of the things other shards have or know of what rares are available or even hear of half the duped items and there for could get done in. And no I am in NO WAY supporting trade sites that sell gold and so on this is purely support for community minded sites or sites that offer information nothing more.

 

[Teeshy]

I was always under the impressiont hat any off site URL was strictly speaking against the rules

This bit of the T&C that was quoted to you says it all really -

With the exception of the sale of in-game items for in-game items or services, you may not market, promote or advertise anything, or make any other form of solicitation (including pyramid schemes and chain letters) through the Ultima Online service or Ultima Online web site.

You can only advertise sites like that auction site that doesnt exist anymore - one that auctioned off UO items for UO gold.

Having said that, I also always assumed that as long as whatever you *were* advertising wasn't a blatent cheat site, they pretty much looked the other way. Just as long as people used some common sense - stayed within the "spirit" of the rules

 

[Amathist of PoC]

Having said that, I also always assumed that as long as whatever you *were* advertising wasn't a blatent cheat site, they pretty much looked the other way. Just as long as people used some common sense - stayed within the "spirit" of the rules

I thought the same but after reading that thread on Uhall and having been told of others being banned for suposidly warning there guild not to go to a site during a meeting....but because they said words like duped and gave a url they where banned even though the said "do not go here......they sell duped items"

But I believe we should be able to say to a newbie who has questions "go to uostratics.com or uoguide.com or spellweave.com for information" but according to that thread and the terms we can not because they are not owned by EA and you can be banned.

 

[Lady-Tor]

Yeah im a little dissapointed by it all. its just one of those rules at seem to be there for the sake of the rule itself. I got in trouble once for having RED's website on my house sign.

 

[Sneaky Que]

Its one of those rules they enforce inconsistently and irrationally.

For example I have seen people link to a site in game that is the most notorious scripting site out there, and nothing happens.

Then people get banned for linking to completely harmless sites...

It really requires someone to page on the person, or for a GM to be present (like that ever happens anymore), which in my view is a complete waste of time (for the pager), especially when its such a petty thing to page on someone for.

 

[Fink]

I think it's an absolute crock as UO would have gone under many years ago without the support of thousands of volunteers working on fansites.

The sheer amount of web-based information that was created to aid in supporting oral tradition (word of mouth between generations) transfer of information has eclipsed many times over any form of game documentation supplied by OSI/EA/Mythic.

To leave the decision of whether or not to prosecute over url sharing to the the discretion of the ignorant, disinterested, and often simply obtuse "customer service representatives" we have in place of the proper GMs of yore smacks of insult and criminally reckless administration.



Ya, I guess that would sum up my opinion on the matter.

 

[Amathist of PoC]

I hope you all can take the time to express your thoughts in the thread on UHALL - I am still hopeful that a EA Mythic team member will respond.....or at least I have not given up yet.

 

[Amathist of PoC]

Another account has been banned for a URL this time in a profile. Yet I personally know I have reported people for openly attacking and swearing at people and 2 hours later they where in game still...this just seems wrong.

For having UOGuide listed in my character profile.




After that we conversed some more about how unfair it was. Then I just told him to finish it because it was clear there was no way out without him pressing the suspend button and I don't want to take up important GM time.

Here is a link to the thread on stratics Uhall - it conatins pictiures of the chat journal with the GM http://vboards.stratics.com/showthread.php?t=96616

and here is my response as I am truly disheartend by this

Sorry to hear of your ban it seems a tad OVER the top when other things in the game could and should be addressed. I mean I had a player come and openly swear at me and my guild mates more then once - we reported and he was still in the game a few hours later. Yet having a URL got you a 24hour ban. I know what offends me more.

I have been trying to get them to clear up the TOS and answer us as to what URLS if any are acceptable. From your post I could assume guild sites are fine...but as yet still have not received an answer from Ea Mythic despite emails,Pms, thread posts and FoF requests.

Here is the thread I was discussing it in if you would like to add your views there hopefully we can get a response. http://vboards.stratics.com/showthread.php?t=95269

 

[Lady-Tor]

I am so frustrated that i got a 24hour suspention for having my guild site on my house sign, but now their saying its ok to have it on my guild page thingy where theres a box to put your guild site....

IT WAS THE SAME SITE!

Grrrrrr

 

[Amathist of PoC]

I am still waiting for EA Mythic to confirm or deny if Guild URL's are acceptable - I always assumed as you could add them to the guild information they where fine to advertise....however you say you got banned for it and others say that NO URL is allowed.

Then someone posted a conversation with a GM (in the thread I mentioned in last post) and the GM said the guild site was OK but that the site selling items and gold for money was not - which I agree with.

But I am still not game to advertise my guild until EA Mythic either respond to my email, pm's or thread or even post something in the FoF just to clear the matter up and make it so that there is no debate and everyone knows one way or another.

 

[Amathist of PoC]

KilandraEAMythic
UO Assistant Development Manager

Was just on another uo site I visit so I sent her the following message


Quote:
Kilandra I feel bad harassing you over this issue but it really is affecting my guild.

I have tried emailing, pming Jeremy but have gotten no response as yet and the posts on Uhall continue to just confuse the issue.

Now please be at ease that my question has nothing to do with duped items or sites selling them or any item or gold for real money or any third party programs that hack and cheat...I consider them all wrong no questions asked.

BUT my question is about the TOS regarding guild websites and ICQ, will we get banned for quoting our guild site url in game or having it in our profile? And is icq okay to say in game or is it also considered a third party program?

Some may say the TOS are clear but as you can see in this thread http://vboards.stratics.com/showthread.php?t=95269 alot of people have alot of different ideas. Some say ALL URLS are banable, others say guild sites are ok and have even shown journals with conversations with GMS who say so. Others say they have been banned or warned about guild urls...so I would just like a direct yes or no from the powers that be...namely you or any other ea mythic representative.

If you could please help me with this matter I would be very grateful.

Best wishes

 

[Mishra]

This is just silly and has gone too far. For years we have added diffrent URL's and even ICQ numbers.

 

[Lady-Tor]

I think considering this game is supposed to be for mature 16+ they should allow URLs. I think we should be allowed to judge for ourselves what we go into or not. if we manage to get a virus because of going into a dodgey URL its realy our own problem.

 

[Katlene]

i still think its nuts that the M rating was pulled off the game. although m15+ doesnt really count for much seeing as the most immature people in this game are in their 20's!

 

[Amathist of PoC]

I am still waiting for an answer from EA mythic...if anyone wants to help get the cause noticed please post in the original Uhall thread linked at the top.

 

[Amathist of PoC]

ANOTHER ONE - this time a radio site. - http://www.thelostlands.com/showthread.php?t=2871

Tempest Suspended !! Oh my!!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Came home from work to find that my favorite Atlantic bank sitter, Temepst was on "24 hour suspension"!!

Apparently, I had a link to my radio station in my profile and that is a no-no. I thought it was only links to places that sell UO things for real money. I guess thats what I get for half reading things. LoL

Sad thing is....someone had to page a GM...and that's just lovely.

It's still a stupid rule no matter what.

I am so close to just giving up UO finally...it seems they want to drive the remaining people out.

Mir

I just really do not know what to say any more I have tried and tried and tried to get a straight answer out of EA Mythic to no avail...the community still seems to be of many different minds about this topic. And mean while guilds and community building websites such as castles and courtyards, Miss Echo's Guilds (sorry forgot the site) and whispering rose radio and tower of roses and alot of other really good sites are going to become extinct because we can not share them.......who knows at this stage if we can even say ICQ.

 

[Amathist of PoC]

Here is a copy of the screen shots where a GM says that GUILD sites are allowed and that TOS breaking trade sites are not ( items for real money or gold for real money).

 

[Lady-Tor]

I feel bad for that guy. If you dont read Stratics how are you supposed to know these things? Who seriously reads the ToS?

 

[Fink]

You could always try a little civil disobedience.. compile an in-game book of helpful urls (spellweave, tower of roses, etc), scribe off a few hundred copies, leave them in key locations like Luna, New Haven, various popular haunts..

It's a stupid blanket policy. It's EA all over though; cheap, nasty, and covers their backside.

 

[Lady-Tor]

As much as i would love to do this, somehow GM's can see who placed items on the floor. I know that cos i once got a warning for putting trapped box's in Luna...

 

[Amathist of PoC]

Yeah I am all for "fighting the man" but do not wish to loose my account in the process. So for now I am just hounding them old school text base style *giggles*......ok so I am also suffering lack of sleep.

 

[Fink]

As much as i would love to do this, somehow GM's can see who placed items on the floor. I know that cos i once got a warning for putting trapped box's in Luna...

See I've never agreed with that being an actionable.. act. People need stuff to explode in their face once in a while, or poison them, just to remind them they're playing a game. Plenty more things in real life to get upset over than making an embarrassingly obvious boo-boo in UO.

Anyhow, the GM would need to have witnessed you dropping stuff to have a case. They're not allowed to prosecute on hearsay, no matter how many stone-cold witnesses they have. Stealth might not stop GM's seeing you, but it stops bored idiots (who need a good dose of RL upset to put things in perspective) from reporting you specifically.

Sheesh, you're making me sound like a criminal..

Yes, anyhow..

 

[Amathist of PoC]

See I've never agreed with that being an actionable.. act. People need stuff to explode in their face once in a while, or poison them, just to remind them they're playing a game. Plenty more things in real life to get upset over than making an embarrassingly obvious boo-boo in UO.

I actually agree whats the fun in making the boxes if you cant use them on people unsuspectingly.....I guess it could cause issues with innocents being killed and looted in tram but I still actually see the funny side...teach you to be a sticky beak and look in boxes that are not your own.

As yet still no response from anyone from EA mythic on the topic...I wish I had more contact details to work with.

 

[Amathist of PoC]

We have been given an answer in the FoF thank you Jeremy. - www.uo.com

"Why did I get a suspension for having a link to a website in my profile?"

First, the relevent bit from the Rules of Conduct:


"With the exception of the sale of in-game items for in-game items or services, you may not market, promote or advertise anything, or make any other form of solicitation (including pyramid schemes and chain letters) through the Ultima Online service or Ultima Online web site."


This isn’t a blanket ban on links - links to guild websites may be just fine, for example - but most sites advertise, promote, or market something - even if it’s just running banner ads. Your safest bet is to avoid bringing the outside world into UO - if you have a website that’s UO-related (and not entirely about making someone a profit) - by all means submit it for inclusion in the fansite section of the FoF! (Remember, email jdalberg AT ea DOT com, and I'm happy to take guild recruitment ads and stuff too. Just make sure you proofread your copy, because I will only give it a quick once-over when I post it!)

 

[Amathist of PoC]

More bannings have taken place this time to WRR djs during a Deal or No Deal event. The DJ's were asked how to tune in they gave the WRR url and recieved 24 hour bans.

NOW admittedly at the time the site was in the wrong as it had some naughty banners or links on it to other sites that broke the TOS so fair enough. BUT the inconsistency is so frustrating as the WRR site was just in the FOF and linked in the FOF the same FOF that had the part on "Why did I get a suspension for having a link to a website in my profile?"

I believe EA Mythic are going a tad bit over kill on the URL bannings and perhaps need to focus on stopping scripters and dupers because I know what annoys me more.

 

[Amathist of PoC]

A new thread on bannings for URLS on Uhall - http://vboards.stratics.com/showthread.php?p=831071&posted=1#post831071

 

[Septimus]

As much as i would love to do this, somehow GM's can see who placed items on the floor. I know that cos i once got a warning for putting trapped box's in Luna...

LOL I so did that just the other day, blew up half a dozen people, god it was funny! I mean no I didnt... LOOK OVER THERE ---->
*Runs n Hides*

 

[Septimus]

i still think its nuts that the M rating was pulled off the game. although m15+ doesnt really count for much seeing as the most immature people in this game are in their 20's!

Hey, I heard that