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[UO Herald] Got another Survey For You!

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ilot

Journeyman
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
The vote is non-void and would have been throw out by the UN.
You can't have 1 option for NO and 4 for YES and count all them as YES.
The NO vote was actually the highest vote option.

I suggest if you want an accurate one you put a poll up for YES or NO, thats it no other YES BUT options.
^^^^
 

sablestorm

Babbling Loonie
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Your opinion rocked. I'll say this one more time i voted three times on this survey is that intended to happen?
Possibly. What if they qualify votes by IP address, so thus your three votes would be pared down to one?
 
F

Fink

Guest
My grandfather used to say "you can't polish a turd". But evidently you can roll it in glitter.

After all the degrading and dumbing down of KR to get SA (sorry, "Enhanced"), to appease the Classic crowd, they go and contradict it with this.
 

Crysta

Babbling Loonie
Alumni
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
A Japanese tester found it on the 21th soon after it was implemented. It was opened to public in the world.

the first found pet dyes
They weren't implemented on the 21st. They were implemented at the start of Open Beta. The puzzle was able to be finished, it was just hard to do so. The first time I saw the dyes was around the 17th or so. Got my first one on the 19th.
 
A

Ash

Guest
Since this argument keeps resurfacing, let me just clarify another thing. This debate was opened on the close beta forums to assess if there was still a majority asking for this or not. The Yes vote was clearly ahead. We decided to redo the vote with a greater number of players to make sure the majority would still be the same. And when I say majority, I meant significant majority. A 51/49 yes vote would not have cut it. In fact, if the no vote had been at least 40% against, that would have been enough to cut this feature altogether. The "No" vote was well below 40% percent. So no, it is not just a few players. In this instance, You, the players fully had control on whether or not a feature was going to be implemented. This is the will of the majority and it is now being adjusted based on your feedback and will be further adjusted once EA Japan's results have come in.
Well, given the options available in the polls, I don't see where it can be determined that a majority 'wants dyes'. I think it can only be honestly stated that x% DOESN'T want and the rest either want or don't care. The way the options were given, the 'don't care' crowd is being lumped in with the YES.

So if you consider those who don't care as being wanting dyes, then the results are slanted/inflated towards the positive anyway.
 
M

Maija

Guest
My grandfather used to say "you can't polish a turd". But evidently you can roll it in glitter.

After all the degrading and dumbing down of KR to get SA (sorry, "Enhanced"), to appease the Classic crowd, they go and contradict it with this.
It is amazing to me that people, both on this thread and others, seem to equate colors besides black, white (oh wait, they hate black and white, too) and brown as "Care bear", "Rainbow Brite", "My Little Pony" or whatever other 80s girl-oriented cartoon you care to insert. We have had brightly-colored clothing for years and years, and people wear it all over the place. We have had bizarrely-colored hair for years and years, and people wear that too - even the really scary stuff that makes it look like some Photoshop newbie did something stupid with the saturation. Animals, especially of the fantasy variety, have more colors than simply black, white, and brown. It feels like the main resistance to this is just that people don't like CHANGE. Moreover, it feels like it's the kind of people who do NOT dress up in lurid colors that are most offended by this. The only place I really ever see lurid colors are at Luna bank. So if you aren't a banksitter, why do you care so much? Don't dye your pets, your pk buddies and enemies probably won't be dying them either, and you can stay in fel and laugh at the carebear trammies and their "neon" llamas, while the rest of us enjoy our game.

I keep hearing the argument about it upsetting the "many" for the benefit of the "few". People who are genuinely getting UPSET because other people are being given an option they aren't interested in really need to get a new hobby. Maybe you could take up calling the cable company and demanding a partial refund because you don't watch Lifetime Television.
 

Slayvite

Crazed Zealot
Supporter
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
It is amazing to me that people, both on this thread and others, seem to equate colors besides black, white (oh wait, they hate black and white, too) and brown as "Care bear", "Rainbow Brite", "My Little Pony" or whatever other 80s girl-oriented cartoon you care to insert. We have had brightly-colored clothing for years and years, and people wear it all over the place. We have had bizarrely-colored hair for years and years, and people wear that too - even the really scary stuff that makes it look like some Photoshop newbie did something stupid with the saturation. Animals, especially of the fantasy variety, have more colors than simply black, white, and brown. It feels like the main resistance to this is just that people don't like CHANGE. Moreover, it feels like it's the kind of people who do NOT dress up in lurid colors that are most offended by this. The only place I really ever see lurid colors are at Luna bank. So if you aren't a banksitter, why do you care so much? Don't dye your pets, your pk buddies and enemies probably won't be dying them either, and you can stay in fel and laugh at the carebear trammies and their "neon" llamas, while the rest of us enjoy our game.

I keep hearing the argument about it upsetting the "many" for the benefit of the "few". People who are genuinely getting UPSET because other people are being given an option they aren't interested in really need to get a new hobby. Maybe you could take up calling the cable company and demanding a partial refund because you don't watch Lifetime Television.
People arnt against change they are against Hues.
Introduce more colour to the game, feel free But make it a worth while colouring of pets not just a Hue job.
This option is LAZY and frankly offensive for a game of this callibre today to say, Were introducing pet dyes but dont worry they only took half an hour to code and look like it to, were sure to get more gamers with this.....
As for not joining in, i dont intend to, but if we just move to another bank how long do you think before the neons follow. And why should my game be ruined by multi-coloured animals because a minority want them.
 

athos_uo

Seasoned Veteran
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Athos, what is the mood among Japanese players regarding the pet dyes?
Hmm, there are no UOSS-like boards in Japan, only anonymous ones or closed SNS. So I can't put together where people in Japan incline to in general.

From what I read on such anonymous boards, there are few "Yes". But those who agree with pet dyes generally don't feel necessity to post there, so that doesn't mean that the noes have it.

We must wait for results of EA Japan.
 

sablestorm

Babbling Loonie
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
And why should my game be ruined by multi-coloured animals because a minority want them.
Nevermind that a minority hasn't been established. It's broad sweeping statements which ring false like this which undermine the whole argument. Sweeping statements like, a majority of players hate the neon colors nevermind that a vast majority of players in-game actually spend tons of money to buy neon tokuno dyes.
 

Slayvite

Crazed Zealot
Supporter
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Nevermind that a minority hasn't been established. It's broad sweeping statements which ring false like this which undermine the whole argument. Sweeping statements like, a majority of players hate the neon colors nevermind that a vast majority of players in-game actually spend tons of money to buy neon tokuno dyes.
You did take that out of context thou as i was quoting another.

To be frank thou i dont know why they ask these things when they are allready ingame and will stay ingame.
 
T

The Fallout

Guest
If this was such a miner addition there wouldn't be a topic on UHall with 330 replies. It is also the longest for any topic related to the Stygian Abyss expansion.

I've made a mock up of what it will look like to have these new color pets around. Colors are not exact, but they are in line with what is being offered.

The only one that looks obnoxious is the purple one. Forgive me if I like variety and not just red and brown.

Besides, apparently most people want this implemented, if the nays hadn't even reached 40%.
 

Cetric

Grand Poobah
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
UNLEASHED
the bright orange ridgeback looks a little obnoxious aswell
 

phantus

Stratics Legend
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
the bright orange ridgeback looks a little obnoxious aswell
What is obnoxious is the green robe he's wearing. Contrasting clothing can make the colors look worse. A black robed figure on the orange would be more appealing. It's all about contrast and perspective.

JC should have put swastikas on them to make it more dramatic. :hahaha:
 
M

Maija

Guest
What is obnoxious is the green robe he's wearing. Contrasting clothing can make the colors look worse. A black robed figure on the orange would be more appealing. It's all about contrast and perspective.

JC should have put swastikas on them to make it more dramatic. :hahaha:
Agreed. The two obnoxious ones are also significantly brighter than the colors actually going into the game. I mean, take a look at his sig vs. the purple dragon and you can tell the one in the sig (the one that got approved) is darker and less saturated.

And Slayvite, I agree with the opinions that it would have been nicer to have *nicely* hued pets instead of simple recolors, but I don't feel that what we got will ruin the game. The artists behind UO have long been lazy about recolors; take weapons that do non-phys damage, for example. They just recolored the whole darn things to purple/green/orange/whatever and called it a day. It's how all of the dyes introduced after the inception of UO have worked (ie. not the clothing dyes, but everything else - and goodness knows furniture dye would be soooooo much nicer if it had been done the painstaking way). While I can silently THINK yeah, they could have looked better if they'd done it that way, the artists haven't taken the time to do it that way in 10 years, and it's unrealistic to break out the pitchforks over it now, especially when the resources as far as money AND number of people working on UO are dwindling. Besides, even if they HAD spent countless hours meticulously recoloring each scale, mane, and patch of fur, or given us accessories, the same crowd would be crying that too much time was being spent on Carebearing up their game, and next we'll be tying bows in our ponies' hair if we'd gotten accessories. It doesn't seem to matter to any but one or two that it wasn't done nicely. The argument I'm hearing over and over is just flat out "I don't like it and anyone using it is offensive and ruining my game."
 
B

BLAU

Guest
The recruitment of the questionnaire is still performed in Japan.
However, why will a result be already given?
I think in doubt.

Yes, I am against an idea of the Pet Dye.
I want to say to the development team, if you adopt this idea in defiance of dissenting opinion..
Please do more polite work.
For example, in this way.



This is the minimum compromise that I can agree.
 

Attachments

Crysta

Babbling Loonie
Alumni
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
The recruitment of the questionnaire is still performed in Japan.
However, why will a result be already given?
I think in doubt.

Yes, I am against an idea of the Pet Dye.
I want to say to the development team, if you adopt this idea in defiance of dissenting opinion..
Please do more polite work.
For example, in this way.

http://vboards.stratics.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2211&stc=1&d=1251604798

This is the minimum compromise that I can.
That I could live with, but it would require making the same adjustments for every single frame of every single tamable animal and monster... I don't know if that's even possible anymore. It certainly is for the SA client.. but 2d..?

Of course, getting it done would benefit the game as a whole, as most of those creatures are rehued and reused as other creatures...
 

Frarc

Stratics Legend
Alumni
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
The only one that looks obnoxious is the purple one. Forgive me if I like variety and not just red and brown.

Besides, apparently most people want this implemented, if the nays hadn't even reached 40%.


Now i see a picture i like the pet dye even more.:)


The orange have been taken out of it already.
 

JC the Builder

Crazed Zealot
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Agreed. The two obnoxious ones are also significantly brighter than the colors actually going into the game. I mean, take a look at his sig vs. the purple dragon and you can tell the one in the sig (the one that got approved) is darker and less saturated.
People need to keep in mind that there are 2 different textures for dragons, red and brown. The same hue applied to both will come out differently. Depending on what type the developers used the color can come out lighter or darker. There are also 3-4 different types of horses. Here is an example:



This is what is meant by most creatures not being designed for colors. The base color has a dramatic effect on how the hue comes out. This is why all clothing is supposed to be white/grey to start with and the developers made a huge mistake in having elf clothing green. Every pet is going to look different because it starts with a different color.
 
M

Maija

Guest
People need to keep in mind that there are 2 different textures for dragons, red and brown. The same hue applied to both will come out differently. Depending on what type the developers used the color can come out lighter or darker. There are also 3-4 different types of horses.
If this were the case, a white dye would come out red or brown and the greys would simply be darker reds and browns, wouldn't it? The recolored llama would have reddish tinges throughout the recoloration where the fur is currently reddish-brown. I don't know about elf clothing (I don't use it and it's been years since I've looked at it) but it looks, from the pictures given us by the developers, that the pets were desaturated (turned to greyscale, aka black and white) before color was applied. You keep making all these fake "screenshots" that are nothing like the ACTUAL, OFFICIAL screenshots that were already given to us.
 

JC the Builder

Crazed Zealot
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
You keep making all these fake "screenshots" that are nothing like the ACTUAL, OFFICIAL screenshots that were already given to us.
I assure you the above comparison shot was made using the same hue applied to both brown and red dragons. There was nothing done to modify them. If the developers detail what hues they are talking about then it would be easy to make up a chart to show everyone. At the moment it is just guesswork what the exact hues are, which is why this should have been tested during open beta.
 
M

Maija

Guest
I assure you the above comparison shot was made using the same hue applied to both brown and red dragons. There was nothing done to modify them. If the developers detail what hues they are talking about then it would be easy to make up a chart to show everyone. At the moment it is just guesswork what the exact hues are, which is why this should have been tested during open beta.
You missed my point. You added the new hue over the top of the existing brown and red in your pictures. The pictures given to us by the developers were put on dragons who had had their color STRIPPED - they are now in BLACK AND WHITE, not red or brown - and THEN had the new color applied.
 

JC the Builder

Crazed Zealot
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
You missed my point. You added the new hue over the top of the existing brown and red in your pictures. The pictures given to us by the developers were put on dragons who had had their color STRIPPED - they are now in BLACK AND WHITE, not red or brown - and THEN had the new color applied.
Um, I don't think that is the case. They would have had to create all new base creature models in order to strip their colors.
 
H

HattoriHanzo

Guest
Um, I don't think that is the case. They would have had to create all new base creature models in order to strip their colors.
Dude...

  1. Look at your last post.
  2. Look at the big, obnoxious banner in your signature that says NO PET DYES.
  3. Look at the white dragon, horse, beetle, etc.

They've already done it!

And if they haven't done it for all pets, it's trivially easy to do. Give me all of the current pet sprites--and I don't care if they're "lost" or whatever, just give me screenshots if that's the case--give me the sprites, Photoshop, and a half an hour, and I could give you a full set of desaturated base sprites.

I mean... How can you believe that anyhow? You've just spent four pages moaning about how terrible it will be to see orange/pink/green pets in your game. But by your logic, there couldn't possibly be any orange/pink/green pets, unless you happened to tame a horse or something that was white to begin with.
 
T

TramMoonWalker

Guest

Attachments

JC the Builder

Crazed Zealot
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Dude...

  1. Look at your last post.
  2. Look at the big, obnoxious banner in your signature that says NO PET DYES.
  3. Look at the white dragon, horse, beetle, etc.

They've already done it!
If they had then the beetle wouldn't be so dark. They are just dying the natural color of the creature. A white wyrm is just a dragon dyed white.
 
B

BLAU

Guest
I made the second ScreenShot with his picture.

before


after


I know that it is not easy to give 2D client these improvement.
But, it shouldn't be introduced when you can't do such polite work.
This is my wish.
 

Attachments

H

HattoriHanzo

Guest
If they had then the beetle wouldn't be so dark. They are just dying the natural color of the creature. A white wyrm is just a dragon dyed white.
The beetle is dark because the greyscale values are a bit low. That could be fixed with a gamma filter or the curves tool.

And your logic makes my brain melt. Are you referring to the in-game "natural" color of the creatures? Because I'm talking about color theory. In the screenshots from the survey (and your signature), they are clearly starting with white base sprites and adding a multiplicative color filter. Which I'm sure is how they'd do it in-game with actual pets.
 

Tanivar

Crazed Zealot
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Sadly all this pet dye garbage will do is thrill a few, and cause more to get more disgusted with what the game is becoming.

All these Bad Idea (tm) changes have been wearing away over the years at the number of players UO has. The shards are ghost towns now. Will encouraging some more players to leave drop the income EA sees from UO low enough that they pull the plug on it? I can wander the wilds most of a day and encounter 3 or 4 people. Even Luna rarely has more than a few dozen people in it. At what point does EA pull the plug on UO?

This game has more content in it than most games out there would even dream of having and isn't level-based so that friends who play different amounts of time can still hunt together. It would have more players if the developers would just quit adding bad points to the game.
 
F

Fink

Guest
The beetle is dark because the greyscale values are a bit low. That could be fixed with a gamma filter or the curves tool.

And your logic makes my brain melt. Are you referring to the in-game "natural" color of the creatures? Because I'm talking about color theory. In the screenshots from the survey (and your signature), they are clearly starting with white base sprites and adding a multiplicative color filter. Which I'm sure is how they'd do it in-game with actual pets.
The gamma/curves tools don't enter into it. It's simply a hue number applied to a sprite, they don't take the sprite out, edit it in photoshop, then put it back in. They don't "strip" the colours out of a sprite before rehueing it, they simply change the palette it uses. In effect it's like whitewash; all the detail and interest is lost.

Check out InsideUO. It has all the sprites in their natural colours. Open up an animation, click the little button to change the colour, and you will see the palette options. Pick one and voila, the sprite is rehued. All they do to the mob is is change the palette by referencing a hue number. No editing of the original pixels occurs.

The only sprites that appear "stripped" of colour before rehueing are the ones that are designed to work that way: forest & frenzied ostards, lava lizard, bird, bullfrog, slimes, characters, hair, clothes. No horses, no dragons, no llamas, etc.

I'm wondering if this survey will be offered to all players via some in-game vote, or is it exclusively for the minority who read Stratics. Remember, we're not making decisions based on minority opinion...
 
M

Maija

Guest
They don't "strip" the colours out of a sprite before rehueing it, they simply change the palette it uses. In effect it's like whitewash; all the detail and interest is lost.
Okay, that may be the case, however:


The only sprites that appear "stripped" of colour before rehueing are the ones that are designed to work that way: forest & frenzied ostards, lava lizard, bird, bullfrog, slimes, characters, hair, clothes. No horses, no dragons, no llamas, etc.
If this were the case, again I ask, why are the dragons, llamas, etc. in the screenshot we were given to judge on colored completely white, completely pink, and so on, instead of white with light brown patches, and such? Clearly they have made SOME change that gave all of these animals the "whitewash" effect.

I'm not trying to argue the "whitewash" looks great. I'm not even trying to say people aren't entitled to say "I don't like it." But you can't deny that there IS the whitewash effect there IN the screenshots we were given, and it's mindbogglingly ignorant and childish to proclaim that giving animals new colors somehow ruins the game, when the use of said new colors is entirely voluntary. Now, if they suddenly announced, "Hey, we're thinking of just recoloring all the dragons to pink and all of the horse-shaped animals to blue, what do you think?" by all means, scream about how it would affect your gameplay. But if you don't plan to use it, who cares? Why is it a terribly horrible thing to let the people who like the colors enjoy them?
 
H

HattoriHanzo

Guest
The gamma/curves tools don't enter into it. It's simply a hue number applied to a sprite, they don't take the sprite out, edit it in photoshop, then put it back in. They don't "strip" the colours out of a sprite before rehueing it, they simply change the palette it uses. In effect it's like whitewash; all the detail and interest is lost.

Check out InsideUO. It has all the sprites in their natural colours. Open up an animation, click the little button to change the colour, and you will see the palette options. Pick one and voila, the sprite is rehued. All they do to the mob is is change the palette by referencing a hue number. No editing of the original pixels occurs.

The only sprites that appear "stripped" of colour before rehueing are the ones that are designed to work that way: forest & frenzied ostards, lava lizard, bird, bullfrog, slimes, characters, hair, clothes. No horses, no dragons, no llamas, etc.

I'm wondering if this survey will be offered to all players via some in-game vote, or is it exclusively for the minority who read Stratics. Remember, we're not making decisions based on minority opinion...
Okay, so they change the color palettes. Makes sense... Like the way a GIF image works, and why the goombas in the underworld levels of Mario appear blue instead of brown. Typical sprite trick.

I was operating on JC the Builder's original assumption of applying hues to the existing sprites. If they're doing full palette replacement, that should render his argument even less valid.

As Maija just said, they clearly have created new palettes (or new sprites) for at least the pets shown in the survey screenshots. And really, if they do palette swaps, then the only pets it should be difficult to color are ones with spots, stripes, or some other major two-tone scheme. Even still, those features can probably be accounted for rather simply with a monochromatic palette.
 
H

HattoriHanzo

Guest
All these Bad Idea (tm) changes have been wearing away over the years at the number of players UO has.
Actually I would venture a guess that the game's age and the natural generational cycle (i.e. "new" gamers will choose newer games) has been what's mostly responsible for UO's declining population. I guarantee you the number of people who would scoff at UO at a glance based on the presence of purple dragons would be dwarfed by the number who would take one look, simply shrug, and say "It's too old".

Frankly I'm surprised they're even releasing Stygian Abyss.

They obviously tried to release Kingdom Reborn to update the graphics and make it more appealing to new gamers--ill-fated, surely because of technological limitations and cost-effectiveness. Looks like the Enhanced client will be a bit more successful, but not enough to attract many new players... Which is why they aren't releasing a boxed copy of SA.

All they have left is to find some way to incentivize the game for the existing players. If you are a game developer, you will inevitably lose business if you don't do something new with the game. And simply releasing a new continent for players to fight new trash mobs the exact same way they fought old trash... isn't new enough.

The dyes are one thing they're trying. And I like it. Frankly, aside from boss fights (which I am nowhere near far enough along with my characters to appreciate) the dyes are one of the things I look most forward to... certainly more than the gargoyle racials and the imbuing, which I feel have too many rules about them.

So yeah, incentives. They're trying to provide them. God help them, as stubborn as some users (whom I suspect are, as usual, a very vocal minority) are.
 

Wenchkin

Babbling Loonie
Alumni
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
Well, if the colours were applied in a way other than dumping them over the head of the poor beastie it'd be possible to add pet dying in that many of us actually liked. Turning a dragon into a purple blob however just adds a childish look to a game and you end up with a game with part medieval type fantasy art and part colouring book for 5 year olds. Other games have a look which flows through every bit of art and the result just looks better.

I play Dofus at times, a very silly looking game with lots of bright colours. But the whole game looks that way, so it fits in. You don't take it serious. No problem with bright silly pets in there. But with UO I think the devs are torn between artwork for grown ups and those who want to have a more silly fun look. Nothing against silly and fun, but competing artwork in a game just looks odd to me.

Those colours could have been put in and made to work beautifully, but that's not what's happened here. A missed opportunity IMO.

And I'm not going to say dragons should look realistic when they're fantasy critters, but heaven knows they could be made to look beautifully reptilian like if the colours were applied better. The best fantasy dragon art isn't a purple blob.

Wenchy
 
S

Stupid Miner

Guest
People need to keep in mind that there are 2 different textures for dragons, red and brown. The same hue applied to both will come out differently. Depending on what type the developers used the color can come out lighter or darker. There are also 3-4 different types of horses. Here is an example:



This is what is meant by most creatures not being designed for colors. The base color has a dramatic effect on how the hue comes out. This is why all clothing is supposed to be white/grey to start with and the developers made a huge mistake in having elf clothing green. Every pet is going to look different because it starts with a different color.
If you want anyone to see something in that pic other than a true black dragon and another true black dragon, you'll want to change the white background to a darker hue.
 
S

Stupid Miner

Guest
@ Regine, could we get the picture in SA? We currently have no idea what they'll look like in SA.
 
S

soulstoner

Guest
Very neat idea. The colors are not eye-sore neons and the array of shades present a color for everyone's individual taste that would partake in the puzzle quest to obtain. It would be a nice view during large groups to see an array of personalized greaters in the killing fields. Even though there are many colors I personally would not choose --- I think --- again, something for everyone.

Also, it's a super idea to have a puzzle/quest that one/some would not tire of very quickly in order to continue with customized pet shade detailing - I dig it.:D
imho though - the wear off time is a bit too quick though ... some folks only have time to play 1 or 2x per week.............

Survey Monkey is kewl is idea as well - sometimes the vocal minority is confused with the majority here & IRL.
 
G

guum

Guest
I'm sure this survey is gonna be VERY accurate considering i've voted 3 times. Honestly, what kind of joke is this?
Who cares if it is? Democracy is a terrible game design philosophy. And I'm one of the ones who voted for the dyes. The devs need to have a vision of their own and be sure enough of it not to just take any suggestion that can float a 51% (or 75%, for that matter) majority, even if it's a legitimate majority. Listening to player input is one thing, and a good thing, but the fact of the matter is that if you listen to the majority often enough, you'll wind up with something that is without major flaws *or* virtues -- the ultimate product of lowest common denominator thinking. No great art or music has ever been produced by large quantities of people; it's always one or a few people with a vision who direct things. I don't see why game design would be any different.

I have to say, after sleeping on it for a few days, I'm less certain I want the pet dyes as proposed than I was when the poll first popped up. Such is just one of the dangers of having a poll for everything and letting polls dictate design plans, regardless of how "accurate" said polls are.
 
C

Coppelia

Guest
Oh, finally someone accurate on the problem. The current way hues apply is the main reason for me to reject the project of pet dyes as a whole.
Pouring a paint pot on a pet is ugly. It's ok with some colors on some pets. But most of the pets need more variations. It's particularily worrying that devs didn't think of packhorses and packllamas. It dyes the saddle bags too. From there it's not too hard to think a little further and understand that such hues don't apply well at all on pets with several colors. You lose too many informations while applying the hue on the whole pet.

And Chrissay, how can you say there's no neon when pure white is still there? Denial?
Any hue that has its darker value too light will become neon on all the creature without enough contrast. Hint : imported from old 3D client. Take all the creatures on one picture, turn it to grayscale and you'll see all the problematic creatures.
So if you don't plan to remove from pet dyes all these creatures or plan to rerender all these creatures for a good quality 2D (which you seem capable of doing seeing some of SA creatures), then remove those hues.
 
F

Fink

Guest
Looks like this pet-painting thing is going in. Pity there's no toggle off for people who have vehemently rejected the idea. A minority they may be, but they have been very vocal and passionate about their preferences on the topic, leading to some very disappointed people. Supposedly the number of supporters for a KR-type client were even fewer, but they went ahead with that anyway. Twice.

As there are a fixed number of colours, I wonder if they would consider making new art at some later stage. Proper sprites by the art department, not cheap dye-dipped ones thrown in as a one-liner-coded afterthought.

Look at the red dragon. Tell me the yellow underbelly and wing webbing would look good in the same red as the rest of it. Then look at the cheap rehues and tell me that's not exactly what's going on.

They now have the 3D assets from Enhanced they can re-skin with texture maps, and render out the sprites to 2D. Proper textures, not rehashed crap. And if you don't think "new art" can look any good, check out crimson and platinum dragons. Hell, even ancient wyrms still look good today, years after their makeover.
 

JC the Builder

Crazed Zealot
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
The beetle is dark because the greyscale values are a bit low. That could be fixed with a gamma filter or the curves tool.
The client does not have a curves tool or a copy of Photoshop hidden inside it. If they want to do any modifications that you are suggesting they need to patch in a new creature model. The red and brown dragons are two different creature models. The White Wyrm is a white hue of one of those (not sure which). A Fire Beetle is a hued Beetle.
 
F

Fink

Guest
The red and brown dragons are two different creature models. The White Wyrm is a white hue of one of those (not sure which).
A bit of both. The "pure wyrm" is the red dragon hued white, and the "dirty wyrm" (sort of speckled) is a brown with the same treatment. :thumbsup:
 

Siteswap

Visitor
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Stratics Legend
A bit of both. The "pure wyrm" is the red dragon hued white, and the "dirty wyrm" (sort of speckled) is a brown with the same treatment. :thumbsup:
Thats true. When a White Wyrm spawns it spawns as a dragon graphic (random between brown and red) and is then given a white hue which manifests itself a different shade of white depending what colour Dragon graphic was generated. Hence the 'Pure White' and 'Dirty' White Wyrm variations.

This is exactly the same with Nightmares. One of the 4 Horse graphics is generated and then hues black. This is why there are 4 different shades of nightmare. The 'True Black' mare is derived from the dark brown coloured horse, the 'Long Maned' mare is derived from the Bay Horse with the long mane and the 'Short Haired' mare is derived from the other 2 horse types, which incidentally are a slightly different shade and why we have 4 different mare types (although the 2 short haired shades of mare are hard to discern without loking carefully).
 
S

Stupid Miner

Guest
Blanket hues are always vomitously nauseating! Just look at this silver steed!


Doesn't it just make you want to gouge out your eyes? rolleyes:

And remember the Pure white Horses we had for Unicorns? Weren't they terrible? Didn't we have a huge outcry of female tamers who thought they were hideous?
 

Dermott of LS

UOEC Modder
Stratics Veteran
Stratics Legend
...

Doesn't it just make you want to gouge out your eyes?

Actually considering how much better it could be done, yes.

But then I've cone to the opiniopn that I don't really care how hideous the end result is in the 2d client as long as they get it right in the newer client(s).
 
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