NEWS [UO.Com] Letter from the Producer

[lineman]

I just cant wait for the day when they actually start banning people again for duping and scripting. Putting a bandage on the problem does not correct it. I just dont understand how every other mmo out there can enforce these issues on a constant basis but UO cant. Here is a recent example of a game doing just that.

RIFT 2.1 Hotfix #2 - 8:00am PST 1/9/13 [NA] - 2:00am GMT 10/1/13 [EU]

** Addressing the Bots **​

​

While we were out for the holidays, there was a marked rise in both fishing and onslaught farming bots. We know that the vast majority of you are responsible, upstanding, and incredibly attractive Telaran citizens, but we do need to take a moment to remind everyone that automating play is a violation of the terms of service that will be acted upon.​

​

As of today, we’ve already shut down a few thousand accounts over the recent rise in fishing botting, and we’ve begun removing gains from others in places of extreme bot use. A good number of these botters were brought in, as is often the case, on stolen credit cards and fraudulent Rift purchases.​

​

That said, some folks do innocently use keyboard-assistance software while they’re at their computer. We’ve gone out of our way to make sure that differently-abled gamers are able to use the assist software that they need.​

​

Unfortunately, for the next week or two, until the bot situation gets back under control, use of this software may intentionally be randomly unreliable, up to causing random disconnects. We ask that you please refrain from using keyboard automation software in the meanwhile.​

 

[phantus]

How would that stop anything? I can already see old Jim Tom over there with [Duped} crap all over his paperdoll. What, you think someone would be to ashamed to buy them or wear them? Why would anyone decline to buy them when there would be no penalty other than a [Duped} tag in your paperdoll.

I know I wouldn`t be able to show my face in Luna if I was wearing anything with a [Duped] tag, lol..... sorry thats just funny

There should just be a world wide sweep of duped items and delete them all. Don`t care who it screws. If the game can recognize a duped item when trying to put it on a vendor,there should be a way for it to recognize them and insta delete upon server up after maintenance or something......

I for one would take a day off of UO to just watch Uhall explode with the tears of the innocent.

Who says it's intended to stop anything? Does it have to? It give me the option of choosing not to purchase( or have) a duped item if I do not wish. I'm not saying that I wouldn't buy a duped item but I can honestly tell you I would be less likely to use one labeled a dupe than one that isn't.

Deleting items duped and then unknowingly purchased by others is the wrong idea and is not going to happen. If they can prevent them from being sold on a vendor then we must assume they could have deleted them already and decided not to. Although the sadism that accompanies the tears of the innocent most certainly sounds appealing to some I'm sure.

Not everyone is going to get it but some people don't treat UO as just a game. They play the game as they live life. I know this must be an alien concept but that is a discussion for a different forum.

 

[Zosimus]

I am just shooting blanks here and all guessing but maybe the duping and vendors were somehow related in duping items. Maybe they can't fix the issue with the ones already exist in UO but they can stop further duping if my guess is true and fact.

If they can't sell them on vendors would people really try to buy items from other sites that may be duped items and have issues themselves with their own account being put into jeaporday. What good buying a duped item if they can't sell it on a vendor later on?

Good news though

 

[SunWolf]

If your against buying an dubbed item, after the publish you can ask for them to throw it on a vendor to test it. There is a grace period no one can buy the item from the vendor but you will be able to see it. The owner then pulls it back off for that period if it is a big money item, to show it is a real one.

120 magery scrolls, it takes time but you can combine 105s, 110,115. Takes a heck of alot of them but still in doable but there all powerscrolls/trans should drop from all the champ spawns once they redo them. Fel should problay just have a bigger reward in them.

This is more than likely step one of many on changes to weed the trash out of this game , people or items.

 

[CovenantX]

Greetings Everyone,

• Introducing a new Housing Theme Pack which will consist of:
  • New couches, chairs, tables, beds, lots and lots of lamps, pictures, and tapestries. (46 new pieces of art total)
  • Advanced Tinkering – This will allows players to create new gadgets, one example is being able to create a light switch for your house to turn off and on your lamps
  • Changing the Co Owner status from 10 co-owners to 10 accounts as co-owners on one house (70 players)

Bonnie "Mesanna" Armstrong

I'm assuming this is going to be something you need to purchase ?

 

[NuSair]

Something you bought and have had for 10+ years gets deleted? I don't know about you but that would be the last straw

Yes, even then.

Because it's the right thing to do. It takes something to look beyond yourself to see what is right.

 

[Lady Michelle]

If your against buying an dubbed item, after the publish you can ask for them to throw it on a vendor to test it. There is a grace period no one can buy the item from the vendor but you will be able to see it. The owner then pulls it back off for that period if it is a big money item, to show it is a real one.

why take it off the vendor? set the price, and let the buyer buy it off the vendor. once its off the vendor whos to say the seller has 2 or so dupes in his pack, and he gives you a duped item. Its better to be save than sorry

 

[Thrakkar]

Even if I logged on and lost almost everything I had because it was duped and deleted, while I'd be mad at first, I'd get over it because I know it was the right thing to do.

Things I stay upset over are like the way the Atlantic revert was handled and we were blown off. I am still pissed about that.

Deleting my stuff because it was duped in a shard wipe of dupes, I support 100%, even if were to lose everything.

This is an extreme measure. Usually only extremists will accept such a thing and the majority won't support/accept it.
On the other hand you're not fixing the cause, just the effect, which would make this measure kind of pointless.
Taking these two arguments into account, I'm pretty sure, the duped items won't be deleted.

Marking them as duped in the tooltip on the other hand is a good idea, since information and transparency is always a good thing.

 

[Petra Fyde]

I'm saving up for the housing theme pack I doubt it will be mega expensive, just I've got more than one house holding account

 

[popps]

Now for the exciting news!

Next Publish

• You will no longer be able to place duped items on vendors.

Producer UO

There is something I fail to understand reading the above.
If it is possible to prevent duped items to be placed on vendors, this means to me that there is some technical way to "detect" which items in the game are duped.

Duped items are illegal, as I understand it, meaning, that they should not be in the game in the first place.

Now, is the vendor change the first step towards deleting all duped items ?
If so, why not do it outright regardless from the vendor change ?

Furthermore, if the duped items will be eventually removed from the game, not having them on vendors does not prevent players to sell them anyways. If they can be stopped from being placed on vendors, why not make them ALSO not tradeable ?

There are items in the game which cannot be put in a trade window, so, why not have the items tagged as duped be refused, besides vendors, ALSO by trade windows ?

This would avoid a lot of players accidentally buying duped items without even knowing it.

Furthermore, if the game will be able to "see" which items are duped, why not add, for all these duped items, a VISUAL text which players can read so as to actually be able to see them ?

As of now, regular items and duped items are indistinguishable from each other, if there is a way that the game can tell them apart, and I assume that by having vendors refuse them such technical way is possible, then players should also be able to see what items they may be considering purchasing are regular and what duped. Especially, if eventually in the future duped items are planned to be removed from the game.

That's at least as I see it.

 

[Bobar]

• You will no longer be able to place duped items on vendors.

I can't see this stopping the dupers to be honest. Surely they will just switch to duping more consumable type items that vanish once used. Power scrolls, tokens etc. People sell these via general chat all the time. Most players won't mind if its duped as long as its cheaper then a proper one, as once it's been used its destroyed. If they were able to stop players using duped powerscolls and tokens, this would be a much more effective way to cut down on the dupers marketplace.

Every journey starts with a single step.

 

[Olahorand]

This vendor placement thing should include the trade window.

 

[Kelly O'Brian]

If your against buying an dubbed item, after the publish you can ask for them to throw it on a vendor to test it. There is a grace period no one can buy the item from the vendor but you will be able to see it. The owner then pulls it back off for that period if it is a big money item, to show it is a real one.

... and trade a duped version via trade window, while keeping the "clean" "proof" item for the next scam ?!

You better buy it out of the vendor!

And to avoid that scam, i support the "not to be traded via trade window" proposal too.

 

[Aurelius]

Surely just make any item tagged as duped 'account bound'. Stops all trade, selling etc, leaves the owner with the item to destroy or keep as they see fit...

 

[Mitzlplik_LS]

Surely just make any item tagged as duped 'account bound'. Stops all trade, selling etc, leaves the owner with the item to destroy or keep as they see fit...

Now that idea I like.

 

[Olahorand]

Surely just make any item tagged as duped 'account bound'. Stops all trade, selling etc, leaves the owner with the item to destroy or keep as they see fit...

But who would be the owner? I have 5 accounts, sharing the same storage in some houses ...

 

[Shakkara]

Nice, I didn't expect the weapon/armor revamp to be coming so soon! Was getting a bit annoyed by the lack of updates/communication, but this really gets me a bit more excited!

One important thing, will the weapon update also rebalance 2-handed weapons? Cause the properties on shields are so big that 2-handed weapons are pretty disadvantaged as you'd miss out on HCI/DCI, damage increase, swing speed increase, resists and other shiny properties.

Now, on to prepare for my election as ambassador

 

[Lord Lew]

[quote="popps, post: 2225345, member: 48403"

Furthermore, if the game will be able to "see" which items are duped, why not add, for all these duped items, a VISUAL text which players can read so as to actually be able to see them ?
[/quote]

I think the main problem is they have the same item I'd, and there is no way to tell which is the original. I may be wrong, but I read this somewhere.

 

[Warpig Inc]

No need to tag the "dupe" Put a tag on the "Real Deal"

Going to buy something of unknown history in the future use vendor only.

This new vendor tool is a way for players to clean up the world we control and not the someone else. You can use a vendor to check your items and trash them if dupes. Buy only off vendor to insure your getting the Real Deal. Those in the future that still buy through trade window might just as well got the gold for the purchase from one those honest gold sales sites. LOL. Simple. We will now have the tool to clean up the game. Only the lowlifes and suckers will be exchanging anything of duped value in the furture. Will still have those that will buy their gold just to be L337Rest. Unlike honest players, those that have no respect for the GAME are never around for long.

 

[GalenKnighthawke]

• You will no longer be able to place duped items on vendors.

I can't see this stopping the dupers to be honest. Surely they will just switch to duping more consumable type items that vanish once used. Power scrolls, tokens etc. People sell these via general chat all the time. Most players won't mind if its duped as long as its cheaper then a proper one, as once it's been used its destroyed. If they were able to stop players using duped powerscolls and tokens, this would be a much more effective way to cut down on the dupers marketplace.

No it wouldn't.

This would screw the buyer, who likely doesn't know, not the duper.

"Galen you stupid Trammie. If you see something selling cheap you know it's duped."

Not necessarily. I, for example, as a seller frequently will sell under market, because I like the quick sale. I like to have the cash.

If nothing else stopping them from going on vendors makes the would-be dupe-seller work harder to sell the dupes. Off-hand this sounds like a good thing. As is the case with car theft, you can't really stop the professionals but you can stop or delay the joy-riders.

For us as buyers there's really basically no way to know, with some rare exceptions.

-Galen's player

 

[GalenKnighthawke]

The light switch makes me somewhat nervous. UO, and Ultima single-player before it, has always been a fantasy with a strong science fiction element but it's always still firmly been a fantasy, with a weird hybrid of the middle ages and renaissance time periods. (The 1200s or so through say the early 1600s about the time period of the English Civil War, with magic taking the place of gunpowder in a firepower sense, and having the exact opposite impact of gunpowder in socioeconomic terms. And all taking place at once.)

Somehow a light switch breaks the spell for me in a way that, say, Exodus doesn't.

I may well be alone in that these days, but I doubt it.

If the implication is that the switch is a mechanical device, which would seem to be the case given that it's a Tinker making it, then think about what this means: This means electricity and wiring. That takes us somewhat beyond the time period of Oliver Cromwell, if memory serves.

I am informed that some fantasies have wizards with a magic spell that can turn on all of the lamps or candles in a dwelling or structure. Indeed I am informed that such a thing existed in one of the single-player Ultima games.

Were this my game I would be modeling this light switch item on that -- on something that already existed in my source material which is so well-known that it was written about on MSNBC's Internet site.

-Galen's player

 

[DevilsOwn]

I am informed that some fantasies have wizards with a magic spell that can turn on all of the lamps or candles in a dwelling or structure. Indeed I am informed that such a thing existed in one of the single-player Ultima games.

Were this my game I would be modeling this light switch item on that -- on something that already existed in my source material which is so well-known that it was written about on MSNBC's Internet site.

-Galen's player

yah, I was kinda.. "huh?"

but, if I arrive home, walk inside and utter a few words and not only the lamps but the candles blink on? yah, that would work

 

[Ron Silverbeard]

I like all the changes and thank you very much for showing us what's next and what's up to come sooner or later.

I somehow miss any new wording on Ingame-Vendorsearch - maybe we get some new Info about this in a few weeks?

And yes, please could you also add 2011 Holiday Ticket rewards to the turn in possibilities, would be nice!

greets

 

[MalagAste]

The light switch makes me somewhat nervous. UO, and Ultima single-player before it, has always been a fantasy with a strong science fiction element but it's always still firmly been a fantasy, with a weird hybrid of the middle ages and renaissance time periods. (The 1200s or so through say the early 1600s about the time period of the English Civil War, with magic taking the place of gunpowder in a firepower sense, and having the exact opposite impact of gunpowder in socioeconomic terms. And all taking place at once.)

Somehow a light switch breaks the spell for me in a way that, say, Exodus doesn't.

I may well be alone in that these days, but I doubt it.

If the implication is that the switch is a mechanical device, which would seem to be the case given that it's a Tinker making it, then think about what this means: This means electricity and wiring. That takes us somewhat beyond the time period of Oliver Cromwell, if memory serves.

I am informed that some fantasies have wizards with a magic spell that can turn on all of the lamps or candles in a dwelling or structure. Indeed I am informed that such a thing existed in one of the single-player Ultima games.

Were this my game I would be modeling this light switch item on that -- on something that already existed in my source material which is so well-known that it was written about on MSNBC's Internet site.

-Galen's player

I look at the Light Switch more like the neat little flask that Dumbledore made for gathering all the lights in Harry Potter.

 

[NuSair]

This is an extreme measure. Usually only extremists will accept such a thing and the majority won't support/accept it.
On the other hand you're not fixing the cause, just the effect, which would make this measure kind of pointless.
Taking these two arguments into account, I'm pretty sure, the duped items won't be deleted.

Marking them as duped in the tooltip on the other hand is a good idea, since information and transparency is always a good thing.

I find it amusing when people try to speak for the majority- I am glad you feel qualified enough to take up that daunting task. And it's not pointless. The point is removing something from the game that shouldn't be there to begin with.

It's not extreme and there is precedent for it, even in UO. The Monk's Robes? The former Vine Cord Sandals? Yes, that was on a smaller scale in terms that it was one item, but the stand and effect are the same. The removal of a duped item from the game. And Vine Cords were selling for a good amount of gold as well.

 

[Sabbles]

Somehow a light switch breaks the spell for me in a way that, say, Exodus doesn't.

-Galen's player

Tink's make magic jewelry, magic creatures, and magic farspeakers. I see Tink's as magical mechanics of UO. Light switch I see a similar way. Magical mechanical. No spell broken here! ^^

 

[Arcades]

Does Advanced Tinkering also = Runic Tinker Tools??? Eh maybe?!?

 

[Petra Fyde]

The light switch makes me somewhat nervous. UO, and Ultima single-player before it, has always been a fantasy with a strong science fiction element but it's always still firmly been a fantasy, with a weird hybrid of the middle ages and renaissance time periods. (The 1200s or so through say the early 1600s about the time period of the English Civil War, with magic taking the place of gunpowder in a firepower sense, and having the exact opposite impact of gunpowder in socioeconomic terms. And all taking place at once.)

Somehow a light switch breaks the spell for me in a way that, say, Exodus doesn't.

I may well be alone in that these days, but I doubt it.

If the implication is that the switch is a mechanical device, which would seem to be the case given that it's a Tinker making it, then think about what this means: This means electricity and wiring. That takes us somewhat beyond the time period of Oliver Cromwell, if memory serves.

I am informed that some fantasies have wizards with a magic spell that can turn on all of the lamps or candles in a dwelling or structure. Indeed I am informed that such a thing existed in one of the single-player Ultima games.

Were this my game I would be modeling this light switch item on that -- on something that already existed in my source material which is so well-known that it was written about on MSNBC's Internet site.

-Galen's player

Would it help at all to remember that there are switches that look very like light switches on the walls of several of the older dungeons. I remember switching them all as a newbie trying to find out what they did.

 

[Tazar]

While you are working on tiles, can we get the Carpet Tiles and Christmas Grass Tiles fixed so they stay under whats on top of them?

For this - just drop a couple of goza mats and raise them one tile. Place the bed on the mats and then chop away the mats. Place the carpet or grass underneath and it will show correctly.

 

[Krinkle]

The Light Switch doesn't mean electricity is being introduced into the game in the modern sense. It is just a switch. Something to turn something on and off. It could control magical light or even alchemy.

 

[Sauteed Onion]

It is just a switch. Something to turn something on and off.

 

[Adol]

* New Aquarium art – New sponges and Coral types

You say "types", does this mean that will be a new creature, or a variant of the old (Coral already exists)? As one of the few people actually still running a full aquarium, let me just remind you it holds 30 creatures, needs at least 1 spare space to spawn a new fish at a growth check, and there are already 26 unique creatures (not including "Of A Rare Colour" variants) so it will only take 4 new Sponge/Coral to ensure you can never get a unique set in there.

However, I would approve of the aquarium getting an overhaul in general, seeing the fish together in a tank rather than on each individual page would be lovely. With coral and sponges at the bottom of course!

* Continuing to work on High Res art..currently working on all the wall pieces.

Also good news. But could you also do a pass at the Mini Houses too? They look atrocious in the Enhanced Client, with huge lines through them where each tile is.

* Pictures/Tapestries/Lamps

Go oooonnnn....?

* New Weapon/Armour system

Hmm, as someone who has always hated Diablo-esque stats ago go systems that require Excel spreadsheets to set up, I've long since abandoned warriors for bards mages and tamers, but if it can revitalize crafting without making it equally time consuming I'm opening to seeing what happens...

* Tinkering

Like this, a long forgotten skill, especially now the only thing anyone ever wanted them for is gone. How about a perma-trapped box, but along the lines of "Awakening Electric Shock Box", with balanced usage of course...?

* Adding 2 new dyes to the turn in reward system

Bring back the Mouse Hole too! My Sherry Statue needs somewhere to live...

 

[GalenKnighthawke]

Would it help at all to remember that there are switches that look very like light switches on the walls of several of the older dungeons. I remember switching them all as a newbie trying to find out what they did.

My impression is that those were levers to open hidden doors and stuff.

Hidden doors which for the most part were never implemented.

(Khaldun has like a lever/door puzzle; one of the other dungeons used those levers for something, I think.)

-Galen's player

 

[GalenKnighthawke]

Tink's make magic jewelry, magic creatures, and magic farspeakers. I see Tink's as magical mechanics of UO. Light switch I see a similar way. Magical mechanical. No spell broken here! ^^

Like I said, I accept the fact that I may well be alone in the world on this one.

Wouldn't be the first time, won't be the last.

-Galen's player

 

[GalenKnighthawke]

And finally may I add:

To write a Producer's Letter was absolutely, 100%, undeniably the right thing to do.

Thank you.

-Galen's player

 

[Herman]

• You will no longer be able to place duped items on vendors.
• Continuing to work on High Res art..currently working on all the wall pieces. These will not be released till all pieces of a house are finished due to the fact they look horrible together with old and new. We still have many wall sets to update including doors, signs, and the roof before any high res art will be released. Please understand its taking us 3 weeks from start to finish to get each wall set type in the game. So yes this is slow going but we are going to finish it *grins* Remember now there are 45 wall sets total and we have totally completed 7. Below is a sneak peak of what you can expect to see in the future.

Thx for taking up work on high res art again if u continue to work on this i will support UO
For me this change to duped items is perfect
Every time I buy a duped item I support the cheaters!! But now if i only stick to buying selling stuff on vendors i dont have to play theire game anymore I LOVE IT

 

[Gantry]

I very much like that the producers letter is on the patch screen too. Not everyone I know that plays, also reads the UO website and I end up trying to explain it all to them. Thanks

 

[Xalan Dementia]

Upcoming New Musical Instruments


This is exciting news! Do you have any weight estimates for these, though, especially the cello? I love the sound of the standing and lap harps, but they are just too darn heavy to carry when hunting and looting. Same goes with the aud char. Beautiful sound, but I hesitate to carry one (or two, when the first is running low) because of the weight. Anything you can do to make these instruments and the new ones a little lighter would be great and probably see them get a lot more use than lightweight flutes, lutes, and tambourines. Also, I hope we'll be able to craft the new instruments with various types of wood and metal and have them show up in various shades.

off the wall but perhaps make a craftable shoulder strap you can attach to instruments or even some select containers that would lessen the weight of the items placed within/on. would take the cloak/quiver slot and would be great to have a paperdoll art at least for the equipped version. This could act as a spell book container as well, since so many have a desire for a neater backpack. Of course make the strapped containers snoopable/stealable etc.
Would love to see my gargoyle bard flying around with an Aud Char slung on his back.

Also, have they ever added a way to craft slayer instruments? You would think at least a runic saw would run the chance of it. Or even make a process where you collect blood or energy from monsters of the target slayer type that you want. Drain 5 of one type of monster to get an item that will infuse a crafted instrument (maybe add in crafted spellbooks) with a single slayer of that type, get 10 off of higher tier mobs and get a super slayer infusion. Meh, its complicated compared to adding them to runics but its alil more rp style.

 

[Kage]

My only fear is the change to weapons and armor. Will this change make the gear we're currently using worthless?

 

[Sauteed Onion]

My only fear is the change to weapons and armor. Will this change make the gear we're currently using worthless?

We won't know til it can be tested on Test Center. But in the event it does, I'm sure it won't cause any kind of hubub or problems at all; just like not deleting dupes. Not.

 

[Picus of Napa]

My only fear is the change to weapons and armor. Will this change make the gear we're currently using worthless?

2013 nerf?

 

[Uriah Heep]

My only fear is the change to weapons and armor. Will this change make the gear we're currently using worthless?

Yeah I figure I have quite a while to run around in nothing but scraps and -100 shame stuff. Don't intend to burn up anymore ingreds without knowing that what im building will be useable...and we should all be aware that there will almost certainly be a lot of bugs with it.

 

[Herman]

Lord lew wrote

I think the main problem is they have the same item I'd, and there is no way to tell which is the original. I may be wrong, but I read this somewhere.[/quote]



This is probably the reason why they can not delete or tag duped items if there is 101 items with the same id then 1 of them is real

 

[startle]

I think the main problem is they have the same item I'd, and there is no way to tell which is the original. I may be wrong, but I read this somewhere.

This is probably the reason why they can not delete or tag duped items if there is 101 items with the same id then 1 of them is real

If they have the same ID, then how would they determine which ones wouldn't be allowed on a vendor (the duped ones) and which ones would be?

 

[Zosimus]

My only fear is the change to weapons and armor. Will this change make the gear we're currently using worthless?

I don't think it would because I think from previous discussions over this and the devs do read the forums where players have talked about how metal suits would be viable in game again. This also goes for aesthics for players wanting their charcter to have that right look and not all mixed parts.

 

[Eddie123]

They should reward us if we find bugs/exploits on TC1. That would make alot more people try to find them instead of the ones that look for them to just use them to make lots of extra gold when the pub hits... Range the rewards for how harmful the bug/exploit may be. Like a token of your choice, Game Time Codes 1-3-6 month codes. and say if u find a dupe and report it free uo for a year or perma free account. If they did something like that it would make a lot more people want to try to find the bugs.

I don't work for free so I do not go on TC1 just to work for them and get nothing. I am sure that most people agree with me on that.

PS.. I am not sure if this is already in action or if it has been mentioned before. If it already exisists then I would say that they should advertise it to the UO player base.

Sorry if you disagree that's just my opinion.

 

[chise2]

Well I personally am very excited about all this! Things like weapons being rebalanced and all armor types being useful again have been long over due. I especially hope this makes two handed weapons more appealing. I do hope though that especialy if the changes are big that we get plenty of time to test these things! Because with so many armor types it could quickly become a real mess if not done right. New housing theme pack sounds cool wonder how much it will be? I like that we are getting new instruments as well. More to do with town loyalty is nice too! Also as a Siege player I am really crossing my fingers for that second house! In all I am VERY impressed with what is coming up the next publish!

 

[Eddie123]

The weapon situation can be great or it can kill the game.. for dexxers anyway. Maybe they will do something to make tank mages good again or something.. only time will tell... :/

 

[Obsidian]

Does Advanced Tinkering also = Runic Tinker Tools??? Eh maybe?!?

Runic Tinker Tools would be the best surprise of all if they came out in Pub 81.

-OBSIDIAN-

 

[LordDrago]

If they have the same ID, then how would they determine which ones wouldn't be allowed on a vendor (the duped ones) and which ones would be?

Perhaps nether of them will be allowed on a vendor, only truly unique item ids would be allowed.
depending on the context, a duped item could be defined as either the original or the resulting item.


just a thought.