[Treasure Hunting] Tmaps... what still needs a bit of improving?

[Stupid Miner]

Bugged ocean maps are a given, so we'll skip those.

Guardians:
-Trammel and Felucca are amazingly lethal as-is.

-Ilshenar: For all the maps allow for Paragon Guardians
Level 5: switch Enforcers with Titans
Level 6: switch Exodus Minions for Betrayers and switch Titans for Succubi

-Malas:
Level 5: Add Blood Elementals
Level 6: Add Skeletal Dragons (or Shadow Wyrms)

-Tokuno: Sounds like it would be a good mix

-Ter Mur:
Level 5: switch Fire Ants with Anlorlem or Ballem or Relanords.
Level 6: Map looks like a decent mix.

Tmap Drop Rate/Creatures:
Global +2% treasure map drop rate

All Peerless/Champ spawn Bosses should have a 50% chance at dropping a level 6 map
All Mini-spawn bosses should have a 20% chance at dropping a level 6 map (except Goblins, which should have 10%)
Blackrock Elementals, Paragon Ancient Wyrms, Paragon Greater Dragons, Paragon Skeletal Dragons, Putrefier, Rend, Abcess, Niporailem, and Navrey should have a 10% chance of dropping level 6 maps
Miasma should have it's Paragon chest rate reduced by 3% (or spawn a Reptalon in the area)

Creatures that should drop level 4 maps
-Ogre Lords
-Titans
-Terathan/Ophidian Avengers
-Changelings
-Dryads/Insane Dryads
-Lesser Hiryu
-Rune Beetle
-Yomotsu Priest
-Fairy Dragons

Creatures that should drop level 5 maps
-Orc Brutes
-Reptalons
-Cu Sidhe
-Hiryu
-Yomotsu Elders
-Fire Daemons

Creature that should drop level 6 maps
-Yamadon (remember the drop rate would be about 1 in 33)

Loot:
Fix the Intensity bug obviously.

Runed Sashes:
Should have their duration increased to 30 seconds. And possibly add minor properties like +3 hp/stam/mana and +3 HCI/DCI/SDI. Variety keeps items interesting and valuable.

Surge Shields:
Stamina regen should be +20 for 30 seconds
HP regen should last 30 seconds (still weaker than a Gheal potion)
Mana regen is fine



... yea, that's about it

 

[Mapper]

Good changes, They should just put the maps in the old spot system, Keeps Rune Library owners happy and stops them needing to fix the randomize system.

Oh and stops us having to hunt for a spot..

 

[Old Man of UO]

Sounds good, except for this:
Miasma should have it's Paragon chest rate reduced by 3% (or spawn a Reptalon in the area)

LEAVE MY MIASMA ALONE!


One thing I would like to see is any creature spawning a map in a dungeon would have the treasure chest location within a dungeon, instead of out in the open lands. That should spice it up a bit.

 

[Storm]

One thing I would like to see is any creature spawning a map in a dungeon would have the treasure chest location within a dungeon, instead of out in the open lands. That should spice it up a bit.

That would be cool !! also would not mind seeing the regular dungeon chests changed a little

 

[Nastia Cross]

One thing I would like to see is any creature spawning a map in a dungeon would have the treasure chest location within a dungeon, instead of out in the open lands. That should spice it up a bit.

I had a map yesterday spawn in the hedge maze next to the gravestones. I thought that was really cool.

Personally I think anything that drops a level 6 map should have the chance to drop any facet. Right now I get Tram and Malas from Miasma, but nothing else. I don't mind having to go to each facet to get specific 1-5 maps for that facet but the chance to get a level 6 from a 5 chest is relatively small.

Also, I rather enjoy hunting for the random locations. I wouldn't like that taken away. The rune libraries are still useful because many of the random locations are spawning close to old ones. The rune libraries could take this as an opportunity to expand their offerings.

 

[Shelleybean]

I may be a minority, but I do not want paragon guardians for Ilshenar maps. There are already paragons and other monsters that can spawn near the map site and some spots are extremely deadly. And there is the added difficulty of not being able to recall to the general area.

I also say no to shadow wyrms and such being guardians. The ancient wyrms and greater dragons on the Trammel maps provide enough challenge already. Can you imagine getting for example, 8 shadow wyrm guardians? And then you pull a piece of loot out of the chest, here comes a shadow wyrm, and another and another. I already dread this with the ancient wyrms.

I do agree that some monsters need an adjustment in their map levels. I'm not sure why Miasma's drop rate should be nerfed though. It already became a ghost town when they nerfed the artifact drop rate. At least now, maybe more people will go fight it.

The runed sash is really lacking for my playstyle. The benefit doesn't last long enough and my robe covers it up anyway. If if had some other property, luck, stat bonus, etc then I would probably use it.

 

[Stupid Miner]

I may be a minority, but I do not want paragon guardians for Ilshenar maps. There are already paragons and other monsters that can spawn near the map site and some spots are extremely deadly. And there is the added difficulty of not being able to recall to the general area.

I also say no to shadow wyrms and such being guardians. The ancient wyrms and greater dragons on the Trammel maps provide enough challenge already. Can you imagine getting for example, 8 shadow wyrm guardians? And then you pull a piece of loot out of the chest, here comes a shadow wyrm, and another and another. I already dread this with the ancient wyrms.

A lot of the reason for having paragons (it's only a 1 in 20 chance, so average 1 paragon per 2 chests, or 1 per if you loot every item)
is because paragons in Ilshenar are terrible to farm: 1 in 20 monsters are paragon and 1 in 10 paragons give chests, so that's 190 monsters and 10 paragons just to get one map. So a lot of it is for chaining maps. (dig one chest, get another)

Shadow Wyrms pack a punch, but they're actually very fragile to poison damage. As long as you pick off one at a time, they're quite manageable.
They're much easier than skeletal dragons or AW or GDs.
and... they're level six chests, they should be scary.

 

[Old Man of UO]

Another thing I'd like to add...

We should not have to or even be able to use a soul stone to swap out skills between digging up the chest and beating down the Guardians. I'm not saying make it harder by requiring detect hidden or remove trap, just that it really isn't that hard to do any level of spawn without having to do the soul stone swap. I'm not sure how you would do that, but the skill swap just feels... sleezy.

 

[Shelleybean]

I stopped fighting shadow wyrms once undead monsters had revenant casting ability added to them. I dislike fighting a lot of undead now because of it. I guess that's my real reason I don't want them added.

 

[Basara]

Additional suggestions.

1. Get rid of the Mining requirement, and institute the following:

a. Finding a map spot would work like finding the Turkey nest spots last year, in terms letting you know if you are getting close.
b. Cartography would allow the map to be dug up from a distance. This would be determined as follows -
((Cartography+5)/15) steps (rounded down), minus the level of the map.
This formula would result in the following dig distances, making people more likely to keep Cartography on (though I'd still like to see Cartography left on the character as mandatory):

Level 0 maps (the old rare Youthfuls for new characters): (Young) Humans with JOAT can dig from 1 away, or any character from even farther, if actually buying/training the skill.
Level 1 map: 1 step away if you have enough skill (barely) to decode the map (kicks in at 25 skill); 2 steps at 40 Carto, 3 steps at 55, 4 at 70, 5 at 85, 6 at GM.
Level 2 map: 3 steps away if you have enough skill (barely) to decode the map (kicks in at 70 skill, just below the decode requirement); 4 at 85, 5 at GM.
Level 3 map: 3 steps at minimum decode level, 4 at GM.
Level 4 map: 2 steps at minimum decode level (which is in the 90s), 3 at GM
Level 5 map: 2 steps at GM ( (105/15)-5 = 7-5 = 2)
Level 6 map: you get ONE extra step if you have your GM Cartography on you. And, frankly, should be impossible to dig if you don't have Cartography on you at the time of digging, even if a cartography-mandatory rule isn't applied to the other levels.

c. Have Mining add 1 or 2 steps to the numbers in b.: but NOT be the primary indicator of ease of digging as is currently.

2. Add "2 taint", "1 lard of paroxsymus" and "1 Captured Essence" to the table of minor artifacts in the bags of level 6 maps (each would be a specific drop). This would still mean only about a 1 in 10 of any of the 3 dropping, or 1 in 30+ of a specific one dropping, as to try to keep the psychotic Peerless farmers happy (as such low drop rates would hardly endanger their business) - and still would require people to do other peerless (or buy from the psychos) to make any item.

3. Keep Level 1 & level 2 Trammel/Fel maps using the Old map point system. This would allow people to train up their skills with more relative ease, and get used to the nuances of looking for the chest. Level 3s in Tram/Fel and lower levels in the other facets would be their initial forays into more dangerous and difficult grounds.

4. Add the old level 0 "youthful" maps from the old New Player Experience system, back to the New Haven new player experience in the Enhanced Client as part of the reward, and make the ones that would fall on the now-underwater locations special level 0 "Youthful SOS" when decoded (identical to level 1, but with a mandatory Youthful map or SOS replacement in it the way the level 0 T-maps have replacement maps). These maps & SOS would not require the EC to use, only to initially get.

 

[Ben Sherman]

Additional suggestions.

3. Keep Level 1 & level 2 Trammel/Fel maps using the Old map point system. This would allow people to train up their skills with more relative ease, and get used to the nuances of looking for the chest.

Yes, because getting used to consulting an archive, recalling off a rune onto the exact spot will really teach them/give them practice in how to find the chests...

 

[LeBaiton]

Guardians:
-Trammel and Felucca are amazingly lethal as-is.

Agreed

-Ilshenar: For all the maps allow for Paragon Guardians
Level 5: switch Enforcers with Titans
Level 6: switch Exodus Minions for Betrayers and switch Titans for Succubi

Agreed

-Malas:
Level 5: Add Blood Elementals
Level 6: Add Skeletal Dragons (or Shadow Wyrms)

Agreed

-Tokuno: Sounds like it would be a good mix

This is getting boring - Agreed

-Ter Mur:
Level 5: switch Fire Ants with Anlorlem or Ballem or Relanords.
Level 6: Map looks like a decent mix.

Agreed

Tmap Drop Rate/Creatures:
Global +2% treasure map drop rate

Disagreed, it's very easy to obtain t-maps. Way too easy...

All Peerless/Champ spawn Bosses should have a 50% chance at dropping a level 6 map

100% Agreed

All Mini-spawn bosses should have a 20% chance at dropping a level 6 map (except Goblins, which should have 10%)

Hmm, not sure if that would be a good idea...

Blackrock Elementals, Paragon Ancient Wyrms, Paragon Greater Dragons, Paragon Skeletal Dragons, Putrefier, Rend, Abcess, Niporailem, and Navrey should have a 10% chance of dropping level 6 maps

Agreed

Miasma should have it's Paragon chest rate reduced by 3% (or spawn a Reptalon in the area)

Since the area is competition heavy with the current changes to t-maps, I think it's fine...

Creatures that should drop level 4 maps
-Ogre Lords
-Titans
-Terathan/Ophidian Avengers
-Changelings
-Dryads/Insane Dryads
-Lesser Hiryu
-Rune Beetle
-Yomotsu Priest
-Fairy Dragons

Would like to add Nightmares to that list, and I was under the impression that Terathan/Ophidian Avengers already dropped maps? Dryads/Insane Dryads/Lesser Hiryu, give them level 3. But I'll say again, way too easy to obtain maps...

Creatures that should drop level 5 maps
-Orc Brutes
-Reptalons
-Cu Sidhe
-Hiryu
-Yomotsu Elders
-Fire Daemons

Orc Brutes shouldn't drop maps, too easy to farm. Cu Sidhes already drop maps, their paragon version drops chests...

Creature that should drop level 6 maps
-Yamadon (remember the drop rate would be about 1 in 33)

Agreed, them big lizzies are badass

Loot:
Fix the Intensity bug obviously.

Still hoping Logrus can confirm or deny if it's a bug at all. I certainly hope so...

Runed Sashes:
Should have their duration increased to 30 seconds. And possibly add minor properties like +3 hp/stam/mana and +3 HCI/DCI/SDI. Variety keeps items interesting and valuable.

Agreed

Surge Shields:
Stamina regen should be +20 for 30 seconds
HP regen should last 30 seconds (still weaker than a Gheal potion)
Mana regen is fine

Agreed

I would like to suggest that maps from Paragon chests are of random facet aswell, to spice things up...

 

[Silverbird]

I would like to see slightly less randomization in the guardians that spawn. Why cant there be a thematic spawn? Like an orc camp or a brigands camp on a low level map. (Lets say one orc captain to lead the camp, one orc mage as help and a few plain orcs to fill up? Could workj the same way with higher lvls and titan/cyclops camps, elemental packs etc.)

 

[Basara]

Yes, because getting used to consulting an archive, recalling off a rune onto the exact spot will really teach them/give them practice in how to find the chests...

rolleyes:

If they are smart about going there to check out their skills (moving away from the spot, and working back in for practice - you know, that thing most people don't do anymore), instead of immediately digging, it will help them tremendously later on. If someone gets too frustrated when only trained enough from trying to find level 1 maps, then quits, it defeats the entire purpose of trying to revitalize the template. Not having an easier beginner's state, given the changes, would be as foolhardy as trying to raid a Harrower with a character fresh out of the New Haven skill quests.

Plus, it will get them used to the map landforms, to recognize areas from just the map on later, random spot, locations. I've gated people to within 20 seconds walk of towns, and they've had no clue of their location from their overhead map. I don't think that's gonna change much, and one of the reasons I DO know my way around is from comparing T-maps that I recalled to larger maps. And, it's why when the similarly random Turkey maps came up, my alliance always turned to me to find them, because I could read the maps.

Besides, last I checked, over half the rune libraries in UO were STILL using old runes from before 2004 - and both the Goodman and THB systems each had runes that were several steps away in error from the actual spots (and not even the same runes for both sets).

 

[Basara]

BTW, Abscess already has a paragon chest drop chance (I believe the chest I got was a level 6).

Rend has paragon chest drop as well (I think a level 6).

With the way the chest drop rules are, this would seem to indicate they have a map chance, just not very often (because so few actually hunt them), probably a level 5.

In both cases, it's been so long (the first few months of ML) since I got those chests, that I can't be sure of the actual chest level.

 

[Ben Sherman]

Rend has paragon chest drop as well (I think a level 6).

This I can confirm, and it is level 6.

 

[Sturdy]

I can just do a level fives in Fel with my archer- level sixes are still out of reach. Now stupid you are a full on PvM expert with experience and resources well beyond the average player- I think buffing the guardians too much would be a mistake.

Instead they could add a level seven that only drops off of champs very rarely? I think that would be fun- a t-map with a massive guild killing spawn and a chest full of arties. "A Tattered Map Drawn on Human Skin"




On the cart/mining issue, I have both and it is not a big deal, but it seems to me that they should just give the mining bonus to cartography and call it even. If there is a balance issue I am un-aware of they could give the mining bonus to detect to keep the whole thing thematically coherent.

I am pretty sure 90% of t-hunters stone off cart when they can.

 

[scarecrow73]

How about instead of off of champs, each lvl 6 has a chance at a piece of "A Tattered Map Drawn on Human Skin" and one would need all 4 pieces for a higer lvl map. There could be different versions of the map, like elf skin, human skin and gargoyle skin, which means one would have to find upper left, upper right, lower left and lower right pieces of same type skin to have a complete map. Then make the spawn like a champ spawn that spews forth a ton of Spawn and requires it to be worked to a champion defender...Like a paragon Rikktor or something? Just a thought...

 

[Goonball FC]

How about instead of off of champs, each lvl 6 has a chance at a piece of "A Tattered Map Drawn on Human Skin" and one would need all 4 pieces for a higer lvl map. There could be different versions of the map, like elf skin, human skin and gargoyle skin, which means one would have to find upper left, upper right, lower left and lower right pieces of same type skin to have a complete map. Then make the spawn like a champ spawn that spews forth a ton of Spawn and requires it to be worked to a champion defender...Like a paragon Rikktor or something? Just a thought...

nice idea

 

[Nastia Cross]

I may have mentioned this before but I seriously think that treasure chests should have talismans in them. No one does the Heartwood quests anymore so my crafters are lacking in good crafting talis.