The PVP stealth ninja... Advice? Lynk?

[Roland of Atlantic]

Ok, I know these are somewhat out of fashion, but I find my sampire running like crazy from raiders when they come to visit when I do my Fel spawns, and I have had enough of having my spawns taken from me and not taking a bit of revenge.

I have an old char that was my experiment with a pvm ninja, and I want to turn him into something that can sneak up on reds that are finishing up the spawn they took from me, surprise dismount and chop one down before he realizes he is being attacked, and fade away when he tells his buddys in Vent to come avenge him. As I build my skill, I could probably hang around after, and maybe pick off another if he strays too far from the group.

Right now template is
120 fencing
86.3 tactics (slow raise)
100 hiding
90 stealth (120 with investigator and cloak of silence)
72.2 ninja (soooo slow, working with a ninja ring and death strike)
44.3 Chiv (prolly useless)
93.3 focus (prolly useless)

I have a 705 skill cap. What other skills should I fit on this guy to make him a serious threat?

I'm assuming I will want 120 Ninja, what do I need for tactics? Is 90 enough, just to give me the second weapon special, or do I need to push it higher? Do I want healing, chiv, spirit speak or just use pots and dog form to heal?

After I fix skills and I know strategy, I need to equip him. Do I need to max HCI and DCI or just concentrate on just HCI and loads of mana for chaining death strikes? What arties should I build his suit around, and should I use woodland or leather?

Finally, any advice on weapons and tactics to use versus warriors, mages, mystics, etc?

 

[Heimi]

120 Ninja
120 Anatomy
120 Tactics
120 Fencing
120 Stealth
100 Hiding
Spare points in Focus, Spellweaving, Med, etc - up to you

I built mine with faction artifacts, specifically the Spirit of the Totem, Crimson Cincture and Primer on Arms talisman. I'm using a medable woodland suit since it gives big bonuses to resists after enhance. I have no EP on my jewels and didn't want to keep chugging stat pots every few minutes, so I have my Str at 150 from items for the damage boost and stamina at 140 to give me a buffer if I take damage (need 120 to swing my leaf blade at max speed with 30 SSI). Also I have around 90 Mana so I can chain a few specials/Death Strikes. As for healing, I use dog form and the HPR from suit since its a passive regen and I can do it hidden. You will definitely need to have 45 HCI, and HLD on your weapon or headpiece will be a big help - DCI isn't so important, but I put 40 on my suit just incase.

A note on tactics - fighting at spawns you may want to carry a few talismen of Ward Removal to pop mages out of Protection if they are working the spawn - the template is built for big burst damage so you don't want them precasting a Greater Heal to negate it.

 

[Roland of Atlantic]

Thanks for the reply, they have been rather sparse...

So If I didn't have the option of using faction arties, what stats should I shoot for?

Also, I want to start with a leather set because I dont have carpentry worked to be able to make a wodland anything, let alone to hope to enhance it. On the other hand, my tailoring is 120, so I can start with that, and replace it piece by piece with woodland when I can make it. I know I will be a real pain to make woodland, so I'm not looking forward to it.

What mods are you running on the suit?

Now that note about the ward removal talisman, that is something I didn't know. What a handy tool...

 

[Heimi]

Truth be told, making it out of woodland armour was probably unnecessarily complicated, as I had to imbue Mage Armour onto it so I could stealth, instead of the 2 HPR which bloodwood armour receives free. Statwise you'll want to have 150 Str, and depending on your weapons a 'buffer' of about 20 stamina over the cap would be handy. I currently have 27 base Int so you could pull points out of that to help reach the right levels for Str and Dex. I'm using a leaf blade for AIs currently, but if you were to use a kryss you could swing at 1.25 with 0 stamina if you have 35 SSI on the suit. A warfork will also swing at 1.25 with 90 stamina, so if you were to get within the range of 100-120 stamina you could drop the saved Dex points into Int.

On my jewels:

16 Str
16 Dex
40 DI
30 DCI
20 HCI

The faction Primer talisman has 10 HCI, so you'll want to drop DCI to 20 and take HCI to 30 if you go the same route, unless you're planning on using Conjuror's Trinket (not always a good idea if you're fighting around rat spawns). On each piece of armour I have 8 LMC, 8 MI, Mage Armour, 2 MR and the rest in a resist - also 2 HPR which came with enhancing.

Before jewels and items I'd say go for 113 Str (20 from SotT, 1 from talisman, 16 on jewels to 150) 99 Dex (5 from Crimson, 16 from jewels to 120) 43 Int. Being an elf would help too.

 

[Picus at the office]

I have a stealth ninja whom kills a fair amount of people though it is more of a gate/team fighter:

120 Macing(imo this is much better than fencing, use a war axe for bleed/AI and a fireworks wand for disarm/dismount)
120 Ninja
80 Hiding
100 Stealth
90 Healing
90 Tactics
120 Resist(mana vamp will kill you and ruin any hope of killing a person)
720 Total(you will need to find 15 points on your jewels)

I run 50 EP, max mana regen(2 per piece of armor and 3 on the chest) 40 LMC, 45 hci, 40 DCI. Chug before the fight starts, disarm and then DS. Follow up with a AI if they stick around and DS again. Most people die from this small combo. All my weapons have hit 50 fireball. Some of the DS's can hit for a total of 60+ damage with the intial strike, the delayed DS and the fireball.

 

[Roland of Atlantic]

Gotcha.

My ninjitso is only 99 at the moment, and I haven't had much luck raising it. It shot up from 70-95 quick enough with a bit of skill on jewels to stay around 86 skill, but at 95 it just seems to have stopped cold. I tried the max mana regen suit, lich form, deathstrike the bejesus out of a cat/dog/rabbit method (1 1/2 hours for .2 points), and I tried using the billion fukiya darts on slimes method (1 hour for .3) Is there a method I haven't tried yet that will work faster? Or should I SOT it to 105 and put 15 on jewels and let GGS bring it up the rest of the way?

Should I be using the fey legs for some DCI, or just go imbued except for the ToTV? The resists will probably be easier with all imbued, and I could work some more mana regen in there, but I suppose DCI would have to go on jewels, which will be further loaded with ninjitsu, and skills are costly in intensity at 1.4.

As far as tactics, I suppose my fist move would be the surprise dismount, do I follow that immediately with disarm, or go straight to deathstrike? Also, when sneaking around, passive reveal only works if I'm moving, but if I sit still they would actually have to look for me actively with area effects, fields and detect hidden. Is that right? What is the range in tiles to avoid detection?

 

[Picus of Napa]

Just to update my guy is in factions. I run all the standard faction items(primer, carapace and cinture) but have replaced the M&S glasses with the Folded Steel for the increase on DCI. All the other pieces are imbued/enhanced(mixture of Barbed and horned)with HCI, Stam or Mana plus 2 Mana regen and LMC. I also have the collar.

Jewels are 15/15, 50 ep, 42 Dmg increase, 10 healing(gets me to 100), dex 1 and mana regen 2. I also have a corgul's sash for a extra stam point and more dci. Rangers Cloak and a plain Conjurer's Garb.

All of my weapons have 50 HLD.

For a typical attack I don't bother with a dismount but instead stealth as close as I can. Mount a ethy. Attack with a disarm prepped and then switch to the war axe. DS, AI/bleed, DS if I'm lucky or chase the guy down.

Good Luck.

 

[Lynk]

Your tactics really need to change based on the scenario.

If you see some dude farming silver at demon temple and he's alone and you want to take him out, then yea, I'd probably dismount.

I would dismount, and then keep him bled so he can't remount or smokebomb/invis. Once you are able to mount your ethy, throw another bleed on him and mount.

You should pretty much have a win at that point.

If you're outnumbered then definitely mount up.

 

[Roland of Atlantic]

So you leave the deathstrike out for the bleed if he's on an ethy. If he's on a live mount do you go for the DS after dismount? How do your tactics change for mages/ dexxers, tamers?

Risso chose a mainly offensive skill spread, while Picus went for a more defensive build. I see advantages in both designs. What is your template?

 

[Lynk]

I have a few different stealther builds. I dont really build mine around defense.. more just all out offense. You need to be able to dish out enough damage to kill someone in under 6 seconds after you reveal yourself.

My favorite one (and I used a crap ton of skill point increase to hit this) has:

120 sword
120 myst
120 focus
120 ninjitsu
120 bushido
90 tact
100 hide
75 stealth

That suit alone cost me about 100 mil to build. But... spell plague, nerve strike, chuck conflag, death strike, spell triggered bombard, supernova pot. Between the conflag ticks, hit spell from weapon, trigger, and nova, I usually get all of the spell plauge procs to go off.

I also wear those big magik flippers all the time just in case someone is wearing a conj trinket.

In order for it to work, the nerve and death strike MUST connect consecutively. If I miss either of the swings I back off.

When it connects, the damage is so huge, so fast, that often times I can kill people when they have several guild members right next to them.

While I did manage to fit 45 DCI in the suit, my hitpoints are only 134 after a pot, I don't have resist, and most of my elemental resists are at 60. Theres one resist below 60. It was hard to fit all those skill points along with hci, dci, and other stuff in. My casting is very slow. This is really a quick assassin build. If I dont kill them instantly, I smoke bomb and dip out.

The first screenshot and the last ones are my favorites. The first one because its in front of their entire guild, the last one because you can see the nerve/death messages along with the killshot text all up at the same time. really demonstrates how quickly they go down.

Oh - and good luck trying to recreate this template!

 

[Roland of Atlantic]

Ok, that's pretty damned impressive! LOL

See, that's an Ferrari build, and while it might be all in a day's work for you, I think I need something a little more like a mid-level sports car. Something that has some grunt, but not a lot of class. I need something that a PVP noob can operate just fine that will not rely on giant intricate combos that I will inevitably screw up. It doesnt need to be awesome, just moderately effective.

My main char is a sampire, so most of my PVP experience comes from basically getting killed at a spawn, going back to the bank for my pvp suit and weapons, and going back with nothing in my pack to get looted, and usually getting killed again. I can hack throwing in special moves at the appropriate times, operating a trapped box and chugging pots, and thats about as much as I can juggle at once.

I want this char to help me get the training wheels off, and the ability to pop a bomb and create time to think is right up my alley. I finished off my suit yesterday. It uses S.o.T.T., fey legs, cloak of silence, royal investigator, mana phase orb and 4 enhanced leather pieces that leave me with 70/70/69/70/74, 25 hp increase, 40 LMC, 9 mana regen, and a whole mess of mana and stam increase. With the jewels, which I haven't figured out yet, I'll have 45 HCI, damage increase, maybe a little skill for ninja, and whatever else might help me kill people.

All that taken into consideration, what will work for a basic, easy to operate template for a noob like me?

 

[Picus at the office]

I would advise you to go with something closer to mine well before you try a temp like Lynk's. A simple temp with a decent chance of living. Work your specials, kill, die and have fun.

 

[Lynk]

I'd agree Picus's template would be better for you.

You seem to have plenty of mana. So I would just use that war axe. Keep them bled, when you get them to 3/4 life, thats when you DS/AI.

Should have plenty of fun on that build.

 

[Picus at the office]

So I tried out the Flippers last night as I've never used this before. Well I have to say I've added these to all of my PVP backpacks and will be buying a good number of sets more. Myself and a guildmate dropped a guy after stealthing up: He AI'd for 52 while I followed up with a DS for 64 plus the initial stike at 10 and hit spell for 12....Dead in one plunge equals loling for 10 minutes. I could only imagine what the DS would have been like with 120 stealth...oh my, I suspect you could reach 100 points total damage with spell triggering. Hmm might be time to replace my robe and cloak....

 

[Lynk]

I must admit.. I love stumbling on people working undead spawns in T2A or deceit. Much fun to be had.

 

[curlybeard]

A Mystic Ninja is a fun template. I play a similar template as Lynk, but without Bushido. Always wanted to add it, but didn't think I had the +skill items to make it work. Turns out it isn't that hard.

Should be able to make it work with:
Shadow Dancer Leggings +20 Stealth
Dread Pirate Hat +10 Swords (Capt John's is +20) and HCI
Cloak of Silence +10 Stealth
Ring and Bracelet + 53 skill each (max)

Need to keep the following real skill:
90 Swords & Tactics
40 Stealth (80 modified skill so I can use shadowstrike)
100 Hiding (duh)
I haven't tested Focus yet

45% HCI: 15% HCI from weapon, 6% from Mana Phasing Orb, 10-15% from the Pirate Hat, 9% more from jewels if using Capt John's Hat

100% LRC from armor including armor of fortune, imbued pieces

25ish% DCI

Would like to close to 100% DI, right now I have just 25% from Stormgrip

 

[slowbyrn]

could you please explain the big magic flippers? I thought all they did was turn you into an orc.

 

[Picus at the office]

If a person has on the undead talisman and you are in orc form any damage delt is up'd by 50%(i think that is the increase). Most of the time you will only get to kill a person a few times before they clue in but it makes for good lulz.

 

[Lynk]

Should be able to make it work with:
Shadow Dancer Leggings +20 Stealth
Dread Pirate Hat +10 Swords (Capt John's is +20) and HCI
Cloak of Silence +10 Stealth
Ring and Bracelet + 53 skill each (max)

I used the +20 stealth cloak and no shadow dancers.

I also use Obi Di Ense for focus.

And I fit more than just skills on my jewels.

 

[Elric_Soban]

does hiding/stealth actually affect DS damage? uoguide says it does, tooltips says it doesnt..

 

[Picus of Napa]

Yes is does but I've never seen the formula to show how.

 

[Lynk]

Your DS damage with max jitsu is like 50.

The actual damage dealt is done as an average for hiding/stealth.

100 hide, 0 stealth, 50% of the damage.

100 hide, 80 stealth, 90% of the damage. Etc, etc.

That is at least what the formula was before they changed the DS # of steps and timer.

 

[curlybeard]

can you use DP Fukiya darts for an extra spell plague tick?

 

[ryanouno]

fyi Im just finihsing my PVP Ninja build and i hope it will be worth

100 swords (+20 captains hat)
60 tact
120 Bush
85 Ninja (+35 jewells)
100 Hide
45 Stealth (+15 jewell, +20 Leggings - waiting to get Cloak)
100 Magery (need to fit 5 more for 100% chance to cast Flamestrike)
110 Eval (+10 tali)

Im running nonstop Protection with 0/6, 25 SDI, 30 DCI (with 75 Phy, Fire, Ene resists), 30 HCI (im waiting to get better ring so ill be able to get 45) and DMI (80 atm - also waiting for better ring)

The goal is to precast Explo and wait for splinter to go of on enemy and then spam him with DS, Nerves and Spells..

I hope ill be able to finish dat item hunt during this weekend and test it live on battlefield!!

 

[celticus]

I have a few different stealther builds. I dont really build mine around defense.. more just all out offense. You need to be able to dish out enough damage to kill someone in under 6 seconds after you reveal yourself.

My favorite one (and I used a crap ton of skill point increase to hit this) has:

120 sword
120 myst
120 focus
120 ninjitsu
120 bushido
90 tact
100 hide
75 stealth

That suit alone cost me about 100 mil to build. But... spell plague, nerve strike, chuck conflag, death strike, spell triggered bombard, supernova pot. Between the conflag ticks, hit spell from weapon, trigger, and nova, I usually get all of the spell plauge procs to go off.

I also wear those big magik flippers all the time just in case someone is wearing a conj trinket.

In order for it to work, the nerve and death strike MUST connect consecutively. If I miss either of the swings I back off.

When it connects, the damage is so huge, so fast, that often times I can kill people when they have several guild members right next to them.

While I did manage to fit 45 DCI in the suit, my hitpoints are only 134 after a pot, I don't have resist, and most of my elemental resists are at 60. Theres one resist below 60. It was hard to fit all those skill points along with hci, dci, and other stuff in. My casting is very slow. This is really a quick assassin build. If I dont kill them instantly, I smoke bomb and dip out.

The first screenshot and the last ones are my favorites. The first one because its in front of their entire guild, the last one because you can see the nerve/death messages along with the killshot text all up at the same time. really demonstrates how quickly they go down.

Oh - and good luck trying to recreate this template!

What benefit are the big majik flippers (makes yu an orc) against some 1 with the Conj trinket that is undead slayer item?

 

[Odin of Europa]

What benefit are the big majik flippers (makes yu an orc) against some 1 with the Conj trinket that is undead slayer item?

If a person has on the undead talisman and you are in orc form any damage delt is up'd by 50%(i think that is the increase). Most of the time you will only get to kill a person a few times before they clue in but it makes for good lulz.