Some advice on template please

[dupadupa]

currently im working on my tamer/bard... ill list where i am at.. and what i want to acheive and hopefully you guys can give me some feedback on what you think is right or wrong/can be better on my character.

actual wish for
animal lore 100 120 (20 jewlery)
animal taming 93.6 120 (20 jewlery)
vetinary 76.7 100
music 98.4 100
peace 75.6 100
magery 100 100
meditation 100 100

current skill total 644.3 740


first question... i know 720 is the skill cap - now when i add jewlery does that count against my total cap? if it does NOT then i wll be using jewlery with a combined 20 animal taming and 20 anaimal lore to make those skills 120....... leaving me with 40 skill points if im correct? is there anywhere you lot would suggest they go

 

[EnigmaMaitreya]

currently im working on my tamer/bard... ill list where i am at.. and what i want to acheive and hopefully you guys can give me some feedback on what you think is right or wrong/can be better on my character.

actual wish for
animal lore 100 120 (20 jewlery)
animal taming 93.6 120 (20 jewlery)
vetinary 76.7 100
music 98.4 100
peace 75.6 100
magery 100 100
meditation 100 100

current skill total 644.3 740


first question... i know 720 is the skill cap - now when i add jewlery does that count against my total cap? if it does NOT then i wll be using jewlery with a combined 20 animal taming and 20 anaimal lore to make those skills 120....... leaving me with 40 skill points if im correct? is there anywhere you lot would suggest they go

I run two tamers, one each account. They have total skill points of 749.x and 771.x

I am sure that there will be a person come on here and say that tomorrow they will change all that yadda yadda yadda.

Well, the problem with that thinking is that they have a lot of fish to fry. They spent 5 years getting things to this state and one certainly hopes they had a reason. To spend resources to undo the investment they made in UO for those 5 years, then spend resources to redo things to bring us back to were we are, is an interesting concept, considering that one might make the case that UO revenu is NOT growing.

As for the template advice there should be plenty of threads here were people have expressed their opinions on templates very similar to yours.

 

[Wenchkin]

There was mention about changing skill caps, but just a mention. If I was you, I'd be aware that it might change in future and require you to train, but in the meantime you can use jewellery and exceed the 720 cap. Just do it wisely because we don't know that a sudden change isn't coming either

If you're using jewellery on a tamer, I'd recommend using it on a non-vital skill like meditation or even magery, rather than your basic skills for pet control or barding. Ideally, you don't want to rush back to your corpse, call your pet away from danger and find it not only refuses the command, but loses loyalty. Spamming commands in that situation can result in a wild pet, so it's best to keep real skill where it counts.

I would suggest disco rather than peace. But if you've trained it already, you could always soulstone between the two skills for different setups. Peace isn't as great as it once was but disco is great for training your pets and general hunting. Music skills ideally need to be up to 120 to bard the highest level mobs. If you can only squeeze in one at 120, go for music as that's the first skill checked in determining your success rate. It is easier to train other music skills with music locked at 100 though, so you want to leave the last bit of training till your peace or disco is done

You could also borrow some skill points from meditation if required. This is when it's handy having the jewellery for med too - it's there if you're using magery intensively, but if not you have item slots free for other equipment. And if anything does change with skill items you won't lose anything essential.

My bard tamer also capped her magery at about 90 real skill then just carries a tome to add extra if she finds someone needing a res. I find that works pretty well

Wenchy

 

[dupadupa]

does'nt discor~ lower the stats of the animal you are trying to tame? or have i got that completly wrong...

that was the only reason i had peace... (created this char back in 2003)

thank you for the advice about jewlery... very interesting the bit about not using jewlery for vital skills, that situation u wrote about not being able to command pet would be a nightmare....

what i think ill do then is go with the current template but with my spare skill points get a real skill of 120/120 in animal taming and lore and get music to 120 along side peace

thank you for that... has made me see that using jewlery for lore/tame is not the smartest...

 

[5% Luck]

Dont listen to wenchy about skills jewelry her and a few others have been waging a campaign against being over the cap via jewelry but the consensus is that it is just fine to do so.

Anyhow on a peace tamer

120 peace music taming lore magery vet is the standard set up. expensive but more usefull than some.

The hybrid skill jewelery possibilitys can be very fun to play with

Just looking at the jewelery slot is a mistake. You can get the birds of Britannia talisman for 10 more points and a travesty mask for a further 20 points. Then drop your taming and lore to 110 leaving 90 points to play with. If you wield a scrappers or any mage book with a +10 or more skills that is a free gm skill. I would suggest eval.

after jewelry and skill items

110 tame
110 lore
100 vet
100 mage
100 med
100 eval
100 peace
100 music

If you wanted to raise your tame and lore to 120s then drop 20 points of med.









Just my 2 cents!

 

[Wenchkin]

Dont listen to wenchy about skills jewelry her and a few others have been waging a campaign against being over the cap via jewelry but the consensus is that it is just fine to do so.

Oh please... all I did was suggest using jewels for non-essential skills because it makes for a safer experience as a tamer. Which it does. I tried twinking when my younger tamer used cus for gains and went hunting with one, and that particular situation nearly cost me a pet when she commanded after a res, which is why I offered the caution, not as part of any campaign... Sheesh, you guys are touchy... Much as I don't agree with skill items, if you look you'll see I still suggested their use elsewhere in the template. I didn't say don't use items, I said don't use them on essential skills - not the same thing.

I'm trying to suggest options that won't screw someone up if a skill cap is put in or items changed, that's all. I don't want to think someone spent millions because I suggested it, only to find those items useless with a publish. I'd have said differently before the sampires were changed, but I think any advice along those lines should go with the proviso that changes may affect how that template works.

Wenchy

 

[Wenchkin]

does'nt discor~ lower the stats of the animal you are trying to tame? or have i got that completly wrong...

It does, but only temporarily. The critter is restored to its previous state if you break the discordance eg by invising yourself. I only disco the really awkward pets before taming, you can use honour if you like for a peace-like effect during taming. I use disco more for hunting and training pets, but it can be handy to lower a pet's skills while it tries attacking you in the taming process. But as I say, you could soulstone between the two if you like, then you'd get the best of both worlds

Wenchy

 

[EnigmaMaitreya]

Oh please... all I did was suggest using jewels for non-essential skills because it makes for a safer experience as a tamer. Which it does.

No your just engaging in scare tactics that are fundamentally baseless. With the goal of trying to get everyone to be a Jewelry Less Tamer, knowing full well (yet you will most certainly claim one can be a 120 tamer in 24 hours of easy effort) that +taming jewelry is what the majority of tamers use.

I'm trying to suggest options that won't screw someone up if a skill cap is put in or items changed, that's all.

Again your just engaging in scare tactics, there is nothing to suggest any change is going to happen tomorrow, the next day etc.

Your entitled to your opinions on what makes a REAL tamer vs a FAKE tamer. Thats all good and fine. What is your compulsion to try to scare people into being in your boat vs just telling them, "I think REAL tamers don't wear jewelry and FAKE tamers do".

The OP needs far more meaningful and constructive help with his proposed template (hence my suggestion to read what others have said because some of those threads have great information in them) than he needs to be totally unrealistically scared away from being a tamer.

To the OP, despite the scare tactics, +10 to Taming is about equal to 3 months of taming, releasing and killing appropriate level pets, once you hit the taming 90+ mark. Your only risk is that you forget to insure your jewelry and/or loot your corpse before trying to command a pet that your natural lore+taming wont let you command. Get a few complaints from the pet and you know what is wrong and probably wont do that again.

 

[EnigmaMaitreya]

does'nt discor~ lower the stats of the animal you are trying to tame? or have i got that completly wrong...

It does, but only temporarily.

To the contrary, there are intermittent bugs in the game that do leave the discorded, newly tamed pets, stats and skills with the disco'd effect factored in.

It can be a risky proposition and perhaps not one your want to risk on a High Value Keeper Tame.

 

[Wenchkin]

No your just engaging in scare tactics that are fundamentally baseless.

If a tamer doesn't have the required skill to control a pet and tries to command it when they forgot to equip taming skill items, that pet will lose loyalty and refuse a command. Continuing to command that pet can result in further loyalty loss and eventually a wild pet. That is not baseless, it is a fact. If you want to build a tamer template where that is no longer a possibility, you use skill items in the least vital skills to avoid problems. Again, I didn't say don't use items, I said use them on non-essential skills. Read it a few times and you'll see there is a very significant difference.

Again your just engaging in scare tactics, there is nothing to suggest any change is going to happen tomorrow, the next day etc.

And there wasn't much warning with sampires. The OP was asking for advice, my advice is not to use skill items for essential skills so they're safe control and for the future, whether there's change or not. You won't lose much if you use items for meditation and forget to re-equip them, or there's a change in how they work. If you depend on items for taming skill however, you do take risks. These again are facts...

Your entitled to your opinions on what makes a REAL tamer vs a FAKE tamer. Thats all good and fine. What is your compulsion to try to scare people into being in your boat vs just telling them, "I think REAL tamers don't wear jewelry and FAKE tamers do".

No, I offered different advice with reasons for doing so. I simply explained why I suggested using items for non-essential skills and why I'd run the template with important skills trained and minor ones boosted if necessary. Same results, different method. Future proof as a bonus.

The OP needs far more meaningful and constructive help with his proposed template (hence my suggestion to read what others have said because some of those threads have great information in them) than he needs to be totally unrealistically scared away from being a tamer.

Your advice is no better than anyone else's Enigma. I remember when you were asking for advice, so don't come telling me that I can't offer advice. It hasn't hurt you, and I haven't had a single complaint from anyone else who's received it. We all tame and handle our templates in different ways and players should be able to ask advice and receive it without tamers ripping into each other because they can't accept alternative suggestions. I sincerely hope the OP doesn't think the whole taming community is as volatile as you two are, it's worse than walking into a 5-girl flat when they're all having PMT....Learn to accept others don't share your opinions and maybe we might make progress.

Wenchy

 

[Wenchkin]

To the contrary, there are intermittent bugs in the game that do leave the discorded, newly tamed pets, stats and skills with the disco'd effect factored in.

It can be a risky proposition and perhaps not one your want to risk on a High Value Keeper Tame.

Personally I've not used disco for a kept pet beyond when my kitsune were being used to beat up a greater drag before taming. But it certainly hasn't bugged any of my training pets after a disco training session and when I used it during cu sidhe spawn working I didn't see it either. I'm guessing it's a very rare bug like the bless bug pets get. I know some folks refuse to even touch a a tame with their pets for fear it'll bless and risk messing with its stats.

I had a bugged runey that made a miraculous recovery, had its skills and stats all noted down after the bug then next time I lored it the git had apparently regained what it lost. Go figure...

Wenchy

 

[EnigmaMaitreya]

Your advice is no better than anyone else's Enigma. I remember when you were asking for advice

I totally agree my advice is no better than anyone else, I in fact tell people to look at other peoples posts. I even tell people I am a biased Peace Tamer and they would be well advised to ask the opinion of a Disco Tamer to offset my opinions, so they can form a personal choice based on their reasons.

And I remember when you knew things you clearly no longer know and have done a 180 on in terms of what makes a Tamer.

As for your reasoned advice. Yes, you do not ever want to use jewelry because you never know some day you may not have it on you and you will lose everything. Of course I wont tell you that you get a free, successful, auto retame on any lost pet. Reducing any and all concerns of this catastrophe to nothing. I wont tell you that you get quite a few "Disobey" status from the pet. I wont tell you a lot of things that would be of value to you to make a personal choice to wear or not wear +taming jewelry and I will of course say what I am doing is giving advice (vs objective, unbiased advice)

As I said, everyone is entitled to express their opinion on what constitutes a REAL tamer vs a FAKE tamer.

That would be refreshing vs giving advice based on fear if you don't do as I say.

 

[uoBuoY]

Just insure your jewels and you never need to worry about your pets going wild from your lack of skills. It might take a whole second to re-equip your jewels.

I've Disco tamed several hundred pets and never had their skill stay Discoed. But I guess anything could happen.

I second the idea of having both Peace and Disco available to your tamer. Music, Disco and Peace should be 120 if you're going to have any chance with tough stuff. 120 Disco makes training pets so much easier and faster.

For me, my 2 tamers only use Magery when they need to gate a fresh tame from a bad neighborhood.

 

[dupadupa]

mmmm this thread has turned into somewhat of a heated debate...

ive decided in the short term to jewellery skill the animal lore/taming and start working up my discord to 120 while stone'n my peace... with the idea in the future 6 months of raising my animal lore/vet to a real skill 120 whilst dropping some point off in med to achieve this, as i rarely cast magic... i would be using magery for like uobuoy said to gate animals out...

ill also look at raising my honour....


thank you everybody for the input... it has given me a direction to take... the problem was i created this char in 2003 and had no idea if the template was still a good one


again thankyou everyone... your input is much appreciated


Yours
Dupavoxe

now onto europa forum to find a guild.... but thats another story for a lonely player

 

[Wenchkin]

And I remember when you knew things you clearly no longer know and have done a 180 on in terms of what makes a Tamer.

Sorry, I don't remember signing up to keep the same opinions and always post the same things forever. Did you? It's called being human

As for your reasoned advice. Yes, you do not ever want to use jewelry because you never know some day you may not have it on you and you will lose everything.

Actually it's because I have the real skill to control the pets I use and don't need the items. Would you run 7-8 tamers all with the same pets? Why would I twink a full 120 tamer? Or a 110 one? All my tamers can control their pets already so why would I twink when I don't need to?

Of course I wont tell you that you get a free, successful, auto retame on any lost pet. Reducing any and all concerns of this catastrophe to nothing. I wont tell you that you get quite a few "Disobey" status from the pet. I wont tell you a lot of things that would be of value to you to make a personal choice to wear or not wear +taming jewelry and I will of course say what I am doing is giving advice (vs objective, unbiased advice)

Yeah, in 9+ years I hadn't figured out you could retame your own pets or how the loyalty system works I suppose nobody has had a pet get killed when it's turned wild and been attacked by spawn. That couldn't happen. Or could it?

See guys it's one thing to say use items, but you need to ensure the person receiving that advice knows about using them safely and what risks they take if they forget to insure something or spam commands. That would be more constructive than chewing my head off because I recommend something safer. Which I did. I didn't say anyone was a fake tamer, I just said use items on skills that aren't going to affect pet control or barding. Please, read my posts before getting excited next time.

Wenchy

 

[Wenchkin]

now onto europa forum to find a guild.... but thats another story for a lonely player

WoY are a good guild to look out for, I'm not sure if Nico is on the forums this week, but several of WoY are tamers and they're a friendly active bunch.

Wenchy

 

[EnigmaMaitreya]

Sorry, I don't remember signing up to keep the same opinions and always post the same things forever. Did you? It's called being human

Oh I totally accept posters, like humans change.