Please move the fel covetous points turnin!

[Raptor85]

I know you moved it to Cove...but there's still a major issue with it....It's still smack in the middle of a guard zone! Since it's payable in "points" it can be farmed 100% safely and purchased in the safety of town...that's not cool...there's enough of tram in fel already. If people want to do that on the tram side...whatever, but for siege especially that location is unacceptable!

Why not just have the NPC hang out in front of covetous itself...that would make a lot more sense as well.

 

[RaDian FlGith]

So that anyone who managed to earn enough points could turn around and be jumped immediately for whatever they purchased? No offense, but that seems to be a bit much. I'd say, at best, a vendor in two different locations, one inside guards and one outside guards.

 

[Raptor85]

if you want to farm free of risk there's tram for that, it's bad enough that there's no loot to carry but having the turnin in a GZ is just insulting.

 

[Lord Frodo]

How dare you take our sheep away from us.

 

[G.v.P]

Mmmm why not just fight the people in Covetous until they leave? Hrm, I mean, what, you want to insta-gib players before they insure their new loot off the NPC? Haha. Can imagine a gank of stealthed archers just sitting that one out.

I guess it does bring up a valid point, though. Previously, in Fel, you fought over physical items that could be lost and stolen. Completion of a spawn, for example, would always end in obtainable items. Covetous challenges a group to not only kill the other side but to protect a specific region as well in order to get the points. The problem is the points are shared (based on wave total, not total total), and the dead opponents will inevitably get some of the points even in between deaths if they remain in the dungeon.

I wonder if one solution--barring any NPC change--might not be an advanced use of exorcism? Maybe if the spell knocks a player ghost to the entrance of Covetous or something. Might be a little better than an enemy side camping the cave paths in between (every time you force the enemy to leave the dungeon it'll cost them waves). Otherwise, it'll be just like Champ Spawns...if you aren't there to raid, you'll lose out.

 

[Lady Storm]

Psst...............
He is talking of Siege placement...
There is no Tram. But I do see ya'lls point. I had to give up on alot of things on Siege when turn in was in luna.... they would kill you the minute you looked cross eye'd
Yes things have slowed down to a trickle but we got new people running around....... not sure if they are kosher on sharing with non voilent people......

 

[FrejaSP]

So that anyone who managed to earn enough points could turn around and be jumped immediately for whatever they purchased? No offense, but that seems to be a bit much. I'd say, at best, a vendor in two different locations, one inside guards and one outside guards.

I think this will work well.
Anyway, we can only bless one item at the time, so what is the problem unless you are thinking off the crafter stuff. Also, not all crafters are gathering resources in guard zone so let them get their tools and find them in the forest and mining caves.

 

[Raptor85]

The issue is they don't drop their "points" if killed when farming, so if we kill an enemy guild there they lose NOTHING...they get to keep all their farming points. Since the turnin is in guard zone, same, there's nothing we can do. At the very least they could have made it like faction life-force where if you die it transfers to who killed you...

 

[FrejaSP]

The issue is they don't drop their "points" if killed when farming, so if we kill an enemy guild there they lose NOTHING...they get to keep all their farming points. Since the turnin is in guard zone, same, there's nothing we can do. At the very least they could have made it like faction life-force where if you die it transfers to who killed you...

Siege is not all about PvP, You can still kill the Customers of the crafters and loot the armor they use. This will make the shard more busy. When you make it possible for the crafters to craft useful PvP gear to a fair price, more will be willing to PvP.
There may also be some fights at covetues. Maybe there won't be a back with monster loot on your victim but there will still be loot on him/her.
I think the changes we already got do help the shard and more love to the crafters can only bring more life to the shard.

 

[Raptor85]

well, i normally don't take the crappy lrc suits and such the tamers wear (only loot they've farmed & artys) but since you're not going to have any other loot i'll just have to start taking everything and camping out in the area then....

 

[FrejaSP]

I do agree, the point system may be a little against the Siege rules but I doubt they will make a special version for Siege. Moving the turnin to outside guard zone will just make it to a place where crafters and non PvP'ers will have no chance surviving as it will be camped of stealth PK's.
There are still alot places to find victims carring loot. Also we are not tamers all of us and the better access I have to crafting and imbuing resources, the better will my suit will be and I do sell suits with more mods than just LRC and resist.
If we could get rid of the Siege Bless, I believe I could sell weapon too.
More looted suits may give the crafters more business.

 

[Lady Storm]

Look I have played siege from open 99% of the times most have left my crafters alone , she has always been good egg to players and even helped new comers to shard. I dont want to go back to the days where I have to hide out till all hours to mine or chop wood to get resources or be scared my poor pet will be killed and no tamer to rez them...
Contrary to popular belief I dont have millions in the bank on siege.... and the lrc suits I have are very few. If I could send stuff to siege I wouldnt care less about them but i cant soooo lay off my crafters plz.

 

[Mervyn]

I'd be careful mentioning the f word in these forums

 

[Petra Fyde]

I think you will have to try to find the crafters when they're using the items they claimed with their points.
Putting the npc outside of guardzone would just mean no one would claim anything in the belief that the poor dear was being camped.

 

[Raptor85]

inside their house or from a bank in a guard zone you mean? Face it, where the NPC is now on siege people will be claiming the rewards and putting them directly in their bank....they may as well be blessed...

 

[Viper09]

If these items are able to be stolen why not just make a thief? Or simply go and find the crafters who are already using these items in the open?
I understand wanting it to be out of guard zones but then it pretty much destroys any chance for crafters who can't fight well to have these items.

 

[Raptor85]

If these items are able to be stolen why not just make a thief? Or simply go and find the crafters who are already using these items in the open?
I understand wanting it to be out of guard zones but then it pretty much destroys any chance for crafters who can't fight well to have these items.

I have a thief, the account is inactive though, wouldnt work anyways, the items are mostly 7+ stones and the turnin is in the middle of a incredibly crowded area (about 5-10 NPC's average on screen), chance of being able to steal even a 1 stone item without instant guardwhack is practically non-existant in that area.

If these crafters can't fight well also, how are they clearing 40 waves of enemies with tons of HP inside the dungeon to get the points in the first place?

Besides the point though, point farming in safety and turning in the items safely isn't just against siege....it's against how fel is built in general....it should never have been set up like that.

 

[Lord Frodo]

I'd be careful mentioning the f word in these forums

TROLL

 

[Viper09]

I have a thief, the account is inactive though, wouldnt work anyways, the items are mostly 7+ stones and the turnin is in the middle of a incredibly crowded area (about 5-10 NPC's average on screen), chance of being able to steal even a 1 stone item without instant guardwhack is practically non-existant in that area.

Didn't look too crowded to me. If you have 120 stealing stealing chances are not that slim.

 

[Raptor85]

i counted about 8 npc's right around the turnin last i looked, and that's even assuming they don't call guards themselves. Stealing skill is a check per nearby character as to whether you go gray or not, it's not the chance of stealing it that's the problem, it's the fact that you'd get guardwhacked either from the npc's or the player pretty much instantly.

Besides, i'm not paying another $15 a month to activate my thief just for this, if it's not moved I'll just make up the difference with a used armor vendor....

 

[Viper09]

Ah, well perhaps my bias of being a thief makes me more optimistic.

But to your previous point, I've always viewed PvM and PvP differently. One who is good fighting swarms of monsters might suck horrible against players, especially if there is a group of them camping the turn-in spot.
I still see the risk involved with the current turn-in location as there will be plenty of other thieves near that point sneaking about. The risk factor in farming is ever present as the spawns are obviously out of the guard zone. But that's opinion.

 

[Raptor85]

Ah, well perhaps my bias of being a thief makes me more optimistic.

But to your previous point, I've always viewed PvM and PvP differently. One who is good fighting swarms of monsters might suck horrible against players, especially if there is a group of them camping the turn-in spot.
I still see the risk involved with the current turn-in location as there will be plenty of other thieves near that point sneaking about. The risk factor in farming is ever present as the spawns are obviously out of the guard zone. But that's opinion.

not a lot of risk factor while farming, 99% of the people doing it will be on stealth tamers with nothing but a normal lrc suit on and they don't drop their "points" when they die.

 

[FrejaSP]

You could also wait to the crafter is out farming resources with his new tools and then kill them to get their resources. Camping a point people have to go too is a cheap way to get your kills.
Also do you really need to ruin it for the crafters when more active crafters will give more PvP gear the PvP/PvM'ers can affort and in the end more players who will like to dance with you.

 

[Petra Fyde]

inside their house or from a bank in a guard zone you mean? Face it, where the NPC is now on siege people will be claiming the rewards and putting them directly in their bank....they may as well be blessed...

Maybe you should consider what these rewards actually are? It would be difficult to use the resource maps, the talismans, the fish finder in the house? There's not a lot of point to using the mobile forge in the house either, only the cauldrons are likely to be used in the house.

Not many will be wanting to waste much of the limited lifespan these items have letting it sit, unused, in the bank.

 

[Zosimus]

You never know what players may do with them on Siege. You are guessing what they may do with them by putting them in the bank. Tis not definetly fair to ask for them to be put in a non guard zone and player A does all that hard work so they can get ganked by player B, C, and D to claim a prize they didnt want to work for either.

 

[Raptor85]

They're farming something that doesn't drop anything to their backpack and they cannot lose (points) and claiming the rewards which are not "only" the cheap crafting tools (who's short duration makes it HIGHLY unlikely that you'll ever run into them while they're using them) but also wearable pieces and the ingot conversion pot. It would say for the ingot conversion thing it would be downright SILLY to ever have it anywhere but their bank or siege bless it quick to take it home...and for the armor pieces due to the point cost and time invested it's HIGHLY unlikely that those that will be using them won't be blessing them. This makes it the first place on siege where you can farm without having to bother with defending yourself from opposing guilds as you drop NOTHING while farming (the tamers and mages need not even bother brining a luck suit as it seems to have no effect here, the cheap and simple 100lrc suits everyone has tons of will suffice)

If you believe people on siege are going to stroll out of the guard zone with a bunch of unblessed artys in their pack though....perhaps you've encountered different plaeyrs than I have...

 

[Zosimus]

You believe they will bank it and I believe in what you say but, I also believe that it's possible they wont bank it and stroll out in the open. I do understand your point and its very valid but I am always optimistic that other things can happen because it's human nature not to think sometimes.

If you are say they wont be using armor for example because its Siege basically then why would anybody want to get them in the first place

In the end usually what added to on the other shards always makes a mess on Siege. You think the devs would know by now

 

[Raptor85]

You believe they will bank it and I believe in what you say but, I also believe that it's possible they wont bank it and stroll out in the open. I do understand your point and its very valid but I am always optimistic that other things can happen because it's human nature not to think sometimes.

If you are say they wont be using armor for example because its Siege basically then why would anybody want to get them in the first place

In the end usually what added to on the other shards always makes a mess on Siege. You think the devs would know by now

Don't believe you play on siege so you may not know, but we get a single item "personal bless" via character gump...it's not that I believe people won't use them, it's that I believe due to the time required to farm them that when people do use them they'll probably be the single item bless and the rest would be filled in with junk armor pieces (this is pretty much common practice suit building here) (the bless stays blessed until you bless another item or set the item down in a container or ground).

Basicly...
1. Farm points safely risking nothing
2. Turnin inside guard zone banking items
3. Sell items in new-mag vendors
4. They're now either permanant "collection" pieces or siege blessed items

The only way people are EVER going to risk them is if they're either AFK farmed driving the cost to the "not worth it" level or the time/item is significantly lowered to keep them super cheap...the cutoff point where most people will risk an item is around 50k gold (for MOST people)

 

[FrejaSP]

Give it up. Except for one Siege Bless item, Siege is still without Item Insurance so I'm sure there still will be some loot for you. Try to play to share some fun with your victims, try do a little RP.
And if you want this points so badly, try to do a little PvM when looking for victims.
It look like you are very alone with this cryout.
And to the ones who think we play naked on Siege. You are wrong. We may not use very expensive stuff unless we can affort losing it but I do sell imbued armor in different ranges of prices so noone are using them. If we did not have the single Siege Bless, I'm sure I would sell alot imbued weapon too.
All have the choice between being almost naked, weak and die easy or put some money/resources/time in getting a suit, that may help them stay alive and have more luck when farming.
I do believe it may be about time to let pet bonding go on Siege or nerf it so you only can rez a pet x times. We do have Pet vendors now so getting a new pet should be easier now as someone will find a business in taming and selling them.
I also believe stealth do need a nerf on Siege, the shard look more emty than it is when far to many are stealthing around. It may be a little scary to live without stealth at first but I'm sure all will get use to it.
There are alot they can do to help Siege and one way is to give us alot of busy crafters. I would like to see new guilds grow up. Crafter guilds with PvP/PvM members to protect them and help them get the resources that need fighting skills.
More sheeps on Siege will bring more wolves.

That will bring Siege back to life.

 

[elspeth]

Hmm. I'm confused. Don't y'all pvp for the fun of fighting? Are you guys really complaining because you can't get the stuff from the people you kill? I think this system sounds fantastic. People will go to covetous to get points, covetous will be camped somewhat by pvpers because that's where the action is but people will keep going anyways just because they WON'T lose their points. All they have to lose is the usual, gold for insurance or armor/whatnot on siege but they still have a chance of getting points and thus eventually getting their reward. Champ spawns were not done by the average person because you could spend hours and do lots of work and then get run off right before the champ pops and not get a damn thing for all your time. They were great for big pvp battles but they still exist, why should covetous be made the same as that? I think it sounds really good the way it is. On production shards everyone will probably do this in tram no matter what except for reds of course. On siege it will be a new gathering point and one that endures due to the limited lifespans of the rewards but at least people won't just throw up their hands and say "its not worth it because I'm going to get killed and then get nothing". And its not like the pvpers can't kill spawn and get points themselves while waiting for victims. I guess I never understood the whole point of pvp then . . . *sigh*

 

[Raptor85]

PVM is for blues, a lot of us find it boring. siege is the only OSI shard still left that actually allows pure PVP playstyles...this is a HUGE step in removing that.

 

[FrejaSP]

Some PvP for the loot, some for the fun, some for both.
One of the point of PvP is, you never know how other players will react, when you attack them and you never know how the PK who attack you will act when/if he kill you.
If you fight monsters, you know how they will react, how strong they are and what loot to expect.
When I still did some RP PvP, I did not kill for the loot, I played a vampire and I really only wanted my victims blood to keep me healthy. Other do kill for the loot too as PK's do get killed and looted too, they need loot, just like you kill monsters for the loot.
I rather die to a PK and get looted dry than to a monster gank and see my stuff decay, because I can't get back to claim it. I had learned always to have at least one suit ready if I die. Even on Siege, I don't die offen and it's sure not everytime I get heavy looted. Some may only loot my loot back, some only kill for the challenge and a few will loot my dry.
We had seen complains here, from someone who tells, they always get dry looted and rez killed. I had dry looted and rez killed a few too but there had been a reason for me to do it and trust me, they did deserve it. With that said, Siege may sometimes have a few grief PK's but they are few.
When I started UO, I was 44 years and female. My sons started to play and soon I was playing too. It was on Atlantic, with dial up from Denmark so lag was very bad and I offen found me char dead to monsters or PK's after lost con.
I loved the game did not hide in town, even when I counted 30 red names, whith hunting ground in east brit, where I did my hunting, lumbering and mining. You may think I would die alot, not really, only a few of them killed me more than a one time but they learned me alot about PvP and how to fight back. Most ended up as friends and after 5-6 months or so, I started to RP a highwayswoman and started my guild, The Dark Outlaws.
Many of my red friends wanted to run with me but I did not want to be in a gank, who just killed and looted their victim. Most time I did run alone, but a few did agree to do it my way, when hanging out with me.
If their had been Trammel, when I started, I fear I would had ended up as a scared Trammel player, who never would go to Fel or to Siege. But I'm born before Trammel and I love the freedom and wild life on Siege.

 

[Viper09]

I think you're overreacting quite a bit there Raptor. Nothing is changing here, at all. The only thing being added is an npc in guard zone territory where people can exchange points for temporary items. Thieves will certainly have a heyday and the pks will be able to find the crafters/resource gatherers with new items on their own. So you can't camp a friggin vendor and attack people when they get a measly item, how is this such a negative impact?

I really hope this has nothing to do with you refusing to PvM and wanting those items.

 

[elspeth]

Other do kill for the loot too as PK's do get killed and looted too, they need loot, just like you kill monsters for the loot.

Aww, now I begin to understand. I wonder how many people out there really never do PvM at all though. I suppose you could in the beginning of UO and perhaps that is what so many miss. Thanks Freja, nice post. Makes me want to try out siege again

 

[FrejaSP]

If you do give Siege a try, be sure to login to general chat and if you need something, just ask, there may be some willing to help you. If you feel the shard look emty, try to say hi in the chat and you may see we are there.
Don't give up first time you get killed, step a little away from your body, show your ghost. Maybe the PK will rez you or tell you to find a healer. When you get back, do go near your body before the killer is done looting or he may end up rez kill you. Maybe ask nicely if there is anything left for you and tell you are new here.
If your stuff is gone and you don't have a new suit in the bank, ask for help in the chat, be cool, don't cry.