Let's Play "What If"....

[Tina Small]

A little over two years ago, shortly before the Stygian Abyss expansion entered its open beta period, Electronic Arts announced that it had entered into a licensing agreement with a Chinese company called NetDragon Websoft, Inc. to develop a new MMORPG based on Ultima Online. The press release stated that NetDragon would develop the new Ultima Online in collaboration with EA's Mythic Entertainment. Also, once the new game was developed, NetDragon would have the exclusive license to operate the new game in China, Hong Kong, Macau, and India.

This licensing agreement between EA and NetDragon Websoft followed by approximately eight months an announcement that EA and NetDragon Websoft had entered into a licensing agreement for NetDragon to develop a 3D MMORPG based on EA's Dungeon Keeper line of games. As with the agreement for development of a new Ultima Online MMORPG, NetDragon was granted the exclusive license to operate the game in certain countries, including Greater China, Hong Kong, Taiwan, and Macau. Dungeon Keeper Online is NetDragon's first 3D MMORPG (others of its earlier MMORPG titles are 2.5D) and it has both an open world element and dungeons, which were developed using different game engines. It is currently in its elite closed beta stage and according to an August press release from NetDragon, is expected to enter public open beta next month and be released by the end of 2011. At this link on the official Chinese website for Dungeon Keeper Online, you'll find a video (mostly in English) where Chris Ondrus of EA describes Dungeon Keeper Online and why EA selected NetDragon to develop it: http://dk.91.com/guide/video/gf_vedio.shtml?vid=7.

So, who is NetDragon Websoft, Inc.? According to their own press, they are one of the leading online game developers and operators in the People's Republic of China. The company was established in 1999 (in the Cayman Islands) by Liu Dejian (a 1995 graduate of Kansas State University). Its Vice President and Chief Financial Officer is Chak Man Wu, a 1994 graduate of the University of California (Berkeley) who received his MBA from Duke University. The company has its headquarters in Fuzhou, Fujian, China, and has been listed on the Main Board of the Hong Kong Stock Exchange since 2008. NetDragon Websoft develops and operates many MMORPGs and along with its subsidiaries is heavily involved in R&D for online games and mobile Internet business. Their US office is in Diamond Bar, California.

Many of NetDragon Websoft's games have been released in multiple languages, including Chinese, English, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Arabic, Turkish, Malay, and Indonesian, and since 2004 they have been operating online games in other countries in English, French, Spanish, Arabic, and Turkish. (Their US portal is at us.91.com and the European portal is at eu.91.com.) They have licensed several of their games with other companies to be operated in countries such as Russia, the Commonwealth of Independent States (CIS), Japan, Taiwan, Hong Kong, Macau, and Vietnam. In addition to Electronic Arts, they also have agreements with several other companies to develop online games, including Disney Online, Ubisoft, and Hasbro, Inc. They have also been working with SINA Corporation (a large online media company) to co-develop a stock trading simulation game named "Stock Tycoon." All of their online games currently available in English (e.g., Conquer Online, The Warlords, Eudemons, Zero Online, and Crazy Tao) are free-to-play.

They also have done significant in-house development of mobile phone application software for multiple platforms. In April 2011, NetDragon entered into an agreement with DeNA Co., Ltd, which owns a large Japanese mobile SNS website called Mobage Town, to develop games for the Mobage platform. By the end of 2011, the company expects to release English web browser and tablet PC versions of their Conquer Online game.

The company has also been recognized in the last several years by Fortune Magazine and Forbes as one of the best companies to work for in China. They jointly invested with IDG Capital Partners to establish the "mFund," a special investment fund targeting China's emerging mobile internet space. As of June 30, 2011, they had 2,139 employees, with 1,364 in R&D and 232 in the mobile internet business.

With public open beta testing for World of Dungeon Keeper Online scheduled for next month, I think if it goes well, it will be just a matter of time before we start hearing about closed beta testing for Ultima Online. I fully believe that EA plans to roll out a 3D version of Ultima Online in time for UO's 15th anniversary next year, which leads me to the purpose of this poll! (Finally, you say!)

If EA decides to replace the current version of Ultima Online with a brand spanking-new 3D version they developed in collaboration with NetDragon Websoft, would you play the new version? And would your decision be contingent on being able to access in the new version your existing characters and perhaps even their existing houses? Or would you give it a try even if you had to start completely from scratch on brand new, empty servers that didn't necessarily correspond with the current ones? Would your decision be contingent on which company (e.g., Electronic Arts, NetDragon Websoft, or possibly some other company in the business of operating games) actually operates the game in your preferred language and with your preferred localized content? And would your decision be contingent on continuing to have to pay a subscription fee, or would you give a free-to-play (F2P) version a try?

I'll have some polling options up in a few minutes....so bear with me please while I try to make them fit!

 

[Kayne]

Oh no I can already see the direction this topic is going to take.

 

[Zosimus]

I voted other for the time being. It's just not enough and clear information on where it will be distributed but just that region.

The things I read about Netdragon that it's only going to be in the China region.

Dungeon Keeper Online
Comment from EA Announce Dungeon Keeper MMO

Sadly for Western lovers of the franchise, the game is slated to appear only in China, Taiwan, Hong Kong and Macau.

Another comment from Dungeon Keeper Online MMO announced . . . for China

An online Dungeon Keeper MMO (Massively Multiplayer Online game) has been announced for release in China by publisher Netdragon, who is licensing the franchise and its themes, characters and other content from EA in a deal for an exclusive online MMO that they will release and distribute throughout the Greater China region, including mainland China, Hong Kong, Taiwan and Macau.

Read more: Dungeon Keeper Online MMO announced . . . for China Dungeon Keeper Online MMO announced . . . for China

So lets go to Netdragons Ultima Online

Comment from WarCry Network : News : Ultima Online: EA & NetDragon Set to Revive UO

HONG KONG, July 22 /PRNewswire-Asia-FirstCall/ -- Electronic Arts Inc. and NetDragon Websoft Inc., a leading game developer and operator in China, today announced a licensing agreement for the development of a new massively multi-player online role playing game (MMORPG) based on "Ultima Online" from Electronic Arts. As part of the agreement, NetDragon will develop the new Ultima Online in collaboration with EA's Mythic Entertainment, and have the exclusive operating license for China, Hong Kong, Macau and India


I can go on and on with the links. It seems that the games are made for that region and only licensed in that region. Any vids of the game that are out show the chinese language on the screen. EA is just expanding in that region since it's the money maker of the world now.

I know there is a rumor ( let me say it again.. "A RUMOR" not rumors) floating around that EA may allow Netdragon to expand it's licensing area but it's only rumor. There are no comments from EA or Netdragon to back this rumor up.

 

[Lady Storm]

I am not going to vote at this time...

IF and I mean IF EA stoped the clasic client of UO for a 3D virsion of the game I would call it quits.

 

[Tina Small]

When I read both the UO and Dungeon Keeper press releases, it really looked to me as if the only exclusive arrangement NetDragon Websoft has is for operating the games in certain countries. I think that leaves the door wide open for EA to operate those games in other countries if they want to or let other companies operate them.

UO is too valuable of a property for EA to just abandon it. But the last few years a lot of their resources have been tied up with developing the new Star Wars title and UO as it stands now is clearly not bringing in many new customers or even many returning customers. From the looks of things, it is losing customers fasting than it is gaining them. So, I think outsourcing an upgrade of UO for worldwide release is definitely in keeping with their current philosophy of trying to wring more profit out of older titles, even if it means a drastic revamp or moving it to a new platform of sorts. EA may even figure that dropping the old title in favor of a new one eliminates one of their headaches (i.e., us and our constant demands and whining as if we're playing one of their top titles). They may figure that a fresh look at an old game, unpopulated with bored billionaire vets, will do better in the long run than trying to keep the current version limping along under two sagging clients.

 

[GalenKnighthawke]

One can speculate over what one chooses, I suppose.

But reality should, I argue, be at least noted.

http://vboards.stratics.com/2021202-post3.html

I'm an old-fashioned boy, I know.

-Galen's player

 

[Kri]

While I'd definitely try out another Ultima based MMO I'm not sure I would consider it a "replacement." There are a lot of great ideas and systems in ultima online to draw from but I'd prefer the game to stand on its own merits and that might be hard if it's tethered to 14 years worth of baggage.

 

[Luvmylace]

I voted but let me be clear I will not play a Japanese pokemon uo.
now if it looks Like Age of Conan ,that is a different story but "cartoony" and WOW- like are out.
If they do it ,they better do it right ,no 2nd chances

 

[canary]

I think the game would actually take a turn for the better without EA at the helm.

We see smaller games out there with actually more ongoing content being released including art and actual communication with their respective development teams. And they do it on what might be a smaller budget than EA's for UO.

 

[Tina Small]

One can speculate over what one chooses, I suppose.

But reality should, I argue, be at least noted.

http://vboards.stratics.com/2021202-post3.html

I'm an old-fashioned boy, I know.

-Galen's player

Yep, married to both clients for the life of what's left of the existing game, Galen. Do you really think any producer in their right mind would knowingly promise that a 14-year old client is really going to exist for another five or ten years? I think the existing game's future is very limited at this point and that's why he was able to make that statement.

 

[Entheeya]

I would try a F2P 3D version of UO even if it required a fresh start and wasn't operated by EA.


The bugs might be cleared up if EA didn't have their hands in it....

 

[Zosimus]

When I read both the UO and Dungeon Keeper press releases, it really looked to me as if the only exclusive arrangement NetDragon Websoft has is for operating the games in certain countries. I think that leaves the door wide open for EA to operate those games in other countries if they want to or let other companies operate them.

UO is too valuable of a property for EA to just abandon it. But the last few years a lot of their resources have been tied up with developing the new Star Wars title and UO as it stands now is clearly not bringing in many new customers or even many returning customers. From the looks of things, it is losing customers fasting than it is gaining them. So, I think outsourcing an upgrade of UO for worldwide release is definitely in keeping with their current philosophy of trying to wring more profit out of older titles, even if it means a drastic revamp or moving it to a new platform of sorts. EA may even figure that dropping the old title in favor of a new one eliminates one of their headaches (i.e., us and our constant demands and whining as if we're one of their top titles). They may figure that a fresh look at an old game, unpopulated with bored billionaire vets, will do better in the long run than trying to keep the current version limping along under two sagging clients.

I agree with what you say but you must of missed that first link. We all know about EA. It's no hidden secret but that is a China operated company. EA is just cashing or hoping to cash in on it..

Another quote from the first link I posted...

Dungeon Keeper Online, as the game will be known as, is to be developed by Chinese studio NetDragon Websoft. As part of the deal,. NetDragon will get access to all of Dungeon Keeper's "themes, characters and other game content", while EA will get access to (provided the game succeeds) large amounts of cash money

This new UO being made is not going to happen for the rest of the world. It will be under China's region and curtain so to speak.

 

[Tina Small]

When I read both the UO and Dungeon Keeper press releases, it really looked to me as if the only exclusive arrangement NetDragon Websoft has is for operating the games in certain countries. I think that leaves the door wide open for EA to operate those games in other countries if they want to or let other companies operate them.

UO is too valuable of a property for EA to just abandon it. But the last few years a lot of their resources have been tied up with developing the new Star Wars title and UO as it stands now is clearly not bringing in many new customers or even many returning customers. From the looks of things, it is losing customers fasting than it is gaining them. So, I think outsourcing an upgrade of UO for worldwide release is definitely in keeping with their current philosophy of trying to wring more profit out of older titles, even if it means a drastic revamp or moving it to a new platform of sorts. EA may even figure that dropping the old title in favor of a new one eliminates one of their headaches (i.e., us and our constant demands and whining as if we're one of their top titles). They may figure that a fresh look at an old game, unpopulated with bored billionaire vets, will do better in the long run than trying to keep the current version limping along under two sagging clients.

I agree with what you say but you must of missed that first link. We all know about EA. It's no hidden secret but that is a China operated company. EA is just cashing or hoping to cash in on it..

Another quote from the first link I posted...

Dungeon Keeper Online, as the game will be known as, is to be developed by Chinese studio NetDragon Websoft. As part of the deal,. NetDragon will get access to all of Dungeon Keeper's "themes, characters and other game content", while EA will get access to (provided the game succeeds) large amounts of cash money

This new UO being made is not going to happen for the rest of the world. It will be under China's region and curtain so to speak.

I dunno. I really don't read the press release that way, Zosimus. And after spending many many hours reading Net Dragon's press releases and other information about them, they have a few games (e.g., Conquer Online) where they have produced expansion packs specific to other regions (e.g., the Middle East and north Africa, or countries where Turkish is a common language, or even Brazil and in Portuguese) for language and content.

Edited to add the following links to the original press releases regarding the agreements between EA and NetDragon Websoft for development of Dungeon Keeper Online and a new version of Ultima Online:

December 1, 2008 agreement for Dungeon Keeper Online: http://ir.netdragon.com/content/2008-12-01/20081201073200333.shtml

July 22, 2009 agreement for Ultima Online: http://ir.netdragon.com/content/2009-07-21/20090721211510467.shtml

 

[GalenKnighthawke]

Yep, married to both clients for the life of what's left of the existing game, Galen. Do you really think any producer in their right mind would knowingly promise that a 14-year old client is really going to exist for another five or ten years? I think the existing game's future is very limited at this point and that's why he was able to make that statement.

One day UO may well die.

And if that happens, the last one who said "UO is dying" will look like a prophet.

But the reality is that folks have been saying things much like this for much of UO's 14+ year history. If it one day does die it will have little if any relation to any prediction thereof.

There are two big threats to UO: EA's spurts of irrationality and our spurts of irrationality, the latter of which take many different forms, of which random rumor starting is only one.

Oh well. I sure can't fight a 14 year tradition.

-Galen's player

 

[Tina Small]

I haven't finished listening to this or watching it, but it is an interview (in English) with Chris Ondrus, the EA producer of Dungeon Keeper Online.

??-³?OL???-dk.91.com

More Dungeon Keeper Online videos are on this page in the official website for the game:

http://dk.91.com/guide/video/

Haven't watched any others yet.

 

[Capn Kranky]

Heck of a list of options ... and several that I could have chosen. I did vote on the option to P2P, keep stuff but not EA run. Any option that excludes EA from the picture is acceptable to me right now.

 

[Tina Small]

Chris Ondrus' profile on LinkedIn says that since June 2009, he has been a Producer at Bioware Mythic, Electronic Arts "producing two projects with International MMO game partner NetDragon."

Christopher Ondrus | LinkedIn

I wonder if Mr. Ondrus has been working on UO as well? I've also been wondering since Mesanna made that mysteriously vague little announcement a few weeks ago if this is where Cal might have gone....

 

[HD2300]

Step 1. Survey.

Reportedly Dungeon Keeper is now going to be released Worldwide, see Dungeon Keeper Online confirmed for US market ~ MMO ☆ Culture, even though it was initially announced as for Asia only.

This is speculation, if both UO and UO 3D ran concurrently like say Everquest I and Everquest II, its more profits that way.

 

[HD2300]

Christ Ondrus' profile on LinkedIn says that since June 2009, he has been a Producer at Bioware Mythic, Electronic Arts "producing two projects with International MMO game partner NetDragon."

Christopher Ondrus | LinkedIn

All I can say is wow, the big guns are in the house, both with the UO franchise and NetDragon partnership.

 

[Tina Small]

All I can say is wow, the big guns are in the house, both with the UO franchise and NetDragon partnership.

Yeah, I guess Jeff and Chris were two lucky folks at Mythic who managed to survive all the mass layoffs at EA two years ago, as these projects were starting to heat up.

The Escapist : News : EA Heavily Cuts Jobs at Mythic, Tiburon, Black Box and Redwood

 

[Lord Frodo]

IF and I mean IF EA stoped the clasic client of UO for a 3D virsion of the game I would call it quits.

 

[Viper09]

Now, I know I posted that I'd be unwilling to try it but I think I should be more precise. I am talking about the current "3d" client. If they were able to start over and give us a crisp 3d client that would be like the 3d clients we see selling today, I would be willing to pay for it.

 

[Elric_Soban]

I just wish they wouldn't do such a half-assed job of everything they do. They give us a half finished client and apparently abandon it. Rinse and repeat a few times, now here we are with the latest SA client. Half finished. And apparently awaiting some art updates (that will likely never come).

Drives me nuts. Would it kill them to see something through for once?

 

[Uvtha]

I can't say. It would all depend on what kind of systems it had. I prefer the 3d iso type game, but I have zero problem with 3d games and I would be willing to play any UO2 or whatever so long as it held true to the spirit of UO and didn't just to to be like all the other 3d games around.

It must have a Siege Perilous shard too or something like it too!

 

[Korik Bloodguard]

I'm really too tied to the classic client art style. I like it for so many reasons: its style is simple, smooth, and is mostly well drawn representation. The tiles and multis blend so well with each other, characters feel in-the-world. As people have inserted newer graphics into the game they haven't respected the 'rules' set out and it muddles a little.

Plus I'd miss my hues, which are so much less special in the 3d clients

 

[Tina Small]

I'm curious to know what people would do if they were in the producer's and designers' shoes and trying to figure out what aspects of the current UO might best be left out of a new 3D version of UO, what should be left in but with some heavy modification, what absolutely has to stay in to make the game still feel like UO, and what to add (besides a totally new client) to keep it moving forward.

What would you do to a new UO, assuming you were starting with entirely fresh shards, but wanted to stay pretty faithful to the original Ultima Online and wanted to attract an entirely new generation of players, bring back a fair number of people who left over the years, and get current players to sign up for the new version? Try to keep it civil, please!

 

[Sevin0oo0]

what people would do if they were in the producer's and designers' shoes

Since they never talk to us, letting us know any of the behind the scenes activities/limitations/etc, I can't make an informed opinion.


But, I'd put in instanced dungeons, scrap the 35,000hp mobs, and use the quest grinds to let players build points to turn in for xpacs and items

 

[Percivalgoh]

lots of things are possible for me. You should have made it a multiple answer type of poll. The question is would I continue to play a 3D version? Not sure I would have to see how it goes but so far I hate the 3D versions but could I get used to them? Not sure.

 

[RawHeadRex]

I am permanently mounted to 2d, a crowbar couldn't seperate us.

 

[Tina Small]

what people would do if they were in the producer's and designers' shoes

Since they never talk to us, letting us know any of the behind the scenes activities/limitations/etc, I can't make an informed opinion.


But, I'd put in instanced dungeons, scrap the 35,000hp mobs, and use the quest grinds to let players build points to turn in for xpacs and items

Yeah, my head's still spinning trying to think of what I would do differently too if I had the opportunity to be the producer of a new UO. I didn't start playing UO until late 2004, so my view of things is probably vastly different from someone who's slogged through 14 years.

I know one thing I would seriously consider would be some shards without insurance and Siege-type rules for skill gain and dealing with NPCS and with no transfers on and off to make things more challenging and to see how the economy turns out. Maybe one would have all Trammel rules and another would have the Fel rule set. For shards with insurance or something similar to it, I would probably have shards that are all Trammel rules and some that are Fel rule set. I don't know that I'd be brave enough to try convincing people to experiment with mixed-rule set shards again! I'd definitely want something like the faction system on shards with a Fel rule set and would be tempted to try to implement some kind of team-based "capture the flag" activity on Trammel rule set shards, but don't have any clear ideas on how it would work.

On all shards, I'd probably also be sorely tempted to do away with castles and keeps and make sure every house has the same storage capacity. However, the house owner would have to pay some kind of a periodic tax based on the footprint of the house and there would be more ready-made designs available and the max floor size would be slightly increased to maybe something like 22x22.

I'd keep the concept of New Haven but come up with quite a few more different and repeatable quests for characters below a certain total skill level to gain in skills, make some gold, and acquire some decent starter gear.

I'd probably keep randomized resources, get rid of double resources in Fel, but slightly increase the spawn rate for the rarer resources, and make your character get very tired and move very slowly if they mine or lumberjack without a decent break within a certain period of time.

At the moment, don't really know what else I'd be tempted to tweak. I'm sure by tomorrow though I'll think of something.

 

[Evlar]

I didn't pick a particular option, but irrespective of who was in "control", I'd certainly give the game a try.

Most important for me though, would be the gameplay - not the graphics.

2d, 3d isometric, fully rotational 3d, whatever... means little to me if I don't find the gameplay engaging.

Wouldn't matter if it was subscription or F2P, if the gameplay was engaging enough either.

For my current fix of UO, I play on free servers. But that's not because it's "free" - it's because the ones I play on are actually better supported and maintained than the "official" servers, plus they retain the gameplay eras I prefer.

I'd be quite happy to pay to play UO if the gameplay and level of service offered by the developers and publishers was worth it.

Simply put, I don't think "current" UO is worth the subscription fee.

 

[RuSini Neb]

I doubt we need a fully 3d client such as wow or rift. Why not massive improved graphics engine comparable to diablo 3. keep the top down isometrics. Just really improve what we are looking at and get away from a tile movement system.

 

[Tina Small]

Mr. Skalski was lurking in this thread for a while this afternoon and I had my fingers crossed that maybe he was going to post something. But it looks like he's gone now.

Drat!

 

[Tina Small]

NetDragon announced some bonuses today for people who have been participating in the closed elite beta test of Dungeon Keeper Online: µØϳǸÐлרÌâ-µØϳÇÊØ»¤ÕßOL¹Ù·½ÍøÕ¾-dk.91.com. I haven't seen any announcement yet for when they'll start the open beta period, though. (Announcements list for Dungeon Keepers Online is here: ¹«¸æÁбí-µØϳÇÊØ»¤ÕßOLÖÐÎĹٷ½ÍøÕ¾-dk.91.com.)

The bonuses include game tokens, a limited-edition doll (I think it looks like one of the minions your character has in the game?), in-game titles, and (if I'm getting a half-decent translation) rare in-game mounts or character aspects (e.g., devil wings, guardian wizard style character). It looks like the rewards are being awarded to the top players in various categories on every server and 30 players who made significant contributions for testing (e.g., finding and submitting bugs, suggesting improvements, etc.).

They've also had some other ongoing rewards for testers, including the chance to win an iPod Touch 4. 体验æœåŠ¡å™¨ä¸“区-地下城守护者OL中文官方网站-dk.91.com

One thing I noticed in reading the information for prospective beta testers is that the government won't accept complaints related to quality while you play the test server. Makes me wonder if China has an official agency that DOES pay attention to quality complaints. Interesting idea but not sure I'd go for it here in the US.

 

[Zosimus]

Actually China has many rules and regulations concerning online games....

There are 2 agencies (Ministry of Culture and General Administration of Press and Publications (GAPP) ) that controls what you are looking for Tina.


Online gaming law set to take effect in China - CNN

Interesting quote from the link above....

Under the new law, gamers will be required to register using their legal names before participating in online games. In turn, online gaming developers will be required to set restrictions that limit the amount of time minors spend playing such games.

This link here has a couple of nice articles...

: Ministry of Culture : China Media & Entertainment Law Report


One stood out....

Foreigners and Internet Games in China: "Unfair" Play Results in New Rules : China Media & Entertainment Law Report



Foreigners and Internet Games in China: "Unfair" Play Results in New Rules

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Foreign companies and their Chinese partners have always been major players in the Chinese online gaming market. The partnership normally is has the foreign company licensing rights to a Chinese partner. The Chinese partner is then responsible for developing the local market. The Chinese partner is required to apply to the Ministry of Culture’s Content Censorship Commission (“CCC”) and the China’s General Administration of Press and Publication (“GAPP”) for pre-approvals to distribute the game. CCC censors game content and reviews the license agreement, which becomes effective upon CCC approval. GAPP examines the qualification of the Chinese partner to provide foreign online game services and decides whether to issue a License for Internet Publishing Service to the Chinese partner.
Chinese companies have accused foreign gaming companies of abusing their copyrights via unfair and arbitrary contractual terms. The Ministry of Culture and GAPP seem to be responding to these accusations by cracking down on foreign online gaming companies. On April 24, 2009, the Ministry of Culture issued the “Notice of Regulating the Censorship and Reporting Mechanism on the Content of Imported Online Games” (“MOC Notice”), and on July 20, 2009, GAPP issued the “Notification on Strengthening the Administration of Approval of Imported Internet Games” (“GAPP Notification”).

These two sets of regulations seek to tighten the control over the activities of foreign online gaming companies in China:

1. Each foreign online game must be distributed in China by a single Chinese partner with exclusive rights.
2. In the event that the Chinese partner is changed, the game is renamed or new game versions are released, the Chinese partner must re-apply with CCC and GAPP for approvals.
3. Foreign operators who are deemed to have included arbitrary contractual terms in their distribution agreements will be sanctioned and CCC may suspend its approval of the relevant foreign online game.
4. GAPP has expanded its authority to review the import of foreign online games for exhibition, demonstration, trade or promotional activities, all of which are now prohibited without GAPP pre-approval.

Kou Xiaowei, Deputy Chief of the Sci-tech and Digital Publishing Department at GAPP, stressed that GAPP would not discriminate between Chinese and foreign game service providers during the approval process. Still, Chinese produced online games only require filing with the GAPP before distribution, approval with GAPP or CCC is not a requirement.


Here are some more for anybody wanting to read up on how they deal with online gaming..

China Limits Use of Gamers’ Online Currency - NYTimes.com

New Online Game Regulations Aim to Tidy Up China's Online Game Sector - Media & Entertainment - China

Issues Foreign Video Game Developers Face in Introducing Online Games to the Chinese Market : China Law Insight

Now this last link above I have to quote this...

Moreover, previously approved imported online games must undergo import procedures again if the games are updated, or new versions and new material were added. When the content of an imported online game is materially altered, the new proposed content must be submitted to the PRC Ministry of Culture for content censorship. In this case, the PRC General Administration of Press and Publication also requires approval of the proposed changes beforehand.

More recently, Blizzard Entertainment and NetEase will finally be able to launch Wrath of the Lich King, the add-on expansion for World of Warcraft, in China on August 31, 2010, about 22 months after the expansion launched in the U.S. “The delay was due to the regulatory and content review process.” Finally, the Announcement on Regulating Applications for Content Censorship for Imported Online Games [《文化部关于规范进口网络游戏产品内容审查申报工作的公告》] makes it clear that games undergoing content censorship should be fully developed and in conformity with the versions officially operated (or in public testing).

This is how things work in China. It's all under control with stipulations and regulations. EA wanting to change any part of any game they are partnered up with has to go through those 2 agencies for approval.

So EA will go that extra mile to get games, keep them updated, add expansions, and do what China tells them to do just to get a piece of the pie. China agencies look over every aspect of any new game and will approve it or not.

Where here in the US we dont have strict regulations for online gaming companies. Maybe this is why we get subpar products because we expect less from these same companies. Funny how these same companies that are willing to jump through hoops and beg for China's approval and do whatever it takes to get into that market.

 

[Tina Small]

Thanks for the links, Zosimus. Interesting stuff. It would be interesting to see how it has played out with regard to requiring players to register with their real names and ages and have game developers limit the amount of time players below a certain age can stay logged on.

 

[Tina Small]

This is speculation, if both UO and UO 3D ran concurrently like say Everquest I and Everquest II, its more profits that way.

So, if EA decided to keep the current version of UO running so it could have bragging rights about owning the oldest continuously running MMO or something like that while also kicking off a new 3-D version of UO, do you think they might make the current version of UO free-to-play and require a subscription for the new version? If yes, do you think both games would flourish to any extent?

 

[HD2300]

So, if EA decided to keep the current version of UO running so it could have bragging rights about owning the oldest continuously running MMO or something like that while also kicking off a new 3-D version of UO, do you think they might make the current version of UO free-to-play and require a subscription for the new version? If yes, do you think both games would flourish to any extent?

I dont think they will go f2P with UO at least in the short term. The account migration and rate of new content being delivered has shown that they dont have the resources to do this currently. But who knows in a years time.

A 3D UO will do well. We have been saying for many years, please let the WAR devs work on a UO 3D client. The problem with WAR was that it was PvP, and with PvP you have the sheep and wolves dynamic, sheep leave, 1/2 the wolves become sheep, sheep leave, repeat repeat repeat. With PvEers if you can continually provide quality new content, you can keep them for a very long time.

 

[Tina Small]

Found a video posted on the 766 game network site from August 23rd showing the NetDragon Websoft (aka 91.com) office in China and several of the folks working on Dungeon Keeper Online: 766???DKOL_766?_?. I think a lot of the display items at the very beginning of the video were used at the Dungeon Keeper Online booth at the China Joy 2011 expo.

There's also another video from the same date interviewing some of the DKOL developers: 766???DKOL???_766?_?. (Unfortunately for us, it is not in English.)

 

[Kiminality]

The problem with WAR was that it was PvP, and with PvP you have the sheep and wolves dynamic, sheep leave, 1/2 the wolves become sheep, sheep leave, repeat repeat repeat. With PvEers if you can continually provide quality new content, you can keep them for a very long time.

Did you ever actually play the game, or are you just working on being wrong about games that actually exist?

 

[Ned888]

I use the EC quite a bit now and I like the concept behind it, but it's a bandaide. It's not really well developed enough to carry the game into the future.

here's what I'd like to see:

1. New Shards that are reset from scratch.
2. Doing away with BOD's and Commodity Deeds.
3. Making shards either Felucca or Trammel only (PvP or PvM shards).
4. Making the faction system apply for all shards/facets (so PVP can take place everywhere). You must declare a faction even on a Trammel shard.
5. Housing needs a bit of a re-work. There should be enough room so everyone can buy housing. Smaller footprints, inn rooms for rent, buying unused properties in towns, etc.
6. Better vendor/auction system. I like the vendors, but I would also like to see an auction house style system incorporated somehow. Maybe a hybrid....
7. NPC Guilds, so a player doesn't have to join a PC guild to get some benefits.
8. Questing system. Sort of a must really....
9. Haven needs to disappear. Starting town based on skills chosen (Trinic for Warrior types; Magincia for Mage types; Minoc for Tinkers; Britain for Bards; etc.). Starting quests could be accessible from all of these towns from the guildmasters of the various skills....
10. Councilors need to be brought back into the game. Find volunteers and get them going again. Even if you only have one or two at a time, it's better than no one! It would take some of the burden off of your GM's who need to deal with more technical issues.
11. Restricting Recall to a few locations (I'd say a single location that can be changed with the mark spell at will). Make people use the world you created! It's too easy to skip the world and avoid other players now. Add a 'Home Stone' that will teleport you to your home town and then to a marked location. Other than that, get on your horse and ride!
12. Pets should be for more than combat/carrying stuff. Dogs help with tracking; Hawks help with hunting small animals for food; Snakes give poison to weapons every once in a while. It'll stop everyone from taming just dragons and giant beetles. Make all the animals useful!
13. All the skills need to be useful. Don't get rid of them; get them to work! Herding should have a useful purpose in game! It's the skill of Shepherds; the ultimate representatives of Humility! There has to be a way. Ask us and we'll give you ideas!

That's just the list I can come up with from the top of head. Even with all that though, I really enjoy the game! For every one thing above, there are 20-30 things that I think are right with the game.

 

[Woodsman]

Did you ever actually play the game, or are you just working on being wrong about games that actually exist?

Based on that comment, I'm guessing he's never played Warhammer and is definitely not familiar with Warhammer's development or design goals. If his quote was posted over on the Warhammer forums, those people wouldn't be able to post for a week because they were laughing so hard.

 

[Woodsman]

[*]Doing away with BOD's and Commodity Deeds.

How about useful/less grindy?

[*]Making shards either Felucca or Trammel only (PvP or PvM shards).

[*]Making the faction system apply for all shards/facets (so PVP can take place everywhere). You must declare a faction even on a Trammel shard.

Trying to force people into PvP would have the same affect as merging shards - people will get pissed and leave. They aren't going to give up their homes or their gameplay preferences for a minority of players to benefit - they are just going to walk away. It's like some of the poll options in this thread about would people leave their items/houses/etc. for a new UO - there are too many people who are set in their ways, and they aren't going to give up much regardless of any perceived benefits, because if you change the game on them, they'll say it's no longer the game they want to play and just walk away. When you start removing people's attachments to the game or change it on them too much, they are liable to start looking at other games.

[*]Housing needs a bit of a re-work. There should be enough room so everyone can buy housing. Smaller footprints, inn rooms for rent, buying unused properties in towns, etc.
[*]Better vendor/auction system. I like the vendors, but I would also like to see an auction house style system incorporated somehow. Maybe a hybrid....

I love the idea of people actually living in towns, and the first time I heard a dev talking about a long time ago, I really liked their ideas - people living within the towns, in hotels/inns or the peasant homes. They mentioned perhaps some kind of instanced housing. I prefer that over like New Magincia.

As for an auction house, I see the arguments for and against. Against because it would help kill off player vendors and malls, and player vendors are one of the more unique things about UO. For, because those places have been slowly dying because EA has shown no interest over the last year in dealing with the scripters who power the UO search engines. Might as well make it a level playing field for all. I see new players being told in general chat to go hit up the search websites, which doesn't help.

[*]NPC Guilds, so a player doesn't have to join a PC guild to get some benefits.
[*]Questing system. Sort of a must really....

How about tying these together, or rather letting a quest system drive the NPC guilds? There's already some new quest stuff being done, they just need to extend it to all virtues, and the thief quest stuff which may or may not have started could go a long way towards that. Unique titles, the whole nine yards. I've been playing some other old DOS games that have quests for some of the guilds (thieves, etc.) and it would be cool to have a full NPC guild system driven by quests.

[*]Councilors need to be brought back into the game. Find volunteers and get them going again. Even if you only have one or two at a time, it's better than no one! It would take some of the burden off of your GM's who need to deal with more technical issues.

Finding volunteers is not the problem. I used to think EA was hung up on the previous lawsuits, but I've been told that BioWare is using volunteer moderators on the official BioWare.com forums. Of course a few years ago I remember one of the SWTOR community relations people say they don't use volunteer forum moderators because of legal issues and because they can't be trusted, so way to go BioWare for double standards and ****ting on people who post on your forums

 

[Ned888]

How about useful/less grindy?

I agree that some of the grind should go away, but if there is a questing system in place, is it grinding or questing? A fine line to be sure!

Trying to force people into PvP would have the same affect as merging shards - people will get pissed and leave. They aren't going to give up their homes or their gameplay preferences for a minority of players to benefit - they are just going to walk away. It's like some of the poll options in this thread about would people leave their items/houses/etc. for a new UO - there are too many people who are set in their ways, and they aren't going to give up much regardless of any perceived benefits, because if you change the game on them, they'll say it's no longer the game they want to play and just walk away. When you start removing people's attachments to the game or change it on them too much, they are liable to start looking at other games.

I would be concerned about this as well, except for a few things.... The game has already been changed many times. I'm not proposing anything radical here, just making shards one or the other, not both. Maybe they could start out this process with new; reset shards. As the populations migrate to the new shards, the old ones fade away, or they don't. I guess my point is, it never hurts to give it a try, especially if it in addition to what's already out there, instead of replacing it right away. Players may find that it's actually beneficial.

I love the idea of people actually living in towns, and the first time I heard a dev talking about a long time ago, I really liked their ideas - people living within the towns, in hotels/inns or the peasant homes. They mentioned perhaps some kind of instanced housing. I prefer that over like New Magincia.

Signed! Lots of vacant property is sitting in towns right now. Rent would be an excellent gold sink, especially if all the property is used up for placing houses. One interesting thing to consider too is... Roommates! You rent part of a house, with a bunch of other people! It's a community space, but you have your own chest in the building and have the ability to customize it in a limited fashion that has to be agreed upon by your roommates! The renters could even vote a person out of a house if they were unanimously against the person! I think it would be hillarious! Reality TV in an MMO!

As for an auction house, I see the arguments for and against. Against because it would help kill off player vendors and malls, and player vendors are one of the more unique things about UO. For, because those places have been slowly dying because EA has shown no interest over the last year in dealing with the scripters who power the UO search engines. Might as well make it a level playing field for all. I see new players being told in general chat to go hit up the search websites, which doesn't help.

Signed again! I certainly don't want to totally get rid of the vendors, but I think that using the existing bulletin boards in game to either advertise, or even teleport you to a vendor might be kind of cool instead of having to search them out at random or pick up a rune at the bank, which could lead you to Felucca anyway and end up getting you killed.... I'm hoping for efficiency and less vendors equals less pixels that need to be animated. It might even speed up the game a bit!

How about tying these together, or rather letting a quest system drive the NPC guilds? There's already some new quest stuff being done, they just need to extend it to all virtues, and the thief quest stuff which may or may not have started could go a long way towards that. Unique titles, the whole nine yards. I've been playing some other old DOS games that have quests for some of the guilds (thieves, etc.) and it would be cool to have a full NPC guild system driven by quests.

I'd like to hear ideas on that. I think NPC guilds could definitely be associated with Factions, but having PC guilds associated with NPC guilds might be kind of interesting. How would that work? The PC's usually don't band together to be Bards or Merchants....

Finding volunteers is not the problem. I used to think EA was hung up on the previous lawsuits, but I've been told that BioWare is using volunteer moderators on the official BioWare.com forums. Of course a few years ago I remember one of the SWTOR community relations people say they don't use volunteer forum moderators because of legal issues and because they can't be trusted, so way to go BioWare for double standards and ****ting on people who post on your forums

Yeah, I think the big thing here is that people need to actually volunteer, not volunteer with the expectation of freebies. I would be happy to volunteer for a couple of hours a week with no free account or game time. I would do it to help out and make the game better....

 

[Tina Small]

I don't know much at all about the cancelled UO2 project and was still several years away from starting to play UO when it was in the works. However, I wonder if anyone thinks it's possible that EA might be resurrecting some of the ideas from that project to incorporate them into a new version of UO? The NetDragon Website description of the UO they are working on says, "Our new version of Ultima Online is a 3D MMORPG, based on the theme, characters and other content of EA’s Ultima Online™." So, to me that leaves the door wide open to make it similar but different from the UO we know.

 

[Ned888]

I don't know much at all about the cancelled UO2 project and was still several years away from starting to play UO when it was in the works. However, I wonder if anyone thinks it's possible that EA might be resurrecting some of the ideas from that project to incorporate them into a new version of UO? The NetDragon Website description of the UO they are working on says, "Our new version of Ultima Online is a 3D MMORPG, based on the theme, characters and other content of EA’s Ultima Online™." So, to me that leaves the door wide open to make it similar but different from the UO we know.

I really hope that NetDragon does a good job. From their website, I can't really see too much detail on the UO project (none at all in fact). Most of their games are very 'Nintendo DS' looking, except for the graphics on Might and Magic, which look cool!

I sincerely hope they pull it off and Mythic/EA keep a tight reign on the license to ensure that it is done properly and with the dignity that UO deserves. There is a lot of history here, both from UO itself and from the entire Ultima series that ran for two decades and spawned some great spin offs. My favorite was the Martial Dreams and Savage Empire games.

In the interim, I'm going to keep suggesting improvements here and hope that others get to read them.

 

[THP]

I am not going to vote at this time...

IF and I mean IF EA stoped the clasic client of UO for a 3D virsion of the game I would call it quits.

DITTO

 

[HD2300]

^^ if you zoom out and rotate 45 degrees the view in a 3D client, you get the 2D isometric view. You can just play only in that view if you want, it would be like the CC and EC but with 2012 quality art.

NetDragon Websoft Inc.--Heroes of Might and Magic Online game video--ir.netdragon.com <- 2008 quality art from NetDragon.

 

[Woodsman]

NetDragon Websoft Inc.--Heroes of Might and Magic Online game video--ir.netdragon.com <- 2008 quality art from NetDragon.

Since when did cartoony-looking graphics become "quality" art?

 

[Zosimus]

The actual cartoony graphics is big in that area of the world. Not sure if anybody seen the transformers online yet. Those graphics are just like the actual original cartoon series.

NetDragon Websoft Inc.--TRANSFORMERS Online--ir.netdragon.com

TRANSFORMERS Online is an MMORPG under development by NetDragon. The game is based on the Hasbro’s iconic TRANSFORMERS brand and is expected to officially roll-out in 2011 in China, Asia, Russia/CIS and MENA.

Another game they are creating for that general region of the world. I see a pattern...........