Just another pancakes thread about speedhack.

[gjohnson5]

jfkeach hits the nail on the head with a 50lb sledge.

To those claiming "no such thing as speedhack" or "it is just enhanced client", you have no clue.

I ping low teens(10-13 usually) to a west coast server. There are a few "leet" PvPers that seem to outrun me while I am mounted and they are on foot... and at least one is in Hawaii. I'd say there might be a speed hack going somewhere

As for the fix, OSI/EA failed on one of the most basic tenants of server programming: "If you don't have control of the program sending stuff to the server, don't trust what is coming to the server." This was taught to me before UO was even in existence.

The problem with trying to check everything coming to you is it will create SEVERE lag issues on the server.

One thing they COULD do is do "packet" logging when a user is paged upon. Basically, count all the incoming packets of suspected speed hackers. If you get more than a reasonable number packets in a time frame, ban the account. This method would be fairly un-invasive. It would be "2 lines of code":
if speed_hacking_flagged
packet_count++

As a base line, they could log an in the building player to determine best case number of packets. Lets say 5000 packets in 5 minutes. If anybody is counted close to this number, you can check location and ban as desired.

That solution would be terribly dependant on good programing but also would have a negative hit on UO revenues. A better idea instead of creating AI which would determine if one is using a 3rd party speed hacking applications, would be a application which would be directly after parsing of the data inside the packet. One the packet's data is parsed, check to see if that data is in the correct format with all the the correct number of fields, etc. If the fields do not contain all the data in the correct ranges or the number of fields is less then what it is supposed to be , simply drop that packet. In this case a person running a speed hacking application or other illegal third party application basically wouldn't be able to move.

Then the inevitable will happen is that they will call EA support to complain. Then send them a debugging application which will scan their computer for 3rd party applications. Once the data from this application is transferred to EA Mythic, Mythic support should know if that person is using an illegal third party application. Once an illegal application is found , THEN ban the account. Basically this would be a similar idea as Microsoft genuine advantage.

At leastthis way EA Mythic is running any discriminatory code which is only targeting specific users. Secondly ,I think this would reduce overhead on the server as packets that are dropped are not processed and no CPU load is created processing that persons packets. Also you'd have specific evidence as to what 3rd party application that person is running.

 

[HD2300]

Stop pancakes. Only a tiny minority speedhack. You just suck.

 

[UOKaiser]

That's what the cheaters say to try to scare developers into inaction when it comes to cheating. It's a version of the "everybody's doing it" lie. Yes they would lose some subs, and maybe quite a few, if they introduced an effective anti-cheat app, but there are ways for them to mitigate that, such as a grace period when they hand out temporary bans instead of permanent ones, and the net effect in the long run, I am confident in this, is that they would gain subscriptions, not lose them.

The developers' inaction when it comes to cheating, throughout the history of UO, has been horrible for the game, and horrible for the reputation of the developers and the publishers, and I think has cost the publishers a lot of money. Their occasional police actions have been good publicity, but in the final analysis have been woefully inadequate, and have failed to address 99.9% of the actual cheating that has been going on in the game.

So many accusations. Find I will agree with you we have 1mil plus subscribers and only 10k of those cheat at all." Even though 250k was the last count on the high of Uo 7-9 years ago. After that they stop releasing numbers" From all the complaining we have on the boards and from what we see there can't be more than that out there right?
Then seemingly this is a updated game and new players raised on WOW and other graphical empty games that spend millions on advertising,tv commercials,shelf presence not to mention all those old Uo palyers that still have the itch of uo that moved on to free shards will be willing to pay for uo as well would just flock to back to us all of the sudden?
This is with me agreeing with you and absolutely using no logic of the realty of the situation at all. The fact is the Uo population is small. Most of it is in the asian shards and I think the restriction of 3rd party tools over there is not even enforced at all. Most subscribers have at least 2 accounts each person ban will most likely lead to multiple sub closures. Case by case basis is the best thing they can do now unless UO becomes the next best thing with some miracle of the gaming gods.
UO is a business if profit falls below marginable amounts the first thing they cut down will be staff, which we have seen already,next will be expensive new projects,extra shards, finaly after the last profitable milk leaves it will close and encourage players to play one of there more popular subscription games.

 

[mrrippletip]

Stop pancakes. Only a tiny minority of people who only play Trammel speedhack. You just suck.

there, fixed that for ya

;+)



seriously, every red guild we fight on Baja is full of members who:

A) jump off your screen when they are near low-life

B) cast flamestrike on the dead run (always have to lol at that one)

C) are so fast when chasing me occasionally they bounce from behind to ahead of me

D) cure with pots so fast it is obvious they are using a script

E) i have even come across someone using a script to control (3) necros who all stand on the same tile, target the same target, and move as one

D) outrun me on foot when i'm on a mount



There is a guild on Atlantic where 90% of the pvprs there are blatantly using a pot throwing script, yet good luck trying to get a GM to haul them to jail...they are like 3 server lines over before you can even target their name in the complaint log.


I think the point all of us are missing is EA DOESN'T WANT TO REMOVE CHEATERS FROM THE GAME OR THEY WOULD HAVE ALREADY. What really upsets me is there is this "threat" of action that keeps borderline people from using the programs that would allow them to level the playing field against the cheaters, and EA should just come out and be honest and say "hey, we are never going to do anything about the cheating scripters so EVERYONE HAVE AT IT"...legalize scripts, legalize speedhacks, legalize the program that is like Assist only better...and stop pretending like they are doing ANYTHING to solve the cheating problem...BECAUSE THEY AREN'T.

AS LONG AS THE CHEATERS ARE PAYING, EA AND THE DEVS DON'T CARE. PERIOD. THEY WILL TELL YOU THEY DO BUT WE HAVE BEEN HEARING THAT FOR YEARS AND YEARS AND YEARS. STOP LYING TO US. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.


But you better not afk macro. Anything that could hurt demand for the goods they sell out of the EA Store will get you drug off to jail FAST.

Cheating is ok tho.

 

[Llewen]

I think the point all of us are missing is EA DOESN'T WANT TO REMOVE CHEATERS FROM THE GAME OR THEY WOULD HAVE ALREADY. What really upsets me is there is this "threat" of action that keeps borderline people from using the programs that would allow them to level the playing field against the cheaters, and EA should just come out and be honest and say "hey, we are never going to do anything about the cheating scripters so EVERYONE HAVE AT IT"...legalize scripts, legalize speedhacks, legalize the program that is like Assist only better...and stop pretending like they are doing ANYTHING to solve the cheating problem...BECAUSE THEY AREN'T.

AS LONG AS THE CHEATERS ARE PAYING, EA AND THE DEVS DON'T CARE. PERIOD. THEY WILL TELL YOU THEY DO BUT WE HAVE BEEN HEARING THAT FOR YEARS AND YEARS AND YEARS. STOP LYING TO US. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.


But you better not afk macro. Anything that could hurt demand for the goods they sell out of the EA Store will get you drug off to jail FAST.

Cheating is ok tho.

I would say it differently, but this is pretty much what I've often thought. If you aren't going to do anything about the cheating, then at least have the balls to say "we don't really care, do whatever you want" so that everyone has the opportunity to play the same game. With the current situation the only people that get screwed over are the honest players, and it has pretty much been that way with UO since day one...

 

[Cailleach]

Yep. And even many experienced PvP:rs quit cause of hacks, so no wonder unexperienced players rather just give up then try to master PvP.

Most of ours are doing very nicely mastering pvp. The bit they're struggling with is the cheaters they run into. We know who cheats, and we've told them which players will usually beat us and why. But why bother to fight to learn and improve and try for the win one day when you know before you start that unless you really do have superiority of numbers, you've lost before you've begun? That's the bit that knocks them back.

Btw, don't know how much of yesterday you saw, but they did good, and it did them good. Pulled off some very nice moves indeed

 

[Restroom Cowboy]

Stop pancakes. Only a tiny minority speedhack. You just suck.

and ignorance is bliss they say...

 

[Splup]

I would say it differently, but this is pretty much what I've often thought. If you aren't going to do anything about the cheating, then at least have the balls to say "we don't really care, do whatever you want" so that everyone has the opportunity to play the same game. With the current situation the only people that get screwed over are the honest players, and it has pretty much been that way with UO since day one...

To be honest I'm not scared of getting banned, not even one bit. I know no one has ever been banned for speed hacking in this game. It's about something else... Can't describe what, maybe combination of self-respect and respect towards all others that don't speed hack. I rather quit then go that low, but it's not cause I was afraid of getting banned.

 

[Astrel]

Speed hack is easy to spot, not some slight difference in clients. Hackers are the guys who are clueless in PvP, no imagination, no idea about tactics. Years ago one hacker on Pac used to terrorize an area. I sucked him into a fight in a confined space for 500k gp, even gave his friends the money before we started. About 20 secs later I was looting his corpse as he basically had no space to run off to and I just dp'd him with every hit. When they had the bounty system I offered the top guy 6mill for a fight in the location of my choice, he never showed. Hackers are clueless.

I might add that when I played on Pac I was on dial-up playing from Japan, so much for the techno theories.

 

[longshanks]

LoL I imagine that happening in UO. 50% player base gone overnite game closed end of month. Oh well kids willl be kids.

as i predicted there is the other end of your fool-hardy argument.:loser:

let me fill you in. the reason most of the player base stays trammel side is because they don't feel they have a chance in hell of competing against cheaters. your post is erroneous off the bat as 50 pct of the player base does NOT PLAY IN FEL!!!

remove cheating from the game be it speeders, stumphacks, heal scripts, pot throwing scripts and you will see more of the player base venture into fel. not to mention it might bring in more people to play the game knowing that there is a level playing field.

 

[UOKaiser]

as i predicted there is the other end of your fool-hardy argument.:loser:

let me fill you in. the reason most of the player base stays trammel side is because they don't feel they have a chance in hell of competing against cheaters. your post is erroneous off the bat as 50 pct of the player base does NOT PLAY IN FEL!!!

remove cheating from the game be it speeders, stumphacks, heal scripts, pot throwing scripts and you will see more of the player base venture into fel. not to mention it might bring in more people to play the game knowing that there is a level playing field.

Um you forgot skill scripts,craft scripts,resource scripts,pvm scripts,loot scripts,etc. PVP accounts only for a very small part in the 50% percentage. Most don't go to fel cause they don't like to pvp anyway doesn't matter if everyone was running around with halos over there head. It is a RPG after all.

 

[Coyt]

Do I remember wrong, I have this image in my head that back in the days I was running away from fireball and I kept running from the animation and dmg didnt hit me before the fireball caught me...

Or then I just remember wrong.

you remember wrong . i think most newbies done that, trying to run away from the spellanimation, damage was probably already delivered

 

[mrrippletip]

I think it's false logic to think every cheater would quit if you removed the cheats. Some of them are very skilled players who would continue to thrive without them.

I also think it's a little short sighted to think that a lot of people wouldn't return to Sosaria to enjoy some PVP on a leveled playing field, once they had some reassurance that the guy who just killed them did so with honor.

Also, scripting is a problem...but i think there is a difference between someone running a script alone in their house to gain a skill, and someone using a script to aid them in a PVP situation.

Maybe that makes me a hypocrite, but yeah...I know they're both cheating...but the latter just seems so...weak.

I mean, man, if you're playing an archer...do you really need a script to do 5 of the only 10 or so things an archer can do?


Anyway, my main point here is that it is false logic to think that if you took away the "cheats" that you would lose all the cheaters. I would bet 80% of them would adapt and just keep playing.

To me, UO is still a really fun game, and still the best PVP/Community of any MMORPG on the market, BY FAR.