Jeremy: Here is some excellent feedback on hiding/stealth and pets. Please report!!

[imported_MoonglowMerchant]

<blockquote><hr>

I just want to throw my opinion out there too. I will caveat it by saying I don't currently play on Siege, so my opinion only takes into account how things work currently on the other shards. I realize Siege works differently (no passive detect, etc.).

I have two character types that I use in factions. Both have 200 points tied up in detect hidden and tracking skills on purpose. One character also has hiding, stealth, magery, stealing, remove trap, and lock picking. The other character also has taming, lore, vet, magery, hiding, and some stealing. I made both characters specifically for the purpose of ferreting out stealthers trying to get into or already in a faction base or hanging out at a base we're raiding. Neither character (yes, even the tamer) is very good at actually killing a stealther once detected. But that's okay, because they are both working as part of a team that consists of other people in the same faction. I made them as supporting characters and I'm just fine with that.

Yes, sometimes it is frustrating to detect a stealther and have them hide again right away, but the better I get at doing what I do with those characters, the fewer times the stealther manages to get away alive. I track first and find them and then when everyone is ready, BOOM....detect ..... chase ..... sometimes detect again (tracking arrow is still up so I know where to look).... and almost always by then they're dead through some good coordinated teamwork. It's a definite cat-and-mouse type of game and I love it. I don't particularly want to see it change or become easier.

Okay, that's my two cents for whatever they're worth.


[/ QUOTE ]

Your post is valid for normal shards.

You make the same point that another poster did above. That is, a team of dedicated people with specialized skills and one purpose can at times, detect, reveal, track and kill one stealther.

The difference on Siege is that there isn't one stealther.

In a group of 8-10 PvP'ers there might be 2 or 3 stealth archers, a couple stealth tamers, and a stealth dexxer.

That is a whole different ballgame.

 

[Samaira]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

Funny, every youtube video I've ever seen of someone soloing a boss has shown the player using a dexxer.

[/ QUOTE ]

Perhaps that is because no one makes youtube videos of a group of tamers killing a boss? That happens so often its boring.

<blockquote><hr>

My husband's half-finished Sampire outdamages my fully trained beetle and bake.

[/ QUOTE ]

On Siege, those are considered PvP pets. People generally use dogs for PvM. Although, I imagine the superdragon will replace dogs soon.

[/ QUOTE ]

Aaaand, your point is?

I'm talking pure and simple damage. Besides - player intelligence &gt; pixel AI. Mostly. Therefore player &gt; pet. This was my point.



<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

EDIT Oh and re: stealthers? Become an elf - higher passive detect.

[/ QUOTE ]

This thread is about hiding/stealth on Siege . There is no passive detect on Siege.

[/ QUOTE ]

Honestly didn't know this before reading posts subsequent to my first one in this thread. Have tried making a newbie char on Siege but didn't get out of my starting city because I lag far too much, so have never had the opportunity to find this out for myself. Is there any particular reason why there is no passive detect on Siege? Maybe a solution to this would be to introduce a scaled down version of what we have on prod shards...



<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

A stealther has had to sacrifice up to 220 skill points for their ability - they'll be lacking in other areas. Find their weakness and killing them is simple.

[/ QUOTE ]

If it were simple on Siege, this wouldn't be a multipage thread.

[/ QUOTE ]

Its looking like quite a simple problem to me, actually... what with the excellent suggestions made by the likes of Wenchy re: petballs *shrugs*

 

[imported_MoonglowMerchant]

Two things.

First, as you know now, hide/stealth/reveal are handled differently on Siege.

Second, I actually don't have any firsthand experience with champs, or dark fathers, or peerless on regular shards. I assumed, perhaps incorrectly, that for the most part they are done the same way that they are done on Siege. That is, as part of a group. That group on Siege almost always includes pets because 1) they have 3-10 times the health of a player character 2) they can be used to absorb damage while bandages and other heals are applied to them 3) they possess special abilities like armor corruption and self healing that makes them effective against high level monsters.

Your point about dexxers being the supreme PvM character may be true on regular shards. I don't know.

I know that on Siege, where we can only bless one thing and everything else is losable upon death, it is impossible to outfit a dexxer the same way one can on a regular shard. Therefore, our dexxers are comparitively less effective and our pets comparitively more effective.

Hence, the discussion about a change.

Edit: I think a timer between uses on a petball makes sense too. I just don't envision it as the ultimate solution to the use of pets in PvP.

 

[imported_SavageSP]

"You wouldn't object to a skill delay between hiding and stealth would you? That single change would really, really help. At least then, one would have a chance at a hider or group of hiders.

Your asking for a timer that you hide, and cant move for ten seconds, so you can Conflag, or Area Spell and your target is done for, he either gets revealed already damaged or runs full out till he gets away.

You know as well as I do the ONLY 1 on 1's you get on Siege are in a Dueling Pit, or VERY Rare occassions you find a lone sole thats not calling in help on Vent and running towards them.

There are Very Few Players that will go out solo and look for fights without calling for help, most of the ones that do now are stealthers, and alot of those have to stealth or they have to cheat to get away, all your gonna do is promote more cheating and quitting.

Cause we all know EA isnt doing ANYTHING about Speeding, you get "were looking into it" from EA, and "Prove It! and Im calling a GM for you harrassing me" from the Cheaters.

They know EA wont and cant do a damn thing when they turn it on and turn it off. Thats what your Promoting, cause if you take away the only defence from the Pets, Dismounts, Speeders, and Zergs that are Siege Perilous and Ultima in it's current uncared for form.

You Either go Join the Cheaters or run only in Huge Numbers or you Die when you run into a Group sent to take you down. Or you run Stealth and pick your Battles.

Siege's days of "Castor Type Players" running solo looking for 1 on 1's are Dead,
only a few do it now and that's rare.

From my crew I see Dexter, Balki, and Tide when hes on Run Solo Visable, sometimes they get lucky, but more often then not its Zerg, Dismount, "all kill", well Ill be back in 20. Sad.....

Address Pets, Address Cheating, maybe then the Solo Players will be willing to show themselves more often and only run from the Zergs.

 

[imported_SavageSP]

"Considering development time, my guess would be that it is easier to make an adjustment to hide/stealth than it is to fix speedhacking."

Until they Fix those things.........

Your just asking to kill all Templets that use Stealth, lets put timers on area effect spells, summons, and do away with those nifty scribe pens that non-scribes use.
How about doing away with the Guard Zone in Towns? Would you run you Bushido dude out there then? Not Solo you wouldnt, and if you did all anyone would see is *Evade*

Dismount from a Heavy, and Pets with stealth combined with the Pet Ball and Ecru Rings, and HPR are the problem. Stealth isnt the Problem it's the other things combined with it that are the problem and Nerfing Stealth Further is Killing a whole set of templets and non PvPers.
Everyone Cant Play a Mage or wants to hug the GZ or Cheat like the Losers that do it now, fix the things that are causing the problem, and live with the fact you cant win em all and kill everyone that doesnt want to Cheat or Fight You

 

[Nerf-Herder]

RTLFC...

We HAD balance on Siege for stealthers before they put in that stupid 10 second timer on area detect hidden.

Anyone who ran a detective before that change knows what I'm talking about. That timer nearly makes the detect hidden skill worthless when trying to pop a stealther. Without it, you can actually reveal the stealther well before his hiding timer resets. That used to leave them open for attacks.

Remove that damn timer and change to how it was a little over a year ago.

Devs, that will save you alot of time trying to screw with hiding/stealth/ninjitsu/smoke bombs/etc...

 

[imported_MoonglowMerchant]

<blockquote><hr>

RTLFC...

We HAD balance on Siege for stealthers before they put in that stupid 10 second timer on area detect hidden.

Anyone who ran a detective before that change knows what I'm talking about. That timer nearly makes the detect hidden skill worthless when trying to pop a stealther. Without it, you can actually reveal the stealther well before his hiding timer resets. That used to leave them open for attacks.

Remove that damn timer and change to how it was a little over a year ago.

Devs, that will save you alot of time trying to screw with hiding/stealth/ninjitsu/smoke bombs/etc...

[/ QUOTE ]

Amen.

 

[imported_SavageSP]

The Difference here is the Revealer Actually has to have the Skill, you identify those players and avoid them, or kill them, hopefully they man up and join Factions rather then the normal blue Chicken S Stuff that happens running a Blue revealer in the GZ or with his Faction Crew there to Stat everyone he reveals, but thats not gonna happen either, it never is equal Risk is it.....

This is how alot of Reds are made and the true Game Mechanic Gurus use everything they can to Win with no Risk, but hey at least someone had to use 100 Skill, Id rather see that then another Nerf, I have Reds for that Purpose.

 

[imported_MoonglowMerchant]

<blockquote><hr>

The Difference here is the Revealer Actually has to have the Skill, you identify those players and avoid them, or kill them, hopefully they man up and join Factions rather then the normal blue Chicken S Stuff that happens running a Blue revealer in the GZ or with his Faction Crew there to Stat everyone he reveals, but thats not gonna happen either, it never is equal Risk is it.....


[/ QUOTE ]

One possible change is making is so that non-faction characters can't reveal faction hiders.

<blockquote><hr>

This is how alot of Reds are made and the true Game Mechanic Gurus use everything they can to Win with no Risk, but hey at least someone had to use 100 Skill, Id rather see that then another Nerf, I have Reds for that Purpose.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't consider hiding/stealth changes a nerf. I think of it as returning it to the way it was before when it was useful but not overpowered. When I think about hiding/stealth on Siege, I keep picturing that big red "Easy" button.

 

[imported_SavageSP]

"I keep picturing that big red "Easy" button. "

Exactly, "Easy" to Kill Everyone,
Just adjust the Detect Timer and make Them Use a Skill to Negate a Stealther's Skill, The Detectors are gonna be bluebie Hiders anyways with company, but at least one of the Zerg Group or GZ Huggers will be off his Tamer.

 

[imported_SavageSP]

"One possible change is making is so that non-faction characters can't reveal faction hiders."

Blues Interfering in factions is a whole different set of Problems...Lame

 

[imported_MoonglowMerchant]

<blockquote><hr>

Just adjust the Detect Timer and make Them Use a Skill to Negate a Stealther's Skill

[/ QUOTE ]

What do you think would be appropriate for the timer?

Could it just be removed altogether as your guildmate suggested?

Should using the detect skill reveal a hidden detecter?

 

[imported_SavageSP]

Well I dont think 10 seconds on detect is fair to the detector, then its just a game of Hide Detect every 10 seconds and the Detector doesnt have 100% chance to Detect, I think 0 is too low because it would be Spamed in a "Circle",
I think 3-5 seconds might be fair to both sides since the detector cant reveal everytime, of course the hider cant hide everytime without Items and 50 ninja.

 

[Kat SP]

<blockquote><hr>

Uh-oh... balancing and pets in the same sentence is making me nervous...I still remember the last time tamers were "balanced" to the point of castration.

[/ QUOTE ]

That has been one of the biggest problems for our dev team's of the past. Instead of tweaking and actually balancing anything, they just beat it to death with the nerf stick, call it good and endure the screaming. =/

 

[Kat SP]

<blockquote><hr>

We HAD balance on Siege for stealthers before they put in that stupid 10 second timer on area detect hidden.

Anyone who ran a detective before that change knows what I'm talking about. That timer nearly makes the detect hidden skill worthless when trying to pop a stealther. Without it, you can actually reveal the stealther well before his hiding timer resets. That used to leave them open for attacks.

Remove that damn timer and change to how it was a little over a year ago.

Devs, that will save you alot of time trying to screw with hiding/stealth/ninjitsu/smoke bombs/etc...

[/ QUOTE ]

Amen again!

I think Savage might have a good idea with a 3-5 second timer on detect too. If there MUST be a timer, that seems like a balanced range to set it, that way, the stealther has some chance to get away, but the detector isn't standing there for 10 seconds while the stealther is already 8 screens away free and clear.

 

[Llewen]

<blockquote><hr>

Elladan, that's why we didn't touch it in the PvP pass - it really requires an across the board monster balance pass.

[/ QUOTE ]
I've spent thousands of hours farming for good pets, if changes are made that renders those thousands of hours meaningless, I will be finding another MMO to subscribe to, no if's and's or but's...

 

[imported_SavageSP]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

Uh-oh... balancing and pets in the same sentence is making me nervous...I still remember the last time tamers were "balanced" to the point of castration.

[/ QUOTE ]

That has been one of the biggest problems for our dev team's of the past. Instead of tweaking and actually balancing anything, they just beat it to death with the nerf stick, call it good and endure the screaming. =/

[/ QUOTE ]

Yep, and this is why Ive always said the Pets need to be fixed in PvP pertaining to an Actively Aggressive Tamer using them for nothing but PvP, The PvM Tamer should still be able to defend himself versus Players.

Not all Tamers are able to make their pets fly across the screen like some do, and Pet balls with no timer at all dont help, at the very least making a pets casting speed and range and movement follow those a player is restricted by and putting maybe a 10-30 second timer on the pet balls would be ok without making the tamer defenceless versus unwanted attacks.

The Pets casting doulble Flamestrikes and whatever else was in there combo should at least be controlled by a casting speed and Range the same as a players, anyone thats been hit like this knows its not. Pets Casting is set like a Monster, not a Player.

The only reason youd need to repeatedly hit a pet ball over and over with no Timer is if your running animal or mounted trying to (P+M)vP

More Tweaking , Less Ruining Everyones Templets with a Executioners Axe.

Oh and Less, "wouldnt super Uber damage bigger better stronger faster be good for everyone", only to be followed by "whoops guess we gotta nerf that when we get around to it...... I dont know if I have the Time, gotta go to Home Depot and Garden Ridge...."

 

[imported_SavageSP]

No one is talking about PvM Tamers, no one is trying to Nerf Trammel Tamers

 

[Llewen]

<blockquote><hr>

No one is talking about PvM Tamers, no one is trying to Nerf Trammel Tamers

[/ QUOTE ]
wtf makes you assume I'm a "Trammel Tamer"? But no, I'm not a Siege tamer, and I agree there is a huge problem with the tamer template being over powered on Siege.

 

[imported_SavageSP]

Sorry, shouldnt have assumed you didnt PvP with your Pets.

 

[Llewen]

<blockquote><hr>

Sorry, shouldnt have assumed you didnt PvP with your Pets.

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm a bit touchy on the subject...

 

[imported_MoonglowMerchant]

I'll try to run some tests and see how far I can stealth away in 3-5 seconds post-reveal.

Results tomorrow!

 

[Guest]

I disagree that hide/stealth is a problem on siege. I think that passive revealing makes hiding/stealth essentially useless on other shards. Siege is fine.

A stealther on siege (or anywhere else) can be revealed by:

1. detect hidden
2. conflag pot
3. poison field/fire field
4. area effect spells
5. a meteor swarm not only will often reveal a stealther, it will tell you exactly where he is even if not revealed.
6. the very cheap explosion pots

Furthermore, tracking will let you determine exactly where a stealther is.

Overall, the advantages of stealth are often worth the point cost on a template, but would be worth nothing if passive reveal were added.

 

[imported_MoonglowMerchant]

We aren't really talking about adding passive reveal anymore. We are talking about shortening the timer on detect hidden.

The methods you gave all have the potential to work for the initial reveal, but if you take time to read all the feedback in this thread it is clear that the initial reveal is only part of the stealth/hide imbalance.

 

[imported_dexdash]

<blockquote><hr>


Siege's days of "Castor Type Players" running solo looking for 1 on 1's are Dead,
only a few do it now and that's rare.

From my crew I see Dexter, Balki, and Tide when hes on Run Solo Visable, sometimes they get lucky, but more often then not its Zerg, Dismount, "all kill", well Ill be back in 20. Sad.....

Address Pets, Address Cheating, maybe then the Solo Players will be willing to show themselves more often and only run from the Zergs.

[/ QUOTE ]


if i knew how i would have posted myself with a big target on my char surounded by 10 hidden dismount tamers.

i guess i could hide in the house and play chess........... sigh

 

[Good_Ole_Lefty]

Jeremy. Mages take mana to cast spells, with AOS Warriors were required to use mana for special moves. However Tamers do not use any mana to say all kill. There should be some requisites here. Tamers get a free lunch as far as I am concerned on the PvP field. A Beetle, nightmare and a archer on the same target is nearly impossible to defend against on foot.

 

[Widowtaker]

I play Seige and production shards. Your problems are just that...yours.

We have learned to always take a detector. Pets..easy..para fields = a dead tamer. Please learn to PvP before you speak about issues that are not issues to those who know how to PvP.

 

[LAH Architect]

My sentiments exactly ... most of them whiners just need to spend more time learning how to fight against a tamer. It's non-consensual PvP in Fel , that means all sort of playstyles and templates are valid. Even if you are usually the badass red pker that takes the role of hunter, you sometimes get hunted by others. You hate being the prey (victim) but that's Fel for you : non-consensual. Just think of all the 'Trammie' blue tamers taming their new dragons in Fel destard (more spawn=more choice) that gets pked by reds. They didn't ask to be pked. But hell no... it isn't allowed if one of them grows a pair, wears decent armor, carry pots and fights back ... and omg ... kills the badass pker... nerf nerf nerf ! Those trammies must be nerfed ! Lets go lobby Mummy Jeremy .

Ultimately, a pet is still controlled by a tamer and it's not as easy to just say 'All Kill' . A good PvP Tamer spends a lot of time selecting and training his/her pets, tweaking templates, gearing up with useful items, learning how to manage pets that go crazy over other small spawn... stuck between rocks / Yew Houses. There are good and bad PvP Tamers, similar to good and bad PvP Mages, Dexers, Archers. And guess what ? PvP Bards could be a viable option in certain spawn thick areas.

It is so much easier to play the Lethal Poisoner | Armor Ignore Parry Dexer. Load up the latest Speedhack and AutoMedic, arm a DPed kyrss . Click and follow the cursor with two macroes set for LP / AI. And yes... this template is very deadly to a stealth ninja tamer. The slightly experienced ones will arm a second weapon to Bleed/Disarm (warfork). The most experienced dexers will carry multiple petballs bonded to more mounts as well as carry a paralyse move weapon.

Having said all that, we still have to give credit to the OP and his supporters that they are from :

SEIGE !

Why does it not have passive detect ? Turn it on !

A SEIGE problem should have a SEIGE solution.

Also, don't forget that the tamer controlling the pet is also wearing uninsured armor that's not all 70s .

 

[imported_BlacK RaiN]

<blockquote><hr>

I disagree that hide/stealth is a problem on siege.

[/ QUOTE ]

We don't think the way hiding/stealth works on Siege is a problem either...


We have a problem with the way detect hidden is broken

We have a problem with tamers who can remain hidden while the battle is underway.

We have a problem with the way tamers can abuse petballs.

We have a problem with the way the magery spell "reveal" doesn't work... at all...

We have a problem with the way tamers abuse the log out/log in feature to retrieve pets.

We have a problem with the way Archers can dismount at a range (we for the most part agree that if you have the cunning and tactics to make it all the way to your opponent on foot... you deserve the dismount.)

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I think this pretty much sums up our dissatisfaction with the current state of pvp.

We've been in era's of UO where PvP was sooo close to being perfectly balanced and it was enjoyed by the majority who partook in it regardless of the character class they played (Warrior, Hybrid, Mage, Tamer, Thief, or even bard...)

We'd like to get back to that place... and are asking the Devs to step in and handle this situation so that we may continue playing and enjoying our gaming experiences.

 

[Nexus]

<blockquote><hr>

Only problem with taming imo is the fact that it requires so little skillpoints to make it viable in a pvp template. Make it require atleast 80/80/80 in taming lore and vet for any chance to control your pets. Also make the legacy monsters equal to the new pets. Meaning tone down the new pets as the legacy monsters were fine as they were. Whilst monsters like rune beetles have several special attacks aswell as obscure casting and speed.

[/ QUOTE ]

See now your hitting an completely other issue. 80/80/80 is easy to obtain from an Advance Character Token and a minute amount of work, yet on the same note newbie tamers who aren't using ACT's would get nerfed to non-existence. I'll only say Yea to a 80/80/80 if that was to apply to ethies, horses, swampies, and any other ridable critter, or pack animal...the restrictiveness of it to mid range tamers would be overly damaging. Any tamer with less than 80 is already stuck with low end pack animals in PvP since Taming and Lore was altered a few months back this would be all they could consistently control. What the real root of the balancing issues are now is Skill Jewelery, and items, without those you won't see any one in PvP with Runes, Kitsune, Mares, Dragons, Drakes, you'd only see folks with packs of frenzied ostards. But then again if you wipe skill items for Tamers it's only fair to do it for every other skill in the game and honestly I'd hate to give up my +10 parry fishing pole.

 

[imported_Kojak]

plz don't screw everyone on the normal shards just to fix siege k thx

 

[imported_BlacK RaiN]

<blockquote><hr>

plz don't screw everyone on the normal shards just to fix siege k thx

[/ QUOTE ]

Only if we can start getting the reverse applied as well?

It would be nice if we could stop screwing Siege just to fix normal shards too...

 

[imported_BlacK RaiN]

For example... look at this list:

- Private housing that we cannot enter or raid/siege on Siege... players can sit in their homes and we can't siege them because of an invisible, impenetrable force field that we have no idea wtf it's even there.

- Instanced corpses

- Instanced dungeons

- bonded pets

- tamers log in/out to retrieve pets

- Having no delay in petball summons - so a naked ninja/stealth tamer can run next to you spamming his "summon + all kill + last target" macro for a cheap, easy, effortless kill.

- beneficial acts (i can't even duel a guildmate because when one of us dies, we can't ressurect the dead person...) Hell, I can't even re-enter the house we're sparing in after I leave the house for a res (my guildmate cant res me) and try to come back... NICE ONE!

- sacrifice self ressurection - 3 free self resses AND you get keep all of your stuff? Come... ON!


- item based combat tailored around item insurance


- "You do not have the right to loot this corpse" - No I don't have the right to loot that corpse, but hell, I should still be able to and I should be flagged a criminal if I do.


- The way loot is distributed. - We kill those (or die trying) who loot our things without our consent... that's kind of the fun part, really.


- Factions being broken/neglected for damn near 8 years now...


- Siege server not showing up on the server list unless you renounce your young status twice or wait the alotted time. (Like people can't handle going straight to the shard if they want to.) This is the hard shard... not the vet shard anymore...


-Players being created in Ocllo because newbies couldn't handle having the choice of picking the city they'd like to be created in... instead its mandatory everyone start on that island. Did they forget people can't recall/gate/sac journey on siege? Oh, I guess they figured everyone would just auto-know the help stuck button to get off... right.


- Removing horse stamina - I'm sorry it was an inconvenience to the trammies... to us it gave us a reason to run around on foot.


- Making resources like valorite/verite/frostwood/etc. almost damn near impossible to obtain... - Ok Ok... so you trammies have a problem with scripters, well we don't because we kill them. So now we have to suffer getting supplies that are easily lost but impossible to obtain... sweet move.


- Nerfing bags of sending... well we understand your scripters also abused these. Well we have to walk everywhere we go unless we have magery. Thank you for making it so that a warrior has to run for 30 minutes to get to a dungeon in ilshenar, hunt monsters for literally 5 minutes until they can carry no more gold... then run allllll the way back just to drop it off. - SMOOTH!


- Making detect hidden have a 10 second delay - good... so when I reveal a player who's stealthing around... he/she can instantly hide again but I have to wait another 10 seconds (when their long gone) to get another shot at revealing them. SWEET!


- Making smokebombs so someone can instantly run away from a fight - (did whoever designed this, forget why we put in the aggressive flag for fighting so people couldn't just recall away?)


- Tailoring combat (PvM AND PvP) around item insurance - we don't have item insurance... yet our system is based on the same items insurance is.


and so on and so on... and SO ON...


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Is it too much to ask to request the same thing good sir?

 

[Guest]

Pet balls should have a timer - every shard.

Stealth should not work after hiding - every shard

Pets should have more balanced control lvls to control a higher end pet you must have x amount of real skill. example these new dragons/rune beetles should have a skill lvl 115 tame 100 lore to tame and even control. - all shards

skills should hamper other skills when used together.- all shards

Its a problem on all shards and should be addressed.

 

[LAH Architect]

<blockquote><hr>

Its a problem on all shards and should be addressed.

[/ QUOTE ]

I disagree and say it's a Seige shard specific problem. If you have read my previous posts, I have suggested various way to improve your gameplay vs the 'ultimatepower' ninja tamers that flip out. Have you tried them ? Do you need a personal coaching by one or some of Baja's best ?

To : Blackrain

I think you have a huge list of grievances. While I applaud your endurance in staying with UO, you seem a very very difficult person to satisfy and I dare say impossible. Whatever the devs do, it won't be enough for you.

The majority of the playerbase are normal shards and Seige has failed to pulled even it's own weight... usually ranking as one of the lowest populated shard. While the Siege veterans do a superb job at voicing their concerns on UHall, do be realistic. Changes has to fit / suit the majority who pay subscription and keep UO running and its devs employed. It does not make any sense to change normal shards first to fit Siege. Being and choosing to be special means sometimes you get the better deal, sometimes you do not.

For a list of better deals that Siege has to offer, contact some of the friendly hardcore Siege veterans that register with SP in their Stratics nicks.

Siege does get attention from the devs. But some Siege players are too spoiled and constantly bring their issues to UOHall to get more attention.

E.g. Look at this thread's title vs the OP's first sentence. It's clear that the OP is playing Seige and is offering feedback with regards to Siege. Why was the title misleading and masquerading to present all the player's feedback ?

Sticking to their shard forums would be neat, tidy and relevant but the 'want it now, change it now to suit us' mentality means these shard specific threads get posted on UHall.

There are 26 normal shards vs 1 Siege rules shard. If you count total players playing normal rules vs total players playing Siege rules, that Siege vote gets diluted further. If you apply this statistic to UHall Forum, 26 or more readers do not care what happens to Siege vs every 1 Siege player that cares.

I know the figures are too brutal and that is not what Seige players want to hear. Ever considered moving your Seige concerns purely to the Seige Shard Forums ? It would be easier for the devs to visit there and be clear of Seige problems and possibly apply shard specific fixes for you special guys and gals.

Let's get an analogy : you are the eldest child in a family with 26 other siblings, all of whom are at least 5 years younger than you. Should family decisions always suit you as the eldest first ?

P.S. I took a glance at the Seige Forum, there's no sticky post on Seige's concerns or special needs that lets the devs read and understand clearly.

 

[Lord_Puffy]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

Its a problem on all shards and should be addressed.

[/ QUOTE ]

I disagree and say it's a Seige shard specific problem. If you have read my previous posts, I have suggested various way to improve your gameplay vs the 'ultimatepower' ninja tamers. Have you tried them ? Do you need a personal coaching by one or some of Baja's best ?

To : Blackrain

I think you have a huge list of grievances. While I applaud your endurance in staying with UO, you seem a very very difficult person to satisfy and I dare say impossible. Whatever the devs do, it won't be enough for you.

The majority of the playerbase are normal shards and Seige has failed to pulled even it's own weight... usually ranking as one of the lowest populated shard. While the Siege veterans do a superb job at voicing their concerns on UHall, do be realistic. Changes has to fit / suit the majority who pay subscription and keep UO and its devs employed. It does not make any sense to change normal shards first to fit Siege. Being and choosing to be special means sometimes you get the better deal, sometimes you do not.

Siege does get attention from the devs. But some Siege players are too spoiled and constantly bring their issues to UOHall to get more attention. Sticking to their shard forums would be neat, tidy and relevant but the 'want it now, change it now to suit us' mentality means these shard specific threads get posted on UHall.

There are 26 normal shards vs 1 Siege rules shard. If you count total players playing normal rules vs total players playing Siege rules, that Siege vote gets diluted further. If you apply this statistic to UHall Forum, 26 or more readers do not care what happens to Siege vs every 1 Siege player that cares.

I know the figures are too brutal and that is not what Seige players want to hear. Ever considered moving your Seige concerns purely to the Seige Shard Forums ? It would be easier for the devs to visit there and be clear of Seige problems and possibly apply shard specific fixes for you special guys and gals.

[/ QUOTE ]

Can we just get passive detect?

And this is a uo forum right? Why dont people post in all of their shard forums when they have problems instead of coming here? Gee ya think?

Lowell...

 

[imported_MoonglowMerchant]

This thread isn't about how many people play on Siege. It is about getting a change to stealth/hiding/detect on the radar and finding out what can be done about PvM pets in PvP.

However, I had to address this comment.

<blockquote><hr>

The majority of the playerbase are normal shards and Seige has failed to pulled even it's own weight... usually ranking as one of the lowest populated shard.

[/ QUOTE ]

In the past, the players of Siege, more than any other shard have worked to bring new players in.

In years past, this was done is spite of large imbalances in PvP (a mainstay of the shard), in spite of the disparity in blessings (PBD's for some, not for others), in spite of threats to close the shard, etc...

I don't know what shard you call home, but ask yourself what the population would be if:

1. No one could start there
2. No one could transfer there
3. Half the shard could use insurance and the other half couldn't

It isn't that the players of Siege didn't pull their weight, the developers simply failed to address our shard specific issues in a timely fashion.

I understand that we represent a small percentage of the total playerbase. On the other hand, my monthly fees are no less than anyone elses. If I am paying the same, shouldn't I expect a similar level of support that someone on another shard receives?

Here is another example, so that you know what I mean.

When I started Siege, the skill resisting spells was broken. If you had resist over 90 you were ok. But, if your resisting spells was below 90, you could not raise it over 90. It was stuck. This was for every single player on the shard with resisting spells below 90.

Ask yourself, if that was on Atlantic, how quickly would that have been fixed?

On Siege, it was a problem for YEARS. It literally took them several years to address that issue.

Once again, its not Siege's fault.

*ends rant*

 

[Lord_Puffy]

i agree completly instanced corpses are a crime.....

I'd also love to see passive detect.

Animal Form taking up 2 pet slots. I mean it is like being mounted isnt it?



ROT? we wont even open that can of worms... i dont see why they dont just take it off... shard was split on the 7th ae gifts but they unblessed them.. So whats the different between 7th ae gifts and rot.. we are always going to be divided and not agree.... so just take rot out and see how many people come to play siege. then once our player base is larger u might have some reason to care about the server. and start fixing little [censored] things.

 

[imported_BlacK RaiN]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

Its a problem on all shards and should be addressed.

[/ QUOTE ]

I disagree and say it's a Seige shard specific problem. If you have read my previous posts, I have suggested various way to improve your gameplay vs the 'ultimatepower' ninja tamers that flip out. Have you tried them ? Do you need a personal coaching by one or some of Baja's best ?

To : Blackrain

I think you have a huge list of grievances. While I applaud your endurance in staying with UO, you seem a very very difficult person to satisfy and I dare say impossible. Whatever the devs do, it won't be enough for you.

The majority of the playerbase are normal shards and Seige has failed to pulled even it's own weight... usually ranking as one of the lowest populated shard. While the Siege veterans do a superb job at voicing their concerns on UHall, do be realistic. Changes has to fit / suit the majority who pay subscription and keep UO running and its devs employed. It does not make any sense to change normal shards first to fit Siege. Being and choosing to be special means sometimes you get the better deal, sometimes you do not.


[/ QUOTE ]

In all honesty... I have no idea why I'm even bothering to respond to this crap.

But either way it's obvious you have no clue what-so-ever of what you're talking about.

Is trammel and notions behind it bringing in new players? Are there people out there holding their breathe waiting to play trammel but refuse to because of their dissatisfaction with the rules that have been super imposed upon them?

No.

There are emulations of Felucca based UO servers that exceed ANY of Ultima Online's most popular servers in population.

There are TONS of players who'd love to play UO if they weren't so disrespected, neglected and down trodden upon.

So [censored] you for pancakes at me for trying to get the Dev team to fix things enough so that they'll come back.

And to be frank with you... Everquest, SWG, WoW, and hell, pretty much every damn game out there sounds like it would suit your carebear pom pom toating self better than this game would.

So thanks for screwing up this game for everyone. You can now stop posting pointless crap now trying to derail this subject for no-good-[censored]-reason.

I'll continue asking the devs to unscrew everything your camp has managed to screw up... all while loving every minute of my in game time.

Should there be a day where I don't enjoy logging in and playing the game... I'll no longer play this game.

Until then, take your bright ideas, erm... suggestions and cram them where the sun don't shine.

kapeesh?

 

[imported_dukarlo]

Passive detct was a poor attempt at fixing stealth archers. One can still easily play a stealth archer. The only characters passive detect effected were thieves. It literaly wiped out what few were left on production shards. The best fix for hiding and stealth would be to revert it back to pre Samurai Empire rules. Stealth should be for being sneaky not for being invulnerable on a range based stealth archer that can just run off in animal form at will. Siege players be careful if your asking for passive detect, you may just get it. Passive detect is just a dice roll that will not take care of your stealth archer problems. What is needed is active skill counters to stealth and pre Samurai Empire stealth certainly had its counters.

 

[Guest]

RTLFC

hhmmm, how about...

- Animal form taking 1 control slot... or ...Animal form being unable to give commands
- Animal form unable to perform ranged attacks(Archery, Bolas?, exct...).
- Reducing Detect Hidden Time down to 5 seconds
- Causing Tracking to give a bonus to the Detect Hidden skill and the Reveal spell.
- 10 Second Pet Ball timer between a successfully obayed command or another Pet Ball summon.
- Make Passive reveal weaker on Prod Shards, based , primarily, on the chars/mobs Detect Hidden and secondarily on Int.

 

[imported_MoonglowMerchant]

Leurocian....did someone say Leurocian?

 

[Guest]

Thread next door

Wenchy