House Security Warning - Waterbarrels

[drinkbeerallday]

You are offended because I am offended at your attitude? that post is a bunch of hogwash.. laying responsibility on the person who has this happening to them is the definition of blaming the victim.. it's bad form, bad policy, and bad for humans in general.. it is an ugliness of spirit on the part of the person blaming the victim and needs to be called out every time it is done.

asking what happened is not laying blame. calm down Yalp jeez..

 

[Yalp]

You must of really done something to make them want to do this to you. Ya I'd be annoyed but then again I don't go out making enemies or act rude to others in or out of game. Not saying this is what you've done it could be that they are jealous and can't find any other mature way to get your attention. Could even be ones those grade school kids with a crush one ya.

this isn't asking questions.. this is blaming the victim.. and I always get upset when people do this.. just as I would if peeps did something just as aggregious.. like abusing a child... it's a philosophy running rampant in our society and I speak out against it every time I see it. It's not ok when it happens irl and it's not ok when it carries over into cyber world.

to be fair.. the poster completely contradicts himself in his post in the next unbolded section.. backing off his blaming the victim tactic.. which to me is more a sign of a lack of clear writing skills vs. trying to figure out why this might be happening.

 

[Rix/\]

You are offended because I am offended at your attitude? that post is a bunch of hogwash.. laying responsibility on the person who has this happening to them is the definition of blaming the victim.. it's bad form, bad policy, and bad for humans in general.. it is an ugliness of spirit on the part of the person blaming the victim and needs to be called out every time it is done.

the blame and responsibility lays squared and SOLELY on the shoulders of the people doing this kind of acts. The fact that GM's refuse to do anything about it is bad customer service, but oddly, not something that surprises us. Which is sad in it's own right.

seriously this post is about crying over spilt milk, imagine if the GM responded to every message sent about another player greifing another. They are GM's not babysitters, he's telling you it's your choice to have a public vendor house. Just because it's in luna doesn't mean it has to be a pulic vendor house and if thats what you want then design the house so that others can't invade your private areas of your home. When you have a vendor house you open it up to the public but the are features in the housing design that allows you to limit the access of other players in your house. I personally hate water barrels, I think they clutter the game and are pointless. You got a response from a GM, may not of liked it, but atleast you got one.

 

[Connor_Graham]

The only thing I can say is, water barrels should be removable from a house by the house owner/co-owner using an axe on them.

As far as I'm concerned, water barrels shouldn't be able to be placed by anyone but an owner or co-owner of a house. Nothing else can be, so why can water barrels?

 

[Rix/\]

this isn't asking questions.. this is blaming the victim.. and I always get upset when people do this.. just as I would if peeps did something just as aggregious.. like abusing a child... it's a philosophy running rampant in our society and I speak out against it every time I see it. It's not ok when it happens irl and it's not ok when it carries over into cyber world.

to be fair.. the poster completely contradicts himself in his post in the next unbolded section.. backing off his blaming the victim tactic.. which to me is more a sign of a lack of clear writing skills vs. trying to figure out why this might be happening.

Lack of writing skill I can agree with ya there I'm not claiming tobe no writer. But your gettin' my epeen from an outsider I don't play on your shard, I'm just taking facts that only one side is showing and I'm trying to see it from other angles.

 

[Vyrquenox]

have been griefing for months on stratics and in game.

In situations like this I always take comfort that when kids grow up, they will realize the error in their ways. If not, then I take comfort knowing that karma will eventually bite them in their behind.

I'd strongly suggest to get in contact with Jeremy about this stuff hapenning in Game. I will continue to be vigilant here at Stratics.

"And the pot calls the kettle black. Glass houses. Dark fire and the sweet spit of a cobra will not avail you. Go back to the shadow, deceiver of the flock. You stand in the path and think you built the road. You wield your mind improperly and do not use it to provide light. You shall not pass by me"
and I am regarding someone I met once who told me this. Not at anyyyyone in particular, I certainly did not say it. I certainly didn't say it. Oval of the moon.

Heh.

 

[azmodanb]

Haha... you have to think it's pretty funny though taking the time to do this to someone..

It's not like you CAN'T remove them... it's not to much of a pain ... (drink drink drink, or hell free plant water!) haha...

I remember doing this to a faction base back in the day.

 

[D'Amavir]

I'm posting this as a 'general security advisory' for anyone with a public house that is accessible by anyone. As we found out the hard way tonight, GMs do not consider placing waterbarrels all over someone's house to be griefing or harassment. As the GM kindly suggests (in the attached screenshot) you may like to consider making your house private if you wish to avoid this sort of harassment. Note that the house in question tonight was a Luna vendor shop, and I don't think making it private is a very helpful suggestion.

Some background on the situation on Oceania at the moment, for anyone who's interested. There's a large Trammel based guild currently under attack from a small group of PvP / Griefers. Yesterday our fishing event (as advertised on FoF) was disrupted by this group. They filled up Cove harbor with boats and lagged out the whole area by placing a large number of 1gp coins in a hidden stack. Tonight they amused themselves by filling up the guild's Luna vendor shop with waterbarrels.

Personally, I am disappointed (but not overly surprised) that EA GM's will ban people for in-game URL's but fail to deal with real troublemakers such as this group of ill-intentioned players.

This is the problem with Trammel. Its full of griefers and scammers that do anything they can to ruin the enjoyment of the game by others.

 

[Teeshy]

Things are never just black and white - especially in this game - I see grey all the time! =P

 

[Amathist of PoC]

Okay to clear a few things up

The vendor house that was attacked last night is not even my house its a guild members house, the guild hall that was attacked is also owned by another guild member. There beef is totally me and the reason they chose me to create the impostor character off but they are targeting the guild as a whole.

Have I done anything to deserve there attacks.......yeah I have stood up to them, disagreed with them, Booted them from events they were disrupting and I have paged Gms and moderators on them for things they have done....do some of these things make me a bigger target....yep I agree it does......do I feel I still deserve help from the gms as do my guild members YES.

At the "PoC Big Fish Oceania Carnival" we hosted the GMS did come and fix the first lots of boats say within 30min, then the next day the day of the event as they attacked it the night before and taunted us with we are going to stay in port for 3 days...any way on the day of the event they created HUGE lag with a coin trick (I don't know how just that it was) and they blocked the entrance to the harbor during a boat race......this took to the near end of the event for the gms to do anything the event started at 11am and it was after 1:30pm when it was ending and by that time alot had got distressed with the lag and the booting from game and appearing in another town on logging back in that they gave up on the event.

The barrels would not be a huge deal if like someone said they made it illegal for anyone but the owner to place them in a house or they where able to be axed by the owner...but to stand there and have to empty barrels by hand is a huge time waster even for a big guild like ours......and the griefers know this they spouted on about it while we where emptying barrels "having fun" "this is the most poc have had to do it weeks you should thank us".....and a whole lot of other dribble.

Do I know what to do about it.......NOPE not really all I can do is keep plugging on and hope the guild does too, thankfully I can be stubborn. The fact that it is not just water barrels they are doing to cause grief is annoying, frustrating and I just wish something would get a reaction from the GMS or some member of EA Mythic.

 

[MalagAste]

As unfortunate as this is it tends to be the trend of late. I recall from running several events on GL that there used to be a time when GM's would watch events and I know for a fact that they would intervene when folk got out of hand...

As for the boats.... those defiantly should have been removed by the GM.... We once held a "siege" type event in Brit and had placed some chests about at Castle British...... we were NOT blocking the castle as there was a clear path....granted it was a bit of a maze... but it was NOT blocking things... A GM came and removed them all saying it "caused to much lag to the server"..... So it would appear to me that GM's do whatever they want when ever they decide and I guess that the SSO seems to have the GM on their side....

Though I must say I'm rather surprised you got a GM I paged them 2 times Yesterday was 12 in Q for 4 hours..... finally said forget it.....

 

[ShadowJack]

if you were in fel you could kill them



aaaaannnndddd if they didn't have insurance they couldn't just pop back for ganks






20 tram players = ownage to 10 fel players





well I would hope so anyhow

 

[Amathist of PoC]

I just went to UO.com guild pages to see there guild list and work out the names that had been greifing us - out of 27 characters which I think is say 5 actual peoples accounts - 11 of those characters have caused us grief and been seen doing it that is not including the fake guild they created and the fake amathist which is another 1.

They are 8th on the vet list we are 2nd - http://town.uo.com/guilds/shard_19.html

 

[Lore Master]

While i must admit this did give me a good laugh i do feel for you. i have a vendor house myself in malas and it does concern me a bit too because if it can happen in fel it sure can happen in malas too. although i have no enemys it can still happen to anyone anywhere. the rules should change so only the owner or co-owner should be allowed to place a water barrel in your house and only the owner or co-owner can remove it.

 

[Maplestone]

I say gather it all up, with the number of people affected and the frequency of the incidents and send it to Jeremy to look at. Might not do any good, but it might get some some discussions going on behind the scenes about what the GMs could do.

(I'll have to try that change-foundation trick mentioned above some time ... that's a good thing to know - not just for this, but all sorts of mess-cleaning)

 

[DevilsOwn]

sometime last year a few vendor houses on Legends were having the very same trouble... I'm amazed that this thread has gone on as long as it has, since as I recall the one on the Legends forums got locked

and no GM response at any of those instances either.... we all helped clean up each time it happened

 

[Gem]

Some background on the situation on Oceania at the moment, for anyone who's interested. There's a large Trammel based guild currently under attack from a small group of PvP / Griefers. Yesterday our fishing event (as advertised on FoF) was disrupted by this group. They filled up Cove harbor with boats and lagged out the whole area by placing a large number of 1gp coins in a hidden stack. Tonight they amused themselves by filling up the guild's Luna vendor shop with waterbarrels.

Personally, I am disappointed (but not overly surprised) that EA GM's will ban people for in-game URL's but fail to deal with real troublemakers such as this group of ill-intentioned players.

Putting the water barrel issue aside, there was a time come--way back when--if someone disrupted or griefed an event--the GMs would actually show up and deal with them when called...even threaten to ban them if need be. There was a sense that they wanted to build sense of community--and encourage those holding community events.

As leader of a guild holding events for over 9 years, I have learned in the past few years that we are on our own when dealing with obvious griefers. Personally I think it is a sad turn as it discourages groups and individuals from holding events.

 

[Sheridan]

As far as I'm concerned, water barrels shouldn't be able to be placed by anyone but an owner or co-owner of a house. Nothing else can be, so why can water barrels?

Because they were never really meant to be used since they are supposed to only exist as static items.

As for imposters and impersonators, Amathist... I've had my share as well:

My guild and I harrassed this guy until he finally disappeared into obscurity. Not that I'm promoting two wrongs making a right (yes I am)... Imitation is always a problem, especially when the impersonator is hellbent on causing trouble for you. It's been my experience that such griefworthy tactics soon fade when it's no longer fun for them... Most immature specimens like these have thankfully short attention spans. Best of luck with your newfound fans.

 

[RoycroftLS]

if you were in fel you could kill them

aaaaannnndddd if they didn't have insurance they couldn't just pop back for ganks

20 tram players = ownage to 10 fel players

Griefers are going to grief no matter what facet they are on. They don't care if anything happens to themselves, their goal is to humiliate/harass their target at all costs.

It's one of the reasons trammel was created in the first place. The lead designer for UO at the time insinuated that trammel was an imperfect solution for keeping the playerbase away from the griefers, since the devs were unsuccessful in finding a way to police the griefers in Fel through game mechanics alone.

So stop using this as justification for going back to a playstyle you prefer. It didn't work before to deter griefing, and it won't work now.

 

[timbeOFbaja]

The sentence 'talk to the people on your friend and co-owner list and let them know you do not wish to have water barrels in your home' shows a total lack of knowledge of water barrels and how they behave. The GM is assuming they are placed by people authorised to lock items down in the house!

What do you expect with GMs who were working on DAOC a few months ago and are currently studying for WAR not UO?

 

[Crystal Canyon]

This whole thing smells fishy like someone did something and now this is retaliation.

Please dont believe that for a minete. (no offence meant) There are plenty of people out there who do things like this just out of sheer jealousy and ignorance.

I dont care what any Gm says, this instance is cleary griefing and it should have been looked into.

I wonder if they ever stop to think, that if they continue to let little twerps run rampant like this, enough people will finally get discourage and quit all together and go to a game that doesnt allow juvinele behavior. Enough people leave and there is no game.....Poof...there goes your job!

Enough people have already left this game for crap just like this.

 

[The Sandman]

You do know that, even with vendors in the house, all you have to do is change the house foundation. This kicks everything not locked down (water barrels included) outside. Careful though, you need to reset security on any doors and teleporters you have.

just tried the "change foundation" thing and the water barrel stayed....I was hoping that would work.

As for the :gun: childern that are griefing these fine Oceania events...."GROW UP PLEASE" !!!!!

If you are so bored with playing in Oceania my little :gun: griefers please come and join us in Siege..you will not have time to do any griefing there.( I can hear them now..."SIEGE!!! we lag to much in SIEGE!!!!) As usual griefers like the ones in Oceania can only deal with things that they have complete control of. So I know they are little childern that would never step foot in Siege...to bad....might make them grow up.

I suggest any and all that read any or all of this tread support the events that are being run on Oceania.

(also you need to hide in your houses and ban them when you see barrels going down)

 

[Amathist of PoC]

if you were in fel you could kill them

aaaaannnndddd if they didn't have insurance they couldn't just pop back for ganks

20 tram players = ownage to 10 fel players

Ahh you see this is the other thing they want - these same said griefers often do the "why dont you come to fel and defend yourself" line as well as complaining that PVP is dead all the time on stratics.

They would love nothing more then for us to go to fel and challenge them.....that alone keeps us from even concidering it as an option even though we would love nothing more the to see the little twirps get eaten by a greater dragon or two.

This part of the issue why they are griefing us and spending so much time on it they are little children who are BORED.

 

[OldAsTheHills]

Agree, that would solve the problem.

It should never be the GM's job to remove them.

I assume you know that all you have to do is remove the water using
water pitchers and once barrel empty move the barrel. So, really the GM
does not need to do this work. Yes, I know it is tiresome activity but it
is not impossible.
Beware, the behavior on other shards are catching up with Siege Perilous.

*stares*
Yahaxithonix

 

[Amathist of PoC]

Please dont believe that for a minete. (no offence meant) There are plenty of people out there who do things like this just out of sheer jealousy and ignorance.

I dont care what any Gm says, this instance is cleary griefing and it should have been looked into.

I wonder if they ever stop to think, that if they continue to let little twerps run rampant like this, enough people will finally get discourage and quit all together and go to a game that doesnt allow juvinele behavior. Enough people leave and there is no game.....Poof...there goes your job!

Enough people have already left this game for crap just like this.

I know what you mean I have had friends from other guilds leave because they where griefed by people and it just became too much for them to deal with it took all the fun out of the game for them.

I am not even so much worried about myself its more my guild that are having to put up with it. I dont feel its fair on them even though they stand by me and mostly ignore it. I just feel if your beef is with me take it up with me not my friends if you know what I mean.

All that I can hope is that some how we have gotten EA Mythics attention - I have emailed jeremy I have pmed her and a few other ea mythic members so I am hoping that I will just not be ignored.

As I said before 11 out of 27 or so characters from SSO guild have caused us grief and most of it is just in the last week. Then there is the fake poc and fake amathist which again is a member of SSO guild in drag.

I do not understand how a guild like this can be aloud to be or how someone can take pride in it and want to be apart of it - but then again the 5 actual people that are the key or core membmers if not the only members act like children and some actually are so what can I expect.

 

[Crystal Canyon]

Ahh you see this is the other thing they want - these same said griefers often do the "why dont you come to fel and defend yourself" line as well as complaining that PVP is dead all the time on stratics.

They would love nothing more then for us to go to fel and challenge them.....that alone keeps us from even concidering it as an option even though we would love nothing more the to see the little twirps get eaten by a greater dragon or two.

This part of the issue why they are griefing us and spending so much time on it they are little children who are BORED.

Well when "children" want to play it is often, that like you say, they are wanting someone to play with them back. They need playmates...so give them some fun.

While you or your guildmates are in a public area, such as the bank, ask one of them WHy they are griefing (being very polite). This is often hillarious! They will have to think fast to come up with an answer and most of the time it doesnt make alot of sense at all. (which makes them look like idiots....LOL

Then, while they are giving these "crazy, no sense answers, take a few screnshots of them to post. This not only exposes the culprits but shows thier true intellegence.

 

[Amathist of PoC]

I have never deliberately set out to display there stupidity - they do that enough on there own. I have pointed it out I guess and thus offended them but no more then there house wife slamming or trammie name calling does anyone else.

 

[Dame Judi]

So far all the comments I have seen have been related to people placing the barrels inside other player's houses. We had an exaggerated instance on Sonoma where someone decided to put hundreds of them (all filled from "endless" pitchers so they took forever to remove individually) in front of several player's places, sometimes stacked 4 and 5 high.

The lag was unbelievable and the intended effect was to grief without doubt.

I don't understand why filled water barrels which are not locked down don't simply decay. If a house owner wants them then they can simply lock them and conversely, if they don't they will be gone in a few hours.

This would surely solve a lot of our complaints.

 

[Salty Pete]

I don't understand why filled water barrels which are not locked down don't simply decay.

Or even make them moveable.

 

[Amathist of PoC]

So far all the comments I have seen have been related to people placing the barrels inside other player's houses. We had an exaggerated instance on Sonoma where someone decided to put hundreds of them (all filled from "endless" pitchers so they took forever to remove individually) in front of several player's places, sometimes stacked 4 and 5 high.

The lag was unbelievable and the intended effect was to grief without doubt.

I don't understand why filled water barrels which are not locked down don't simply decay. If a house owner wants them then they can simply lock them and conversely, if they don't they will be gone in a few hours.

This would surely solve a lot of our complaints.

NOW THIS I AGREE WITH 100%

 

[Ghost_Writer]

Sorry Folks. No Direct accusations of Guilds by name, characters by name, or mentioning of GM's names in a complaint. That after only reading a small portion of this thread.

However before locking this, a suggestion to the OP. Put Doors on your house and secure them. You can still keep the house public and put vendors out in front but no one will be able to get inside and fill it with Barrels. Simple solution.

Ghost