House placement within the city limits

[longshanks]

With the upcoming Magencia rebuild event I was thinking about what is the purpose of this? Will we rebuild Magencia only to abandon it to the friendly confines of Luna upon conclusion of the event?

Therefore would it be a good idea to allow the player base to build housing on plots within the limits of all the cities. If you run around any town there are many buildings that serve no purpose what so ever. Most cities are nothing more than ghost towns (Nujelm anyone?) Very rarely do you see any players in them.

I really believe for instance that Britain should have a player housing within its confines. I imagine a sort of 5th avenue with player housing and vendors abound.

Maybe this is the way to get the player base out of luna...

Discuss.

 

[Jhym]

Only if:

1) All in-city housing is public, no exceptions. Only certain plots will become available, and only certain sizes can be placed. Some plots can be broken up into multiple plots, but the placement is exact (no placing a 7x7 in the middle of a 14x14 plot, only on the edges.)
2) All in-city housing is from a set group of house templates and tiles, and is not externally customizable. This stops people from putting up ugly box housing in the middle of an otherwise nice-looking town. The inside of the house can be customized to a point and you would have normal lockdowns.
3) All in-city housing that is used for vendors has property upkeep costs, 1% of all vendor sales taken from the vendors upon purchase.
4) In-city housing can be sold/traded as is. If the house drops, anything inside is distributed throughout the city at random in barrels, crates and other containers.
5) In-city housing can be designated as "event-available"; if it is used for an EM or other event the owner receives a small rental fee.

If they do that, I'd consider accepting it.

 

[Evlar]

See, this is always something I've thought was a crying shame about the concept of house placement.

Granted, there should always have been placement areas away from the towns, as is. But, I've always felt that areas should have been made surrounding or in very close proximity to all the towns. The concepts of Luna in Malas and Makoto in the Tokuno Islands did do just this, but I've always felt it would have been better for all towns in this manner.

The design of Luna and Makato lend themselves to be trading hubs because of the house placement, why not do something similar with the other towns.

Granted, in different events towns have been attacked over the years, but that should always be part and parcel of living "in" a town.

As for housing styles, it would be great if they were selectable from gumps of the same type of architecture featured in the towns, in practice I believe that would be very difficult to implement. Another option would be to have pre-made saleable housing. They could be bought from NPC architect, traded between players, etc. Instead of falling like an IDOC, lockdowns and secures could just "unlock".

The sceptic in me says it's unlikely to happen though.

 

[Tek]

Actually I had the same idea the other day, it be great to actually have a real city laid out with streets and such, not just a ring of houses around a city, or following a road outside city limits. Lets actually build a player city, player houses in blocks with streets.
Sure maybe a small park and a few wandering NPC’s but the city is all players.

 

[Val-Tur]

1) Player housing in towns should be limited to a limited number of plots depending on the size of the city.
2) The plots should be a set size and cannot be changed.
3) The style of housing can only be picked from a set of house designs that match the city/area of the city. Exceptions are that you can make internal changes like moving internal walls, teleporters etc. But the outside walls/roof/etc are pre-set 100%
5) What about apartments? You could put up a housing/apartment like complex and charge a decent rent per week. A lot of people would use them temporarily simulating real apt turnovers. It sounds silly but why not give people options to live in the town.


If done correctly, I believe it could help create a living atmosphere within cities and help revitalize them. Because of the *urban sprawl* of modern housing, the cities feel like nothing more than the place to visit a few npc's when needed. They feel so empty. The developers need to find ways to bring people back into the cities like the days when only a few had houses. I think putting player housing or even apartments into cities could start that process.

 

[longshanks]

1) Player housing in towns should be limited to a limited number of plots depending on the size of the city.
2) The plots should be a set size and cannot be changed.
3) The style of housing can only be picked from a set of house designs that match the city/area of the city. Exceptions are that you can make internal changes like moving internal walls, teleporters etc. But the outside walls/roof/etc are pre-set 100%
5) What about apartments? You could put up a housing/apartment like complex and charge a decent rent per week. A lot of people would use them temporarily simulating real apt turnovers. It sounds silly but why not give people options to live in the town.


If done correctly, I believe it could help create a living atmosphere within cities and help revitalize them. Because of the *urban sprawl* of modern housing, the cities feel like nothing more than the place to visit a few npc's when needed. They feel so empty. The developers need to find ways to bring people back into the cities like the days when only a few had houses. I think putting player housing or even apartments into cities could start that process.

i absolutely love the apartment idea. one of the reasons i hate venturing off shards is the fact that with one account you are forced to play out of the bank box.

 

[Beastmaster]

In city housing should be customizable only on the inside. The exterior should be fixed so that the city's character is not jeopardized.

 

[Mairut]

1) Player housing in towns should be limited to a limited number of plots depending on the size of the city.
2) The plots should be a set size and cannot be changed.
3) The style of housing can only be picked from a set of house designs that match the city/area of the city. Exceptions are that you can make internal changes like moving internal walls, teleporters etc. But the outside walls/roof/etc are pre-set 100%
5) What about apartments? You could put up a housing/apartment like complex and charge a decent rent per week. A lot of people would use them temporarily simulating real apt turnovers. It sounds silly but why not give people options to live in the town.


If done correctly, I believe it could help create a living atmosphere within cities and help revitalize them. Because of the *urban sprawl* of modern housing, the cities feel like nothing more than the place to visit a few npc's when needed. They feel so empty. The developers need to find ways to bring people back into the cities like the days when only a few had houses. I think putting player housing or even apartments into cities could start that process.

i absolutely love the apartment idea. one of the reasons i hate venturing off shards is the fact that with one account you are forced to play out of the bank box.

These. Houses in other cities (like Brit!) would be awesome. If they did this and I was able to, I would definitely consider selling my Malas house to live in Brit. I love the apartment idea too, and it does sound like it would get more people back into towns.

It would be a good goal for a new player to work towards, make them feel like they were more... effective? competent? adequate? something like that...if they could work towards getting an apartment-type thing before/while working on getting their own real houses (or castles or keeps or whatever).... Because of this, I think that if there were "apartments" in game, they should be fairly cheap. And I'd say you can't have an apartment on the same shard that you own a house, but I know some people will disagree with this (and I can understand why).

Also, I think I saw a thread a few days ago (maybe in the homes and castles forum?) about someone asking about a box that used to be available to lock down in your house to be accessed by a person of your choice... this would probably solve that problem too.

 

[Val-Tur]

Apartments could be limited to say 1/2 or 1/3 the storage capacity of a 7x7. Roughly 2-3 times a bank box?

We want to stimulate town activity, so I think one apartment per shard per account not to count against a house. That way you can support role playing. The city house vs the country house, etc. I like options.

True about the new player. Gold isnt hard to keep making, so they could "rent" until they can "own" or find a suitable plot for a house. Gives them a bit more involvement in the game earlier than just saving up for that perfect spot.

 

[GarthGrey]

In city housing should be customizable only on the inside. The exterior should be fixed so that the city's character is not jeopardized.

This

 

[Terrorknight]

Love the idea, I agree that there should be limits of course so that cities arn't bogged down with lag pockets. I'm just not sure how easy this would be to fully implement.

 

[Zayin666]

Only if:

1) All in-city housing is public, no exceptions. Only certain plots will become available, and only certain sizes can be placed. Some plots can be broken up into multiple plots, but the placement is exact (no placing a 7x7 in the middle of a 14x14 plot, only on the edges.)
2) All in-city housing is from a set group of house templates and tiles, and is not externally customizable. This stops people from putting up ugly box housing in the middle of an otherwise nice-looking town. The inside of the house can be customized to a point and you would have normal lockdowns.
3) All in-city housing that is used for vendors has property upkeep costs, 1% of all vendor sales taken from the vendors upon purchase.
4) In-city housing can be sold/traded as is. If the house drops, anything inside is distributed throughout the city at random in barrels, crates and other containers.
5) In-city housing can be designated as "event-available"; if it is used for an EM or other event the owner receives a small rental fee.

If they do that, I'd consider accepting it.

/Signed

 

[A Rev]

Ok now i was sceptical when i opened this post...but you know what??

I LOVE it!

You can have the neccessary shops, bank, tailor, smith, mages, carp, bowcraft etc...or only a bank.

And an actual city of players...both on the trammel side and fel side.

It would be nice to have it as an EM event. You do the event and have to find a "key to the City" type deal (you know like a hero would get given). This allows you to place your spot. I would suggest making all house plots exactly the same size maybe 9x9.

 

[Connor_Graham]

The concepts of Luna in Malas and Makoto in the Tokuno Islands did do just this......The design of Luna and Makato

Luna is a city in Malas. Makoto (actual name Makoto-Jima) is the name of an island. The city on that island (like Malas) is called Zento, not Makoto.

I see this mistake made over and over and over again. Doesn't anyone ever read anymore?

 

[longshanks]

Thanks for the discussion on this. It is interesting that the two cities with the most activity are the ones that have housing basically within city limits.

As such I ask for the mods assistance as to what is the best way to bring forth this type of idea to the dev's? could we sticky a poll on uhall for a specified period of time?

 

[RichDC]

Thanks for the discussion on this. It is interesting that the two cities with the most activity are the ones that have housing basically within city limits.

As such I ask for the mods assistance as to what is the best way to bring forth this type of idea to the dev's? could we sticky a poll on uhall for a specified period of time?

Im not certain but i think the best way would be to send it to the Ask the Devs...although looking through it we havent had an answer for a while now...so much for replacing the weekly FOF.

 

[Schuyler Bain]

I really like this idea and always have. The reply posts make very valid points and I think the concept could work. I would go so far as to say that if you inhabit a house in a town it should be left "as is." Decorate all you want with items, but I think it would be a development nightmare to allow certain customization and not others. If you want to customize your house then stick with the current housing options available. I would also add that perhaps the old system of "refreshing" the building by the occupying account opening the door weekly would be a great way to keep it fair.

 

[RichDC]

I really like this idea and always have. The reply posts make very valid points and I think the concept could work. I would go so far as to say that if you inhabit a house in a town it should be left "as is." Decorate all you want with items, but I think it would be a development nightmare to allow certain customization and not others. If you want to customize your house then stick with the current housing options available. I would also add that perhaps the old system of "refreshing" the building by the occupying account opening the door weekly would be a great way to keep it fair.

Agreed. But how would you handle the IDOC??

Only be allowed to place the same house Type??

Also i think it should be allowed to use different types of the classic housing if im honest. I understand the no-customization thing...but to keep the city exactly the same would be dull and uninteresting. Allowing the placement of the classiv style of houses surely would be best??

That being said, i think the line should be drawn at towers (that is they arent allowed). Just thought i think a neat way to judge house plots would be using the key to the city idea.

If you get one key you get the 7x7 classic option, you can upgrade your plot by finding more keys?

 

[Drakhan]

Some really cool ideas in this thread. Hope the devs read it

 

[Beer_Cayse]

... 2) The plots should be a set size and cannot be changed.

Yup - see below but I would not allow towers, keeps or castles.

3) The style of housing can only be picked from a set of house designs that match the city/area of the city. Exceptions are that you can make internal changes like moving internal walls, teleporters etc. But the outside walls/roof/etc are pre-set 100%

What about the "classic" house styles with customizable interiors ... perhaps just the plot and exterior walls, allowing player to do whatever inside?.

If done correctly, I believe it could help create a living atmosphere within cities and help revitalize them. Because of the *urban sprawl* of modern housing, the cities feel like nothing more than the place to visit a few npc's when needed. They feel so empty. The developers need to find ways to bring people back into the cities like the days when only a few had houses. I think putting player housing or even apartments into cities could start that process.

Absolutely this ...

 

[TandaBSK]

That would be so awesome, towns that are actually lived in by live players!
In the days of no housing to be had, I often thought it would be awesome to be able to place a house that was an apartment building, deeding off portions depending on size to other players to give them ownership (like a vendor) but with more safeguards or it could be game controlled and all rental goes to the game. So that player's scamming or stealing from other players wouldn't be an issue. It might be a nice way to pull some gold out of the economy too, individuals or guilds could rent a city house from the game.

It would be so cool to see live people in Brit or Skara again or any of the other cities besides Luna.

 

[Beer_Cayse]

Actually, when I got started in UO and the opportunity presented itself to share a place with a RL friend who lucked out, it was surrounded by many player houses and we all considered ourselves a "town".

It was on Pac, pre-Tram, N or Minoc. Even though some of the neighbors were reds, we got along well and there was little problem until well ... some disruptive types entered the area and decided to PK/res-kill all the neighbors as often as possible. <shrug>

We stuck it out as long as we could and had 2 guilds whose members would come and assist us in pest control when we asked. She & I learned then we were not good at PvP even paired. But with 4 or 5 others against 8 to 10 attackers, we did reasonably well. Then Tram came along and we joined the carebear caravan to there because our characters were not growing like we wanted due to the perpetual disruptions.

Player run areas can be really nice if controlled in appearance to an extent. LA has a small Tram-based setup of several houses and they are all within the basic theme of Skara Brae, the nearest town.

 

[Schuyler Bain]

Agreed. But how would you handle the IDOC??

Only be allowed to place the same house Type??

Also i think it should be allowed to use different types of the classic housing if im honest. I understand the no-customization thing...but to keep the city exactly the same would be dull and uninteresting. Allowing the placement of the classiv style of houses surely would be best??

That being said, i think the line should be drawn at towers (that is they arent allowed). Just thought i think a neat way to judge house plots would be using the key to the city idea.

If you get one key you get the 7x7 classic option, you can upgrade your plot by finding more keys?

I guess I was thinking along the lines of just taking over ownership of the existing building in the town. That way there would be no IDOC issue.

You bring up a good point though that if they allowed placement of classic style housing it would make it a bit more interesting for sure.

Key to the City is another interesting idea. Perhaps this could become a type of gold sink in that the more you donate to the town the bigger the plot size. This might limit this to vets more than new players, but I am not sure that is all bad. The apartment idea would take care of the new player needs. Along those lines I think the rooms in the inns should be available for rent with a single container for storage. There could be a sign outside of each door (think a flat house sign) that would state if the room was available or not and the cost per week. I think the storage should be no more than a chests worth of items/weight. I also feel that if you own a house (in or out of town) on the shard you should not be able to rent an apartment. I know that will not make some folks happy, but to be fair I think something like this would be required. Of course on the same account, but different shard you could rent one apartment. Just thinking out loud.

 

[Demonous]

With the upcoming Magencia rebuild event I was thinking about what is the purpose of this? Will we rebuild Magencia only to abandon it to the friendly confines of Luna upon conclusion of the event?

Therefore would it be a good idea to allow the player base to build housing on plots within the limits of all the cities. If you run around any town there are many buildings that serve no purpose what so ever. Most cities are nothing more than ghost towns (Nujelm anyone?) Very rarely do you see any players in them.

I really believe for instance that Britain should have a player housing within its confines. I imagine a sort of 5th avenue with player housing and vendors abound.

Maybe this is the way to get the player base out of luna...

Discuss.

that would be a cool idea, give luna a run for its money

 

[Faerunner]

Love it.

I think apartments would be cool, but even being able to 'rent' a room at the Inn would be neat... most people just use the rooms to log out safely, so having a public area in the inn to be able to log out would still be necessary, but I'd love seeing the inn have an actual use where you could rent a room, get owner-only access to the door (I'd say give players a room key, but I remember stories of house key theft..), and have a chest for storage. One chest won't lag anyone nearly as much as the junk around Brit/Haven/Luna banks...

As for in-town housing I'd either limit it to certain wall/roof types so that customizable plots 'fit' the city's look (stone/plaster 'classic' housing tiles would be fine if there were a way to set it up independently of account access to other tilesets - although I can just imagine the code tangles that might cause!), or just give people the option of placing houses that fit the town from a pre-set list. Heck, we could even have contests per shard to spice things up, and use player designed residences to be entered as house templates!

Definitely submit this to the Devs. We could start with Magincia, as they've already suggested player interaction with the rebuild (and I'd like to see a Magincian florist shop, so if they won't give us one I'll move my house and run one myself!).

 

[Aran]

No you won't. You're lazy.