Hiya, looong post...sorry

[Shalimar/Cleo]

Just to let everyone know, NEW is up and running again. We've made our East Brit guildhouse public in order to assist EJ players as much as game mechanics allow, and placed items they are able to use in the entryway of the keep. Friends of the house can open the interior door and take the EJ player into the house proper, and get the player what they need from the various chests set out for them (if the player has died or lost his/her stuff or has changed template, etc).

I'd like to take this opportunity to ask everyone to get involved (we all know the shard is very quiet right now but hopefully that will change when summertime is over) and if you would like to support NEW in our efforts, come and be friended to the guildhouse, then you could drop in when new players are around and perhaps advise them on templates, take a new player out on a hunt etc., or just generally get to know them. New players tend to want to become a part of a guild (or community) that has helped them in some way, and will want to join, hopefully becoming valued members.

The only thing I ask is that you don't kill while they are NEW (everyone has been really agreeable so far). Given a little time to get used to the shard and the players, we can all do our bit in helping them want to stay. Most just need a little time and help and when they get to know the great personalities we have on Siege, they'll want to hang around.

Anyone willing to place one of our 'New to Siege Perilous?' books on their doorstep let me know and I'll make sure you have one. I'm not asking for any donations right now as we don't need much until we start to get busy again (remembers the month Wakayama guild came to Siege and I had 94 new players total that month, including 29 of Wakayama... fabulous time) and my crafter can handle most of the basics. Of course donations will be accepted but please limit them to low-end items. In the past, when we had scroll donations, I would save the 115s and better items such as jewels and armour etc., for when a new player was moving on to a real guild and give them a chest of useful items according to their skill set. Now, as scrolls are used for pets, we don't anticipate getting them, so new players will have to wait until they join a guild or are able to do spawns.

PS. If any Vice have a crafter they would be willing to use as a NEW emissary and be co-owned to the house, please pm me or icq 9-626-593 (Elaine)

Thanks for reading.

Shalimar, GM of NEW

 

[chargar42]

Welcome back!

 

[Shalimar/Cleo]

I like and have backed people trying to run a NEW guild, I have never understood the no killing agreement. I ask why not show them it all, that yes you may get killed on Siege but death on Siege passes. REsuit up and enjoy the game. It's not like there will be loads of people filing into Siege this fall, you will have players who know about UO. Some maybe might give it a go from other shards, but more so you will have returning players who are aware of the basic things. But holding their hands and giving them a false sense of security doesn't seem right. After 30 days how many people stay once they can openly be killed? From NEW , NEW2, NOOB, and back around to NEW spanning many years nothing really ever changes.

Hi Baby Doll
Many, many players have stayed on Siege for years after their NEW (NEW2, NOOB) time is over, and gone on to join/form thief guilds, pvp guilds, pvm guilds, crafter guilds...all types of guilds. For a long time at least 50% of the people playing here had been in NEW when they started. Whenever there's an exodus from this shard it's not only those who were in NEW that leave, entire guilds leave.

We only ask for a month's reprieve from killing them while they get skills up somewhat. We don't expect 100% of the players to get on the bandwagon, but new players appreciate a little time to get skills up so they at least have a chance to fight back. They're not under any false sense of security at all. We do make sure they know they're simply getting a break from most players who would otherwise attack them while they gain some skills.

I'm not convinced that we'll get a lot of EJ players, especially if things stay as they are with regard to storage. I think most players who will have an EJ character will also have an alt they sub for to transfer/store stuff. I also think we will still get those players who haven't really tried to play here, mainly from Tram, and given some time to adjust here does help them. They know any reprieve is temporary.

 

[Ol'Rac Nnod]

We quickly forget how frustrating it is those first few weeks when training skills from nothing. The character is very fragile, and doesn't have the gold to just buy another suit or items that assist in there training. A few weeks with the NEW tag is beneficial. This allows returning or fresh new players to get there bearing and learn the ins and outs of the game mechanics. By 30 days you at least have the skills to half way defend yourself, or escape conflict nearly together if you choose. The longer our char get away from being fresh spawn, so to do we forget what it was like to train from nothing and have little to no resources to fall back on. I only rejoined uo 2 years ago, it's easy to remember in that first couple weeks when my char was fumbling to survive even just walking on the roads, how much it would suck to get dry looted. Couple o' times I just thought of finding something else to do with my free time... but then I met Freja, since new wasn't operational in that time... and with just Aliitle help and a push I could blossom and complete training relatively safely. Any way, my point is the more years go by, we only remember the fun of the game and quickly forget how tedious it can feel to be new spawn. ... 30 days is a small request to let people get a little established before going at them hardcore.

 

[Ol'Rac Nnod]

And by the way, NEW does impress upon young players to take a respectful death, meaning to be polite and respectful and sometimes you'll gain respect of the pvper, they may very well rez you and may even not dry loot you. .. This I think is a valuable lesson they teach the young players.

 

[Bo Bo]

Hello, don't get me wrong I like the newbie guild idea I think it helps alot and I back them. My only question/issue was the no kill rule to a newbie guild. I think there is value to learning you can die and get dry looted and yet you can continue to play. I have seen people in past say they would pass on hunt invitation saying I only got one suit and don't wanna lose it. My newbie ass many years ago learned from many reds and blues alike. Reds like Max, Bo, Sprago , Crunch. Igg .(and the list goes on on) who are respectful killers on Siege, a killing from a decent red might get ya hints of what to do next time. I just think there nothing that gets yer heart a popping quicker then reacting to a red. Part of the fun.

Don't assume reds don't kill them. Bo will usually kill them, res them and help them out anyway possible. like you said to give them feel of what they are in for.

 

[Blind Otto]

Over the years, I've lost count of the people who have reacted in absolute shock and horror at being PK'd in their first few days as a Siege newbie.
Those people, lacking any sort of understanding of what they have walked into, lacking any insight into the PK mindset, tend to quit on the spot.
You may well say "Well, who needs them?". The answer is, we do. We need our population to grow.
The other side of the coin is those who have been "gently" introduced to the business end of a PK's sword. They tend to stick around. Some of them become PKs themselves.
Please understand - the group of people who react to a PK by going "I'm going to train up and get revenge" can be counted on one hand. I wish there were more like that, but there aren't. So, NEW's "please be gentle" approach does help Siege. It's one month. Seriously. Siege PKs have managed not to have a nervous breakdown over one lousy month of being nice to NEWs for years - there's no good reason why that should change. Time has proven that it works.

To close, let me repeat my own first day on Siege:
I arrived, wandered around a bit, and headed out of town, without a clue as to what Siege was all about, and ran headlong into WyRm [VmP].
I was accused of being "INSOLENT!", tribute was demanded, and when I said I had no idea what he wanted, I died rapidly.
He looked at my corpse, sneered at my starter gear (all cloth), rez'd me, told me I was even more insolent, gave me some idea what VmP expected by way of tribute, and directed me to NEW.

So, by that point, I wasn't in NEW, but WyRm recognised a beginner when he saw one. Should NEW be untouchable? No. The point is, how you treat them. If you have no way to rez a NEW, unless you can see they're wandering around the countryside in 100% legendary gear and obviously have a good supplier, then what do you gain from killing them? If you can't rez them, unless there's a wandering healer RIGHT THERE, they're going to get a bad experience out of it.

We want to grow. All of us want Siege to grow - if anyone reading this is the exception, please let us know so we can declare you KOS.

And that's the end of today's random thoughts. Thanks for reading.

 

[SpyderBite]

WyRm was also my introduction to Siege. I was fascinated by the "ritual" he performed after killing me. So much so that I forgot to show for the rez he was offering.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

 

[Blind Otto]

There's some considerable irony in a blind man declaring anyone KOS...

 

[Max Blackoak]

is excessive PKing of NEW really an issue at the moment?

 

[Victim of Siege]

I PK'd all their cookies . . .

 

[Drakelord]

I would suggest that we kill them (NEW) and res them like Bo says. That way you get a feel for the shard, its people, the bad one (jerks) that trash talk you and loot you and walk away or res-kill you as you run back because they not done yet or those good guys that res you heal you and help you. People make this shard, the good and the bad. Let them get to know them all.

 

[Old Timer]

As a player that remembers NEW from ancient times... early 2000s... I left the game sometime in 2004... did not return until November of last year... so roughly 13 - 14 years have passed. NEW was needed then, as it is now, and I'm glad it has found it's rebirth. The question of PKing the new ones is tough... cuz I don't think there's a correct answer. Things have changed much in the world of the real, and in this game world. Those changes will shade an individuals reactions, responses, and temperment about gameplay. Getting 'whacked' is part of life on Siege. Sometimes you meet an aggressor who's feeling benevolent today, so you're spared. Tomorrow you may meet that same person.. and take a lil respite in the dirt while they peruse your bag. The thing is how people are treated in the process. Names beget reps... reps beget notariety... both positive and negative. People recognize names and develop their own tactics... run, hide, fight, etc.. for those encounters. In the months I've been back, I have certainly developed them. And they're based primarily on my encounters and interactions... not so much on what I hear or have been told. I knew what to expect... somewhat - on my return. But, in general terms... I was a bit of a newborn as well because so much has changed. There was much I needed to relearn. Part of that was getting whacked... and helped soon after coming back. It put me on a path towards regaining my Siege Legs.

So I can't say that allowing Newbies to be PK'd... or not, is correct. I will say many of the best lessons learned are the ones learned the 'hard way', because those stick.

And my personal opinion about 'red' or 'blue' colors... I don't see the color... I see the person behind that color. Who has earned and gets respect, and who doesn't... and trust me when I say they've earned that status with their actions, not due to the color... nor Guild Marker they wear.

And Otto... it still could be KOS for you... blind folks are known to develop higher senses like hearing, or smell... so for your case it could be 'Kill on Smell'....

 

[Blargety]

Been in NEW since the beginning of the month. Have had one attempt at my life that I managed to dodge because I’m a ninja, and one outright PK from someone incog.

Here’s my perspective.

If you want Siege to survive, you’ll understand that players coming to the server are under the impression that they’re joining the “hardcore shard” to test it out. They get one character, 1k gold, and the clothes on their back if they don’t find Shalimar or someone who can direct them to the NEW keep for assistance.

If they die, either at your hands, or the hands of monsters they weren’t aware were actually strong because they’re used to having tricked out 70’s suits and gnarly weapons with perma-practically free insurance, they’re likely to chalk it up as an L and return to Atlantic. Adversity isn’t something the average UO player is used to anymore.

“Good riddance, we didn’t need the likes of them trammies anyways!” You might say. You’re wrong. Dead wrong. Easing and assisting those players into the mindset of Siege, and helping them understand that adversity is a feature that is fun, instead of a bug that gets in the way of progress will remind them of why they started playing this game 21 years ago. Keeping them here allows everyone to progress by increasing player activity, and there’s a reason everyone’s favorite memories of UO involve being killed by some dastardly red.

You could wander around randomly PKing new players for the lulz, treating them like another piece of content, or you could be merciful for thirty days and let them discover that adversity in fact breeds fun. Your kills might not come as easy from those players after thirty days, but it’ll guarantee that they stick around long enough for you to actually fight with those players more than a singular time before you’ve chased them back to sitting outside of the Luna bank in their twinked out and insured equipment.

UO is already a small game. Siege is a small percentage of that small game. Your flexing won’t look nearly as cool when you’re stuck doing it in a mirror by yourself.

That’s my 2 sovereigns. Take it or leave it.

 

[Victim of Siege]

The request for lenience has been in place a long time and this debate has been going on for just as long (well maybe one second less) and it has always fleshed out the same and it is my stance on it. some people will agree with and follow it, some won't. My personal feelings are this, we are all individuals with distinct personalities and are going to do things our way, it is why we are on Siege in the first place after all, I didn't get the "oh your'e new?, we'll let you live for now" experience, I got the *withdraw's their sword from your pancreas* "welcome to Siege N00b" experience. Granted it was back early in the days of Siege but I didn't let a little blood and bile on my robe deter me, you can say give them that 30 days all you want but fighting and scratching for everything i have by starting from scratch multiple times is what made me eventually make this shard my main home. I have a fondness for everyone on this shard that includes the ones that are reviled, because they make up this community just as much as everyone else. if new players cannot accept that they are going to die and will have to start from scratch multiple times, then they will never build those feelings of nostalgia we have or maybe build that lifelong friendship with the one that picked up their kidney and handed it to them along with some advice or gear. The best scenario here is that NEW asks for a 30 reprieve, but accepts that some will not honor it. just my .02, Rock on Siege.

 

[kelmo]

 

[Shalimar/Cleo]

The best scenario here is that NEW asks for a 30 reprieve, but accepts that some will not honor it. just my .02, Rock on Siege.

Absolutely correct Victim.

 

[Blind Otto]

And Otto... it still could be KOS for you... blind folks are known to develop higher senses like hearing, or smell... so for your case it could be 'Kill on Smell'....

*wanders around sniffing people with a sharpened white cane at the ready*

 

[Blind Otto]

*gets arrested for sniffing with vicious intent*

 

[Bithmus]

I'm not convinced that we'll get a lot of EJ players, especially if things stay as they are with regard to storage. I think most players who will have an EJ character will also have an alt they sub for to transfer/store stuff. I also think we will still get those players who haven't really tried to play here, mainly from Tram, and given some time to adjust here does help them. They know any reprieve is temporary.

I think you might be surprised how many EJ players may stick around Siege. I found that when I went to my characters on standard shards my bank account was overloaded and as such I couldn't take items out to use the bank. As far as I'm concerned, this makes those characters unplayable. I'm not going to create an alt account just to bank with.

When I logged into my Siege character my bank was over the limit but I found that I could take items out to get under the limit. I also found that I have 75 storage spots, NOT 20, probably because of the one character rule. This makes a huge difference for the playability of my character and made me stay on Siege as opposed to Lake Superior.

 

[Shalimar/Cleo]

I think you might be surprised how many EJ players may stick around Siege.

I'd be pleasantly surprised, especially if they don't also have a subbed account.
Welcome back.