Creating A Jail. Player justice.

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

You pancake and complain about the game being fair, and player killers being penalized. Why? Do you actually press that little button marked Felucca?

I'm guessing here, but I'd have to say the times you have visited, you have been killed, and didn't like it, thus, since you were unable to go back and kill those players on your terms, you want the game to step in and help you.

It's becoming much clearer now...la

[/ QUOTE ]


You should try and understand what he is saying vs. thinking your right and can read minds.

Your making me laugh. Thanks.

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

Personally I think getting a group of friends together and fighting back is a good enough justice system.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed...la

[/ QUOTE ]

Sure thats fine for a group. Doesnt address the fact players can come rez in 5 seconds and be back doing the same thing.

Getting back as a group is satisfying in its own.

This post is about a game system.

[/ QUOTE ]

So they rez back to life. Rez kill them, a pretty simple solution...if you played Siege, you'd actually have a chance to loot them. and if they do care about saving a little cash, they won't keep rezzing knowing they will die again and again...la

[/ QUOTE ]

Great solution. In depth and thoughtful. Ill try it.

 

[Guest]

There is no need for rocket science to play this game. The sooner you figure this out, the faster you can have more fun...la

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

There is no need for rocket science to play this game. The sooner you figure this out, the faster you can have more fun...la

[/ QUOTE ]

I have loads of fun.

And thats where we differ. A little rocket science could really improve the game.

To each his own.

 

[Nixon[I-C]]

I still fail to see how this benifits PvP in anyway shape or form. Factions is dead for a reason, and part of that reason is the statloss.

 

[imported_Tina Small]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

Minus Hacks.
Minus Insurance.
Minus all the other PvP stuff.


In the name of Law and Order. Why cant one option be when a red (or aggressor) is killed to claim "Ressurect in Jail" as a menu option for the victorious non-aggressor.

My problem with PvP is Im not really interested in beating you for the sake of.
I want your loot. There is no more loot in PvP.

Then my problem is both of us can Rez and be back in the game in 5 seconds. Why even have death?

There is no player justice system. I think you could incorporate a jail system. If a player chooses to go red, or is killed when gray. A blue player (if victorious) can select "ressurect in jail".

If and agressor blue is killed. Same thing.


How it would work is.
Reds.
Grays.
Aggressor Blues.

Could be tagged by the victorious BLUE (blue only) player to have the ghost sent to jail.

Thats the gist.

It would be a point accumulation that would send you to jail or something like that.

Jail could be 10 minutes, 1 hour, 1 day. Whatever. I find if i give detail like that people get stuck on the numbers.

Basically, this system would allow players to police aggression. It cant be abused. There is now a penalty for being an aggressor.


You could even create a noteriety system for players that jail players.

[/ QUOTE ]

Raven, be honest here now. If something like this was introduced, would YOU actually spend significantly more time in Fel than you do now? If yes, what would you do during the time you spend there?

[/ QUOTE ]

For me it would be interesting to challenge a spawn of power scrolls. Without justice/consequence. Everyones up a going way to fast.

Seeing the same people up and insta corpse their body and back in the fight in what 30 seconds is silly.

Thats all I am saying.

Books of truth, I dealt with reds. I got all I needed. I dont care about dieing. Because...
Insure everything.
Sell stuff in Trammel to supply my insurance costs.
Bag of send my rewards or insure.
Rez, insta corpse
Recall
Recall
and back at it.

In 2 minutes.

Now would I go to Fel more? Well in my OP, I dont really see the benefit of killing and getting nothing. So yes and no. Would I go just go? No

But it might be fun to hook up with blue players and hunt reds to jail them. That, I would do.

[/ QUOTE ]

Raven, another question for you. If a system like this were to be introduced, do you think there should be an opportunity for murderers to have all their counts erased beforehand? I believe something like that was done when factions was introduced, but I didn't play then and I've only heard bits and pieces about the "faction reprieve" from other players.

If you agree there should be an opportunity for murderers to lose their counts first, do you think that after the system is introduced there would be enough murderers running around to make it worthwhile for more players to go to Fel to do what you suggested (i.e., cause PKers to end up in jail)? If everyone has the opportunity to clear their slate and then has an incentive to keep it clean, what is the end result? A Fel with little or no real risk associated with it? If that's the end result, then what has really been achieved? How many people who love the thrill of playing in a risky environment are going to stick around? Would there still be justification for the Fel-only "rewards" currently available, or would they need to be tweaked?

 

[Guest]

Well what I think. Is everyone should be turned blue. Why? If you going play a red charcture, youll be red in a day anyway. So blue.

I really think a system needs to be created that addresses this.

When killed, we are back in the game within what 30 seconds. There is no consequence for death any more.

But for this thread I am addressing a jailing system as a consequence.

whatever the system (inlcuding well move to seige) it has to inhibit play.

10 minutes in jail
Stat loss
Colored Yellow and cant attack
Expulsion from dungeon
An increase in insurance. (which i think is a brilliant suggestion)

Whatever.

As of now. I insure myself. I walk to Fel. Do what I have to do. If I die, all my stuff is on me. What do I lose?

As of now. I fight in Fel. Kill a red player or aggressors. They are back fighting in 30 seconds. They kill me. I am back in 30 seconds.

To be honest the last time I fought in fel truely was books of truth. After learning some things here. I could run around and most things were draws. It was very boring. If they died which was rare. They were right back. If I died. I collected myself and would wait, and theyd move to next recall spot and Id go back to getting books.


In fact why even have red players now adays. The only thing they lose is access to the other realms. To me thats silly.


If everyone stayed blue or turned red but could go where ever (but stayed red to show they were killers) and we could punish attackers when killed with "JAIL" or something like that. Then battles would have more of a point.


10 players square off with 10 players. As you die. You out at least 10 minutes or whatever.

You tell me what are champ spawn like now? Imagine if you actually killed someone they where out of there.

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

I still fail to see how this benifits PvP in anyway shape or form. Factions is dead for a reason, and part of that reason is the statloss.

[/ QUOTE ]


Actually, if i get what you saying is the punishment for death in factions takes you out of the battle.

Thats what I am saying should happen in PvP. Your out of the battle. Or more out of the way.

Not back in in 10 seconds.

I think factions is dead because they made 4 factions groups. We used to have chaos vs order. Factions is to diluted. Create 2 sides. 2 towns. And actually fix up the system.

But thats another opinion.

 

[imported_Tina Small]

Raven, if you implement something like this you have just eliminated a lot of the risk associated with Fel. Do you think that as a result the Fel-only "rewards" need to be adjusted? Do you think Fel would lose even more players? If yes, what would this change really achieve? Why even have Fel?

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

Minus Hacks.
Minus Insurance.
Minus all the other PvP stuff.


In the name of Law and Order. Why cant one option be when a red (or aggressor) is killed to claim "Ressurect in Jail" as a menu option for the victorious non-aggressor.

My problem with PvP is Im not really interested in beating you for the sake of.
I want your loot. There is no more loot in PvP.

Then my problem is both of us can Rez and be back in the game in 5 seconds. Why even have death?

There is no player justice system. I think you could incorporate a jail system. If a player chooses to go red, or is killed when gray. A blue player (if victorious) can select "ressurect in jail".

If and agressor blue is killed. Same thing.


How it would work is.
Reds.
Grays.
Aggressor Blues.

Could be tagged by the victorious BLUE (blue only) player to have the ghost sent to jail.

Thats the gist.

It would be a point accumulation that would send you to jail or something like that.

Jail could be 10 minutes, 1 hour, 1 day. Whatever. I find if i give detail like that people get stuck on the numbers.

Basically, this system would allow players to police aggression. It cant be abused. There is now a penalty for being an aggressor.


You could even create a noteriety system for players that jail players.

[/ QUOTE ]

Raven, be honest here now. If something like this was introduced, would YOU actually spend significantly more time in Fel than you do now? If yes, what would you do during the time you spend there?

[/ QUOTE ]

For me it would be interesting to challenge a spawn of power scrolls. Without justice/consequence. Everyones up a going way to fast.

Seeing the same people up and insta corpse their body and back in the fight in what 30 seconds is silly.

Thats all I am saying.

Books of truth, I dealt with reds. I got all I needed. I dont care about dieing. Because...
Insure everything.
Sell stuff in Trammel to supply my insurance costs.
Bag of send my rewards or insure.
Rez, insta corpse
Recall
Recall
and back at it.

In 2 minutes.

Now would I go to Fel more? Well in my OP, I dont really see the benefit of killing and getting nothing. So yes and no. Would I go just go? No

But it might be fun to hook up with blue players and hunt reds to jail them. That, I would do.

[/ QUOTE ]

Raven, another question for you. If a system like this were to be introduced, do you think there should be an opportunity for murderers to have all their counts erased beforehand? I believe something like that was done when factions was introduced, but I didn't play then and I've only heard bits and pieces about the "faction reprieve" from other players.

If you agree there should be an opportunity for murderers to lose their counts first, do you think that after the system is introduced there would be enough murderers running around to make it worthwhile for more players to go to Fel to do what you suggested (i.e., cause PKers to end up in jail)? If everyone has the opportunity to clear their slate and then has an incentive to keep it clean, what is the end result? A Fel with little or no real risk associated with it? If that's the end result, then what has really been achieved? How many people who love the thrill of playing in a risky environment are going to stick around? Would there still be justification for the Fel-only "rewards" currently available, or would they need to be tweaked?

[/ QUOTE ]

There will always be enough murderers in Fel. And this system is for aggressors not just reds.

What is your risk and thrill? What do you lose? What is your reward?

There should be a ton of fel only rewards. Things that can and cant be removed from the land. Titles for blues.

One of the greatest rewards could be spawns. Be it champ or whatever.


You with 13 guildmates that are very skilled are doing a champ spawn.

Cheezy guild of 25 storms in. Do you really have a chance? Whats it matter.

Cause as fast as you kill them. They a rezzed and back in. You and your guild hold their own till great lag comes and your dead. Since they have the upperhand the keep rez killing in the area. They win, not because they are good but because of numbers and "insta being back in battle."

Now with 10 minute jailing. As you pick them off with some elite moves. Your guild throttles them to nothing. They can only trickle in now. You finish the spawn and move on.

 

[Guest]

Anyway,

I think you all can see Im right (hehe). Or not. Keep in mind consequences are part of the game.

Someone tell me the consequence of death in UO. Beside 5k in insurance for insuring everything.

 

[imported_Tina Small]

You need to try factions now Raven before any further changes are made. It would give you much to think about.

 

[Nixon[I-C]]

<blockquote><hr>

Actually, if i get what you saying is the punishment for death in factions takes you out of the battle.

Thats what I am saying should happen in PvP. Your out of the battle. Or more out of the way.

Not back in in 10 seconds.

I think factions is dead because they made 4 factions groups. We used to have chaos vs order. Factions is to diluted. Create 2 sides. 2 towns. And actually fix up the system.

But thats another opinion.

[/ QUOTE ]

Factions being dead had nothing to do with O/C. They functioned beside each other for a long time and there was no problems.

Factions wasn't hit by an inactivity problem until p16, and eventually AoS. Publish 16 saw the removal of the statloss system in dungeons, which meant we saw an explosion of reds. Once again UO had dungeon PvP like in years gone by, so it was only natural people would progress and give it a try. Factions suffered a final blow when statloss was removed completely, there was no longer a reason to really play factions.

I mean why would anyone seriously want to play a system that was 1) bugged 2) wasn't recieving updates 3) had statloss. When instead they could play a red, enjoy EVERY single PvP change (which is laughable when you consider how many there actually is), fight who they want, when they want?

Yes, there would now be an arguement to make factions smaller because we have a smaller playerbase. Yes it badly needs a face lift. Yes statloss is one of the main issues that stop people playing.

 

[Der Rock]

----------------------------------------------------------------
There should be a ton of fel only rewards. Things that can and cant be removed from the land. Titles for blues.
One of the greatest rewards could be spawns. Be it champ or whatever.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------


LOL, that IS,WAS and ever will BE the one and only appreciation of PvP in UO

the butcher´s are begging for fresh meat.


in UO was NEVER a real PvP playingfield, and i doubt, most of so called uo-pvp player even know what pvp is.

 

[Nixon[I-C]]

<blockquote><hr>

I believe something like that was done when factions was introduced, but I didn't play then and I've only heard bits and pieces about the "faction reprieve" from other players.

[/ QUOTE ]

We used to have a 3rd form of count called Ping Pongs. When you reached 4, you were effectively permenant red and couldn't use this reprieve. Occasionally red's would join a faction, usually Shadowlords - because of its location, for the so called faction reprieve. If they were passed the ping pong limit, they weren't subject to the reprieve.

There was also a count wipe in Publish 16 or so, because there was a bug regarding harrowers I think it was, that turned people red, at the time it was pretty much a server event when there a harrower, so literally 100's of people went red completely unintentionally, which left them with no choice but to give everyone a reprieve.

If my memory is correct, it was quite a few years ago

 

[Karthcove]

In the end it all does, or at least should, come down to the fact that evil without consequence goes totally against the virtue system Ultima Online and series was based upon. Going back to a system, whatever that might be, of consequence would bring UO back to its roots and successes of earlier times.

I hope with all my heart we don't continue down that path of what is a "console game" mentality.

 

[Guest]

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<blockquote><hr>

Though Id be for sending any reds killed on my shard to siege.

[/ QUOTE ]


LOL!

Banish them to the abyss so to say? hehe

[/ QUOTE ]

Siege is nothing compared to what Abyss was...

 

[Guest]

I tried faction in the beginning. My opinion. 4 is to many. Not enough players to man 4. Once they got rid of the sigil dye trick. People stop playing.

I remember not being able to find theives.
I remember walking in to opposing factions and no one was there.

Good ideas. Just to big.

 

[imported_ParadoxUO]

PvP switch...

Powerscrolls on Trammel...
Stat Scrolls on Trammel...

lets destroy the last valuable items!!!

soon... 1 million = 1$... and falling.

 

[Nixon[I-C]]

<blockquote><hr>

I tried faction in the beginning. My opinion. 4 is to many. Not enough players to man 4. Once they got rid of the sigil dye trick. People stop playing.

I remember not being able to find theives.
I remember walking in to opposing factions and no one was there.

Good ideas. Just to big.

[/ QUOTE ]

Which shard, because I can tell you, on the European and Japanese shards, there wasn't really an issue with it being too big.

 

[Karthcove]

<blockquote><hr>

PvP switch...

Powerscrolls on Trammel...
Stat Scrolls on Trammel...

lets destroy the last valuable items!!!

soon... 1 million = 1$... and falling.

[/ QUOTE ]

1 million GP should equal $0 and not sold at all for real life - outside of the game stuff, but thats a topic for another thread

 

[imported_Tina Small]

Raven, there are currently consequences for having a red character. Perhaps they need some tweaking. However, I think we're way past the point in the game's evolution to have it make sense to introduce "jail." At least with something like a skill or stat loss period, someone has the ability to keep playing and do something during that time. Yes, even kill more characters. (Have seen it done many times by faction characters that are in skill loss, and no I'm not necessarily advocating skill/stat loss as a consequence for committing murder.) What would they do that's actually fun or satisfying while they are in jail?

You mentioned in one of your posts that someone could work their trade skills while they are in jail. I'm afraid you just completely lost me with that comment. We're talking about PKers, Raven, not merchants or crafters. What the heck could they do in terms of advancing their fighting skills while they are in jail? Go to the weight room????

If you introduce a system that virtually eliminates PKing because no one wants to go sit in a time-out with absolutely nothing to do if they PK another character, then I think you have to ask why even have the ability to PK another character? If the answer to that question is that you've finally hit on something that completely discourages PKing (and leads to a dramatic drop in PvP), then why have special rules/rewards for Fel?

In my opinion, Raven, introducing a system that leads to sheer crushing boredom, even if for only ten minutes, for PKing someone (deliberately or not) will only lead to more people who enjoy playing in a risky environment leaving UO for another game. And keep in mind that I'm not much of a PvPer and I don't have any red characters. I just happen to play in Fel a bit and have found I kind of enjoy the thrill of knowing someone could PK my character at any moment. Take that away and all I see is that Fel has become Trammelized and champ spawns become ho-hum and routine and the game loses a lot of the players it still has.

 

[imported_Tina Small]

<blockquote><hr>

Once they got rid of the sigil dye trick. People stop playing.

[/ QUOTE ]

You just completely ruined my day, Raven. Are you saying that people were joining factions just to be able to dye stuff sigil purple? Geeze.....

Maybe it really is time to consider quitting UO if it's true there are that many people playing just for that sort of stuff. I guess I'll make up my mind for good when factions opens up and we see just how many people join up just for the "rewards."

 

[Masumatek]

No thanks. Despite what a lot of you think, there's plenty of penalties for being red. We don't need anymore, especially not some jail system.

Btw, and someone may already have said this...I haven't read the whole thread...but you're idea of "player justice" is wrong...or at least I think it is. There seems to be different definitions of player justice floating around. You think player justice is about reds and greys. What I've always thought player justice to be didn't have anything to do with reds and greys, but instead cheaters/exploiters, scammers, griefers, etc....be they grey, red, blue or any other color. So if I'm correct and the "targets" of player justice is what I listed, not your listing of reds and greys, then what you should be asking for is removal of things like trammel, and only allowing one character per account, since trammel and multiple characters per account hurt the ability of players to enact player justice on the true criminals (not the PKs...but the griefers, scammers, cheaters....).

 

[imported_Splup]

Problem is that most of reds are not on factions. So being in faction doesnt make any difference considering champ fights etc.

 

[imported_Tina Small]

I guess one advantage factions has is that it is expected that you try to kill the enemy and are actually rewarded for doing so with kill points. It's too bad there isn't enough to the faction system to satisfy more people who enjoy PvP.

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

Once they got rid of the sigil dye trick. People stop playing.

[/ QUOTE ]

You just completely ruined my day, Raven. Are you saying that people were joining factions just to be able to dye stuff sigil purple? Geeze.....

Maybe it really is time to consider quitting UO if it's true there are that many people playing just for that sort of stuff. I guess I'll make up my mind for good when factions opens up and we see just how many people join up just for the "rewards."

[/ QUOTE ]

Its hard to catch sarcasm in this form of communication.

Trade skills in jail is sarcasm. Its was a jump to rehab in jail. Not funny I guess.

Purple Dye Sigil, was a big interest to players. Not the reason but players loved getting the sigl more during that time to dye fishing poles then to hold them.

Factions in my opinion was just to grand with 4 sides and a small player base.


I have to say your they most thoughtful responder.

I agree with some of your stuff. However, a 10 minute penalty wont stop pkers or reds.

Id even be for leaving Fel as is.

I think the cool thing about ultima is you can have 10 different facets with all their own rule sets. Its like going to different countries. Thats the fun of the game.

When the Devs finally listen to me and create an new realm with 100s of randoms rewards, a stealing system, random monster events, 1 shot dungeons, and much more... without insurance, and consequence for death, and "jailing for aggressors"....

You all will thank me. (sarcasm) Till then. I am going to go join Seige. Ive been chronologically worn out.

But first one more patient to help....
Addiction and child abuse... RL , I thank UO for the escape. And all posters opinions.

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

I guess one advantage factions has is that it is expected that you try to kill the enemy and are actually rewarded for doing so with kill points. It's too bad there isn't enough to the faction system to satisfy more people who enjoy PvP.

[/ QUOTE ]

Kill points.

Suppose. Just suppose. I got Law points for jailing a red. And I can only jail a player 3x daily.

Suppose. Just suppose. I got Lawless points for killing. And I could only get them from the killing the same player 1x daily.

Suppose we dont worry about cheats.

These points could be used to buy stuff.

Now suppose if you the system recognized accounts and players. So if you killed the same players and accounts, youd lose you points. So you can really cheat that way.

Would that be an incentive.

Points spent on stuff.

 

[imported_ParadoxUO]

The problem isnt the pvp...

Most of the felluca controlling guilds do it to sell powerscrolls/statscrolls...

and they cheat to protect their extra income.

that simple.

 

[Guest]

Tina

If you took the vision of factions, the simplicity of chaos vs order, penalties for aggressing, but both sides got reward points...

I bet we could design a better system keeping the kill points (law and lawless points) as the reward.

 

[imported_Tina Small]

<blockquote><hr>

However, a 10 minute penalty wont stop pkers or reds.

[/ QUOTE ]

I guess I don't understand the rationale for wanting to stop PKing and not having red characters. How many people would you lose from the game if you eliminate these things? I'm afraid it would be quite a few, Raven, and I just don't think UO would survive as a PvM only game or with limited PvP in a system like factions. Some people truly enjoy playing with "outlaw" characters now and I suspect there are a fair number of people (myself included) who have a secret goal to someday have their own outlaw character just to see if they can do it.

 

[imported_Tina Small]

<blockquote><hr>

Would that be an incentive.

Points spent on stuff.

[/ QUOTE ]

For me, no. I'm sick of all the emphasis on "stuff" in UO.

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

<blockquote><hr>

However, a 10 minute penalty wont stop pkers or reds.

[/ QUOTE ]

I guess I don't understand the rationale for wanting to stop PKing and not having red characters. How many people would you lose from the game if you eliminate these things? I'm afraid it would be quite a few, Raven, and I just don't think UO would survive as a PvM only game or with limited PvP in a system like factions. Some people truly enjoy playing with "outlaw" characters now and I suspect there are a fair number of people (myself included) who have a secret goal to someday have their own outlaw character just to see if they can do it.

[/ QUOTE ]

See I cant get to your rationale of my idea of "jailing" to it being me wanting to stop pking. I dont care if you pk (not you but you know). My idea wouldnt stop pking. It doesnt eliminate red players. People arent going to quit for 10 minute break or similiar.

An "outlaw" characture that cant be punished, isnt at outlaw. Its a player that kills other players, dies, rezzes and kills. You cant be outlawed cause there is no law.

Now lets say you have "Lucy Lawless". She gets an Outlaw ranking of +1 for each kill. Yeah she can cheat and kill her other account players. But you dont.

When shes jailed she loses the kill ranking. But your good. And you can be proud of you 67 Outlaw ranking.

Law could be your friend.

 

[imported_Tina Small]

<blockquote><hr>

See I cant get to your rationale of my idea of "jailing" to it being me wanting to stop pking. I dont care if you pk (not you but you know). My idea wouldnt stop pking. It doesnt eliminate red players. People arent going to quit for 10 minute break or similiar.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ummm....yeah...I think a fair number of people would quit playing if the consequence for their character killing another character (outside of the guild or faction systems) is 10 minutes of landing in a jail cell with absolutely nothing to do.

<blockquote><hr>

An "outlaw" characture that cant be punished, isnt at outlaw. Its a player that kills other players, dies, rezzes and kills. You cant be outlawed cause there is no law.

[/ QUOTE ]

But there currently ARE consequences for killing other characters, if the victim chooses to impose them. Red characters certainly don't have all the same freedoms/abilities as blue characters.

<blockquote><hr>

Now lets say you have "Lucy Lawless". She gets an Outlaw ranking of +1 for each kill. Yeah she can cheat and kill her other account players. But you dont.

When shes jailed she loses the kill ranking. But your good. And you can be proud of you 67 Outlaw ranking.

[/ QUOTE ]

You lost me here, Raven. Lucy kills other characters and gets a kill point for each kill. What lands her in jail and makes her lose all those points?? Why didn't she land in jail after every kill?

 

[Guest]

You would land in jail because you were killed. A lawful blue you attacked killed you and chose to take you jail.

Your reign of lawlessness is over. So you start over.


There really is no lawlessness in Fel. Cause there is no law. No rules are bing broken.

You need lawful consequences to be considered an outlaw is all I am a saying.

 

[Guest]

Your not thinking you go to jail everytime you kill a player are you?

The only time youd get a consequence is if you were wooped by a blue player.

If you dont die. You never go to jail.

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

We already have a jail like that.

Page a GM and tell him to blow it out his ass and you'll get to stay for a while.

[/ QUOTE ]ROFLMAO!!!!!!

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

My problem with PvP is Im not really interested in beating you for the sake of.
I want your loot. There is no more loot in PvP.

Then my problem is both of us can Rez and be back in the game in 5 seconds. Why even have death?



[/ QUOTE ]Well, in the earlier days of the game there was no loot to be had except maybe some regs or aids, but IMO PVP was incredibly fun then because it was all about skill.

 

[imported_Tina Small]

<blockquote><hr>

You would land in jail because you were killed. A lawful blue you attacked killed you and chose to take you jail.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're saying that you, with your blue character, can just decide to kill another character because it happens to be red? The red character may not have done a darn thing to your character, but you can just decide to attack and if you happen to prevail and you choose to make them resurrect in jail, then they have to spend the next 10 minutes cooling their heels in a time out????

 

[Guest]

Well, did you become red by being friendly to players?


Im saying a consequence like jail. Conceptual discussion. Not implementation today.

I really dont care if its for hunting reds just because their red. Or tag to aggressive charactures.

That is charactures that attack first.

But in all honesyt Tina. Your red. Come on.

Im not sure what you really all talking about.

If your a killer player. Or an aggressive attacker. Or gray. You fight. If you win. You are free to keep killing and looting.

BUT if you are killed. You go to "jail". Im not sure how else to say it.

Are you saying now a Red that is minding his own business should be left alone?

Ah it doesnt matter. Im just talking about ideas not implementing something.

 

[imported_Tina Small]

<blockquote><hr>

Are you saying now a Red that is minding his own business should be left alone?

[/ QUOTE ]

Considering that some characters are red because they were used to do things that many might consider "honorable," such as defending a champion spawn or killing faction "spies," yes that is what I'm saying.

If you want to implement a system that encourages and rewards attacking characters simply because they are red, how is that any different than being in factions? All that's different is the color! Also, wouldn't you have to offer a reprieve first before implementing such a system?

 

[imported_Tina Small]

Another question for you, Raven.

What would happen to the justice virtue in your scheme of things? Would you just get rid of it?

 

[Guest]

<blockquote><hr>

We already have a jail like that.

Page a GM and tell him to blow it out his ass and you'll get to stay for a while.

[/ QUOTE ]

Been there, done that. Was fun.

 

[imported_Tina Small]

<blockquote><hr>

Ah it doesnt matter. Im just talking about ideas not implementing something.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think it's worth discussing just to get some ideas out there, Raven. Heck, the boards are slow anyway, so why not? Also, I know that there's at least one free shard that has a penal system; however, if memory serves, it seemed like the offender and not the victim got to choose his punishment.

 

[Guest]

How about, when you kill a blue, you get everything in their bank?? Sounds even, jail me if you can kill me, but i get your coin...

 

[Guest]

"in UO was NEVER a real PvP playingfield, and i doubt, most of so called uo-pvp player even know what pvp is."

You obviously have NO idea WHATSOEVER what actual PvP is. You're probably one of them EQ/WoW playing newbs that think Level/Class Systems are good for PvP. Those are Brawns over Brain, relying on your char to do all the work for you. I once let a friend on my Lvl 70 Human Mage, he had never played WoW before, and he rolled over some people in PvP with my char, despite him having no experience/familiarity with the game whatsoever. I quit playing that ******** grindfest that day, and haven't played since. Currently, UO is sitting on top of the MMORPG Throne of PvP, however each year and each expansion PvP leans more towards Brawns. PvP in UO is a mere shadow of it's former self, yet is still the most intense True PvP you'll find in an MMORPG to date.

The Devs of Darkfall have a true understanding of actual PvP in MMORPGs.
"If a game has levels it's going to be a grind plain and simple and you can't sugar-coat that. If a PvP game has levels, the higher levels typically have an impossible advantage so you have to get to maximum level just to be viable and to hope for an even playing field. In Darkfall everyone is viable and can PvP from day one."
This was taken from http://www.warcry.com/articles/view/devjournals/darkfalljournals/3070-Darkfall-Dev-Journal-24-Full-Freedom-Gameplay-and-Substance