Closed tY!

[Baby Doll]

Don't cry it's just a joke! 1/20/17




"The following is opinion and not necessarily official policy.

There are three methods to gain a seat. Become a governor, become a recognized town/society or become the leader/moderator of the council.

Any particular group can band together to attempt to win a council seat. A band of pirates decides that it wants a voice on the council. They choose Jhelom.
The pirates choose a leader and then campaign for that leader and rustle up the votes to win.

Alternatively, any particular group can approach and ally with a sitting Gov/Council member and have influence in that matter. This could work for any group whether it be crafters
or murderous PKs.

Building an officially recognized town/community is difficult but possible."


Above is my cut and paste of Kelmos response, from Miss Echo thread. Below is my response.

*****I did not want to derail MissEcho's thread.

I think Kelmo needs to lay out a plan on Stratics.. I may have misunderstood what was happening here. I thought this was a shard wide plan to work among ourselves to create cohesive council, which in time may have some slight influence with with the powers that run UO/Siege. I do not have a problem that governors be on, said council, but only them?

The parts that I cut and pasted above, It was not my thinking that this was just a Governors meeting plus 2 representatives of 2 player based towns.
1)It is going be be what 5 months or so for even trying for Gov seat.
2) It is going to take many months to years to establish a recognized player town
3) Only one spot open for "leader/moderator". Isn't this the spot you had in tended to lead?

I would like a thread to what it is that actually is trying to be done. Please don't waste my time for input that means nothing.

 

[Sargatanza]

Who angered Baby Doll! now i need to hide...

 

[Sargatanza]

If serious, Miss Baby Doll i think King Kelmo figure it out as a pro!

 

[Baby Doll]

Who angered Baby Doll! now i need to hide...

Haha,.... I am not really angered, but I am now confused about what I thought was happening. If this is all about governors meetings I am just down with that. So I ask for clarification.

Nothing but love for ya Siege,

Baby Doll

 

[Lord Frodo]

You go girl.

 

[Lord Frodo]

IMHO you need the seat right beside Kelmo as in Queen Baby Doll

 

[FrejaSP]

IMHO you need the seat right beside Kelmo as in Queen Baby Doll

That Seat is already taken of Queen Luka

 

[FrejaSP]

I have it the same way Baby Doll. There need better ways for the rest of the community to join if we want this to work. There may not be others who feel ready to join their group right now, but the door need to be open.

 

[Lord Frodo]

That Seat is already taken of Queen Luka

Is she on the council. IMHO Baby Doll needs a seat.

 

[FrejaSP]

No she is the Kings wife

 

[Ol'Rac Nnod]

Don't forget all, this is a new endeavor. I think most important is getting it formed in the first place, the counsel will be able to make modifications as needed.

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

 

[kelmo]

*smiles* I will try to clarify as best I can. First, I am aware the last Town Hall meeting did not go well. I will accept the responsibility for that. Communication issues are almost impossible to overcome. Some players got frustrated and left. Some got bored and at least one left in anger. I will attempt to do better in the future. There some really good ideas at this meeting, though.

I would like to clarify that town hall meetings are not meetings to set policy. The town hall meetings are to gather information and listen to the public. No one "votes" at a Town Hall meeting.

I do not mean to be exclusive in the make up of the council. I also will not wish for a bloated bureaucratic mess of dozens of Council members. The council members should be representative of the community. There are nine Governor positions. One of these is vacant at the present time. There are two recognized townships. The is one leader/moderator that I propose will serve at digression of the council. I am not certain as to how this position will be chosen in the future, I have seen some really good ideas on how to handle elections, but that can be determined soon.

I wish there could be an at large member, but I will not hold my breath on that. I said at the meeting I will recuse myself from determining who that might be.

Right now that is twelve members, perhaps thirteen. That is a great start.

On Governors. I can speak from experience and say I have won a spot as Governor with a single vote running unopposed. This is where I believe we should focus our efforts to be inclusive. If a guild/alliance or special interest group of any sort wants a seat, then run for office. Pick a town and make an organized concerted effort to win that town. What we are doing today is laying the ground work for the future.

The current members of the council may very well not win on the next go around. I may very well be replaced before then even. The townships being the hardest spots to attain will likely be the most consistent. The idea behind a representative style of government is an elected official that answers to the constituents. Pick a town or a player and use that conduit to express your concerns.

On the matter of where council meetings will be held, Coco's proposal is a fantastic idea. Larger town hall style meetings with the public will be held in guard zones. That is a clear mandate. We will not set ourselves up as targets. Anyone can co exist with in a guard zone if they choose.

I believe we have the foundation of who in place. Venues are settled for the time being, I believe. Mission is still on the table. I will have one more town hall meeting. Likely at the NuJel'm location. Then meet with current council or chosen representatives of council. Please review Miss Echo's (Coco) proposal as that is the best solution brought to me thus far. I appreciate issues that have solutions over general complaining.

I will monitor this thread closely and answer questions as best I can. Thank you if you have made it all the way through this posting. *bows*

 

[Baby Doll]

Thank you Kelmo for the response. I whole heartidly think Miss Echo proposal is a great meeting spot . I am going to step out of this endeavor. Not to be the difficult pancake, I just do not view this the same way. To me when I see the words that people speak on game and here on Stratics " Siege Community" I take that to mean we includes everyone on neutral platform. My perspective on your post above, is that twelve people want to get together and role play King and Governors Which I absolutely have no ill will towards. Forgetting the facts that we all know how heated and involved elections can get, where is some cases the wins came from off shard or no one cared for the spot so you just got it. I have never enjoyed role playing to the level many others do. I doubt that I will change my mind, even in 5 months or so for new campaign. I do not see the "Siege Community" is the same as "Governor's Community". So I wish you the best on this project, have fun.

Nothing but love for ya Siege,

Baby Doll

 

[Baby Doll]

IMHO you need the seat right beside Kelmo as in Queen Baby Doll

Haha, dude did you miss my "Delusional" post. I am Goddess of Siege.I just wouldn't have the time.

 

[Lord Frodo]

Haha, dude did you miss my "Delusional" post. I am Goddess of Siege.I just wouldn't have the time.

Your attitude/demeanor is needed on that counsel

 

[Baby Doll]

Your attitude/demeanor is needed on that counsel

*giggles* To date I enjoy most of my time playing Siege. Getting mixed up with this may very well ruin that.

 

[FrejaSP]

I'm still worried about how we get the whole shad present in this council.
Also not all kind of players do have RP that fit Virtue towns and the in game voting for the virtue towns are something we can't make fair as people will bring friends for other shards to vote from them.

The original idea was, that other towns could be choosen too, that be Buc den, Cove, Umbra, Luna etc
Because someone win a Virtue town, it do not mean he do have a community behind him/her.
I know it is not easy. And I sure know, it is not easy to be the Co-ordinator for this.

This 5 months goes fast, I don't know if Safe Haven have the energi for an Election every 6 months unless someone demand a new Election. I also believe player groups, that be crafters, hunting groups, groups for new Siege players, RP groups good as well as evil would be a more stabile fundament for the Siege Council as 11 new Virtue town Governors could kill the council if it end up being all about who will get most voices in the council.

What if next town Election get support from Atlantic PvP'ers and 5 or more govenors are from HI-5, Luna Boys, Sith, etc, that would be as bad as 5 being GIL. I'm sure it would give some nightmare.
I know the current governors all are good Siege players who care so this are not an attack on them.

Where the council should meet for meetings with out access for the rest of the shard does not really matter, that could be anyway with enough chairs and a tele from a central place. If you choose Coco's place, that's all fine.
Also where the Town Hall meetings are hold are less important as long it is possible to stop all from blabring on same time. A moderator is a must.

It's also fine we start with the 12 members we do have so far as long we keep the door open for new community leaders.
And I agree, Baby Doll need a seat as she really are the Goddess of Siege and care for the ones, who may not be present right now. How that will fit the setup, i don't know.

I do agree, voting do not belong on a town hall meeting, if we want the whole shard to vote for something, make a poll here and show who are the voters so we know they play here.

You are doing fine Kelmo and I know you want this to work as badly as me and others.

 

[MissEcho]

Thank you Kelmo for the response. I whole heartidly think Miss Echo proposal is a great meeting spot . I am going to step out of this endeavor. Not to be the difficult *****, I just do not view this the same way. To me when I see the words that people speak on game and here on Stratics " Siege Community" I take that to mean we includes everyone on neutral platform. My perspective on your post above, is that twelve people want to get together and role play King and Governors Which I absolutely have no ill will towards. Forgetting the facts that we all know how heated and involved elections can get, where is some cases the wins came from off shard or no one cared for the spot so you just got it. I have never enjoyed role playing to the level many others do. I doubt that I will change my mind, even in 5 months or so for new campaign. I do not see the "Siege Community" is the same as "Governor's Community". So I wish you the best on this project, have fun.

Nothing but love for ya Siege,

Baby Doll

I see where your comming from. From my reading of all posts prior to my putting up the proposal it seemed like most ppl had already tentatively 'agreed' that there should be a council, and that is should consist of those I put on it. If others think different then it wasn't really clear . Unlike a full shard meeting (Town Hall?) where everyone comes and it turns into a shoutfest, I thought ya'll had wanted a more measured system where everyone could have input but somewhere where decisions could actually get made and submitted to the Devs etc?

I would expect if the council is serious about bringing change then a first thing would be to establish the 'Submissions to SCC' thread to be stickied on Stratics forum. If It was me all players could put up what they wanted to see 'done'. Kelmo (as moderator) lists those submissions in order that they come in. He can then make an 'agenda' and include the first say 4 submissions onto the agenda for the next meeting and invites the submittor along to the council meeting to expand on their issue. (More than 4 pulled from this thread would make meetings take well over 3 hrs which wont happen) If you wanted to get really clever, then say 'submissions' for February, (posted in Jan) and then at the end of the period pick the four submissions that had the most 'likes' for bringing forward etc.

EG: So if say I really think it would be great for a 'bin' to be placed in the Tur Mer City square (lol couldnt think of anything else) and put that as a submission which then gets the 'most' likes that month. I then expect that Kelmo (as moderator) puts it on the agenda and takes it forward for discussion and reports back (if I can't attend) and where possible he can invite me along council meeting as a 'contributor'. I can then go along to a meeting and give my 'proposal re new bin' and the matter can be discussed with all the council (don't forget they are supposedly elected by the players to represent them) and if it is decided that 'yes this bin idea is fantastic!" the council can then organise a public vote for the whole shard. So the Topic on the ballot would be 'Should Ter Mur' have a bin in the city square? Vote Yeh or Nay. That way 'all' have made a contribution to the agenda, and 'all' on shard have a vote on whether it should proceed or not.

The Governors/Player Reps should consult with their citizens, and use their 5 minute podium speech to bring up stuff from them. With 11 of these at 5 mins each that is 55 mins, allow 5 mins to discuss what they bought up, then you are at 2 hrs. Four (4) submissions bought by Kelmo to the meeting allow another 30 mins and you are already at 2.5 hrs for a meeting. I would assume that not all Governors will have stuff to bring every meeting (bloody well hope not !). On Oceania when I was a governor it was rare that more than 1 or 2 issues were ever bought up. If that is the case (you will figure it out over time) then Kelmo could bring more from the boards.

The format I proposed does give you a 'structure' to work with that can be refined as you go along rather than shard wide meetings which just provide places to 'vent' but don't actually achieve anything other than generally exposing the 50 different opinions on anything.

I won't be attending meetings, although I may submit stuff to a submissions thread and if enough ppl liked the idea would be happy for it to go via Kelmo to a meeting for further discussion without me being in attendance. I can read the minutes after the meeting and if I don't think what I wanted was given enough consideration or was not representative of what I meant or wanted I could resubmit.

Don't forget with the communication hubs that individuals can also 'submit' requests in writing. Which could also be added to the agenda for discussion.

Until you see what 'issues' people actually want to discuss it is difficult to see how long stuff is going to take. It may be that 30 issues are raised in the first meeting, in which case they should all be tabled, listed on stratics and then polled to see what are of most importance to take along to the next meeting. it is too hard so say at the moment.

Anyways, I am bowing out now of this whole thing lol. If you want to use my premises all good, if not, all good.

Edited: The coloured stuff shows where the whole player base is definitely included. The council is really the conduit to enable co-ordination of the issues the players put up.

 

[Baby Doll]

And I agree, Baby Doll need a seat as she really are the Goddess of Siege and care for the ones, who may not be present right now. How that will fit the setup, i don't know.

Thank you Freja. Here is the thing though I do not think plan will go forward as a whole. If this is just Kelmo's setting up the base plan then it is too early have the shards backing as a whole. All I can see is fighting over smaller issues for equality. I suggest Kelmo move forward with his plan and work out the small stuff and name it Governors Meeting . Then bring this up to the community when he has the basics done . Maybe then when time has past and people have had the time to think about it, we all can move forward to Siege Community.

 

[Baby Doll]

MissEcho, Thank you, I am on overload on this whole thing. I am going to take a day or so and ponder what others have posted. Slowing the roll is all!

 

[FrejaSP]

I see where your comming from. From my reading of all posts prior to my putting up the proposal it seemed like most ppl had already tentatively 'agreed' that there should be a council, and that is should consist of those I put on it. If others think different then it wasn't really clear . Unlike a full shard meeting (Town Hall?) where everyone comes and it turns into a shoutfest, I thought ya'll had wanted a more measured system where everyone could have input but somewhere where decisions could actually get made and submitted to the Devs etc?

Submitting ideas to Devs are one part of it but more important for me is to make the council work to help the shard interact better if all sub groups of the shard do have a say. This are way more than the Em kings council, it's a Siege Community Council.

Yes Baby Doll, I agree, that we are not there yet and we do fight about small stuff

 

[MissEcho]

All groups do have a say Freja.

1. by putting in submission to the SCC thread on stratics
2. by consulting with their town governors
3. by consulting with their player town rep
4. by participating in public votes via ballots in game and polls on stratics
5. by attending town hall meetings when called

You have to start somewhere with a smaller group to CO-ORDINATE it. The Council is a co-ordinating body, not a deciding body. Anything to be decided will be by 'public' vote in whatever form it takes, ballots, poll etc. Whether stuff goes to the devs or is just a Siege thing to make groups work better is not the issue both can be done.

I am not sure what it is you want.

Also it is only Governors that need to be chosen every 6 mths. It is a 'game mechanic' and constitutes the way anyone can get to be on the committee. Player reps from Safe Haven and Gilfane can elect their rep in whatever time frame they want, annually, every 5 yrs if that is what they want.

 

[FrejaSP]

I am not sure what it is you want.

I want to get rid of the feeling of someone telling me, take it or leave it. I had not seen any poll here yet, but it seem like someone already did set the rules. And I can see some feel left out for the next 5 months.

. by putting in submission to the SCC thread on stratics

That is fine

2. by consulting with their town governors

This are my problem. Right now, the governors do have a community behind them but will they have in the future.

3. by consulting with their player town rep

That works fine too but we can't wait for an EM and Mesanna to make a player town officiel. We could add guild/allianceleaders from guilds/allies not already present in the council.

4. by participating in public votes via ballots in game and polls on stratics

No problems with that.

5. by attending town hall meetings when called

Fine too but we need a moderator and logs from meetings

 

[Lady Michelle]

@kelmo
Lets say someone sets up township like Gil & SH, and they want Delucia, or Pau maybe both in the lost lands, but they set up their township in Umbra. Basicly what I'm asking does it matter where someone sets up their Townships, if the town is up for graps a township may put a bid in. like township is luna, and they want Umbra?

 

[kelmo]

My definition of a township is a recognized town by Broadsword. Gilfane and Safe Haven both have achieved this by having a monument built by the "powers that be".

 

[Lady Michelle]

My definition of a township is a recognized town by Broadsword. Gilfane and Safe Haven both have achieved this by having a monument built by the "powers that be".

This I know, but I'm asking once the township is recognized if its in Umbra will they be able to bid on any town that is not one under a gov? or do you really have to have a township to even bid on a town you want to run? I just want to know how to put a bid in to run a town like Luna.

 

[kelmo]

I do not know. If you have a plan to run Luna let me know. I am listening.

 

[Lady Michelle]

I do not know. If you have a plan to run Luna let me know. I am listening.

I have no idea, and Luna I was just using as an example. if I do come up with a plan I will post it