A few questions

[Raptor85]

But then again back then gold was a secondary concern to the experience of playing. You didn't need millions of gold to be competitive...hell, you didn't need more than a couple thousand to buy a suit of GM iron armor and a GM weapon.

Honestly, I think this post from above PERFECTLY sums up the difference pre/post AOS, and as an extension to it I'd also remind that pre-aos GM weapon skill was neither common nor necessary for most players, you could play just fine from the moment you set foot in the world since the "useless" monsters around now were actually a challenge with decent loot back then, post-aos you basicly needed a golem to get you up to 80+ skill before you could even hunt "low end" things for loot, it killed off the ability for new players to just go out and have fun.

 

[Herman]

Best part with this item system though was even with a full suit of invuln plate and a vanq sword w/ a hit spell, a guy in normal plate with a normal sword could still take you down easily if he's better than you, the advantages of the armor and weapons were nice but nothing like the ridiculousness of the high end armor today.

Cmon now dexxers pre aos
I dont like to be rude and criticize an opinion about an era in the game but i just got to ask Dexxers they was the most boring thing in the world to play back then i quit because how boring they was and did not think once about uo in 6 years
Surely i cant be the only one to think dexxers is so much more fun to play now with all the new skills it s just so much more to do with them

So can u plz explain to me other than connection what was the diffrent between a good and a bad dexxer back then

 

[Raptor85]

falling back, timing swings/heals, switching weapons, baiscly the same things that can tip the balance of a fight today assuming nearly equal suits.

 

[Ned888]

From my perspective as a returning player (I hadn't played since 1998), I like the Tam/Fel thing to a point, but I think that it would have been better to instead create some basic controls so that PvP was voluntary, instead of mandatory (some sort of flag system perhaps).

Either way, my thoughts are this:

The aspects that damaged this game are directly related to commodities; their use and their longevity. Please let me explain:

Reagents are now no longer necessary; Mana is only required to an extent now as well. LMC/LRC from imbuing has removed much of the control over magery and has reduced demand for reagents as both a saleable commodity and a limited resource which was once coveted.

Commodity Deeds; while taking up the same space as a stack of the commodity itself have resulted in the ability to carry and transfer vast sums of products from place to place and person to person.

Repair Deeds have removed the need to maintain a crafting skill or a crafter for many people. This also contributes to equipment being around in game a lot longer than it should be.

Insurance has created a very difficult situation because nothing ever leaves the game. This alongside the lack of PvP looting in Tram makes it so a suit of armor lasts for months if not years if it is constantly repaired with the repair deeds I mentioned above.

The economy is so outrageously out of control that it would take a true miracle to get it back in line. Millions of gold has been hoarded and there is no sink to move it. This is greatly impacted by the above; all of which require output of gold.

Just my thoughts on the state of the game. I know I focused a bit, but I think I may have answered some of your questions.

 

[Clx-]

Pleas forgive me for this post .My curiosity has risen to the point ,That I can no longer control my urge to ask you several questions.
Your well chosen wording in your intro has protected this thread from deteriorating to rants and trolls fodder. Your subsequent questions in later posts seem more fact finding than mere curiosity.
My hat is off to you. However ,I am curious as to who you really are and because of the choice of your questions ,why are you here asking them ,if you no longer play Ultima.
You sound like a developer or someone interested in a remake of this great game.
Do tell.

Hiya. You're half right. I'm only an amateur though. A theorist more than anything, just dabbling. I'm not Garriott or anything, sorry if I got your hopes up. Very perceptive of you though.

I was never involved in crafting or RP on more than a casual basis so need some assistance. My knowledge of most other aspects of the game and it's history is quite comprehensive.

UO is simply the best game ever created in my opinion, by a distance. No other game has come close, and what worries me is that none ever will. The strange mix of player innocence and the newness of it all, coupled with a genuinely enthralling and interesting world populated by some fantastic people. A working economy, a real sense of being part of something. The community. No other game has or had that. Topped off with what is still the best PvP in any game to date.

I think the biggest accolade you can offer the original designers of UO is that the game continued to be the best around for years and years, despite ever increasing competition and the gradually watering down and destruction of the original goals and ideals of the game. For me it continued to be a great game up until SE release, despite my complete opposition to most of the UO:R and AOS changes. The game had almost completely changed by then, but still had most of the essential ingredients. It obviously still contains a few of those ingredients for the people still playing.

I started playing this game when I was 17 years old. I'm 30 now, haven't played for years and years - but still in touch with tons of friends I made through the game and think about the good times almost every day. There can't be any other game that's had such an effect on people's lives.

I don't think any gaming company is going to take a financial risk with a UO-like sandbox game ever again, unfortunately. Partly they'd be right - that 'special time and place' and everything it entailed has passed, I'm coming to understand.

Sorry, completely rambled. It's been a really interesting thread and I'd love to hear some more.

 

[Mirt]

Just for the record at no point of UO lifespan was Origin not owned by EA. We should clarify that when we try and discuss what happened. If you don't believe me go pull out your first disk. Check what it says under Origin. Many of the changes are issues. There really is no reward for wearing plate armor anymore. That should be fixed. There is no difficulty in being an RP and a rules player. I have actually done both for the bulk of my life. I came into role playing games at the ripe old age of 5 (my father played and to be honest back before the A was added how hard was it to play a barbarian). I have continued since then and will tell you with the exception of the armor UO is one of the best possible role playing games ever. If you ask me why I will tell you its because of how open it was. There are so many options for what you can be and how you can make it work. Do you sometimes have to adjust your idea of what makes sense RP-wise to the game world... yes. That being said you are playing a game and there are certain world rules. What has hurt RP in UO is the tramel fel split and the slow and steady decrease of players. RPers also seem to suffer from the fact that get more then a few of them in any one area and they start attacking each other and each others RP style. That being said I believe that it could once again be a thriving place for RP, with just a little love from the Devs and EMs.

 

[Luvmylace]

Thank you . I think you have discovered the secret to the fame and persistence of UO in what we all have related in many ways and through many anecdotes. It is simply ,that a new world and new people to wander it with no idea of it's scope ,no idea of the populations ; numbers and mean age, no idea how to get through one day,and who was your enemy ,was the beauty of the game .What made it great was the community.Finding someone !The way people grouped and joined forces .. or not .The simple dangers and the fear of what was around the corner can never be experienced again. The mere fact that we have a test center removes that possibility even further .When the game began , we had lots of problems and they were fixed as we went along in our world . We grumbled with all the growing pains but we moved on to find new things and new ideas.
People today are in a big hurry to conquer ,figure out how to beat it or find the cheats ;not to adventure .That is what UO has lost.

 

[Uvtha]

Sorry this isn't really related to current UO, I don't play it anymore. Just a few questions for people more knowledgeable than myself, would really appreciate any answers:

1. What in particular about the AOS release in 2003 was bad for roleplay communities? I'm sure I used to know the answer to this question, but I've not played for three years+ and AOS release was over 8 years ago anyway...

2. Do people still play a crafter/merchant as their 'primary' character in UO? If not, when did this end, and why?

3. What were the initial and long term attractions to being a crafter in UO as a primary playstyle? All that I remember people giving as a reason were the social aspects pre-trammel, being at Brit forge, etc. After UOR crafters mostly became a 'support' character for people's main profession, I believe?

4. Has crafting ever been as profitable as other aspects of UO, like PvM? If so, when was this, and was profit a big reason behind people picking this playstyle? I know this possibly overlaps with question 3 slightly...

1) poorly implemented system made peoples outfits patchwork messes, made items very important and turned the game more toward the side of grinding for better gear or be unable to compete. Less time for rp, and less able to rp in style. Now a days those issues are mostly resolved I'd say. You can easily get any kind of gear you want with good mods for cheap.

2) On siege people still do. With insurance, and the addition of tram items are not lost, this no need to replace, thus no crafting.

3)originally it was a very good source of money as a GM smith (or tailor when the special leathers came in) was rare and in VERY high demand, and I found it appealing just because it was something different. I also liked to help people out, and provide them with good gear. There was also the very active brit forge scene. Lots of fun people to chat with. Lots of good memories.
If any one played LS back then and remembers the GM smith named "Not A Thief" that was me.

4) Tottally. I used to make a butt ton from the safty of town. I could still make a very good living (I dont really play much anymore) on siege with imbuing as well. If you are smart about it you could still make more crafting than anything else (on siege only).

 

[Clx-]

Thank you . I think you have discovered the secret to the fame and persistence of UO in what we all have related in many ways and through many anecdotes. It is simply ,that a new world and new people to wander it with no idea of it's scope ,no idea of the populations ; numbers and mean age, no idea how to get through one day,and who was your enemy ,was the beauty of the game .What made it great was the community.Finding someone !The way people grouped and joined forces .. or not .The simple dangers and the fear of what was around the corner can never be experienced again. The mere fact that we have a test center removes that possibility even further .When the game began , we had lots of problems and they were fixed as we went along in our world . We grumbled with all the growing pains but we moved on to find new things and new ideas.
People today are in a big hurry to conquer ,figure out how to beat it or find the cheats ;not to adventure .That is what UO has lost.

You are 100% correct. That time is gone. The game has been taken down completely the wrong path as well, of course.

 

[Percivalgoh]

You are 100% correct. That time is gone. The game has been taken down completely the wrong path as well, of course.

Of course you would say that since it no longer holds any appeal to you but for myself if this is the wrong path then maybe I am playing the wrong game because it sure seems like the right path.

 

[Clx-]

Certainly. I'd say that you're in the minority by feeling that a WoW/Diablo imitation with Samurai Elves and Ninja's is the right path for ULTIMA ONLINE, though.