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Shoot.. I use the "phone a friend" option when that happens. Find someone I know who uses EC and get them to buy it.... or I just go buy it for a few more mil on a vendor that did not stock while using EC lol
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I'm sure I'll get flamed on this but some of the pictures from KR looked good far better than the EC I was excited about KR until it was released. Then it just looked like pastel smeared and smudged mess, not to mention the ice skating effects. EC isn't any better imho.
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cc with uo assist 99.9% of the time. I tried EC afew times, it hurts my eyes. guess I'm getting old. I like the features with EC/Pinos, it does make it unfair between the 2 clients. I always wondered why the devs don't make an uoassist type add on to make the 2 clients aliitle more even concerning game play.
Yeah what I saw when I logged on that client the first time looked like paintings someone had rubbed down with a wet rag...nothing at all like what the KR art looked like
problem with that is that there are some pple using EC, and they would be unhappy...
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Definitely some great options in EC.. that insta-equip on suits and the searchable loot deal would be great to use/have.. just can't handle the headaches I get from it.
The invasions are that boring, that Im on here. LOLI'm pleasantly surprised how popular this poll is... the thread was only posted eight hours ago and there are already 81 votes.... who knew so many people read Uhall on a daily basis!
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Yeah, I try to hit the corpse to re-arm but sometimes it is not an option. But, even with UOAssist it takes a while to redress... and at times it hangs up telling you that "you can't equip that" or something along those lines... then after a few seconds it finally puts whatever item it had an issue with on ya and continues. Takes a minute or so to undress and dress in luck suit as well... so I don't use it that often.
Why? because there is not a majority of players using the EC means it has to be put to rest. Some players use it and really like it no need to get rid of either client. Plus what about the players who use EC, but dont post on stratics.
Because there are only about 3 devs. They are very limited as it is. They do not need to be spending extra time working on the EC. That just means less content for the rest of us.
Ever think the devs might use EC, and decide well will get rid of CC that way we have more time to work on the EC.CC players want to keep playing will have to switch to the EC.
I am a CC kinda girl. I have uoassit for the accounts I have. (inherited).
I like that I can copy and paste my macros when I do a change.
I like that the backpack has a natural feel. I use it when I visit EC for trying to play.
If I didn't have UOassist and was just starting, I would probably just play EC.
I get dizzy playing EC. Much like I do sitting first in line at a busy intersection or stopped first at a train. I have to look far left or right.
I use EC to buy stuff from vendors.
I use EC to test place for homes.
I used EC to train taming.
I use it to zoom when taking screen shots.
I can't figure out the macros in EC.
I dig the hotbars.
I'll have to try it out on maps.
I wish I didn't get an error when switching clients. meaning I wish I didn't have to logout to keep from having to reboot the client. It should boot me just like normal and connect me.
I like that I can copy and paste my macros when I do a change.
I like that the backpack has a natural feel. I use it when I visit EC for trying to play.
If I didn't have UOassist and was just starting, I would probably just play EC.
I get dizzy playing EC. Much like I do sitting first in line at a busy intersection or stopped first at a train. I have to look far left or right.
I use EC to buy stuff from vendors.
I use EC to test place for homes.
I used EC to train taming.
I use it to zoom when taking screen shots.
I can't figure out the macros in EC.
I dig the hotbars.
I'll have to try it out on maps.
I wish I didn't get an error when switching clients. meaning I wish I didn't have to logout to keep from having to reboot the client. It should boot me just like normal and connect me.
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I play the EC exclusively. I tried Pincos a few times, but it slowed me down (albeit it was on an older computer) and I never re-installed after Publish 86 or so.
When people cite "graphics" as the reason for playing CC over EC, I roll my eyes. It's a rather lame excuse, frankly.
The increased play options and interface on EC is far superior to not only the CC but any of the CC's unmentionable third party clients. Backpack grid and list functions, better targeting, quickly creating macro bars, paper doll with equipment slops, insta-equip ability for various suits and different set ups, slightly faster run speed are the main highlights for me. I don't see how any serious player can ignore these advantages over some nostalgic feeling for 20 year old graphics.
Without illicit scripting programs, the CC would lose a major part of it's player base.
Kind of funny how we always see the CC players suggesting we do away with the EC, but rarely the other way around. Even if these "poll results" are indicative of the community as a whole, I don't think it would be wise to write off an entire third of us.
When people cite "graphics" as the reason for playing CC over EC, I roll my eyes. It's a rather lame excuse, frankly.
The increased play options and interface on EC is far superior to not only the CC but any of the CC's unmentionable third party clients. Backpack grid and list functions, better targeting, quickly creating macro bars, paper doll with equipment slops, insta-equip ability for various suits and different set ups, slightly faster run speed are the main highlights for me. I don't see how any serious player can ignore these advantages over some nostalgic feeling for 20 year old graphics.
Without illicit scripting programs, the CC would lose a major part of it's player base.
I'm not so sure about that. Stratics population is skewed toward older players... even older than the average UO player age, which is considerably higher than most video games. Those players are more likely to favor CC over EC.
Kind of funny how we always see the CC players suggesting we do away with the EC, but rarely the other way around. Even if these "poll results" are indicative of the community as a whole, I don't think it would be wise to write off an entire third of us.
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Maybe I should try the EC without Pinco's, not really done that. I confess though if I want to dye my hair I have to use the CC, I just can't make head nor tails of the colour chart in Pinco's, most of the colours don't work!
That's not pinco's... that's the EC... the colors from day 1 have never worked.
mmm... it looked way better in those promo shots than it did in actual game. Item art in particular was pretty wretched. I always thought the vast majority of the monsters looked pretty good, and the tilesets for the most part also looked good. The rest was mostly miss rarely hit.
As for the client I play its 100% CC. Aesthetics are very important to me, especially in this, a game so fueled by nostalgia. I love the EC's functionality, but it's in no way worth it for me to use with the absolutly abhorrent mishmash of graphics.
I don't have the numbers or anything but I would be willing to bet the average age of all UO players is over 30. I think most players are vets, probably of at least 5 years, if not 10. I don't really see UO appealing to many younger, modern gamers. Some, sure, but UO is primarily a game that appeals to older people.
Ones you linked look so nice. It is odd how some of the models visible in those images got ditched. KR was a terrible mess, but it had some serious potential graphics-wise.
It is worth noting how these are pre-release promo pics though. All displayed in them is carefully hand picked if not hand-crafted. In reality, It wasn't - that - nice looking a candyland overall. And iirc, t'was utterly broken otherwise. Killing it of entirely and starting, graphics' style -wise, as if from scratch in EC made a really weird decision. Which is entirely logical and consistent if we consider how UO's history is an unbroken chain of like 17 years worth of really weird decisions when it comes to clients.
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I always had the feeling the screenshots were taken on very new, cutting-edge PCs with the graphics whacked up full and that's why it was never going to look like that for the actual players, some of the UO population are older people with older PCs, I always did think some of the mobs in KR looked really nice, it was just the overall washed-out vague-ness that I found odd. I guess nobody expects an old game to need a new PC to run well...
The only time I EVER use EC is to check hue ids. I beta tested KR and loved it but when they brought in EC, I went back to CC.
Hehe, I kinda fear the measure of cuts the edge of the PC running KR was irrelevant. It was just so broken..it just did not run well. Since Garriot left, we've seen three unfinished clients. heh. Wonder how many half measures it would take til they try to tweak CC rather than replace it. 5?20?I always had the feeling the screenshots were taken on very new, cutting-edge PCs with the graphics whacked up full and that's why it was never going to look like that for the actual players, some of the UO population are older people with older PCs, I always did think some of the mobs in KR looked really nice, it was just the overall washed-out vague-ness that I found odd. I guess nobody expects an old game to need a new PC to run well...
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I think they already realised they can't fully replace the CC, so if it goes then so does the game, your poll has shown that two thirds of players at least are still on the original client, despite it's lack of features. They won't risk losing that many accounts and what they can do with the CC is somewhat limited due to it's age.
Nothing "lame" to it.
In 2017 AD, it isn't even current or relevant to speak of some "nostalgic feeling" of CC graphics. That kinda implies we'd have " the old and familiar " and " the new and exciting!" We don't. In less than two years, EC too is over a decade old. They are both old and familiar. Both of them are aged and objectively speaking obsolete in terms of visuals. It's just that different graphic styles and different quality of work ages differently. - SNES game with 2d graphics from early 90's can look perfectly fine, even appealing today. It withstands time. Meanwhile, a more ambitious SNES game from the same era that attempted a 3d approach looks, despite once very impressive in it's own time, hopelessly obsolete and difficult to look at today. When it comes to UO, and purely in terms of graphics, I feel time is undeniably on CC's side now. It looks sharp and crisp and out of time and colourful. More technology marches onwards, more blurred and messy EC appears.
Over the 10+ years of playing UO, people have understandably developed a very strong impression of how the game they play looks. How graphics style of it feels. I think this image can (or could) be altered. You can improve, tweak and enhance graphics. But if you start CHANGING the entire graphics style, it gets very dangerous very quickly.
When talking about EC/CC, I often end up thinking of World of Warcraft. WoW is an MMO with resources at it's disposal that are of entirely different scale to what UO has ever had. WoW, too, is an old game by now. It too, had it's old character graphics enhanced few years back. But the thing is, despite the stellar size of their graphics team, WoW's devs needed ages before they began doing anything concrete. Instead, they were all talk. They talked a lot and they talked for long. Directly to their playes too. For years, they spoke how.. A) It is clear for them how the character models of their game need to be updated. B) How they are absolutely terrified to do so. They spoke about how they understood what a personal, important and even sensitive thing the looks and feels of one's own character/pet is for the player. How easy it is to ruin it by " improving", even if you do good job.
Everything in EC character models screams how the above simply was never a a line of thinking that ever belonged to Mythic's tables and equations. What really ticks me off about EC graphics isn't about the graphics looking like the outcome by a bad, sloppy shareware studio(they do) or things looking strangely blurry all the time( things do.); no, it is all about quality of work looking so..careless. Characters, clothes and pets look like an afternoon job that pays no mind to the original material. It is of different style and could and should belong to some different game.
This is bit petty, quite insulting and very inaccurate. Despite some bitter..thing you have going for CC, it pays to accept majority of people simply like it more There isn't any malign reason or desire to exploit behind this. Despite EC being incredibly intimidating for returning vets and new players,it's UI is very powerful for sure. I'd love to make use of it. I just can't stand the way it looks and feels. So many things look like they shouldn't. It doesn't look or feel or play like UO.
I see absolutely no reason to assume a typical Stratics poster wouldn't be a typical UO player. Not everybody who plays UO uses or reads stratics. But all kinds of people and players do. It isn't the entire population for sure. It is without a doubt a perfectly good sample of the population. And in broader sense, sample of people who have UO on their map in 2017.
Unfortunately UO is stuck with two clients. This has been the case for over half of it's life time. Which is completely crazy when you think about it. Three attempts to replace a client made in 90's. Three failures to do so. It is fortunate and kinda miraculous how the game itself and the development teams responsible for UO survive miscalculations and mistakes of this scale. You'd think one or two mistakes on this front had been enough to show and tell which basket the eggs should have been placed. Sadly it wasn't.
I think you are right, neither client can be killed. Sadly UO is stuck with the ones it now has til the end.
...But I feel much, much more love and attention should go to client majority of people use.
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Sadly I have noticed this too, maybe it's because everyone who now plays the EC started off playing the CC and has some residual affection for it, unfortunately there is none of that going in the opposite direction....
Hehe, if you guys are genuinely hungry for anecdotal evidence pointing to either direction over something like this, I'd recommend checking the old poll I linked few posts back. It features a guy screaming how CC is UO's mortal would over and over again. ;p Considering how @Merlin just now kindly pointed out how "a major portion of CC users do so exclusively cause of hacking UO", I'd say it is pretty fair to say tiny bit of bitterness floats to both directions just fine, lol
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Question polled here is one that has been asked every now and then over the years. I thought it'd be very interesting to compare the results!
Here is a similar thread that @Smoot made in 2014. classic or enhanced
Here is one I made in 2013 Which Client do you use?
2013: 65,2% CC - 34,8 EC Total of 105 Votes given
2014: 64% CC - 35% EC Total of 85 Votes given
2017: 68.2% CC - 31.8% EC Total of 129 Votes given so far!
Numbers are pretty consistent.
What I like most about these findings is the amount of people who have voted this time already! Based on this alone ( this alone isn't much;p) more people are using Stratics now than few years back! I bet it is the 20th event arc, hype is real!
Tbh It would be nice for some dev to weigh in on the matter. It is interesting how EC isn't really gaining ground here.
Here is a similar thread that @Smoot made in 2014. classic or enhanced
Here is one I made in 2013 Which Client do you use?
2013: 65,2% CC - 34,8 EC Total of 105 Votes given
2014: 64% CC - 35% EC Total of 85 Votes given
2017: 68.2% CC - 31.8% EC Total of 129 Votes given so far!
Numbers are pretty consistent.
What I like most about these findings is the amount of people who have voted this time already! Based on this alone ( this alone isn't much;p) more people are using Stratics now than few years back! I bet it is the 20th event arc, hype is real!
Tbh It would be nice for some dev to weigh in on the matter. It is interesting how EC isn't really gaining ground here.
i came back to UO a few years ago, after a 9 year break, in that time i played alot of games like WoW, GW2, Rift, Aion...etc when i came back to UO i tried the CC and after playing games like those i just couldnt do it, was just goin to scrap my idea of tryin to come back to UO, but i figure ahh what the hell i'll give the EC a try, been here ever since.
2015: 57,1% CC - 18,6 EC Total of 210 Votes given
Poll on Client popularity
*There was other options available but poll would have finished around the same hehe
Found another two
2009: 67,1% CC - 28,9 EC - 4% Other Total of 173 Votes given
2d vs. whatever.....
2011: 62,3% CC - 27,8 EC - 10% Both Total of 281 Votes given
Which client do you use?
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I think CC users have this delusion that if EC was gone, BS would devote all these insane resources to making CC somewhat comparable in functionality to EC. The reality, neither client has seen any meaningful development in years and is highly unlikely to see any more. Bugs just accumulate. Coding a client requires quite a bit of resources and skills. I am guessing, powers that be decided that the best bang for their buck is to keep working on content rather than doing anything with the client. After all, we've complained for 5 years. We can complain for 5 more.
Everyone here is a programmer and knows the effort it will take.
In my job, we have programs that house a library of common business queries... Business asked for one more filter on the query. Projected cost was in the hundreds of thousands. The same business team hired me and showed me and I just moved it over to a query in a DB2 query program and added a line on the query. It took me 5 minutes to browse the schema and add the line. It took longer to have the program loaded on all the business team's PCs than it did to make the change.
Companies spend so much time talking about it and they just need to do it.
In my job, we have programs that house a library of common business queries... Business asked for one more filter on the query. Projected cost was in the hundreds of thousands. The same business team hired me and showed me and I just moved it over to a query in a DB2 query program and added a line on the query. It took me 5 minutes to browse the schema and add the line. It took longer to have the program loaded on all the business team's PCs than it did to make the change.
Companies spend so much time talking about it and they just need to do it.
People don't play uo based on the art or the graphics, EC is still garbage compared to some of those games you mentioned tbh. People play this game because its hands down the best mmorpg of all time, even with the terrible CC graphics that I've grown to love.
I hope Broadsword never touches the client code again, I could care less if they do. They only have one guy capable of making it work, and that is a lot of overhead for one person to do, we've seen all the bugs with the resolution that still need fixing.
You can but if they don't fix the EC and make it playable soon I'll be done at the end of the year. I'm not going to tolerate this anymore... be one think if it was just some annoying little bug but the problems with the EC pretty much make it so you can't do a large portion of the game anymore...
If you can't do EM Events which is the weekly RP and they PAY People to provide this entertainment for us... and it's the ONE thing in UO that has kept me from quitting for the last 5 years... if I can't participate in it anymore well then what is the point of paying to keep getting so irritated??? I don't see one. Despite my friends grumbling I will be finished with this... it's seriously not worth the aggravation... and telling me for the 15th time to set settings that haven't changed one bit in 5 years isn't going to endear me to continue...
One more nail in the coffin as far as I'm concerned either they need to hire someone competent or admit that it's over their collective heads and they just aren't able to effectively support the game and LET IT DIE... which IMO they perhaps should have done 5 years ago... as it is now I think it's somewhat like a cancer... people want to remember how wonderful it was but the last dying throws have poisoned those memories and now it's becoming pathetic... you want to put it down. Almost want to say if you love the game let it go... Don't keep it on this life support that is pumping poison into a corpse.
There is a certain sad sad truth in what you just said MalagAste...
Someone had to say it.
Maybe you already know this, but after you hit "Start UO Game" on the initial screen, go the "Custom UI" tab at the top and choose Default instead of Pinco's and then log in. You will see what the EC without Pinco's is like.
not sure why so many people are saying the EC client is unplayable, i only use the EC client and i pretty much do everything, except for EM events, but if i used the CC i still would'nt do EM event s anyway.
But EM Events are pretty much the only thing I enjoy really in game anymore... so to me it's unplayable if I can't do them.
Yep, pretty much this. I exclusively use EC with Pinco's and enjoy it. However I stopped going to EM events years ago due to the problems that everyone here is aware of. But I don't think that's a solution a game company should find acceptable.
Well here is my thought on that... They are PAYING people to provide this service to the players... shouldn't we be able to enjoy it??? What's the point of paying people to provide a service if 1/2 your playerbase can't even participate?
Damn, you still use UOTamer?99.999% Vanilla CC (no assist), UOTamer, UOAM.
0.001% EC (installed and updated!) for color ID
hehe I wonder if anyone still uses Curse or Wedding or any of the other old ones made by Xena etc.
Spot on. Age of the art doesn't = quality of the art. The original UO art assets are clean and classic and look just about perfect, I can say without reservation that artistically they are the match or more often the superior of anything KR had to offer. Demons and Dragons in UO are two examples of the best video game art I have seen, simply iconic work. I would make a game today with that exact same art style, albeit with the resolution one would expect in modern graphics, probably in 3d, and with an engine capable of more dynamic world building.
There are actually a lot of games from the past that are very nice to look at, and a more simple style (call it retro if you wish) including pixel art can make for stunning visuals just as much as a modern AAA open world RPG. Don't get me wrong, I love games like that too, but it's not an either or scenario, they can both be "modern" and beautiful, and amplify the gaming experience.
Now the EC... it's horrid no matter how you look at it. It comes across as exactly what it is, a hack job of two sets of art assets. It looks amateurish, and terrible, and I don't know how any new player wouldn't be instantly turned off. That said, I also don't know how a new player wouldn't be instantly turned off by the lack of functionality in the CC, so...