NOT!! But seriously.. Bar fights, arena duels, fight clubs, etc.. Were absolutely necessary when roleplaying.. But because you have to add in all these stupid anti-griefing mechanics even if I own the house, it seems if I attack more than one green player I get EJECTED! And if I leave when I flag on a green player (my own GUILD members) I cannot re-enter the home.. So that is yet another tool you added to kill immersion and realism and kill the roleplaying community as it slowly dies in favor of the elite PVE//PVP players.. Thank you soooo much!! I can't even have a RP-PVP tournament in a house or use it for any RP purposes beyond that since I run a guild that is like a "military" and we do trainings at our barracks which features a pit to fight in.. I customized it to look like an arena somewhat, but now it is useless.. I hate you all..
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Dear Devs, thank you for slowly killing the roleplaying community!
It hasn't been that long.. Just a few years ago in Cove we had a blood bath inside one of my homes. A complete blood bath and it was fine.. I don't know when they implemented it.. But I am sick and tired of getting ejected, I can't do any RP-PVP with my guild members inside a house..
All I know is, I have been on Europa involved in the RP community for sometime.. And the real downfall began when we ran into trouble recruiting new guild members.. I believe this happened when changes were made to allow anyone to start (besides young account players) anywhere they would like.. New Haven was getting a lot of attention being the only starting point as the game was a GOOD thing as it was spread way too thin and still is, and this helped turn the city of New Haven into a recruiting ground, it was often visited by guilds to search for new members, but since it is no longer the only starting point, people don't visit it, and I can't find as many players that might be interested in joining a roleplaying guild.. The SECOND time we got hurt was when changes were made to dungeons.. For a long, long time Europa had the LARGEST roleplaying community but we were never catered to..
Our armor and weapons still look like this..
That is a standard Covian "uniform" on Europa in the Covian Army.. and in RP-PVP we always thought it better to fight in gear so that PVP within the RP community was not based on who had "the best item" but we did our share of RP_PVM as well and when changes were made to make dungeons, and PVM harder in general we have to adapt whenever we go do RP-PVE/PVM and we actually have to put on items to help us on said RP hunts.. I don't complain about it but it is yet another thing that helped kill off the "realism" that made the roleplaying so great as it takes my characters out of their standard uniform..
Our armor and weapons still look like this..
That is a standard Covian "uniform" on Europa in the Covian Army.. and in RP-PVP we always thought it better to fight in gear so that PVP within the RP community was not based on who had "the best item" but we did our share of RP_PVM as well and when changes were made to make dungeons, and PVM harder in general we have to adapt whenever we go do RP-PVE/PVM and we actually have to put on items to help us on said RP hunts.. I don't complain about it but it is yet another thing that helped kill off the "realism" that made the roleplaying so great as it takes my characters out of their standard uniform..
Just reading these couple replies gives insight as to why the "RP community" is dwindling......
Bazinga...trolled again ....
Bazinga...trolled again ....
Partially... there are many reasons... but the lack of community driven things pretty much kills it. Most people want to solo everything and it's all about getting stuff... it's not about coming together and doing things as a community anymore.
People don't want to hunt in groups anymore as they look at it as getting less stuff. I wish they had mobs and things that had better drop rates the more people were fighting it and if It got stronger and more challenging as more folk fight it too.
People don't want to hunt in groups anymore as they look at it as getting less stuff. I wish they had mobs and things that had better drop rates the more people were fighting it and if It got stronger and more challenging as more folk fight it too.
This is a pretty ridiculous complaint. Like sorry the game's combat and item systems aren't designed around your particular clique's urge to never, ever, ever change in any way.
Besides, I haven't been part of the Europa RP scene since like 2005, but even back then it was obvious that the rules of engagement were designed so that the generic vanilla warrior templates favored by the large "town guardmen" guilds wouldn't get massacred by anything more current. I remember like half the necromancy spells being randomly forbidden and not being allowed to use anything that would thrash some guy who hadn't updated his character or gear since T2A.
Oh I know the feeling we toyed with the idea's of such things and saying you can only wear GM crafted stuff for years... but what it comes down to is the fact that if you do that you build your character around that sort of armor and fighting..... So even if you do put on a suit built to actually play the game as intended.... your character is crippled due to the build you had to maintain to be able to play in only GM armor. Your skill sets are different... there are 100's of things you can't do with your character simply because you have crippled yourself with silly restrictions.
Truth of the matter is if it is available in game it's available to your character... limiting things to GM only with no added bonus or magic or whatever is just limiting your gameplay....
Certainly one could argue that you could have other characters to participate in the world outside the RP community but IMO that pretty much says.... you only play 1/4 of the game on your character.
And while yes you get 7 characters I'm sorry but when I RPed it was on multiple characters... I didn't just RP one guy... so you are talking about crippling more than one character... and then restricting your gameplay to one or 2 characters that you DON'T rp with... Even a mage template is going to be effected by having stats and skills set according to NOT having bonus's... believe it or not this can GREATLY effect your effectiveness when you DO wear armor and such with bonus's...
Even if you skill swap things around you are going to have stat issues. And those you don't just swap around.
The handful of times GL RP bothered trying the ridiculousness of restricting people to GM armor or certain builds it was an unmitigated clusterfrack that just drove people away. RP isn't about restrictions.
What facet is the house in? Is the attacker ejected from the house immediately or are they simply unable to re-enter if they step off the plot?
We all had to move on after aos, update your clients and relearn the game. There are far more options today then there ever has been in the past. When I hear people talk about how role playing is being killed off I just cant help thinking, there is a person with a shallow imagination....and that fantasy sustained becomes stagnant and boring if it never changes.
Diablo does it, and I love it, although I'm geared up enough (on my non-seasonal Barbarian) to EASILY handle the current highest difficulty setting (Torment 13), although it gives me a decent amount of high-end gear (that I don't need...) - I have to play in level 70+ Greater Rifts to have a challenge. I know WoW does it too, but I don't play that. I've debated doing it, but I've avoided playing it this long, why start now?
I agree with the initial point about the house rules being damaging to RP and i wish they didn't make those changes, if someone starts going crazy in a house you can easily ban or eject them.
I think you've gone about complaining about it a bit wrong here though Jassi and let your emotions get the better of you lol.
Alot of the time we don't get our way and have to adapt and make do with what we have. We can always build arenas outside houses and maybe even email the PEC to assist with the event and lock down deco for the night.
Alot of the debate in this thread comes down to personal preferance. It's all well and good for Spock to say to Jassi that his complaint is ridiculous and that he's moaning about the game not be designed to the Europa RP Clique; but then complain that the Europa RP Rules of engagement werent designed to his own 'clique'. It all comes down to personal preferance of combat in the game.
The Europa Rules of Engagement were around since the start of Europa RP. The two RP communities in the early years of UO; Crossroads of Yew (CoY) and Europa Roleplaying Association (ERPA) both had their own versions. When the two communties merged into the Community of Roleplayers Europa (CoRE) then a single Rules of Engagement was drawn up to accomdate both communities playstyles.
Sticking with non magic gear in Europa RP meant that UO itself was no longer catering to balancing PvP in RP, thus we had to cater for ourselves and balance it ourselves with the Rules of Engagement.
They were NOT created to favour certain guilds or templates as every guild in the community had their say when drawing up these rules. We didnt just ban certain spells and stuff for the hell of it. It was created solely to keep a level and balanced playing field in PvP. Some of the new spells with the newer skills were just powerful for non magic armour. Each guild had their own rules also on what skills they allowed, some didnt allow necromancy because it isn't part of their Roleplay guild theme or Lore.
You don't like it? Fair enough, thats your personal preferance and everyone has one. There were/are plenty of other RP communities across the shards that play with magic gear that people who don't like the Europa RP rules can/could play with.
Don't bash eachothers playstyles or cliques, it just ends up in petty argueing, everyones entitled to their opinion and to play the game how they wish.
The Europa RP Community was one of the largest RP Communities on UO and went strong well up to 2012. It catered for a large 'clique' that wanted to play that way. Just like other RP communities catered for their 'clique'.
I was with Europa roleplay since 2000, most of that time spent with one of the oldest and largest RP guilds Vesper [-V-] Which i GM'd for 4 years up to 2010.
I loved my time in Europa RP and I was completely for the Rules of Engagement. It made RP PvP so much better than fel PvP in my own opinion. Fighting was all about teamwork and personal skill, not who had the best items. It wasn't as fast paced and battles lasted alot longer.
And my lord.....the big wars.....they were truly magnificent. Large scale battles fought around tactics, teamwork, crosshealing. They were one of my favourite parts of Europa Roleplay.
So for those saying all GM equipment is stupid, yes it is to you. But to myself and as you can see a rather large playerbase, it was our way of life, our prefered playstyle; and we enjoyed every second of it.
As for the decline of the RP Community on Europa and im sure other shards too. There are a number of reasons and in my opinion none of the main ones are even related to the Devs.
My first main point relates to all shards RP communities. The decline of the games overall playerbase. Roleplayers are a minority of the overall playerbase, so as the game shrinks the RP communities are gonna die off first.
Secondly and I noticed this during my last year as GM of Vesper. As the playerbase shrunk so did the numbers of leaders. The number of people willing to take up leadership roles, willing to host events and create RP Storylines just faded away. By the end I couldn't get anyone to help run Vesper reguarly and was running it basically by myself most of the time which can lead you to burn out on UO very quickly. Thus the commited guild leaders and such also dwindled and gave up from being burnt out.
Thirdly concerning Europa RP was the politics and drama that went on behind the scenes on the guild leaders forums and on ICQ between guild leaders. During big wars etc there was a strain on guild relations behind the scenes having to deal with problem members on either sides and number of other reasons.
Now everyone has arguements, its part of life; back in the day though there was a large number of guilds. So if two guilds leadership's were having arguements they could also have a break from eachother and focus RP'ing and have wars with other guilds in the community. As the community got smaller and the number of guilds got less; the same guilds were having to deal with eachother more reguarly until it got to the last 8/9 guilds where all the storylines and wars were between the same guilds all the time. So our leaderships were never getting breaks from eachother or the arguements.
This is what lead to me quitting RP and leaving UO for 2 years. During the last big war on Europa it was Vesper vs Yew, Cove, Skara, Trinsic and the Knights Templar. No one wanted to start a war or be seen as the bad guy, all the latter guilds were in an RP Alliance as most were royalists and loyal to the king where as Vesper was a Free Republic. So i thought screw it Vesper will give it a crack fighting all of them. Don't get me wrong it was an epic war with one of my most memorable battles the Yew Beach Landing.
Im sure members on all sides enjoyed the war and battles, but behind the scenes on the All GM board between the leadership there was a huge arguement going on. I won't get into details about it but it lead to my AGM quitting followed a few weeks later by myself. I ended up spending more time argueing on forums than actually playing the damn game. When a game becomes a job and you actually get stressed IRL over it then its time to stop. Its just sad that my last months of RP were a stressful time. Once i had left then Vesper quickly declined and im sure once other guild leaders left their guilds declined without commited leaders at their helms due to lack of leaders willing to take the thrones in game.
When I returned to UO i didn't return to RP really, created a PvM guild and started doing the other parts of the game. Ive only just returned to Europa RP the other week casually with the handful that are left.
My last point that i feel should be mentioned as it also played a part in Europa RP's decline is that an idea to centralise all the remaining RP'ers and guilds in Britain. Everyone packs up and creates guilds in Britain to start a fresh there, all in one place. This would of kept the RP community going at a decent size for more years but only half the community were willing, the other half didn't want to leave behind all their guild areas/housing and history and characters they had created there. Which is fair enough i guess. So that idea didnt go ahead as it would of split the already declining community in 2. Looking back now though I wish that everyone did get on board with the idea.
This post may be a little bit biased as of course im from Europa RP and thats what kept me playing for 10 years. I aint trying to offend anyone or insult them, im just telling the hard truth and defending what so many people are bashing in this thread; just trying to make you see things from the Europa RP perspective. Im sure you all played/play with awesome vibrant communities on other shards, so please don't bash Europa RP's way of life because its not your own playstyle.
P.S Jassi stay cool next time you post lol, making us all look like nutters.
I think you've gone about complaining about it a bit wrong here though Jassi and let your emotions get the better of you lol.
Alot of the time we don't get our way and have to adapt and make do with what we have. We can always build arenas outside houses and maybe even email the PEC to assist with the event and lock down deco for the night.
Alot of the debate in this thread comes down to personal preferance. It's all well and good for Spock to say to Jassi that his complaint is ridiculous and that he's moaning about the game not be designed to the Europa RP Clique; but then complain that the Europa RP Rules of engagement werent designed to his own 'clique'. It all comes down to personal preferance of combat in the game.
The Europa Rules of Engagement were around since the start of Europa RP. The two RP communities in the early years of UO; Crossroads of Yew (CoY) and Europa Roleplaying Association (ERPA) both had their own versions. When the two communties merged into the Community of Roleplayers Europa (CoRE) then a single Rules of Engagement was drawn up to accomdate both communities playstyles.
Sticking with non magic gear in Europa RP meant that UO itself was no longer catering to balancing PvP in RP, thus we had to cater for ourselves and balance it ourselves with the Rules of Engagement.
They were NOT created to favour certain guilds or templates as every guild in the community had their say when drawing up these rules. We didnt just ban certain spells and stuff for the hell of it. It was created solely to keep a level and balanced playing field in PvP. Some of the new spells with the newer skills were just powerful for non magic armour. Each guild had their own rules also on what skills they allowed, some didnt allow necromancy because it isn't part of their Roleplay guild theme or Lore.
You don't like it? Fair enough, thats your personal preferance and everyone has one. There were/are plenty of other RP communities across the shards that play with magic gear that people who don't like the Europa RP rules can/could play with.
Don't bash eachothers playstyles or cliques, it just ends up in petty argueing, everyones entitled to their opinion and to play the game how they wish.
The Europa RP Community was one of the largest RP Communities on UO and went strong well up to 2012. It catered for a large 'clique' that wanted to play that way. Just like other RP communities catered for their 'clique'.
I was with Europa roleplay since 2000, most of that time spent with one of the oldest and largest RP guilds Vesper [-V-] Which i GM'd for 4 years up to 2010.
I loved my time in Europa RP and I was completely for the Rules of Engagement. It made RP PvP so much better than fel PvP in my own opinion. Fighting was all about teamwork and personal skill, not who had the best items. It wasn't as fast paced and battles lasted alot longer.
And my lord.....the big wars.....they were truly magnificent. Large scale battles fought around tactics, teamwork, crosshealing. They were one of my favourite parts of Europa Roleplay.
So for those saying all GM equipment is stupid, yes it is to you. But to myself and as you can see a rather large playerbase, it was our way of life, our prefered playstyle; and we enjoyed every second of it.
As for the decline of the RP Community on Europa and im sure other shards too. There are a number of reasons and in my opinion none of the main ones are even related to the Devs.
My first main point relates to all shards RP communities. The decline of the games overall playerbase. Roleplayers are a minority of the overall playerbase, so as the game shrinks the RP communities are gonna die off first.
Secondly and I noticed this during my last year as GM of Vesper. As the playerbase shrunk so did the numbers of leaders. The number of people willing to take up leadership roles, willing to host events and create RP Storylines just faded away. By the end I couldn't get anyone to help run Vesper reguarly and was running it basically by myself most of the time which can lead you to burn out on UO very quickly. Thus the commited guild leaders and such also dwindled and gave up from being burnt out.
Thirdly concerning Europa RP was the politics and drama that went on behind the scenes on the guild leaders forums and on ICQ between guild leaders. During big wars etc there was a strain on guild relations behind the scenes having to deal with problem members on either sides and number of other reasons.
Now everyone has arguements, its part of life; back in the day though there was a large number of guilds. So if two guilds leadership's were having arguements they could also have a break from eachother and focus RP'ing and have wars with other guilds in the community. As the community got smaller and the number of guilds got less; the same guilds were having to deal with eachother more reguarly until it got to the last 8/9 guilds where all the storylines and wars were between the same guilds all the time. So our leaderships were never getting breaks from eachother or the arguements.
This is what lead to me quitting RP and leaving UO for 2 years. During the last big war on Europa it was Vesper vs Yew, Cove, Skara, Trinsic and the Knights Templar. No one wanted to start a war or be seen as the bad guy, all the latter guilds were in an RP Alliance as most were royalists and loyal to the king where as Vesper was a Free Republic. So i thought screw it Vesper will give it a crack fighting all of them. Don't get me wrong it was an epic war with one of my most memorable battles the Yew Beach Landing.
Im sure members on all sides enjoyed the war and battles, but behind the scenes on the All GM board between the leadership there was a huge arguement going on. I won't get into details about it but it lead to my AGM quitting followed a few weeks later by myself. I ended up spending more time argueing on forums than actually playing the damn game. When a game becomes a job and you actually get stressed IRL over it then its time to stop. Its just sad that my last months of RP were a stressful time. Once i had left then Vesper quickly declined and im sure once other guild leaders left their guilds declined without commited leaders at their helms due to lack of leaders willing to take the thrones in game.
When I returned to UO i didn't return to RP really, created a PvM guild and started doing the other parts of the game. Ive only just returned to Europa RP the other week casually with the handful that are left.
My last point that i feel should be mentioned as it also played a part in Europa RP's decline is that an idea to centralise all the remaining RP'ers and guilds in Britain. Everyone packs up and creates guilds in Britain to start a fresh there, all in one place. This would of kept the RP community going at a decent size for more years but only half the community were willing, the other half didn't want to leave behind all their guild areas/housing and history and characters they had created there. Which is fair enough i guess. So that idea didnt go ahead as it would of split the already declining community in 2. Looking back now though I wish that everyone did get on board with the idea.
This post may be a little bit biased as of course im from Europa RP and thats what kept me playing for 10 years. I aint trying to offend anyone or insult them, im just telling the hard truth and defending what so many people are bashing in this thread; just trying to make you see things from the Europa RP perspective. Im sure you all played/play with awesome vibrant communities on other shards, so please don't bash Europa RP's way of life because its not your own playstyle.
P.S Jassi stay cool next time you post lol, making us all look like nutters.
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Lucas Drachen here. Just to pop in and give my usual "shut up Jassi"
That is all. Carry on.
That is all. Carry on.
Oh Jassi, haha dude the ejection mechanic in houses has been in since forever. Chill and use the work around of just making the tournaments outside, as for bar brawls, not sure how you got kicked out, literally had one two weeks ago and no problems. I think someone might have been trolling you, were you on a second account that you though was friended to your other house?
As for everyone saying it's stupid to use GM gear, the simple short answer was always "It lets everyone stay on the same level during RP and makes entry into the community easier." It also had the added benefit of forcing people to work together to do things which makes the game more fun. I left the Europa RP community because, everyone else was leaving and I had $hit to do. That however doesn't mean that it was a bad idea.
As for everyone saying it's stupid to use GM gear, the simple short answer was always "It lets everyone stay on the same level during RP and makes entry into the community easier." It also had the added benefit of forcing people to work together to do things which makes the game more fun. I left the Europa RP community because, everyone else was leaving and I had $hit to do. That however doesn't mean that it was a bad idea.
Most of the threads you start are exactly what you call ridiculous. The last one was about how YOU are too weak to wear plate armor when hit with a - str spell.
You mean that thread that scored double-digit likes and was full of people agreeing with me? Yeah, gee, that's totally equivalent to this guy complaining that the game's items and combat didn't stay static for 15 years so his RP friends wouldn't have to adapt. What an insightful point on your part.
Go sit down somewhere.
Roasted
LOL
Game mechanic changes have hurt a lot of the togetherness we used to have. Cant gain skills good sparring with guildies anymore (remember powerhour?). Cant help a friend GM parry anymore by casting BS at him.
Cant help anyone gain resist anymore by casting energy fields under the second floor stairs of a small tower and having them run up and down em (and rez them when they went too slow
).
These are gone, some changed because they were considered bugs. Guess the powers that be think it makes more community to stand alone and bash wolf spiders and golems...
Cant help anyone gain resist anymore by casting energy fields under the second floor stairs of a small tower and having them run up and down em (and rez them when they went too slow
).These are gone, some changed because they were considered bugs. Guess the powers that be think it makes more community to stand alone and bash wolf spiders and golems...
Yea, same for every new worthwhile boss encounter. Only in a party. Because god beware someone from running into a random guy in a mmorpg. I guess crybabies won UO. GG.
Yeah, on Catskills we seem to have no problem knocking each other unconscious.
The WoW part, or the Diablo part? WoW is a guildmate playing it. Diablo, the Barbarian's from when I played Season 5. I was bored and decided to play my Leapquake Barb again, since it's already geared/high level. Game still too ez even with the increase in difficulty.
Napa had similar situations - guilds that agreed to a certain RoE and would RPvP with one another till the cows came home. Events were organized - we didn't need pixels to have us participate - we were there for the experience, the camaraderie, the fun. Enemies and friends alike, we did it for the FUN and the ENJOYMENT and of course, the ADVENTURE.
Very hard pressed to find that in a game now. Any game, not just UO. Sorta have it over in SotA, but I'm not active enough to really get into the activities there (too much school right now - MBA comes first).
SP kinda has the ruleset, but again, it is the people that helps to make the events of a shard worth while, not just game mechanics. The mechanics help though....
Oh look, I have another essay due on chivalry.... hasta!