Can we please..........

[TimberWolf]

Dread you are being hypocritical... in one breath you condem pvpers for wanting to make the vvv system fair because it changes your ability to heal strangers....in the next breath you want to change their play style.

what is good for some is good for all! ...VVV doesnt need to effect anyone who hasnt joined...and if you have joined, then suck it up buttercup!

 

[Lord Frodo]

Stop this BS, it's not about sheep, it's a bout playstyle. Some players don't like PvP, they can still hunt in peace in Trammel. Other players like the risk for PvP, when they hunt and some like to be aggressive in PvP, Trammel zone are very boring for them. Allow PvP in Trammel would let the ones who don't want any kind of PvP stay safe and the ones, who like some PvP can join VvV. Sure they need to fix the flaging from healing so non VvV can't heal a VvV, who are fighting an other players and end up orange.
It may even make fel less dangerous as the PvP'ers will hunt at other places too. Noone are forced to join VvV, they decide if they want to be sheeps or not.

Really if PvP was so great then Fel would be over run with players. The only reason they want into the other facets is because Fel is dead and they want to bring their BS everywhere in UO. We understand that you play SP and have very little if any clue how PvP runs on the other shards and the little children that do it. You have invited many people to SP and help them understand a Fel only shard, please come to the prodo shards and listen to the little kiddies so you can see what it would be like all over UO, no ty.

 

[DreadLord Lestat]

Dread you are being hypocritical... in one breath you condem pvpers for wanting to make the vvv system fair because it changes your ability to heal strangers....in the next breath you want to change their play style.

what is good for some is good for all! ...VVV doesnt need to effect anyone who hasnt joined...and if you have joined, then suck it up buttercup!

I am not asking anyone to change their play style but VvV as it is would not work on all facets and the majority do not want it on all facets. If they were to make it like factions where the only way to get flagged was to actively join, then I would not care but as it stands now, I do not want to be flagged on the other facets because I am healing someone at an event or rezzing someones pet because the vet rez has been broken since it was implemented. VvV as it is now needs to stay in Fel.

I am not condemning PvPers at all, it is a valid play style. I have enjoyed it in many other games but I do not want to be forced into because I heal the wrong person or rez the wrong pet or I am afk in the wrong town at the wrong time. People are objecting because how VvV is set up currently could force others into non-consensual PvP. That is why Fel and Siege exist, for people who want to PvP at any given time against any opponent. It is not the fault of others that Fel and Siege are slow and quiet these days.

As far as others using VvV items without participating in VvV for PvP, it is a flaw that should be fixed. I agree that you should not be able to participate minimally and gain good gear to use else where. Instead of asking for VvV to be instituted everywhere, maybe wearing VvV gear should flag you everywhere but at the same time by wearing that gear, you are not able to be healed by others so no one else flags.

 

[TimberWolf]

I am not asking anyone to change their play style but VvV as it is would not work on all facets and the majority do not want it on all facets. If they were to make it like factions where the only way to get flagged was to actively join, then I would not care but as it stands now, I do not want to be flagged on the other facets because I am healing someone at an event or rezzing someones pet because the vet rez has been broken since it was implemented. VvV as it is now needs to stay in Fel.

I am not condemning PvPers at all, it is a valid play style. I have enjoyed it in many other games but I do not want to be forced into because I heal the wrong person or rez the wrong pet or I am afk in the wrong town at the wrong time. People are objecting because how VvV is set up currently could force others into non-consensual PvP. That is why Fel and Siege exist, for people who want to PvP at any given time against any opponent. It is not the fault of others that Fel and Siege are slow and quiet these days.

As far as others using VvV items without participating in VvV for PvP, it is a flaw that should be fixed. I agree that you should not be able to participate minimally and gain good gear to use else where. Instead of asking for VvV to be instituted everywhere, maybe wearing VvV gear should flag you everywhere but at the same time by wearing that gear, you are not able to be healed by others so no one else flags.

Or perhaps the easiest solution would be just dont heal anyone without pulling their bar.......problem solved. Or if you just cant help yourself because you are such a wonderful human being....and just have to rez every pet you see and heal every poor slob in the game then.....wait what are we talking about we both know you arent really that nice, you just like to argue....lol

 

[FrejaSP]

Or perhaps the easiest solution would be just dont heal anyone without pulling their bar.......problem solved. Or if you just cant help yourself because you are such a wonderful human being....and just have to rez every pet you see and heal every poor slob in the game then.....wait what are we talking about we both know you arent really that nice, you just like to argue....lol

I believe it would be a problem, Devs would need to solve first.
If a non VvV want to heal/rez a VvV in Trammel, he should be able to do it without going orange if the VvV players are not flaged in a VvV fight/Died to a VvV player.
But if the VvV player is fighting other VvV or died to a VvV player, the non VvV player will get a popup telling him, it will make him orange (VvV) for 2 hours, if he say say OK, it will let him heal/rez the VvV player. If he say No Thanks, it will cancel the healing/rez. Players should be able to set it to always rez/heal or never rez/hel in options.

It is a legal concern from Trammel players and if Devs can fix it, I don't see why VvV can't work on all facets.

 

[FrejaSP]

.
That is why Fel and Siege exist, for people who want to PvP at any given time against any opponent. It is not the fault of others that Fel and Siege are slow and quiet these days.

The problem is, alot do not want to play on Siege, not because they fear non con PvP but because Siege only do have one char slot and no recall. There may be a few other reasons but it is not to much PvP and to many deaths.
We use to say, there are no thieves on Siege, this days, I can say, there are no PK's on Siege, shard are really safe. want to do Turtle spawn and one is goin on, just join in, you are welcome.

 

[OREOGL]

The problem is, alot do not want to play on Siege, nit because they fear non con PvP but because Siege only do have one char slot and no recall. There may be a few other reasons but it is not to much PvP and to many deaths.
We use to say, there are no thieves on Siege, this days, I can say, there are no PK's on Siege, shard are really safe. want to do Turtle spawn and one is goin on, just join in, you are welcome.

The one character really kills siege for me. I could reopen all 6 accounts but I'm not going to eat $100 bucks a month to play a shard.

I could buy a bunch if soul stones but also is pricey along with the amount of training I would need to do to catch up would be absurd.

I never understood the one character but. Sure it's supposed to be harder but not from a character standpoint, but from the rule set.

 

[MalagAste]

Or perhaps the easiest solution would be just dont heal anyone without pulling their bar.......problem solved. Or if you just cant help yourself because you are such a wonderful human being....and just have to rez every pet you see and heal every poor slob in the game then.....wait what are we talking about we both know you arent really that nice, you just like to argue....lol

Oh that's bloody Brilliant.... why of course though you are fool for suggesting it might I point out that the current way to get "Drops" which you know is why 90% of the people attend these events is based on how much damage/healing/etc... you do..... so while we are all forced to play who's who that really isn't going to help us... WE shouldn't have to be putzing around trying to figure out who is going to flag me or not in the middle of trying to stay alive and fight a boss.

 

[Lord Frodo]

Or perhaps the easiest solution would be just dont heal anyone without pulling their bar.......problem solved. Or if you just cant help yourself because you are such a wonderful human being....and just have to rez every pet you see and heal every poor slob in the game then.....wait what are we talking about we both know you arent really that nice, you just like to argue....lol

Or perhaps the easiest solution is keeping it in your dead facet and live with it.

 

[DreadLord Lestat]

Or perhaps the easiest solution would be just dont heal anyone without pulling their bar.......problem solved. Or if you just cant help yourself because you are such a wonderful human being....and just have to rez every pet you see and heal every poor slob in the game then.....wait what are we talking about we both know you arent really that nice, you just like to argue....lol

Sarcasm is strong in this one, it is. I see that you just want to debate and nit-pick so it is what it is. Unless they make major changes, I say no, just as the majority has so good luck with this.

 

[Jack Daniels]

Why is it people seem to think everything must involve event. Not everyone cares about the stupid ass event. The easiest way to fix this is to go back to the old days and blues can not cast a heal or a rez a VvV char. Problem solved you wont go grey, you wont have any chance of being killed in the PvP aspect of the game and this will not interfere with your precious event drops. So with this in mind PvP can spread to tram and not interfere with your daily bank sitting. If you join VvV and don't want to be attacked then guess you shouldn't join VvV that simple, I understand some people play their thieves but this is a chance you take being part of the vvv.

 

[Merlin]

What if non-VvV players can only go orange in Fel?

 

[Cadderly]

What if non-VvV players can only go orange in Fel?

Brilliant idea! Love it.. fel=vice and tram=virtue, same rules and notificatios as towns. Dog will hunt!!!

 

[OREOGL]

What if non-VvV players can only go orange in Fel?

I was thinking this also.

 

[FrejaSP]

What if non-VvV players can only go orange in Fel?

Sounds nice but not all blue are nice honorable guys. If they can rez and heal VvV players, who are fighting other VvV, we will see blue hang out with the VvV and heal them, when they are fighting other VvV.
There need to be some code to handle this.

What about?
A blue char can't rez/heal a VvV char, who are in a fight with other VvV. This way, he do not risk to go orange.
If a blue are hunting with a VvV, who are not flaget for fighting other VvV, he should be able to rez or heal him without risk for going orange.

It's not optimalt IMO as I think a players should be able to changes setting for their char, so they can heal/rez fighting VvV but it will make them orange for 2 hours. This would then be the players choice if he want to be safe or want to help his VvV friends.

Maybe Disable VvV in Trammel zone towns, to make it easier for young and lesser PvP'ers as towns still would be safe for them,

 

[Aran]

With VvV opt-in consensual PvP, there's really no need for any non-consensual PvP in the game at this point. Remove all non-consensual PvP.

 

[Lady Kittie]

Alright everyone, let's please keep things civil. Please, let's not resort to any sort of personal attacks. Thank you kindly!

 

[OREOGL]

Alright everyone, let's please keep things civil. Please, let's not resort to any sort of personal attacks. Thank you kindly!

This is legit, I was out of line.

 

[kelmo]

Do not let the trolls get ya, OREO. *smiles*

 

[TimberWolf]

So it seems we get back to the root of all things evil....event drops! Remove them from the game then no one will heal anyone other then their friends ( and most of these haters wont even heal their friends if there is nothing in it for them)

Look I am just saying VVV is an opt in opt out system. VVV should only involve PvPers....if you don't want Pvp then don't interact with Pvpers....it is real simple! But since VVV is opt in...it should exist everywhere. And if it did....you could probably eliminate Fel... move champ spawns tram...make it so only oranges can do champ spawns. Instantly you increase the population on tram....increase housing demand....resource demand...etc.

Be we all know the regulars on here that just have to hate on anything different that might improve the game for the majority.....all they care about is their minority.

 

[MalagAste]

So it seems we get back to the root of all things evil....event drops! Remove them from the game then no one will heal anyone other then their friends ( and most of these haters wont even heal their friends if there is nothing in it for them)

Look I am just saying VVV is an opt in opt out system. VVV should only involve PvPers....if you don't want Pvp then don't interact with Pvpers....it is real simple! But since VVV is opt in...it should exist everywhere. And if it did....you could probably eliminate Fel... move champ spawns tram...make it so only oranges can do champ spawns. Instantly you increase the population on tram....increase housing demand....resource demand...etc.

Be we all know the regulars on here that just have to hate on anything different that might improve the game for the majority.....all they care about is their minority.

If it were that simple it wouldn't be a problem..... but it isn't.... if you aren't in VvV you don't see who or what is in it.... accidently cast something like Cleansing Winds and now you are IN VvV whether you wanted to be or not..... There is no "opt" in the "opt in ..... if you do a mass heal or mass cure you ARE going to be in.... If you pick a random dragon to heal it's not flying VvV to you since your not in..... So in you go.... whether you wanted to or not....

And the hell if I or anyone else not in VvV wants to have to stop and close some stinking pop up box every other min while trying to stay alive kill the boss and earn healing points... That would give some advantages to folk in VvV though I can say this.... Having played in RPPvP for a LONG time that will also mean NO ONE in VvV will be able to use EV's, RC's or any other area effect spells at the EM Events... consider that before you think it's a wonderful idea... I know full well that casting an EV or RC with any oranges about will cause them to attack the Oranges not the boss...

So you will be shafted at the events as well. Is that really what you want???

 

[Jack Daniels]

If it were that simple it wouldn't be a problem..... but it isn't.... if you aren't in VvV you don't see who or what is in it.... accidently cast something like Cleansing Winds and now you are IN VvV whether you wanted to be or not..... There is no "opt" in the "opt in ..... if you do a mass heal or mass cure you ARE going to be in.... If you pick a random dragon to heal it's not flying VvV to you since your not in..... So in you go.... whether you wanted to or not....

And the hell if I or anyone else not in VvV wants to have to stop and close some stinking pop up box every other min while trying to stay alive kill the boss and earn healing points... That would give some advantages to folk in VvV though I can say this.... Having played in RPPvP for a LONG time that will also mean NO ONE in VvV will be able to use EV's, RC's or any other area effect spells at the EM Events... consider that before you think it's a wonderful idea... I know full well that casting an EV or RC with any oranges about will cause them to attack the Oranges not the boss...

So you will be shafted at the events as well. Is that really what you want???

And here we go with event yet again. The point of this discussion has nothing to do with event, not everyone cares about events or RP. But you keep bringing it up. And please don't speak for everyone, some people like the fact that pop ups appears when they are about to commit a criminal act so one popping up as warning about VvV may not be that big of an hindurance. , so this is your opinion and not every ones. I am really tired of hearing how this will impact YOU. I don't take part in events because I lag like no tomorrow and I find all the RP jibberish to be an eye sore and just plain stupid. But I certainly don't come on the forums and moan and groan about how it impacts MY game play. I respect the fact you enjoy and let it go. Maybe you should try the same.

It would be easy to fix, by going back to the old system where a blue can not heal or rez a VvV member. Problem solved, if this limits your healling points, well guess we all don't really care about your healing points.

 

[OREOGL]

If it were that simple it wouldn't be a problem..... but it isn't.... if you aren't in VvV you don't see who or what is in it.... accidently cast something like Cleansing Winds and now you are IN VvV whether you wanted to be or not..... There is no "opt" in the "opt in ..... if you do a mass heal or mass cure you ARE going to be in.... If you pick a random dragon to heal it's not flying VvV to you since your not in..... So in you go.... whether you wanted to or not....

And the hell if I or anyone else not in VvV wants to have to stop and close some stinking pop up box every other min while trying to stay alive kill the boss and earn healing points... That would give some advantages to folk in VvV though I can say this.... Having played in RPPvP for a LONG time that will also mean NO ONE in VvV will be able to use EV's, RC's or any other area effect spells at the EM Events... consider that before you think it's a wonderful idea... I know full well that casting an EV or RC with any oranges about will cause them to attack the Oranges not the boss...

So you will be shafted at the events as well. Is that really what you want???

Well man, I can't say I care for pvp being anywhere other than Fel, but I think some of your argument needs a little filtering.

The annoying box only pops up in an active pvp town. Other pop up only occurs when committing a criminal act.

The only mass heal I know of is cleansing winds which you must be in a party to benefit of indirect casting.

Arch cure is arguable but I think has already been addressed in this thread by not having non VVV spells affecting VVV players.

This was actually a system in place in factions so wouldn't be hard to add in. "You cannot perform beneficial acts..."

And RVPVP? I only know of a couple players on Great Lakes to do so, one being Lore Denin and John.
I am certain you are not Lore, but I'd be interested to know who your pvp character is on Great Lakes.

Lastly, if we reverse the same argument, event drops should be removed because they are forcing me to play in trammel.

 

[FrejaSP]

If it were that simple it wouldn't be a problem..... but it isn't.... if you aren't in VvV you don't see who or what is in it.... accidently cast something like Cleansing Winds and now you are IN VvV whether you wanted to be or not..... There is no "opt" in the "opt in ..... if you do a mass heal or mass cure you ARE going to be in.... If you pick a random dragon to heal it's not flying VvV to you since your not in..... So in you go.... whether you wanted to or not....

Don't you think Devs can fix that, just like you don't attack blue if you attack with areal spells. They may need some time to program it but I'm sure it is possible.

If they make it so:
A blue char can't rez/heal a VvV char, who are in a fight with other VvV. This way, he do not risk to go orange.
If a blue are hunting with a VvV, who are not flaget for fighting other VvV, he should be able to rez or heal him without risk for going orange.

And the hell if I or anyone else not in VvV wants to have to stop and close some stinking pop up box every other min while trying to stay alive kill the boss and earn healing points...

What if you could set option, so it won't try to heal a VvV, if you try, nothing will happen, just like when you cast an areal spell, it hit your enemy and monsters but not any blue or green, your areal heal will only heal blue and green non VvV.
Do your mass heal and cure heal and cure the monsters around you?

Having played in RPPvP for a LONG time that will also mean NO ONE in VvV will be able to use EV's, RC's or any other area effect spells at the EM Events... consider that before you think it's a wonderful idea... I know full well that casting an EV or RC with any oranges about will cause them to attack the Oranges not the boss...

We can handle that on Siege, when I was red, I did stay away from the casters of EV's. It someone attacked me with a mistake, I could tab out and move away, maybe hide and unhide to break target.
As long you are hunting with friends, just be sure to be allied with them, your EV's, RC's or any other area effect spells to not attack green or you can leave VvV 3 days before an EM event and rejoin after.

Instead of yelling NOOOOO, try to be positive and help finding solution because it is possible to make it happen without ruin the gameplay in Trammel. It's ok to fear the worse, but with analyse it in a positive way and list the problems it may bring, Devs can work on it and have a chance to make all happy.

When one in the thread react aggressive, it will make others aggressive too

 

[FrejaSP]

And RVPVP? I only know of a couple players on Great Lakes to do so, one being Lore Denin and John.

I miss Lore Denin, I have no idea where he went but I know he is open for this idea as I speaked alot with him about how to improve VvV. He is one of the greatest RPPVP'er I ever meet and I miss him. Sadly it seem like the char Lore Denin is gone from GL, Origen and Siege Perilous but I'm sure he is not gone from UO.

 

[OREOGL]

I miss Lore Denin, I have no idea where he went but I know he is open for this idea as I speaked alot with him about how to improve VvV. He is one of the greatest RPPVP'er I ever meet and I miss him. Sadly it seem like the char Lore Denin is gone from GL, Origen and Siege Perilous but I'm sure he is not gone from UO.

Lore is known to take extended breaks (as are we all) but I think he was spending most of his time on origin.

I haven't seen him play on Great Lakes in years, which is unfortunate because he's a great guy.

 

[FrejaSP]

He moved to Siege, was with us a while.
He managed to get respect from both good and evil. He sure is a great guy

 

[TimberWolf]

No,... event drops should be removed because the system is open to the very real possibility of corruption....VVV can easily be adapted to trammel with no significant inconvenience to trammies. Will people whine and moan about it....of course because as Giggles so often reminds me...haters gotta hate! With a few other minor modifications you could literally close Feluca and go back to a single facet. Which would be a huge advantage for everyone... but yes I understand the will be a half a dozen trolls on here that will scream blood murder about it.

 

[DreadLord Lestat]

but yes I understand the will be a half a dozen trolls on here that will scream blood murder about it.

So people who don't agree with you are trolls...noted...good to see you have an open mind.

Fel is for PvP, if PvP was in such high demand that it should be moved everywhere, then why are all the PvP'ers running around in Tram anyways? I truly wish that the devs would make a pre-aos PvP server. it would be interesting to see how long it stayed populated before PvPers came back to the normal shards because there aren't any lambs to slaughter. General chat would be so pleasant for a month or two....

Out of curiosity, why not just guild war each other. You can then PvP in any facet without affecting anyone else.

 

[MalagAste]

Lore is a great person and wonderful with RPPvP ..... and Yes I have RPPvPed with him on many an occasion... last I knew he was doing things on Siege mostly but as someone pointed out he tends to take extended breaks... so trying to get anything RP going on with him can be somewhat difficult since you never know when he'll just vanish for months at a stretch... was that way when he was on GL's and we learned to deal with it over the years.

As for healing people many folk do area healing and curing at EM events... it's what gets you points in the drop system. Many folk also cast area effects... adding VvV to other facets would seriously have implications that would cause massive issues at large public events. And would be EXTREMELY disruptive to EM events... we already have to tolerate and put up with enough griefing and childishness at the events certainly don't need to have FEL Bickery at an EM event. And don't tell me it wouldn't happen since i happen to know a LOT of Fel players attend the events on GL's....

Its where the money is.

 

[FrejaSP]

As for healing people many folk do area healing and curing at EM events... it's what gets you points in the drop system. Many folk also cast area effects... adding VvV to other facets would seriously have implications that would cause massive issues at large public events. And would be EXTREMELY disruptive to EM events... we already have to tolerate and put up with enough griefing and childishness at the events certainly don't need to have FEL Bickery at an EM event. And don't tell me it wouldn't happen since i happen to know a LOT of Fel players attend the events on GL's....

Try listen, that problem can be fixed with some coding. I'm sure there are enemies from guildwars at events too, all they need to do is to keep distance to orange enemies. If worried about it, go on a non VvV char.
I'm sure Devs won't allow VvV on all facets before they have the code ready, so regular blue won't end up as orange on a Trammel facet. The code just have to check, if you try to heal a VvV player, who are fighting other VvV and you are not VvV, your areal heal won't heal him, just like it won't heal a monster.

Now stop calling all Fel players griefers and immature because I'm sure there are as many of them or more of them in Trammel.
Your cases do not make sense as it's just a matter of getting the coding right. It may not be easy, but sure not impossible.

Now try to debat in a mature way with respect for other playstyles. Noone in this thread want to ruin EM events, they just want to go to all facets and fight the ones who don't mind a fight = in VvV
Players should not join VvV if they can't handle the risk for getting attacked.

 

[MalagAste]

Try listen, that problem can be fixed with some coding. I'm sure there are enemies from guildwars at events too, all they need to do is to keep distance to orange enemies. If worried about it, go on a non VvV char.
I'm sure Devs won't allow VvV on all facets before they have the code ready, so regular blue won't end up as orange on a Trammel facet. The code just have to check, if you try to heal a VvV player, who are fighting other VvV and you are not VvV, your areal heal won't heal him, just like it won't heal a monster.

Now stop calling all Fel players griefers and immature because I'm sure there are as many of them or more of them in Trammel.
Your cases do not make sense as it's just a matter of getting the coding right. It may not be easy, but sure not impossible.

Now try to debat in a mature way with respect for other playstyles. Noone in this thread want to ruin EM events, they just want to go to all facets and fight the ones who don't mind a fight = in VvV
Players should not join VvV if they can't handle the risk for getting attacked.

First off I zero faith that they could even code it right.... already there are major issues with getting pulled into VvV without wanting to or expecting to... best way to avoid it is to not go to Fel. Which most of us who want nothing to do with it already do.

Secondly I call things as I see them and in Gen Chat at least on my shard the PvPers in Fel are the ones chatting like a bunch of adolescents and whatnot with the name calling, taunting and vulgarity...

And they can go to all facets... No one is stopping them from going to all facets... They just need to leave the PvP in Fel where it belongs. Never said anyone couldn't PvP or said that I wanted to stop anyone from doing it.... just don't want it in Trammel.

And I'm not saying that there aren't plenty of Griefers in Tram.. though I have noticed that an awful lot of them fly the same tags in Fel.

 

[FrejaSP]

That's your opinion or your believe but that do not mean Devs should only to listen to you.
I also believe you should have more faith in our Devs.

It's about time we correct the mistake of the fel/tram split and bring the community together like it is on Siege.
Trust me, when I say, your trouble makers would get it much harder if they could not hide in Trammel.
Also how can you see in gen chat if a char is VvV or not, if he is in Fel or Trammel.

I'm so tired of hear this BS and see it stop UO from moving forward.
You did not play before the split, I did and I remember it as a great time. Yes there was standing a few in town, crying, that they could not step outside town without 50 PK's attacking them but they did never try leaving town.

Outside town, there was a good balance between PK's and Anti PK's and both sides did have fun. Only problem we had was, we did have players, who of different reason could not handle PvP and wanted to be safe outside town. I respect that and noone should be forced to PvP if they don't want.

Letting VvV fight each others on all facets, just like Guild wars already can, would not changes that at all, the non PvP'ers would still be safe.

But no, all have to blay the game the way you want, it's not really about PvP'ers interrupting your game but about them being in the game. I'm sure you wish you could remove Fel and just forget about PvP players.

Do you really believe that would make UO to a "carebear" game, where all hold in hand and noone will try to grief or cheat or trash talk? I don't because it have nothing to do with PvP and VvV.

 

[Jack Daniels]

First off I zero faith that they could even code it right.... already there are major issues with getting pulled into VvV without wanting to or expecting to... best way to avoid it is to not go to Fel. Which most of us who want nothing to do with it already do.

Secondly I call things as I see them and in Gen Chat at least on my shard the PvPers in Fel are the ones chatting like a bunch of adolescents and whatnot with the name calling, taunting and vulgarity...

And they can go to all facets... No one is stopping them from going to all facets... They just need to leave the PvP in Fel where it belongs. Never said anyone couldn't PvP or said that I wanted to stop anyone from doing it.... just don't want it in Trammel.

And I'm not saying that there aren't plenty of Griefers in Tram.. though I have noticed that an awful lot of them fly the same tags in Fel.

So you call it how you see it. So how do you know what facet someone in gen chat is on?? Maybe your eyes sight is off impairing your judgment

The only event I ever went to I most people were using loot scripts, multiple accounts but yet I am not here saying these events are ruining the game because of what I saw, nor am I grouping all of these people into hackers or cheaters because of a few.

I lag so bad that I could never hope to compete at an event to get a drop, so does this mean all event should be removed because I can't compete? I see people always spamming in gen chat how they didn't get a drop and how unfair the event was or how badly organized it was, often using foul language. so does this mean we should remove all event and group all the people that attend them into the same catergory because of the way a few act in gen chat?

And on the gen chat topic, I highly doubt there is much pvp talk in gen chat because I play your shard as well as several others and well PvP is absolutley dead on great lakes. Infact I did a spawn on my mule char last week just to make it more challenging.

No one is asking you to play a VvV char, no one is asking you to take part in VvV, no one cares if you don't get as many heal points because you cant heal a VvV char. So really having VvV on all facets really has no affect on you. Other than it disrupts events, but sadly there is more to uo that events but apparently you missed the boat on that. And you can always switch channels in gen chat so you can't see spamming and vulgarity.